Received: from delta.eecs.nwu.edu by mintaka.lcs.mit.edu id aa25143; 6 Jul 93 3:45 EDT Received: by delta.eecs.nwu.edu id AA01941 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4 for telecomlist-outbound); Tue, 6 Jul 1993 01:21:45 -0500 Received: by delta.eecs.nwu.edu id AA07667 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4 for telecomlist); Tue, 6 Jul 1993 01:21:02 -0500 Date: Tue, 6 Jul 1993 01:21:02 -0500 From: TELECOM Moderator Message-Id: <199307060621.AA07667@delta.eecs.nwu.edu> To: telecom@eecs.nwu.edu Subject: TELECOM Digest V13 #451 TELECOM Digest Tue, 6 Jul 93 01:21:00 CDT Volume 13 : Issue 451 Inside This Issue: Moderator: Patrick A. Townson Audiovox CTX-3200M Cellular Telephone Programming Information (B Nickless) Lobbying Powers in U.S. (was Re: Opiniongrams) (Doug Granzow) Access to Toll Records (Les Reeves) Phones That Work With "Call Answer"? (Irene Berkovich) 900 Number Portability? (Jeff Jonas) Electronic Exhibition in China Announcement (YXL6@psuvm.psu.edu) Mitel Smart-1 Dialer Programming Information Needed (Jack Decker) Nine Volt Phone Operation (was Re: Decline ...) (Jack Winslade) Looking For a Solution to Voicemail Problem (Chuck Wooters) Connecting From Poland (Steve Weimar) Re: Telepassport (was Re: Sprint Does it Again!) (Willie Smith) Re: Cell Phone Fraud Losses Triple in a Year (Steve Forrette) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Subject: Audiovox CTX-3200M Cellular Telephone Programming Information Date: Mon 05 Jul 1993 17:12:42 -0500 From: Bill Nickless I own an Audiovox CTX-3200M Cellular telephone. This is a very nice installed-in-car phone, and it includes an RJ-11 jack to accept modems, fax machines, etc. Following is what I know about NAM programming for that phone, and I'd like to know more. But first a disclaimer: I am only interested in making cellular calls expecting and intending to pay for them as per standard, legal, aboveboard service arrangments. What I'm want is control over the options and features enabled to the local user of the cellphone. Taking half a day's vacation and paying someone $25 to reprogram the phone to, say, turn off in twelve hours after the ignition key is removed instead of the standard eight hours is a wee bit excessive. My next hardware hack is a 12-volt battery with a wiring harness so that, if I run the main car battery down, I can still call AAA. I think I have all the information I need to do that. Ameritech would probably even *like* it! A big Thank You to Douglas Scott Reuben for his message of Fri, 25 Jan 1991 in the Telecom Archives about other Audiovox cellphones. The same mechanism for entering program mode applies to the CTX-3200M. Thanks go to Leroy Donnelly for his list of cellular phone technical support numbers; unfortunately, Audiovox at +1 800 229 1235 wouldn't tell me anything about this because I (truthfully) told them I wasn't a service center. *sigh* I would be interested in a) anyone confirming/denying my guesses, b) anyone adding information to what I have below, and/or c) anyone sending me the non-private settings of their CTX-3200M (or similar Audiovox product.) Don't send me your phone number(s) or lock code(s)! I don't want them! I don't need them! I don't want to be responsible for them! But if, say, you *know* you have Horn Alert enabled, I'd be interested in your values for registers 09, 10, 11, 12, 13 and 14. Modulo Moderator approval, and those of you who send me information, I'll summarize results back to the Digest. Here's what I do know: (n's replace numbers You Don't Need to Know.) To put phone in program mode, enter the three-digit lock code, then # 1. To move through the list, press "*" or "#" keys. After you alter items, press . writes the values to NAM and advances you to Reg #46. resets the phone to the NAM values last 'd. Confidence values: A=Gotta Be, B=Probably Is, X=Wild Guess, Z=No Clue Original Valid My Personal Reg# Value Regex Meaning Confidence --- ----------- ----------- --------------------------------- ----------- 01 708nnnnnn8 [0-9]{10} Telephone number A 02 nn8 [0-9]{3} Standard Lock Code A 03 00020 [0-9]{5} Cellular System ID A 04 08 [0-9]{2} Overload Class B 05 10 [0-9]{2} Group ID B 06 1 [0-1]{1} Access X 07 1 [0-1]{1} Local X 08 0334 [0-9]{4} Paging channel A 09 0 [0-1]{1} Z 10 1000 [0-1]{4} Z 11 00000000 [0-1]{8} Features, left->right bits 7->0: Bit 7: Beep every minute feature A Bit 6: Power on into locked mode A Bits 5-1 Z Bit 0: Any digit answers incoming A 12 11111000 [0-1]{8} Z 13 00 [0-9]{2} Z 14 000 [0-9]{3} Z 15 nnn [0-9]{3} Call timers lock code A 16-40 00000 [0-9]{5} System IDs to inhibit B 41-45 *{0} Unwritable. A 46-47 nn, nn [0-9A-F]{2} Unwritable. NAM checksum. A Location unknown, but referred to as NAM options in user's guide: Automatic Redial: Retries busy cell cites if busy 911 Emergency Call: Allows 911 calls even if locked Call Restrictions: Set of restrictions on outbound numbers Hands-free operation: [Active on my phone, I can't seem to disable it!] Horn Alert: [Not active on my phone, may not even be connected] Safety Timer: Turn off some number of hours after car is stopped "Call timers lock code" is the code that must be entered to reset the total elapsed airtime used and number of calls made. This might be different than the standard lock code for a short-term cellphone rental outfit. "System IDs to inhibit" is a list of cellular services to ignore. The phone will say "NoSvc" rather than "Roam" in those areas. I hope this helps someone save on reprogramming fees, and I hope anyone using this information to try to defraud a cell company gets caught and thrown into the slammer! Bill Nickless System Support Group +1 708 252 7390 ------------------------------ From: dig@pro-cynosure.cts.com Subject: Lobbying Powers in U.S. (was Re: Opiniongrams) Organization: ProLine [pro-cynosure] Date: Mon, 5 Jul 93 15:12:53 EDT ae446@freenet.carleton.ca (Nigel Allen) writes: > -- The key groups who are frequent communicators with Congress are > senior citizens (48 percent), followed by Pro-Life/Religious Right (15 > percent), special interest groups (14 percent) and environmentalists > (11 percent). General or across-the-board opinions made up 15 > percent. Is this saying that 48 percent of Senior Citizens communicate with Congress, or that 48 percent of those that communicate with Congress are senior citizens? Either way, this statistic demonstrates the power held by the AARP. You thought the NRA was the biggest lobbying organization in the U.S.? Think again. > [Moderator's Note: Western Union is desparately trying to stay in > business. I can't blame them, but the handwriting is on the wall. I work in a store that offers Western Union services. None of their services are cheap, but the same people who complain to us about the rates are the same ones that keep coming back. The most popular service (at our location) is the Quick Collect payment. For $10.50, you can send any amount of money to beat the deadline on your mortgage, credit card, etc., so long as the company you owe already has an arrangement with Western Union. We get about 50% commission on these, which is why we continue to offer the service, but may also be part of the reason WU is struggling. Doug Granzow (dig@pro-cynosure.cts.com) -- Cynosure BBS 410-549-2584 (free!) [Moderator's Note: Quick Collect from Western Union is going to be one of the options I begin offering customers of the Talk Ticket; that and a few currency exchanges in the Chicago area have indicated to me they would like to begin selling cards. PAT] ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 05 Jul 1993 13:40:53 -0400 (EDT) From: LESREEVES@delphi.com Subject: Access to Toll Records Two programs aired on PBS in 1992, "Nova" and "Adam Smith" dealt with privacy and access to personal information. In both programs, the example of viewing then V.P. Dan Quayle's credit report was used. In the Adam Smith program, a person named Jeffery Rothfeder used his "computer" to access Quayle's credit report. The journalist in Nova supposedly got legitmate access to Quayle's info by simply stating that he was a journalist. The credit info both of these came back with appeared to be the same thing an individual is entitled to when denied credit by a credit grantor. Both programs used the figure of 100 dollars as what they paid for other information, including long-distance records. There was no elaboration on what was meant by "records", but one would assume they meant individual call detail. I have a problem understanding how this can be so. First, assume that "long distance" is restricted to 1+ calling billed to an individual's personal telephone bill. Second, assume that the long-distance is provided by one of the three major long-distance carriers. Third, assume the person is served by a Regional Bell Operating Company Local Exchange Carrier. Fourth, assume that criminal activity is not involved, and that no law-enforcement agencies are involved. These assumptions mirror the calling-billing of many individuals. It does not seem possible that toll records are available to any entity, at any price, under the above scenario. What's going on here? ------------------------------ From: wc4209@writer.yorku.ca (Irene Berkovich) Subject: Phones That Work With "Call Answer"? Organization: Computer Assisted Writing Centre, York Univ, Toronto, Canada Date: Mon, 5 Jul 1993 11:13:52 -0400 I have recently subscribed to Bell Canada's "Call Answer" which is a voice mail answering service. It notifies you that there is a message waiting by changing the dial tone into a broken stacatto-like tone. Unfortunately this means that you have to pick up the telephone to see if there are any messages waiting. Are there any phones on the market (preferably Panasonic) that have a flashing light to indicate that there are messages waiting on Call Answer? Thanks. ------------------------------ From: Jeff Jonas Subject: 900 Number Portability? Date: Mon, 5 Jul 1993 21:28:48 -0400 (EDT) There's been talk in TELECOM Digest about 800 number portability. I was wondering if 900 numbers are portable too? What brought this to mind is a catalogue I got with an errata slip that reads: "Due to sudden changes in regulations within the telephone industry, the telephone numbers shown are incorrect ..." I do not understand - what would cause somebody to change their 900 number? If 900 numbers are now portable (as 800 numbers), then they could switch carriers and keep the existing numbers. Does this have anything to do with some companies no longer accepting billing? But how would that force then to change their numbers? Mind you, my heart doesn't bleed for these 900 services, but I'm curious about the number changes. Jeffrey Jonas jeffj@panix.com [Moderator's Note: It is anyone's guess what the catalog meant by 'sudden changes in regulations within the telephone industry'. If this was a sex-catalog you were reading, it might be they could no longer bill via 900. Also, at one point, all of AT&T's 900 numbers were org- anized by the cost of the call. For example, calls to 900-410-xxxx cost so much; calls to 900-234-xxxx cost so much, etc. What prefix you got on depended on what you wanted to charge. You changed your price and the phone number had to change. Maybe that is not the case any longer. How about telling us the *original* numbers which are now wrong and the *now correct* numbers printed in the errata. Maybe we can piece together the facts from the actual numbers; figure out which carrier operates what, etc. PAT] ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 05 Jul 1993 12:47:44 -0400 (EDT) From: YXL6@psuvm.psu.edu Subject: Electronic Exhibition in China Announcement Organization: Penn State University Exhibitions on electronics products, sponsored by Electronics Information Cen Ministry of Machinery & Electronics Industry, PRC, will be held in Beijing, Sha ai, and Guangzhou sequentially. Those who are interested in the exhibition can write to: Transpac Infoserv. 1816 Weaver St. State College, PA16803 for detailed information and formal application form. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 05 Jul 93 03:14:45 EDT From: ac388@freenet.hsc.colorado.edu (Jack Decker) Subject: Mitel Smart-1 Dialer Programming Information Needed Subject line says it ... I know a guy (not on the net) who needs the programming information for a Mitel Smart-1 PAV dialer. Apparently, Mitel won't send programming manuals to anyone other than their dealers, and none of the local dealers in his area (or mine) have one. If you have one, I'd either like to ask you a couple of questions (well, maybe a FEW more than a couple :-) or else see if we could work something out to get a copy of the manual. In fact, if you know anything at all about these units (good, bad, or indifferent) I'd like to hear from you. Please reply via e-mail so as not to waste bandwidth here in the TELECOM Digest. Thanks in advance, Jack Decker | Internet: ac388@freenet.hsc.colorado.edu ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 05 Jul 93 07:20:08 CST From: Jack.Winslade@axolotl.omahug.org (Jack Winslade) Subject: Nine Volt Phone Operation (was Re: Decline ...) Reply-To: jack.winslade%drbbs@axolotl.omahug.org Organization: DRBBS Technical BBS, Omaha In a message dated 27-JUN-93, writes: > Please remember that a phone is designed to work with 48 volts, not > nine ... if you want a DTMF circuit off 9V, then I recommend creating one > yourself ... the phone probably wont work without a lot of hacking > around. CO batteries are typically around 48 volts or so, but on a POTS line when the set goes off hook, the resulting DC across the pair is usually right around 9 volts, +/- a few. Some non-telco equipment will run the loops at 24 volts with no ill effects. Ah-ha. I just remembered the case of the almost-extinct AML-1 box. This was a kludgy analog subscriber carrier used to multiplex a second POTS line over an existing physical pair. The box at the subscriber end was powered by a twelve volt nicad, trickle-charged from the physical loop when it was on hook. The on-hook voltage across the derived pair was between nine and twelve volts, and this dropped to six volts or so when the second line went off hook. Touch tones usually worked fine on these. The AML had its problems, so most of them are in the scrap heap by now. Good day. JSW Ybbat (DRBBS) 8.9 v. 3.14 r.1 (1:285/666.0) ------------------------------ From: wooters@ICSI.Berkeley.EDU (Chuck Wooters) Subject: Looking For a Solution to Voicemail Problem Date: 5 Jul 1993 06:13:00 GMT Organization: ICSI (International Computer Science Institute) Hello- I'm looking for a hardware/software combination that will let me collect data over a telephone line on my PC. Specifically, I want to run some experiments in which a person calls into my PC and navigates through a "simulated" voice-operated voicemail system. It will be simulated by a person (the Wizard) who is listening to the callers voice commands and controlling the voicemail system's responses. The purpose of this setup is to be able to evaluate different speech interfaces over the telephone. Some of the features I'm looking for include: 1) The ability for a person (the Wizard) to listen to the caller and control the voice-mail system's responses. 2) Programmability. A nice C, C++, (or whatever) programming interface. (I want to be able to construct different voicemail interfaces easily.) Thanks in advance for any help/suggestions. Chuck Wooters wooters@icsi.berkeley.edu ------------------------------ From: sweimar1@cc.swarthmore.edu (Steve Weimar) Subject: Connecting From Poland Organization: Geometry Forum Date: Mon, 5 Jul 1993 19:33:04 GMT I'll be working in Poland for two weeks. Any advice on how I might connect to my Internet account? I'll be using a Powerbook and Supra v32biz modem. steve [Moderator's Note: One of our regular readers is in Poland and I hope he will respond with details to this ... but anyone welcome! PAT] ------------------------------ From: wpns@newshost.pictel.com (Willie Smith) Subject: Re: Telepassport (was Re: Sprint Does it Again!) Organization: PictureTel Corporation Date: Mon, 5 Jul 1993 13:59:11 GMT jmm@Elegant.COM (John Macdonald) writes: > Pat writes:] >> Me! I am going to be offering a new service called 'Telepassport' >> lines installed for the purpose. They will let it ring once or twice >> (best to have it ring twice to be sure I catch the signal) then hang up. > Hmm, Pat, I can recall there having been many instances where you have > disapproved of the practice of passing messages through the phone > system without paying the phone company for the use of its services [...] > Is this system not a variant on the same theme? Someone calls your > equipment to pass a message to you without your answering the call and > thus causing their call to get billed by their phone company. > [Moderator's Note: Well, we are going to be using international toll- > free (ie 800) lines from AT&T. The foreign telco won't be out anything > one way or the other. Plus, AT&T is going to be handling all our > traffic, both on the return call to the subscriber and on his outbound > call through our system. Yeah, but Pat, you didn't answer the original question: Doesn't the deliberate and continued use of "call this number, I won't pick up, I'll call you back" constitute fraud, as you are passing messages thru the phone system without paying for them? AT&T may not mind, as it's generating revenue for them indirectly, but the foreign telco isn't even getting paid for the original call to the international 800 number. Do they normally not get paid (by AT&T) for the use of their facilities for such calls? Willie Smith wpns@pictel.com N1JBJ@amsat.org [Moderator's Note: I do not know how AT&T and the PTT's settle with each other on the use of international lines from overseas which are terminated in the USA. I know when we will call back to the subscriber the call will go over AT&T to the distant PTT and the PTT will collect on those calls in the usual way from AT&T. PAT] ------------------------------ From: stevef@wrq.com (Steve Forrette) Subject: Re: Cell Phone Fraud Losses Triple in a Year Date: 5 Jul 1993 21:34:48 GMT Organization: Walker Richer & Quinn, Inc., Seattle, WA In article haynes@cats.UCSC.EDU (Jim Haynes) writes: > Not to get into the old rut of arguing whether it's the cell phone > companies' own fault that their systems are poorly designed, and all > the analogies about whether you left your door unlocked, ad > infinitum ... but it does seem that the cell system doesn't make the > best use of available technology to prevent that kind of thing. > Maybe I'm armchair quarterbacking, but it seems to me Kerberos should > be good for making cell phone accounting really secure. It would also be a good way to make all current cellphones obsolete. Keep in mind that any change in the authentication protocol would necessitate making current phones unusable -- there would be no opportunity for having both the 'old' and the 'new' phones operable. After all, then the phreaks would always imitate an 'old' phone, wouldn't they? Even once a new standard was agreed upon, a carrier would have to either require all subscribers to replace their phones with what would certainly be just a few available models at higher prices, or buy a new phone for every subscriber. And then what would they do with roamers? It sure would have been nice if they had thought of these things 15 years ago when the AMPS standard was being developed. Then again, the proliferation of cellphones has greatly exceeded even the industry's wildest expectations. Ten years ago, cellular was just getting started in most markets, and nobody had any idea just how big it would get. With all of the growth, it makes the problem of dealing with the installed base enormous for any substantial change in the protocol. Steve Forrette, stevef@wrq.com [Moderator's Note: But you know something Steve? I'll bet the cellular industry could cut a deal with two or three (or how many ever) of the major cellphone manufacturers to make new phones at a deeply discounted rate, then *give them away* to existing customers for less than the current losses due to fraud. The cell companies would have to bite the bullet and do it, but once it was over with, so would be the problem for the most part. Didn't AT&T have to make some major changes in the 'way the system worked' in the 1960's to combat not only fraud but the extremely rapid increase in telecommunications usage? Contract with Motorola and others to make new phones; cut the best deal possible. Announce a cutover date and tell the subscribers to go to any dealer with (a) their old phone and (b) proof they are a sub- scriber on some cellular service -- maybe the most recent billing. Dealer would verify the customer was in good standing with the carrier, and issue a new phone on the spot *if the carrier approved the trans- action*. Dealer would be required to keep old phone which would be sent back to the factory as part of the deal for scrapping or to be retrofitted or whatever ... there would be a conversion period of two weeks or maybe three weeks for everyone to take in their old phone and get a new phone *in the approximate price range and with the same fea- tures as their old one*. In other words, no upgrading to better quality phones (other than where security is concerned) at the expense of the cell company. At the time the conversion was to begin, and for the two or three weeks it was in progress, the carrier's software would be toggled to *ignore* ESN's it could not understand, did not recieve, etc. This would be sort of like they do now with demonstration phone numbers used by dealers: every cell phone on the premises can be used to demonstrate how it works; the tower simply is told when calls come from (cell) phone number such and such, ignore the ESN ... and don't think a few phreaks are not familiar with the cell phone number used by the Radio Shack dealer in their community and don't set their phones to go out on his 'demonstration' phone number ... :). On the closing day of the conversion, toggle that software back to normal status. Yes there would be two or three weeks of fraud galore, and yes, the cost of conversion -- giving the customer a free phone of equal value but with enhanced security -- would run in the millions of dollars. How much is fraud costing now? I'd be very surprised if the conversion was not amortized in several months or a year at best. Once it was over with, the old phones would be worth zilch, that is, in the event you decided to keep a few and try to bluff the carriers. You watch, there will be a major shakeup and reform before long ... there has to be the way the cell carriers are being eaten alive. PAT] ------------------------------ End of TELECOM Digest V13 #451 ******************************   Received: from delta.eecs.nwu.edu by mintaka.lcs.mit.edu id aa26808; 6 Jul 93 4:54 EDT Received: by delta.eecs.nwu.edu id AA11756 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4 for telecomlist-outbound); Tue, 6 Jul 1993 02:29:33 -0500 Received: by delta.eecs.nwu.edu id AA18373 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4 for telecomlist); Tue, 6 Jul 1993 02:29:01 -0500 Date: Tue, 6 Jul 1993 02:29:01 -0500 From: TELECOM Moderator Message-Id: <199307060729.AA18373@delta.eecs.nwu.edu> To: telecom@eecs.nwu.edu Subject: TELECOM Digest V13 #452 TELECOM Digest Tue, 6 Jul 93 02:29:00 CDT Volume 13 : Issue 452 Inside This Issue: Moderator: Patrick A. Townson First Announcement/On-Line Congressional Hearing (Journet via Nigel Allen) Help Wanted Addressing Email (John Hurst) International Yellow Pages Wanted (Hindra Irawan) Answering Machine Bypass Code Information Wanted (Dennis Mitchell) Telephone Gateway Information Wanted (J. van Zijll de Jong) Auto Call Back on Collect Call? (juyoung@kiwi.ucs.indiana.edu) How to Get EIA/TIA Standards? (Marko Ilari Silventoinen) Re: How to Destroy a COCOT (Justin Greene) Re: How to Destroy a COCOT (Charles Stephens) Re: Value Added Voice Services (Steve Forrette) Re: Time Signals via Modem (Louis A. Mamakos) Re: GSM Security (Haakon Styri) Re: Only in Texas (Charles Stephens) More About Counterfeiting (Andrew Finkenstadt) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 6 Jul 93 02:08:30 EDT From: ae446@freenet.carleton.ca (Nigel Allen) Subject: First Announcement/On-Line Congressional Hearing Organization: Echo Beach Reply-To: ae446@freenet.carleton.ca I found the following message on the JOURNET@QUCDN.BITNET mailing list. From: David Farber Subject: First Announcement/On-Line Congressional Hearing Station: Internet Multicasting Service Channel: Internet Town Hall Program: On-Line Congressional Hearing Release: July 5, 1993 Content: First Announcement/On-Line Congressional Hearing On July 26 at 9:30AM EDT, the Subcommittee on Telecommunications and Finance of the U.S. House of Representatives will hold the first Congressional Hearing ever held over a computer network. The oversight hearing on "The Role of Government in Cyberspace" will take place in the Grand Ballroom of the National Press Club at 14th and F Streets, N.W., Washington, D.C. The hearing is open to the public. An open house will be held from 3 - 5PM on the same day in the same location and is also open to the public. Chairman Markey has asked that this historic occasion demonstrate the potential and diversity of the global Internet. Thirty Sparcstations will be in the hearing room, allowing members of Congress, staff, and their guests to read e-mail, use Gopher menus, read testimony in WAIS databases, browse the World Wide Web, and otherwise use the resources of the global Internet as part of the hearing. Some witnesses for the hearing will testify remotely, sending audio and video over the Internet. Audio and video of the hearing will also be multicast over the Multicast Backbone (MBONE). We are hoping that C-SPAN and other traditional media will also carry the event. *MORE DETAILS ON MBONE AND OTHER WAYS TO WATCH THE HEARINGS REMOTELY WILL BE FORTHCOMING SHORTLY.* One of the primary points that we are hoping to demonstrate is the diversity and size of the Internet. We have therefore established an electronic mail address by which people on the Internet can communicate with the Subcommittee before and during the hearing: congress@town.hall.org We encourage you to send your comments on what the role of government should be in the information age to this address. Your comments to this address will be made part of the public record of the hearing. Feel free to carry on a dialogue with others on a mailing list, cc'ing the e-mail address. Your cards and letters to congress@town.hall.org will help demonstrate that there are people who use the Internet as part of their personal and professional lives. We encourage you to send comments on the role of government in cyberspace, on what role cyberspace should play in government (e.g., whether government data be made available on the Internet), on how the Internet should be built and financed, on how you use the Internet, and on any other topic you feel is appropriate. This is your chance to show the U.S. Congress that there is a constituency that cares about this global infrastructure. If you would like to communicate with a human being about the hearing, you may send your comments and questions to: hearing-info@town.hall.org Support for the Internet Town Hall is provided by Sun Microsystems and O'Reilly & Associates. Additional support for the July 26 on-line congressional hearing is being provided by ARPA, BBN Communications, the National Press Club, Xerox PARC, and many other organizations. Network connectivity for the Internet Town Hall is provided by UUNET Technologies. Nigel Allen, Toronto, Ontario, Canada ae446@freenet.carleton.ca ------------------------------ From: jhurst@netcom.com (John Hurst) Subject: Help Wanted Addressing Email Organization: NETCOM On-line Communication Services (408 241-9760 guest) Date: Tue, 6 Jul 1993 03:43:59 GMT I am trying to find an email route to my dad in Omaha. He says his address from denver is omhp/nwnt11/thurst. Thanks in advance for your help. John Hurst jhurst@netcom.com ------------------------------ From: irawan@netcom.com (Hindra Irawan) Subject: International Yellow Pages Wanted Organization: NETCOM On-line Communication Services (408 241-9760 guest) Date: Tue, 6 Jul 1993 04:00:08 GMT I need help locating distributor/publisher/supplier for computer readable (CDROM/tape/disks any format) of international yellow pages. Does this thing even exist? I thank you for any leads that you can provide me. Hindra Irawan hin@aol.com irawan@netcom.com ------------------------------ From: mitchell@cwis.unomaha.edu (Dennis Mitchell) Subject: Answering Machine Bypass Code Informatio Wanted Organization: University of Nebraska at Omaha Date: Tue, 6 Jul 1993 03:18:47 GMT I'm looking for a new answering machine, I've heard that one with the features I want exists, but I have no idea who makes it. My fiance works nights, and sleeps during the day. When she's in bed, she unplugs the phone and lets her answering machine take all the calls. Generally that's all right, but _sometimes_ there are calls that she needs to receive right away. We need to find an answering machine that will prevent the phone from ringing unless the caller enters a bypass code of some sort. Can anyone offer a suggestion on where to look? ------------------------------ From: J.VanZijll@massey.ac.nz (J van Zijll de Jong) Subject: Telephone Gateway Information Wanted Organization: School of Maths and Info Sciences, Massey University, NZ. Date: Tue, 6 Jul 1993 01:59:06 GMT Does anyone have any information on telephone gateways. I am doing a fourth year project at Massey University New Zealand on home automation. I am interested in being able to have remote operation of the home control system via the telephone. I know that SMART HOUSE has a AT&T telephone gateway, but I have been unable to get any information on it. Do you know of any other products avaiable that would be relevant to my project. Thanks, Jeroen ------------------------------ From: juyoung@kiwi.ucs.indiana.edu Subject: Auto Call Back on Collect Call? Organization: Computer Science, Indiana University Date: Tue, 6 Jul 1993 01:21:47 -0500 After reading recent posting about passing the message without accepting the collect call, I just wonder if the auto callback feature can work on those unaccepted collect calls. For example, a person call collect from a payphone, can the other party say no to the telco, that is, not accepting the call, but use auto call back to call the payphone (provided it accepts incoming call) and talk to the party there? [Moderator's Note: This will not work because auto callback like other CLASS features relies on getting the number of the calling party. When the call goes through the operator, the called party's number is not sent along to the end recipient. In other words, if the operator calls you it shows up as 'outside' on the Caller-ID box. Auto callback attempts will fail, and the computer will tell you either it has for- gotten the number, or never had it to begin with, or similar. What you *can* do, although it is illegal and a violation of tariff is have the calling party call you *person to person collect*. When someone answers and tells the operator you are not there, the calling party can ask the operator to 'leave word'. She will then leave a message with the person who answered your phone saying 'Ask Mr. Smith to call Mr. Brown in Chicago. Dial the long distance operator, ask for Operator 7 and the Chicago number 312-xxx-xxxx." Now there is no such person as 'Operator 7' (or maybe the number has since been changed). That is merely a code phrase which tells *any* AT&T operator handling the return call to put the call through and bill it at operator assisted person to person rates and show Chicago as the originating point of the call for inter-company billing purposes, etc. When you receive this message, instead of going through the Operator 7 routine, you simply dial the Chicago number at station dial rates, saving quite a bit of money (again assuming the payphone he called from accepts incoming calls.) Like other collect call scams where a message is passed but no one pays for it; it is illegal to return the call direct without advising AT&T to bill it at person to person rates, but at least the company gets some money out of the deal; all they lost was the operator's time and surcharge. PAT] ------------------------------ From: s35316s@puukko.hut.fi (Marko Ilari Silventoinen) Subject: How to Get EIA/TIA Standards? Organization: Helsinki University of Technology, Finland Date: Tue, 6 Jul 1993 06:26:57 GMT Hello there, Could somebody tell me how can I obtain EIA/TIA standards? The address or telefax number of TIA office would do also. Thank you in advance, Marko Silventoinen, PhD student of Helsinki University of Technology, Finland. ------------------------------ From: jgreene@nyx.cs.du.edu (Justin Greene) Subject: Re: How to Destroy a COCOT Organization: Nyx, Public Access Unix at U. of Denver Math/CS dept. Date: Mon, 5 Jul 93 22:52:15 GMT > (useful for voicemail, calling cards, etc.). Can anyone recommend a > good tone dialer? Are they available in general electronics stores? Radio Shack sells a few models the cheapest being about $20.00. > 2. If I use a COCOT to place a collect call to Canada, then assuming > the call goes through at all, can I assume the party in Canada will > be charged only the standard rate for a collect call (as opposed to > the exorbitant AOS rate)? I've always assumed that the AOS would have > no way of charging their high rates for collect calls to Canada because > of the monopoly situation in Canada. Am I right? Which standard rate? Be careful as a lot of COCOTS use small expensive third party carriers. They should however allow you to select a carrier using 10xxx0. Justin [Moderator's Note: On a collect call, the rate charged is the rate in effect at the telco originating the call and per the time of day at the place of origin ... the recipient's telco rates or his time of day have no bearing on it. He is simply agreeing to pay on behalf of the caller. PAT] ------------------------------ From: cfs@mathcs.emory.edu (Charles Stephens (ast GA uucpMC - exp 1/9/93)) Subject: Re: How to Destroy a COCOT Date: 6 Jul 1993 03:32:28 GMT Organization: Emory University, Dept of Math and CS Well if it isn't so profitable, then why aren't there less COCOTS and AOS's around?!?! Wouldn't they go belly up sooner or later? Charles Stephens cfs@mathcs.emory.edu DISCLAIMER: I am a guest a Emory's Math and CS Dept., all opinions expressed, except those quoted by others, are my own, and not those of said organization. [Moderator's Note: A lot of them have gone out of business. People have gone into the COCOT business knowing diddly about the telecom industry, and wound up getting eaten alive by fraud and vandalism to their phones. COCOTS are not a get rich quick business. If you have a bunch of COCOTS out on the street you must pay attention to them. They are as subject to vandalism and theft as the 'genuine Bell phones' plus they have the distinct disadvantage of no central office intelligence. So the owner either programs them correctly or he stands to lose big time. PAT] ------------------------------ From: stevef@wrq.com (Steve Forrette) Subject: Re: Value Added Voice Services Date: 5 Jul 1993 21:52:07 GMT Organization: Walker Richer & Quinn, Inc., Seattle, WA In article deej@cbnewsf.cb.att.com (david.g.lewis) writes: > In article itbkl@puknet.puk.ac.za >> 2. When making calls from some hotel rooms, all the numbers dialed are >> intercepted, printed out, and used by hotel staff when calculating >> your bill. When you dial the card-calling service, your ID (or >> card-number) AND your secret number, is also printed out. > Actually, it isn't. The hotel switch receives only the tones used to > reach the card service provider. It then cuts through the voice path, > and the remaining tones are sent directly to the card service > provider. If the hotel were to monitor and intercept those tones, it > would be in violation of those same wiretap laws. I know someone that used to be the front desk manager at a hotel. With their equipment, which was in common use at many hotels a few years ago, the calling card number was definately recorded by the hotel's equipment. This was in the days before integrated billing equipment at the front desk. Each device that generated charges for the guest printed out its own ticker of the charges, which the front desk clerk then manually keyed into the register to put on the guest's folio. The pay-per-view cable machine printed out little tickets which were keyed in by hand, and the PBX did the same. For every call that was placed, the PBX would print out a single line on an 80 column dot matrix printer. The guest would dial 9+ for a local call, and 8-1+ for a long distance call billed to the room, or 8-0+ for a long distance call billed collect or to a calling card. In any event, all digits dialed from the guests phone (up to the first 32 digits) were printed on the printer, including the called number (of course) and the calling card number. This was not done for any nefarious purpose, but simply because the device that recorded the digits was too dumb to do anything else. The front desk personnel were trained to just ignore the 8-0+ calls, and only enter charges for the other ones. My friend who was the manager said that the other front desk personnel weren't bright enough to figure out what the other digits were -- they were told by the manager to just ignore the 8-0 calls, and that's what they did. He did note that there was a large opportunity for anyone that knew what the digits were to have a constant supply of valid stolen calling card numbers. I would imagine that the AT&T fraud people would be able to corrolate that a large number of cards that are used at a particular establishment were later reported compromised, and would be able to have the management look into it. But the bottom line is that this definately was wide-spread in the 80's. Now, most hotels have integrated compter systems, where the PBX feeds the charges directly into the billing computer, so the clerk never sees the SMDR directly. Steve Forrette, stevef@wrq.com ------------------------------ From: louie@sayshell.umd.edu (Louis A. Mamakos) Subject: Re: Time Signals via Modem Date: 6 Jul 1993 01:46:03 GMT Organization: University of Maryland, College Park In article dannyb@panix.com (Daniel Burstein) writes: > You can -guess- based on phone line distance, but there are so many > factors involved (what route was taken, what's the built in delay from > signal processing ... or, to paraphrase Admiral Harper: "How many > nanoseconds are there between your system and Fort Collins?") that you > really are just making a guess. Arrggg ... it's Admiral Grace Hopper. She's only been dead a short time now. I'm glad I was able to see her in person giving a talk on the "stone-age" of computing and other interesting topics. Louis Mamakos ------------------------------ From: Haakon.Styri@nta.no (YuNoHoo) Subject: Re: GSM Security Organization: Norwegian Telecom Research Date: Tue, 6 Jul 93 02:09:14 GMT lmcrajy@noah.ericsson.se (Raj Sanmugam) writes: > The governments consider the security measures in the GSM system as > "Too secure". I am not familiar with the #435 comments. But, I think > the GSM security measures should make it much more difficult, if not > impossible, to penetrate the system. The security measures you are thinking about here wouldn't be the authentication scheme, but rather the encryption of signalling and the data ("speech" or whatever). Encryption of the signalling does of course help against fraud, but encrypting the data channel is more of a privacy question. The way GSM was designed the authentication is mandatory, but the encryption is optional. If either the handset or the base station doesn't turn on encryption it will not be used. However, even a flexible design may turn into a political hot potato when the subject is encryption. I'll say no more (in this group anyway). Haakon Styri std. disclaimer applies. ------------------------------ From: cfs@mathcs.emory.edu (Charles Stephens (ast GA uucpMC - exp 1/9/93)) Subject: Re: Only in Texas Date: 6 Jul 1993 03:28:05 GMT Organization: Emory University, Dept of Math and CS Randal L. Schwartz (merlyn@ora.com) wrote: > In article , khx@se44.wg2.waii.com (K > Husain) writes: >> I saw a similar listing in the Austin, residence pages by a Heanauder >> Titzhoff a few years ago. Don't see him here now. If I remember >> correctly some guy did answer the phone and acknowldege the name when >> my roommate had called. Found it quite by accident actually ... > Several years ago, one of the Portland Oregon phonebook whitepages had > "FARRAH ... FAWCETT" as the range of last names covered on that page. > No kidding. While we are on the subject, the Atlanta white pages lists as the last resident: ZZMMTHISJ Zibre 123 Elm St. SW Mreta --- 555-1212 (Phone and address changed obviously...) It think his (or is his hers?) parents wanted to ensure that person would show up last in any alphabetical listing ... Charles Stephens cfs@mathcs.emory.edu DISCLAIMER: I am a guest a Emory's Math and CS Dept., all opinions expressed, except those quoted by others, are my own, and not those of said organization. [Moderator's Note: The last one in Chicago for several years -- as long as I can remember -- has been Mr. Zzyxy. He exists, they say. PAT] ------------------------------ From: andy@vistachrome.com (Andrew Finkenstadt) Subject: More on Counterfeiting Reply-To: andy@vistachrome.com Organization: Vista-Chrome, Inc. Date: Tue, 6 Jul 1993 05:47:44 GMT Our Esteemed Moderator noted: > Counterfeiting requires a claim by the person making the > reproduction that his scrip is the currency of the United States. A > printed repudiation on the scrip is all that is required; note the > newspaper advertising coupons which include 'savings dollars' and the > like; any 'too close to the real thing' always have a disclaimer > printed on them. It is a requirement of the Secret Service to make ANY color copies of money via press, xerography or sublimation less than 75% or more than 150% of the original size in all cases. Even then sometimes they will come after you for other specks in your eye, ignoring the plank in the eyes of the Miami hoods. We (Vista-Chrome) once printed a dollar savings book which had pictures of various kinds of money including coinage and bills which was distributed in the Seattle area. They traced it back to us in Tallahassee, came in, said they wanted the the film, the plates, any spoilage, the camera readies, and never to do that again. Andrew Finkenstadt | andy@{homes.com,vistachrome.com,genie.geis.com} Systems Analyst | Vista-Chrome, Homes & Land Publishing Corporation | 1600 Capital Circle SW, Tallahassee Florida 32310 +1 904-575-0189 | GEnie Postmaster, Unix & Internet RoundTables Sysop ------------------------------ End of TELECOM Digest V13 #452 ******************************   Received: from delta.eecs.nwu.edu by mintaka.lcs.mit.edu id aa21519; 7 Jul 93 2:25 EDT Received: by delta.eecs.nwu.edu id AA14171 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4 for telecomlist-outbound); Tue, 6 Jul 1993 23:58:50 -0500 Received: by delta.eecs.nwu.edu id AA29336 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4 for telecomlist); Tue, 6 Jul 1993 23:58:08 -0500 Date: Tue, 6 Jul 1993 23:58:08 -0500 From: TELECOM Moderator Message-Id: <199307070458.AA29336@delta.eecs.nwu.edu> To: telecom@eecs.nwu.edu Subject: TELECOM Digest V13 #453 TELECOM Digest Tue, 6 Jul 93 23:58:00 CDT Volume 13 : Issue 453 Inside This Issue: Moderator: Patrick A. Townson Cox and BellSouth Want to Use 511 (Brendan B. Boerner) Canada <--> US Call Rates (was Re: How to Destroy a COCOT) (Steve Kass) Exclusion Module Question (Michael Weigang) BBS to Internet Connection (Thomas Hinders) Any Communication Exposition/Show in the Near Future? (Heng Chu) Northern Telecom Wins AGT Pact (Washington Times via Paul Robinson) North American Numbering Plan (Bob Schwartz) Digital Signature Patents (Paul Robinson) Some More Historical Questions (Martin McCormick) Most Economical Way to Call Canada From UK (Tony Palik) Touchtone Pad Needed (George Thurman) DID Chip? (Seth B. Rothenberg) Canadian Telecoms Law (Tyson Macaulay) SL-1 Msg Waiting Light Always On! (Richard Hyde) Re: Caller ID via 800 Number (tanner@ki4pv.compu.com) Re: Gnocchi al Telefono (Frederick Roeber) New House Problems (Chris Ambler) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: BBOERNER@novell.com (Brendan B. Boerner) Subject: Cox and BellSouth Want to Use 511 Organization: Novell, Inc. --Austin Date: Tue, 6 Jul 1993 15:45:07 GMT I was reading in the {Austin Chronicle} the other day that Cox Enterprises, Inc. (big paper chain, owns the {Austin American Statesman}) and BellSouth have announced an "agreement in principle" to form a joint company that will deliver information services to consumers who dial 511 (for a small fee of course). I think the Austin A-S has been trying to generate demand for such a service by offering a service where you can call them up and get additional information about a topic or whatnot in the paper by punching in a four digit code next to the article or whatever you were reading. Presumably if they are ever able to charge for this then they will have hooked some percentage of current callers. My questions are: Who controls the allocation of N11 numbers? And if presumably the allocation is controlled by a regulatory body and not the phone company, why in God's name would these guys even think of allocating such a number so phone companies/newspapers can make a buck? Tell them to get a phone number like the rest of us ... Let's see: 111 - can phone equipment distinquish between this and a L.D. call? 211 - ? 311 - ? 411 - Directory assistance 511 - Proposed information services 611 - ? 711 - ? 811 - ? 911 - Emergency services This means that there would be five, maybe six codes left over. Hmmm, I wonder if we can think of a better use for 511. Later, Brendan B. Boerner Phone: 512/346-8380 MHS: bboerner@novell Internet: bboerner@novell.com \ Please use either if replying or Brendan_Boerner@novell.com / by mail exterior to Novell. Disclaimer: My views are my own, not Novell's. They pay me to write code, not speak for them. [Moderator's Note: Don't forget 611 in your list above which is often used for repair service. 811 is used in California to reach the phone company business office. Of course, 011 is used as a prefix for inter- national calls from the USA. Within any given area code, the telco of record (as often as not, a Bell company) is responsible for doling out the exchanges or prefixes. For instance, in 312/708, Illinois Bell arranges for Centel to have certain prefixes, keeping others for their own use. I think elsewhere in Illinois, IBT also controls the process and arranges with the other telcos in the state regards who gets what. With this in mind, BellSouth (although I think you mean Southwestern Bell) can pretty much do as they please with 511 within their territory, so long as it does not conflict with the same code being used by some other telco in the area code. *Area code* assignments are a different matter. PAT] ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 06 Jul 1993 12:06:44 -0400 (EDT) From: SKASS@DREW.DREW.EDU Subject: Canada <--> US Call Rates (was Re: How to Destroy a COCOT) In TELECOM Digest Volume 13 : Issue 452 The Moderator noted: > [Moderator's Note: On a collect call, the rate charged is the rate in > effect at the telco originating the call and per the time of day at > the place of origin ... the recipient's telco rates or his time of day > have no bearing on it. He is simply agreeing to pay on behalf of the > caller. PAT] The recipient's telco rates can affect the cost of a call. When I was living in Canada five years ago, I found this was the case for some calling card calls. The situation was this: AT&T calling card Bell Canada calling card ============================================= | Bell Canada rate for a Call from US to AT&T rates | call entirely within Canada | Canada based on distance | called! ============================================= | Call from Canada Bell Canada rate | Bell Canada rate to US converted to $US | | In a perfect world, the upper right box should read AT&T rate converted to $Cdn. Since AT&T carried the call, it should be their rate, right? Anyway, after paying very high rates for such calls, I started using a friend's AT&T card for calls back to Canada. It never made sense to me, but I read the tariffs and they backed up this assymetrical rate structure. Does anyone know if this is still the case? Steve Kass, Math/CS, Drew U, Madison, NJ 07940 skass@drew.drew.edu, 201-514-1187 ------------------------------ From: mweigang@umce.umext.maine.edu (Michael Weigang) Subject: Exclusion Module Question Organization: University of Maine Date: Tue, 6 Jul 1993 13:36:53 GMT We have offices where multiple modems and phones are connected to the same phone line. We run into problems with people placing voice or modem calls while someone is already connected via modem. We are experimenting with a device called a 41405 Station Exclu- sion Module from Proctor. Apparently, this device, when connected to each modem and phone in the office, will prevent someone from beaking into another's call. How does this device work? (I have a very limited knowledge of phone systems.) Is this the best solution for our problem? BTW, all phones in our offices run through key systems like a Merlin, or Panasonic 616. Michael Weigang University of Maine e-mail: mweigang@umce.umext.maine.edu Cooperative Extension, Rm 114 Phone: (207) 581-3871 5741 Libby Hall Fax: (207) 581-1387 Orono, ME 04469-5741 ------------------------------ Date: 06 Jul 1993 10:28:10 EDT From: Hinders, Thomas Subject: BBS to Internet Connection I have a friend who is setting up a BBS system (for the Commonwealth of PA). He would like the BBS to be able to pass messages to/from the Internet. Fidonet came to mind. Could someone point me towards information on obtaining Fidonet access, etc. Does anyone have any other suggestions. Thanks............. Tom Hinders/Soft-Switch +1 215 640 7487 (v/vm) +1 215 640 7511 (f) Internet: thinder@SSW.COM X.400: C=US A=Telemail P=Softswitch S=Hinders G=Thomas [Moderator's Note: Have your friend check a local BBS list for Fido sites. Any local FIDO sysop would be able to refer him to the coordinator for the local network and arrange for him to get a 'node number' and be part of the node listings which come out weekly. Or, your friend could run a BBS using something similar to Waffle; this has UUCP mail and news as part of the package. Then all he has to do is cut a deal with a local public access Unix site to get a news feed and mail from them. I imagine this message will prompt at least a few people in your vicinity to write a note with offers of help, etc. PAT] ------------------------------ From: chu@cs.unc.edu (Heng Chu) Subject: Any Communication Exposition/Show in the Near Future? Date: 6 Jul 1993 16:05:54 -0400 Organization: The University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill (I am asking this for my friend who has no access to news service. My friend wants to know if there is any communication exposition/show (NOT of academic type) in the coming few months. Any information or pointer will be appreciated. Please reply to me (chu@cs.unc.edu) and I will pass on the information. Thanks a lot! Heng Chu chu@cs.unc.edu ------------------------------ Reply-To: TDARCOS@MCIMAIL.COM From: Paul Robinson Date: Tue, 06 Jul 1993 16:11:33 EDT Subject: Northern Telecom Wins AGT Pact Page B4, {Washington Times}, 6/6/93 "Edmonton, Alberta - Northern Telecom Ltd. received a three-year contract worth more than $18 million from AGT Ltd. to supply copper, fiber optics and cable. AGT, Canada's third-largest telephone company, operates the phone system for most of the province of Alberta and is the main unit of Telus Corp. Northern Telecom's U.S. unit is also a major supplier of telephone equipment." ------------------------------ Subject: North American Numbering Plan From: bob@bci.nbn.com (Bob Schwartz) Date: Tue, 06 Jul 93 14:23:59 PDT Organization: Bill Correctors, Inc., Marin County, California Sure enough, the North American Numbering Plan seems to be cuumbling before our eyes. The introduction of "1 and 0" as the second digit for NPA and NNX is tough enough but when I asked a Pacific Bell executive what will happen in 1994 (my estimate) when LATA competition is authorized, he looked puzzled. I explained my question further by asking if local numbers had been set aside for competition as was the case for 800#'s prior to portability. I also asked if portability would be a feature of Lata competition. The answer - We don't know yet Belcore hasn't told us, but we just may have to implement ten digit local, intra-LATA, accross the street , dialing like they have in parts of New York. Imagine, 1 + ten digits to call the apartment next door! Bob Schwartz bob@bci.nbn.com Bill Correctors, Inc. +1 415 488 9000 Marin County, California [Moderator's Note: Hey, I have to dial 1 + 708 to call fifty feet across the street to the McDonald's to have them fix and bring me my dinner. I am right on an area code boundary between 312/708 (Howard Street). You'll survive! PAT] ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 6 Jul 1993 22:16:53 -0400 (EDT) Reply-To: 0005066432@MCIMAIL.COM Subject: Digital Signature Patents From: Paul Robinson Organization: Tansin A. Darcos & Company, Silver Spring, MD USA It has been mentioned that there is an E-Mail address related to the Digital Signature Patent item. It is as follows: The eMail address for: Michael R. Rubin Active Chief Counsel for Technology Room A-1111, Administration Building, National Institute of Standards and Technology Gaithersburg, Maryland 20899 (301) 975-2803. mrubin@cam.nist.gov Paul Robinson - TDARCOS@MCIMAIL.COM ------------------------------ Subject: Some More Historical Questions Date: Tue, 06 Jul 1993 16:38:30 -0500 From: Martin McCormick The discussion of the origin of the -48 volt DC telephone line voltage reminds me of an interesting story told by a Southwestern Bell official who appeared on a radio talk show, once. He said that when Oklahoma became a state on November 16, 1907, a speech was broadcast from Oklahoma City to Tulsa via telephone line so that Tulsans could participate in the celebration. The account of this hookup said that the governor spoke into a water-cooled microphone in Oklahoma City and the signal was audible in Tulsa, about 100 Miles to the Northeast. I actually called into the talk show and asked the official for more details about the setup, but he only had that schetchy account. In 1907, vacuum tubes were in their infancy, if available, so it almost sounds like they just ran an incredible current through that microphone and used water to keep it from doing a melt-down. The audio in Tulsa must have been really fabulous after 100 miles of open-wire unequalized line. If anybody has actual knowledge of a similar system, please give us a technical description. In that day and time, this type of telecommunication was probably as amazing to the listeners as holograms or tiny cell phones are, today. Martin McCormick WB5AGZ Stillwater, OK O.S.U. Computer Center Data Communications Group [Moderator's Note: Yours is the second time I've heard that story, and it is hard to imagine how it was done. My grandfather was born about 1880 near (what was then) Tulsa, Indian Territory, in a small town called Tahlequah. As a young man he was an administrative assistant to the federal governor who oversaw or administered Indian Territory. He told me about being at the ceremony when the federal government officially disincorporated Indian Territory simultaenously with the establishment of Oklahoma as a state in the USA. He kept telling me they 'broadcast the ceremony over the radio' and I kept telling him they didn't likely have radios then. 'Well,' he said, 'they took turns talking in a microphone to people ...'. Grandpa was almost eighty years old when he told me about this, and his memory from a half-century before was not good. Amazing technology? By the time grandpa left us he had seen in his lifetime: the invention of radio, television, talking movies, airplanes, automobiles, computers, countless other things; he saw the telephone and electricity come into very wide acceptance and use as well, bringing with widespread electrical distribution the use of refriger- ators, fans, household lighting, etc. Can you imagine coming into a world with none of those things as a young person growing up and and having all of them in your daily life when you leave? Will we ever see another century like the 20th in terms of sheer variety of inventions and technological changes? Of course *I* remember when there were no computers and television was only something that a few very rich people had in their houses and phones were black instruments with a round dial if you lived in a place where the exchange was 'modern'. I suppose given life-expectancy rates I will be around until 2030 or so, and many of you will be around until 2070. Given the changes in the past century, doesn't it blow your mind to think of what technology will be like when *you* depart? I know it excites me. PAT] ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 6 Jul 1993 08:49:00 +0000 From: Tony (A.T.) Palik Subject: Most Economical Way to Call Canada from UK I will shortly be moving from Canada to the UK on a semi-permanent basis. My wife and I have a number of relatives here in Canada and will call them on a regular basis. Being aware of the rates from BT and Mercury, I thought I could use my Bell Canada Calling Card and make my calls through Canada Direct. No luck. Bell won't let you keep a Calling Card if you don't have a home phone number to bill it to. In an attempt to give me more choices, I have obtained both MCI and Sprint Cards through no small amount of grief (at least with MCI. What do you mean you don't have a zip code ? A story for another day). I can therefore route calls through the US to Canada. My question is, have others facing this situation determined what provider offers the best rate? Are there other providers that offer better rates? I'm reluctant to go to AT&T given who I work for. Tony Palik +1-613-763-8883|Bell Northern Internet : tpalik@bnr.ca |Research Ltd. Ottawa ENVOY 100 : TONY.PALIK |Ontario, Canada ------------------------------ From: gst@gagme.chi.il.us (George Thurman) Subject: Touchtone Pad Needed Organization: GAGME - Public Access UNIX of Chicago, Illinois, USA, Earth Date: Tue, 6 Jul 1993 12:06:00 GMT Does anyone know where I can buy some old Western Electric Touch-Tone pads? I need the real old ** POLARITY SENSIVIVE ** type. Please E-mail me. Thanks !! GEORGE S. THURMAN (312) 509-6308 gst@gagme.chi.il.us ------------------------------ From: rothen+@pitt.edu (Seth B Rothenberg) Subject: DID Chip? Date: 6 Jul 93 19:02:26 GMT Organization: University of Pittsburgh Having resolved that there's no cheaper substitute for DID service, I would like to ask if there is anyone who knows where I could find out if there is a chip that supports DID? (I figure, if you can buy a telephone-on-a-chip at Radio Shack, maybe there's a chance you can buy DID-on-a-chip someplace ... it does not need to be as close as the Radio Shack up the street.) Thanks, Seth ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 6 Jul 93 15:28:38 EDT From: Tyson=Macaulay%DTP%DGCP=HQ=ADMSR@dgbt.banyan.doc.ca Subject: Canadian Telecom Law It occured to me that I never saw this press release posted anywhere on the 'net. (Better late than never.) Though this is an offical Canadian Government press release, I regret that it cannot be made available in both offical languages. This is due to the fact that french, with it accents and hyphens, is incompatible with the ASCII format. I tried and failed to send the French version with the English version. If there is a way around this I would appreciate hearing about it. Regards, Tyson Macaulay e-mail: tyson@debra.dgbt.doc.ca tmacaula@ccs.carleton.ca Communications Canada 7th Floor, Journal Tower North 300 Slater Street Ottawa, Ontario K1A 0C8 ---------------------------------- JUNE 23, 1993 FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE Canada has its first Telecommunications Act OTTAWA -- Communications Minister Perrin Beatty today announced that Canada now has, for the first time in its history, comprehensive telecommunications legislation. Bill C-62, the Telecommunications Act, today received Royal Assent. The new legislation will replace a mixture of outdated Acts that had been used to regulate telecommunications. "Canadians everywhere will benefit from the passage of the Telecommunications Act," said Mr. Beatty. "This forward-looking piece of legislation will open the doors to new communications products and services, and will help to propel our already world famous telecommunications industry into the twenty-first century. This legislation will also help to protect Canadian consumers from intrusive or abusive telemarketing practices, including 'junk' faxes." Before C-62, telecommunications was governed by a mixture of The Railway Act, the National Telecommunications Powers and Procedures Act, the Telegraphs Act, and a number of special Acts. C-62's focus on a unified national regulatory structure will help to accelerate the market entry of new products and services, to the benefit of both consumers and businesses. "C-62 is the first successful overhaul of telecommunications legislation in over 60 years," added Mr. Beatty. "As such, it is also the first piece of legislation that can pave the way for the Electronic Highway System, which depends heavily on advances in telecommunications technology. With the Telecommunications Act, Canadians and Canadian businesses will be able to take full advantage of the leading-edge telecommunications media that are just around the corner!" Contacts: Charles Chenard Minister's Office Ottawa, Ontario (613) 990-6886 ------------------------------ From: rah@netcom.com (Richard Hyde) Subject: SL-1 Msg Waiting Light Always on! Organization: NETCOM On-line Communication Services (408 241-9760 guest) Date: Tue, 6 Jul 1993 17:05:36 GMT I've got a puzzle that I hope someone out there can help me with. We have an NT SL-1 switch with M2616 sets attached. Our VP Sales has a message waiting light that remains lit, even when all messages have been deleted from the list. Unplugging the phone briefly causes the light to extinguish for a few seconds, but then the switch re-activates it. Performing a DISU followed by an ENLU has no effect. The manuals seem to have no information on this situation, but then again, they are NT manuals and the information could be anywhere :-) Right before this problem with the light occured, I had programed this DN and two others to appear on the area associates desk. Both of the other two DNs are working correctly. Thanks for the help! Richard Hyde RaH@netcom.com ------------------------------ From: tanner@ki4pv.compu.com Subject: Re: Caller ID via 800 Number Organization: CompuData Inc., DeLand Date: Tue, 6 Jul 93 09:26:04 GMT > If you are receiving harrasing calls, call your telco's business > office and explain the situation. If you are in Southern Bell territory, you can save some time by not doing this. All they will do is try to sell you a service where, for so much a month (or so much per use) they will print the caller's number inside their office. While they won't give it to you, they may offer some co-operation (for a fee) with law enforcement. This phone co practice makes it more costly to be the victim of harrassing callers. Of course, the phone company profits by this crime, and therefore does nothing effective to discourage it. I wonder if I can charge the deputies $4.50 the next time I am a witness to crime, thereby profiting from it, or if the privilege of profiteering is restricted to phone companies. ------------------------------ From: roeber@vxcrna.cern.ch (Frederick Roeber) Subject: Re: Gnocchi al Telefono Reply-To: roeber@cern.ch Organization: CERN -- European Organization for Nuclear Research Date: Tue, 6 Jul 1993 08:33:33 GMT In article , bellutta@ohsu.EDU (Paolo Bellutta) writes: > In article gmw1@cunixa.cc.columbia. edu (Gabe M Wiener) writes: >> Gnocchi al Telefono > I'm Italian, an I never heard about such a kind of Gnocchi. You guys are missing the obvious solution: they don't make it themselves -- they order out for it! Frederick G. M. Roeber | CERN -- European Center for Nuclear Research ------------------------------ From: cambler@cymbal.calpoly.edu (Chris Ambler -- Phish) Subject: New House Problems Organization: The Phishtank Date: Tue, 06 Jul 1993 09:02:39 GMT I've just moved into a new house, and took all 11 analog lines plus the two ISDN BRIs we have. What a hassle. The problem I'm having is that hangups don't seem to be recognized by some of my equipment now! The answering machines don't recycle when the user hangs up, but wait for five seconds of silence. A few of the modems cannot detect when the remote site hangs up as well. The voice mail isn't on line yet, but I'm dreading it. Is this common on the outskirts of a town (where I am). Could it be a lack of voltage or impedance or something like that at the end-of-the- line where I am? Thanks in advance! Oh, PS: My request for ISDN data services in Los Angeles LATA 5 yielded 3 responses, all "me too" flavoured. Oh well, technology marches on, but slowly :-) cambler@zeus.calpoly.edu | Christopher J. Ambler chris@toys.fubarsys.com | Author, FSUUCP 1.32 ------------------------------ End of TELECOM Digest V13 #453 ******************************   Received: from delta.eecs.nwu.edu by mintaka.lcs.mit.edu id aa11599; 7 Jul 93 18:56 EDT Received: by delta.eecs.nwu.edu id AA17584 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4 for telecomlist-outbound); Wed, 7 Jul 1993 16:27:25 -0500 Received: by delta.eecs.nwu.edu id AA07046 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4 for telecomlist); Wed, 7 Jul 1993 16:26:48 -0500 Date: Wed, 7 Jul 1993 16:26:48 -0500 From: TELECOM Moderator Message-Id: <199307072126.AA07046@delta.eecs.nwu.edu> To: telecom@delta.eecs.nwu.edu Subject: Telepassport International Calling Service Telepassport is now available and open for business! Hereinafter in this message I shall refer to it as TP. TP is an international long distance carrier. The idea behind TP is to route international calls all over the world via the United States, allowing callers to access state of the art telecommunications technology, the best line clarity, and the lowest rates in the world. TP capitalizes on the rate differential between the USA and other countries using a technique known as 're-origination'. The switch takes calls from customers anywhere in the world, reverses the call so it is billed as USA originated, and provides USA dialtone so the customer can complete the connection to any other country in the world. The cost savings to the customer could be up to fifty percent, depending on a few factors. For example, a five minute call from Italy to the USA handled and billed by the PTT would cost $11.40. Using TP, the cost for the same call would be $6.84. A five minute call from Brazil to the United Kingdom costs $18.95 through the Brazilian PTT, but only $10.84 using TP. Legal Status: ============= TP is available in virtually every country in the world as a Value Added Service. Although in some countries the PTT may not welcome the compe- tition, they are bound by international telecommunication treaties to allow us to operate. In addition, TP is required to compensate the PTTs as part of an international settlements process for carrying our calls in and out of their country. Where telecommunications monopolies are in effect, they specifically prohibit competition by disallowing the installation or use of facilities in the territory controlled by the monopoly. TP requires no installation or equipment of any kind in various countries except the telephone instrument itself. It is an American service and its customers are billed in the United States, with the US Dollar the method of payment. In the United States, AT&T has raised objections when certain companies it suspected were marketing a callback system filed for FCC authorization to carry international traffic. In their objections they complained that callback systems were illegally using carriers' facilities to signal for the callback and thereby avoiding payment of the tariffed rates for useage. In fact, the tariffs are specifically set not to charge for uncompleted calls so there is no avoidance of payment. AT&T's own answering machine product, 'The Toll Saver' is designed not to answer a call if there are no messages on the machine, thus signalling such to the caller without him incurring a charge. There are several other examples of security systems, energy devices, etc which use the telephone for signalling without payment. AT&T was requested to respond as to their intentions regards their own products and the technology used by non-telecom related services (security devices, etc) and 'toll avoidance'. AT&T was asked if their stance on this related only to organizations in direct competition with that company. How to Use Telepassport: ======================== An account is required of all users. TP cannot accept 'casual users' who do not have a specific business relationship with us. This is because of the nature of how the TP switch operates. Accounts are *very easy* to set up, but accounts *are* required, since your telephone number must be authorized to use the service. You need not call from an authorized phone however; if you do so, your call will proceed without further identification or security checks unless you ask us to incorporate this feature. If you (as a subscriber) call from an unauthorized telephone, then an account number and PIN must be entered as part of the session. Subscribers who are outside the USA: Three methods can be used to access Telepassport - (A) Automatic Callback when calling from an authorized telephone: 1. Dial your TP access number in the USA (1-212-xxx-xxxx). 2. Let the phone ring once or twice (preferably twice to insure we caught the signal), then hangup. - You will receive a call within 10-20 seconds - 3. When our call arrives, pick up your receiver, then you will hear, depending on your instructions one of these messages: "Telepassport" OR "This call is for , please transfer this call to ; if you are press 1 on the keypad." OR "Please transfer this call to extension xxx, if this is extension xxx please press 1 on the keypad." One of these messages (depending on how you have it set up) will play in any of several languages, depending again on the language you have chosen for the computer to use. 4. Press '1' at any time during the message. - if you are not at your authorized telephone, or if you instructed us to make the PIN mandatory on all calls you will then hear, (in language of choice) "please enter your PIN now." 5. If PIN required, enter it at this time. - USA dial tone will be extended to you - 6. Dial the number you wish to reach followed by # (country code + city code + number + #) ... for example, to Japan 81 44 954 3951# or to the USA 1 818 956 6936#. - you will hear a TP tone indicating your call is being processed. - If you get a busy signal, or the called party does not answer or you get an error message, just press * to get dial tone and make another call if you wish, or hang up. Also when the called party hangs up you may stay on the line and make another call if desired. If you make an error in dialing, just press *, wait for dial tone and dial your call again. If you get an answering machine or some other device answering the call, maintain silence for five to ten seconds after speaking your message and you will hear dial tone. (B) Immediate Callback (For use when not at your authorized telephone): 1. Dial the TP toll-free number from your country, or if toll-free is not available in your country dial the direct number in New York (1-212-xxx-xxxx). Please note if toll-free access to us is not available in your country then you will have to pay PTT charges for this call, however once you connect with us, *immediatly* instruct the computer to make a callback to you. This will limit your exposure to PTT charges to a minute or lerss. 2. After dialing our toll-free number from your country (or our direct New York number) you will hear the computer respond, "Telepassport, please enter your account number and PIN". Enter these numbers and you will hear a spurt of tone followed by dial tone. 3. Either dial your call to completion as per 'automatic callback' -or- preferably to keep your costs down access the Administrative Functions Menu to arrange an immediate callback. (C) If you choose to continue the call, we refer to this method as 'Direct Access'; if you choose to have us call you back, we refer to it as 'Immediate Callback'. You use 'Immediate Callback' or 'Direct Access' when you are NOT at an authorized telephone number. When you are at an authorized tele- phone number you merely call the number we give you, let it ring a couple times and hang up to await our callback. If you are calling from within the USA: ======================================= 1. Dial the number we assign you to call or the direct access number. If you are calling from an authorized TP telephone, you will hear 'Telepassport' followed a second or two later by dialtone. If not, you will hear 'Telepassport, please enter your account number and your PIN'. After entering this you will hear dialtone. Regardless of where you are calling from, or how you access TP (that is, by Direct Access or Automatic Callback) when you reach the dialtone you can either place your call or access administrative functions. To reach administrative functions, press 1# when you get dialtone. You will hear: "Press 1 to change your callback number, 2 to access your account balance, 3 to change your callback message, 4 to change your callback message language, 5 for an immediate callback." Changing your callback number: Press 1. "Please enter your new callback number." You enter the country code, city code (area code), number, and #. You will be asked to re-enter it for confirmation. If you do it the same way, fine, if not the computer will keep asking until you get it the same way twice in a row. We will then use this as the number to reach you for Automatic Callbacks until you change it. To change it back to your authorized telephone number as per our records, when you are asked to 'enter new callback number' just press #. The computer will respond, 'your new callback number is '. Press 2 to hear what credit balance remains in your account. Press 3 to change the way we speak when we call you back. If the short form 'Telepassport' is sufficient, you can indicate that. If you are in a hotel or at a place where many people answer the phone or we need to be transferred to an extension or room number, you can tell us with choices 1, 2 or 3 how to ask for you: "This call is for , call to the phone". "Please transfer this call to extension xxx" If you tell the computer to ask for you at an extension number, the computer will ask you to enter the extension number we are to ask for, followed by #. Press 4 to change the language we use when making callbacks to you. Press 1 for English; 2 for Spanish; 3 for Mandarin; 4 for Japanese; 5 for German; 6 for French; 7 for Italian; 8 for Portugese; 0 to make additional choices. Your callback message ('connect this call to ' or 'connect this call to ') will remain in the language chosen until you change it. This is helpful when dealing with telephone operators or hotel clerks, etc in other countries. Press 5 to get an immediate callback from us. The computer will ask you to enter the number you want us to call you at. This will be the country code, city code and number, followed by #. After entering this, hangup. We will call you back in 10-20 seconds, at which time you would proceed as with Automatic Callback. To exit administrative functions menu at any time, press *. Other features of Telepassport: ============================== Voicemail: callers leave you messages. You retrieve later with your PIN. Message forwarding: If called party is not available, you can record a message. We will try to deliver it every two hours for four days. Phone Home: You pay for the calls of relatives and customers, but only on calls they make to you. The best way to describe this is that it is very similiar to the AT&T Easy Reach 700 service. Toll Free service from USA to other countries: If your country does not offer toll free service (or offers it, but not from international points) then TP will offer this to your customers in the USA. They will dial an 800 number here, and get cut through to your international number (as shown on our records, or to whatever is your 'callback number' at the time). We also offer speed dialing and restricted calling using four digit codes. You can set it up so that persons calling you dial an 800 number in the USA, then are permitted only to enter a four digit code to reach you. Or you can allow employees to make calls to certain places while not making calls to other places, etc. Conference calls: dial multiple numbers linking participants from all over the world. Fax broadcast: send your fax to TP, and we forward to your distribution list. Above special services and rates discussed on request. Various special applications can be designed. Billing arrangements: All payments are made either by credit card or electronic funds transfer from your bank to ours. You will receive a very detailed monthly accounting. If you prefer, you may establish a trust fund with the TP business office from which charges will be paid. If you wish, a 'credit limit' will be set for monthly usage to assist you in detecting abuse when usage for the month reaches the agrreed-upon limit. TP does *not* offer open account billing at this time. ---------- RATES FOR CALLS ------------ This is probably the most important part to many of you. A full schedule of rates would be impractical to list here; there are simply too many countries which can call other countries, etc ... so this sample listing will provide rates *to and from the USA* from other countries, with some comments about calls from other countries to third countries via the USA. I'll be glad to quote rates between countries on request; just ask for your specific application. Our rates are composed of three parts. Calls to the USA, and certain other countries where we have agreements in place will only see ONE OR TWO of these components. Calls to third countries via the USA will see either TWO OR THREE of these components. The components are: ACCESS CHARGE (a per session charge regardless of how long you are connected through us) INITIAL CHARGE (a per call charge which applies on many inter- country calls via our switch) PER MINUTE CHARGE (the cost of the call for each minute you are connected, speaking with someone). On calls to the USA from other countries, usually the only charge will be the PER MINUTE charge. From some points, the ACCESS charge will also apply. The INITIAL CHARGE will only apply when calling between other countries using the USA as the transit routing. If we had *our way*, only the PER MINUTE rates would apply ... but we must make payments to the PTTs and AT&T for services they render to us, thus the ACCESS CHARGE and INITIAL CHARGE in some instances. Here are some sample rates to the USA from elsewhere. Where the rates are shown as amount/amount/amount this means standard/discount/economy rates, as per the custom in the country where the call originates. Time of day for the call is always by local time in the country where the call originates. Remember, the ACCESS CHARGE is made one time per session; you can make several calls in succession by pressing the * key between calls. Each callback by us (or direct access to us) counts as one session, or one ACCESS CHARGE. From (to USA) Access Charge Per Minute ============== ============= ========== Venezuela 51 cents .91/.81/.81 Italy 36 cents $1.09/1.09/.80 Lebanon 86 cents $2.73/2.73/2.73 Mexico None .95/.95/.95 plus .16 INITAL CHARGE per call. Canada None .39/.39/.39 China $2.12 $1.29/1.29/1.29 Greece 52 cents .91/.91/.91 plus .59 INITIAL CHARGE per call. Korea Dem. Rep. $1.15 $1.20/1.20/1.20 Japan None .98/.85/.79 Colombia 68 cents $1.05/.94/.94 Taiwan 95 cents $1.04/.99/.99 Argentina 57 cents $1.39/1.19/1.19 CIS (USSR) 91 cents $1.81/1.81/1.81 Brazil 60 cents $1.50/1.30/1.30 Dominican Republic 23 cents .85/.85/.85 France None .89/.67/.60 Germany 28 cents .99/.99/.99 Haiti 31 cents $1.11/1.11/1.11 Israel 31 cents $1.03/.83/.80 United Kingdom None !! Fifty cents per minute always !! These are just a few examples ... Now country to country via the USA gets tricky -- you can check out what your local PTT charges for calls, knock off 30-40 percent in almost every case, but add on an INITIAL CHARGE typically in the range of 50 cents to a dollar. The charge for the first minute therefore will be INITIAL CHARGE plus MINUTE. Now on calls from USA subscribers outbound: TO: (from a USA origin) First 30 secs. Addl. 6 secs. ======================== ================ =============== Argentina 1.18/1.02/.94 .07/.06/.05 Australia 1.00/1.00/1.00 .06/.06/.06 Germany .69/.67/.63 .06/.06/.05 Israel 1.25/1.25/1.25 .07/.07/.07 Netherlands .59/.43/.43 .06/.06/.06 Hong Kong 1.54/1.27/1.30 .07/.06/.06 Japan .34/.32/.30 .07/.06/.06 United Kingdom 48 cents per minute, all hours! France 58 cents per minute, all hours! Calls to Australia as an example would cost $1.30 for the first minute and 60 cents per minute thereafter. Calls to Japan as an example would cost between 60-70 per minute depending on the time of day. Calls to Hong Kong would cost 60-70 cents per minute after the first minute which is much more expensive. The same is the case in calls to Israel. I am not privy to all the details as to why calls to some places have higher first minutes; I do know that TP had to negotiate not only with AT&T on outbound calls from the USA but also with various PTTs around the world to meet their requirements and pay them certain fees, etc. Also, I should point out that USA subscribers calling outbound will pay an additional 9 cents per minute if they access TP via our 800 number for that purpose. If they dial direct to our New York number, they pay the rates shown above. It almost makes better sense (and we recommend) for all callers to whenever possible use our automatic callback from their authorized phone(s) or immediate callback to avoid the extra toll charges while they are calling our switch. To sign up for Telepassport service, send me email. In the course of our discussion and sign up process, be prepared to supply the VISA/MC or AMEX number you wish to have charges applied to periodically or the bank account you wish to have debited for charges. (But we will be sending you a detailed monthly analysis and billing in any event.) Other fine print and 'gotcha!' things you should know about: Anyone is free to sign up. Businesses will be the primary users of Telepassport but individuals making at least $25 per month in international calls are also invited to join the service. In fact, we have a $25 per month minimum fee; you will be charged that minimum fee unless your usage exceeds that amount. Another 'gotcha!' -- We have both 'system time' and 'connect time'. System time is the time between when you answer our callback and the party you are calling answers the phone. Connect time is the time you are actually speaking with your party. When your caller disconnects (but you stay on the line to make another call) then the 'system time' clock begins running again. As long as your 'system time' each month is not more than ten percent of the total session time (system plus connect) we waive the charges for system time. If your system time is excessive (i.e. in excess of ten percent of the total amount of time you spend connected to us), then system time is charged at the rate of a call to the United States. There is no system time if the call is on your nickle, i.e. you dial our direct access number and continue straight through. System time is only the time when *we call you back*. And as stated above, provided this is not excessive, we waive that charge. How can you keep system time from being excessive? For one thing, a call of ten minutes would in effect give you a free minute of system time. When we call you back, be prepared to begin dialing immediatly. Answer our phone calls promptly if we need to have someone call you to the phone, as in a hotel. We offer speed dialing of your common numbers at no extra charge. Most international connections from the USA can be done in seconds if you dial rapidly and remember to put the # terminator on the end of the dialing string. If you were to spend let's say, two hours per month in actual talking time on international calls, that 120 minutes would give you 12 minutes of system time at no charge -- more than enough to dial your calls, wait for the ringing, change your administrative options, etc. For most users, this will never be a problem ... but I am required to tell you that if you call us and hang on the line doing nothing but wasting our time and money on the callback connection, we charge you for it. Almost anytime you make a call that lasts two or three minutes or longer your system time will be easily absorbed. And since it accumulates all month, several short calls and one or two longer ones will reach the same result: no system time charges. Remember the ratio is not more than ten percent of the time on call set ups, administrative options, etc. Welcome to Telepassport! I hope it will provide a low-cost solution to your international calling requirements both to and from the USA. For precise rates, please ask, and certainly on calls between countries where the USA is the switching point ask for rates. I could not begin to list the thousands of actual rates in this message. Patrick Townson ptownson@eecs.nwu.edu If you prefer: call 312-465-2700 or fax 312-743-0002. Or write: Telecom Digest Telepassport Program 2241 West Howard Street #208 Chicago, IL 60645   Received: from delta.eecs.nwu.edu by mintaka.lcs.mit.edu id aa19894; 8 Jul 93 3:21 EDT Received: by delta.eecs.nwu.edu id AA30662 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4 for telecomlist-outbound); Thu, 8 Jul 1993 01:10:59 -0500 Received: by delta.eecs.nwu.edu id AA05982 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4 for telecomlist); Thu, 8 Jul 1993 01:10:07 -0500 Date: Thu, 8 Jul 1993 01:10:07 -0500 From: TELECOM Moderator Message-Id: <199307080610.AA05982@delta.eecs.nwu.edu> To: telecom@eecs.nwu.edu Subject: TELECOM Digest V13 #454 TELECOM Digest Thu, 8 Jul 93 01:09:40 CDT Volume 13 : Issue 454 Inside This Issue: Moderator: Patrick A. Townson Kerberized Cellular Phones (Paul Robinson) Re: Cell Phone Fraud Losses Triple in a Year (Dan J. Declerck) Re: Cell Phone Fraud Losses Triple in a Year (Andrew Watts) Re: Cell Phone Fraud Losses Triple in a Year (Paul Wallich) Re: Cell Phone Fraud Losses Triple in a Year (Tom Olin) Re: Were You a Victim of 900 Abuse? (Mike King) Re: Coin Refund Required ... NOT! (Andy Sherman) Re: Coin Refund Required ... NOT! (David J. Greenberger) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 7 Jul 1993 21:51:05 -0400 (EDT) Reply-To: 0005066432@MCIMAIL.COM Subject: Kerberized Cellular Phones From: Paul Robinson Organization: Tansin A. Darcos & Company, Silver Spring, MD USA Steve Forette suggested the possibility of using Kerberos Authenti- cation for Cellular Telephones as a means to reduce fraud. Kerberos is a means of authenticating access to something by means of a "ticket" or authentication code being generated on the fly each time a request is made. When a system uses Kerberos Authentication, the system is said to be Kerberized. "SF" refers to Steve Forrette; "Moderator" refers to Pat Towson. The following was my response; I'd appreciate comments: SF>> Maybe I'm armchair quarterbacking, but it seems to me Kerberos should SF>> be good for making cell phone accounting really secure. I think I already settled this several months ago in asking questions on both the TELECOM Digest and Info-Vax list (because a number of VAX systems are using Kerberos). Kerberos can't be used on mobile telephony because there is no trust at *all* that can be imposed on the system. A user who calls into a system has *something* that can be trusted, either the terminal location (for a local terminal) or their "dotted quad" internet address they are at under TCP/IP, or the dial-in telephone number, in addition to their password. Well, with the ESN or Password given in the clear, there is *nothing* that is secure in mobile telephony. But I could be wrong with respect to telecomputing. Someone want to tackle this? Is any place using Kerberos for security where anyone can call in on a dial up number without any other considerations, e.g. they could be at home or on a dial-up computer? I suspect that Kerberos won't work without *something* it can trust. Could Kerberos be used to create Kerberized Cellular Telephones or Kerberized Mobile Computing? In short, Cellular phones can't be Kerberized because any mobile user could be spoofed by any other, there is *nothing* that can be trusted on the system. Therefore you need something that either (1) authenticates the user based on something that can't be faked (2) authenticates the user in such a manner that failure to authenticate can be used to deny service. SF> It would also be a good way to make all current cellphones obsolete. SF> ... Keep in mind that any change in the authentication protocol would SF> necessitate making current phones unusable ... phreaks would always SF> imitate an 'old' phone... a carrier would have to either require all SF> subscribers to replace their phones... or buy a new phone for every SF> subscriber. SF> And then what would they do with roamers? > [Moderator's Note: But you know something Steve? I'll bet the cellular > industry could cut a deal with two or three (or how many ever) of the > major cellphone manufacturers to make new phones at a deeply discounted > rate, then *give them away* to existing customers for less than the > current losses due to fraud. The cell companies would have to bite the > bullet and do it, but once it was over with, so would be the problem > for the most part. Before this could happen, a major antitrust exemption would have to be issued to every wireline and cellular company in the United States, and every cellular telephone manufacturer, in order to allow them to do this. The three major broadcast networks and Fox had to get this in order to allow them to set up standards for the violence in television shows. Otherwise, as competitors it's a criminal offense for the representatives at these companies to meet together to make joint agreements. Doubly so in view of the ex-Bell system companies being under the restrictions of Judge Greene. Perhaps a cheaper way is to have some sort of security device retrofitted onto cellular phones that generates an off-band security code. Have it made by one company in the ten-million quantity range. It simply generates an extra identification code tacked onto the beginning or end of the ESN, in the manner and method I state below, e.g. block of twenty different numbers issued in rotation each time a call is placed. If both don't match the call won't be permitted *and* all twenty codes become invalid. In the multi-million copy range the device can be made for perhaps $10 or so. If it's that cheap, it can be made such that if it gets broken, you get a replacement. Now, you'd also have to fix it so the device becomes inoperative if opened, or maybe not since each one would have a different serial number. Tie a serial number group (authcode) to someone's ESN and you have essentially the same security as an ATM card user, since he must have a valid ESN AND a matching authcode security box both registered with the carrier. To spoof any user, the thief would have to have caught all twenty or so authcodes of the same user, then remember which one was the last one used and use the next one in sequence. Also, they'd have to increment to the next code, meaning that they would have to make 19 calls in order to spoof the phone owner so that his phone isn't invalidated. And to defeat that capability, use a four digit number indicating the call number; if the two don't match, the carrier knows the user's phone has been compromised. So it would require someone monitoring and storing thousands of codes in order to spoof one code, plus needing some means to not let the phone owner know his phone has been compromised. If each phone (or authentication box) has 20 random ESNs/authcodes, there is no way to know which ones are related to which phone unless you took it apart. This would solve the problem of everything except someone fraudulently obtaining a phone and selling the codes to someone. But then, only one person at a time could use it since a second code coming in at the same time would then deny access to *all* codes of that phone until authorized. As would a call at the same time as someone else using it. The other thing to do is to reset the national database of authorized and hot-listed numbers and get federal laws in place to allow data sharing. Adding credit limits would help as well. But the answer will have to be a change in authentication. And here are some suggestions that will probably have to be done. 1. A sequence challenge in which a phone has several authentication codes, and each time a call is placed, the next code in sequence is sent; memory is cheap, so a phone could easily have twenty or thirty ESNs. The advantage here is that if the ESN is not the one that is next in order, the phone can be permanently denied service (see 2). 2. When an ESN comes in that isn't recognized, it calls back to the issuing carrier and asks if it's valid. If the ESN is the next in the sequence based on the last ESN accepted, the call is approved, otherwise the questioning carrier can be told to deny service. This would require that all roaming calls be verified with the originating carrier. As the usual delay is about one second or so, this should not be a problem. 3. Allow any phone to call 911 or customer service, even if it's invalid roaming or hotlisted. It makes no sense to refuse a phone access to 911 or to call the cellular carrier to complain that their phone doesn't work. Paul Robinson - TDARCOS@MCIMAIL.COM ------------------------------ From: declrckd@rtsg.mot.com (Dan J. Declerck) Subject: Re: Cell Phone Fraud Losses Triple in a Year Organization: Motorola Inc., Cellular Infrastructure Group Date: Thu, 7 Jul 1993 15:40:46 GMT In article attsbbs!laurence.chiu@ PacBell.COM (Laurence Chiu) writes: >> In article , TELECOM Moderator > eecs.nwu.edu> writes: >>> In a one year period from 1991 through 1992, losses from cellular >>> phone fraud tripled from $100 million to $300 million nationwide >>> according to the Washington DC based Cellular Telecommunications >>> Industry Association. >> I have two comments. >> Whoever designed the AMPS "security" system was an idiot. It was well >> known in the telephone industry at least as far back as 1978 (see the >> Bell System Technical Journal describing the Unix password system) >> that you don't broadcast passwords in the clear. That should be >> obvious to anyone, even if you aren't expert in security systems. >> The other thing is, I don't understand how roamer fraud could be a >> problem in LA, since the LA carriers don't allow inward roaming >> without a pre-arranged billing arrangement (usually via credit card). >> Can someone explain this? >> [Moderator's Note: Well, they don't *any longer*. Fraud problems, >> maybe? They were not always that way, where they? PAT] > As a new user of cellular communications, I am concerned about this > hole in security (though I don't live in LA thank goodness). Does > anybody know if the ESN is transmitted in the clear using either > digital AMPS or GSM? This might be a longer term solution to the > problem. > Using current technology, would it be possible for the Cellular > companies to put safeguards in their system which would deactivate a > cellular phone once a monthly bill got beyond a set amount for an > account. If a user really was using more a particular month then he > could call it, present some identification code and have the limit > raised that month. Ah, just another reason for the U.S. to finally adopt a new digital cellular standard!! Digital AMPS (TDMA AMPS) does a secondary authentication once the digital voice channel has been established. It cannot enhance the old authentication of the analog stuff, due to compatability issues. The secondary authentication uses a shared secret data scheme, similar to GSM, I believe. Note that TDMA AMPS still does not have a fully digital control channel yet. DS-CDMA proposed by Qualcomm, and provisionally accepted by the TIA as PN-3118, uses a shared secret data scheme and has a fully digital control channel. So, regardless of the new digital standard, the fraud problem will be abated. I beleive more than 15% of a provider's cost goes toward fraud. Dan DeClerck EMAIL: declrckd@rtsg.mot.com Motorola Cellular APD Phone: (708) 632-4596 ------------------------------ From: andreww@defiance.vut.edu.au (Andrew Watts) Subject: Re: Cell Phone Fraud Losses Triple in a Year Organization: Victoria University of Technology Date: Thu, 8 Jul 1993 02:12:37 GMT Fred Morris (m3047@halcyon.halcyon.com) wrote: > Judges *make* law. It's the law. Legislation is law. And it's made by politicians. Judges interpret the law as they see it, and set legal precidents. They don't make law. Just my two cents worth. Andrew Watts | andrew%consent@uts.edu.au | andreww@defiance.vut.edu.au [Moderator's Note: Well, there have been serious social problems in the USA in the past few decades because of what has been termed by many an 'activist judiciary'. PAT] ------------------------------ From: pw@panix.com (Paul Wallich) Subject: Re: Cell Phone Fraud Losses Triple in a Year Date: 7 Jul 1993 16:09:04 -0400 Organization: Trivializers R Us In mc/G=Brad/S=Hicks/OU=0205925@mhs. attmail.com writes: >> "Why bother," said Mr. Belitz. "The judge in this district >> said cellular fraud is not a violation of the law ..." > Of course, this presupposes that you HAVE some way to detect > fraudulent use of an ESN in time to catch the user, anyway. Which > they don't. > But honestly folks, this is yet another attempt to retrofit a legal > solution onto a technical problem. The real problem here is that > valid ESNs can be taken right off the airwaves and then used for > months, because the ESN is broadcast "in the clear" and there's no way > to tell a valid use from an invalid use. The cellular phone > manufacturers put in no security other than "security through > obscurity" -- which NEVER works. Hear, Hear. Note, BTW, that the decision in question said nothing about phone fraud and the law -- what it was talking about was the applicability of a (relatively) obscure provision of the law governing unauthorized access to computer systems. This is the one that said if you know more than ten passwords that you shouldn't, you've committed a federal crime -- it's been extended to telephone credit cards by the hack of considering the phone system to be one big computer (and making a call to be alteration of files because it generates billing records). What the judge said was that cellular fraud is a crime, but it's not _this_ _particular_ _crime_. (Personally, I think the "Access Devices" rule, which is the thing above, is a major crock because it makes a felon of anyone able to write the numbers from 0 to 9999 and append them to a phone number. But that's another story.) paul ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 7 Jul 93 15:00:25 EDT From: adiron!tro@uunet.UU.NET (Tom Olin) Subject: Re: Cell Phone Fraud Losses Triple in a Year m3047@halcyon.halcyon.com (Fred Morris) writes: > adiron!tro@uunet.UU.NET (Tom Olin) writes: >> Do you say this because you sincerely feel that the judge intention- >> ally made a decision contrary to the law, or are you merely displeased >> with the practical consequences of the decision? > Judges *make* law. It's the law. Well, then, I sit corrected. I know people say that the Congress doesn't do anything, but I thought it was still involved somehow in the legislative process. My mistake. >> And there is also the real possibility that a law may be >> interpreted differently by different people. > What's the point? The point is that just because two people disagree doesn't mean that either one is an idiot or a criminal. Of course, either one or both *could* be, but not necessarily. Tom Olin (tro@partech.com) ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 7 Jul 93 18:03:57 EDT From: mking@fsd.com (Mike King) Subject: Re: Were You a Victim of 900 Abuse? In TELECOM Digest, V13, #443, Jim.Rees@umich.edu (Jim Rees) wrote: > I always assumed that the sex lines went through an ACD and out to > POTS lines in suburban housewive's homes, probably with distinctive > ringing to inform them of the nature of the call. They don't really > have a bunch of women hanging around a boiler room, do they? > Of course, getting the POTS translation out of the ACD would be nearly > impossible ... and Pat replied: > [Moderator's Note: 'They' have it both ways -- either way. A bunch of > people working out of a phone room, or sometimes calls transferred to > people at their home, etc. But if the call was transferred to someone > at home, even with distinctive ringing, finding out that number would > cause havoc for the IP, wouldn't it? PAT] A couple of months ago, {The Washington Post} had an article by a lady who took a job working for a phone-sex service. She described how she had the choice of working in the boiler room or working at home. She opted for the latter. Each day when she was ready to work, she had to call the service's switch and enter her ID and password. This validated her AND logged her time for pay purposes. She would then wait on the line, and the switch would three-way callers to her. When the caller was finished, he would be disconnected, and the lady would then wait for the next caller to be connected. When her 'shift' ended, she would hang up. She could also hang up to disconnect an abusive caller; she simply called back to continue her shift. Mike King | +1 301-428-5384 | I don't speak for my Software Sourcerer | mking@fsd.com or | employer. My employer Fairchild Space | 73710.1430@compuserve.com | doesn't speak for me. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 7 Jul 93 12:20:28 EDT Subject: Re: Coin Refund Required ... NOT! Organization: Salomon Inc, Rutherford NJ From: andys@internet.sbi.com (Andy Sherman) On 3 Jul 93 06:00:25 GMT, hhallika@tuba.calpoly.edu (Harold Hallikainen) said: > So, any c.d.t. readers in the COCOT biz? I've read very little > about it. Some of the technology would be interesting to hear about, > as well as the business itself. To which Pat replied: > [Moderator's Note: A couple years ago when we had this dicussion and > terms like 'bottom-feeders' were in all the messages, we did have one > regular reader who operated a service bureau for COCOT and AOS type > calls. I wonder if he is still out there. He wrote to us several > times to explain his position and business practices. PAT] That was Jim Allard, who showed his grace and sense of humor by adding "The Bottom Feeder" to his .signature. Jim always claimed to be running an honest AOS that give good prices, value, and dealt fairly with consumers. He also claimed that it was possible to make money with such a business ... until his AOS went belly up. Some will probably cry that obviously something bad that Mother, her seven children, and her two distant cousins (MCI and SPRINT) did put this company out of business. I suspect that the nature of the business is such that it is nearly impossible to run one both honestly and at a profit. Consider how Joe's Storm Door and AOS Company gets customers. They pay huge commissions to the owners of the places that their payphones or AOS services cover, and then charge the differential (and more) to the ultimate consumer in the form of outrageous call prices. If you play fair, and allow consumers to dial around your service, then you either get low call volume, or you have to offer rates that are competitive with the big three. Either way, the margins are attacked on both ends, what with those big commissions, and the capital required to set yourself up at the fringes of the phone business. *MY* opinions, of course ... Andy Sherman Salomon Inc - Unix Systems Support - Rutherford, NJ (201) 896-7018 - andys@sbi.com or asherman@sbi.com ------------------------------ From: d.greenberger@cornell.edu (David J. Greenberger) Subject: Re: Coin Refund Required ... NOT! Reply-To: d.greenberger@cornell.edu Organization: Young Israel of Cornell Date: 7 Jul 93 22:52:02 GMT hhallika@tuba.calpoly.edu (Harold Hallikainen) writes: > We hear a lot of terrible things about COCOTs. I also > generally avoid them, since they generally don't do what I want to do. > Some haven't let me use 950 to access my long distance carrier. > Others disable the DTMF pad when the call goes through so I can't pick > up messages off my answering machine. But, there MUST be some good > COCOTs out there! Is it not possible to have a privately owned pay > phone that works well? It does make sense to me that these phones be I'm sure some COCOTs (hey, I learned a new term from the TELECOM Digest today!) are quite decent, and they do have a purpose. New York Telephone recently removed the payphone from my organization, leaving a gaping hole in the wall (it wasn't getting them any money, probably because a non-payphone is semi-publicly available nearby for local calls, so the only use the payphone got was for long-distance, usually calling card or collect, calls). It might make sense to get it filled with a COCOT. However, I'm not plunking *my* quarter into the slot to test it. David J. Greenberger (212) 595-2901 d.greenberger@cornell.edu ------------------------------ End of TELECOM Digest V13 #454 ******************************   Received: from delta.eecs.nwu.edu by mintaka.lcs.mit.edu id aa21242; 8 Jul 93 4:46 EDT Received: by delta.eecs.nwu.edu id AA31219 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4 for telecomlist-outbound); Thu, 8 Jul 1993 02:22:05 -0500 Received: by delta.eecs.nwu.edu id AA00386 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4 for telecomlist); Thu, 8 Jul 1993 02:21:03 -0500 Date: Thu, 8 Jul 1993 02:21:03 -0500 From: TELECOM Moderator Message-Id: <199307080721.AA00386@delta.eecs.nwu.edu> To: telecom@eecs.nwu.edu Subject: TELECOM Digest V13 #455 TELECOM Digest Thu, 8 Jul 93 02:21:00 CDT Volume 13 : Issue 455 Inside This Issue: Moderator: Patrick A. Townson Re: Dialing "1" First (David J. Greenberger) Re: Dialing "1" First (Hans Mulder) Re: Dialing "1" First (Dave Niebuhr) Re: Dialing "1" First (Mike King) Re: Is AT&T no Longer Asking For Caller Name on Collect Call (Mitch Wagner) Re: Is AT&T no Longer Asking For Caller Name on Collect Call (Andy Sherman) Re: Answering Machine Bypass Code Information Wanted (Steven King) Re: Answering Machine Bypass Code Information Wanted (Kenneth R. Crudup) Re: Nine Volt Phone Operation (was Re: Decline ...) (Jack Decker) Re: Caller ID via 800 Number (David G. Lewis) Re: Networked Notebooks (was Net Safari '93) (Jim Rees) Re: Only in Texas (Ed Casas) Re: Only in Texas (Brendan B. Boerner) ---------------------- TELECOM Digest is an e-journal devoted mostly -- but not exclusively -- to discussions on voice telephony. The Digest is a not-for-profit public service published frequently by Patrick Townson Associates. PTA markets a no-surcharge telephone calling card and a no monthly fee 800 service. In addition, we are resellers of AT&T's Software Defined Network. For a detailed discussion of our services, write and ask for the file 'products'. The Digest is delivered at no charge by email to qualified subscribers on any electronic mail service connected to the Internet. To join the mail- ing list, write and tell us how you qualify: telecom-request@eecs.nwu.edu. All article submissions MUST be sent to our email address: telecom@eecs. nwu.edu -- NOT as replies to comp.dcom.telecom. Back issues and numerous other telephone-related files of interest are available from the Telecom Archives, using anonymous ftp lcs.mit.edu. Login anonymous, then 'cd telecom-archives'. At the present time, the Digest is also ported to Usenet at the request of many readers there, where it is known as 'comp.dcom.telecom'. Use of the Digest does not require the use of our products and services. The two are separate. All articles are the responsibility of the individual authors. Organi- zations listed, if any, are for identification purposes only. The Digest is compilation-copyrighted, 1993. **DO NOT** cross-post articles between the Digest and other Usenet or alt newsgroups. Do not compile mailing lists from the net-addresses appearing herein. Send tithes and love offerings to PO Box 1570, Chicago, IL 60690. :) Phone: 312-465-2700. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: d.greenberger@cornell.edu (David J. Greenberger) Subject: Re: Dialing "1" First Reply-To: d.greenberger@cornell.edu Organization: Young Israel of Cornell Date: 7 Jul 93 23:08:35 GMT dig@pro-cynosure.cts.com writes: > Basically, dialing 1 is like saying "I know this is a long distance > call and I understand that I will have to pay extra for this call." > It's a good idea, I think, and it makes it easy to teach kids how to > use the phone ("Never dial a number that starts with 1, because it > costs more.") Unfortunately, it's not that easy. Calls between area codes 212 and 718 are local, yet from 212-land I always dial 1-718-whatever or vice versa. It costs the same 10.6 cents it does to call within 212 (no "1" first). David J. Greenberger (212) 595-2901 d.greenberger@cornell.edu ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 7 Jul 93 20:44:38 +0200 From: hansm@info.win.tue.nl (Hans Mulder) Subject: Re: Dialing "1" First Brett Frankenberger writes: > By enforcing the correct "dial 1" rules, the telco switch is able to > make sure you know if the call is toll or not. If you just dial > XXX-XXX, that means (to the switch) that you don't think the call is > toll. If you are wrong, the switch will tell you by informing you > that you must dial 1 (and the reverse applies also). I fail to understand the reverse. I can see that people from a 1-means-toll area being annoyed when they have to pay toll for a call even if they didn't dial a leading 1. But the reverse? What's the point of telling callers to hang up and dial again, without the 1? Do people complain that they dialed a 1 and that they expect to pay toll. Would anybody complain if the meaning of the leading 1 were changed into "please, connect me to this number, even if it's toll"? Confused, Hans Mulder hansm@win.tue.nl ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 7 Jul 93 09:08:52 EDT From: dwn@dwn.ccd.bnl.gov (Dave Niebuhr) Subject: Re: Dialing "1" First In TELECOM Digest V13 #449 goudreau@dg-rtp.dg.com (Bob Goudreau) writes: > Regarding the discussion of the few benighted areas where "1" is still > not allowed before area codes when dialing LD numbers ... > Does anyone have an exhaustive list of all the locations in the NANP > that have this restriction, and when they plan on changing over to > allow eleven-digit dialing? Are there any telcos that aren't on track > to handle NXX area codes when they arrive in 18 months? I tried using 1+ in the 516 area code and came up with the following (the number is one that I know to not be in service yet otherwise I would have substituted X's): 395-6701: Disconnected 1-395-6701: Cannot be completed as dialed 1-516-395-6701: Cannot be completed as dialed 10288-1-516-395-6701: Cannot be completed as dialed So, as I said in prior issues, 516 will not implement 1 plus dialing until forced to do so. Dave Niebuhr Internet: niebuhr@bnl.gov / Bitnet: niebuhr@bnl Brookhaven National Laboratory Upton, LI, NY 11973 (516)-282-3093 Senior Technical Specialist: Scientific Computer Facility ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 7 Jul 93 17:52:58 EDT From: mking@fsd.com (Mike King) Subject: Re: Dialing "1" First In TELECOM Digest, V13 #449, armand@comm.mot.com (Arman Dolikian) wrote: > HOWEVER, MY PET PEEVE is that, when I dial using the "fully specified" > string of digits, there is NO ambiguity, and therefore, the system > should not reject "extra" information. Here in Maryland (C&P, 301), a leading 1 is required for a toll call, but if it is included on a non-toll call, the call goes through without any whining from the switch. Dialing my office from home is a local call, but I can dial 1-301-428-5384 and the call goes through. The switches in Northern Virginia (C&P, 703) exhibit the same behavior. Local calls *from* 202 to 301 or 703 do get denied if preceded by a 1, however. Maybe the congresscritters NEED unnecessary regulation in their lives? Local calls to other area codes (e.g., 202, 703) do NOT require the leading 1; one simply dials the area code and the phone number. Toll calls in this area always require the area code, even if it's the same (there are many NXX exchanges in the area). > For example, if the called number is 1 (708) 555-1234: > (remember, the "1" is the country code for USA) Actually, it's more a coincidence that the country code for North America is the same as the code used in many areas to indicate 'area code follows' or toll call. Otherwise, you should be dialing 011-1-708-555-1234. > This is like having the Post Office REJECT my mail, if I put TOO MUCH > information on the letter, such as adding "USA" on a letter sent > inside the USA! Might not be a bad idea for letters to New Mexico. Mike King | +1 301-428-5384 | I don't speak for my Software Sourcerer | mking@fsd.com or | employer. My employer Fairchild Space | 73710.1430@compuserve.com | doesn't speak for me. [Moderator's Note: Awwwwg! Ask any New Mexico resident how often stupid telephone order takers claim they 'cannot ship outside the United States' when the person gives a NM address. A reader from there even wrote to me saying an AT&T service representative once told him he would have to 'contact the Mexican Telephone Company to see what long distance plans they had available ...' Gimme a break already! When I was in elementary school they taught geography. I don't know if they were still teaching it when the young'uns who work on inbound telephone marketing desks were in school or not, but some of them don't have the brains that God gave a goose. PAT] ------------------------------ From: wagner@utoday.com (Mitch Wagner) Subject: Re: Is AT&T no Longer Asking For Caller Name on a Collect Call? Organization: Open Systems Today Date: Wed, 07 Jul 93 17:43:06 GMT andys@internet.sbi.com (Andy Sherman) writes: < regarding the system for operators processing collect calls> > This system was not designed to piss off customers or any nefarious > stuff like that. After watching it in action, it was clear that this > system was designed to keep operators *VERY* busy. (Well, except for > the voice path games, which were designed to keep you from passing > messages for free). I notice that this system does not preclude the time-honored system, known to college students and kids at sleepaway camp everywhere, of using the name you give the operator as the means of sending a message. Thus when the operator asks your name, you respond, "I. M. Okay," or something like that ... > [Moderator's Note: Now what would happen if when the call supervised, > for a few seconds all operator positions were busy? That is, my phone > rings, I answer, John Doe is waiting to call me collect. He hears me > answer but his talking path is not open. Ideally at the instant of > supervision an operator should be brought on the line, no? What > happens if there is no operator available for five or ten seconds? Do > John and I sit and scream 'hello' at each other trying to make the > other one hear us, or do either I or John or both of us get any sort > of 'stand by for an operator' message? I would suppose as a courtesy > the complete talk path would open, and the two of us would converse > even for a very few seconds as a courtesy to us until an operator was > available to cut in on the line and complete the formalities? PAT] What if it connects to the operator first? That way, until the operaor is available, the call does not go through to the called party? Wouldn't that work? Is that the way it's done now? mitch w. [Moderator's Note: Not from what he said, no. He said the call progresses on its way and only when supervision is detected does an operator come back on the line to query for billing authority. PAT] ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 6 Jul 93 15:48:01 EDT Subject: Re: Is AT&T no Longer Asking For Caller Name on a Collect Call? From: andys@internet.sbi.com (Andy Sherman) >>>>> On 3 Jul 93 17:48:23 GMT, Pat asked: > [Moderator's Note: Now what would happen if when the call supervised, > for a few seconds all operator positions were busy? That is, my phone > rings, I answer, John Doe is waiting to call me collect. He hears me > answer but his talking path is not open. Ideally at the instant of > supervision an operator should be brought on the line, no? What > happens if there is no operator available for five or ten seconds? Do > John and I sit and scream 'hello' at each other trying to make the > other one hear us, or do either I or John or both of us get any sort > of 'stand by for an operator' message? I would suppose as a courtesy > the complete talk path would open, and the two of us would converse > even for a very few seconds as a courtesy to us until an operator was > available to cut in on the line and complete the formalities? PAT] Since my training was large aimed at what things looked like from the OSPS operator's end, nobody talked about what happened if there were no operators. I am pretty sure that the system was engineered to make it unlikely; one switch controlled multiple operator services centers, and I'm pretty sure it could put the call on the first available position in any of them. I am all but certain that the system would *NOT* open a bidirectional voice path as a "courtesy" in the absence of an operator. You would hear John answering the phone, just as you heard the call progess leading up to supervision. I don't know what John would hear, but it certainly wouldn't be you. I strongly suspect that this type of event would be exceedingly rare. Andy Sherman Salomon Inc - Unix Systems Support - Rutherford, NJ (201) 896-7018 - andys@sbi.com or asherman@sbi.com [Moderator's Note: Actually, if AT&T did not do this as a courtesy (permit the call to complete pending an available operator) I would be surprised simply because in the past the customer was given the bene- fit of the doubt time after time when irregularities occurred. Even today, you can have a twenty second coversation with someone, then call the operator and claim you reached a wrong number and you will be credited. You can still claim you lost money in a payphone and have a refund coupon mailed back to you, admittedly 'payable to the order of the Telephone Company'. Long retired (since 1960) operator Myrtle Murphy here in Chicago told me once that AT&T used to have fire drills for the operators. When the fire drill was announced, everyone had to leave the building. Although no new calls would be answered, calls which were 'up on the board' stayed connected but in the process of vacating their position for the fire drill, all pending long distance tickets were 'stamped out' on the time clock. Better that disconnects during the interim got away with a minute or two of free time than disconnects during the interim get charged a minute or two too much. Seriously. PAT] ------------------------------ From: king@rtsg.mot.com (Steven King, Software Archaeologist) Subject: Re: Answering Machine Bypass Code Information Wanted Reply-To: king@rtsg.mot.com Organization: Motorola Inc., Cellular Infrastructure Group Date: Wed, 7 Jul 1993 15:09:37 GMT mitchell@cwis.unomaha.edu (Dennis Mitchell) publicly declared: > We need to find an answering machine that will prevent the phone from > ringing unless the caller enters a bypass code of some sort. Can > anyone offer a suggestion on where to look? Sounds like a job for Distinctive Ringing (or whatever your telco calls it). Get a switch that detects the ring patterns and routes different rings to different devices. Then, have the "normal" number route to the silent answering machine and the "immediate" number route to the noisy phone. Of course, you have to rely on people not using the "immediate" number capriciously ... Another answer is to get her a pager. Low-priority callers should use the regular phone number and talk to the machine, high-priority callers should page her. In either case, you can add to the machine's OGM "In case of an emergency, I can be contacted immediately at xxx-xxxx." Steven King -- Motorola Cellular Infrastructure Group ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 7 Jul 93 19:19:59 EDT From: kenny@mvuts.att.com Subject: Re: Answering Machine Bypass Code Information Wanted Organization: AT&T In article mitchell@cwis.unomaha.edu (Dennis Mitchell) writes: > We need to find an answering machine that will prevent the phone from > ringing unless the caller enters a bypass code of some sort. > Can anyone offer a suggestion on where to look? I really hate to start sounding like a Panasonic spokesman, but my KX-T2634 has a mode where you dial a (user-specified) code of up to three digits during OGM announcement, and it will produce a loud ringing tone regardless of volume control setting or ringer-volume setting. (Evidently, there's a lot of single young males in (like me) for whom having a lot of loud messages from other ... people while entertaining could be a problem, but don't want to miss important calls from business associates :-) Kenneth R. Crudup, ATT BL, 1600 Osgood St, N. Andover, MA 01845-1043 MV20-3T5B, +1 508 960 3219. kenny@mvuts.att.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 07 Jul 93 08:51:35 EDT From: ac388@freenet.hsc.colorado.edu (Jack Decker) Subject: Re: Nine Volt Phone Operation (was Re: Decline ...) In message , Jack.Winslade@axolotl. omahug.org (Jack Winslade) wrote: > Ah-ha. I just remembered the case of the almost-extinct AML-1 box. > This was a kludgy analog subscriber carrier used to multiplex a second > POTS line over an existing physical pair. The box at the subscriber > end was powered by a twelve volt nicad, trickle-charged from the > physical loop when it was on hook. The on-hook voltage across the > derived pair was between nine and twelve volts, and this dropped to > six volts or so when the second line went off hook. Touch tones > usually worked fine on these. I am currently served by a "Lenkurt 82A Station Carrier System" (according to the inscription on the box on the pole outside my home). It provides about 15 volts on-hook voltage, dropping to around six when off-hook. I think it is powered by a line from the C.O. (a couple of repairmen told me that the C.O. line is actually at over 200 volts; I'm not sure whether to believe that or not). > The AML had its problems, so most of them are in the scrap heap by > now. The Lenkurt units should be, in my opinion. Or at least, they should never be used in places where there are temperature extremes since they tend to get a bit flakey on cold days. They're also quite susceptable to Radio Frequency Interference ... if a CB Radio operator passes by while transmitting, the Lenkurt does a great job of injecting his chatter into my phone conversations (I just hope the guy next door doesn't take up CB Radio as a hobby!). I have been told that we should be off these units sometime this year, as they are supposed to install some sort of remote service unit in my area. I haven't seen it yet, but they did say it would probably be in by the end of the summer. As far as I'm concerned, it can happen none too soon! And BTW, the low on-hook voltage DID cause me problems when I first moved here. I had a "privacy adapter" circuit hooked up to my phone lines (except for the jack that the modem plugs into) so that if the modem was online, no one could knock it off by picking up a phone. This worked great when my mobile home was parked in Michigan Bell territory, but when I got to GTE land, none of my phones would work EXCEPT for my cordless phone that shares the modem jack. This caused me a few minutes of head-scratching until, armed with my trusty voltmeter, I figured out what the problem was ... the low on-hook line voltage wasn't sufficient to let current flow through the "privacy adapter" circuit. I had to remove it and take my chances with people picking up phones. :-( Jack Decker | Internet: ac388@freenet.hsc.colorado.edu ------------------------------ From: deej@cbnewsf.cb.att.com (david.g.lewis) Subject: Re: Caller ID via 800 Number Organization: AT&T Date: Wed, 7 Jul 1993 13:18:18 GMT In article rlatham@hpmail1.fwrdc.rtsg. mot.com (Russ Latham) writes: > With the recent posting of the 800 number that reads back the number > you are calling from [800-235-1414], I was wondering about the > following: > You have an 800 number with ANI, and let's say you live in an area > that doesn't have Caller-ID yet. If you were receiving harrassing > calls on your residential line, could you call-forward that > residential number to the 800 number, and then take the calls from > there and determine who was calling you? When a call is sent to an IXC, the ANI sent is the ANI of the station which would pay for the call if it were caller-sent-paid. In most cases, this is the station doing the forwarding, so the ANI that would be received by the 800 service would be the ANI of the forwarding line. > If this does work, would it also work in the case where a person did > Caller-ID blocking before they made the call? (Assuming Caller-ID > services were available in the residential area.) Moot question, because it wouldn't work ... > One final question. What is required for 800 ANI? Is it similar to > how current Caller-ID works, with the attachment of an additional box > to your phone line? As PAT stated in his note, for real-time ANI delivery, an 800 customer requires a direct connection to the 800 service provider (IXC in this case, as to my knowledge only IXCs provide real-time ANI delivery as an 800 service feature). David G Lewis AT&T Bell Laboratories david.g.lewis@att.com or !att!goofy!deej Switching & ISDN Implementation ------------------------------ From: Jim.Rees@umich.edu Subject: Re: Networked Notebooks (was Net Safari '93) Date: 7 Jul 1993 16:31:06 GMT Organization: University of Michigan CITI In article , roeber@vxcrna.cern.ch (Frederick Roeber) writes: > one of us even took AMTRAK across he country with a Little Work > prototype and the Outback portable cellular modem. That paper is old. We're using an Oki handheld phone now with various modems (Microcom, Qblazer) and it's a lot easier than lugging the Outback. The biggest problem I have now is not technical, it's administrative. Cellular roaming is still pretty difficult in most places. On my last cross-country trip (to San Diego on the Sunset) I was unable to roam anywhere west of Austin. ------------------------------ From: edc@ee.ubc.ca (Ed Casas) Subject: Re: Only in Texas Organization: University of BC, Electrical Engineering Date: Thu, 8 Jul 1993 07:36:06 GMT In article cfs@mathcs.emory.edu (Charles Stephens) writes: > While we are on the subject, the Atlanta white pages lists as the last > resident: > ZZMMTHISJ Zibre 123 Elm St. SW Mreta --- 555-1212 I was aware of the war over the first listing in the phone book, but it's amusing to find that there's also a little skirmish to capture the end. In the 1992 Vancouver white pages the last two listings are: Zzyzzy W ..... Zzzyzyton P ...... Ed Casas (edc@ee.ubc.ca) ------------------------------ From: BBOERNER@novell.com (Brendan B. Boerner) Subject: Re: Only in Texas Organization: Novell, Inc. --Austin Date: Wed, 7 Jul 1993 15:26:34 GMT In article khx@se44.wg2.waii.com (K Husain) writes: > I saw a similar listing in the Austin, residence pages by a Heanauder > Titzhoff a few years ago. Don't see him here now. If I remember > correctly some guy did answer the phone and acknowldege the name when > my roommate had called. Found it quite by accident actually ... My officemate a few years ago pointed out a Dr. who I could swear advertised as doing vasectomies. I just checked and he's still there but there is no mention of what his specialty is. Anyway, his name is Chopp, Dr. Richard Thomas. Ouch! Brendan B. Boerner Phone: 512/346-8380 MHS: bboerner@novell Internet: bboerner@novell.com \ Please use either if replying or Brendan_Boerner@novell.com / by mail exterior to Novell. Disclaimer: My views are my own, not Novell's. They pay me to write code, not speak for them. ------------------------------ End of TELECOM Digest V13 #455 ******************************   Received: from delta.eecs.nwu.edu by mintaka.lcs.mit.edu id aa25442; 8 Jul 93 6:41 EDT Received: by delta.eecs.nwu.edu id AA08004 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4 for telecomlist-outbound); Thu, 8 Jul 1993 04:22:56 -0500 Received: by delta.eecs.nwu.edu id AA26235 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4 for telecomlist); Thu, 8 Jul 1993 04:21:50 -0500 Date: Thu, 8 Jul 1993 04:21:50 -0500 From: TELECOM Moderator Message-Id: <199307080921.AA26235@delta.eecs.nwu.edu> To: telecom@eecs.nwu.edu Subject: TELECOM Digest V13 #456 TELECOM Digest Thu, 8 Jul 93 04:21:30 CDT Volume 13 : Issue 456 Inside This Issue: Moderator: Patrick A. Townson Re: New York Telephone Outage (David G. Lewis) Re: New York Telephone Outage (Steve Forrette) Re: Cox and BellSouth Want to Use 511 (Harold Hallikainen) Re: Cox and BellSouth Want to Use 511 (Lynne Gregg) Re: Cox and BellSouth Want to Use 511 (Nigel Allen) Re: Cox and BellSouth Want to Use 511 (Charles McGuinness) Re: Cox and BellSouth Want to Use 511 (Carl Moore) ---------------------- TELECOM Digest is an e-journal devoted mostly -- but not exclusively -- to discussions on voice telephony. The Digest is a not-for-profit public service published frequently by Patrick Townson Associates. PTA markets a no-surcharge telephone calling card and a no monthly fee 800 service. In addition, we are resellers of AT&T's Software Defined Network. For a detailed discussion of our services, write and ask for the file 'products'. The Digest is delivered at no charge by email to qualified subscribers on any electronic mail service connected to the Internet. To join the mail- ing list, write and tell us how you qualify: telecom-request@eecs.nwu.edu. All article submissions MUST be sent to our email address: telecom@eecs. nwu.edu -- NOT as replies to comp.dcom.telecom. Back issues and numerous other telephone-related files of interest are available from the Telecom Archives, using anonymous ftp lcs.mit.edu. Login anonymous, then 'cd telecom-archives'. At the present time, the Digest is also ported to Usenet at the request of many readers there, where it is known as 'comp.dcom.telecom'. Use of the Digest does not require the use of our products and services. The two are separate. All articles are the responsibility of the individual authors. Organi- zations listed, if any, are for identification purposes only. The Digest is compilation-copyrighted, 1993. **DO NOT** cross-post articles between the Digest and other Usenet or alt newsgroups. Do not compile mailing lists from the net-addresses appearing herein. Send tithes and love offerings to PO Box 1570, Chicago, IL 60690. :) Phone: 312-465-2700. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: deej@cbnewsf.cb.att.com (david.g.lewis) Subject: Re: New York Telephone Outage Organization: AT&T Date: Wed, 7 Jul 1993 18:46:08 GMT In article Christopher Zguris <0004854540@mcimail.com> writes: > Previously I wrote: >> With this cable break in place, what would happen if someone in 914 >> tried to call a business in 212 on an 800 number provided by someone >> other than NY Telephone (MCI, SPRINT, ETC.)? Likewise, what would >> happen in the same situation using one of the local 800 numbers NY >> Telephone tries to push on its customers? > And our much-better-informed-than-IO Moderator responded: >> [Moderator's Note: I suppose if the wires handling the call went >> through that cable the call would not go through. 800 numbers are >> nothing special ... they travel over a wire pair also. PAT] > My original question was not clear. The original message about the > outage said a trunk cable that connects 212 and 914 (and other area > codes) was severed/broken whatever. What I want to know is when > someone in 914 calls my MCI 800 number in 212, does their call leave > the 914 telco switching equipment, connect to MCI, then move through > MCI to the 212 switching equipment? If this is the case, then the > broken cable would be completly bypassed since it goes out from 914 > into MCI then back through MCI into 212. I guess my question is where > and when does a call leave the local carrier? Additionally, John Hawkinson jhawk@panix.com writes: > So my question is whether if I'd dialed 10333- first, instead of the > 10288- I dialed to get AT&T, would Sprint have successfully completed > the call. I would think so, since they should, like AT&T, have > separate circuitry between 212 and 914, but then again, the sprint 800 > number (which maps to the number I was calling) failed. So is that > number carried by NYT within the LATA or something? The answer to all of these questions is, as usual, "it depends". Let's start with the simplest case, 1+ dialed, IXC-carried, sent-paid calls. These are routed from the originating end office to the IXC in one of two ways: directly to the IXC from the end office, or via an access tandem. Typically (although not necessarily in all cases), AT&T uses access trunks directly connected to the end office, whereas other IXCs use access trunks connected to an access tandem. Therefore, in some cases, a LEC facility failure may cause MCI, Sprint, and other IXCs which get LATA access through an access tandem to be unable to handle interLATA calls, if the facility failure is between an end office an an access tandem, while AT&T may remain able to handle the same interLATA calls due to AT&T having direct facilities into the end office. In the more complicated case of 800, post-800-number-portability, a failure between the EO and AT will likely cause 800 service to all carriers to fail. This is because the query to the 800 database (SCP) is sent from an 800 SSP (Service Switching Point, if I recall correctly); and most SSPs are implemented on access tandems. Therefore, even though AT&T has the facilities to directly route calls from end offices to the AT&T network, the LEC must first route to the access tandem to perform the routing translation on the 800 number that determines the call gets sent to AT&T. If the EO/AT facilities are down, the call can't get to the SSP, the routing translation never happens, and the call fails. Given that the failure was characterized as a NYT cut between 914 and 212, and not as a trunk failure in 212 or in 914, I suspect that the failure was not between an EO and an AT; it was more likely between two NYT tandems (LATA tandems, I think they're called in the post- divestiture world). So 800 calls to all carriers could, presumably, exit the LEC network and get into the IXC network. So, given the above information, and the additional information (also from John Hawkinson jhawk@panix.com): > New York Telephone failed due to disruption > Sprint 800 number " " " " > AT&T successful the question remains of why did the Sprint 800 call fail, given that the call should have been able to exit the NYT network in Manhattan and re-enter in Weschester, and would an MCI (or, for that matter, AT&T or any other carrier) 800 number succeed or fail? My hypothesis is that, since intraLATA toll competition is not widely tariffed, widely known, or widely advertised, many IXCs do not build their own intraLATA facilities (or may not be permitted by the state PUCs to build their own intraLATA facilities). They therefore lease facilities from the LEC to handle the intraLATA traffic, such as 800, that they can handle. Not that they lease trunks on a minutes of use basis, but rather that they lease DS1s on a monthly basis, and build their own "interoffice" trunks and "access" trunks on those facilities. So an interLATA 800 call served by, say, Sprint may go from the caller's CO to the NYT access tandem at, say, the 140 West Street CO downtown (I'm just guessing that NYT has an access tandem there, but it seems a likely spot ...), where the switch queries the 800 SCP and determines that the call should indeed go to Sprint. NYT then routes the call to the Sprint POP downtown. Sprint sends the call to wherever their nearest switch is, which does its lookup and determines the call has to go to a 914 POTS number. The Sprint switch routes the call to a trunk group riding on a DS1 which goes back to 140 West Street, then cross-connects to a DS1 (built and operated by NYTel, leased to Sprint) which heads up to Westchester. Unfortunately, the cable has been cut, so the call fails (most likely at the Sprint switch, since the trunk group will be down). At this point I admit my analysis starts getting biased, both in terms of knowledge (I know more about how the AT&T network works) and claims (I would claim it works better ...). Sprint will, presumably, fail the call at that point, either because the leased NYTel facility is the only route to a Sprint switch serving Westchester (unlikely; Sprint has a sufficiently small number of switches that I suspect the switch that serves Manhattan is the same switch that serves Westchester), or because the leased NYTel facility is the only access facility leading to the Westchester NYTel access tandem from the Sprint switch serving Manhattan and Westchester. MCI, I suspect, is in a similar position; I have read in the trade press that Sprint has on the order of a dozen switches, and MCI on the order of a dozen and a half to two dozen, so I wouldn't be surprised to find that a single switch serves all of downstate NY for both of them. I'm sure people from MCI and Sprint will correct me if I'm wrong ... AT&T, on the other hand, would route the call from 140 West Street to our office at Broadway (33 Thomas Street, formally). The Broadway 4ESS switch would then attempt to route the call to the White Plains 4ESS switch, which would send it to the end office serving the called party. AT&T, I suspect, has its own facilities between BW and WHPL. Even if AT&T does lease facilities from NYTel for intraLATA traffic, those are unlikely to be the only facilities between the two switches; if one trunk group fails due to a facility failure, the BW 4E will hunt to a second facility. And even if all the facilities between the two switches fail, the call can be routed through a via switch in, say, Minneapolis. The call progresses to the WHPL 4E, egresses to the LEC end office serving the translated called party number, and completes successfully. I realize that I've painted a picture of the Sprint and MCI networks as being very "thin" in terms of alternate routes and backups. I do not know this to be the case, and it is strictly guesswork on my part based on the behavior reported with regard to the NYT facility failure -- the only reason I can see that an IXC would be unable to complete calls based on a LEC facility failure is if the only trunks available to complete the call are leased from the LEC and ride on the failed facility. If the picture I've painted of MCI and Sprint are inaccurate, I apologize in advance and I'm sure Sprint and MCI folks will rush in to correct my errors. Disclaimer: I doubt there's anything in here that Frank Ianna (AT&T Network Services Division Chief Quality Officer) hasn't been saying in prime time ads for a year now ... AT&T, Best in the Business (SM). David G Lewis AT&T Bell Laboratories david.g.lewis@att.com or !att!goofy!deej Switching & ISDN Implementation ------------------------------ From: stevef@wrq.com (Steve Forrette) Subject: Re: New York Telephone Outage Date: 7 Jul 1993 20:59:54 GMT Organization: Walker Richer & Quinn, Inc., Seattle, WA In article jhawk@panix.com (John Hawkinson) writes: > I believe I was a little ambiguous above. On this intra-lata call, > New York Telephone failed due to disruption > Sprint 800 number " " " " > AT&T successful > So my question is whether if I'd dialed 10333- first, instead of the > 10288- I dialed to get AT&T, would Sprint have successfully completed > the call. I would think so, since they should, like AT&T, have > separate circuitry between 212 and 914, but then again, the sprint 800 > number (which maps to the number I was calling) failed. So is that > number carried by NYT within the LATA or something? It depends on the carrier. Each IXC must have at least one Point of Presense (POP) in each LATA where it operates. Generally speaking, the access charges that they pay the local telco are not mileage sensitive, so they pay the same rate regardless of the distance between the originating or terminating end and their POP. So, many carriers see fit to only provide one POP per LATA. AT&T is known to have many more POPs per LATA than any of the other carriers -- in fact, they have started to complain to the powers that be that this uniform pricing is unfair. Take, for example, the case of city A and city B in the same LATA, 50 miles apart. Let's say IXC 1 has a POP in both A and B, while IXC 2 only has a POP in city B. When a call is placed from city A to city B over carrier 1, the call goes into 1's network in city A, travels over 1's facilities 50 miles, and goes back into the LEC's network in B. However, since carrier 2 only has a POP in B, the call travels over the LEC's network 50 miles from A to B, into 2's switch at B, and back out into the LEC network at the same POP! Both 1 and 2 are charged the same rate by the LEC for each part of the access charge, but 1 has carried the call 50 miles on its own network, and 2 hasn't done anything but switch it back out within the same switch. In states where intra-LATA competition is not allowed, this is not as big an issue, but still can be significant. Where intra-LATA IXC calls are allowed, it gets quite ridiculous. So, in your case above, what probably happened is Sprint's configuration of POPs in the LATA meant that Sprint-handled calls went over the same NYT trunks as a NYT-handled call does, but AT&T had POPs on both sides of the cable break so their traffic was unaffected. Steve Forrette, stevef@wrq.com ------------------------------ From: hhallika@tuba.calpoly.edu (Harold Hallikainen) Subject: Re: Cox and BellSouth Want to Use 511 Organization: California Polytechnic State University, San Luis Obispo Date: Thu, 08 Jul 1993 03:50:10 GMT In article BBOERNER@novell.com (Brendan B. Boerner) writes: > I think the Austin A-S has been trying to generate demand for such a > service by offering a service where you can call them up and get > additional information about a topic or whatnot in the paper by > punching in a four digit code next to the article or whatever you were > reading. Presumably if they are ever able to charge for this then > they will have hooked some percentage of current callers. > My questions are: Who controls the allocation of N11 numbers? And if > presumably the allocation is controlled by a regulatory body and not > the phone company, why in God's name would these guys even think of > allocating such a number so phone companies/newspapers can make a > buck? Tell them to get a phone number like the rest of us ... > 111 - can phone equipment distinquish between this and a L.D. call? > 211 - ? > 311 - ? > 411 - Directory assistance > 511 - Proposed information services > 611 - ? > 711 - ? > 811 - ? > 911 - Emergency services > [Moderator's Note: Don't forget 611 in your list above which is often > used for repair service. 811 is used in California to reach the phone > company business office. Of course, 011 is used as a prefix for inter- > national calls from the USA. A few comments ... on "Tell them to get a phone number like the rest of us", true, why are there ANY three digit phone numbers (other than, perhaps, 911). With all this talk about phone number shortages, they're giving up maybe 80,000 phone numbers per area code by having these three digit numbers. I recently got the PacBell bill stuffer on "1 means ten digits follow". It looks like that's really gonna free up the number space. People have complained about not knowing if a call is gonna cost them. Maybe the telco can give a little warning beep as the call is being handled. In any case, the "new system" seems to make a lot of sense, though I prefer my previously proposed method of using # or timeout on dialing. The system would then assume all unspecified leading digits were the same as the originating phone. That way, I could dial one digit to get my second line, or eleven digits (country code, area code, and seven digits). This method would allow those with pocket dialers to use the same number, no matter where they were. It would also remove the need for an international access code. If you dialed eleven or more digits, the first ones must be country codes. Back on the subject (511 infomation), the idea of putting a code at the end of the article to get more information sound nice! However, I sure wouldn't want more info in voice form. I'd go for ASCII or maybe fax. This could be handled with a standard phone number (no need for special three digit number). With DID, several numbers could be assigned with one number per subject, or some such thing. This could even be done with 900 or 976 numbers. By the way, what do telcos charge for 900 and 976 billing? I've seen very few legitimate IPs. Can only illegitimate ones afford the high rates? Finally, having "more information" available on line (again, ideally in ascii) is wonderful. A newspaper article on something the prez said should then refer you to full the full text on line. I've been having a wonderful time reading US Supreme Court decisions via ftp to ftp.cwru.edu in the /hermes/ascii directory. All public info should be available like this! Harold Hallikainen ap621@Cleveland.Freenet.edu Hallikainen & Friends, Inc. hhallika@oboe.calpoly.edu 141 Suburban Road, Bldg E4 phone 805 541 0200 fax 544 6715 San Luis Obispo, CA 93401-7590 telex 4932775 HFI UI ------------------------------ From: Lynne Gregg Subject: Re: Cox and BellSouth Want to Use 511 Date: Wed, 07 Jul 93 15:02:00 PDT Pat, he's in SWB parts, but he really means Bell South. They're the guys in partnership with Cox Enterprises. Yep, the local telcos pretty much designate NXX codes, though I believe there are Bellcore guidelines. Regards, Lynne ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 7 Jul 93 18:52:22 EDT From: ae446@freenet.carleton.ca (Nigel Allen) Subject: Re: Cox and BellSouth Want to Use 511 Reply-To: ae446@freenet.carleton.ca In a previous article, BBOERNER@novell.com (Brendan B. Boerner) says: > I was reading in the {Austin Chronicle} the other day that Cox > Enterprises, Inc. (big paper chain, owns the {Austin American > Statesman}) and BellSouth have announced an "agreement in principle" > to form a joint company that will deliver information services to > consumers who dial 511 (for a small fee of course). > This means that there would be five, maybe six codes left over. Hmmm, > I wonder if we can think of a better use for 511. Someone (possibly the Canadian Association for the Deaf) has suggested that 511 and 711 should be reserved for voice-relay services (511 for TDD-to-voice, and 711 for voice-to-TDD, or vice versa). When the phone service in the Yukon and part of the Northwest Territories was provides by CN Telecommunications, a division of Canadian National Railways, 511 (or maybe 1-511) was the number for the CN telegraph office. CN's telephone and telex operations in the Yukon, the western Northwest Territories and northern British Columbia were later transferred to a new CN subsidiary, Northwestel Inc., which was eventually sold to BCE Inc., the parent company of Bell Canada. I suspect that 511 no longer works in Northwestel territory. I think the proposal to reserve 511 and 711 for voice-relay services would be particularly useful for hearing-impaired people who travel a lot, and for those who want to communicate by phone with hearing-impaired people but do not have their own TDD. Nigel Allen, Toronto, Ontario, Canada ae446@freenet.carleton.ca ------------------------------ From: marks!charles@jyacc.jyacc.com (Charles McGuinness) Subject: Re: Cox and BellSouth Want to Use 511 Date: Wed, 7 Jul 93 9:32:43 EDT You may be also interested to note that in New York's World Trade Center, the number 211 is used for emergencies -- at least in the public areas. It summons the Port Authority Police instead of the NYC Police, I assume. All the payphones have "Dial 211 for Emergencies" inscribed on them. [Moderator's Note: I found out some time back that some telcos have provisions in their tariff which allow a subscriber to intercept his own 911 calls if he has a 'working relationship' with the emergency authorities in his community to do so. For instance, a university phone system may be on centrex. Calls to either 911 or 9-911 can be intercepted and routed to the university police emergency line, provided the university and the city police department have reached an agreement for that. PAT] ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 7 Jul 93 11:52:36 EDT From: Carl Moore Subject: Re: Cox and BellSouth Want to Use 511 There was a blurb maybe two years ago in the Digest about some other information provider arranging for use of 511. In 1976, 511 was used (at least in Philadelphia) for Bicentennial information. And didn't New York City previously use 211 for refunds? Apparently no N11 is useable as an area code. All N10 (except for the apparently-unuseable 710) is in use or announced for future use as area codes. Some N00 is available if any more area codes are needed before 1995. ------------------------------ End of TELECOM Digest V13 #456 ******************************   Received: from delta.eecs.nwu.edu by mintaka.lcs.mit.edu id aa26861; 9 Jul 93 3:51 EDT Received: by delta.eecs.nwu.edu id AA24711 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4 for telecomlist-outbound); Fri, 9 Jul 1993 01:10:47 -0500 Received: by delta.eecs.nwu.edu id AA03625 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4 for telecomlist); Fri, 9 Jul 1993 01:10:01 -0500 Date: Fri, 9 Jul 1993 01:10:01 -0500 From: TELECOM Moderator Message-Id: <199307090610.AA03625@delta.eecs.nwu.edu> To: telecom@eecs.nwu.edu Subject: TELECOM Digest V13 #457 TELECOM Digest Fri, 9 Jul 93 01:10:00 CDT Volume 13 : Issue 457 Inside This Issue: Moderator: Patrick A. Townson Proposal: alt.technology.smartcards (Lars Kalsen) Incident at a COCOT (Paul Robinson) White House Orders No Bid Telephone System (Paul Robinson) Lawyers and IP Owners (Dave Niebuhr) Teleglobe Canada to Close Down Globetex Text-to-Telex Service (Nigel Allen) Public Phone in Chemult, Oregon (Tony Harminc) Communication Departments Who Can't Communicate (Monty Solomon) Internet Articles in {The Nation} 12 July 1993 (David Leibold) How to Get Coin Phone? (Juergen Ziegler) US -> Europe Direct Dial: 13th Digit Spells Bad Luck (Ekkehard Rohwedder) Can I Use Telnet Over a Satellite Link? (Rogelio Montanana) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: dalk@login.dkuug.dk (Lars Kalsen) Subject: Proposal: alt.technology.smartcards Followup-To: alt.config Date: Thu, 8 Jul 1993 18:50:44 GMT R E Q U E S T F O R D I S C U S S I O N ========================================= This is a Request For Discussion on creation of a newsgroup under the alt.technology hierachy. The discussion will be about creation of a newsgroup for discussions about SmartCards. Please repost this RFD to any newsgroup or listserver that you think might have readers interested in this subject to reach as broad an audience as possible. Proposed Group alt.technology.smartcards General discussions of Smartcards Status Unmoderated Charter Alt.technology.smartcards (unmoderated) will be a newsgroup which will provide a common forum for all persons interested in the use and development of SmartCards and the technologies behind. (1) To share ideas, information and specific experience about the use of SmartCards. (2) To discuss the design, programming and manufacturing of Smart- Cards. (3) To discuss the use of SmartCards in various businesses and pro- spectives for the future use. (4) To discuss economic issues concerning SmartCards. (5) To discuss security issues around the SmartCards. (6) To discuss standard issues concerning SmartCards. (7) To educate and inform others about the the strength, weaknesses and general use of SmartCards. (8) To share information and ideas about the future use of Smart- in all appropriate areas. Subgroups Subgroups will be added at a later date, as technology mature and new products emerge. Rationale A SmartCard is commonly understood to be a single chip integrated on card like a credit card. The chip can be a pure memory device, but it can also be a full microprocessor for more sophisticated use. The functions of the card is defined by programming the chip and it can of course be done in many ways. Therefore the wide spread of use. SmartCards are today used in many different areas and there will be many new possibilities in the future. A market survey from 1992 looks like this: Mobile Telephones 25 % Banking 25 % Pay Telephones 5 % Access Control 15 % Health Care 5 % Transportation 15 % Others 10 % SmartCards are often used for identification purposes which means that security is important issue when we are discussing these cards. The SmartCards are an emerging technology which will have great im- pact on a lot of different businesses in the future, therefore the newsgroup will be of great help to a lot of people. Summary In summary, the creation of a new newsgroup is needed for discus- sions about SmartCards which is an emerging technology. SmartCards are used and will in the future be used in a lot of dif- ferent businesses, therefore also a great need for the newsgroup. Discussions of the proposed group should properly be help on alt.config (Note that the Followup-To: line of this posting will direct any responses to alt.config.) Readers should feel free to re-post this article to other newsgroups whose readers might find it of interest, as long as the Followup- To: line remains directed to alt.config. Please E-mail me if you have any suggestions or oppinions about the group, or post them to alt.config. Lars Kalsen dalk@login.dkuug.dk ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 Jul 1993 12:46:45 -0400 (EDT) Reply-To: 0005066432@MCIMAIL.COM Subject: Incident at a COCOT From: Paul Robinson Organization: Tansin A. Darcos & Company, Silver Spring, MD USA I went with my relatives in Alexandria, VA to go to a theatre near their home at the Skyline Mall to see the movie "The Firm." (About the only telecom issue which could be raised by that film was whether the bugs in the house's phones were installed by the law firm or by the telephone installer at the lawyer's home who said "We do all the firm's installations"). The movie ended about 10:30 at night. We got separated and I was going to call someone, only to discover I had no money on me at all, not even a quarter; I'd spent it on cab fare over to the mall from the train station. No sweat, I'd use my calling cards. NOT! The pay telephones in the mall were all private, e.g. "Customer Owned Coin Operated Telephone Single Line Insert Money Excessive", or the infamous "COCOT SLIME". :) Sure, they'd take quarters for local calls, or yhou can use a credit card to make 0+ calls via some AOS whose name I had never heard of. Since I'm a regular reader of this Digest, this was a red flag warning to be aware of high rates. So I thought that I'd better check the rate on a call. For a local call over a credit card, that the local phone company would charge 65c, and AT&T would probably charge about $1 plus the usual time charge of 10c/minute, the AOS operator quoted me a rate of $4.00 for the first ONE MINUTE. We are talking about a distance from the mall to the house I needed to call of roughly four or five miles. At this rate, it would almost be cheaper to take a cab over there! If they were going to charge me the usual rate of say $1.10 or even $1.60, I would have grumbled and accepted that, but 400% of AT&T's rate was in my opinion excessive so I refused to go along. Well, trying to dial the call by using 10288-0-703-xxx-xxxx doesn't work, giving me a recording of "It is not necessary to dial a long-distance access code." Sure it isn't, if I wanted to pay them 6 times what the local telephone company would charge me, or 4 times AT&T's rate. So I tried dialing the call 0-703-xxx-xxxx and using the "85" credit card from AT&T at their "bong". Their operator came on, then explained that they can't accept AT&T's non-telephone credit cards, but she would transfer me. That didn't work, as the AT&T Operator couldn't hear me. I tried using MCI. Apparently I haven't used my cards in a while or something, because MCI says the MCI card they issued me is not valid, and they can't seem to take the telephone company issued card over the 950 or 1-800 access numbers. (I didn't want to use my telephone company issued card directly via 0-703-xxx-xxxx because I felt $4 for the first minute for a local call was excessive.) And while MCI *can* take Visa for credit card calls, they can't take it without a PIN number. I haven't used a PIN number with my Visa card in four years, so I don't even know what the PIN is. I panicked. I tried calling AT&T's number to dial into its switch - and I messed up and dialed the wrong number - which meant I couldn't get through to AT&T; I first thought the phone was blocking that particular 1-800 number. After a while, I calmed down and realized what was wrong; I wasn't dialing 1-800-32-10ATT, I was dialing something else. After I calmed down, I dialed the correct 1-800 number for AT&T and the call went through with the "85" card AT&T issued me. I wasn't too far off on the cost difference; I got through and someone at the relative's place left out money for me to take a taxi from the mall to their house, and it cost $4.75. Paul Robinson - TDARCOS@MCIMAIL.COM ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 Jul 1993 12:35:58 -0400 (EDT) Reply-To: 0005066432@MCIMAIL.COM Subject: White House Orders No Bid Telephone System From: Paul Robinson Organization: Tansin A. Darcos & Company, Silver Spring, MD USA There has been considerable flack placed upon the White House for deciding to contact two switch bidders -- Northern Telecom and AT&T -- and deciding to place an order consisting of Centrex service from C&P Telephone and ordering a switch from AT&T, without putting this contract out for bids. The White House cited the security concerns which only those two equipment companies were able to meet, as the reason for the no bid contract. A spokesperson for the White House indicated that they need to order something fast to keep up with the huge volumes of calls they are getting, and that the new contracts will give them better service for less than they are paying now. There may be some issue to question the ordering of a telephone switch without putting the order out for bid, but -- irregardless of my personal opinions of the current resident of the Oval office and her husband -- the questioning of the proposed contract with C&P Telephone seems specious, because no matter what type of system was installed, the White House, whether it got Centrex or DID system or even POTS lines or some hybrid, it would still have to contract for local dial tone and loop termination of the standard number 202-456-1414 with the local phone company. Paul Robinson - TDARCOS@MCIMAIL.COM ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 Jul 93 12:47:30 EDT From: dwn@dwn.ccd.bnl.gov (Dave Niebuhr) Subject: Lawyers and IP Owners There was an article in the July 7, 1993, issue of {Newsday} in the Part II section about why lawyers are held in such low esteem by the general public. There was a little blurb at the end about a person who set up a 900 number that people could call for $5.00 per minute and chew out lawyers. The IP owner? A lawyer. Dave Niebuhr Internet: niebuhr@bnl.gov / Bitnet: niebuhr@bnl Brookhaven National Laboratory Upton, LI, NY 11973 (516)-282-3093 Senior Technical Specialist: Scientific Computer Facility ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 Jul 93 19:28:36 EDT From: ae446@freenet.carleton.ca (Nigel Allen) Subject: Teleglobe Canada to Close Down Globetex Text-to-Telex Service Organization: Echo Beach Reply-To: ae446@freenet.carleton.ca Teleglobe Canada Inc., Canada's only overseas telecommunications carrier, says it plans to close down its Globetex text-to-telex service. It had previously closed down a text-to-fax service. You could reach the Globetex computer via the Datapac packet network or by making a normal modem call. Teleglobe, formerly the Canadian Overseas Telecommunications Corporation, provides telecommunications links between Canada and the rest of the world, except for the United States. Teleglobe is partly owned by BCE Inc., the parent company of Bell Canada. I think BCE owns significantly less than 50 percent of Teleglobe, but I don't know the exact figures. BCE and Teleglobe have their head offices in the same building in Montreal (1000 de La Gauchetiere Street West, which also houses the Montreal terminal of STRSM, the Montreal South Shore Transit Corporation). A letter from Mr. Gilles Leduc, Teleglobe's vice-president of marketing, suggests that Globetex customers could switch to comparable services offered by Stentor (Envoy 100) and Unitel (Dialcom T-mail). Mr. Leduc can be reached by phone at (514) 868-7200, or by fax at (514) 868-7428. In practice, I think that Canadian telecommunications users who want to send a text message to an overseas telex machine may find it easier and cheaper to use a U.S. e-mail service such as MCI Mail, which automatically assigns an MCI telex number to every MCI Mail user. Other e-mail services such as CompuServe and AT&T Mail may also allow users to send telex messages. As other people have pointed out, telex may make sense when you need to communicate with someone in a country where phones are scarce or unreliable. In most other cases, e-mail or fax makes more sense. (A shipbroker tells me that messages about chartering ships are often sent by telex because shipbrokers want written proof a message was sent, though.) Nigel Allen, Toronto, Ontario, Canada ae446@freenet.carleton.ca ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 08 Jul 93 22:54:42 EDT From: Tony @ Brownvm Subject: Public Phone in Chemult, Oregon Last week I took the train from LA to Portland, Oregon. The train made a three minute stop in Chemult, and I noticed from the window a 1960's style red and white phone booth on the platform. Inside was what appeared to be an ordinary beige wall phone. There was certainly no room for a coinbox, though I couldn't see if there was a dial. There was a small (say 7" x 9") booklet on a shelf in the booth. The booth said TELEPHONE, so I doubt this was a direct taxi line or anything like that. What's the story? Does Chemult have free public phones? I gather it's a small lumber town. On a related note, does anyone know what the cellular coverage is like along the route of the Coast Starlight? How about mobile data (Mobidem)? Amtrak doesn't provide Railfone service on this train, presumably because of spotty coverage. Tony Harminc ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 Jul 1993 00:38:54 -0400 From: Monty Solomon Subject: Communication Departments Who Can't Communicate [Moderator's Note: Mr. Solomon passed this along from rec.humor.funny. PAT] Date: Mon, 5 Jul 93 4:30:02 EDT From: frank@rover.bsd.uchicago.edu (FRANK BORGER) Abstract of a recent phone conversation between myself and a service person from our local communication department. Me (after bouncing through about six offices) "One of our computer lines, (xxx-yyyy) has a bad line. I can no longer get an outgoing dial tone, and incoming calls get a message 'That number is currently being tested, please try again later.' We've been doing work-arounds, but wonder how long it will be down?" Service-droid (after some delay talking to their computer ...) "Oh, that line was de-activated as a cost cutting measure. We can re-activate it if you wish." Me (somewhat puzzled at Ameritech's use of the English language ...) "You mean nobody was actually checking the line? Why did the recorded message say the line was being tested?" Service-droid, (rather bemused at questioning the voice of god ...) "Oh, that's always been the message you get when a line has been de-activated." Selected by Maddi Hausmann. Sponsored by ClariNet Communications Corp. ------------------------------ Subject: Internet Articles in {The Nation} 12 July 1993 From: woody Date: Thu, 8 Jul 1993 16:52:21 -0400 The current edition of {The Nation} has two articles regarding Internet and related "data superhighway" concerns. The first is by Kevin Cooke and Dan Lehrer, entitled "The Whole World is Talking" and contains a description of Internet's history and possible future, including an anecdote about Wam Kat's "Zagreb Diary" reporting the situation from Croatia via an Internet link through Germany. The second article by Herbert I. Schiller, "Public Way or Private Road?" deals more with the future ownership or "government" of the Internet. There are dangers to letting the private interests run the show, many of which are old hat to the likes of the EFF, various Internet veterans, and the computer underground. Check for 12 July 1993 edition of {The Nation}. David Leibold ------------------------------ From: juergen@jojo.sub.org Date: Thu, 8 Jul 1993 06:13:07 +0200 Subject: How to Get Coin Phone? Hi folks, A friend of mine will celebrate his ..th birthday this year. Since he is also one of the phoneholics, I want to make a very special gift to him. Well, there are many different new types of phones available, but I think a US coin phone (please no GTE design) would be just great. Now I guess such phones are rather expensive, if you buy them new. But is there a way to get such a phone, "partially" defective, which could be repaired for home use (no coin operation needed)? Here (in Germany) the national telephone operator sells old "stuff" measured by its weight! So I guess the US telcos also want to get rid of old stuff, and make some "money" on it!? Please answer by mail! Thanks. BTW, how to get other used phone equipment in the USA?? Juergen Ziegler | Mail: juergen@jojo.sub.org standard Obervogt-Haefelinstr. 48 | disclaimer 77815 Buehl (Baden) | applies Germany | ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 Jul 93 14:34:28 EDT From: Ekkehard.Rohwedder@KURT.TIP.CS.CMU.EDU Subject: US -> Europe Direct Dial: 13th Digit Spells Bad Luck Hello -- I never thought I would have occasion to contribute a story to TELECOM, but ... here it goes: When dialing direct through AT&T to a fax number in Germany: 011 +49 6131 XXX 4555 after some time lag, I always hear a short beep and then a busy signal. On the other hand, I can reach the voice line there at: 011 +49 6131 XXX 450 just fine. I contacted AT&T, and today I finally got a technician on the phone. The bottom line is this: Local U.S. exchanges only have the capacity to store 12-digit numbers (i.e. in my case +49 6131 XXX 455). This turns out to be an illegal phone number in Germany, which causes a congest signal to be sent back to the US (the beep), which then is turned into a busy signal here. The technician was able to reach the fax number dialling through a T1 connection. ATTENTION: EUROPEAN READERS TAKE NOTE If you have a 13 digit (including country code) phone number, you cannot be reached through direct dial from a local exchange in the United States!! (As I was told there are 13-digit numbers currently in Germany, Austria, and the Chech Republic.) AT&T suggested to: (a) go through the operator. -- Of course, this is going to be somewhat of a hassle --- no unattended scheduled faxes this way. Supposedley in this case I would only be charged the direct-dial rate (is this true?). (b) get a T1-pipe connection and not go through the local exchange. This is very expensive. (Just out of curiosity - how expensive? Supposedly there some companies do have their own T1 lines.) Any other suggestions? -- I guess the local exchanges here will always have 12-digit memory only. I am actually a bit surprised that the Long Distance Services Repair operator did not suggest right away to dial through the operator. Maybe this 13-digit problem is not yet so well known or widespread. Ekkehard PS: Excuse me if I used the wrong terminology - I do not know much about telecommunications. I also do not remember having seen this topic brought up here, but then I do not read all the messages on the digest, either. I will try my luck with option (a) when I get home. [Moderator's Note: It is true that when direct dial is not possible for some reason, the AT&T operators will complete the call at direct dial rates, waiving the surcharge for operator assistance. But I have never heard of this before; that a number which requires thirteen digits to dial cannot be reached directly. We in the USA have had IDDD in many exchanges for twenty years, and in almost all exchanges for several years now. No one has yet raised this point??? PAT] ------------------------------ Organization: Valencia University (Universitat de Valencia) SPAIN Date: Thu, 8 Jul 1993 23:32:58 EST From: Rogelio Montanana Subject: Can I Use Telnet Over a Satellite Link? We are a group of four Universities that want to be connected by high speed links (2 Mb or higher), without using the PTT services, that happen to be very expensive in Spain. The topology would be a star with three links, the distances varying from about 8 Km to about 100 Km. The main protocol used is TCP/IP. Talking with telecommunication specialists they recommend satellite links (they call it VSAT); I remember to have read somewhere that satellite links introduce long delays in the packets sent (something between half a second and two seconds maybe?). It worries me because, for example, using telnet with remote echo means two packets sent per key, and half a second delay would be unacceptable in this situation. The specialists claim that it is no problem, but I am not so sure. Is anybody over there using satellite links for interactive applications, like telnet? I will appreciate hearing of any experience using satellite links in TCP/IP networks. Regards, Rogelio Montanana, System Analyst Tel:(346)3864310 Fax:(346)3864200 Valencia Univ. Computer Center Bitnet: montanan at evalun11 Dr. Moliner, 50 Internet: montanan@vm.ci.uv.es 46100 Burjassot Hepnet: evalun::montanan (or 16530::montanan) Spain X400: C=es;A=mensatex;P=iris;O=uv;OU=ci;OU=vm;SN=montanan ------------------------------ End of TELECOM Digest V13 #457 ******************************   Received: from delta.eecs.nwu.edu by mintaka.lcs.mit.edu id aa03042; 9 Jul 93 8:39 EDT Received: by delta.eecs.nwu.edu id AA27253 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4 for telecomlist-outbound); Fri, 9 Jul 1993 02:24:46 -0500 Received: by delta.eecs.nwu.edu id AA19025 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4 for telecomlist); Fri, 9 Jul 1993 02:24:01 -0500 Date: Fri, 9 Jul 1993 02:24:01 -0500 From: TELECOM Moderator Message-Id: <199307090724.AA19025@delta.eecs.nwu.edu> To: telecom@eecs.nwu.edu Subject: TELECOM Digest V13 #458 TELECOM Digest Fri, 9 Jul 93 02:24:00 CDT Volume 13 : Issue 458 Inside This Issue: Moderator: Patrick A. Townson HPN '94: High Performance Networking - Call For Papers (C. Diot) Requesting Information on Arch Telecom Corp. (David Lebowitz) Switching Red/Green to Black/Yellow (Rob Knauerhase) There is Indeed Some Competence at Pacific Bell (C. E. Buckley) Information on Singapore Telecomm Wanted (Gerry George) Power Crosses Phoneline (Was why -48V) (system@garlic.sbs.com) Phone Test Set Recommendations? (Scott McClure) Control Device Wanted (Sean Slattery) Electronics Now Telephone Projects (David Leibold) 811 to Reach Telco Business Offices (Lauren Weinstein) 811 in California (was Cox and BellSouth Want to Use 511) (Rich Greenberg) Charging, Accounting, Billing (Robert Reijmerink) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Christophe.Diot@imag.fr (Christophe Diot) Subject: HPN '94 : High Performance Networking - Call for Papers Organization: IMAG Institute, University of Grenoble, France Date: Thu, 8 Jul 1993 15:44:17 GMT HPN'94 5th IFIP CONFERENCE ON HIGH PERFORMANCE NETWORKING (GRENOBLE- FRANCE) JUNE 27 - JULY 1, 1994 CALL FOR PAPERS *************** OBJECTIVE AND SCOPE This workshop belongs to the serie started in 1987 in Aachen, followed by Liege in 1988, Berlin in 1991 and Liege in 1992. It aims at presenting and discussing evolution in the framework of high-speed networking and computing in private and public networks. Original contributions on the following topics are solicited. A. NEW MAC SERVICES AND PROTOCOLS Gigabit networks ATM-based Systems B. ENHANCED NETWORK AND TRANSPORT SERVICES AND PROTOCOLS Multipeer services and protocols Admission and congestion control Time-constraint management C. NEW SERVICES AND PROTOCOLS Synchronization semantic and management Protocols for groupware communication Video over high speed networks QoS semantic D. NEW APPLICATIONS Multimedia Distribution network algorithms Groupware communication E. INTERNETWORKING Routing in high performance multimedia networks Bridges and routers technology and protocols Meshed architectures F. IMPLEMENTATION AND PERFORMANCE EVALUATION MAC Performance in high speed networks Efficient Protocol Implementation Prospective authors are invited to send an intention to submit a paper (with provisional title, author list, and addresses) to Serge Fdida (fdida@masi.ibp.fr) GENERAL CHAIRMAN Guy Pujolle (MASI, Univ. Versailles, F) PROGRAM CHAIRMAN Serge Fdida (MASI, Univ. Paris 5, F) PROGRAM COMMITTEE Daniel Abensour (IBM Res. Div. Cary, USA) Andres Albanese (Bellcore, USA) Patrick Baker (HP Labs Bristol, UK) Augusto Casaca (INESC P) Greg Chesson (SGI, USA) Andre Danthine (Univ. de Liege, B) Michel Diaz (LAAS, F) Christophe Diot (IMAG, Grenoble, F) Zygmunt Haas (AT&T Bell Labs, USA) Marjory Johnson (RIACS, USA) Nick Maxemchuk (AT&T Bell Labs, USA) Hanafy Meleis (DEC, USA) Gerard Michel (IMAG, Grenoble, F) Craig Partridge (BBN, USA) Radu Popescu-Zeletin (GMD FOKUS, D) Otto Spaniol (Tech. Univ. Aachen, D) Samir Thome (TELECOM PARIS, F) Harmen Van As (IBM Zurich, CH) Martina Zitterbart (Univ. Karlsruhe, D) ORGANIZATION CO-CHAIRMEN Jean-Pierre Verjus (IMAG, Grenoble F) Christophe Diot (IMAG, Grenoble F) VENUE The conference will be organized by the IMAG Institute and IBP Institute, and will be held in Grenoble, France. Grenoble is located at hundred kilometers from Lyon and hundred and fifty kilometers from Geneva. Grenoble is the heart of the French Alps. Following the 1968 Olympic games, Grenoble developed a high technology R&D park around one of the most famous French Universities. CONTRIBUTIONS Papers must be written in English and should not exceed 12 pages single spaced, or 20 pages double spaced. The front page should contain the author's names, address, phones, faxes, and emails, as well as a 150 words abstract. All submitted papers that scope with the topics will be refereed. Authors of accepted papers will be requested to sign a copyright release from the IFIP. A participant edition of the proceedings will be made available at the Conference from the camera-ready copy which will be used later on for the publication of the proceedings by Elsevier (North Holland). The accepted papers not presented by the author(s) at the conference will not be included in the published proceedings. Four copies of the submitted papers will have to be received no later than October 30, 1993, by: Serge FDIDA Universite Rene Descartes - UFR Maths-Info Laboratoire MASI 45, rue des Saints-Peres 75006 Paris (France) Phone : +33 (1) 42 86 21 36; Fax : +33 (1) 42 86 22 31; e.mail : fdida@masi.ibp.fr TUTORIALS Tutorials will be organized on June 27 & 28, 1994. Suggestions for half or full day tutorials are welcome. IMPORTANT DATES OCTOBER 30, 1993 FULL PAPER SUBMISSION DEADLINE JANUARY 31, 1994 NOTIFICATION OF ACCPTANCE MARCH 31, 1994 CAMERA-READY COPY DUE JUNE 27-28, 1994 TUTORIALS JUNE 29, JUL 1, 1994 CONFERENCE Any information about HPN'94 can be requested through e-mail at the following adress: HPN94@imag.fr If interested by HPN '94, return the following information to Serge Fdida (by post or e.mail): [ ] I intend to submit a paper to HPN '94; the provisional title will be ............................................. The list of authors will be ............................... e-mail for the first author:............................... [ ] I do not intend to submit a paper but I am interested to receive the program of HPN '94 First and last names :..................................... Title :................... Affiliation :................... Address: .................................................. Tel : ................... Fax :........................... E.mail :................. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 Jul 93 22:29 GMT From: David Lebowitz <0004051565@mcimail.com> Subject: Requesting Info on Arch Telecom Corp. Recently a relative of mine was recruited by a company in the tele- communication business to work for them as a sales representative. She attended a seminar provided by the company and then contacted me to see if I might be interested in becoming involved. I asked for more details on the company and the arrangements for representation and she forwarded a couple of brochures and a copy of their employment contract. The name of the company is Arch Telecom, their headquarters is in Houston, Texas. From what I can determine, they are a re-seller of 800 services and claim to have exclusive and proprietary software that allows them to offer services that other 800 providers don't have. .Fraud Detection and Cost Controls. They guarantee that the user will not be responsible for any amount over $50 because they monitor all calls constantly. .Travel card. Arch Telecom's calling card service has no sur- charge, 6 second call rounding, no call minimum, no higher 1st minute rate, protection from unauthorized use, speed dialing, customers' own choice of authorization codes, international calling capabilities, 24 hour customer service. .Automatic transfer of calls via preset codes by receptionist. .Transfers of calls anywhere without pre-programming by recep- tionist. .Caller may transfer calls by use of predetermined pre-programmed codes allowing caller to make multiple calls to other offices or locations without hanging up. .Automated menu routing. .Live operator database routing based on zip codes, customer I.D. or product codes, etc. .Real time destination programming allowing the customer to re- program from any touch tone phone, where their "800" number will ring. .Exchange-by-exchange routing, allows a compnay with multiple locations to use 1 "800" number. Calls are automatically routed to the closest office. .Overflow routing. .ANI blocking/passing. Blocks access of unmwanted calls or limits access. .Custom calling region to limit the area from which the number is accessible. .Real time ANI & DNIS. .Customer call back. By entering a predetermined code customers can return calls to hang-ups or disconnects. .International call back. .On-line up to the second call detail. Since I'm no authority on the details of 800 services, I would appreciate any feedback on the relative value of the services as well as information on their availability from other sources. I would also be very interested in hearing from anyone who has had any experience in dealing with Arch Telecom. They claim to have grown to $100,000,000.00 in annual billings in a very short time without any sales force whatsoever. Thus I assume that there must be people out there who have done business with them and might be willing to share some information about them. Thanks for any assistance or information you can provide. David K. Lebowitz dlebowitz@mcimail.com ------------------------------ From: knauer@ibeam.intel.com (Rob Knauerhase) Subject: Switching Red/Green to Black/Yellow Date: Thu, 8 Jul 1993 21:09:33 -0700 (PDT) Organization: Intel Mobile Software Lab, Hillsboro, OR Greetings all, Does anyone know of a switch that will take a four-wire input (where red/green are line one and black/yellow are line two) and select one of the pairs to connect to red/green output? I have two lines in my apartment, and would like an easier way of switching the modem between them than moving the plug from one jack to another. Radio Shack (even the catalog) was unhelpful. Hello Direct sells a two-lines-to-one-line switch, but it's (1) expensive and (2) clumsy since I'd have to split my one wire in two in order to switch between them. I've checked in a couple other places to no avail as well. Thanks, Rob Knauerhase, Intel Mobile Software Lab, Hillsboro OR [Moderator's Note: Radio Shack has a two-line controller which uses buttons on the front to shift the line of your choice into a single line output. For incoming calls, the ringing signal forces the con- troller to shift the ringing line into the output. I've got one here which allows two Caller-ID equipped lines to be fed into a single Caller-ID display unit. Either ringing line seizes the controller and feeds its output to the display box. PAT] ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 Jul 93 21:17:03 -0700 From: ceb@netcom.com (Buckley) Subject: There is Indeed Some Competence at Pacific Bell I recently had a service interaction with a Pacific Bell business office representative that was so extraordinarily above their usual mediocre performance that I'd like to see to it that the represen- tative involved gets proper credit. Unlike the typical Pacific Bell interface employee, this person knew her stuff, and really did an effective job. Even more refreshing was that when she didn't knwo something, she actually went and found out the answer instead of trying to making something something up (through which I can usually see). I know her identifying information, and am so impressed I'd be more than happy to write a letter of commendation for her (in case anyone there does care about quality and competence, which sometimes seems far from evident). I know that Pacific Bell employees lurk on this list, and I'd be most appreciative for advice on how to make known my experience in a way that won't actually cause more harm than good (as often seems to happen when commendations are fed into organizations which institutionalize mediocrity). If Pacific Bell is serious about being some place where "'good enough' isn't", I'd appreciate the opportunity to give a push to someone who might materially contribute to making that come true. ------------------------------ From: ggeorge@bu.edu (Gerry George) Subject: Information on Singapore Telecomm Wanted Date: 9 Jul 1993 04:22:35 GMT Organization: Boston University I am in dire need of some information from anyone at U. of Penn. (Wharton Business School) or Cornell U. I'm trying to get a copy of part of a report on "Teleconnumications in Southeast Asia" by Frost & Sullivan Research Inc. The portion I'm specifically interested in is on Singapore. I found out that it is online at the Wharton Business School Library, and is available on the shelf (bound copy) at Cornell U. Is there anyone out there in netland who knows how I can get online access to the Wharton School Library or the U-Penn system? Either a host name or dial-up number would be fine. In addition, information about any access restrictions or a contact name (library personnel at either Wharton or Cornell) whom I could contact for information would also be helpful. Additionally, would anyone in comp.dcom.telecom world know of any pointers, additional info, or any general help? This info is required for a research project, and is required *as soon as possible* so please e-mail me at ggeorge@acs.bu.edu if you can provide any help. Thanks very much, Gerry George School of Management, Boston Univ. Internet: ggeorge@acs.bu.edu HomeNet: ggeorge@jacquot.ci.net Compu$erve: 72607.2560@compuserve.com ------------------------------ From: system@garlic.sbs.com Date: Thu, 08 Jul 93 22:34:15 EDT Subject: Power Crosses Phone Lines (was Why -48V on Local Loop?) Andy Rabagliati writes: > In the UK, any crossing of power lines over phone lines is treated > with great concern. Big netting arrangements are built, so that if the > power cables break they will still not touch phone lines. [The above was left in just for clarity] > Phone lines strung cross country are bare wires -- not the two inch > cables seen in the US. Those two inch cables in the United States used to carry quite a few copper pairs and are just now beginning to carry lots of fiber optic lines. > Phone lines in town are ALWAYS buried. Lots of cities and states in the US seem to be pushing for burial of most utility cables. Funny part is, where I live my electrical service is underground, but telephone is still on poles. I've noticed that during storms you can ALWAYS expect the electricity to go out (if your lines are on poles) but the phone service hardly EVER goes out with the exception of a physically torn line. Tony system@hades.cdp.org ------------------------------ From: scott@ryptyde.nix.com (Scott McClure) Subject: Phone Test Set Recommendations? Organization: NIX - The Network Information eXchange Date: Thu, 8 Jul 1993 08:05:19 GMT Hi all, I bought a Vodavi LTS-2000 test set last week, and used it briefly over the last weekend. It is a fairly basic model, with few "extras." To make a short story long, I ran into a PacBell installer and we got into comparing gear. His had all kinds of features, such as memory presets and a speakerphone (really nice to have when you're trying to do a million things at once!). 8-) So I've been looking at exchanging it for a model with more features. I've been looking at spec sheets on several other models, such as the Dracon TS-22 and 22A. The former is available at the local Greybar for $299.94. The 22A (top-of-the-line) is $433.27. I'm not sure I really want to pay over $400 for a test set. Has anyone else used a particular brand/model they would recommend? Do the above prices seem "reasonable?" Thanks, Scott INTERNET: scott@nix.com Non-MX: ryptyde!scott@nosc.mil UUCP: {crash, nosc}!ryptyde!scott ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 Jul 93 13:09 GMT From: Sean Slattery Subject: Control Device Wanted Hello all, I am looking for a box that I can attach to a phone line such that when I call that line the box will answer and will close relay contacts according to what I type on the pad. For example: I would dial up the box, it would answer, I would dial "7364#" and contact A would close, I would dial "45#" and contact B would close. Dialing "*" would cause contact C to close only while the "*" tone was present (in this case you would buzzing someone through a door). Box should be completely programmable as to number of digits and actions. This is for an access control system for my company, I have been tasked with the job of designing a system flexible enough so that the engineers won't disable it when it thwarts them. Please reply to: vonslatt@mcimail.com Sean Slattery Network Administrator Airflow Research & Mfg. ------------------------------ Subject: Electronics Now Telephone Projects From: woody Date: Thu, 8 Jul 1993 23:52:06 -0400 The August '93 edition of _Electronics_Now_ (formerly Radio-Electronics, which formerly was Radio Craft) has a couple of telephone projects for the DIY enthusiast. One is a phone line simulator which provides ringing signal, and a tone (albeit a 500 Hz tone, not a true 350/440Hz dual tone) through RJ11 jacks. Phone sets and answering machines can thus be tested off the local loop. The other project is a phone line selector, with four phone lines input, going to a single line output (such as an answering machine, etc). This is not to be confused with devices to decode a distinctive ringing cadence; this device just picks up the first call on the incoming lines. David Leibold ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 9 Jul 93 00:36 PDT From: lauren@vortex.com (Lauren Weinstein) Subject: 811 to Reach Telco Business Offices Greetings. The Moderator mentions use of 811 in California to reach the telco business office. It's worth noting that 811 is not a complete number -- at least not in Pacific or GTE territories. Actually, 811 is a statewide "prefix" used by Pacific Bell (I don't know if Pacific's Nevada territory is tied in). There are a whole slew of 811 + 4D numbers for reaching all manner of business offices, administrative offices, corporate headquarters, etc. Many are listed in local telephone directories. I believe that most 811 numbers are mapped into conventional POTS numbers. Note that these 811 numbers are dialed without any area codes -- they are "local" (and toll-free) everywhere you can dial them. While the phone books warn that 811 numbers may not be reachable from non-Pacific areas, I've yet to find a GTE area where 811 numbers were not dialable. How the internal billing for 811 is handled between the companies, and how the inter-LATA traffic is routed, might be interesting. Most likely it all travels on Pacific Bell private circuits. GTE, by the way, makes no use of 811 themselves in California, but uses 800 numbers extensively for business offices and the like. --Lauren-- ------------------------------ From: richgr@netcom.com (Rich Greenberg) Subject: 811 in California (was Cox and BellSouth Want to Use 511) Organization: Netcom Online Communications Services (408-241-9760 login: guest) Date: Thu, 8 Jul 1993 15:09:51 GMT In article BBOERNER@novell.com our Esteemed Moderator who was remarking on a post from (Brendan B. Boerner) noted: > [Moderator's Note: Don't forget 611 in your list above which is often > used for repair service. 811 is used in California to reach the phone > company business office ... I guess the news hasn't worked as far east as Chicago yet. 811-xxxx to reach your local telco (provided that your local telco happens to be Pa Bell) has been phased out. I had noticed some months ago that all of the Pa Bell phone numbers on my bill were 800- numbers, not the 811 numbers. The next time I had business with Pa Bell, I asked the rep why. The reason turned out to be quite sensible and customer service oriented. Within California, where whatever Pa Bell tells the little telcos to put into their routing tables goes (with the exception of those who don't know how to fix the tables) 811 was working well. The problem was that some Pa Bell bills were being paid by out-of-state corporate headquarters and that number was increasing with mergers, buyouts, takeovers, ... It didn't make sense to have 800 numbers for out of state and 811 in-state, so they just made all of us dial an extra four digits. :-( Rich Greenberg Work: ETi Solutions, Oceanside CA 619-631-5280 N6LRT TinselTown, USA Play: richgr@netcom.com 310-649-0238 I speak for myself only. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 08 Jul 1993 11:15:35 +0000 (GMT) From: R.A.J.Reijmerink@research.ptt.nl (Robert Reijmerink) Subject: Charging, Accounting, Billing Organization: PTT Research, The Netherlands I have a few questions about telecommunication billing. Billing procedure in the Netherlands provides every customer with one (specified) bill every two months. Tariffing is centralised. However, situations occur in which customers (i.e. customer terminals: PBX or payphone) have a more direct need for cost information, preferably on-line. For this, the term direct charging is used. With direct charging the problem of tariff distribution arises. In the Netherlands, direct charging is now conducted by means of sending 50 Hz meter pulses to the calling party's terminal. We are looking for alternative ways of sending cost data to user's terminals. Choosing a widely used solution is of importance and therefore we would like to have a view of some methods used for direct charging in other countries. Can anyone provide information about this subject? The following questions are of concern: - How is direct charging done in your country? In what ways can subscribers get on-line charging information? - What signals are provided to subscribers (which protocol, meter pulses, other solutions)? - How is tariff information transferred to peripheral devices, like payphones and PBXs ? Please answer by email. Thanks in advance, Robert Reijmerink PTT Research P.O.Box 15000 9700 CD Groningen The Netherlands Internet R.A.J.Reijmerink@research.ptt.nl Phone +31 50 821089 Uucp [mcsun,hp4nl]!pttrtl!reijmeri Fax +31 50 122415 X.400 Country:NL,Admd:400Net,Prmd:PTT Research,Surname:Reijmerink ------------------------------ End of TELECOM Digest V13 #458 ******************************   Received: from delta.eecs.nwu.edu by mintaka.lcs.mit.edu id aa20778; 9 Jul 93 20:59 EDT Received: by delta.eecs.nwu.edu id AA30481 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4 for telecomlist-outbound); Fri, 9 Jul 1993 17:57:27 -0500 Received: by delta.eecs.nwu.edu id AA02727 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4 for telecomlist); Fri, 9 Jul 1993 17:56:50 -0500 Date: Fri, 9 Jul 1993 17:56:50 -0500 From: TELECOM Moderator Message-Id: <199307092256.AA02727@delta.eecs.nwu.edu> To: telecom@eecs.nwu.edu Subject: TELECOM Digest V13 #459 TELECOM Digest Fri, 9 Jul 93 17:56:30 CDT Volume 13 : Issue 459 Inside This Issue: Moderator: Patrick A. Townson Re: Cox and BellSouth Want to Use 511 (Seth B. Rothenberg) Re: Cox and BellSouth Want to Use 511 (Charles Stephens) Re: Cox and BellSouth Want to Use 511 (Bob Goudreau) Re: Cox and BellSouth Want to Use 511 (Carl Moore) Re: Cox and BellSouth Want to Use 511 (John R. Levine) Re: Some More Historical Questions (John R. Levine) Re: Some More Historical Questions (Carl Oppedahl) Re: Some More Historical Questions (Mark Terribile) Re: Dialing "1" First (Paul Houle) Re: Dialing "1" First (David Leibold) Re: Dialing "1" First (David Breneman) Re: Maximum Number of Phone Lines to a Residence? (Reid R. Buyaky) Re: Maximum Number of Phone Lines to a Residence? (Dale Farmer) Re: Maximum Number of Phone Lines to a Residence? (Jeffrey Jonas) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: rothen+@pitt.edu (Seth B Rothenberg) Subject: Re: Cox and BellSouth Want to Use 511 Date: 8 Jul 93 13:30:40 GMT Organization: University of Pittsburgh In article hhallika@tuba.calpoly.edu (Harold Hallikainen) writes: > I recently got the PacBell bill stuffer on "1 means ten digits > follow". It looks like that's really gonna free up the number space. > People have complained about not knowing if a call is gonna cost them. > Maybe the telco can give a little warning beep as the call is being > handled. Maybe this could be done by requiring IXCs to play their standard tone whether the call is operator or not. eg, you would dial 1-212-555-4320 and hear " (chime!) AT & T" and then ringing. Or "(chime!) Thank you for using AT&T" and then ringing. Of course, then you would need the LECs to also give 'toll warnings' such as "(bong) Thank you for using Bell of PA" (they don't use a chime like AT&T does. Seth ------------------------------ From: cfs@mathcs.emory.edu (Charles Stephens) Subject: Re: Cox and BellSouth Want to Use 511 Date: 8 Jul 1993 17:11:42 GMT Organization: Emory University, Dept of Math and CS In MetroAtlanta (Southern Bell area) 611 is reserved for repair and 311 is used in some locations as automatic number readback. Very convenient when you don't label your phone jacks and you need to know which one goes to which phone line. Charles Stephens cfs@mathcs.emory.edu DISCLAIMER: I am a guest a Emory's Math and CS Dept., all opinions expressed, except those quoted by others, are my own, and not those of said organization. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 Jul 1993 13:39:32 -0400 From: goudreau@dg-rtp.dg.com (Bob Goudreau) Subject: Re: Cox and BellSouth Want to Use 511 In article hhallika@tuba.calpoly.edu (Harold Hallikainen) writes: > ... I prefer my previously proposed method of using # or timeout on > dialing. The system would then assume all unspecified leading digits > were the same as the originating phone. That way, I could dial one > digit to get my second line, or eleven digits (country code, area code, > and seven digits). This method would allow those with pocket dialers to > use the same number, no matter where they were. It would also remove > the need for an international access code. If you dialed eleven or more > digits, the first ones must be country codes. But you presume too much by requiring all fully-qualified international numbers to be at least 11 digits long. Not all countries have numbers which are guaranteed to be that long; some tiny countries have numbers as short as seven or eight total digits (including the three-digit country code). So, for example, how would you parse "6172345678" -- as a call to the Boston area (area code 617, with the missing country code defaulting to 1), or as a fully qualified number in the Brisbane, Australia area (country 61, area code 7)? Bob Goudreau Data General Corporation goudreau@dg-rtp.dg.com 62 Alexander Drive +1 919 248 6231 Research Triangle Park, NC 27709, USA ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 Jul 93 9:58:35 EDT From: Carl Moore Subject: Re: Cox and BellSouth Want to Use 511 There was a note in the Digest recently about 711 being used for self-ring in area 412 in western Pennsylvania. Anyone else ever hear anything regarding any usage of 711? ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 Jul 93 09:57 EDT From: johnl@iecc.com (John R. Levine) Subject: Re: Cox and BellSouth Want to Use 511 Organization: I.E.C.C. BellSouth made a big deal a little while ago about their plan to offer the currently unassigned X11 codes to various sorts of information services. (They listed it as one of their wonderful new advances in the quarterly financial report.) It is my impression that Bellcore's NANP folks are not thrilled by this plan, but since Bellcore is BellSouth's slave (along with the other RBOC's) there isn't much they can do about it. Perhaps they can assign 511 as an overlay area code for Miami. Regards, John Levine, johnl@iecc.com, {spdcc|ima|world}!iecc!johnl [Moderator's Note: This sort of fiasco did not happen back in the days when we had 'one system' (Bell) and 'one way of doing things', did it John? :) PAT] ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 Jul 93 11:13 EDT From: johnl@iecc.com (John R. Levine) Subject: Re: Some More Historical Questions Organization: I.E.C.C. > The account of this hookup said that the governor spoke into a > water-cooled microphone in Oklahoma City and the signal was audible in > Tulsa, about 100 Miles to the Northeast. They probably just pumped fantastic amounts of power through it. In the early days of electronics, in the absence of tube-based tunable amplifiers or receivers, they just cranked up the power since power generation was a technology which was already well established thanks to Tesla and Edison. I visited the Marconi site in Sydney N.S. a while back; one of his first trans-Atlantic radio stations, and the amount of power it used was amazing (although at the moment I can't find what it was), something like a megawatt. Regards, John Levine, johnl@iecc.com, {spdcc|ima|world}!iecc!johnl ------------------------------ From: oppedahl@panix.com (Carl Oppedahl) Subject: Re: Some More Historical Questions Date: 8 Jul 1993 19:52:39 -0400 Organization: PANIX Public Access Internet and Unix, NYC In Martin McCormick writes: > The account of this hookup said that the governor spoke into a > water-cooled microphone in Oklahoma City and the signal was audible in > Tulsa, about 100 Miles to the Northeast. Well, last year in {QST}, the amateur radio magazine, there was a photograph of a water-cooled telegraph key. A modern-day reconstruction of an old one, that is. Then one looked at the date of the magazine ... April. Carl Oppedahl AA2KW (intellectual property lawyer) 30 Rockefeller Plaza New York, NY 10112-0228 voice 212-408-2578 fax 212-765-2519 ------------------------------ From: mat@mole-end.matawan.nj.us Subject: Re: Some More Historical Questions Date: Fri, 9 Jul 1993 00:19:30 GMT Our Moderator notes: > Amazing technology? By the time grandpa left us he had seen in his > lifetime: the invention of radio, television, talking movies, airplanes, > automobiles, computers, countless other things; he saw the telephone > and electricity come into very wide acceptance and use as well, > bringing with widespread electrical distribution the use of refriger- > ators, fans, household lighting, etc. Can you imagine coming into a > world with none of those things as a young person growing up and and > having all of them in your daily life when you leave? Will we ever see > another century like the 20th in terms of sheer variety of inventions > and technological changes? ... Given the changes in the > past century, doesn't it blow your mind to think of what technology > will be like when *you* depart? I know it excites me. PAT] Excites? It _frightens_ me! Cast your minds back to the summer of 1969, those of you who are old enough. As Apollo 11's Lunar Module separated from the Command Module and began its descent to our moon's surface, a horde of dignitaries, guests, and such sat or stood watching a screen in a hall near Mission Control. In the front row there was a pair of black men. One of them was (if I recall correctly) 65 years old. He was there to accompany his father, who was 113 years old at the time, having been born a slave in the antebellum south. And those of you who are not old enough -- imagine the hush in millions of homes as the first pictures come back from the moon. Deep as we are in the heart of the Cold War this transmission is piped to the Soviet Union and broadcast there for those lucky enough to have -- or to be able to see -- a television. Imagine, if you can, the over-contrasty side view of a ladder, the black shape at the top changing as the hatch is opened, the clumsy white form stepping backwards down the ladder as hushed voice breaks in to explain what you are watching ... the glitch that suddenly turned the image negative until it was corrected a minute or so later ... and the feeling, when the transmission ended, that you may never quite understand all that this has meant. (This man's opinions are his own.) From mole-end Mark Terribile mat@mole-end.matawan.nj.us, Somewhere in Matawan, NJ [Moderator's Note: Oh Mark, I think the television coverage that Sunday night was the most amazing thing I've ever seen. At the time, I had a part-time job running the switchboard at the South Shore Country Club weekend evenings. Normally that three-position board was a real rocker, busy all the time; that night it was dead. Everyone in the place was downstairs either in the lobby or the cocktail lounge watch- ing the 'moon walk' on television. And not a peep from anyone. Dead silence with their eyes glued on the picture. Even the talking heads on television -- I call them the men with the fifty dollar hairdoos and the fifty cent brains -- had nothing to say once those men came down the ladder. Do you recall the twenty minutes or so of totally dead audio on CBS? Just silence as the camera followed those guys around, first to install the flag of the United States then to go about collecting rocks and dirt specimens to bring back to earth ... that was broadcast everywhere in the world simultaneously; people having their lunch Monday noon in Australia watched as amazed as we did here. Normally talkative Walter Cronkite was stunned into sil- ence. Oh yes, we wanted the Soviet Union to see this -- so what if it was four in the morning in Moscow! Do you recall President Nixon speaking briefly after that? He spoke only a minute or so in relative humility -- what could he say except thank you for a job well done to the people who made it possible? And the front page of the paper the next day was a single large photo of the men uprighting the American flag on the moon -- like that old photo from 25 years earlier at Iwo Jima -- and a headline, "Wow! Can You Believe This?" You can purchase a video of the entire event based on the CBS-TV coverage that Sunday night from Columbia House in Terre Haute, IN. I don't need a video. It is burned in my memory forever. ------------------------------ From: Paul.Houle@leotech.MV.COM (Paul Houle) Reply-To: houle@leotech.MV.COM Date: Thu, 08 Jul 1993 13:51:00 Subject: Re: Dialing "1" First Tom writes: > To 1+ or 0+ means that I am spending extra money. I like to > know this. I do too; Not too long I made all my phone calls on a campus phone system {could tell you the worst horror stories about Sprint, but I'll pass}, where I had to dial 3+ to enter an authorization code and 9+ to get an outside line. Well, not too long I was making an international call on an ordinary residental line {thank god!}, and I tried to enter my ATT calling card number as a "3+" once, realized what I was doing wrong, and then tried to dial the call "9+", well, I'm dialing "900+[more stuff]" and there were enough digits there to form a legal 900 number. Now, if you could dial a 900 number without the 1+, I could have gotten socked pretty bad. Unscrupulous 900 providers might find high volume international numbers and set up a number that slams you for $50 or so. I think this is already being done with 800 numbers, since I am sure people have their fingers slip when dialing them and hit the "9" instead. It might really pay to have a 900 number that is close to the number of really big mail order houses, reservation lines, long distance access ports ... 1-900-CALL-ATT and 1-900-COLLECT! When I called the number that was mentioned here that reads back your number along with an ad for 1-900-STOPPER, I got a "wrong number" the first time which seemed to be a hint line for a computer game on acid. Seriously. There was a voice menu telling you to "Dial 1 if you just landed on the planet Clorox 2 and don't know what to do", and "Dial 5 if you can't get past the pukeoid". Turns out that my finger slipped and there was an adjacent 900 number, as was investigated with the use of my custom long distance savings plan. Origin: NETIS (603) 432-2517/432-0922 (HST/V32) (1:132/189) ------------------------------ Subject: Re: Dialing "1" First From: woody Date: Thu, 8 Jul 1993 10:07:45 -0400 When the 416/905 split occurs in October, ten digit local calls will be introduced when crossing the Metro Toronto boundary (which will be the new area 416 boundary). Local calls from Toronto to 905 points will be dialed as 905 + number (no 1+ needed) whereas local calls into Toronto will be dialed as 416 + number. 1+ is only necessary for toll calls. Whether Bell Canada will permit local calls to be dialed with the 1+ in front remains to be seen, though calling 1+ local number normally results in a recorded message complaining that the call is not long distance. David Leibold ------------------------------ From: daveb%avatar@dsinet.dgtl.com (David Breneman) Subject: Re: Dialing "1" First Date: 9 Jul 93 19:40:37 GMT johnl@iecc.com (John R. Levine) writes: > To tell a number like 802-5556 from 802-555-6789, there are > two dialing plans in use in North America. In one plan, all calls > within your area code are dialed with seven digits, whether they are > local or toll. In the other, all toll calls are dialed with eleven > digits, even within your area code. There's also another dialing plan -- all toll calls are dialed with a 1 first. If its inside your area code, you dial eight digits; if its outside your area code, you dial 11 digits. This is the way it was in 206 until last year when we were switched to 1-206 for all toll calls. Still, it's not so bad -- I remember when our access code was 1123! Now here's another question -- why do all the people with 800 numbers say "dial One, Eight-Hundred," etc? The "one" is superfluous information. If you dial 800, you *must* dial the access code. ...And having lived in an area where "1" was *not* the access code (it is now) it really peeved me! ("Ignorant urban-centric jerks...") :-) David Breneman Email: daveb@jaws.engineering.dgtl.com System Administrator, Software Engineering Services Digital Systems International, Inc. Voice: 206 881-7544 Fax: 206 556-8033 ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 9 Jul 93 09:00:33 EDT From: mr!dev2!rbuyaky@uu3.psi.com (Reid R. Buyaky) Subject: Re: Maximum Number of Phone Lines to a Residence Steve Forrette (stevef@wrq.com) responded to my query: > To the point of your original question, here's what it cost me: the > standard residential installation charge of $31 per line, plus $11 per > line for the four lines that are in a hunt group (more on hunting > later). So, I expected to pay around $200 for the installation, plus > the standard labor rate.. Geesh ... did I get taken for a ride? As I originally wrote, I finally wound up installing eight lines into rented office space. There was no question that these were going to be business lines, though. The installation charges for those first eight lines ran around $1000!! When I increased my line count to 16 I had to pay another $1000 (approx.). These were all supposed to be no frills lines (pulse dial, per call charges instead of measured rates, etc.) but they stuck me with tone dial and a fee that allowed me 70 free calls per month (recall that these lines were for a BBS, so there were NO outgoing calls expected to be made). I didn't catch this problem until the second group of lines were installed, and the installer went over the order with me. They tried to give me those extra services on the new lines, too. I asked for a refund on those services they sold me that I had explicitly asked NOT to have, and they said "Your fault ... you should have reviewed the order at the time of installation." I know the tariffs set the maximum installation charges for residential lines, and my telco (Ohio Bell) told me what those were. But no one seemed to know what the tariff said about business lines (the PUC referred me to some main telco office in Cleveland that's always busy). Scott H Harris (sharris@chopin.udel.edu) responded to my query: > out said "NO." That is just too many lines for a residence. They > suggested I go with a Centrex service. I like the concept, but at > $36.99 per line *each month* and additional "service" fees, this can > add up quickly. Are there any better ways to go about getting a hunt > group for dirt cheap? Actually, Centrex would have been THE way for me to go when all this started. But four years ago, they weren't marketing it to "small" businesses. According to a co-worker who used to work for Ameritech when Centrex was first introduced, it was geared for, and marketed to, businesses with 100-200 lines, or more. Eight lines was too small for them to mess with back then. Now they've set it up so you can get Centrex here on as few as seven lines (possibly as few as two). For standard business lines, one can save quite a bit on monthly charges with Centrex. Since I had stripped down service, I won't save any money at all. But the hook for me was the charge for installing additional lines. Activity on my BBS fluctuates wildly. I've had as many as 16 lines running busy all the time, to as few as eight active lines struggling for activity. With Centrex, I can up my line count as high as I want for about a $61 installation fee, in total (of course, monthly charges are per line). This would allow me to drop my line count (for free) during slack periods, and increase them during busy times (like Summer) for a minimal fee. Compared to the ~$1000 I paid to add eight lines before, this is like Heaven. Reid R. Buyaky (Software Systems Engineer) Micro Resources, Inc. -- rbuyaky@mr.com Heartland Multiline BBS - 614-846-7669 MajorNet - Sysop@HRT ------------------------------ From: dale@access.digex.net (Dale Farmer) Subject: Re: Maximum Number of Phone Lines to a Residence? Date: 9 Jul 1993 16:41:36 GMT Organization: Express Access Online Communications, Greenbelt, MD USA Last year my uncle built a small residential development in Eastern Mmassachusetts. We put the street in also so we went to New England Tel. and asked them what they wanted. After giving them the information (six house lots, three to six bedrooms each, and showing them the land plot) They told us we could put in their cable and hardware (provided by them at no cost) or they could charge us a lot of $$ to put it in themselves. We took the spool of 25 pair and the spool of six pair, plus the funny green mushrooms that the splice points appear in. Power and sewer up one side of the street, telephone, cable TV and drinking water up the other side of the street, all buried 12 feet for liquids and eight feet down for cables. (We put it deeper than the minimum required. We do good work.) So the 25 pair appears in all of the mushrooms, and six pair from the mushroom to the house. I would wager that two or three pairs were connected all the way back to the CO for each house. (I was not there the day the telco came and made the connections and locked up the mushrooms) Leaving several spare pairs for future use. Actually, since they gave us enough 25 pair we put in two runs of 25 pair from the old street to the intersection where the extra side street left the main street of the development, there are double the number of pairs in the development that the telco asked for. Then a single 25 pair from there to the side street, and a single 25 pair the rest of the way down the main street. So one house has (in theory) all 50 pairs available to it in the mushrooms. the rest of them only have 25 available in the mushroom. Dale ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 9 Jul 93 14:04:40 EDT From: jeffj%jiji@krf.jvnc.net (Jeffrey Jonas) Subject: Re: Maximum Number of Phone Lines to a Residence? When I moved into the old two family house, the phone wires were probably over 50 years old. I asked for and got two lines. The standard operating procedure here in NJ is to pull a cable of six pairs to the house and attach the demarc outside the house with the usual gray box. So I guess asking for up to six lines is quite reasonable. While walking to the train station, I passed a New Jersey Bell truck with a familiar looking spool - yup, six pair. Yesterday, I lost dial tone on my modem line, and I checked that it was dead at the demarc. It didn't occur to me to check the unused four lines. I'd guess they're not even attached at the pole (unless they attached one or two in anticipation of growth so the line could be activated without any service call, just from the CO. But that doesn't sound right since a visit is usually required to verify the dial tone reaches the demarc, or identify the lines, perform line tests, etc.) Jeffrey Jonas jeffj@panix.com [Moderator's note: Did you find out the problem and get service restored to the modem line? PAT] ------------------------------ End of TELECOM Digest V13 #459 ******************************   Received: from delta.eecs.nwu.edu by mintaka.lcs.mit.edu id aa23078; 9 Jul 93 23:05 EDT Received: by delta.eecs.nwu.edu id AA29112 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4 for telecomlist-outbound); Fri, 9 Jul 1993 20:40:55 -0500 Received: by delta.eecs.nwu.edu id AA01223 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4 for telecomlist); Fri, 9 Jul 1993 20:40:13 -0500 Date: Fri, 9 Jul 1993 20:40:13 -0500 From: TELECOM Moderator Message-Id: <199307100140.AA01223@delta.eecs.nwu.edu> To: telecom@eecs.nwu.edu Subject: TELECOM Digest V13 #460 TELECOM Digest Fri, 9 Jul 93 20:40:00 CDT Volume 13 : Issue 460 Inside This Issue: Moderator: Patrick A. Townson Moving Up the Food Chain (Paul Robinson) Send Suggestions for ISDN FAQ (Michael J. Barr) EIA/TIA Standards (Bonnie J. Johnson) Talk Ticket Distributors Wanted (TELECOM Moderator) Phone Noises, Frequencies and Durations (Scott Perry) Computerized Phone Directory Sites (Richard C. Harrison) ISDN/SS7 Test Equipment Needed (Holly Elliott) Audiovox CTX-3200M Programming Information Available (Bill Nickless) Interesting Use of ANI at Ballys (Seng-Poh Lee) DXI Interface (Martin Steinmann) Unitel Access Phone Number in Toronto? (Albert Pang) Do Operators Interrupt Modem Calls? (Anthony Wallis) CDMA Technology Texts (Richard Nash) 700 Number Information Wanted (Mark Christopher Macsurak) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 9 Jul 1993 07:12:05 -0400 (EDT) Reply-To: 0005066432@MCIMAIL.COM Subject: Moving Up the Food Chain From: Paul Robinson Organization: Tansin A. Darcos & Company, Silver Spring, MD USA Seven years ago, I started communicating via modem using a 1200 baud modem. Over the past four years, I've bought at least five 2400 baud modems, starting with a 2400, a 2400 with send-only fax, a 2400 with send-receive fax, and finally an external 2400 with send/receive fax for a machine that I could not install an internal in because the serial port used had sockets for both Com1 and Com2. After wanting to do so for more than five months, I finally moved "up the food chain" to the top of the line of standard commercial modems, a 14,400 baud Practical Peripherals V32bis IBM-PC internal modem in a half length card which includes send/receive fax capability at the same speed. (I say 'standard commercial' because any PC-Based modem faster than 14400 baud must use a proprietary method and will only talk to another modem of the same brand and type). I purchased the modem at Micro Center in Vienna, VA. The price was a reasonable $229.95. I could have purchased a slightly less expensive no-name brand for $199, but this modem included service trial offers from the four major on-line services: America On Line, Compuserve, Genie, and Prodigy. Features mentioned in the manual: The modem will operate at V32Bis and lower speeds (14400, 9600, 7200, 4800, 2400, 1200 and 300 baud); it includes MNP 1-4 and MNP 5, as well as V42 and V42bis, the usual standards for error correction and data compression of text files. It will allow the computer it is plugged inside of to talk to it at any speed up to 57,000 baud. It supports the $ "wait for bong" feature, ! to issue a 1/2 second "flash", and @ for "wait for silence". The Fax capability supports both Class 1 and 2 at 14400 to 4800 baud. The modem claims that it has built-in support for Caller ID, which I can't test because I don't have it on my line, but if the phone company offers installation charge amnesty for Caller-ID anytime soon, I'll probably take it for a time to try it. My own experiences with this modem: I have only had the modem for about six hours, but here is my experience based upon using a few services. Calling the usual 1-800-456-6245 number on MCI Mail got a standard 2400 baud connection and no significant difference in speed. Since I am local to MCI's 9600 baud number, I decided to use the 202 number instead of the 9600 baud 1-800 number so I could see how it would perform on a local call. When I was using a modem at 2400 baud, Zmodem transfers came in at the 235-237 cps range. MCI Mail's 9600 baud connection is supposed to support MNP5 (data compression), but the parameter settings they give in their help file do not match any of the command parameter values my modem supports. MCI's suggested command strings all begin with backslash or percent (\, %) whereas this modem's command strings all begin with a letter or an ampersand except for the %CCID= command to enable or disable receipt of Caller-ID info or %CRID= to re-display last-received caller-id. I'll probably do better as I figure out what settings to use; I've been getting much better results since I started changing some parameters. Zmodem transfers on MCI Mail are taking place in the 840-850 CPS range which seems a bit on the low side. However, I called a local BBS and uploaded an 8K text file which I had downloaded from MCI, but the BBS supported an LAP-M connection with V.42bis and the file, uploaded with ZMODEM, transferred at a staggering 2000 CPS! The 8K text file transferred in four seconds! On at least one BBS I called, my modem claimed to get a connection at 14400, but had problems which were alleviated when I forced the connection for that particular modem to be no higher than 9600. One BBS I had to call twice because the first connection locked up without a response. Another one connected at 2400 but would not accept input. I fixed this by telling the terminal program to not "auto baud select" which means it leaves the port locked at 38400 baud, but the two modems talk at whatever speed that they connect. On another BBS it connected without a problem at 9600. I did some uploads. On a couple of files, one being a ZIP archive, I was doing about 850-900 cps. On a text file, I was getting 945 cps. If I had disabled compression the ZIP file might have gone through faster. Major differences between calling at 9600 baud and higher is the extra time for connections to be made and broken. The extra negotiations for 9600 or above can take anywhere from three to ten seconds longer than the usual two or three second negotiation of two 2400 baud modems. Also, call teardowns can take much longer, sometimes ten seconds at high speed as opposed to zero to two at 2400 baud; I discovered that it was to my advantage to reset an S-Register to set the "time before disconnect" parameter (S38) to one second. This parameter is used to allow packets to finish transferring before a disconnection is made. I called up one site which would connect at 14400 would display to me correctly, but my input became garbage. Oddly, changing the default for that one number to force 9600 caused it to _still_ make a connection at 14400, but then my input was okay. I now notice the difference. An ANSI full screen update at 2400 isn't too bad; at 14,400 the screen just flies by! I haven't had the opportunity to test the fax capability as I made the mistake of not checking the package label; the diskettes enclosed are all 1.2 meg 5 1/4" disks and I can only support either 3.5" in 1.4m or 720K, or 5 1/4" at 360K. I will have to obtain replacement disks in a size I can use. The software supplied is Smith Micro's Quick Link, a program that is acceptable for fax use but worthless as a terminal program; I've used it before. In fact, I may even have an old copy of the same send/recieve program around here from an older modem. The modem will also dial the special A B C D codes in touch tone mode. It also does something which I had not known was being done in modems now, and would help people who want to use a modem as an automated dialer. I can dial a number such as 1-800-CALL-ATT by telling the modem to dial: ATDT 1800 "CALLATT" and the modem will translate the letters (except Q and Z) into the associated digits. The double quote tells the modem that the indicated field is a string of digit letter equivalence. And if you forget what the codes are, AT $H will bring up six screens showing every AT command and the default value. Press space at the end of a screen to go to the next page, ESC to stop the display. Note: this is NOT done by the terminal program; this is six pages of display built into the modem. All in all, it's an amazing piece of work. Note that I transferred this message using the new modem. When I uploaded this message as 6K of text at 14,400 baud to a local service, I got a transfer rate reported at 1657 CPS, which is excellent. Paul Robinson - TDARCOS@MCIMAIL.COM ------------------------------ From: mike@dcs.umd.edu (Michael J. Barr) Subject: Send Suggestions For ISDN FAQ Date: 9 Jul 1993 14:29:07 GMT Organization: University of Maryland, Department of Telecommunications Hello, I am willing to donate my time to compiling and maintaining an ISDN FAQ. What types of questions should be addressed? Please send me a list of questions you think should be addressed in such a document. I will attempt to include answers to all reasonable questions in an attempt to build one thorough, standard place for basic information about ISDN. If there are questions to which I cannot quickly find answers, I will solicit help in answering them from the readers/posters of comp.dcom.isdn. Thanks, Michael Barr mike@dcs.umd.edu ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 09 Jul 93 08:58:25 EDT From: Bonnie J Johnson Subject: EIA/TIA Standards Pat one of the netters asked how to obtain EIA/TIA Standards- The address and phone numbers I have in the front of my Standards Manual is as follows: Electronic Industries Association Engineering Department 2001 Penna. N>W> Washington, DC 20006 US & Canada 800-854-7179 International 714-261-1455 Good day, bj ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 9 Jul 1993 19:28:23 -0500 From: TELECOM Moderator Subject: Talk Ticket Distributors Wanted The Talk Ticket program is now officially underway, and distributors for the product are needed ASAP. While this is not limited to those of you who tested the product, my feeling is those of you who purchased and used the sample tickets will have the best understanding of the service and be able to correctly market them. There is no multi-level marketing, no 'distributor fees', no territorial arrangements, no contracts or other gimmicks. You won't be working for anyone as an employee or contractor. No one cares or will ask what you do with the profit from the sale of the tickets. You need not provide identification or SSN, etc for the purchase of the tickets. The several dozen of you who purchased the samples have seen how they work and that there are no gimmicks or hidden costs, and I thank the several of you who responded with summaries this past week in response to my request for same about a week ago. Tickets are now available in Spanish or English, with appropriate lang- uage response from the computer in either case. Tickets are available in $5, $10, $20 and $50 denominations. Pick the selection and inventory you want or a 'standard selection' (with emphasis on the five and ten dollar denominations) will be sent to you. The minimum order is $2500 in assorted tickets for $1875. My suggestion for an assortment would be 50 tickets @ $20 = 1000 50 tickets @ $10 = 500 200 tickets @ $ 5 = 1000 You see that your profit is 25 percent on this; if you wish to sell these as a courtesy at no profit to yourself the tickets would be sold for $15, $7.50 and $3.75 respectively. Or you might wish to keep fifteen percent profit for yourself and give ten percent off to the buyers, or the other way around. This is your choice; don't tell me about it. Checks for $1875 should be made payable to TELECOM Digest and mailed to my attention. Be sure to indicate the desired mix of tickets (and if to be in English or Spanish) to total the $2500. For your protection and mine, the tickets will be sent registered mail and will NOT be activated in the computer until the receipt is returned or we talk on the phone, etc. If outside the USA, your check should be 'payable in US Dollars'. So, if you have ever wanted to be in the long distance reseller business, here is your chance to get started, with a nice little profit for yourself. Call or write with questions. TELECOM Digest 2241 West Howard Street #208 Chicago, IL 60645 Phone: 312-465-2700 Fax: 312-743-0002 PS: If you are not familiar with these and want to try them out first, the sample $2 tickets are available for $2 each. Or you can have ten $2 tickets for $15, a $5 ticket for $4.50 or a $10 ticket for $9. They are good for calls anywhere in the world by calling an 800 number, then entering the ticket serial number and the number you are calling. They work the same as any telephone calling card except they are prepaid. PAT ------------------------------ From: phantom@cs.umd.edu (Scott Perry) Subject: Phone Noises, Frequencies and Durations Date: 9 Jul 1993 20:12:09 GMT Organization: U of Maryland, Dept. of Computer Science, Coll. Pk., MD 20742 I am looking to reproduce various noises you hear over the phone with my computer (I miss Cat's Meow on the apple). I've found a few things via the FAQ (touch tones) and searching some FTP sites (quarter, nickle, dime tones), but this leaves a lot left. What I would like is the frequency and durations necessary to reproduce various things like busy signals, doo-doo-doo "We're sorry ..." messages, etc. Basically anything I can find. If anybody can point me to info (preferably electronic), it would be most appreciated. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 9 Jul 1993 16:11:10 -0400 (EDT) From: Richard C. Harrison Subject: Computerized Phone Directory Sites The Beth Israel Hospital of Boston is implementing a computerized telephone directory system which will integrate operational processes concerned with telephone, voicemail, and pager installation as well as directory updating and electronic mail. We seek sites who have accomplished a high degree of directory integration who are willing to discuss their strategic and tactical approach with us. We are particularly interested in speaking with the Director of Telecommunications or other knowledgable individual by telephone with the possibility of a later site visit. Beth Israel Hospital in Boston is an independently owned Harvard-affiliated teaching hospital with 452 beds, a $30 M research effort and a personnel complement of 4,000. We are a decentralized multibuilding urban campus. If you know of an organization which is a good match to the above let me know. Thanks for your help. Please reply directly to: Dick Harrison harrison@bih.harvard.edu tel: (617) 278-1445 FAX: (617) 731-1492 ------------------------------ From: helliott@digi.lonestar.org (Holly Elliott) Subject: ISDN/SS7 Test Equipment Needed Organization: DSC Communications, Plano Tx. Date: Fri, 9 Jul 1993 15:50:24 GMT I am looking for test equipment for ISDN and SS7, preferably in the same unit. We currently are using a Tekelec 32, but it will not meet our needs. What we want is a unit (PC card?) that will allow us to build ISDN/SS7 messages in software, and the recieved messages must also be software readable. The test unit must handle Primary Rate ISDN, Layer 3 ISDN and Layer 4 SS7, and ISDN Code Set 6. If you have any leads on who I should contact, please respond via e-mail, as I do not regularly read this group. Thanks in advance. Holly Elliott DSC Communications Email: helliott@dsccc.com ------------------------------ Subject: Audiovox CTX-3200M Programming Information Available Date: Fri, 09 Jul 1993 11:51:21 -0500 From: Bill Nickless I think I have figured out some of the programming options for a CTX-3200M cellular phone; things like how to turn on a beep every minute for the first five minutes, power on into locked mode, and so forth. I am willing to send out my information via email, or contribute what I know to the TELECOM Archives. (It seems that it's of too little general interest for publication in TELECOM Digest itself.) This message is being sent to flush out other Audiovox cellular telephone users; there are some features I don't yet know how to activate, and would like to compare notes with others who may have tried something similar. Of course, if someone has authoritative information, that would be great too. Bill Nickless System Support Group +1 708 252 7390 ------------------------------ From: Seng-Poh Lee Subject: Interesting Use of ANI at Ballys Date: Fri, 9 Jul 1993 10:36:07 -0400 (EDT) Ballys/Holiday Matrix Health Clubs have a nationwide 800 number for locating clubs near your vicinity. When you call it, the system determines your location via ANI, and then routes your call automatically to the nearest club. It does this without announcing the fact. You just dial the number, and the nearest club picks up. Seng-Poh Lee ------------------------------ From: nstmar@hasler.ascom.ch (Martin Steinmann, NVES, Tel. x1244) Subject: DXI Interface Reply-To: nstmar@hasler.ascom.ch Organization: Ascom Hasler AG Date: Fri, 9 Jul 1993 14:54:12 GMT There is a DXI Interface defined by the SMDS Interest Group (SIG). Can anyone tell me from where I could obtain the respective document? Martin J. Steinmann ascom Ltd., Switzerland ------------------------------ From: albert@INSL.McGill.CA (Albert Pang) Subject: Unitel Access Phone Number in Toronto? Organization: INSL, McGill University, Montreal, Canada Date: Fri, 9 Jul 1993 04:23:38 GMT I am an UNITEL subscriber in Montreal, PQ. I will be travelling to Toronto, Ont. this weekend. I was wondering if I get the local access number of UNITEL in Toronto, will I still be able to make long distance phone call via UNITEL. Can somebody give me the access number of UNITEL in Toronto? Thanks, Albert Pang Information Networks & Systems Lab McGill University Montreal, Quebec, Canada. [Moderator's Note: Did you try calling Unitel and asking them? PAT] ------------------------------ From: tony@nexus.yorku.ca (Anthony Wallis) Subject: Do Operators Interrupt Modem Calls? Organization: York University Date: Fri, 9 Jul 1993 20:01:59 -0400 Today I was logged on to a remote computer via modem for three hours. A friend needed to contact me, and getting repeated busy signals, asked an operator for an "emergency" interrupt. The operator said there was "static" on the line and did I "have a computer"? Nothing was done, apart from me getting some garbage once. Can operators constructively and in a technically competent way interrupt modem calls? Or are they "scared" to? (Yeah, I know, get a second line.) tony@nexus.yorku.ca = Tony Wallis, York University, Toronto, Canada [Moderator's Note: There is nothing different about a modem line than any other from the operator's point of view. The operator can do an emergency interuppt on most lines (there is a class of service in some telcos which prevent even the operator from interuppting if the line is set up that way), but the operator can only speak in a human voice, thus is unable to communicate with a modem. In this case, the operator make an intelligent decision about what she heard, and reached the conclusion that regardless of how long she stayed on the line asking for a human being to respond to her, it was not likely to occur. The only thing that would occur, given enough persistence by the operator would be the complete garbaging-out of the connection and the abandon- ment by the computer operator (yourself) of the call. In other words, whether or not you wished to acknowlege the emergency interuppt (which by law you are supposed to do if the calling party claims an emergency exists), you'd be the loser and the interuppter would be the winner. So the general rule of thumb is 'operators cannot interuppt computer lines'. Not without (as an end result) causing the whole connection to get dropped by the person making the computer call from exasperation. Had there been human beings on the line, they would have understood the operator's inquiry and said 'yes' or 'no', but *willingly* given up their connection had they chosen to do so or *willingly* refused to do so. The poor guy with a computer/modem on the line would get no choice, nor even be cognizant of the operator's presence on the line other than seeing his 45 minute download getting garbaged-out in the final minutes. So generally when the operator hears 'that static', she knows enough to back off and tell the caller 'I cannot interuppt the computer.' PAT] ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 9 Jul 1993 20:04:41 -0600 Reply-To: rickie@trickie.ersys.edmonton.ab.ca From: rickie@trickie.ualberta.ca Subject: CDMA Technology Texts At the watering hole tonite, we were discussing the current TDMA and CDMA technologies. We decided that better technical information on the relatively new CDMA cellular technology would be an asset to further our understanding. Would someone please recommend a good set of reference texts that we could obtain to enlighten us? Thanks in advance. Richard Nash Edmonton, Alberta Canada T6K 0E8 UUCP: rickie@trickie.ersys.edmonton.ab.ca Amateur Radio: ve6bon.ampr.ab.ca [192.75.200.15] ------------------------------ From: bigmac@leland.Stanford.EDU (Mark Christopher Macsurak) Subject: 700 Number Information Wanted Organization: Stanford University, California Date: Fri, 9 Jul 93 05:50:22 GMT Because I am moving around so much, I am thinking of getting a (700) number which sounds basically like a permanent-call-forward. That way I can tell my friends and not have to change business cards so often. I haven't really seen any (700) numbers though. Do these exist? How convenient are they? I'd like to hear from anyone who uses them. Also, I heard if you have AT&T's 700 number, and a person must then dial 10ATT0 before they can reach you (how are they supposed to know that). An alternative would be to rent/purchase a voice mailbox -- which is sort of a permanent number that I can check on every day. Which is a better way to get a permanent number? I plan on being in the San Francisco area for at least the next few years, with some periods in New York City. Please e-mail me or post if you think others may be interested. Thanks a lot. bigmac@leland.stanford.edu [Moderator's Note: The '700 number program' you are referring to is the AT&T Easy Reach service. AT&T is the only company offering the service in quite the way they do. Because the 700 number space is unique in the sense that all carriers get complete use of the entire range of numbers, it is possible that two totally unrelated parties could have the same 700-xxx-yyyy number, thus the requirement that the caller fully qualify the number with the prepending of 10288 when dialing unless the phone line is defaulted to AT&T as the long distance carrier. I admit it is quite a nuisance. I signed up for it a long time ago but rarely use it. And either the caller or yourself have to pay 25 cents for *each minute* of conversation during the day (less at night) even if it is a local call. The owner of an Easy Reach number can forward calls to wherever he will he at, so in this respect it makes it easy for your callers to reach you *provided they default to AT&T or know they have to use 10288*. Gotcha! Perhaps a better solution would be 800 service from Cable and Wireless, as this permits the caller to dial from any phone without regard to the default carrier. C&W allows the owner to forward the 800 number to wherever he might be at, but the trade off is you pay for each call (no option to let the caller pay the 25 cents per minute) and you pay for the call-forwarding option. Still another option (here comes today's commercial folks!) is to use a service like 'Telepassport', which while intended mainly to to be a '700 Easy Reach like' service internationally, *can* do the same thing domestically in the USA. Your caller would dial your 800 number on our switch; we'd flip it back out to you at the number you told us to call, and for a lot less money than C&W I might add. For details on Telepassport, contact me direct: ptownson@eecs.nwu.edu. PAT] ------------------------------ End of TELECOM Digest V13 #460 ******************************   Received: from delta.eecs.nwu.edu by mintaka.lcs.mit.edu id aa23726; 9 Jul 93 23:47 EDT Received: by delta.eecs.nwu.edu id AA06540 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4 for telecomlist-outbound); Fri, 9 Jul 1993 21:28:42 -0500 Received: by delta.eecs.nwu.edu id AA03031 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4 for telecomlist); Fri, 9 Jul 1993 21:28:00 -0500 Date: Fri, 9 Jul 1993 21:28:00 -0500 From: TELECOM Moderator Message-Id: <199307100228.AA03031@delta.eecs.nwu.edu> To: telecom@eecs.nwu.edu Subject: TELECOM Digest V13 #461 TELECOM Digest Fri, 9 Jul 93 21:28:00 CDT Volume 13 : Issue 461 Inside This Issue: Moderator: Patrick A. Townson Re: US -> Europe Direct Dial: 13th Digit Spells Bad Luck (E. Rohwedder) Re: US -> Europe Direct Dial: 13th Digit Spells Bad Luck (John J. Butz) Re: US -> Europe Direct Dial: 13th Digit Spells Bad Luck (A. Schultz) Re: US -> Europe Direct Dial: 13th Digit Spells Bad Luck (John R. Levine) Re: US -> Europe Direct Dial: 13th Digit Spells Bad Luck (David Leibold) Re: US -> Europe Direct Dial: 13th Digit Spells Bad Luck (Carl Moore) Re: US -> Europe Direct Dial: 13th Digit Spells Bad Luck (David G. Lewis) Re: US -> Europe Direct Dial: 13th Digit Spells Bad Luck (Paolo Bellutta) Re: Dialing "1" First (David J. Greenberger) Re: Dialing "1" First (Justin Greene) Introduction to WilTel (was Re: Information on Public Carriers) (R McGuire) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 9 Jul 93 19:06:36 EDT From: Ekkehard.Rohwedder@KURT.TIP.CS.CMU.EDU Subject: Re: US -> Europe Direct Dial: 13th Digit Spells Bad Luck Here is the rest of my story about trying to reach a fax machine at the 13-digit number 011 +49 6131 XXX 4555: I call the AT&T long distance operator at 00 and explain my problem. She transfers me to her supervisor, who appears to understand what I need and calls the operator in Germany. It rings for a while until a busy signal comes back. Supervisor: "The operators must be busy." Me: "Oh, I do not think so -- it is 6:30 a.m. local time there." Since this faxing business turns out much more involved than just calling 00, giving them my number, and them putting me right on a T1-pipe (which the service technician was able to do), I decide to revise my fax (putting everything in that I might otherwise have sent at a later time). When I call 00 an hour later, there is no need to be transferred to a supervisor. However, it takes a while for the operator to get set up. Strangely, she also asks me for the town that I want to connect to in Germany (which is Mainz). (I wonder whether the fact that the area phone prefixes in Germany vary in length, and can be up to four digits is confusing to US operators.) Again, nobody answers on the first try. The second time we finally do get the international operator in Germany. The AT&T operator spells the name of the city and the number I want to reach. The German operator dials the number locally, then reports back: "There is a fax machine answering." Me: "That's exactly what I want." Finally, I get put through to Germany, hear the answer tone of the phone and can start my fax. While it was kind of fun (I have never needed to use operator services), and also supposedly at direct dial rates (I will check my next phone bill), this is also a major pain! Count the blessings of international direct dialing to 12 digits and less! It also seems that the international operators at Telekom are understaffed (humans are expensive, machines are cheap -- too bad if you need a human). Ekkehard ------------------------------ From: John.J.Butz@att.com Date: Fri, 9 Jul 93 09:51:14 EDT Subject: Re: US -> Europe Direct Dial: 13th Digit Spells Bad Luck Ekkehard.Rohwedder@KURT.TIP.CS.CMU.EDU writes: >The bottom line is this: >Local U.S. exchanges only have the capacity to store 12-digit numbers >(i.e. in my case +49 6131 XXX 455). This turns out to be an illegal >phone number in Germany, which causes a congest signal to be sent back >to the US (the beep), which then is turned into a busy signal here. Let's not blame AT&T or the local telcos for 13 digits in Germany, they happen to be playing according to the rules. For those of you familiar with the CCITT (or whatever it's called these days), 12 digits plus a country specific international dialing prefix (011 for IDDD and 01 for operator assisted here in the US) is the current world standard for international dialing. (Recommendation E.163) Targeted for a 12/31/1996, 23:59 Universal time (I think) implementation, the CCITT has recommended a new numbering plan, E.164 ("for the ISDN era", whatever that means). This dialing plan specifies a 15 digit number that consists of a country code, a national destionation code (city/area code) and a subscriber/line number. All equipment manufacturers and service providers are encouraged by the CCITT to meet the above date for E.164 implementation. Back to intl phone numbers > 12 digits...... I understand there are a few places in the world where an international phone number > 12 digits is not uncommon. In Germany, the American military bases use this kind of numbering plan. Used for what? I don't know, but AT&T CAN complete calls to these and other numbers that don't follow the current CCITT numbering plan, by operator assistance. Since AT&T plans meet the target implementation date, its quite likely that on January 1, 1997 your direct dial call to the fax in Germany will go thru! J "ADC" Butz ER700 Sys Eng jbutz@hogpa.att.com AT&T - CCS ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 9 Jul 93 19:06:44 EDT From: kityss@ihlpe.att.com Subject: Re: US -> Europe Direct Dial: 13th Digit Spells Bad Luck Organization: AT&T >Maybe this 13-digit problem is not yet so well known or widespread. You are right it is a "new" problem. CCITT (The UN body that sets world wide telecommunications standards, I think they are now TSS-ITU) Recommendation E.164 "Numbering Plan for the ISDN ERA" defines the maximum allowed length phone number (consisting of a Country Code + National Number - CC+NN) as 15 digits. [Note this does not include prefixes such as "011", 10XXX, etc.] HOWEVER - E.165 defines 12/31/1996 as the date AFTER which all "conforming" networks should be able to handle "E.164 format numbers". Prior to 12/31/1996, E.163 defines a maximum length CC+NN of 12 digits!!! What appears to be happening is that some countries are instituting E.164 format numbers prior to 12/31/1996. The technician was right -- there is no guarantee that "local", PBX, or even IXC equipment will handle more than 12 digits before then. [Actually there is probably no guarantee after 12/31/1996, but I certainly wouldn't count on it before then!!!] I would guess that since CCITT set a specific date (12/31/1996) that the US is not the only place where switching equipment (including PBXs) would have problems with CC+NN of more than 12 digits. >[Moderator's Note: But I have never heard of this before; that a > number which requires thirteen digits to dial cannot be reached > directly. We in the USA have had IDDD in many exchanges for > twenty years, and in almost all exchanges for several years now. > No one has yet raised this point??? PAT] Like I said -- new problem. No country has had CC+NN over 12 digits before now. Arnette Schultz kityss@ihlpe.att.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 9 Jul 93 10:55 EDT From: johnl@iecc.com (John R. Levine) Subject: Re: US -> Europe Direct Dial: 13th Digit Spells Bad Luck Organization: I.E.C.C. >Local U.S. exchanges only have the capacity to store 12-digit numbers I read somewhere (probably right here in Telecom) that the CCITT has long said that no number should be longer than 12 digits total. But due to the explosion of ever-longer numbers in places that use the CCITT's, or whatever it's called now, quaint numbering plan, the maximum is being increased to 15 digits. > +49 6131 XXX 4555 fails > +49 6131 XXX 450 works This is probably a company's PBX, where the digits after the XXX are decoded entirely in the PBX. I'd expect the main number to be +49 6131 XXX 0. You might tell the people you're calling that they should assign shorter extension numbers or they won't be callable from the U.S. Alternatively, they could try to get a two-digit rather than three-digit number from Telekom. In most places outside North America the length isn't really a problem because calls are routed incrementally and, except in the fanciest new electronic exchanges, the whole number is never buffered in one place. Here in North America, we use 11 digit numbers as the Lord told us to, and numbers will only get longer when She changes Her mind sometime around the year 2050. Regards, John Levine, johnl@iecc.com, {spdcc|ima|world}!iecc!johnl [Moderator's Note: I thought you were in charge of making those decisions John; and now you say its your mother-in-law? :) PAT] ------------------------------ Subject: Re: US -> Europe Direct Dial: 13th Digit Spells Bad Luck From: woody Date: Fri, 9 Jul 1993 11:04:01 -0400 >[Moderator's Note: It is true that when direct dial is not possible >for some reason, the AT&T operators will complete the call at direct >dial rates, waiving the surcharge for operator assistance. But I have >never heard of this before; that a number which requires thirteen >digits to dial cannot be reached directly. We in the USA have had IDDD >in many exchanges for twenty years, and in almost all exchanges for >several years now. No one has yet raised this point??? PAT] Actually, the international standard limit for international telephone numbers (ie. the country code, and following digits needed to complete a call) is 12, until the international limit expands to 15 in a few years (referred to by CCITT, actuall ITU-TS, as "Time T"). Thus, the few countries having 13 digits are in violation of the international digit length, thus requiring manual operator processing in many cases. Some exchanges may be set up to handle more digits already, or could be easily changed to do so. All this should be in ITU recommendations like E.163 or E.164. David Leibold djcl@internex.io.org dleibold1@attmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 9 Jul 93 10:47:25 EDT From: Carl Moore Subject: Re: US -> Europe Direct Dial: 13th Digit Spells Bad Luck Recently, I noticed the pattern of using __0 (where the "__" can be any number of digits) as the main number, with __xx (or even __xxx?) being the extension for the fax line. In the message I am responding to, I have noticed this pattern in: +49 6131 XXX 450 voice +49 6131 XXX 4555 fax A complete telephone number (excluding the international access code but including the country code) is 1 xxx xxx xxxx, in other words 11 digits only, in country code 1. Also: You mention the Czech Republic (along with Germany and Austria) as having some 13-digit telephone numbers, including the country code. What about the Slovak Republic (i.e., the other part of the former Czechoslovakia)? ------------------------------ From: deej@cbnewsf.cb.att.com (david.g.lewis) Subject: Re: US -> Europe Direct Dial: 13th Digit Spells Bad Luck Organization: AT&T Date: Fri, 9 Jul 1993 14:11:08 GMT ITU-T (Formerly CCITT) Recommendation E.164 on telecommunications numbering specifies that the maximum length of an international number be 12 digits, consisting of a one, two, or three digit country code, and a national significant number of any length such that the length of the country code plus the national significant number not exeed 12 digits. Therefore, in countries where the CC is two digits, a NSN of 11 or digits (such as that above) will cause the total length to exceed 12 digits, which is not consistent with E.164 and therefore can not be expected to be dialable across national boundaries. The CCITT (now ITU-TSS) has recommended an expansion of international numbers from 12 to 15 digits at what they call "Time T", defined as December 31, 1996. As of that date, all switches should be able to handle international numbers of up to 15 digits in length. Before that time, 12 is the maximum. I suspect that no one has yet raised this point because this point has only recently appeared with the introduction of 11-digit national significant numbers in Germany. Frankly, I don't know why Telekom (DBT) has assigned 11 digit NSNs, unless they're unable to expand the codespace any other way (perhaps due to the capabilities, or lack thereof, of the equipment in the eastern portion of the country?) Anyone from Telekom or anyone in Germany able to shed any light on this? Disclaimer: I don't work on numbering for a living. David G Lewis AT&T Bell Laboratories david.g.lewis@att.com or !att!goofy!deej Switching & ISDN Implementation ------------------------------ From: bellutta@ohsu.EDU (Paolo Bellutta) Subject: Re: US -> Europe Direct Dial: 13th Digit Spells Bad Luck Organization: Oregon Health Sciences University Date: Fri, 9 Jul 1993 20:29:26 GMT Well, when I dial my friends in Italy I dial 13 to 14 digits, and I use AT&T as long distance company. No problems. I still get the satellite link most of the time while calling back they get the cable instead, but I have no problems in dialing international. Not even with the calling card from a payphone. > in many exchanges for twenty years, and in almost all exchanges for > several years now. No one has yet raised this point??? PAT] It looks fishy to me too... Paolo Bellutta -- bellutta@ohsu.edu - tel: (503) 494-4804 BICC - OHSU - 3181 SW Sam Jackson Park rd. - Portland, OR [Moderator's Note: But, as our other correspondents today point out, this *is* a real condition which exists at the present time. Yet I must wonder, how are *you* managing to call Italy doing it? (Now more suspicious ...) How about telling us the sequence of numbers you dial; let's see if its *really* more than 12 or if there is some local code on your end, etc that is being counted as well. PAT] ------------------------------ From: d.greenberger@cornell.edu (David J. Greenberger) Subject: Re: Dialing "1" First Reply-To: d.greenberger@cornell.edu Organization: Young Israel of Cornell Date: 9 Jul 93 21:41:34 GMT dwn@dwn.ccd.bnl.gov (Dave Niebuhr) writes: > 395-6701: Disconnected > 1-395-6701: Cannot be completed as dialed > 1-516-395-6701: Cannot be completed as dialed > 10288-1-516-395-6701: Cannot be completed as dialed That doesn't really show anything. It merely indicates that you can't dial a number in 516 from another number in 516 with the area code. Try calling a number in a different area code with a 1. In other words, even though in 212-land I must dial a 1 before an area code, I would end up with the same results as you did, simply because the phone system doesn't like redundant area codes. David J. Greenberger (212) 595-2901 d.greenberger@cornell.edu ------------------------------ From: jgreene@nyx.cs.du.edu (Justin Greene) Subject: Re: Dialing "1" First Organization: Nyx, Public Access Unix at U. of Denver Math/CS dept. Date: Fri, 9 Jul 93 23:54:21 GMT > Here in Maryland (C&P, 301), a leading 1 is required for a toll call, > but if it is included on a non-toll call, the call goes through > without any whining from the switch. Dialing my office from home is a > local call, but I can dial 1-301-428-5384 and the call goes through. Does it go through as a local call or over your primary carrier? I often will dial 10xxx for a local call (for my own weird reasons) and the call is billed to the long distance carrier. > behavior. Local calls *from* 202 to 301 or 703 do get denied if > preceded by a 1, however. Maybe the congresscritters NEED unnecessary > regulation in their lives? Some areas (like Colorado, have areas which are localish; you dial 1-xxx-xxxx to connect, but it is a metered service (local long distance). Anything out of you LATA (?) requires a 1. They don't have to tell you when the call will cost extra but they do ... Justin ------------------------------ From: russ_mcguire@wiltel.com (Russ McGuire) Date: Fri, 9 Jul 93 07:57:03 -0500 Subject: Introduction to WilTel (was Re: Information on Public Carriers) Nadeem Haider (nadeem@alpha.acast.nova.edu) writes: > Can anyone recommend how I may go about finding information on > public carriers? > I need information (hardware required, procedures, etc..) on > setting up communication links for a dedicated WAN. I forsee using > dedicated leased lines and would like to know who are the major > players in the service provider game. > Any information will be greatly appreciated. I (almost) hate to turn this into an advertisement, but you asked the question, and since we don't have AT&T's advertising budget, you probably don't already know these things ... WilTel is a full service telecommunications company that offers data, voice, and video products and services nationwide. WilTel owns and operates a nationwide digital fiber-optic network, one of only four in the United States, with access to more than 30,000 system miles. Historically, we are an industry leader in private line services. We have also been known as the "carrier's carrier", providing bandwidth on our network to virtually every other US carrier for their private line and switched services. Over the past several years, WilTel has established itself as a leader in virtual data networking. We provided the first public Frame Relay service approximately six months before our competitors. We are also preparing to be among the first to offer ATM-based services. Since you are considering carriers to establish a WAN, I would strongly recommend that you consider frame relay and ATM services. Frame relay and ATM provide: logical connectivity to multiple remote locations over a single physical interface; the dynamic allocation of capacity to support simultaneous applications; the ability to oversubscribe network interface connections to take advantage of the intermittent nature of data transactions and reduce network expenditures; automatic routing around network failures to reduce expenditures on geographically diverse facilities, the ability to sustain a burst above the committed information rate to improve throughput and optimize response times even during busy hours; and the consolidation of traffic over a single network to provide maximum economies of scale and the simplification of network design, management and operation. All this adds up to an improved network price performance ratio. Whether you continue to consider private lines as the appropriate technology for your application, or you decide to pursue advanced virtual data networking options, such as frame relay and ATM, I hope you will consider WilTel as your carrier. Our sales office which is closest to you is: Orlando: 407-422-2761 or 800-864-4123 Some of our differentiators include: We are the only network provider with a nationwide fiber optic network that is focused on business applications (as opposed to our primary competitors who must dedicate enormous resources to support residential customers). We provide industry leading network service management tools via the WilView family of products. This is particularly true for private line services where we offer a single, consistent X-Windows/Motif GUI tool for near-real-time circuit alarm monitoring, historical circuit performance (ESF) reporting, graphical mapping of actual circuit routing, trouble ticket entry and tracking, service order tracking, and circuit inventory. All of this available via your current workstation/PC equipment, whether DOS, Windows, OS/2, Mac, NeXTstep, Sun, HP, DEC, RS/6000, etc. Basically any device that can support X11R4 and TCP/IP. We can provide a full range of solutions. As previously mentioned, we offer private line and frame relay services and will shortly offer ATM-based services. We are also the nation's leading distributor of Northern Telecom PBX and Key System equipment, as well as similar voice-based CPE from a variety of other vendors. We are also a large distributor of data CPE from Synoptics, 3COM, and a wide variety of other vendors. We also service the broadcast television networks for carrying regularly scheduled and special event television transmissions from around the country to the networks' mixing and uplink sites. We have carried the last several Super Bowls and World Series (whats the plural for series???) as well as the most recent Democratic and Republican conventions across our fiber optic network. We have also built a nationwide switch platform for business-oriented 1+ and 800 services. Anyone wanting to know more about WilTel can e-mail me or phone WilTel at 1-800-364-5113. Russ McGuire 918-588-2836 WilTel, Inc. PO Box 21348 russ_mcguire@wiltel.com Tulsa, OK 74121 [Moderator's Note: Thanks for the lengthy description. I'm sure a lot of readers -- myself included -- did not know that much about WilTel, and I appreciate your getting us aquainted with it. PAT] ------------------------------ End of TELECOM Digest V13 #461 ******************************   Received: from delta.eecs.nwu.edu by mintaka.lcs.mit.edu id aa14503; 10 Jul 93 19:55 EDT Received: by delta.eecs.nwu.edu id AA15762 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4 for telecomlist-outbound); Sat, 10 Jul 1993 17:21:18 -0500 Received: by delta.eecs.nwu.edu id AA31221 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4 for telecomlist); Sat, 10 Jul 1993 17:20:35 -0500 Date: Sat, 10 Jul 1993 17:20:35 -0500 From: TELECOM Moderator Message-Id: <199307102220.AA31221@delta.eecs.nwu.edu> To: telecom@eecs.nwu.edu Subject: TELECOM Digest V13 #462 TELECOM Digest Sat, 10 Jul 93 17:20:30 CDT Volume 13 : Issue 462 Inside This Issue: Moderator: Patrick A. Townson Cell Phone Fraud Arrest (Palm Beach Post via John S. Hickey) USTA Seeks Changes in Calling Card Regulations (Comm. Daily via Les Reeves) New Telecom Journal Needs Writers (Jane Fraser) How Can One Dial a US 1-800 Number From Canada? (David B. Perrussel) "Please Dial the 12-Digit Number at the Tone..." (Paul Robinson) Yet Another Incident at a COCOT (Paul Robinson) Network Documentation; Change and Problem Management (Armin Schweizer) I Just Got Scammed (Vince Grove) Questions About Cable TV and Telephone Relationships (Thomas L. Atzenrath) Telecommunications Billing Analysis Programs: Are There Any? (Clif Baker) What Other Orange Card Abbreviations? (Carl Moore) Three Years and Four Months After Full Cutover (Carl Moore) Can Hear But Can't Talk on International Call (Gerrold T. Sithe) SLIP Information Needed (Todd W. Carter) TAP Spec For Beepers (Jerry Whiting) Help: Telco Line Problem With v.42 Modem (Bruce D. Nelson) Conversion From UTM to Geographical Coordinates (Samir Soliman) Some Additional Thoughts About Western Union (Jeffrey Jonas) Do We Have a Theme Song? (Paul Robinson) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: John S. Hickey Subject: Cell Phone Fraud Arrest Date: Sat, 10 Jul 1993 11:46:52 -0700 (PDT) A front page story in {The Palm Beach Post}, 12 June 1993 dateline Miami, reports the arrest of seven men for cell phone fraud. Secret Service agents seized 75 illegally modified cellular phones, more than 700 cellular phone/serial number combinations, eight personal computers and numerous software programs used to transfer pirated numbers into cellular phones. Undercover Secret Service agents bought either software diskettes to clone cellular phones or cellular phones that already been cloned. Agent Jim Bauer of the Secret Service said "Some are saying it is the most significant cellular phone cases to date. It certainly is the largest in Florida". The seven men arrested face a maximum of 15 years in prison and $50,000 fine for each offense. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 10 Jul 1993 12:08:50 -0400 (EDT) From: LESREEVES@delphi.com Subject: USTA Seeks Changes in Calling Card Regulations The United State Telephone Association (USTA) has asked the FCC to block calling card users who have unlisted phone numbers from using their cards unless they provide written authorization allowing the card issuer to release their billing name and address information to interexchange carriers. USTA claims that carriers are spending millions of dollars and wading through tons of paperwork tracking such information. {Communications Daily}, "Calling card users with unlisted numbers asked to disclose billing data," 7/9/93) [Moderator's Note: Someone is not doing their homework here. Since the beginning of divesture the FCC regulations have stated that having a non-pub number does *not* forbid the telco from giving out name and address data for billing purposes, and in fact local telcos are *required* to give this data for that limited purpose -- even to companies like Integratel -- on request. Even in the old days, a non-pub listing was not an impediment to inter-telco billing. Why does USTA suddenly feel they need another database (of signed authorizations from each individual) rather than continuing to use existing procedures? Or is it their member COCOT/AOS operators would love to get their hands on those AT&T customers with the scrambled card numbers; heretofore difficult/impossible to scam with high charges because they don't relate back to any actual phone number as written? FCC, please vote NO on this! PAT] ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 10 Jul 1993 08:26:36 EDT From: fraser@ccl2.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: New Telecom Journal Needs Writers This item comes from John Lusa <0004910572@mcimail.com>. Ball State University's Center for Information and Communications Sciences (CICS), Muncie, Indiana, is launching a refereed journal, the ICS Journal. The CICS is a graduate level school turning out graduates in telecommunications, information sciences and networking management. The ICS Journal is soliciting original manuscripts from industry, technology and academia with a length between eight and fifteen double-spaced pages -- 2000 to 3500 words. Student papers will be accepted if the writers have an academic or industry sponsor. Topics can cover a wide range of networking, communications and information sciences issues: New Technologies Research studies Pilots/trials Student projects Systems integration International Beta test results Ergonomics and human factors Teaching/educational uses Regulation Video compression Strategic applications The editorial objective of this new publication is to help key management users keep abreast of changes in communications and information sciences for use in their companies and operations. For more information you can contact the editor -- Professor Richard Bellaver -- or his assistant -- Nicole -- at (317) 285-1827. By the way, I'm the editorial consultant for the ICS Journal and will be one of the referees. ------------------------------ From: DBP@ECL.PSU.EDU (David B Perrussel) Subject: How Can One Dial a US 1-800 Number From Canada? Date: 10 Jul 1993 03:25:18 GMT Organization: Penn State Engineering Computer Lab I'm posting this for a friend ... A friend in Canada wants to dial 1-800 numbers in the US from Canada but most of the time he cannot. I know there used to be a number in the US he could call to dial out 1-800 numbers but I forgot it. (I don' t even know if it is still running.) Please e-mail me because I don't use usenet/netnews that much. Thanks in advance. Dave Perrussel dbp@ecl.psu.edu [Moderator's Note: Please tell your friend that he can call USA 800 numbers *if the owner of the number wants to be called from Canada* by simply dialing the number in the usual way. If the call does not go through, then the USA subscriber *does not want* to pay for calls from Canadians. Certain carriers allow you to call the USA on your nickle, *then* continue on the USA side to an 800 number. But you must pay to get to the USA unless the owner of the 800 number has agreed to accept calls from international points. PAT] ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 9 Jul 1993 22:48:37 -0400 (EDT) Reply-To: 0005066432@MCIMAIL.COM Subject: "Please Dial the 12-Digit Number at the Tone ..." From: Paul Robinson Organization: Tansin A. Darcos & Company, Silver Spring, MD USA The problem that an international number longer than 12-digits cannot be dialed is a real one, and is historical in nature. I had the privilege of being in a switch room for a shift while we were doing some work in our office and we had to move into the switch room. One of the books sitting on top of an AT&T dimension PBX switch (about 6 1/2 feet tall and each of the bays was about 3 feet wide) was a programming manual for the switch. I think the manual is pre-divestiture, e.g. 1980 or so, so it didn't have features for 10xxx in the manual. Being bored, I picked up the manual and read from it. Some rather interesting things I noted: On a speed-dial or dedicated number dedicated to a trunk (such as a "hot line" number which is dialed when a phone is picked up), a U.S. number consists of a three, four or five digit intra-PBX number, a seven digit local number, a ten-digit local number, a 1 + seven digit toll number, or a 1 + ten digit toll number. Of the same class, an international number may be up to 15 digits in length; if we allow three digits for the 011 code, this means that the switch can't handle an international number longer than 12 digits. Paul Robinson - TDARCOS@MCIMAIL.COM ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 10 Jul 1993 07:22:32 -0400 (EDT) Reply-To: 0005066432@MCIMAIL.COM Subject: Yet Another Incident at a COCOT From: Paul Robinson Organization: Tansin A. Darcos & Company, Silver Spring, MD USA The general temperature in the Washington, DC area has been hovering at or near the 100 degree mark. So when I was returning from a computer store in Vienna, VA, I decided to call a cab instead of walking some six blocks uphill. I went to a pay phone in front of the Safeway store there. The bank of three phones are all COCOTs. Often times a cab company will put a sticker on phones indicating their number. No such luck, this time. So I decided to dial 411 and get the number of the cab company. I picked up the phone, listened for dial tone and heard something I *never* hear from telephone company pay phones: "Please deposit 25 cents." I was rather surprised. (I had another incident with a COCOT in Northern Virginia last week; I never tried calling directory assistance from that phone.) I don't mind paying for a phone call. I *do* mind being charged more than the telephone company. So I went inside and asked the store manager for the number, and she was nice enough to write it down. I then went outside, put a quarter in the phone and called the cab company. Some people claim that the reason COCOTs charge more for some things is that they are unable to get the same service from the phone company as it provides to itself. I don't know if that's true; I do know that C&P's pay phones don't charge to call local directory assistance. Such a shame. If these sort of rates keep up, I may just install a wats extender similar to Patrick Townson's plan for overseas callers. I dial a 1-800 number that I have terminating into one of the four phone lines in my house. When my phone answers, I punch in a code and the number I'm at. I hang up and my phone calls me back with dial tone allowing me to make whatever calls I want. (Net cost would be for 20 seconds of WATS time, since I have unlimited local service.) Well, some of the COCOTs try to defeat that by making their phones outgoing only. But with the problems with these type phones it's making me mad enough to want to go that route, if I had to make a lot of local calls while traveling in the metro area. Paul Robinson - TDARCOS@MCIMAIL.COM [Moderator's Note: Telepassport is a bit more involved than a 'WATS extender' but the idea is similar. The reason COCOTS are frequently one-way outgoing is because unlike Genuine Bell, the intelligence is in the phone. Many COCOTS can be programmed remotely using a modem to call them. The owners have problems with snoopy people who like to play with their modem and computer at home to liberate the COCOT of its incessant demands for more money. (Gee, just like your Virtual Moderator, eh? ... what's needed on Usenet is a COCOM -- Customer Owned, Coin Operated Moderator. Deposit $3.75 to see your article in the Digest with a customized, personalized note following. Or, as I say to my erstwhile west coast affiliate from time to time, "Ride 'em Cowboy! Yahoo!") :) PAT] ------------------------------ From: wasc@ciba-geigy.ch (Armin Schweizer) Subject: Network Documentation, Change and Problem Management Organization: Ciba-Geigy Ltd.,Basel,Switzerland Date: Sat, 10 Jul 1993 07:18:58 GMT dear colleagues, We are looking for improved capabilities for network documentation plus change management plus problem management (troubleticketing) tools for all type of networks. - who is offering such systems? - are you using such a system and have you (good) experience with it? - is there any tool integrating documentation of hierarchical networks as well as lan's and wan's into the same documentation system? - is the change management and problem tracking tool using this documentation database? - is the system fully graphic? - is there any system adding logical (layer 3 and/or 4) documentation to the pure physical layer doc? Thanks and kind regards, Armin R. Schweizer, CIBA-GEIGY AG, R1045.P.06, WRZ 4002 Basel / Switzerland phone: -41-61-697'79'46 ------------------------------ From: vinceg@bos.mcd.mot.com (Vince Grove) Subject: I Just Got Scammed Date: 10 Jul 93 19:19:51 GMT Organization: Motorola Microcomputer Division, Woburn, MA I seem to remember a scam described here some time ago. I received a collect call from a New England Telephone service representative. I was told the charges would be forwarded to NE Telephone. The service rep claimed that my line was being overheard on other phone lines in the area and they were checking it out. How does this scam work?! Vince Grove vinceg@bos.mcd.mot.com Moderator's Note: For starters, telco *never* calls anyone collect. Most telcos accept collect calls from anywhere; they never place collect calls. PAT] ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 9 Jul 1993 11:06:11 +0100 From: thomas@wwwors.wiwi.Uni-Wuppertal.DE Subject: Questions About Cable TV and Telephone Relationships Dear Sirs, as a member of the University of Wuppertal I should kindly ask for your assistance in solving the following problem: The development shows that data computer, telephone and cable television melt together. TV-cable-nets are used for computer transmission to reach every household. This enables informations to enter and leave homes. Telephone and to cable companies have chosen to cooperate in the delivery of services. "Interactive" television tasks are possible, i.e. screen shopping services, where catalogue models parade their wares at the viewer's command. To my knowledge American firms are testing the possibility of providing services by cable-information. There are cable-based services including for example on-demand movie and restaurant reviews, home shopping, bill paying etc. (GTE Corp. experiments in Ceritos, California, for example.) I am very interested in informations (points at articles, books, datas, or a contact person who can help me) regarding: a) electronic shopping in general; b) interactive service demands; c) the most recent developments in fusion television and datanets; Additional I need information about Comp-U-Card / Comp-U-Store. I need information in general and the adress from the service. Where can I get statistical data about the quantity of subscribers etc. ? Thanking you in advance for your attention, Thomas Ltzenrath ------------------------------ From: ba.cgb@RLG.Stanford.EDU (Clif Baker) Subject: Telecommunications Billing Analysis Programs: Are There Any? Organization: Research Libraries Group, Inc. Date: Sat, 10 Jul 1993 14:56:36 GMT Folks, Please e-mail me if you can point me in the right direction[s]. Essentially I'm attempting to replace the warm body I once had with a bit of automation. Thanks! Clif ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 10 Jul 93 14:20:31 EDT From: Carl Moore Subject: What Other Orange Card Abbreviations? I just got my latest Orange Card bill, which has calls made from various areas in Indiana and Illinois on my trip there. The only threee-character abbreviations I saw for the point of origin were 800, MAK, and BAL. Darn. (For those who don't know: MAK and BAL showed up on earlier bills, for calls originating in Delaware and northeastern Maryland, respectively.) ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 10 Jul 93 14:53:19 EDT From: Carl Moore Subject: Three Years and Four Months After Full Cutover After an area code split, there may be some signs left over with the old area code. I was in Illinois last month, and while driving from Danville toward Chicago on Illinois route 1, I entered Will County (also entering the 708 area, from 815) and found two signs displaying the 946 prefix; one sign had the 708 area code and the other had old area code 312. This happened three years and four months after the full cutover of 708. [Moderator's Note: Riding north on the elevated train in Chicago until recently one could read a sign painted on the side of a building (albiet a bit faded over the years) telling one to do business at a certain company on the north side; phone Edgewater 395. That would be 45 years after the cutover. The company is long out of business and the building with the sign has been abandoned (gutted and burned out) for quite a few years. PAT] ------------------------------ From: cc935@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Gerrold T. Sithe) Subject: Can Hear But Can't Talk on International Call Date: 10 Jul 1993 19:03:13 GMT Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, Ohio (USA) I just switched to MCI from ATT. Now sometimes when I call internationally I can hear the other party fine but they can't hear me at all even though I can hear myself talking in the earpiece. I have two phones and a recording device connected, but I don't know if the problem is due to my equipment, my local telco, the foreign telco, or the long distance carrier. I would blame the carrier except the same thing happened on another line I have which uses Sprint. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 10 Jul 1993 11:53:38 -0400 (EDT) From: Todd W. Carter Subject: SLIP Information Needed I'm looking for some basic to intermediate information on using a SLIP connection to the Internet. Is software required to do FTP, gopher, irc, etc., that I depended on from my host computer? If so, what are some recommendations? I've heard of slipdisk.zip. Are there any others? Is there a SLIP FAQ? The books I've seen on the Internet only give this topic a couple pages at most. Thanks for the help, Todd ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 10 Jul 93 00:52:44 PDT From: Jerry Whiting Subject: TAP Spec For Beepers I'd like to write a simple terminal app to send messages to alphanumeric pagers. The local beeper companies are somewhat vague about details but I've heard of a TAP spec. Is there code (Basic, C, etc.) floating around to do such a thing? Doesn't seem like I can do it from within ProComm+ (I can have it call my digital beeper though). What is and where can I get a copy of this rumored TAP spec? Thanks in advance for any and all enlightenment. Please respond via email. Jerry Whiting azalea@igc.org [Moderator's Note: You might check the Telecom Archives files which begin with the phrase 'ixo' and see if they are of any help. The archives is accessible using anonymous ftp lcs.mit.edu. PAT] ------------------------------ Reply-To: usenet@eastman.rdcs.kodak.com From: nelson@titan.ppd.kodak.com (Bruce D. Nelson (67890)) Subject: Help: Telco Line Problem With v.42 Modem Date: 10 Jul 93 14:54:36 GMT Organization: Eastman Kodak Company Till about a week ago, the phone line I use with my US Robotics v.32/42 modem connected flawlessly with any other modem I called, locally or long distance. Now it refuses to connect at speeds > 2400 with many services and connects at 4400/14400 LAPM with some others. I connected the modem to my voice line and it works ok. So I called telco repair (Rochester Telephone). They "tested" the line and said it was ok. They also said that the line wasn't guaranteed to carry data calls. Since there's no "trouble" from their position, they said they can't do anything about the problem. Do any of you know the "magic words" needed to get it fixed? Any conjectures as to what might be wrong? Thanks, Bruce Nelson | Phone: (716) 726-7890 Rochester Distributed Computer Services | Internet: nelson@kodak.com Eastman Kodak Company | Rochester, NY 14652-3302 ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 10 Jul 1993 19:12:15 -0700 From: Samir Soliman Subject: Conversion From UTM to Geographical Coordinates Does anyone know how the conversion from UTM to geographical coordinates is done? Samir Soliman ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 10 Jul 93 17:59:11 EDT From: jeffj%jiji@krf.jvnc.net (Jeffrey Jonas) Subject: More Thoughts About Western Union > [Moderator's Note: Western Union is desparately trying to stay in > business. I can't blame them, but the handwriting is on the wall. I forgot if I ever sent you the article telling how my grandfather was a telegraph opertor for Western Union and taught himself how to use the teletype. I used to work across the street from the N.Y. Western Union building. It still speaks of a magnificance long ago -- the tall vaulted entrance, the brass doors, the elevator banks. My cousin is still poked in the ribs for letting her sentimentality get in the way and not selling her W.U. stock in time. > Just yesterday I received a telegram from someone ... a real, actual > telegram. How was it delivered -- by a person? I thought there was no more telegram delivery services. Did he/she wear the funny uniform like the doormen with the ropes on the shoulders and all? The only time I ever received a telegram was at my bar-mitsvah from family that could not attend. It started something like "imph gurna grnk". Not being familiar with e-mail at the time, it took me a while to notice that the message was after the routing codes and header information. > The message was important enough they wanted to contact me ASAP. I had > to feel embarassed for the sender in a way. :( It was a much older > person who contacted me by the way. PAT] A person "much" older than you. Imagine that :-) Jeffrey Jonas jeffj@panix.com [Moderator's Note: No, you did not send the article, and I hope you will do so soon. Yes, the WUTCO Building in New York is a treasure; it remains from an era most of you can only dream about and hope that it will return some day. They don't deliver telegrams any longer. They called me and said to pick up email from any agent close to me, so I went to the Devon-Western currency exchange. The woman there retrieved it from email, printed it on the printer and handed it to me. The 'much older person' is a 66 year old cousin who was eager and proud to announce that her grandchild had graduated from high school; a grand- child who probably never heard of Western Union, :( sniff ... once the second largest company in the USA after AT&T. I have an article around here somewhere taken from a feature story which appeared in the {Chicago Tribune} in 1912 about a man being honored by WU as a long time telegrapher employee of the company (that year) who was the operator on duty here the night of the Great Fire in October, 1871 which I will print if I do more WU history anytime soon. PAT] ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 9 Jul 1993 23:01:44 -0400 (EDT) Reply-To: 0005066432@MCIMAIL.COM Subject: Do We Have a Theme Song? From: Paul Robinson Organization: Tansin A. Darcos & Company, Silver Spring, MD USA It just occurred to me that this newsgroup needs something to distinguish it from all the others. I just thought, as important as telephony and telecommunications is, that maybe we need to adopt some song as the "Theme Song" of TELECOM Digest. But which one? What's a fairly "good" song about telephones? I note that the regular use of fax machines is so new that I can't think of one being referenced in a song. Jim Croce's "Operator" is about a guy who ties up an operator for five minutes trying to make up his mind whether to call some people. Since using an operator to place a call these days is rare, it's a little dated, as would a song from the early 1900s, "Hello Central Give me No Man's Land." A group released the famous "Jenny/867-5309" which is simply about some guy deciding to call his girlfriend. It doesn't really say much about telephones. The same objection I think can be raised toward Steely Dan's "Ricky Don't Lose That Number." Glenn Campbell's "Wichita Lineman" isn't too bad, but it's about the worries of someone who has to fix the equipment; it doesn't touch on people who _use_ phone service. It's sort of a tossup among several. The Electric Light Orchestra released a song which is, I believe called either "Telephone" or "Hello". But it's a rather sad song about someone trying to reach someone who doesn't answer. In the interim, e.g. until we get some other nominations, I'll put in my vote for one. To this end, I nominate the song by The Orlons ("Wah! The Watusi") called "Don't hang up." Paul Robinson - TDARCOS@MCIMAIL.COM [Moderator's Note: Why me, Lord? Why do I get this kind of email? PAT] ------------------------------ End of TELECOM Digest V13 #462 ******************************   Received: from delta.eecs.nwu.edu by mintaka.lcs.mit.edu id aa15908; 10 Jul 93 21:15 EDT Received: by delta.eecs.nwu.edu id AA05127 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4 for telecomlist-outbound); Sat, 10 Jul 1993 18:48:15 -0500 Received: by delta.eecs.nwu.edu id AA08028 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4 for telecomlist); Sat, 10 Jul 1993 18:47:32 -0500 Date: Sat, 10 Jul 1993 18:47:32 -0500 From: TELECOM Moderator Message-Id: <199307102347.AA08028@delta.eecs.nwu.edu> To: telecom@eecs.nwu.edu Subject: TELECOM Digest V13 #463 TELECOM Digest Sat, 10 Jul 93 18:47:30 CDT Volume 13 : Issue 463 Inside This Issue: Moderator: Patrick A. Townson Re: Telecom in China (Cyrill Vatomsky) Re: Kerberized Cellular Phones (Andrew Marc Greene) Re: Cox and BellSouth Want to Use 511 (system@garlic.sbs.com) Re: Cox and BellSouth Want to Use 511 (Steve Forrette) Re: 811 in California (was Cox and BellSouth Want to Use 511) (J. Greene) Re: 811 to Reach Telco Business Offices (Lauren Weinstein) Re: 811 to Reach Telco Business Offices (Carl Moore) Re: Switching Red/Green to Black/Yellow (Rob Levandowski) Re: Switching Red/Green to Black/Yellow (Rich Greenberg) Re: Telephone Gateway Information (Laurence Chiu) Re: Cellular to RS232 Interface (Laurence Chiu) Re: Value Added Voice Services (Seth B. Rothenberg) The Latest Word on the Privacy Mailing List (Dennis G. Rears) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: cyrillv@netcom.com (Cyrill Vatomsky) Subject: Re: Telecom in China Organization: NETCOM On-line Communication Services (408 241-9760 guest) Date: Sat, 10 Jul 1993 18:34:24 GMT Laurence Chiu (uttsbbs!laurence.chiu@PacBell.COM) wrote: > I just thought I would report some experiences I had calling Guangzhou > (aka Canton) China. While there are not technical difficulties making > the call (I use both MCI and AT&T) there are logistic difficulties > related to the lack of telephones in private houses. > My wife needs to call China occasionally to speak to her parents. > Since they don't have a phone we need to call a phone center which is > located near their house. This is basically a location with two > phones, one for outgoing calls and one for incoming. There is an > attendant 24 hrs/day and some helpers. We call the incoming number and > tell the attendant we wish to speak to a certain party. They dispatch > someone to the home and we call back later, usually 30 minutes or so. > The dispatcher gets paid a nominal amount. > While this works okay it's really expensive. Both AT&T and MCI > charge $5.57 (+/- 1c) for the first minute and $1.62 for subsequent > ones. We have to call minimally twice and the other night, we had to > all four times since there was some confusion over times (daylight > saving or not) and the ineptitude of the attendant who when asked if > inlaws were there said no when they were. My inlaws could get a > phone but 1) the cost would be 3000 RMB (about US$300) to install 2) > there would be nobody to call apart from us! In one of the May issues of the {Forbes Magazine} was the story about a company that arbitrages phone calls. They allow a party from a foreign country to call a special number in the US and hang up after the first ring. Then the system automatically calls the number that called and they get a US carrier and US rates. If you are interesated I can find the article and give you the bibliographic reference. Cyrill [Moderator's Note: One such service I'm working with here is called Telepassport, a product of US FIBER CORP. We're looking at the idea of making the 'phone stations' in some countries our actual customer, and letting them resell Telepassport. Re-origination, as we call it, is an idea whose time has come. Surely it will force many PTT's to bring their prices down a lot if they wish to compete. PAT] ------------------------------ From: Andrew_Marc_Greene@frankston.com Subject: Re: Kerberized Cellular Phones Date: Sat, 10 Jul 1993 14:25 -0400 Paul Robinson writes: > Kerberos can't be used on mobile > telephony because there is no trust at *all* that can be imposed on > the system. A user who calls into a system has *something* that can > be trusted, either the terminal location (for a local terminal) or > their "dotted quad" internet address they are at under TCP/IP, or the > dial-in telephone number, in addition to their password. Kerberos was designed for insecure systems. (Just how insecure? The root password for public Project Athena workstations is public knowlege.) Your (or your telephone's) password is what makes you trusted (well, actually, it's your session key, which is transmitted encrypted in a trapdoor function of your password); your IP (or other) address is irrelevant to the security of the system. Disclaimer: I haven't hacked on Kerberos or worked for Athena in several years, so my memory may be foggy.... - Andrew Greene ------------------------------ From: system@garlic.sbs.com Date: Sat, 10 Jul 93 17:56:42 EDT Subject: Re: Cox and BellSouth Want to use 511 BBOERNER@novell.com (Brendan B. Boerner) writes: > I was reading in the {Austin Chronicle} the other day that Cox > Enterprises, Inc. (big paper chain, owns the {Austin American > Statesman}) and BellSouth have announced an "agreement in principle" > to form a joint company that will deliver information services to > consumers who dial 511 (for a small fee of course). [some things deleted] > My questions are: Who controls the allocation of N11 numbers? And if > presumably the allocation is controlled by a regulatory body and not > the phone company, why in God's name would these guys even think of > allocating such a number so phone companies/newspapers can make a > buck? Tell them to get a phone number like the rest of us ... For convenience, I wouldn't mind dialing a three digit number for services that I use on a regular basis. The phone company has had this option for years, why not let other business use it? As far as who controls it, I think it's all up to regulatory agencies within the states to set rates caps and approve tarrif but it all comes down to the BOC. > Let's see: > 111 - can phone equipment distinquish between this and a L.D. call? > 211 - ? 211 used to be the way you made a long distance call in the U.S. before everything got automated. > 311 - ? > 411 - Directory assistance > 511 - Proposed information services > 611 - ? In many areas, 611 is still used to call repair service. Here in NET land we dial 1-555-1611. > 711 - ? I recall there having been something for 711 years back but can't remember it. > 811 - ? > 911 - Emergency services > This means that there would be five, maybe six codes left over. Hmmm, > I wonder if we can think of a better use for 511. What would you propose? I think that what they're using them for now, and Bell South's proposal to use them for large business is perfectly legitimate. Tony [Moderator's Note: For many years up until the early 1970's, the towns of Lafayette and West Lafayette, IN had dial service via GTE, with regular seven digit phone numbers, with one exception: Purdue University was reached from anywhere in town by dialing 90. (Just nine-oh). That got you the Purdue operator; if you knew the five digit extension you wanted on the campus, you dialed 92 plus the five digits. Even though Lafayette was surrounded by area code 317, it was not direct-dialable until sometime in the early seventies, despite it having seven digit numbers with the exception of Purdue. From elsewhere in the USA if you wished to call Purdue University, you dialed your long distance oper- ator and asked for 'Purdue University . Your long distance operator looked it up or called 'rate and route' to find that indeed, Purdue was listed as its own thing, with the operator instructed to 'mark the ticket 317 plus 156 plus ... operator's route 317 plus 156'. That brought the Purdue operator on the line directly, either to connect to the extension or provide information and then connect. Remember when all the military bases in the USA used to have two or three digit dialing locally from the town where they were located and long distance calls (even after DDD started) went through the long- distance operator who connected with the military base operator direct? PAT] ------------------------------ From: stevef@wrq.com (Steve Forrette) Subject: Re: Cox and BellSouth Want to Use 511 Date: 10 Jul 1993 00:06:09 GMT Organization: Walker Richer & Quinn, Inc., Seattle, WA In article rothen+@pitt.edu (Seth B Rothenberg) writes: > In article hhallika@tuba.calpoly.edu > (Harold Hallikainen) writes: >> I recently got the PacBell bill stuffer on "1 means ten digits >> follow". It looks like that's really gonna free up the number space. >> People have complained about not knowing if a call is gonna cost them. >> Maybe the telco can give a little warning beep as the call is being >> handled. > Maybe this could be done by requiring IXCs to play their standard tone > whether the call is operator or not. eg, you would dial 1-212-555-4320 > and hear " (chime!) AT & T" and then ringing. Or "(chime!) Thank you > for using AT&T" and then ringing. This would be a terrible idea! There's the technical problem of devices that are listening to the line for call progress tones misinterpreting the extra sound as an answer (I have an old modem that interprets the "Thank you for using AT&T" calling card confirmation as a BUSY and hangs up the line immediately). Also, since calls carried over SS7 complete almost instantly now, some delay would have to be added to play the sound. Then there's just the aesthetic annoyance factory - I think "(chime!) AT&T" would be even more annoying than the network logos that all the TV networks recently began using in the bottom corner of the screen for all their programs. I'm paying for the call, I know it's long distance, and I don't want the call slowed down just to play an annoying message. If I'm not sure that a call is long distance, well that's what the operator is there for. Steve Forrette, stevef@wrq.com [Moderator's Note: If you're not sure if a call is long distance, well that's what your wallet or checkbook are there for! :) PAT] ------------------------------ From: jgreene@nyx.cs.du.edu (Justin Greene) Subject: Re: 811 in California (was Cox and BellSouth Want to Use 511) Organization: Nyx, Public Access Unix at U. of Denver Math/CS dept. Date: Sat, 10 Jul 93 00:07:44 GMT > It didn't make sense to have 800 numbers for out of state and 811 > in-state, so they just made all of us dial an extra four digits. :-( Not to mention that you could not dial the 811 or xxx-811-xxx from out of state. You had to have directory assistance translate it into a POTS #, or you couldn't call, and most people didn't know it could be done (nor were the operators forthcoming with the suggestion). A side note, many smaller telco's use in-state only 800 service for the business office and do not list a number that can be reached from out of the area :-(. Justin ------------------------------ Subject: Re: 811 to Reach Telco Business Offices Date: Sat, 10 Jul 93 10:53:30 PDT From: Lauren Weinstein The current books have a notation at the start of the Pacific Bell listings warning that 811 numbers are not reachable from outside California and may not be reachable from some non-Pacific territories. They suggest calling directory assistance for an alternate number if necessary. This seems rather bizarre actually, since the only numbers that directory assistance should have are the same ones listed in the book -- where you presumably would have gotten the 811 number in the first place! Alternate numbers are not generally listed in the book, in any case. There are fewer 811 numbers than in previous years. The 800 numbers definitely predominate this year, though 811 numbers are still scattered throughout the Pacific Bell listing section. --Lauren-- ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 10 Jul 93 10:52:59 EDT From: Carl Moore Subject: Re: 811 to Reach Telco Business Offices I don't have any examples in front of me, but don't some California phone books supply the "actual" telephone numbers in case they need to be called from a place where 811-xxxx cannot be used? [Moderator's Note: See previous message. Not according to Lauren or Steve they don't. PAT] ------------------------------ From: macwhiz@roundtable.cif.rochester.edu (Gone Fishing) Subject: Re: Switching Red/Green to Black/Yellow Organization: Computer Interest Floor - University of Rochester, NY Date: 10 Jul 93 22:23:50 GMT In knauer@ibeam.intel.com (Rob Knauerhase) writes: >Greetings all, > Does anyone know of a switch that will take a four-wire input > (where red/green are line one and black/yellow are line two) and > select one of the pairs to connect to red/green output? I have two > lines in my apartment, and would like an easier way of switching the > modem between them than moving the plug from one jack to another. > [...] Well, if you just want to switch the modem for outgoing use... i.e., the modem isn't seeing any incoming use that you want to automatically switch for, a good old DPDT switch from Radio Shack's bargain bin did the job for me for many years. Dirt cheap too. Get a small experimentor's box, wire up the switch inside and you're all set. I'd recommend getting a switch with screw terminals and three sets of base cord to spade lug cable if you want to do it neat and easy. Maybe $10 in parts, I'd guess. And unlike most RS stuff I've had occasion to use, there's not much to break down or go wrong. :) Rob Levandowski Computer Interest Floor / University of Rochester ------------------------------ From: richgr@netcom.com (Rich Greenberg) Subject: Re: Switching Red/Green to Black/Yellow Organization: Netcom Online Communications Services (408-241-9760 login: guest) Date: Sat, 10 Jul 1993 16:38:43 GMT I made such a switch with 2 modular cords and a DPDT switch. If you number the six contacts on the switch like this: --------------------------- | 1 3 5 | | | | 2 4 6 | --------------------------- (3 & 4 are the "arms" of the switch.) >From a 2 line jack, connect: red = 1, green = 2, yellow = 3, and 4 = black If you have 2 single line jacks, use 3 cords and connect line 1's red/green to 1/2, line 2's red/green to 5/6. Tape up the yellow/black pair on each. >From the modem, red = 3, green = 4. Tape up the yellow/black pair. A center off switch can completely disconnect it. All of this can be gotten at Radio Shack. A DPDT toggle switch (you may be able to find one with screw terminals if you can't solder), and 2 or three cords with a modular on one end and spade lugs on the other. Rich Greenberg Work: ETi Solutions, Oceanside CA 619-631-5280 N6LRT TinselTown, USA Play: richgr@netcom.com 310-649-0238 I speak for myself only. ------------------------------ Subject: Re: Telephone Gateway Information From: uttsbbs!laurence.chiu@PacBell.COM (Laurence Chiu) Date: 10 Jul 93 10:05:00 GMT Organization: The Transfer Station BBS, Danville, CA - 510-837-4610/837-5591 Reply-To: uttsbbs!laurence.chiu@PacBell.COM (Laurence Chiu) In a message, J Van Zijll De Jong commented on Telephone Gateway Information: > Does anyone have any information on telephone gateways. I am doing a > fourth year project at Massey University New Zealand on home > automation. I am interested in being able to have remote operation of > the home control system via the telephone. I know that SMART HOUSE > has a AT&T telephone gateway, but I have been unable to get any > information on it. Do you know of any other products avaiable that > would be relevant to my project. I used to have some equipment that allowed me remote control capability of any appliance in my house. I just plugged an addressable receiver box into each outlet and then could send pulses through the house wiring to turn on/off appliances at will, dim lights etc. I think the system called X10 and I think you can get a PC interface. You could also dial in from any touch tone phone and activate appliances. It may not be as hi-tech as the one you are looking for but it is a start. Laurence Chiu The Transfer Station BBS (510) 837-4610 & 837-5591 (V.32bis both lines) Danville, California, USA. 1.5 GIG Files & FREE public Internet Access ------------------------------ Subject: Re: Cellular to RS232 Interface From: uttsbbs!laurence.chiu@PacBell.COM (Laurence Chiu) Date: 10 Jul 93 10:05:00 GMT Organization: The Transfer Station BBS, Danville, CA - 510-837-4610/837-5591 Reply-To: uttsbbs!laurence.chiu@PacBell.COM (Laurence Chiu) In a message, J.harrison@bra0401.wins.i commented on Cellular to RS232: > I've been looking round for a new phone and it looks to me like the > easiest one to interface to a modem has *got* to be the Nokia 101 if > anyone else is trying this. Well I just bought a Nokia 121 and it has a modem interface (optional extra of course). It looks like a cradle that the phone sits in, the cradle having a cable terminating in a PCMCIA card that would slot into any notebook having such a connector. Looks pretty neat but expensive. I didn't think the 101 had this option. Laurence Chiu Walnut Creek, CA lchiu@Holonet.net The Transfer Station BBS (510) 837-4610 & 837-5591 (V.32bis both lines) Danville, California, USA. 1.5 GIG Files & FREE public Internet Access ------------------------------ From: rothen+@pitt.edu (Seth B Rothenberg) Subject: Re: Value Added Voice Services Date: 10 Jul 93 17:30:33 GMT Organization: University of Pittsburgh In article deej@cbnewsf.cb.att.com (david.g.lewis) writes: > Or, somebody could be standing a meter behind you listening to what > you say. Someone could be fifty meters away across a train terminal > watching you through binoculars as you key in the card number and PIN. > Welcome to the wonderful world of calling card fraud. > For the most part, they monitor for "unusual" calling patterns. I > don't know what types of patterns AT&T monitors for, and even if I > did, it's almost certainly proprietary information, but speaking > *very* generally the kinds of things watched for are order-of- > magnitude increases in usage This has happened twice to my father's calling card. He thinks that once my brother got shoulder-surfed in NYC's Port Authority bus terminal, and once my father himself got 'hit' in the airport in Atlanta. Both times, NYTel cut off the card the same day. They did not call first. (Come to think of it, the technology exists that they could have the caller patched through to an operator or investigator in order to check with the customer ... or, to someone who can call the police, but they don't seem to do this. I am sure they did not try to bill us for any of the extra calls, and they keep giving us cards :-). Seth ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 10 Jul 93 10:24:09 EDT From: Dennis G. Rears Subject: The Latest Word on the Privacy Mailing List [Moderator's Note: I recently wrote to Dennis Rears asking for his current address regards the mailing list he maintains. PAT] > Dennis, I have had inquiries from people who say they cannot reach you > with mail for your digest. Could you send a note giving us all an > update on where mail should be sent, etc? And Dennis Rears replied in mail to me: To reach the Computer Privacy Digest the following addresses are available: Submissions: comp-privacy@pica.army.mil Admin: comp-privacy-request@Pica.army.mil You might also want to put out an announcement that the telecom-priv mailing list no longer exists. Recently I have been getting email about telecom-priv. If people can reach me at all they can always email . Thanks, dennis [Moderator's Note: Thanks, and how about you, Lauren W? Care to provide the address for your privacy journal in case readers wish to subscribe? PAT] ------------------------------ End of TELECOM Digest V13 #463 ******************************   Received: from delta.eecs.nwu.edu by mintaka.lcs.mit.edu id aa17151; 10 Jul 93 22:50 EDT Received: by delta.eecs.nwu.edu id AA19232 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4 for telecomlist-outbound); Sat, 10 Jul 1993 20:22:54 -0500 Received: by delta.eecs.nwu.edu id AA01887 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4 for telecomlist); Sat, 10 Jul 1993 20:22:02 -0500 Date: Sat, 10 Jul 1993 20:22:02 -0500 From: TELECOM Moderator Message-Id: <199307110122.AA01887@delta.eecs.nwu.edu> To: telecom@eecs.nwu.edu Subject: TELECOM Digest V13 #464 TELECOM Digest Sat, 10 Jul 93 20:22:00 CDT Volume 13 : Issue 464 Inside This Issue: Moderator: Patrick A. Townson SUMMARY: Costing Home Fiber Installation (Peter J. Scott) Answering Machine and Fax Marriages - Can They Work? (Eddie Corns) Re: Answering Machine Bypass Code Information Wanted (system@garlic.sbs) Re: Answering Machine Bypass Code Information Wanted (Robert B. Thompson) Re: DID Chip? (Fred R. Goldstein) Re: Access to Toll Records (Justin Greene) Re: Access to Toll Records (Paul Houle) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: pjs@euclid.Jpl.Nasa.Gov (Peter J. Scott) Subject: SUMMARY: Costing Home Fiber Installation Date: 10 Jul 1993 16:59:07 GMT Organization: Jet Propulsion Laboratory, NASA/Caltech Reply-To: pjs@euclid.Jpl.Nasa.Gov I promised I would summarize the information I received on my request regarding getting fiber-optic access at home (even in the boondocks) for high-speed connectivity to the Internet so I could get X, audio, and video connections to my work place. Here's the result. This is a long post, but I received a lot of high-quality information, and I know there are others out there very interested in this. From: bud@kentrox.com (Bud Couch): Ask about Switched 56 access as well. Usually, it's implemented using 4W DDS and the "bigger hammer",so that access charges are ridiculous (2 pairs required). However, if you're lucky, and your local CO is a Northern Telecom DMS, and PacBell has set it up, you may be able to get Switched 56 service via a technology called Datapath. This uses a ping-pong transmission method at 144Kbps to provide up to 64 kBps. Switched 56 is easily implemented on it, and, since it only requires a single pair, the access charges are about half of the other major technique. From: gg502@fermi.pnl.gov Well, depending on what you are _doing_ with X, it may be that you don't really need 56 kbps. I have an NCD x terminal at home, with a 9600 baud modem. I dial in using their Xremote software (which is the basis for Low Bandwidth X, which is "under construction" by the X Consortium). From: johnl@iecc.com (John R. Levine) Can you get line of sight from the roof of your house (perhaps with an antenna mast) to an existing network site? If so, there are some inexpensive wireless modems that can give you up to 2MB/sec at reason- able cost up to five miles. I'm currently using a pair of Wavelan wireless 2MB Ethernets which cost about $600 each. They are implemented as ISA or Microchannel adapter cards, so I stuck them in old PCs with regular wired Ethernet cards and use PCROUTE. Works pretty well. The standard omnidirec- tional modems work up to 300 feet, and you're supposed to get up to five miles line of sight with external yagi antennas which cost about $400 each including lightning protectors. From: lars@spectrum.CMC.COM (Lars Poulsen) You should contact an INTERNET SERVICE PROVIDER also called a mid-level network operator or "regional network". There are about 50 of these; most are only active in a particular geographical area, and many serve only "Research and Education". Among the beter known providers of commercial connections are: Alternet (UUNET Technologies) PSI (Performance Systems International, I think) CERFnet The biggest cost driver is carriage from your house to the network provider's nearest router. If you are five males from a small town, odds are that the network provider's point of presence is not within a local call. (They tend to co-locate with either a large research park or the LATA point-of-presence of a long-distance carrier.) If you are fairly close to a POP (point of presence) the carriage may be less than $100/month for a four-wire circuit that can run 56 Kbps. The going rate for the Internet Service through that pipe is about $1000/month. This is not totally out of reach for engineering consult- ants working out of their home. If you are within a local call of someone who has an internet connection and is willing to share with you, you can get a couple of IP addresses from their network number, and run a dial-up IP connection over 14400 bps modems. With enough savvy, you can install free software on a unix workstation on each end of the link. Or you can buy a turnkey dial-up router to install at each end for $1995 each, which attaches to the ethernet at each end and dials up the link when there's traffic. This puts the cost well within the budget of many "part-time work-at-home" engineers. And the prices are coming down fast. Going up the speed range, the price goes up fast. From 14400 bps to 56 kbps is not a big step: Each of them is worth "one phone connection". The next faster is typically a T1 (1544 kbps) line, worth 24 phone connections, and usually priced at about ten times the 56 kbps. The point at which they run a fiber is probably a T3 (43 million bits per second) which is 28 T1's or 672 telephone connections' worth. I haven't priced it recently, but it isn't cheap. From: "Terry Kennedy, Operations Mgr" As someone who has actually *done* this, I should be able to give you some good answers. First, it's going to be very expensive. Second, you will probably be better off leasing circuits from the phone company for this sort of thing. Here are some details: First, fiber is generally considered a high-bandwidth medium. A pair of fibers (one for transmit, one for receive) is generally going to be operated at 10Mbit (Ethernet speed) or faster. 100Mbit is also common. Thus, you're looking at linked Ethernet segments, which is much faster than the typical Internet link (DS0 - 56Kbit or T1 - 1.544Mbit). Current Internet links will run quite happily over copper pairs leased to you by the local telco. The cost of leasing such a circuit will likely be less over a reasonable period (say, five years) than building your own fiber link. Lastly, most (if not all) Internet service providers aren't going to know what to do with your fiber once you get it there. So, you'd probably need to run it to your workplace. This brings up the issues of job security, etc., and whether you could profit from that piece of fiber if you were no longer employed there. So, if you still want to do it, here is what you will need to do: First, establish a reasonable route for your fiber. You will want to use existing utility poles wherever possible. This will save you negotating with each and every property holder along the route, let you avoid construction permits, etc. Next, establish which utility handles pole space leasing in your area. There may be various owners of poles (power utility, telephone company, cable TV, municipal fire alarm, etc.) but normally they will appoint one of them as the lease agent for the entire area, no matter who owns the pole. You will then have to contact the lease agent and discuss the feasibilty. You should have gathered various pieces of necessary information, such as the number of poles and their serial numbers (yes, they're serialized). You will probably find that there is a per-pole rate which is quite reasonable, an annual minimum, and some additional charges. Here in NJ, the rate is under $5 per pole per year with a $100 minimum. However, since many of the poles will have been installed with no idea that you wanted space (in fact, some of them were a tight fit when Cable TV came along), you may have to pay to have the other users of the pole move their attachments up or down, and in some cases you may have to pay for a new, taller, pole if the attachments can't be moved (for example, because it would reduce necessary clearances or spacing). This is all quite reasonably priced (again, in NJ it was something like $20 per pole to relocate telco). I never priced new poles. If any part of the run is underground, you'll need a separate lease for the conduit space. So, now you have an idea how much renting poles will cost you. The lease agent may charge you for a survey to determine the number of attachments to be moved, or poles to be replaced. My experience is that you won't be charged if the agent thinks you are serious (serious == likely to go through with the job). Then you have to price your fiber. You'll want a good outdoor-grade fiber like AT&T 3DFX-xxx-HXM, where xxx is the number of fibers. Be sure to allocate enough spare fibers to cover damage (more on that later). You'll also need to supply the "messenger strand" your fiber will attach to, and the various hardware parts to attach all of that to the poles. Also plan on getting some of the "FIBER - don't cut" tags. If any portion of your run is underground, you will need a conduit liner as well. Once you have your signed (and paid) lease agreement and your fiber, you're about ready to start. However, first you'll need to post a liability bond or acquire liability insurance. For my run in NJ, this was a $1,000,000 bond or a $5,000,000 policy. This is to cover things like your cable falling down and injuring someone, etc. Now you need to get the cable up on the poles. This is gonna cost you. You really can't do this yourself (unless you already do this for a living) as it needs lots of specialized tools, and more than one person. Your best bet is to contract with one of the existing pole users (remember, that's usually the power utility, telco, Cable TV, municipal fire alarm, etc.). This is a *good* *thing* for a number of reasons: 1) Since they do this for a living, they'll do it right, and you can usually avoid any inspection by the lease agent if done this way. 2) Since they're on the same poles, they do a good job, typically. They don't want their stuff damaging yours, or vice versa. 3) When the obligatory drunk takes down a pole you're on (provided you set this up as part of your deal), the installer will fix your stuff (or at least prevent it from becoming further damaged or a hazard) while they're out fixing their stuff. Otherwise you're likely to get a late night call from the police/fire department telling you to clear your cable or lose it. This brings up the need for spare cable, splicing equipment, etc. If you can't find anyone to do this, you can always get a commercial electrical contractor to do it. I'd advise getting the detailed plans showing all of the requirements from the lease agent, and telling your contractor they won't get paid in full until the lease agent approves their job. Stuff on poles is utterly foreign to most electricians and the rules are very different from the ones they're used to. The particulars of my run are a four-block distance in NJ, using a cable with four fibers, partially underground and partially pole-based. It took about a year of on-and-off negotiation to get this set up. The installation contractor was the local Cable TV company, and the poles were leased from NJ Bell Telephone. The cost breakdown was about $1750 for installation, $2000 for the fiber itself (terminations included), $300 for leases/relocation/etc. Then there was $5000 for the Ethernet gear (prices have come down). And, let's not forget the million dollar liability bond. ---------------- Thanks to everyone who responded! Peter Scott, NASA/JPL/Caltech (pjs@euclid.jpl.nasa.gov) ------------------------------ From: Eddie Corns Subject: Answering Machine and Fax Marriages - Can They Work? Date: 10 Jul 93 12:09:37 GMT Hi, I am posting this query on behalf of a friend trying to run a small business. He has currently one telephone line and an answering machine. He would like to also add a fax machine and wants to find the most viable options. Obvioulsy he can simply get a second phone line installed but he is hoping for a cheaper solution because BT can charge up to 160 for that (I think). If he tries to put them on the same line I presume he needs some kind of manager box that discriminates fax callers from others. My limited knowledge of telephony suggests this is done by the bleepy noise the caller gives when connection is established. I presume in order for this setup to work either a) answering machine answers phone and discriminator listens for signal and quickly turns on fax and cuts out answering machine (before it gets to the tone which we are asked to speak after) or b) discriminator answers call and if fax passes it straight through to fax, if not actually makes answering machine start ringing so that it will then answer as normal (caller will presumably notice a slight glitch in ringing) or c) neither of the above. Because he is a very small company he doesn't want to buy a particularly expensive fax machine, in fact I have been trying to persuade hime to use his Mac with appropriate modem/software which seems like a very economical method to me. Needless to say when he's actually in, he will answer the phone himself. Would anyone please suggest any DOs and DONTs here and any helpful hints and even to satisfy my curiousity of how they can work together. Eddie ------------------------------ From: system@garlic.sbs.com Date: Sat, 10 Jul 93 22:39:56 EDT Subject: Re: Answering Machine Bypass Code Information Wanted mitchell@cwis.unomaha.edu (Dennis Mitchell) writes: > I'm looking for a new answering machine, I've heard that one with the > features I want exists, but I have no idea who makes it. > My fiance works nights, and sleeps during the day. When she's in bed, > she unplugs the phone and lets her answering machine take all the > calls. Generally that's all right, but _sometimes_ there are calls > that she needs to receive right away. > We need to find an answering machine that will prevent the phone from > ringing unless the caller enters a bypass code of some sort. Can > anyone offer a suggestion on where to look? I have an AT&T 1523 Phone/Answerer/Dialer combo and it has a neat feature call Priority Codes. When I really don't want to answer the phone unless it's absolutely urgent (hangover recoveries mean even Priority gets disabled!) the caller gets my outgoing message, taps in the two digit (changeable, like all the codes on my machine) and the phone starts beeping like mad for 20 seconds. After 20 seconds, if nobody picks up the phone it will prompt the caller to leave a message anyhow. Talk about the height of frustration. Heh heh. Tony system@hades.cdp.org ------------------------------ From: Robert B. Thompson Subject: Re: Answering Machine Bypass Code Information Wanted Date: 10 Jul 93 15:08:34 EST Organization: Forsyth County, Winston-Salem NC In article , mitchell@cwis.unomaha.edu (Dennis Mitchell) writes: > I'm looking for a new answering machine, I've heard that one with the > features I want exists, but I have no idea who makes it. Home Automation Laboratories (1-800-HOMELAB) sells a device called "Friends Only" that sounds like it should do what you need. It sits between your CO demarc and the phones in your home. When an inbound call arrives, the box answers it silently and prompts the caller for a passcode. If the caller fails to enter the proper code he is disconnected. If he enters the correct code, the box itself rings. It's important to note that the box itself generates an electronic ring, but does not generate ring current on the line; that is, the only ring you'll get is from the box itself. Your phones will no long ring at all. I think the device costs about $70. Robert Bruce Thompson thompson@ledger.forsyth.wsnc.org Forsyth County MIS Department (919) 727-2597 x3012 Winston-Salem, North Carolina USA (919) 727-2020 (FAX) ------------------------------ From: goldstein@isdnip.lkg.dec.com (Fred R. Goldstein) Subject: Re: DID Chip? Reply-To: goldstein@carafe.tay2.dec.com Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation Date: Sat, 10 Jul 1993 04:27:24 GMT In article rothen+@pitt.edu (Seth B Rothenberg) writes: > Having resolved that there's no cheaper substitute for DID service, I > would like to ask if there is anyone who knows where I could find out > if there is a chip that supports DID? (I figure, if you can buy a > telephone-on-a-chip at Radio Shack, maybe there's a chance you can > buy DID-on-a-chip someplace ... it does not need to be as close as the > Radio Shack up the street.) Huh? DID is a service delivered by the central office. Basically, the phone company sells you a whole heap of numbers for a price, and prefaces each incoming call with the last few digits, either pulsed or toned. Since it's the numbers you're buying from their owner (phone company), 'tain't nuttin' you can do with any chip to get them elsewhere. Fred R. Goldstein goldstein@carafe.tay2.dec.com opinions are mine alone. sharing requires permission ------------------------------ From: jgreene@nyx.cs.du.edu (Justin Greene) Subject: Re: Access to Toll Records Organization: Nyx, Public Access Unix at U. of Denver Math/CS dept. Date: Sat, 10 Jul 93 21:17:35 GMT > The credit info both of these came back with appeared to be the same > thing an individual is entitled to when denied credit by a credit > grantor. It probably is and the person who ran the report could get > a mongo fine if they don't have a signature on file giving permission > to pull the info. > Both programs used the figure of 100 dollars as what they paid for > other information, including long-distance records. There was no > elaboration on what was meant by "records", but one would assume they > meant individual call detail. I have a problem understanding how > this can be so. > It does not seem possible that toll records are available to any > entity, at any price, under the above scenario. What's going on here? Well, it's like this. Money can buy anything and people are sheep. Your phone records have three components, local calls, local long distance,and long distance. If your regional company handles the billing for the long distance carrier then it's all there at the local level, all you need is a good scam or a source (not quite so easy as it sounds). Personally, I'm kinda funny about privacy so I use a carrier that does not bill through my local telco and I use 10xxx to access them so anyone trying to access my records would get a headache trying to find them. I also use ATT, MCI & Sprint depending on how I feel. If they want all my records they are going to pay through the nose. If you want to make life really tuff ask the telco to put a code on your account and no info will be released without it (yeah right). It will at least stop any amatuers from getting info. I also have an 800 number which I give to family and old friends so that my number cannot be obtained by pulling their tolls (though a pen register on the line would give that number which would then have to be translated to my pots number, etc. Privacy unfortunately in this day and age is very very expensive. Now that I have you sufficiently paranoid, rest secure that it isn't all that easy to get info. Most private people can't get it, nor would they know what to do with it if they could. Credit bureaus keep a record of who requests full reports so fraudulent inquiries can be tracked down (Of course you have to be in the habit of checking your reports every now and then to know if an inquiry was made). Telco accounts can be notes in big capital letters not to release info, though that won't stop a pro. The show accomplished it purpose though and got your attention didn't it :-) -Anonymous ;-) Justin ------------------------------ From: Paul.Houle@leotech.MV.COM (Paul Houle) Reply-To: houle@leotech.MV.COM Date: Sat, 10 Jul 1993 12:49:00 Subject: Re: Access to Toll Records > Fourth, assume that criminal activity is not involved, and > that no law-enforcement agencies are involved. > It does not seem possible that toll records are available > to any entity, at any price, under the above scenario. The fourth assumption is probably false. Call-detail records and other propreitary phone information can be very easily had from crooked phone company employees. Most private eyes have a good working relationship with one, and you don't even necessarily need to pay them money. I have a 'phriend' who wrote a kind of executive briefing on fiber optics for a BOC employee. He had met the BOC employee in person previously, and the guy had asked him to tell him all about optic fiber, and he did. Anyway, the BOC guy wanted to print this out and make photocopies to hand out to his subordinates. In return my phriend got some confidential information. My phriend is rather proud that he wrote training materials that were used [unofficially] at a BOC! Origin: NETIS (603)432-2517/432-0922 (HST/V32) (1:132/189) [Moderator's Note: All of us probably have known at one time or another a telco employee who was corrupt. All the telcos take the violation of customer and company records as a very serious offense. For the fifty or hundred dollar bribe a clerk might get for giving out a non-pub number for example, the risks are just too great they will be caught. *If you get caught*, consider this scenario: you are told to go the Personnel Department. There you see your supervisor, a couple guys from security, and your union steward waiting for you. Security confronts you with the evidence, and your supervisor fires you, collecting your keys, identification card and/or other company property on the spot. You were an excellent worker otherwise, and its hard for your supervisor to say the words he has to say ... but he says it, security walks you down to the front door and hands you your final paycheck on the way out with any back pay or vacation pay you have coming. The union steward can't do much to help you under the circumstances; he can grieve to the company on your behalf, but being a traitor to company secrets and theft of records is hard to appeal. He's there to see that you get your final pay and that the company does not screw you around too much; but when security walks you to the front door, puts your pay in your hands and tells you to never come on company property again for any reason, that's it. You worked there twenty years? Tough; you are out ... on your ass! *You* get to go home and explain to your wife and kids why you no longer work for telco. Think about it before you get seduced by some phreak looking for company proprietary information. Remember former Digest participant Randy Barrow from three years ago? Don't forget the example made of Randy for other AT&T employees! PAT] ------------------------------ End of TELECOM Digest V13 #464 ******************************   Received: from delta.eecs.nwu.edu by mintaka.lcs.mit.edu id aa09195; 12 Jul 93 4:46 EDT Received: by delta.eecs.nwu.edu id AA32320 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4 for telecomlist-outbound); Mon, 12 Jul 1993 01:48:54 -0500 Received: by delta.eecs.nwu.edu id AA14421 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4 for telecomlist); Mon, 12 Jul 1993 01:48:11 -0500 Date: Mon, 12 Jul 1993 01:48:11 -0500 From: TELECOM Moderator Message-Id: <199307120648.AA14421@delta.eecs.nwu.edu> To: telecom@eecs.nwu.edu Subject: TELECOM Digest V13 #465 TELECOM Digest Mon, 12 Jul 93 01:48:00 CDT Volume 13 : Issue 465 Inside This Issue: Moderator: Patrick A. Townson Re: Some More Historical Questions (Pat Turner) Re: Some More Historical Questions (Robert L. McMillin) Re: Some More Historical Questions (David Breneman) Re: I Just Got Scammed (system@garlic.sbs.com) Re: I Just Got Scammed (Jan Hinnerk Haul) Re: Power Crosses Phone Lines (was Why -48V on Local Loop?) (Al Varney) Re: Caller ID and Bell Canada (Tony Harminc) Re: GSM Security (Bruce Albrecht) Re: White House Orders No Bid Phone System (Alan Boritz) Re: Do We Have a Theme Song? (Brian T. Vita) Re: Do We Have a Theme Song? (Dave Grabowski) Re: Do We Have a Theme Song? (Roy M. Silvernail) The Day the Bell System Died (Reprint with comments by John C. Fowler) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: turner@Dixie.Com Date: Sun, 11 Jul 93 22:06 EDT Subject: Re: Some More Historical Questions > In 1907, vacuum tubes were in their infancy, if available, so > it almost sounds like they just ran an incredible current through that > microphone and used water to keep it from doing a melt-down. The > audio in Tulsa must have been really fabulous after 100 miles of > open-wire unequalized line. Two things would have worked in their favor, however: 1) Open wire has a much lower loss than twisted pair 2) There wasn't a lot of RFI or PI (power influence) back then, that continues to plague long rural loops. If powers lines did run near the cable (doubtful), there were no switching power supplies, ballasts, or cap banks to generate the dreaded triple odd harmonics. 100 miles isn't impressive. If they could drive a speaker at that distance, that would be something. Of course, people would probably still be impressed if someone listened to a set of headphones and relayed the message to the public. Patton Turner KB4GRZ FAA Telecommunication turner@dixie.com ------------------------------ From: rlm@helen.surfcty.com (Robert L. McMillin) Subject: Re: Some More Historical Questions Organization: Surf City Software/TBFW Project Date: Mon, 12 Jul 1993 02:33:27 GMT On Tue, 06 Jul 1993 16:38:30 -0500, the Moderator noted: > Amazing technology? By the time grandpa left us he had seen in his > lifetime: the invention of radio, television, talking movies, airplanes, > automobiles, computers, countless other things; he saw the telephone > and electricity come into very wide acceptance and use as well, > bringing with widespread electrical distribution the use of refriger- > ators, fans, household lighting, etc. Can you imagine coming into a > world with none of those things as a young person growing up and and > having all of them in your daily life when you leave? Will we ever see > another century like the 20th in terms of sheer variety of inventions > and technological changes? Of course *I* remember when there were no > computers and television was only something that a few very rich > people had in their houses and phones were black instruments with a > round dial if you lived in a place where the exchange was 'modern'. I > suppose given life-expectancy rates I will be around until 2030 or so, > and many of you will be around until 2070. Given the changes in the > past century, doesn't it blow your mind to think of what technology > will be like when *you* depart? I know it excites me. PAT] Is it so exciting? It seems that what technology giveth with the one hand, it taketh away with the other. Television brought entertainment and the immediacy of distant images; but it's also given us reduced attention spans, has been linked to rising crime rates, oversimplifies the events it does manage to show us, and invites us into ill-considered foreign military adventures. Computers make possible this very message, the Internet through which it passes, and our whole far-flung communication system; yet the widespread application of computers has resulted in the most significant social upheaval since the Industrial Revolution. Like that distant time, it is not entirely clear what those on the bleeding edge will do after the revolution is over. Remember the Chinese curse: "May you live in interesting times." Robert L. McMillin | Surf City Software | rlm@helen.surfcty.com ------------------------------ From: daveb%avatar@dsinet.dgtl.com (David Breneman) Subject: Re: Some More Historical Questions Date: 11 Jul 93 19:33:16 GMT martin@datacomm.ucc.okstate.edu (Martin McCormick) writes: > The account of this hookup said that the governor spoke into a > water-cooled microphone in Oklahoma City and the signal was audible in > Tulsa, about 100 Miles to the Northeast. > In 1907, vacuum tubes were in their infancy, if available, so > it almost sounds like they just ran an incredible current through that > microphone and used water to keep it from doing a melt-down. The > audio in Tulsa must have been really fabulous after 100 miles of > open-wire unequalized line. > [Moderator's Note: Yours is the second time I've heard that story, and > it is hard to imagine how it was done. I think the key is "water-cooled" microphone. Even in the early days of radio, the signal was generated by feeding the output of an alternator (which generated the carrier signal) *through* a microphone and on to the antenna. Much research was devoted to designing microphones which could modulate greater and greater currents. It was DeForest's invention of the Audion which allowed the microphone to modulate a small current, which was fed to the transmitter tube which used that small current to modulate the big current coming from the alternator. It makes perfect sense that this speech could have been "transmitted" by connecting a high-current microphone to a large bank of *telegraph* batteries (much more voltage than telephone batteries) and using a chalk-cylinder amplifier at the receiving end - there were *mechanical* amplifiers long before electronic ones (used for "loud speaking" phonographs in the 1890's). It would be quite a treat if this pioneering technological stunt could be repeated on Oklahoma's centennial. David Breneman Email: daveb@jaws.engineering.dgtl.com System Administrator, Software Engineering Services Digital Systems International, Inc. Voice: 206 881-7544 Fax: 206 556-8033 ------------------------------ From: system@garlic.sbs.com Date: Sun, 11 Jul 93 18:38:54 EDT Subject: Re: I Just Got Scammed vinceg@bos.mcd.mot.com (Vince Grove) writes: > I seem to remember a scam described here some time ago. I received a > collect call from a New England Telephone service representative. I > was told the charges would be forwarded to NE Telephone. The service > rep claimed that my line was being overheard on other phone lines in > the area and they were checking it out. > How does this scam work?! I don't know but New England Telephone NEVER calls collect. Why should they, they own the system. But I suppose someone could do it to you with the NET voice system. If you're dumb enough to accept the call then you deserved to get scammed. ------------------------------ From: Jan Hinnerk Haul Date: Sun, 11 Jul 93 20:15:33 +0200 Subject: Re: I Just Got Scammed In comp.dcom.telecom TELECOM Moderator notes: > Moderator's Note: For starters, telco *never* calls anyone collect. > Most telcos accept collect calls from anywhere; they never place > collect calls. PAT] So, why do the operators connect such calls? They know who pretends to be calling, and they screen out calls like "Needa Ride", so why don't they screen out calls from "Police", "Telco" etc? Regards, Jan H. Haul Tel. +49 40 - 890 57 57 Disc.: Not even *my* Hamburg, Germany Fax +49 40 - 890 51 57 opinion [Moderator's Note: I doubt it was an operator who called him! If I were to call you now and claim to be an AT&T operator in the United States with a collect call for you, wouldn't you be hard pressed to know the difference, particularly if it was a female who called? I think someone called our correspondent hoping he would accept the collect call but maybe reveal his calling card number in the process. You can accept collect calls that way you know; when the operator says there is a collect call, tell her you wish to put it on your AT&T Calling Card. She'll ask for the Calling Card number and PIN, but of course you be certain to tell her to split the connection before you start rattling off the number so the caller does not hear the number, especially the PIN part. PAT] ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 11 Jul 93 22:03:12 CDT From: varney@ihlpe.att.com Subject: Re: Power Crosses Phone Lines (was Why -48V on Local Loop?) Organization: AT&T In article Andy Rabagliati writes: > In article varney@ihlpe.att.com > writes: >> The heat coils were in place to detect a real concern of the time -- >> 120V AC power lines falling onto the telephone lines that were on the >> same or nearby poles. > In the UK, any crossing of power lines over phone lines is treated > with great concern. Big netting arrangements are built, so that if the > power cables break they will still not touch phone lines. It's not just where the lines cross, although that was once a major concern -- now a minor issue due to the removal of most bare overhead telephone wire. Telephone training on the installation of bare wire included diagrams of how wire under strain could flip itself up or over onto adjacent power lines. And there used to be lots of complex rules about whether the telephone lines ran over or under a particular set of power lines. In the USA, many individual pairs of overhead wires still run below 120/240 volt electrical service lines. My father's farm receives electrical service from one side of the road and telephone service from open wire on the other side of the road. At the transformer stepping down the voltage to 120/240 volts, the telephone wires are run as a small cable a few feet below the electrical wires. (The telephone cable would have to have an insulation break in order for 120V to short to the telephone wires. However, both electrical and telephone insulation is cracked and missing entirely on these one wires.) Al Varney ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 12 Jul 93 00:03:39 EDT From: Tony @ Brownvm Subject: Re: Caller ID and Bell Canada msb@sq.sq.com (Mark Brader) wrote: >> Incidentally, with Bell Canada, if you have Call Return, you are told >> the number that last called you, and given the *option* of returning >> the call. If Call Block was used on that call, then you are told that >> the number "cannot be given out", and then given the option of >> returning the call anyway. ... > And someone asked me in email what the phone bill would show if you > decided to return the call anyway, and it did turn out to be long > distance. I don't know, and I don't have any out-of-town friends with > Call Block to try it with. Does anyone else here know? A billing insert came around two or three months ago that explains this. Evidently Call Return will refuse to return a billable call that is ID blocked, precisely so that the number will not show up on your bill. This is Bell Canada's way of doing it -- other telcos may well vary. Tony Harminc ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 12 Jul 93 01:06:47 CST From: bruce@zuhause.MN.ORG (Bruce Albrecht) Subject: Re: GSM Security In , Vangelis Kontogiannis writes: > What I would like to ask our (European) readers is, given the digital > encryption in GSM, are fraud schemes of the type often mentioned in > this list (see #435) possible? Any data on the subject? Remember, in > GSM subscription data is recorded in a credit-card sized SIM > (Subscriber Information Module) that plugs into the GSM phone; the > subscriber is uniquely identified by his IMSI (International Mobile > Subscriber Identity). There are also plug-in SIMs (Siemens and Motorola make them), which are just a bit larger than the chip contacts, about the size of the thumb from the tip to the first joint. As far as fraud is concerned, someone with enough knowledge of the GSM standards might be able to make their own SIMs, but it probably wouldn't be easy. They'd also have to know the proper encryption algorithms, which are probably A3/A8 or a variant, in order to convinced the network that the IMSI is valid. The SIMs themselves contain data in an EEROM, but the data stored in a file system that generally makes the files containing serial number information read-only. bruce@zuhause.mn.org ------------------------------ Date: 11 Jul 93 07:03:01 EDT From: Alan Boritz <72446.461@CompuServe.COM> Subject: Re: White House Orders No Bid Phone System TDARCOS@MCIMAIL.COM (Paul Robinson) writes: > There has been considerable flack placed upon the White House for > deciding to contact two switch bidders -- Northern Telecom and AT&T -- > and deciding to place an order consisting of Centrex service from C&P > Telephone and ordering a switch from AT&T, without putting this > contract out for bids. Sounds like another "Travel Office Scandal" all over again. Seems that the Clinton administration just loves to embarass itself whenever it gets a chance. There most certainly are secure (by government standards), reliable, and technically superior alternatives to "Mother," but some public sector officials always feel that they're above the (competitive bidding) laws. Hmmm, history (sort of) repeating itself ... ;) Alan Boritz 72446.461@compuserve.com ------------------------------ Date: 11 Jul 93 10:49:17 EDT From: Brian T. Vita <70702.2233@CompuServe.COM> Subject: Re: Do We Have a Theme Song? > In the interim, e.g. until we get some other nominations I nominate Mars Lasar's "Cellular City" from his Eleventh Hour CD. It includes sampled DTMF tones, ringback and intercepts. The song came onto our office music system as I was cutting over to a new key system. At first I thought that I had wired the system wrong and it had started speed dialing itself :-). Brian Vita CSS, Inc. Ci$70702,2233 ------------------------------ From: dcg5662@hertz.njit.edu (Dave Grabowski) Subject: Re: Do We Have a Theme Song? Organization: New Jersey Institute of Technology, Newark, New Jersey Date: Mon, 12 Jul 1993 01:54:41 GMT In article 0005066432@MCIMAIL.COM writes: > It just occurred to me that this newsgroup needs something to > distinguish it from all the others. I just thought, as important as > telephony and telecommunications is, that maybe we need to adopt some > song as the "Theme Song" of TELECOM Digest. But which one? What's a > fairly "good" song about telephones? > [Moderator's Note: Why me, Lord? Why do I get this kind of email? PAT] I suppose another question could be, why did you put it in the Digest? Another question could be, why am I responding to this? :) I'm bored ... Back when Bell first broke up, a radio station in NYC (and I'm sure other ones around the country) had a spoof song ... the lyrics were something like ... "Ma Bell ... Breaking up is hard to do." Dave dcg5662@hertz.njit.edu 70721.2222@compuserve.com ------------------------------ Subject: Re: Do We Have a Theme Song? From: roy@sendai.cybrspc.mn.org (Roy M. Silvernail) Date: Sun, 11 Jul 1993 13:01:55 CST Organization: The Villa CyberSpace, executive headquarters In comp.dcom.telecom, 0005066432@MCIMAIL.COM writes: > It just occurred to me that this newsgroup needs something to > distinguish it from all the others. I just thought, as important as > telephony and telecommunications is, that maybe we need to adopt some > song as the "Theme Song" of TELECOM Digest. > It's sort of a tossup among several. The Electric Light Orchestra > released a song which is, I believe called either "Telephone" or > "Hello". But it's a rather sad song about someone trying to reach > someone who doesn't answer. That one's called "Telephone line". My vote goes to the Sugarloaf comeback song from 1974 ... "Don't call us, we'll call you". It's even got some touch-tones! > [Moderator's Note: Why me, Lord? Why do I get this kind of email? PAT] Just cuz we like you, Virtual PAT! Roy M. Silvernail |+| roy@sendai.cybrspc.mn.org ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 11 Jul 1993 14:18:35 -0600 From: John C. Fowler Subject: Re: Do We Have a Theme Song? Paul Robinson writes: > I just thought, as important as telephony and telecommunications is, that > maybe we need to adopt some song as the "Theme Song" of TELECOM Digest. > But which one? What's a fairly "good" song about telephones? Oh, come on, Paul! Surely you know that TELECOM Digest already has a theme song! Check out the file lauren.song in the TELECOM Archives! :-) John C. Fowler, fowlerc@boulder.colorado.edu [Moderator's Note: To save him a trip to the archives (anonymous ftp to lcs.mit.edu) -- although I wish everyone would visit the archives now and then -- I've pulled the file in particular. Since today marks the tenth anniversary of when this was first printed, I thought it would be fun to do again. So here, dear readers, is "The Day The Bell System Died", a song by Lauren Weinstein which first appeared here in TELECOM Digest on July 12, 1983. Enjoy! PAT] 12-Jul-83 09:14:32-PDT,4930;000000000001 Return-path: <@LBL-CSAM:vortex!lauren@LBL-CSAM> Received: from LBL-CSAM by USC-ECLB; Tue 12 Jul 83 09:12:46-PDT Date: Tuesday, 12-Jul-83 01:18:19-PDT From: Lauren Weinstein Subject: "The Day Bell System Died" Return-Path: Message-Id: <8307121614.AA17341@LBL-CSAM.ARPA> Received: by LBL-CSAM.ARPA (3.327/3.21) id AA17341; 12 Jul 83 09:14:35 PDT (Tue) To: TELECOM@ECLB Greetings. With the massive changes now taking place in the telecommunications industry, we're all being inundated with seemingly endless news items and points of information regarding the various effects now beginning to take place. However, one important element has been missing: a song! Since the great Tom Lehrer has retired from the composing world, I will now attempt to fill this void with my own light-hearted, non-serious look at a possible future of telecommunications. This work is entirely satirical, and none of its lyrics are meant to be interpreted in a non-satirical manner. The song should be sung to the tune of Don Mclean's classic "American Pie". I call my version "The Day Bell System Died"... --Lauren-- ************************************************************************ *==================================* * Notice: This is a satirical work * *==================================* "The Day Bell System Died" Lyrics Copyright (C) 1983 by Lauren Weinstein (To the tune of "American Pie") (With apologies to Don McLean) ARPA: vortex!lauren@LBL-CSAM UUCP: {decvax, ihnp4, harpo, ucbvax!lbl-csam, randvax}!vortex!lauren ************************************************************************* Long, long, time ago, I can still remember, When the local calls were "free". And I knew if I paid my bill, And never wished them any ill, That the phone company would let me be... But Uncle Sam said he knew better, Split 'em up, for all and ever! We'll foster competition: It's good capital-ism! I can't remember if I cried, When my phone bill first tripled in size. But something touched me deep inside, The day... Bell System... died. And we were singing... Bye, bye, Ma Bell, why did you die? We get static from Sprint and echo from MCI, "Our local calls have us in hock!" we all cry. Oh Ma Bell why did you have to die? Ma Bell why did you have to die? Is your office Step by Step, Or have you gotten some Crossbar yet? Everybody used to ask... Oh, is TSPS coming soon? IDDD will be a boon! And, I hope to get a Touch-Tone phone, real soon... The color phones are really neat, And direct dialing can't be beat! My area code is "low": The prestige way to go! Oh, they just raised phone booths to a dime! Well, I suppose it's about time. I remember how the payphones chimed, The day... Bell System... died. And we were singing... Bye, bye, Ma Bell, why did you die? We get static from Sprint and echo from MCI, "Our local calls have us in hock!" we all cry. Oh Ma Bell why did you have to die? Ma Bell why did you have to die? Back then we were all at one rate, Phone installs didn't cause debate, About who'd put which wire where... Installers came right out to you, No "phone stores" with their ballyhoo, And 411 was free, seemed very fair! But FCC wanted it seems, To let others skim long-distance creams, No matter 'bout the locals, They're mostly all just yokels! And so one day it came to pass, That the great Bell System did collapse, In rubble now, we all do mass, The day... Bell System... died. So bye, bye, Ma Bell, why did you die? We get static from Sprint and echo from MCI, "Our local calls have us in hock!" we all cry. Oh Ma Bell why did you have to die? Ma Bell why did you have to die? I drove on out to Murray Hill, To see Bell Labs, some time to kill, But the sign there said the Labs were gone. I went back to my old CO, Where I'd had my phone lines, years ago, But it was empty, dark, and ever so forlorn... No relays pulsed, No data crooned, No MF tones did play their tunes, There wasn't a word spoken, All carrier paths were broken... And so that's how it all occurred, Microwave horns just nests for birds, Everything became so absurd, The day... Bell System... died. So bye, bye, Ma Bell, why did you die? We get static from Sprint and echo from MCI, "Our local calls have us in hock!" we all cry. Oh Ma Bell why did you have to die? Ma Bell why did you have to die? We were singing: Bye, bye, Ma Bell, why did you die? We get static from Sprint and echo from MCI, "Our local calls have us in hock!" we all cry. Oh Ma Bell why did you have to die? ------------------------ [Moderator's Note: Thank you again Lauren for the many instances of pleasure this song has given us in the Digest! For our newer readers, I would note that Lauren is a charter member of the Digest mailing list; he has been part of the group since opening day in 1981. PAT] ------------------------------ End of TELECOM Digest V13 #465 ******************************   Received: from delta.eecs.nwu.edu by mintaka.lcs.mit.edu id ab12484; 12 Jul 93 6:25 EDT Received: by delta.eecs.nwu.edu id AA28938 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4 for telecomlist-outbound); Mon, 12 Jul 1993 03:43:48 -0500 Received: by delta.eecs.nwu.edu id AA07784 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4 for telecomlist); Mon, 12 Jul 1993 03:42:47 -0500 Date: Mon, 12 Jul 1993 03:42:47 -0500 From: TELECOM Moderator Message-Id: <199307120842.AA07784@delta.eecs.nwu.edu> To: telecom@eecs.nwu.edu Subject: TELECOM Digest V13 #466 TELECOM Digest Mon, 12 Jul 93 03:42:45 CDT Volume 13 : Issue 466 Inside This Issue: Moderator: Patrick A. Townson Re: Cell Phone Fraud Losses Triple in a Year (Rob Boudrie) Re: Cell Phone Fraud Losses Triple in a Year (John R. Levine) Re: Cell Phone Fraud Losses Triple in a Year (Raj Sanmugam) Re: Cell Phone Fraud Losses Triple in a Year (Eric Varsanyi) "It's the law" (Garrett Wollman) Re: Kerberized Cellular Phones (Andrew R. Ghali) Re: Access to Toll Records (Alan Westrope) Re: Access to Toll Records (Daniel Burstein) Who Was Randy Barrow? (Brian T. Vita) Re: Collect Calls and Call Forwarding (Douglas W. Martin) Re: Future of ISDN (Arthur Marsh) Re: Call Forward to a 1-800 Number (Joe Pace) Re: Step-by-Step Offices (Tad Cook) ---------------------- TELECOM Digest is an e-journal devoted mostly -- but not exclusively -- to discussions on voice telephony. The Digest is a not-for-profit public service published frequently by Patrick Townson Associates. PTA markets a no-surcharge telephone calling card and a no monthly fee 800 service. In addition, we are resellers of AT&T's Software Defined Network. For a detailed discussion of our services, write and ask for the file 'products'. The Digest is delivered at no charge by email to qualified subscribers on any electronic mail service connected to the Internet. To join the mail- ing list, write and tell us how you qualify: telecom-request@eecs.nwu.edu. All article submissions MUST be sent to our email address: telecom@eecs. nwu.edu -- NOT as replies to comp.dcom.telecom. Back issues and numerous other telephone-related files of interest are available from the Telecom Archives, using anonymous ftp lcs.mit.edu. Login anonymous, then 'cd telecom-archives'. At the present time, the Digest is also ported to Usenet at the request of many readers there, where it is known as 'comp.dcom.telecom'. Use of the Digest does not require the use of our products and services. The two are separate. All articles are the responsibility of the individual authors. Organi- zations listed, if any, are for identification purposes only. The Digest is compilation-copyrighted, 1993. **DO NOT** cross-post articles between the Digest and other Usenet or alt newsgroups. Do not compile mailing lists from the net-addresses appearing herein. Send tithes and love offerings to PO Box 1570, Chicago, IL 60690. :) Phone: 312-465-2700. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: rboudrie@chpc.org (Rob Boudrie) Subject: Re: Cell Phone Fraud Losses Triple in a Year Organization: Center For High Perf. Computing of WPI; Marlboro Ma Date: Sun, 11 Jul 1993 21:44:27 GMT > I beleive more than 15% of a provider's cost goes toward fraud. This is hard to quantify, and I suspect it does not consider a few things: Fraud costs are NOT the sum total of the charges that would rightfully be owed for the unpaid calls. The fraud costs are: Costs of calls which would have otherwise been made with a toll paid to the cellular provider in the absence of fraud. (Many such calls probably would NOT have been made legitimately if that were the only option.) Costs of legitimate calls which could not be made because the bandwidth in a cell was clogged with fradulent calls. Plus indirect costs: Cost of anti-fraud program; Cost of collection and prosecution; Note: These costs are debatable with no clear answer. When totalling the amount burgularly costs the US, do we include the cost of every door lock and burgular alarm? Plus very indirect costs: Cost of business lost because potential customers are afraid of being defrauded. Workplace productivity lost while people discuss this issue on Usenet. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 11 Jul 93 10:55 EDT From: johnl@iecc.com (John R. Levine) Subject: Re: Cell Phone Fraud Losses Triple in a Year Organization: I.E.C.C. >> Judges *make* law. It's the law. > They don't make law. It's a floor wax! It's a breath mint! No, it's both! Seriously, the Congress, the executive, and judges make law. It's part of the deliberate tension among the three branches of the government. In many cases, the Congress will punt lawmaking to other branches. For example, the copyright law declares that there is something called "fair use" but doesn't say what it is, letting the precise definition be hammered out in case law. (This isn't just buck-passing -- it often makes sense when they reasonably can't foresee all of a law's applications; under the older more specific copyright law software cases were being decided under a 1909 precedent involving player piano rolls.) Also, a lot of the civil law (lawsuits as opposed to than criminal prosecution) is based on common law precedents going back to medieval England. The executive gets involved by making regulations that implement various laws. That's most of what's in the Federal Register. And the courts get involved at the other end by interpreting the Constitution to forbid or require various laws. There are also various creative readings of laws either to cover an area (depending on how you look at it) that the congress didn't intend to cover, or that they would have covered had they been aware of it at the time. This is where most of the complaints about activist judges arise. For example, one of this year's hot topics is the use of the RICO law that was intended to aid prosecution of organized crime to attack groups like Operation Rescue. Thus endeth the civics lesson. So, anyway, does anyone know the actual issues in the cellular fraud case in question and on what the judge based his decision? Regards, John Levine, johnl@iecc.com, {spdcc|ima|world}!iecc!johnl ------------------------------ From: lmcrajy@noah.ericsson.se (Raj Sanmugam) Subject: Re: Cell Phone Fraud Losses Triple in a Year Reply-To: lmcrajy@noah.ericsson.se Organization: Ericsson Communication Inc. Date: Sun, 11 Jul 1993 21:34:11 GMT Historically, when 25% of the subscribers in Holland refused to pay their bills an authentication scheme was introduced, all the mobiles were re-called and upgraded with the necessary changes and fraud was reduced to a manageable level. So, while Steve's concerns are understandable I would agree with the Moderator that something could be worked out between the carriers and the mobile manufacturers. I have heard figures nearing a billion in telecom fraud. Moreover, most mobile manufacturers have already developed dual mode phones which has authentication schemes. So, upgrading the analog phones should not cost that much more as it would be cheaper to reuse the technology. Raj ------------------------------ From: ewv@craycos.com (Eric Varsanyi) Subject: Re: Cell Phone Fraud Losses Triple in a Year Organization: Cray Computer Corporation Date: Mon, 12 Jul 93 06:34:40 GMT This is pretty sad. I called Cellular One (my carrier here in CO) and asked about LA. My prefix (a small one in Colorado Springs) is completely blocked in LA. They offered to pay ALL my roaming charges (setup and calls) with PacTel Cellular on a credit card arrangement (I assume they would just credit my account). Seems like a good deal for me anyway. He told me that it was cheaper for them to give me free service than keep my prefix open and be defrauded. Scary. I asked about other markets, NY is the same as LA but at this point those are the only two that are roaming blocked from certain prefixes (from my cellular anyway). When I asked what the solution was he said they would keep giving away free calls until the digital standard took over. Based on this data I'm thinking that the carriers are going to anything they can to switch to a decent system ASAP, even if it means killing the installed base. Eric Varsanyi ewv@vars.com ------------------------------ From: Garrett.Wollman@UVM.EDU (Garrett Wollman) Subject: "It's the Law" Organization: University of Vermont, EMBA Computer Facility Date: Sun, 11 Jul 1993 23:42:54 GMT (Sorry for extending this overly-long thread...) In article andreww@defiance.vut.edu.au (Andrew Watts) writes: > Legislation is law. And it's made by politicians. Judges interpret the > law as they see it, and set legal precidents. They don't make law. Legislation, when passed according to the established procedures, is statutory law. Statutes, when interpreted by government agencies, turn into regulatory law. Statutes, Regulations, and the Constitution, when interpreted by courts, turn into Common Law (except in Louisiana). This distinction can cause some confusion to people who watch, for example, the US Supreme Court. When the Constitution is silent or unspecific about some issue, the justices can and do rely on our pre-Revolutionary heritage of British common law, a significant amount of which is still in effect here (except in Louisiana). In any event, the decisions of the Second Circuit Court of Appeals in New York are no less law than statutes passed by Congress. (Except, of course, that the Law of the Land as the Second Circuit sees it does not necessarily apply in the Ninth Circuit.) Disclaimer: my father is Deputy in Charge at the Reno divisional office of the US District Court for the District of Nevada. Garrett A. Wollman wollman@emba.uvm.edu uvm-gen!wollman UVM disagrees. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 12 Jul 93 01:13:48 EDT From: Andrew R. Ghali Subject: Re: Kerberized Cellular Phones In article , Andrew_Marc_Greene@ frankston.com writes: > Kerberos was designed for insecure systems. (Just how insecure? The > root password for public Project Athena workstations is public > knowlege.) Your (or your telephone's) password is what makes you > trusted (well, actually, it's your session key, which is transmitted > encrypted in a trapdoor function of your password); your IP (or other) > address is irrelevant to the security of the system. I from my experience with AFS and Kerberos tickets here (which is slightly tangental) Kerberos-style (actually, just the query/challenge part) authentication seems like a workable system. Tickets would be tougher to manage, especially if you turn the phone off, and hence unnecessary. The abbreviated query/challenge system should go something like this: Phone: "Hi, I'm NNN-NXX-XXXX, I'd like to make a call" Cell: "Oh yeah, prove to me that you are NNN-NXX-XXXX. Here is a session key encoded using your ESN, decode it, encode the number you want to call with it and send it back" Phone: "OK, here is the number I want to call encoded with the session key" Cell: "Looks good, here's your call, encoded with the current session key. Enjoy." Sorry for the simplicity/layman's terms -- the official Kerberos documentation is much more detailed and tougher to read and provides more functionality. Note, however, that this allows a unique "session key" that can be used to encode the digital conversation as a "freebie." Note that the ESN is never transmitted -- you have to pry it out of the physical phone, and that the entire algorithm could be implemented in the firmware of phone quite simply. On the land end, the phone's number has to be translated to the "home" system if roaming, which then has to contacted by the local system, and then the challenge is performed by the home system. It doesn't seem that this system would be too hard to implement by a new cellular carrier, who could offer better security (digital encryption of the conversation) at a lower rate because he won't have to deal with the fraud problem. Or am I just being naive? Andrew ------------------------------ From: awestrop@nyx.cs.du.edu (Alan Westrope) Subject: Re: Access to Toll Records Date: Mon, 12 Jul 1993 02:00:00 GMT LSREEVES@delphi.com recently wrote: > Two programs aired on PBS in 1992, "Nova" and "Adam Smith" dealt with > privacy and access to personal information. In both programs, the > example of viewing then V.P. Dan Quayle's credit report was used. > In the Adam Smith program, a person named Jeffery Rothfeder used his > "computer" to access Quayle's credit report. > What's going on here? If you really want to learn how Rothfeder accomplished this (along with other interesting stuff), you should read his book: AUTHOR : Rothfeder, Jeffrey. TITLE : Privacy for sale : how computerization has made everyone's private life an open secret New York : Simon & Schuster, c1992. 224 p. ; 25 cm. Includes bibliographical references and index. Briefly, most of it was accomplished by getting in contact with people of dubious ethics who used social engineering, payola, etc., rather than by the hacker/cracker/phreak/telecom-wizard stereotypes that the media loves to sensationalize. I found the book enjoyable, informative and, of course, frightening, although I doubt that its revelations would come as a surprise to most Digest readers. Alan Westrope awestrop@nyx.cs.du.edu adwestro@ouray.denver.colorado.edu ------------------------------ From: dannyb@panix.com (Daniel Burstein) Subject: Re: Access to Toll Records Date: 11 Jul 1993 08:26:47 -0400 Organization: PANIX Public Access Internet and Unix, NYC There is (or at least may be) another route to accessing a person's long distance telephone ("toll") records. Earlier discussions in the TELECOM Digest claim that under the consent decree that broke up AT&T and gave more or less equal access to all inter-exchange carriers, an interesting aside was developed. Apparently (and I haven't independently verified this) any long distance carrier has access to the long distance calling records of any customer. This way the carrier can make marketing decisions and direction. Note that this allows carrier xyz to get your records, even though you're hooked up to abc. -If- this is true, then the number of people with access to your records goes up dramatically. BTW, what you consider to be -your- phone records are actually the telco business records, and they have -tremendous- options in releasing them to whomever they wish (i.e. the local gendarmes do -NOT- need a warrant to get your records. the telco -may- demand a warrant, but they can just as easily hand them over without legal restriction. but that's a story for another day or for alt.privacy or comp.risks ...) dannyb@panix.com [Moderator's Note: You are largely correct, but I think most telcos do require legal service be made upon them before releasing records about their customers to government authorities. And although various carriers can get the toll records of customers billed via the local telco (they cannot, obviously, demand that a carrier doing its own billing turn over its records for marketing purposes), I believe there are criminal penalties involved with the misuse of the information or its resale as it might tend to identify any one customer to unauthorized parties. This is much the way the credit bureaus are governed. Anyone who is a subscriber can use their computer and modem to pull credit bureau files for *legitimate business reasons*. But pulling a file merely to satisfy your own curiosity, or because you are running your own thing on the side (selling bureau reports) is illegal, as is (assuming you are otherwise authorized to pull credit bureau files) pulling your own personal bureau file at any time. Many Trans-Union subscribers have a large wall poster hanging right above the bureau machine: a picture of Uncle Sam with his top hat and striped clothing, a frown on his face and fingers covering his lips. The caption says "Uncle Sam wants you to keep the trust; don't divulge privileged information; don't abuse credit bureau files." I think the long distance carriers are under many of the same constraints: They get the information they need in order to conduct their business; if they were to start selling lists of the phone calls people made to the general public or other businesses they would get in a lot of trouble. PAT] ------------------------------ Date: 11 Jul 93 10:49:12 EDT From: Brian T. Vita <70702.2233@CompuServe.COM> Subject: Who Was Randy Barrow? > Remember former Digest participant Randy Barrow from three years ago? > Don't forget the example made of Randy for other AT&T employees! For those of us new to the Digest, how about a brief recap? Brian Vita CSS, Inc. [Moderator's Note: Very briefly, Randy was a customer service represen- tative for AT&T here in the Chicago area, and a regular reader of this Digest. He wrote articles frequently. We had a thread going about a telemarketing firm here in Chicago which, while doing nothing illegal, was still a sleazy outfit. Randy used his position to pull the files on that customer and report the details of their calling patterns here. He did *not* reveal what they were paying for service, or even the exact places they called. He merely reported their calling trends over the few months prior, ie 'they make a lot of calls to the east coast in the morning, and start calling the west coast later in the day ...'; that sort of thing. AT&T Security found out he had passed along even that limited information on the customer and the company fired him. His union steward grieved, and the appeals went on for several months but the company prevailed. It was reported here in detail at the time. Unlike Randy (or other employees of AT&T) I have no agreements with the company to remain silent about things I hear ... Randy and others do as a condition of their employment. He was out on the street a day or two after his article appeared here. The information was really blaise as that stuff goes, and it was very unfortunate. At the time I quoted a security guy (we have many among our mailing list readers) who said 'AT&T employees need to be shown an example of how the company responds when proprietary information like customer records are revealed to outsiders ..." Randy made a good example alright. :( I still feel badly they canned him for such relatively innocent comments. PAT] ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 11 Jul 93 08:20:36 -0700 From: martin@cod.nosc.mil (Douglas W. Martin) Subject: Re: Collect Calls and Call Forwarding If I have calls forwarded from my home, 223-xxxx to my work number, 553-xxxx, and my home number gets a collect call, which number is billed? I cannot accept collect calls at work, but am expecting to need to receive some collect calls during the day. It would seem that if the calling party calls collect to my home number, and the call is forwarded, that the home number would be billed. At least, this is what I want to happen. What actually happens in this case? Doug Martin martin@nosc.mil [Moderator's Note: The number the operator or automated equipment at the point of call origination *thought it was reaching*, i.e. the number being forwarded is where the bill goes. The person at the number where calls are being forwarded might get confused by hearing an operator ask if he will accept the charges. He can say yes, but he still won't be billed. So you are correct; your home number would be billed. Explain this to your company PBX operator, etc. PAT] ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 11 Jul 1993 23:47:40 +1000 From: Arthur@cswamp.apana.org.au (Arthur Marsh) Subject: Re: Future of ISDN Reply-To: Arthur@cswamp.apana.org.au Organization: Camelot Swamp bulletin board, Hawthorndene Sth Australia Martin McCormick wrote: > I remember hearing a telecommunications-related program on > Radio Australia during the mid eighties that discussed ISDN One Radio Australia broadcast that I remember was an interview where the then Telecom head honcho, Mel Ward, suggesting that ISDN Basic Rate would be ideal for people working from home. Not at the rates currently charged, though. Origin: Camelot Swamp MJCNA, Hawthorndene, Sth Australia (8:7000/8) Camelot Swamp bbs, data: +61-8-370-2133 reply to user@cswamp.apana.org.au ------------------------------ From: pace@usace.mil (Joe Pace) Subject: Re: Call Forward to a 1-800 Number Organization: US Army Corps of Engineers, Sacramento District Date: Sun, 11 Jul 93 16:53:51 GMT I tried calling 800-235-1414 from our Intecom PBX and rather than reporting my phone number it gave the POTS number of the Pacific Bell circuit the call went out on. Do some PBX's forward the internal numbers to phone company switches, or is this not possible using conventional phone lines? Joe Pace UNIX/Networking Analyst US Army Corps of Engineers pace@usace.mil Sacramento District JPPACE@UCDAVIS.BITNET ------------------------------ Subject: Re: Step-by-Step Offices Date: Sun, 11 Jul 93 10:21:56 PDT From: tad@ssc.com (Tad Cook) lsp@Panix.Com (Lee S. Parks) writes: > Well believe it or not, right in the heart of lower Manhattan is a > step-by-step exchange in the Broad Street CO. It services 212-820 and > I'm sure what other prefixes. If you have DID (as my office does) in > 212-820 it takes over 20 seconds to complete the call. NY Tel gives > conflicting dates as to when this old switch will be replaced. Is it REALLY an old stepper? I did a search for 212-820 in the NPA shareware program that has been discussed before on this forum, and discovered that the Broad Street CO is the southernmost exchange in Manhatten. Here are the other prefixes that are in the same building: 208 383 509 635 806 232 422 510 668 809 248 425 511 701 825 269 440 514 709 855 344 480 530 742 902 352 482 558 747 908 357 483 607 770 943 361 487 612 785 952 363 495 623 797 968 How could this HUGE exchange, with a potential capacity of perhaps 460,000 lines, in area with probably more phones per acre than anywhere else in the country, be served by an old stepper? Or is there more than one switch in that building? tad@ssc.com (if it bounces, use 3288544@mcimail.com) Tad Cook | Packet Amateur Radio: | Home Phone: Seattle, WA | KT7H @ N7DUO.WA.USA.NA | 206-527-4089 ------------------------------ End of TELECOM Digest V13 #466 ******************************   Received: from delta.eecs.nwu.edu by mintaka.lcs.mit.edu id aa03390; 13 Jul 93 0:03 EDT Received: by delta.eecs.nwu.edu id AA03487 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4 for telecomlist-outbound); Mon, 12 Jul 1993 21:31:27 -0500 Received: by delta.eecs.nwu.edu id AA02561 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4 for telecomlist); Mon, 12 Jul 1993 21:30:03 -0500 Date: Mon, 12 Jul 1993 21:30:03 -0500 From: TELECOM Moderator Message-Id: <199307130230.AA02561@delta.eecs.nwu.edu> To: telecom@eecs.nwu.edu Subject: TELECOM Digest V13 #467 TELECOM Digest Mon, 12 Jul 93 21:29:45 CDT Volume 13 : Issue 467 Inside This Issue: Moderator: Patrick A. Townson CFP 2nd Feature Interaction Workshop (H. Velthuijsen) Mitel Announces Largest Individual Sale in Company History (Paul Robinson) Has Power Company Broken Telco Monopoly on "Last Mile" (Robert Monaghan) Re: Italian Numbering Plan (Luca Parisi) End User Common Line Charges (EUCL) (Bob Schwartz) The Last A/B Phone Booths in the United Kingdom? (Peter Ilieve via N Allen) Escort Digital Cordless Telephone (David I. Dalva) Re: Electronics Now Telephone Projects (Ray Normandeau) Telecomic - Teenage Phun? (David Leibold) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 12 Jul 1993 13:27:43 +0000 (GMT) From: H.Velthuijsen@research.ptt.nl (Velthuijsen H.) Subject: CFP 2nd Feature Interaction Workshop Organization: PTT Research, The Netherlands CALL FOR PARTICIPATION Second International Workshop on Feature Interactions in Telecommunications Software Systems Amsterdam, The Netherlands May 9-10, 1994 DESCRIPTION This workshop is the second in a series, whose mission is to encourage researchers from a variety of computer science specialties (software engineering, protocol engineering, distributed artificial intel- ligence, formal techniques, software testing, and distributed systems, among others) to apply their techniques to the feature interaction problem that arises in building telecommunications software systems (see the back page for a description of the problem). We welcome papers on avoiding, detecting, and/or resolving feature interactions using either analytical or structural approaches. Submissions are encouraged in (but are not limited to) the following topic areas: - Classification of feature interactions. - Modeling, reasoning, and testing techniques for detecting feature interactions. - Software platforms and architecture designs to aid in avoiding, detecting, and resolving feature interactions. - Tools and methodologies for promoting software compatibility and extensibility. - Mechanisms for managing feature interactions throughout the service life-cyle. - Management of feature interactions in PCS, ISDN, and Broadband services, as well as IN services. - Management of feature interactions in various of the operations support functions such as Service Negotiation, Service Management, and Service Assurance. - Feature Interactions and their potential impact on system Security and Safety. - Environments and automated tools for related problems in other software systems. - Management of Feature Interactions in various proposed architectures such as TMN, INA, ROSA, CASSIOPEIA, SERENITE, or PLATINA. FORMAT We hope to promote a dialogue among researchers in various related areas, as well as the designers and builders of telecommunications software. To this end, the workshop will have sessions for paper presentations, including relatively long discussion periods. Panel discussions and tool demonstrations are also planned. ATTENDANCE Workshop attendance will be limited to 90 people. Attendance will be by invitation only. Prospective attendees are asked to submit either a paper (maximum 5000 words) or a single page description of their interests and how they relate to the workshop. About 16-20 of the attendees will be asked to present talks. We will strive for an equal mix of theoretical results and practical experiences. Papers will be published in a conference proceedings. SUBMISSIONS Please send five copies of your full original paper or interest description to: Wiet Bouma PTT Research, Dr. Neher Laboratories PO Box 421 or St. Paulusstraat 4 2260 AK Leidschendam 2264 XZ Leidschendam The Netherlands The Netherlands E-mail: L.G.Bouma@research.ptt.nl Tel: +31 70 332 5457 FAX: +31 70 332 6477 IMPORTANT DATES: November 15, 1993: Submission of contributions. January 15, 1993: Notification of acceptance. February 15, 1993: Submission of camera-ready versions. WORKSHOP CO-CHAIRPERSONS Wiet Bouma & Hugo Velthuijsen (PTT, The Netherlands) PROGRAM COMMITTEE Chair: E. Jane Cameron (Bellcore, USA) Jan Bergstra (CWI and University of Amsterdam, The Netherlands) Ralph Blumenthal (Bellcore, USA) Kong Eng Cheng (Royal Melbourne Institute of Technology, Australia) Bernie Cohen (City University of London, UK) Fulvio Faraci (CSELT, Italy) Robert France (Florida Atlantic University, USA) Steve German (GTE, USA) David Gill (MITRE, USA) Richard Kemmerer (UCSB, USA) Eric Kuisch (PTT Research, The Netherlands) Victor Lesser (University of Massachusetts, USA) Yow-Jian Lin (Bellcore, USA) Luigi Logrippo (University of Ottawa, Canada) Robert Milner (BNR, UK) Leo Motus (Tallinn Technical University, Estonia) Jacques Muller (CNET, France) Jan-Olof Nordenstam (ELLEMTEL, Sweden) Stott Parker (UCLA, USA) Henrikas Pranevitchius (Kaunas University of Technology, Lithuania) Lynne Presley (Bellcore, USA) Jean-Bernard Stefani (CNET, France) Greg Utas (BNR, Canada) Yasushi Wakahara (KDD R&D Laboratories, Japan) Ron Wojcik (BellSouth, USA) Pamela Zave (AT&T Bell Laboratories, USA) WORKSHOP STATEMENT The feature interaction problem has been a major obstacle to the rapid deployment of new telephone services. Telecommunications software is huge, real-time, and distributed; adding new features to a tele- communication system, like adding new functionalities to any large software system, can be very difficult. Each new feature may interact with many existing features, causing customer annoyance or total system breakdown. Traditionally, interactions were detected and re- solved on a feature by feature basis by experts who are knowledgeable on all existing features. As the number of features grows to satisfy diverse needs of customers, managing feature interactions in a single administrative domain is approaching incomprehensible complexity. In a future marketplace where features deployed in the network may be developed by different operating companies and their associated ven- dors, the traditional approach is no longer feasible. How to detect, resolve, or even prevent the occurrence of feature interactions in an open network becomes an important research issue. The feature interaction problem is not unique to telecommunications software; similar problems are encountered in any long-lived software system that requires frequent changes and additions to its func- tionality. Techniques in many related areas appear to be applicable to the management of feature interactions. Software methodologies for extensibility and compatibility, for example, could be useful for providing a structured design that can prevent many feature inter- actions from occurring. Formal specification, verification, and tes- ting techniques, being widely used in protocol engineering and software engineering, contribute a lot to the detection of inter- actions. Several causes of the problem, such as aliasing, timing, and the distribution of software components, are similar to issues in distributed systems. Cooperative problem solving, a promising approach for resolving interactions at run time, resembles distributed planning and resolution of conflicting subgoals among multiple agents in the area of distributed artificial intelligence. This workshop aims to provide an opportunity for participants to share ideas and experiences in their respective fields, and to apply their expertise to the feature interaction problem. Hugo Velthuijsen PTT Research Phone: +31 70 332 6258 P.O. box 421 Fax: +31 70 332 6477 2260 AK Leidschendam, The Netherlands Email: H.Velthuijsen@research.ptt.nl ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 12 Jul 1993 04:59:50 -0400 (EDT) Reply-To: 0005066432@MCIMAIL.COM Subject: Mitel Announces Largest Individual Sale in Company History From: Paul Robinson Organization: Tansin A. Darcos & Company, Silver Spring, MD USA Copied from the Mitel List MITEL ANNOUNCES LARGEST INDIVIDUAL SALE IN COMPANY HISTORY FOR SUPPLY OF 175 GX5000 SYSTEMS TO CHINA KANATA, ONTARIO, July 8, 1993 - Mitel Corporation announced today that its Public Switching Division, in association with Mitsui and Co. (Canada) Ltd., has signed the first in a series of contracts for the supply of 175 GX5000 public switching systems over the next two years valued at a total of $24.0 million (Cdn). This series of contracts represents the largest individual sale in the Company's history. The contract has been signed with the Hunan Province Countryside Telephone Exchange Bureau. An initial shipment of 73,000 lines will be completed by March of 1994. All of the systems will be manufactured at the Company's facility in Kanata, Ontario. This contract, enables Mitel to successfully enter the largest public switching market in the Far East, a market with an expected growth rate of 75 million public switching central office lines by the year 2000. In April of this year, Mitel created a separate sales organization to focus on the Asian market. John Millard, Mitel's President and Chief Executive Officer, commented, "This is an extremely exciting opportunity for Mitel. China's economic growth rate and its emphasis on developing the country's telecommunications capabililities make this area a major priority for Mitel. In fact, the Company is currently holding discussions with representatives from a number of other telephone companies within China for future business." During the first year of the contract, Mitel will establish an in-country maintenance and training facility for servicing its hardware. Mitel's Public Switching Division began operations in 1988. To date, it has installed GX5000 systems in over 15 countries around the world including the rural telephone market in North America. Mitel is an international manufacturer of business telecommunications systems, public switching systems, semiconductor and PC communications products, network enhancement and gateway products, and systems development software components. The Company, which had revenues of $423 million (Cdn) for its 1993 fiscal year, has sold in excess of 168,000 PBX systems in over 80 countries, more than any other PBX manufacturer. Contact: Bonnie Perrigard Director, Public & Investor Relations Mitel Corporation (613) 592-2122 ext. 1125 Rob Dietrich VP, Government & Public Relations Mitel Corporation (613) 592-2122 ext. 4070 ------------- Paul Robinson - TDARCOS@MCIMAIL.COM ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 12 Jul 93 11:39:31 CST From: Robert Monaghan Subject: Has Power Company Broken Telco Monopoly on the "Last Mile"? Just when I was convinced that the means of bringing datacom to the consumer would be an inevitable battle between two corporate monopoly giants -- the BOCs and the Cable Industry -- another monopoly joins in -- the Power Company! Here are some details from a blurb in "ISCET Update" of June 1993 p. 8 (for non-certified electronics technicians, that is the International Society of CETs): "Spread Sprectrum Carrier" The Spread Spectrum Carrier by Intellon Corporation has provided General Electric Meter and Control with technology that enables electric meters to send and receive data over the same AC power lines that provide electricity. Spread Spectrum Carrier was developed to provide low cost, high-speed, high-reliability communications over noisy power lines and radio frequencies. GE's UCNet system will provide a two-way communication between utilities and customers. The system will implement programs for real-time pricing, load control and curtailment, and interruptable rates. The powerline communications standard for the Electronic Industries Assoc.'s Consumer Electronics Bus (CEBus) will ensure that compatible end-use equipment will be available from a number of vendors. Eventually utilities will be able to link with their customers and provide them with choices about energy use. Refrigerator defrosting, and drying cycles of the dishwasher and clothes dryer would trigger these functions automatically when energy costs are low." Given that virtually every consumer in America is somehow wired up to some power grid system, and that GE is one of the largest corporations in America (1% of the GDP in sales), it follows that they have the technology and clout to do a lot more with this high-speed, high-reliability networking system than just read our electric meters. Many of the low end automatic alarm, Point of Sale credit card validation, etc could conceivably be drained off of the other potential suppliers (ISDN D-channel, X.25 packet networks). Other services, such as stock quotations and EFS/ATM machine private line replacements, also come to mind. The silicon-based spread spectrum technology may also get so cheap, if it can be economically inserted into your consumer electric meter, as to greatly expand the potential for this technology too. If the transmitter power is below FCC minimums (e.g., 15 milliwatts with a given antenna length) we might also see some alternative broad-band telecom uses developing as well. An equally intriguing possibility is a computer network run over the powerline using spread spectrum, linked to anybody this side of the nearest transformer, and using such a cheap chipset as a replacement LAN card/NIC/cabling. Regards, BoB Monaghan vb7r0027@vm.cis.smu.edu ------------------------------ Subject: Re: Italian Numbering Plan Date: Tue, 13 Jul 93 1:04:19 CEST From: Luca Parisi Paolo Bellutta reported: > Well, when I dial my friends in Italy I dial 13 to 14 digits, and I > use AT&T as long distance company. And Pat, the Moderator, replied: > let's see if its *really* more than 12 or if there is some local > code on your end, etc that is being counted as well. PAT] I must reinforce Pat's guessing. It is most likely that Paolo included in the figure he quoted all the digits he dialed, while we are talking of the CC+NN part of the number only (that is, starting from 39+). The current Numbering Plan in Italy is best described as a complete mess, but is states clearly that "The maximum lenght of a National Number is 9 (nine) digits". Given that the CC is two digits long, this accounts for up to 11 digits. The awful part of it is that the maximum lenght is specified, but the minimum is not. Therefore, in Rome there are valid telephone numbers of 4 digits (Railroad Information, e.g. is 4775) as well as residential users with numbers of 6-7-8 digits. The areacode for Rome is "6", but there are areacodes of up to 3 digits (half of them unused). On T-time we should switch to a closed, 10-digits numbering plan. Luca Parisi Rome, Italy. ------------------------------ Subject: End User Common Line Charges (EUCL). From: bob@bci.nbn.com (Bob Schwartz) Date: Mon, 12 Jul 93 15:21:30 PDT Organization: Bill Correctors, Inc., Marin County, California I'm looking for anyone who knows about End User Common Line Charges (EUCL's) for an ongoing project. Does anyone have a good working understanding of them: When they should or should not be applied? Has anyone ever been able to have one removed? Please contact me at (415)488-9000 or bob@bci.nbn.com. Bob Schwartz bob@bci.nbn.com Bill Correctors, Inc. +1 415 488 9000 Marin County, California ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 12 Jul 93 18:10:38 EDT From: ae446@freenet.carleton.ca (Nigel Allen) Subject: The Last A/B Phone Booths in the United Kingdom? Reply-To: ae446@freenet.carleton.ca I found the following article by Peter Ilieve in the uk.telecom newsgroup. From: peter@memex.co.uk (Peter Ilieve) Subject: Old phone box trivia Organization: Memex Information Systems Ltd, East Kilbrde, Scotland Date: Mon, 12 Jul 1993 12:40:30 GMT Iseem to remember a query here some time ago about old button A/B phone boxes. I think I even posted something saying I knew there was recently one still on Rum but I can't find any trace of that now. This Sunday's Sunday Times Scotland has a piece about an old button A/B box on the island of Muck. It mentions that there are 5 in total, on Muck, Rum, Soay, Canna and Papa Stoer (all islands). They are now being phased out, because they only accept the old 10p pieces and these are no longer legal tender (or won't be soon). The main part of the story is about a local woman who keeps a big jar of old 10p coins and has put a note in the box to say she has them. The photo shows a bell push mounted on the panel above the phone so this box may have some sort of party line arrangement like the one on Rum. The Rum box had something, it might even have been a crank handle, for getting dial tone and had a note warning you that if you heard some buzzing noise you should get off the line soon as it meant someone else was wanting to use it. So now you know. If you want to use one of these relics get on the ferry fast, it says you have less than a month left :-) A second order trivia question is which Soay has the box, there are several. Peter Ilieve peter@memex.co.uk ----------- Nigel Allen, Toronto, Ontario, Canada ae446@freenet.carleton.ca ------------------------------ From: dave@TIS.COM (David I. Dalva) Subject: Escort Digital Cordless Telephone Date: 12 Jul 1993 22:14:54 GMT Organization: Trusted Information Systems, Inc. Has anybody here had any experience with the new Escort (Cincinnati Microwave) digital cordless telephone that lists for $399? How does it compare to the Tropez? Dave ------------------------------ Subject: Re: Electronics Now Telephone Projects From: ray.normandeau@factory.com (Ray Normandeau) Date: 12 Jul 93 18:01:00 GMT Organization: Invention Factory's BBS - New York City, NY - 212-274-8298v.32bis Reply-To: ray.normandeau@factory.com (Ray Normandeau) > The other project is a phone line selector, with four phone lines > input, going to a single line output (such as an answering machine, > etc). This is not to be confused with devices to decode a distinctive > ringing cadence; this device just picks up the first call on the > incoming lines. This should also be terrific to connect a fax machine to a PC fax card so that a fax machine can more easily be used as a scanner. ------------------------------ Subject: Telecomic - Teenage Phun? From: woody Date: Mon, 12 Jul 1993 01:19:04 -0400 The 10 July 1993 episode of the Walnut Cove comic (seen in {The Toronto Star} among other newspapers) had a storyline in which the family phone bill was reviewed, and it turned out that the family son (Thurman) was making a number of billable calls to other "girls". The punchline was "Strange that so many of them live in the 900 area code..." David Leibold [Mpderator's Note: A nice joke, but are you just now getting it in the papers up there? We had that one some time ago here in the Digest, and it has been done with variations in other comic strips a few times over the past few years. Funny though! :) PAT] ------------------------------ End of TELECOM Digest V13 #467 ******************************   Received: from delta.eecs.nwu.edu by mintaka.lcs.mit.edu id aa05568; 13 Jul 93 1:12 EDT Received: by delta.eecs.nwu.edu id AA01332 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4 for telecomlist-outbound); Mon, 12 Jul 1993 22:56:59 -0500 Received: by delta.eecs.nwu.edu id AA20492 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4 for telecomlist); Mon, 12 Jul 1993 22:56:01 -0500 Date: Mon, 12 Jul 1993 22:56:01 -0500 From: TELECOM Moderator Message-Id: <199307130356.AA20492@delta.eecs.nwu.edu> To: telecom@eecs.nwu.edu Subject: TELECOM Digest V13 #468 TELECOM Digest Mon, 12 Jul 93 22:56:00 CDT Volume 13 : Issue 468 Inside This Issue: Moderator: Patrick A. Townson Conference With Dorothy Denning: Encrypting Voice and Data (Matthew Lucas) Impairment Levels on T1 Carriers (Albert Chau) NPA Locator Shareware Program Wanted (Curtis Bohl) MCI Outage (Tad Cook) SS7 via PC Card Information Wanted (Robert P. Jaksa) "Oh No! Not This Confused Again ..." (Paul Robinson) International Twist on Adult Group Chat (Greg Trotter) Motorola Cellular Pinout Wanted (Timothy Hu) PRIVACY Forum Information (Lauren Weinstein) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 12 Jul 1993 16:26:13 -0500 From: Matthew Lucas Subject: Conference With Dorothy Denning: Encrypting Voice and Data Conference Announcement: A TeleStrategies Conference with Dr. Dorothy Denning Encrypting Voice and Data: Strategies for the Future Aug. 3-4, 1993 Washington, DC Tuesday, August 3, 1993 8:30-9:00 Registration 9:00-10:30 CRYPTOGRAPHY OVERVIEW The basic concepts of cryptography and encryption, including single-key and publickey, authentication, digital signatures, key negotiation or distribution, and cryptanalysis (code breaking) will be introduced along with the Data Encryption Standard (DES), the RSA public-key system, and the Digital Signature Standard (DSS). The speaker will also discuss the need for encryption and the role of encryption in telephony and communications networks. Dr. Dorothy E. Denning, Professor and Chair of Computer Science, Georgetown University 10:30-10:45 Coffee Break 10:45-11:45 SURVEY OF ENCRYPTION PRODUCTS The speaker will survey commercial hardware and software products that contain encryption capabilities, including the types of products that are available, their relative strengths and weaknesses, and the major vendors. Jim Bidzos, President, RSA Data Security, Inc. 11:45-12:30 CELLULAR ENCRYPTION Cellular calls are especially vulnerable to eavesdropping. PrivaFone's approach, which is interoperable on cellular and land lines, will be described. Digital cellular standards that provide voice privacy and authentication for TDMA or CDMA technologies also will be discussed. Dr. Ming Lee, President, Synacomm Technology Charles Wistar, President, PrivaFone Corp. 12:30-1:45 Hosted Lunch 1:45-2:30 THE CLIPPER AND CAPSTONE CHIPS The Clipper and Capstone Chips are part of a new U.S. technology initiative to provide secure communications and legitimate law enforcement access through a key escrow system. The speakers will describe the initiative, the security functions provided by the chips, and the use of the Clipper Chip in the AT&T Telephone Security Device. William M. Agee, Manager, Secure Communication Systems - Government, AT&T Raymond G. Kammer, Acting Director, National Institute of Standards and Technology 2:30-3:00 BUSINESS CONCERNS WITH ENCRYPTION The speaker will give a snapshot of one computer security program and discuss business concerns with encryption, including practical needs and requirements, organizational constraints, operational concerns, security of the process, and balancing concerns and practical use. Randolph N. Sanovic, Manager of Computer Security Planning, Mobil Corp. 3:00-3:15 Coffee Break 3:15-4:00 USING CRYPTOGRAPHY TO ARCHITECT DISTRIBUTED OPEN SYSTEMS SECURITY: A CASE STUDY Securing networks and computers in a distributed environment presents several new challenges. The speaker will describe Bell Atlantic's enterprise-wide approach to architecting security in such an environment, showing how encryption fits into the design. Ravi Ganesan, Specialist, Security Research and Planning, Bell Atlantic 4:00-5:00 ENCRYPTION IN ELECTRONIC COMMERCE AND ELECTRONIC MAIL Encryption is becoming an integral tool for building secure applications. The speakers will discuss the use of encryption and digital signatures in Electronic Data Interchange (EDI) and Internet Privacy Enhanced Mail (PEM). Michael S. Baum J.D., Principal, Independent Monitoring Dr. Stephen D. Crocker, Vice President, Trusted Information Systems, Inc. 5:00-6:00 Reception Wednesday, August 4, 1993 8:30-10:30 CRYPTOGRAPHY POLICY IN THE U.S. The speakers will discuss the Clipper and Capstone chips, law enforcement needs and the Digital Telephony proposal, export and import of encryption products, international markets, industry growth and competitiveness, and individual privacy. They will also report on the national policy review in progress. Dr. Willis H. Ware, Chair, Computer Systems Security and Privacy Advisory Board (Moderator) Jerry Berman, Executive Director, Electronic Frontier Foundation Clinton C. Brooks, Special Assistant to Director, National Security Agency Alan R. McDonald, Special Assistant (Legal) to the Assistant Director, Technical Services Division, Federal Bureau of Investigation Ilene Rosenthal, General Counsel, Software Publishers Association 10:30-10:45 Coffee Break 10:45-11:30 CRYPTOGRAPHY IN THE EUROPEAN COMMUNITY In the European Community, government controls on cryptography differ across countries and affect achievement of secure open systems and, consequently, achievement of the Open Market and transborder electronic trading. The speaker will summarize the current situation in Europe, describe some of the initiatives to address the issues, and comment on the recent initiatives in the US. Christopher E. Sundt, Business Strategy Manager, ICL Secure Systems 11:30-12:15 THE FUTURE OF CRYPTOGRAPHY IN TELECOMMUNICATIONS Several fast-moving trends in telecommunications demand cryptographic solutions, including wireless transmission, multi-media conferencing, and electronic commerce. As broadcast and multiple access technologies are used increasingly for information transmission, and everyday business is carried out in "cyberspace," structures that ensure privacy, authenticity, and (often) anonymity must become part of the natural landscape. Dr. David P. Maher, Chief Scientist for AT&T Secure Communications Systems, AT&T For complete information call TeleStrategies Inc. at (703) 734-7050. ------------------------------ From: achau@mpr.ca (Albert Chau) Subject: Impairment Levels on T1 Carriers Organization: MPR Teltech Ltd., Burnaby, B.C., Canada Date: Mon, 12 Jul 1993 18:02:00 GMT Does anybody know of any studies that investigated the performance of T1 carriers? I'd like to know what are typical BERs, frequency of slips, jitter induced errors, etc. Thanks for any help. Albert (achau@mprgate.mpr.ca) ------------------------------ From: EXTMO4H@mizzou1.missouri.edu (Missouri 4-H Youth Development Programs) Subject: NPA Locator Shareware Program Wanted Organization: University of Missouri Date: Mon, 12 Jul 93 13:40:28 CDT I'm a recent subscriber to TELECOM Digest. Can someone point me to this shareware program for searching for telephone prefixes? Curtis Bohl Computer Programmer/Analyst extmo4h@mizzou1.missouri.edu 4-H Youth Development Alternate: bohlc@ext.missouri.edu Programs [Moderator's Note: They're around, although I don't have one in the Telecom Archives. What we do have in the archives is a very detailed listing of all city and country codes from around the world broken down by zones. We also have a complete NPA/exchange list for Canada. I've never put one there for the USA because of the sheer volume of data and the limitations on the archives. We do have simple programs in the archives for all USA area codes however. To visit the archives use anonymous ftp lcs.mit.edu, then 'cd telecom-archives'. PAT] ------------------------------ Subject: MCI Outage Date: Sun, 11 Jul 93 19:39:34 PDT From: tad@ssc.com (Tad Cook) I have been getting All Trunks Busy, or sometimes no response at all, when dialing the 800 number for MCI Mail. I tried making a few regular toll calls via MCI, and get the same response. Finally after many attempts at dialing 00 on my line that is served by MCI, I reached an operator. I assumed there was a cable cut affecting Seattle, but she said that the problem was network wide, probably flood or weather related, and should be solved soon. This was about 7:20 PM PDT Sunday night. tad@ssc.com (if it bounces, use 3288544@mcimail.com) Tad Cook | Packet Amateur Radio: | Home Phone: Seattle, WA | KT7H @ N7DUO.WA.USA.NA | 206-527-4089 ------------------------------ From: mci22@class.class.org (MCI) Subject: SS7 via PC Card Information Wanted Date: 12 Jul 1993 15:27:07 GMT Organization: C.L.A.S.S. Cooperative Library Agency for Systems and Services Please send me any information about vendors/products that provide SS7 via a PC (IBM capatible) card. Thanks, Robert P. Jaksa MCI Telecommunications Internet: rjaksa@mcimail.com Systems Eng., 0697/107 2400 N. Glenville Dr. Richardson, TX 75082 ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 12 Jul 1993 09:25:06 -0400 (EDT) Reply-To: 0005066432@MCIMAIL.COM Subject: "Oh no! Not This Confused Again ..." From: Paul Robinson Organization: Tansin A. Darcos & Company, Silver Spring, MD USA > Ball State University's Center for Information and Communications > Sciences (CICS), Muncie, Indiana, is launching a refereed > journal, the ICS Journal. Haven't we had enough trouble with the dual-use of the term 'ATM network'? There is a terminal operating system sold by IBM for use in full-screen and other applications on IBM Mainframes. This system is called Customer Information Control System, but everyone calls it "CICS". IBM has been selling this program for over 20 years. It's used for medium to high-volumes of transactions. Just what we need, another duplicate use of the same acronym in the same industry for two different things. This is almost as bad as Snyder's Potato Chips. Here's that story: Imagine if you will that there were two companies called AT&T or MCI, that went into the telephone business selling service under the identical name. Well, there are two companies selling "Snyder's Potato Chips." "Snyder's of Hanover, PA, Inc." and "Snyders, Inc. of Berlin, PA" Both companies indicate in explicit terms that they are totally unrelated to and will have nothing to do with the other slime. :) Both sell potato chips under the name "Snyder's". This is the kind of confusing situation we need to avoid. Paul Robinson - TDARCOS@MCIMAIL.COM [Moderator's Note: For quite a few years here in Chicago there was a 'Regency Hotel' in no way connected with the Hyatt chain; it was here long before the Hyatt people started any hotel properties in our town. The best way to describe the place was that it was a flophouse hotel, serving a transient, lower class type of tenant in rooms which cost (at the time) about $5 per night. All residents on a floor shared common bathroom/shower facilities, etc. When the Regency Hyatt House opened here, their telephone directory listing "Regency Hyatt" came after the listing for "Regency Hotel". To complicate matters further the flophouse people saw a distinct advantage in having the directory assistance operators confused, so they added an additional item in the directory in subsequent years called "Regency Hotel Reservations Office". Time and time and time again, people from out of town coming to Chicago (vacation, business, etc) would call to make reservations at the Regency Hyatt House; the directory assistance operators would try to be helpful and say to the caller, "...they have a number for reservations, is that what you want?" and of course the caller would say yes it was. They would call the number given by the operator which got them the Regency Hotel (flophouse) instead of the Regency Hyatt House Hotel. The Regency Hotel clerks would cheerfully make a reservation for the out of town guest and inform them that it had to be guarenteed with a credit card charge to which the caller would of course agree. They were perfectly honest about it; gave the address for *their hotel* and in fact set aside rooms as required. Of course when the visitor got to town and told the cab driver to take them to the 'Regency Hotel', they wound up at the one on Michigan Avenue, not the flophouse on Ohio Street. And of course, there was no reservation waiting for them. After sorting out the confusion, they found they were booked at the flophouse hotel. Since the flophouse hotel had given the guest the address and had never claimed to be anything else, their contention was they accepted a reservation in good faith, it was guarenteed and they were unable to refund the deposit. They were sued a few times and never lost once. They'd tell the guest, "if the phone company gave you the wrong phone number to call, then sue the phone company." The Hyatt people tried to stop the Regency Hotel from 'stealing their reservations' and for that matter from using the same name; but the flophouse owners said this was nonsense. They were in business for years before the *nice* Regency opened, and they were incorporated, had business licenses, etc. "Maybe we should sue you to make *you* quit using the name of our hotel," was their reply. Finally the Regency Hyatt House paid the Regency Hotel some unspecified sum of money to change their name to something totally different. PAT] ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 12 Jul 93 02:19 CDT Subject: International Twist on Adult Group Chat From: greg@gallifrey.ucs.uoknor.edu (Greg Trotter) Organization: Gallifrey - Home of the Timelords I wasn't paying much attention when yet another ad for what sounded like an adult 900 chat service came on. They did have my full attention when the number they read off started with '011-' indicating an international call. >From what I was able to pick up and write down, the number was 011-5695-5695. That's their punctuation ... 56 is the country code for Chile. There was no detail saying how much it would cost ... naturally, since it's not a 900 number, and your tolls may vary depending on your carrier. I'd guess that the South American company is collecting a termination fee from the carrier(s) ... what I believe we would call a "Nevada Plan." I thought that that was an interesting twist on the market. Greg Trotter Norman, Oklahoma Internet: greg@gallifrey.ucs.uoknor.edu Fidonet: 1:147/63 Treknet: 87:6012/8009 I don't even represent me. [Moderator's Note: There are a lot of those around. The information provider is given a commission by the long distance carrier who in turn profits from the additional traffic which otherwise would not have been generated. We've discussed this in detail in recent months here. PAT] ------------------------------ From: timhu@ico.isc.com (Timothy Hu) Subject: Motorola Cellular Pinout Wanted Organization: Interactive Systems Corp., Boulder CO Date: Mon, 12 Jul 1993 21:21:04 GMT Can someone point me to a source of information where I can get the pinout of the contacts on the back of a Motorola America Series 875 Cellular phone? Cheers, Timothy Hu timhu@bou.shl.com | The intelligence (or lack of) expressed Interactive Systems Corporation | above does not necessarily reflect Resource Solutions International | that of anyone else. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 12 Jul 93 18:56 PDT From: lauren@vortex.com (Lauren Weinstein) Subject: PRIVACY Forum Information Pat, Here's the current information blurb (as you requested) regarding the PRIVACY Forum. Subscription, archive, etc. details are all included. --Lauren-- >>> What is the Internet PRIVACY Forum? <<< The Internet PRIVACY Forum is a moderated digest for the discussion and analysis of issues relating to the general topic of privacy (both personal and collective) in the "information age" of the 1990's and beyond. Topics include a wide range of telecommunications, information/database collection and sharing, and related issues, as pertains to the privacy concerns of individuals, groups, businesses, government, and society at large. The manners in which both the legitimate and the controversial concerns of business and government interact with privacy considerations are also topics for the digest. The PRIVACY Forum digest is supported in part by the ACM (Association for Computing Machinery) Committee on Computers and Public Policy. Except when unusual events warrant exceptions, digest publication is limited to no more than one or two reasonably-sized digests per week. 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For more information regarding the listserv system, follow the same command procedure described above, but send the command: help in the BODY of your message. >> GOPHER << All PRIVACY Forum materials can also be obtained through the Internet Gopher system via a gopher server on site "gopher.vortex.com". ------------------------------ End of TELECOM Digest V13 #468 ******************************   Received: from delta.eecs.nwu.edu by mintaka.lcs.mit.edu id aa08211; 13 Jul 93 2:38 EDT Received: by delta.eecs.nwu.edu id AA12176 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4 for telecomlist-outbound); Tue, 13 Jul 1993 00:07:06 -0500 Received: by delta.eecs.nwu.edu id AA25448 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4 for telecomlist); Tue, 13 Jul 1993 00:06:14 -0500 Date: Tue, 13 Jul 1993 00:06:14 -0500 From: TELECOM Moderator Message-Id: <199307130506.AA25448@delta.eecs.nwu.edu> To: telecom@eecs.nwu.edu Subject: TELECOM Digest V13 #469 TELECOM Digest Tue, 13 Jul 93 00:06:00 CDT Volume 13 : Issue 469 Inside This Issue: Moderator: Patrick A. Townson New NE Cell Developments (Douglas Scott Reuben) Ring Generator Schematic Needed (Ralph Hires) Article Excerpts: Numbering Crisis in World Zone 1 (Carl Moore) Calling Number Announcement Numbers (David Leeibold) What Was That? (Michael Covington) Re: 900 Number Portability? (Will Martin) Press 1 for a Sexy Surprise! (Phillip Dampier) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 12 Jul 1993 17:10:29 From: Douglas Scott Reuben Subject: New NE Cell Developments A number of "new" enhancements to cellular service in the Northeast: 1. Metro Mobile/CT (which tries to get away from its poor image of recent years by calling itself Bell Atlantic Mobile), has just added call- delivery to ComCast/NJ,DE, and PA. Metro Mobile CT (and I think Western Mass) customers can now get calls in all of South Jersey (except Ocean County Cellular, and maybe not Atlantic City and Vineland), as well as the Metrophone 00029 service area of Metro Philly, and all the way down into Wilmington and along the Delmarva Peninsula to Dover on the 00123 DE system. This brings auto call delivery for CT customers to include: Rhode Island and Western Mass (always had it), Boston (00007), New York Metro (00025), ComCast/South Jersey (00173-New Brunswick, 00575-Trenton, 01487-Flemington), Philly (00029), and DE (00123). Call delivery is activated by hitting *28, and deactivated by *29. Note that in all the ComCast areas, you WILL pay a daily roam charge, and ComCast bills for "ringtime", so if you let your phone ring for more than 40 secs, you will likely be billed the $3 daily and $.99 per minute charge even if you don't answer the phone! All your features should work (thanks to all the switches being Motorolas, so it was pretty easy for them to set this all up - wonder why it took so long), BUT, as of yet, calls will NOT go back to Voicemail or No-Answer- Transfer, which is a real drawback. Callers will get a ComCast "Out of Area" recording if your phone is off or you do not answer. Additionally, as with all the other Motorola-based auto call delivery systems here, if you register in ComCast, and then turn your phone off, your calls will CONTINUE to be re-routed to ComCast indefinitely! There is no timeout period after which calls go back to CT (or whatever your EMX-based home system is). So let's say you are driving from CT to DC, and you are last last active in ComCast/DE, once you hit the DC/Batimore (00013) system, you can NOT force calls back to CT for VM or NAT purposes. Moreover, you can not use Nationlink (see below), thus any EMX-based customer who roams into and then out of an auto-call delivery system will NOT be able to have calls redirected via Nationlink!. (Ie, a Boston customer goes to Western Mass [auto call delivery] and then to Vermont [Nationlink] - no luck! Nationlink won't kick in!) Oh, and I forgot, Metro finally got Nationlink, where (if the above does not apply) you can hit *31 to have calls forwarded to you in a visited system, *32 to have callers given the roam port number of where you are, or *30 to cancel the whole thing and have calls handled at your local switch, generally for VM or NAT purposes. Metro does not charge "home" airtime for Nationlink, so its similar in function and pricing to (in my opinion) the more reliable Follow Me Slowly ... err ... Roaming ... on the B side. Some A companies, like Cell One/Boston, charge home and of course roamer airtime for Nationlink calls, meaning that during the daytime you can pay as much as $1.70 per minute to receive a call over Nationlink! :( 2. SNET Cellular just added Albany and Orange County,NY to its auto-call delivery system. You are basically covered from NYC up to Albany, except for some hick B system adminstered by NYNEX in Columbia County (01516?). They don't have call delivery with anyone (not even NYNEX), and no FMR. I don't know about SNET waiving the roam surcharge there, but they do this for Boston/RI, New York, and Pittsfield. If you have Roam USA with SNET, you don't have to worry about this since you pay a flat $.75 per minute and no dialy fee wherever you roam on the B side. I suspect that they will be adding Philly and NJ soon - if your phone is active there, calls are not delivered yet, but it does recognize you are there and does other minor odd things. 3. NYNEX/NY adopted a uniform roaming policy for its auto call delivery system: $.75 per minute, plus toll, no daily charge, for INCOMING calls. (See recent ads in the _New York Times_, DON'T rely on what their inept cust. svc. tells you!). You can now get calls in: Eastern Mass (Boston)/Southern NH 00018, Rhode Island (00028), Connecticut/Western Mass (00088), Pittsfield (00068?), Albany (00068), Orange County-Poughkeepsie and Mid Hudson regions (00404/00486), New York (of course) and Northern New Jersey (00022) (does this include Western NJ, near PA?), all of southern NJ, INCLUDING Atlantic City, Ocean County, and Vineland and the Philly Metro/NE PA system (all in 00008), all of the DC/Anapolis/Baltimore system (00028). This is *significantly* more than the "A" side in NY offers, and at a lower rate for incoming calls. Note that there may be no daily charge for outgoing calls in some of the above systems (like CT), but that policy is not universal throughout the entire auto call delivery area. 4. In an effort to catch up, it SEEMS like Cell One/Boston is getting ready for auto call delivery with NY - NY's "Do Not Disturb" feature codes *35/*350 now get confirmation tones in Boston, which until a few weeks ago just got a reorder signal. NY doesn't seem to know about this (or want to talk about it), but they have said they are anxious to get a system in place with Boston, and the implementation of *35/*350 is generally a good indicator of future linkages from previous experience. 5. The B side auto call delivery system continues to be very slow at returning calls from visited systems after the mobile customer has turned his phone off. It frequently takes *four hours* before calls will go back to voicemail, and there is NOTHING (no code or feature) that a customer can hit to send the call back to VM sooner. The "A" side has the *28/*29 or *30/*350 feature to allow calls too be forced back to VM or NAT, but the "B" has nothing (I guess the Autoplex switch has trouble with this or something, or maybe NYNEX is just lazy...:/ ). Cust. Svc says that they are working on the problem, but have no idea when it will be fixed. Good job, eh? (Of course the real culprit here isn't usually inept NYNEX, it is the DOJ and MCI, et. al., who have made a big deal about BOC-owned cell cos handling interlata traffic for the return call from the visited switch to the home switch for VM and NAT treatment. So we have to wait for IS-41 Rev.X or who- knows-what before this problem is fixed on both the A and B sides, when in fact without these IMHO burdensome DOJ regs. cell cos. could fix the problem in about a minute or so [ok, a few days for NYNEX...:) ] McCaw recently said it was working on an enhancement for the NACN which will be implemented in a few months which will allow for this, so I'm interested to see if other delivery systems outside of the NACN will work this out in a similar timeframe.) Anyhow, I think that's about enough for now! Sorry about the legnth; a lot has happened since my last post. Doug dreuben@eagle.wesleyan.edu // dreuben@wesleyan.bitnet ------------------------------ From: cinpmx!bears!rhyre@hugo.att.com Date: Mon, 12 Jul 93 13:07:30 EDT Subject: Ring Generator Schematic Needed Reply-To: ralphw@csc.com I purchased the recently cited (V13 #V458) issue of Electronics Now!, hoping to find a ring generator circuit in the phone line simulator. Alas, the ring generator module depicted is a 'black box' not documented in the article. I'm looking for some circuit(s) that can perform the following functions (this is essentially a simplified line card for a PBX or telco switch): 12VDC + ------[power supply] ~500mA + + + 12VDC | | 48VDC | 90VAC | | ? Audio in >------o-+-----+ |circuit| Audio out <-----o o----> TIP | | (telephone) Off-hook<-------o o----> RING ____ | | Ring >--------o-------+ TIP and RING are at 48VDC when telephone is on-hook, 12VDC when off-hook. Audio in is the mike-level output to the telephone. (Dialtone and call progress tones can also be presented through this interface.) Audio out is the mike-level signal from the telephone line. Off-hook output triggered when handset is picked up. (Off-hook will also pulse when the phone is pulse dialed). -------------- Ring input sends 90VAC, 20hz to telephone, except when Off-hook is active. (Some inexpensive phones use piezo buzzers for ringers that trigger regardless of the telephone instrument switchook, with the potential for hearing damage.) The goal of this is to build a mini-PBX/intercom that is controlled by an old PC with some audio and digital I/O boards that I have sitting around. Since I'm trying to do this on the cheap, I'll happily settle for circuits with functional limitations, such as only driving one Ringer (REN 1.0A). Ralph Hyre (ralphw@csc.com) ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 12 Jul 93 17:09:09 EDT From: Carl Moore Subject: Article Excerpts: Numbering Crisis in World Zone 1 I have picked up a copy of "The Numbering Crisis in World Zone 1" by Brian Hayes. It comes under "The Information Age" in the publication "The Sciences", November-December 1992. (Brian Hayes is editor-at- large of American Scientist.) I don't recall if the article has already been in the Digest. The article points out that a Strowger step-by-step switch allows little flexibility in resolving ambiguities. In an example, it mentions that once you are able to dial between central offices, a step-by-switch would not be able to distinguish between your sister across the street on 5552 and your uncle across the river on KLondike 5-2345. (It does not say that some places were able to retain four-digit local calls within an exchange by restricting the numbers which could be used.) In the example, if the system established a tentative route to 5552, there would be no way to make the connection to KLondike 5-2345. "By 1950 seven-digit dialing had spread to much of the U.S. (though not to my grandmother's house). A telephone connected to the network had the theoretical potential of reaching five million other telephones. At the time there were fewer than fifty million telephones in the nation. [from CGM: what about Canada and the Caribbean?] Thus all that was needed, in order to allow a subscriber to reach out and touch everybody, was a factor-of-10 increase in the numbering capacity." In other words, you'd need just one extra digit. A "conservative" scheme was adopted -- the 3-digit area code. It says that the original area-code proposal was published in 1947, with 86 assigned codes, "with another fifty or so held in reserve for growth". There were 136 available codes since there was to be no N11, N10, or N00 codes. Some N11 codes were reserved for the phone company (it lists 411 for directory assistance -- no reference to "information" -- 611 for repair, 811 for the business office; later 911 added for emergency services). N00 was "designated service access codes", and it mentions toll-free 800. N10 was given to the Telex network. The N0X/N1X format came about so that extra digits were only needed for dialing long distance. "Direct distance dialing with ten-digit numbers first went into service in 1951, in Englewood, New Jersey." The scheme given for local and long- distance is 7D for local and NPA+7D for long distance (no comment offered about long-distance-within-area-code); with the possible exception of long-distance-within-area-code, this is what New Jersey had until 201 area needed N0X/N1X prefixes. This does not work with step-by-step switch, because it's necessary to remember the 1st digit while making a switching decision based on the 2nd digit; 2 solutions were tried for this problem, and what came out was 1 before area code. It's noted that if 1+ (the "+" only indicates that more digits follow) had been there from the outset, area codes wouldn't have to be restricted to N0X/N1X. [No comment about 1+7D for long distance within area code; isn't that also getting from step-by-step switch?] To account for number shortages, say in New York, Los Angeles, and Chicago: 1. expand prefixes from NNN to NNX. [from another source, I heard that there are many NN1 prefixes in Cincinnati area because that 1 was added to standardize phone number lengths] 2. expand prefixes from NNX to NXX. [this is discussed in the archive file history.of.area.splits] 3. SPLIT THE AREA CODE! "By the late 1980s it had become apparent that all 136 of the available NPA codes would soon be allocated. Growth in demand was not abating. Where could more numbers be found? A stopgap was to recover some of the N10 codes that had been assigned to the Telex network. They all were returned except 610, which is still used by the Canadian Telex system, and 710, whose function is now listed as Government Special Services. NPA codes 310, 410, and 510 are already in service, and they will soon be joined by 210 and 810. At that point World Zone 1 will have only one NPA code left: 910." [ 810 is announced, not yet in use, in Michigan; and at the beginning of this year, you saw the notes for 610 in Pa. and 910 in NC. ] For the NXX area codes, it mentions 2 possible sets of dialing instructions: continue requiring 1+ on "ten-digit" call but forbid 1+ on "seven-digit" call (does not discuss 7D vs. 1+NPA+7D for long distance within NPA) Bellcore approach is to require 10D for all calls, even local; this gets rid of 1+ [ this approach shows up in the Orange Card instructions and also in the instructions for the airplane phone ] ------------------------------ Subject: Calling Number Announcement Numbers From: woody Date: Mon, 12 Jul 1993 22:47:23 -0400 Reply-to: dleibold1@attmail.com Since this comes up in the Digest on occasion, and since I have a bit of time on hand, I am willing to collect a list of ANAC or auto number identifiers. When such numbers are dialed, these will read back the calling number in synthesised voice. An example in Florida (Southern Bell) is 200 222.2222 or in New York City it has been 958. I have some data on hand already, but would be interested in getting a comprehensive list set up. Numbers for outside North America would be quite welcome as well. Please mail contributions to dleibold1@attmail.com (the .io.org address may not work from everywhere yet). David Leibold [Moderator's Note: Please submit these direct to David. Do *not* send your message here. David will summarize when his list is complete. PAT] ------------------------------ From: mcovingt@aisun3.ai.uga.edu (Michael Covington) Subject: What Was That? Organization: AI Programs, University of Georgia, Athens Date: Tue, 13 Jul 1993 03:57:20 GMT I recently put in a Hayes Optima 144 modem (usually used at 9600 baud) and settled in for a lot of working at home during the summer. Twice now the following has happened: the modem loses carrier and, when it hangs up (which is apparently quite a few seconds after the line goes dead), my phone rings briefly (less than 1 normal ring). I pick up the phone and hear a dial tone. Once, it _may_ have been an emergency interrupt from an operator. (Our doctor was trying to reach us and I didn't know it; he did reach us later but did not mention any telephonic difficulties.) But wouldn't they let it ring until I actually answered? Or what was it? Aliens? UFOs? :) Michael A. Covington, Associate Research Scientist Artificial Intelligence Programs mcovingt@ai.uga.edu The University of Georgia phone 706 542-0358 Athens, Georgia 30602-7415 U.S.A. amateur radio N4TMI ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 12 Jul 93 14:05:59 CDT From: Will Martin Subject: Re: 900 Number Portability? Jeff Jonas wrote: > What brought this to mind is a catalogue I got with an errata slip > that reads: >"Due to sudden changes in regulations within the telephone industry, >the telephone numbers shown are incorrect ..." > I do not understand - what would cause somebody to change their 900 > number? If 900 numbers are now portable (as 800 numbers), then they > could switch carriers and keep the existing numbers. > [Moderator's Note: It is anyone's guess what the catalog meant by > 'sudden changes in regulations within the telephone industry'. If this > was a sex-catalog you were reading, it might be they could no longer > bill via 900. Also, at one point, all of AT&T's 900 numbers were org- > anized by the cost of the call. For example, calls to 900-410-xxxx > cost so much; calls to 900-234-xxxx cost so much, etc. What prefix you > got on depended on what you wanted to charge. You changed your price > and the phone number had to change. Maybe that is not the case any > longer. How about telling us the *original* numbers which are now > wrong and the *now correct* numbers printed in the errata. Maybe we > can piece together the facts from the actual numbers; figure out which > carrier operates what, etc. PAT] Heck, Pat, I'm not proud! I'll admit to getting the same catalog! :-) It's the "Adam & Eve" catalog of porn, sex toys, and related junk ... (These people claim they mail out catalogs to three million customers! I'm sure there are a lot more Telecom'ers out there who get these and won't admit it ... :-) Anyway, I usually pitch the 900-sex-call literature as soon as I get it, because I have no intention to waste my money on something as worthless as aural simulated sex, especially when the person on the other end is probably someone I'd have no interest in ever meeting in real life, and who may even be a person pretending to be of a sex they really aren't. (I refer here to that case in Nevada of the guy who sued his employer for unjustified firing or something like that; he was a male who worked as a sex-line partner, pretending to be female ...) However, in this case, I happened to get *two* of these catalogs, and hadn't opened the other one, so I still have the errata sheet Jeff referred to. All the 900 numbers are changed to other 900 numbers, so it isn't a case of switching from 900 to 800-with-callback or the like. Also, the text states that the service and price for each is the same as before, so it isn't a case of changing the number due to a rate alteration. But then the first example shown says the rate DOES change. Hmmm ... Here are the old numbers, their new replacements, the charge, and a brief description (the errata sheet is pretty poorly printed and the old numbers are lined through, so I may make an error but will try to be as accurate as possible): OLD NUMBER NEW NUMBER CHARGE DESCRIPTION 900-903-CHIC 900-568-5555 $3.50 / min. "Confess Your Darkest 2442 Secrets" (This one was "$14.95 per call" before; no time limit stated.) 900-454-6789 900-847-3825 $2 / min "Hear Christy Canyon's Intimate Fantasies" 900-903-4EVE 900-646-5555 $2.49 / min "Dial-A-Date" personal ads 900-454-4EVE 900-535-7777 $2 / min "Men Seeking Women" ads 900-896-SUSI 900-646-7825 $2.99 / min "Romantic Fantasies" 900-288-4GUY 900-847-5555 blurred "Man to Man" gay male "1 on 1 connection with real guys in your area" All of these have fine print indicating "123 Communications" as the sponsoring company, and the errata sheet is "signed" with the name "Leila Maxwell for 123 Communications". On the ones I can read, the address of "PO Box 1550, Madison Square Station, NY, NY 10159" is given, but there's a too-blurred-to-make out different address on the "Christy Canyon" one. [She's a large-breasted porn star, if anyone out there didn't know already... :-)] Here's a technical question: How do they run this business about getting connected "1-on-1 with someone in your area"? How do they know there IS someone else in "your area" calling at the same time? How do they define "your area"? Well, here's the data ... Have at it! Regards, Will [Moderator's Note: We have a file in the Telecom Archives which says what carrier is assigned to which 900 prefix. If someone wants to go to the trouble to correlate the above numbers with that list and see who the carriers were before (and are now), it might produce some interesting results. "One on one with someone in your area" simply means they ask each caller accessing that feature to punch in his area code (or they get it from the ANI possibly). Then instead of matching calls waiting in the queue with each other, they only match calls with the same area code. I'd think they must get a lot of calls in the one on one queue if the operator can guarentee a match that precisely. Of course a lot of them can't and don't care. They got your money, that's what counts! :( PAT] ------------------------------ From: phil@rochgte.fidonet.org (Phillip Dampier) Reply-To: phil@rochgte.fidonet.org Date: Tue, 13 Jul 1993 00:31:06 -0500 Subject: Press 1 for a Sexy Surprise! Back in early May, my voicemail spent several minutes recording a "delightful" conversation between two eager sisters who apparently wanted to do each other all over my phone line. Yes, Teleslime no longer waits for you to call, it calls you! This "Overland, Kansas" special dials your number and then taunts you repeatedly to "press one for a sexy surprise." Unfortunately, after minutes of this begathon, my voicemail alerts the caller that their time is almost up by, you guessed it, by generating a touchtone followed by a warning. Predictably, I was treated to several moments of the eager sisters before my voicemail times out. On the day this happens (Saturday morning at the same time the cartoons are on), I call Rochester Telephone (a telco that is open on Saturdays ... beg for it RBOC sufferers) and yell and scream about the latest trend in dial-a-smut lines calling at a time when any child could press one and be treated to quite an education. Rochester Tel is sympathetic and notes in my records that a subsequent call would likely be coming from me when the bill came. Well, the bill came all right. The "sexy surprise" is a bill from OVERLAND KS for an 11 (!) minute call costing a sexually significant $35.00!!! The local prostitutes here can't get $35 for 11 minutes of action. They are in the wrong business. Teleslime will do you $35.00 worth with nary a blink of the eye. I called Rochester Tel and they promptly removed the charge. I call the media whores at the NY State Department of Consumer Protection who can't wait for the collection agency to pound on my door so they can drop a lead weight on them and get free press. I even gave ole "family values" himself, Al "Senator Pothole" D'Amato copies of the relevent goodies so he can rant and rave about the moral depravity of the sleaze who calls home when Bugs Bunny is on. We're now waiting for the inevitable collection agency to contact me. Anyone else who is in the same boat, please share your horror stories. Further updates as warranted. [Moderator's Note: Overland Park, Kansas is the corporate office for Sprint, or at least it was. Sprint's information and entertainment services used to be billed as 'Entertainment, Kansas'. So Sprint is who you want to talk to about this. When this sort of thing has been reported here in the past (of a sex-IP allegedly making outbound calls without an invitation or prior business arrangement with the called party) I have suggested that either a prankster was responsible for giving out your number as the place to return the call collect, *or* that a mechanical failure occurred. By mechanical failure I mean the outbound dialer dialed what it was supposed to and either the local exchange misunderstood or the long distance carrier misunderstood. Has no one here but me ever dialed *what you knew for a fact was the correct number* and still wound up getting a wrong number because of an error in the central office? For example the outbound dialer could be set to go quite fast and 99 times out of a hundred the CO picks up on it but one time out of a hundred the CO mistranslates. I can set the dialing speed on my modem to be quite fast -- so fast it is virtually just a blur when I hear it with my ears -- and the CO will properly handle it. Other times the CO will incorrectly register it that fast. I slow down my modem dialing speed a little, and all is well. Or maybe it was an error by the intake operator at the IP, i.e. 'can we call you collect; what is your number?'; the person says 1234 and the operator writes down 1243. 1243 gets the call, 1234 waits by the phone disappointed. 1243 gets the bill cause the operator wrote that down in error, etc etc etc etc. So a couple old biddies in town get these calls in error, and suddenly we have an urban legend going around about how sex-IPs make unsolicited calls so little kids will run up the phone bill while getting an earful. I still maintain sex-IPs do not make unsolicited calls. The risks involved due to the nature of the program content are simply too great. *Anyone* should know that. So I again issue the 'Patrick Challenge': find for me an actual case of this happening -- a sex-IP who has a bunch of operators or computers or whatever sitting there dialing people at random to get them to 'push 1' or accept a collect call, etc. I don't want newspaper accounts; I don't want what some ignoramus on the television had to say about it. I want the name of an IP, and a documented example of him going through an entire exchange (the most logical way to do it I would think) one number after another making unsolicited sex calls. A report from a state prosecuting authority with docket number will also be adequate. Since Mr. Dampier got the bill, we have to assume the dialer was correctly understood by the telco and long distance carrier which handled the call. Maybe the intake operator wrote it down wrong. Among Sprint's other faults, they do not place sex calls to people who don't want them. I'm sure the charge will be credited and nothing more said about it. And by the way Mr. Dampier, Illinois Bell customer service is open 24 hours per day, seven days per week. PAT] ------------------------------ End of TELECOM Digest V13 #469 ******************************   Received: from delta.eecs.nwu.edu by mintaka.lcs.mit.edu id aa06494; 13 Jul 93 20:33 EDT Received: by delta.eecs.nwu.edu id AA02363 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4 for telecomlist-outbound); Tue, 13 Jul 1993 17:41:46 -0500 Received: by delta.eecs.nwu.edu id AA13850 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4 for telecomlist); Tue, 13 Jul 1993 17:41:01 -0500 Date: Tue, 13 Jul 1993 17:41:01 -0500 From: TELECOM Moderator Message-Id: <199307132241.AA13850@delta.eecs.nwu.edu> To: telecom@eecs.nwu.edu Subject: TELECOM Digest V13 #470 TELECOM Digest Tue, 13 Jul 93 17:41:00 CDT Volume 13 : Issue 470 Inside This Issue: Moderator: Patrick A. Townson Summer School on Telecommunications (Vesa Ruokonen) International Workshop on Intelligent Networks (Vesa Ruokonen) Community Networking Conference (Tyson MacAulay) Question about "Dark Fiber" (Paul Robinson) Followup on Introduction to WilTel (Brian Hess) ---------------------- TELECOM Digest is an e-journal devoted mostly -- but not exclusively -- to discussions on voice telephony. The Digest is a not-for-profit public service published frequently by Patrick Townson Associates. PTA markets a no-surcharge telephone calling card and a no monthly fee 800 service. In addition, we are resellers of AT&T's Software Defined Network. For a detailed discussion of our services, write and ask for the file 'products'. The Digest is delivered at no charge by email to qualified subscribers on any electronic mail service connected to the Internet. To join the mail- ing list, write and tell us how you qualify: telecom-request@eecs.nwu.edu. All article submissions MUST be sent to our email address: telecom@eecs. nwu.edu -- NOT as replies to comp.dcom.telecom. Back issues and numerous other telephone-related files of interest are available from the Telecom Archives, using anonymous ftp lcs.mit.edu. Login anonymous, then 'cd telecom-archives'. At the present time, the Digest is also ported to Usenet at the request of many readers there, where it is known as 'comp.dcom.telecom'. Use of the Digest does not require the use of our products and services. The two are separate. All articles are the responsibility of the individual authors. Organi- zations listed, if any, are for identification purposes only. The Digest is compilation-copyrighted, 1993. **DO NOT** cross-post articles between the Digest and other Usenet or alt newsgroups. Do not compile mailing lists from the net-addresses appearing herein. Send tithes and love offerings to PO Box 1570, Chicago, IL 60690. :) Phone: 312-465-2700. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Vesa.Ruokonen@lut.fi (Vesa Ruokonen) Subject: Summer School on Telecommunications Date: Tue, 13 Jul 1993 21:21:40 GMT Reply-To: Vesa.Ruokonen@lut.fi Organization: Lappeenranta University of Technology, Finland SUMMER SCHOOL ON TELECOMMUNICATIONS Lappeenranta 9.-13.8.1993 The Second Summer School on Telecommunications will be arranged in Lappeenranta University of Technology 9. - 13. 8. 1993. The summer school consists of four seminars and one international workshop. The seminars will be arranged in Kareltek, E-building, Laserkatu 6, Skinnarila. The workshop takes place in the University main building, auditorium 2. The Seminars start at 10.15 am each day, and the Workshop starts at 9.15 am. The language used in the presentations is English. The admission is free, the summer school is sponsored by Lappeenranta University of Technology and Telecom Finland. Because of limited space in seminars, please inform your visit schedule to Ms. Ansa Laakkonen Tel. +358 0 7098 3515, fax +358 0 7098 3526. PROGRAM: Monday 9.8. SEMINAR ON HIGH SPEED NETWORKS Chairman Prof. Jarmo Harju 10.15 Opening speech, Director Olli Martikainen, Telecom Finland 10.30 Overview of high speed network technologies, prof. Peter Martini, University of Paderborn, Germany 11.30 On traffic theoretic problems in ATM networks, Ph.D. Jorma Virtamo, Technical Research Centre of Finland 12.30 - 13.30 Lunch 13.30 Implementation of FSR - a new high speed data bus solution , Senior Research Scientist Pertti Raatikainen, Technical Research Centre of Finland 14.00 Performance of FSR, prof. Jarmo Harju, Lappeenranta University of Technology 15 - 18 Tour in the fortress and harbour of the city 18 - 21 Rantasauna by the lake Saimaa Tuesday 10.8. INTERNATIONAL WORKSHOP ON INTELLIGENT NETWORKS Chairman Director Olli Martikainen, Telecom Finland 9.15 Detailed program to be announced later Wednesday 11.8. SEMINAR ON ASN.1 LANGUAGE AND TOOLS 10.15 Lectures on ASN.1 (Basics and new features of the language), R&D Manager Ari Ahtiainen, Nokia Research Centre 11.30 - 12.30 Lunch 12.30 Lectures on the ASN.1 tool CASN, Ari Ahtiainen 14.00 Coffee 14.15 - 16.00 Demonstrations and practical exercises with CASN, Ari Ahtianen and Dipl. Eng. Markku Turunen, Nokia Research Centre Thursday 12.8. SEMINAR ON PROTOCOL SOFTWARE TOOLS Chairman Assistant prof. Jukka Paakki 10.15 A Case Study on the application of protocol software tools, Mr. Kari Grano, University of Jyvaskyla 11.00 Guidelines to a new integrated language and environment for protocol engineering, Mr. Kari Arvonen, Lappeenranta University of Technology 11.30 - 12.30 Lunch 12.30 Overview of Erlang language and tools, Mr. Mike Williams, Ellemtel Computer Science Laboratory, Sweden 13.30 Improving the telecommunications software process, Mr. Esa Kettunen, Nokia Telecommunications 14.15 Coffee 15 - 18 Rantasauna Friday 13.8. SEMINAR ON RADIO AND MOBILE NETWORKS Chairman Prof. Veikko Hara, Technical Research Centre of Finland 10.15 Title to be announced later, Mr.Jaakko Lahteenmaki, Technical Research Centre of Finland 11.00 DECT and the implementation of its call control procedures, Mr. Jari Vanttinen, Lappeenranta University of Technology 11.30 - 12.30 Lunch 12.30 Title to be announced later, prof. Veikko Hara 13.30 Parallel simulation and its application to mobile network design, M.Sc. Matti Salmi, Lappeenranta University of Technology 14.15 Coffee and close of the Summer School Olli Martikainen, Telecom Finland Jarmo Harju, Lappeenranta University of Technology Vesa.Ruokonen@lut.fi ------------------------------ From: Vesa.Ruokonen@lut.fi (Vesa Ruokonen) Subject: International Workshop on Intelligent Networks Date: Tue, 13 Jul 1993 21:24:18 GMT Reply-To: Vesa.Ruokonen@lut.fi Organization: Lappeenranta University of Technology, Finland WORKSHOP ON INTELLIGENT NETWORKS Lappeenranta University of Technology Tuesday 10th August 1993 Lappeenranta University of Technology and Telecom Finland are hosting the International Workshop on Intelligent Networks in Lappeenranta, Finland, 10th August, 1993. The admission to the Workshop is free. Because of limited space, please send your registrations not later than July 23 to Ms. Ansa Laakkonen, PO.BOX 106, SF-00511 Helsinki, Finland, Tel. +358 0 7098 3515, Fax. +358 0 7098 3526. PROGRAM: 9.00 OLLI MARTIKAINEN, Telecom Finland Opening 9.15 LENNART SODERBERG, Ericsson Telecom Ericsson Intelligent Network Approach 9.45 KARI LAUTANALA, KARI VEIJALAINEN, Nokia Telecom Intelligent Network Architectures and Services with the DX200 Switching System 10.15 - Coffee Break 10.45 JAMES AITKEN, Logica Space and Communications Ltd An Approach to Resolving Feature Interaction in Advanced Intelligent Network Services 11.15 JOAO MOREIRA, Telefones de Lisboa e Porto, S.A. Intelligent Networks and Multimedia 11.45 TAPANI KARTTUNEN, Telecom Finland Service Creation Process 12.15 - Lunch 13.15 CARLA CAPELLMANN, HEINZ DIBOLD, Deutsche Bundespost Telekom The Object Oriented Petri Net Method for the Specification of IN Services 13.45 JORGEN NORGAARD, Tele Danmark Research An IBC Service Architecture 14.15 MARIA JANILCE B. ALMEIDA, CARLOS A. HEUSER, LIANE M.R. TAROUCO, Federal University of Rio Grande do SUL An Integrated and Intelligent Environment for Protocol Specification 14.45 - Coffee Break 15.15 PEKKA LEHTINEN, Nokia Telecom Performance and Overload Modelling of SCP and SSPs of an IN 15.35 KIMMO RAATIKAINEN, Helsinki University A Framework for Evaluating the Performance of IN Services 15.55 JUKKA AIRAKSINEN, OLLI MARTIKAINEN, JARKKO SONNINEN, HARRI TOHOHOEN, Telecom Finland UPT Service Management 16.15 TIMO METSAPORTTI, ITF Oy, SEPPO NOPPARI, Telecom Finland Alarm Management in Telecommunication Networks, Case Study 16.45 - Poster Demonstrations VALERI NAOUMOV, KONSTANTIN SAMUYLOV, PFU Moscow Portable SS#7 Implementation JORMA JAAKKOLA, HARRI TOHONEN, Telecom Finland IN Pilot System 18.45 Evening Program: Cruising Tour at Lake Saimaa starting from Lappeenranta Harbour Vesa.Ruokonen@lut.fi ------------------------------ From: tmacaula@ccs.carleton.ca (Tyson MacAulay) Subject: Community Networking Conference Date: Tue, 13 Jul 93 8:31:05 EDT INTERNATIONAL CONFERENCE COMMUNITY NETWORKING: THE INTERNATIONAL FREE-NET CONFERENCE AUGUST 17-19, 1993 CARLETON UNIVERSITY OTTAWA, CANADA Community computing networks offer an open door into the Information Society. Electronic highways, interactive computer mediated communications, multimedia, cyberspace? ... the real question is, how do ordinary people get connected? This is not a trivial problem. Free-Nets offer one solution. From its start in the 1980's, the Cleveland Free-Net has inspired many other projects. The concept has become an international phenomenon with Free-Nets operating in United States, Finland, New Zealand and Canada. Where do we go from here? The National Capital FreeNet,Ottawa, in association with Industry and Science Canada, is sponsoring an international conference on community networking August 17 to 19, 1993. The conference will bring people interested in community networking face-to-face to discuss four themes: 1. HOW TO START AND RUN A FREE-NET; THE ORGANIZATION OF FREE-NETS * What do we mean by community computer networking? * How to start a Free-Net * How to fund your Free-Net. * Increasing awareness about the purpose and possibilities of community computing networks. * Identifying key issues and possible responses for communities and governments in the growth of community computing networks. 2. THE SYSTEM TECHNOLOGY OF FREE-NETS * Managing FreePort software * Super users and trusted users; coordinating hands-on system development * Menu structure and page design * Security * Internet access * Software and interface standards * Programming for bilingual text * Getting the most out of Free-Net; turning members into power users * The next generation; what should the face of Free-Nets and other networks look like? 3. SUSTAINING COMMUNITY; THE USE AND IMPACT OF FREE-NETS * How do we use community computer networks as tools for community development? * Local / global? - how much internet to give members? * Censorship, privacy, copyright and other legal issues * Social issues: language, gender and cultural issues, access for the differently abled; how do we deepen participation in the life of the community? * Free-Net and the arts * Relating to governments, providing government information * Understanding Free-Net as a communications medium, not an information medium * For business and profit; commercial uses and relations * Deschooling society; learning and community networks * How to moderate online discussions; critical skills for information providers in building community 4. INTRODUCING COHERENCE INTO THE COMMUNITY NETWORK MOVEMENT. * Action planning; where does community networking go from here? * What are the necessary local, national and global links among Community networks? * Finding out who is active in the development of a network of community computing networks. * Creating learning spaces for people interested in starting and running community computing networks. * Other models for community networks and bulletin boards * CA*net and CANARIE relations with Free-Nets * Public access to high-speed networks; future telecommunications tariffs and policy * The equity issue of rural access from outside your free dialing zone * Impact research and evaluation; understanding the role of Free-nets in social change WHO SHOULD ATTEND?...ARE YOU: * Active or interested in organizing FreeNets? * Operating a FreeNet or other community bulletin board? * Interested in the social, economic, physical, and philosophical impacts of community networking? * Already a computer network user or planning to be? * Involved in community, government or public interest groups that want access to computer mediated communications and networks? * An information provider or service agent? * A private industry executive or professional from the Information Sector with an interest in broadening the base of information technology use? The agenda of the conference is action oriented. Following panel presentations by experts on the four themes, every conference participant will have the opportunity to participate in working group discussions to develop "action agendas" addressing key issues in the development of Free-Nets. The subtopics listed above are suggested as ideas for discussion, not as definitive lists of concerns. The action agendas developed by the working groups will be presented to all conference participants in a plenary session and a conference summary will be posted on FreeNet. Conference registration begins at 6:00pm, Tuesday, August 17, at the Carleton Tour and Conference Centre, University Commons Building, followed by a barbecue at 7:00pm. The official opening is 9:00am, Wednesday, August 18. Further information on program may be obtained from: Garth Graham: aa127@freenet.carleton.ca 613-253-3497 COST: Send cheque or money order for $86.25 CAD (including 15% GST/PST) to: National Capital FreeNet, International Freenet Conference Carleton University, 1125 Colonel By Drive Ottawa, Ontario, Canada, K1S 5B6 Accommodation is available at University residences for $27.95 / per night (Plus GST/PST of 15%). This includes breakfast. COMMUNITY NETWORKING: THE INTERNATIONAL FREE-NET CONFERENCE AUGUST 17-19 1993 * CARLETON UNIVERSITY * OTTAWA, CANADA PARTICIPANT REGISTRATION FORM _________________________________ Name: .................................................................... Organization: ............................................................ Email address: ........................................................... Postal address: .......................................................... ............................................ Postal code: ............... Telephone: ........................ Fax: ............................... I require university residence accommodation for the dates of: .......... Please return this form to: International Free-Net Conference Email: freenet_conference@freenet.carleton.ca Fax: 613-788-4448 Phone: 613-788-3947 Write: National Capital FreeNet, International Free-Net Conference Carleton University, 1125 Colonel By Drive Ottawa, Ontario, Canada, K1S 5B6 Garth Graham aa127@freenet.carleton.ca <<< NGL/CANIS (Community Access Network Information Services) >>> Box 86, Ashton, Ont., K0A 1B0 613-253-3497 ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 13 Jul 1993 01:41:10 -0400 (EDT) Reply-To: 0005066432@MCIMAIL.COM Subject: Question about "Dark Fiber" From: Paul Robinson Organization: Tansin A. Darcos & Company, Silver Spring, MD USA Gordon Cook , in the Internet Privatization list asked a question about "dark fiber" by explaining what it is then asking what is going on. The posting he made explained why the issue of "Dark Fiber" is being taken so seriously by the phone companies and the information providers. I didn't really understand the issue until I read his post. Here's the quote: The following is a direct quote from George Gilder's long article in the December 7, 1992 Forbes ASAP. Can anyone offer any pointers as to the current status of this court action? The 'Dark Fiber' Case "That need has driven EDS into an active role as an ex parte pleader in Federal Case 911416, currently bogging down in the United States Court of Appeals for the District of Columbia as the so-called "dark fiber" case. On the surface, the case -- known as Southwestern Bell et al. v. the Federal Communications Commission and the U.S. Department of Justice -- pits four regional Bell operating companies against the FCC. But the legal maneuvers actually reflect a rising conflict between the Bells and several large corporate clients over the future of communications. Beyond all the legal posturing, the question at issue is whether fiber networks should be dumb and dark and cheap, the way EDS and other customers like them, or whether they should be bright and smart and "strategically" priced, the way the telephone companies want them. On the side of intelligence and light are the phone companies -- Southwestern Bell, U.S. West, Bell South and Bell Atlantic. The forces of darkness include key officials at the FCC and such companies as Shell Oil, the information services arm of McDonnell Douglas and long-distance network provider Wiltel, as well as EDS. Most of the four-year course of the struggle has passed unnoticed by the media. In the fall of 1990, the FCC ruled that the phone companies would have to offer dark fiber to all comers under the rules of common carriage. Rather than accept this new burden, the phone companies petitioned to withdraw from the business entirely under what is called a Rule 214 application. Since the FCC has not acted on this petition, the Bells are preparing to go to court to force the issue. Their corporate customers are ready to litigate as well. It is safe to say that none of the participants fully comprehend the significance of their courthouse confrontation. To the Bells, after all is said and done, the key problem is probably the price. Under the existing tariff, they are required to offer this service to anyone who wants it for an average price of approximately $150 per strand of fiber per mile per month. As an offering that competes with their T-3 45-megabit-per-second lines and other forthcoming marvels, dark fiber threatens to gobble up their future as vendors of broadband communications to offices, even as cable TV preempts them as broadband providers to homes. Since the Bells' profits on data are growing some 10 times as fast as their profits on voice telephony, they see dark fiber as a menace to their most promising markets." ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 13 Jul 93 13:41:49 -0500 From: bnh@active.com (Brian Hess) Subject: Followup on Introduction to WilTel [Moderator's Note: The Digest recently published a short article introducing WilTel to our readers; many had not known of the company prior to the message. Mr. Hess writes with a followup. PAT] "WilTel" stands for "Williams Telecommunications", which is a spin-off of the Williams Energy Company. According to a WilTel R&D guy I talked to, the origin of WilTel was in unused pipeline capacity -- someone figured that they could just clean out an old pipeline, fill it with cable, and use existing rights-of-way for a brand new business! Brian Hess Active Ingredients, Inc. bnh@active.com (or bnh@mcimail.com) [Moderator's Note: Well, you know Sprint had the same kind of origin back in the middle 1970's. The Southern Pacific Railroad upgraded their telecommunications facilities greatly, and wound up with lots of unused capacity. Railroads years ago used to run their own telephone lines on poles along side the tracks, with 'call boxes' every five or ten miles for use by railroad employees. In addition, they connected their depots and terminals together using their own lines strung along the right-of- way. When Southern Pacific did their upgrade, they decided to sell the excess capacity to other businesses needing (presumably) better and cheaper service than what those businesses were getting from Ma Bell at the time. outhern

acific ailroad internal etwork elecommunications Sservice was the name of the entity. Like icrowave ommunications, ncorporated which started in 1968 as a small carrier handling specific business calls between Chicago and St. Louis, Sprint was originally just for businesses. You had to dial into their switch using straight seven- digit numbers, etc. They started serving residential customers sometime in the early 1980's. Sprint started mainly to copy what they saw MCI doing and making a profit at. By the year 2000, I hope another player of some significance will be PAT; ah, but that others had the faith in me that I have in myself! It is tough going. PAT] ------------------------------ End of TELECOM Digest V13 #470 ******************************   Received: from delta.eecs.nwu.edu by mintaka.lcs.mit.edu id aa08511; 13 Jul 93 21:58 EDT Received: by delta.eecs.nwu.edu id AA27418 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4 for telecomlist-outbound); Tue, 13 Jul 1993 18:52:02 -0500 Received: by delta.eecs.nwu.edu id AA30846 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4 for telecomlist); Tue, 13 Jul 1993 18:51:00 -0500 Date: Tue, 13 Jul 1993 18:51:00 -0500 From: TELECOM Moderator Message-Id: <199307132351.AA30846@delta.eecs.nwu.edu> To: telecom@eecs.nwu.edu Subject: TELECOM Digest V13 #471 TELECOM Digest Tue, 13 Jul 93 18:51:00 CDT Volume 13 : Issue 471 Inside This Issue: Moderator: Patrick A. Townson Dialing Plan Questions (Bill Hofmann) Phone Numbers of PTTs in ex-USSR (Alfredo Cotroneo) New AM Band Violates No-Intercept Rule? (Bart Z. Lederman) What Happens When ANI is NOT Delivered? (Colin Tuttle) The "Ultimate" Personal Telecom System (Patrick Goebel) Nokia P4000 Programming Info Wanted (Mike Riddle) Information Needed on Using US Phones in Germany (Mark Skelton) GSM Comes to New Zealand (Ross Douglas Alexander) ADAD Suggestions Please (Gilles Lehoux) New England/Mid Atlantic Paging (Douglas Scott Reuben) Stand-By Line From U.S. West (John C. Fowler) Re: Cox and BellSouth Want to Use 511 (Bryan Reece) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 13 Jul 93 11:12:15 -0700 From: wdh@netcom.com (Bill Hofmann) Subject: Dialing Plan Questions Folks, I'm looking for some information. In fact, a large amount of information. I've been doing a bunch of this research by writing PTTs in many of these countries, but, bureacracies being what they are, not many places have responded. Here's why: My company is developing software (currently for the Macintosh) which will automate dialing for travelling computer users. To do this, we need to be aware of a fair amount of information about dialing plans in many countries. Here's what I need: * City code minimum and maximum length lists of city/city codes are appreciated * Local number minimum and maximum length * Fully qualified number minimum and maximum length (LD access code + city code + number) * long distance and international direct dial access codes (if > 1, by company) e.g.: 0, 00 * long distance and international "charge" access codes (in the US, we can enter an access code + number + account number and have the call billed to our account) How are these calls made? * Is there a "dial home", " Direct" type service? How are these calls made? * What countries can (or cannot, whichever is shortest) be direct dialed? * Can a user dial a "fully qualified" number? That is, if I'm in Paris, can I dial 16,1-xxxx-xxxx (no) or if I'm in London, can I dial 071-xxx-xxxx (yes) Note, it may not be *required*, but is it possible? * Is the phone system mostly pulse dial? * Are there any anomalies in dialing? e.g., only some cities have automatic exchanges * How long will this information be valid? e.g., Norway just changed its numbering plan, UK will, Australia is in the process. Below are the countries I need the information for most of all (info about other countries is welcome, in particular about dialing fully-qualified numbers and about "charge" services). Please email information to wdh@netcom.com. BTW, if any of you are Macintosh users who travel frequently and use your modems constantly, and you'd like to beta test this product, please email me. Tell me what you do with the modem, what Mac you have, and where you travel. If anyone can suggest a good source for this information besides the PTTs or local consulates, I'd be happy to hunt it up. Countries where information is needed: Armenia (7), Azerbaijan (7), Belarus (7), Georgia (7), Kazakhstan (7), Kyrgystan (7), Russia (7), Tajikistan (7), Turkmenistan (7), Ukraine (7), Uzbekistan (7), Egypt (20), South Africa (27), Netherlands (31), Belgium (32), Balearic Islands (34), Canary Islands (34), Ceuta (34), Melilla (34), Spain (34), Bosnia and Hercegovina (38), Croatia (38), Macedonia (38), Serbia and Montenegro (38), Slovenia (38), Yugoslavia (38), Italy (39), San Marino (39), Vatican City (39), Romania (40), Liechtenstein (41), Switzerland (41), Czech Republic (42), Slovakia (42), Austria (43), Poland (48), Peru (51), Cuba (53), Brazil (55), Easter Island (56), Pitcairn Island (56), Venezuela (58), Malaysia (60), Indonesia (62), Timor (62), Philippines (63), Thailand (66), Republic of Korea (82), Vietnam (84), China (86), Tibet (86), Turkey (90), India (91), Pakistan (92), Afghanistan (93), Sri Lanka (94), Myanmar (Burma) (95), Iran (98), Algeria (213), Tunisia (216), Libya (218), Senegal (221), Mauritania (222), Mali (223), Guinea (224), Cote d'Ivoire (225), Burkina Faso (226), Niger (227), Togo (228), Benin (229), Mauritius (230), Liberia (231), Sierra Leone (232), Nigeria (234), Chad (235), Central African Republic (236), Cape Verde Islands (238), Sao Tome and Principe (239), Equatorial Guinea (240), Zaire (243), Angola (244), Guinea Bissau (245), Seychelles (248), Sudan (249), Rwanda (250), Ethiopia (251), Somalia (252), Djibouti (253), Kenya (254), Tanzania (255), Burundi (257), Reunion Island (262), Zimbabwe (263), Namibia (264), Lesotho (266), Botswana (267), Swaziland (268), Comoros (269), Saint Helena (290), Aruba (297), Faeroe Islands (298), Greenland (299), Azores (351), Madeira Islands (351), Portugal (351), Ireland (353), Cyprus (357), Finland (358), Malawi (365), Lithuania (370), Latvia (371), Estonia (372), Moldova (373), Belize (501), Guatemala (502), El Salvador (503), Honduras (504), Nicaragua (505), Costa Rica (506), Panama (507), Saint Pierre and Miquelon (508), Haiti (509), Guadeloupe (590), Bolivia (591), Ecuador (593), French Guiana (594), Paraguay (595), French Antilles (596), Martinique (596), Saint Barthelemy (596), Saint Martin (596), Suriname (597), Uruguay (598), Netherlands Antilles (599), Saipan/N. Mariana (670), Antarctica (Casey Base) (672), Antarctica (Scott Base) (672), Brunei (673), Nauru (674), Admiralty Island (675), Bougainville (675), New Britain (675), New Ireland (675), Papua New Guinea (675), Tonga (676), Solomon Islands (677), Vanuatu (678), Palau (680), Cook Islands (682), Niue Island (683), American Samoa (684), Kiribati (686), Tuvalu (688), Moorea (689), Tahiti (689), Marshall Islands (692), DPR Korea (850), Hong Kong (852), Kampuchea (855), Laos (856), Bangladesh (880), Maldives (960), Lebanon (961), Jordan (962), Syria (963), Iraq (964), Kuwait (965), Saudi Arabia (966), Yemen Arab Republic (967), Oman (968), Yemen Arab Republic (PDRY) (969), United Arab Emirates (971), Gaza Strip (972), Israel (972), West Bank (972), Bhutan (975), Mongolia (976), Nepal (977) -Bill Hofmann Fresh Software wdh@netcom.com [Moderator's Note: You can get some information on city codes for the above countries by referring to the Telecom Archives directory called 'country.codes'. I'm afraid the archives doesn't have all that you are seeking but some of it might help you. Use anonymous ftp.lcs.mit.edu, then when logged in 'cd telecom-archives/country.codes'. PAT] ------------------------------ From: A.Cotroneo@it12.bull.it (Alfredo Cotroneo) Subject: Phone Numbers of PTTs in ex-USSR Date: Tue, 13 Jul 1993 09:50:19 GMT I am trying to get in contact with PTT officials in Ukraine and Georgia. Does anybody have a listing of phone/fax/telex numbers of PTT offices in the newly created Administrations of countries previously part of the USSR? I am particularly interested in reaching people responsible for HF (High Frequency/Shortwave) operations originating from their respective countries. Needless to say that directory assistance thru the operator, is very difficult. I need to get in touch with the equivalent of the FCC in each of the CIS countries. Thanks for any help in this direction. Alfredo 100020.1013@compuserve.com (preferred) Alfredo E. Cotroneo, Bull HN Italia, I-20010 Pregnana Mil. work: A.Cotroneo.@it12.bull.it personal: 100020.1013@compuserve.com phone: +39-2-6779 8492 / 8427 | fax: 8289 ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 13 Jul 1993 08:46:07 EDT From: Bart Z. Lederman Subject: New AM Band Violates No-Intercept Rule? Another aspect of the "no radios can receive telephone calls" legislation fiasco has just occurred to me. According to the May 1993 issue of {Popular Communications}, the FCC plans to expand the upper end of the AM Broadcast band to 1700 kHz. They've already started warning services that use this band (such as the Traveller's Information Service stations now on 1610 kHz and various navigation beacons) to move. And since few receivers currently tune this range (unless you have a REALLY old radio that reaches up into the archaic "police" band), the FCC will undoubtedly pass some rule requiring manufacturers to make receivers that include these frequencies. But this frequency band was recently used for cordless telephones (before 46-49 MHz became available), and I'm sure a lot of those units are still in use. Anyone care to speculate on what is going to happen when the FCC has two rules in place: one which requires manufacturers to build receivers that cover these frequencies, and one which prohibits them from building receivers which cover these frequencies because they could be used to listen in on telephone calls? Anyone want to quote odds on the FCC levying fines on the same company twice: once for not making the receivers, and then again for making them? (Ah, now I understand! It's a conspiracy to make the Japanese pay for reducing our national debt!) Bart Z. Lederman System Resources Corp. [Moderator's Note: I think the old-style cordless phones, like the highway road conditions announcement service are going to be booted out of that frequency range. Others having to leave include the radio signal beacons on the Great Lakes which operate at 1630 KC; that is, if the broadcast band does get expanded. I don't think it is an absolutely done deal yet by any means. And bear in mind by the time all this comes to pass -- if it does -- in the next few years, the cordless phones operating around 1700 will be another two or three years older, with very few still in usable, working condition. There won't need to be any extensive modifications to new radios built for public use. Any AM radio on the market now tunes to 1630 without any hassle and it is easy enough to warp them a little so they reach 1700 without any hassle. As kids, we used to take old tube-style radios and divert the intermediate frequency, sending it out a short piece of wire which served as the transmitting antenna. By cranking it up and optimizing the way we tuned it and cut the wire, we could get a quarter or sometimes a half-watt out of those suckers ... and let everyone for two blocks around us who tuned to 1615 or 1620 KC listen to our pirate radio station. :) Better though, we found was to attach the antenna wire to one side of a telephone pair. It didn't affect the phone at all and that mile or so of wire back to the CO on overhead poles made for great transmission of our signal we thought. RF can travel along on one wire (of the pair) with a phone conversation just fine. Doing it that way, we could get several blocks away and by listening closely to the radio pick our signal out of the hash, just barely; or stand right next to a telephone pole and our signal would boom out of the little pocket radio we carried along for testing on our walks. PAT] ------------------------------ Subject: What Happens When ANI is NOT Delivered? From: ctuttle@wuntvor.pillar.com (Colin Tuttle) Date: Tue, 13 Jul 93 13:19:38 CDT Organization: The Eternal Apprentice BBS, Oklahoma City, Ok There has been some talk recently about the 800 number that returns ANI and is an ad for the 1-900-STOPPER service. My question is what about phone numbers that don't return ANI? We have numerous 800 numbers that come in on our T-1 line from within the State of Oklahoma. Every month we get many that are listed on the bill as the area code, prefix, and then 0000 as the suffix. Obviously the true number is not reported to our long distance carrier. Many of these are from small phone companies (non S.W. Bell) in rural areas of the state. Now, I wonder what would happen if one of these people called the 800 number that demonstrated ANI. Would it give the area code, prefix and then 0000 as the last four digits? Now, more importantly what would happen if these people called the 900 number advertised ... or any 900 number, for that matter. Since the IP doesn't receive the actual phone number of the caller, would the caller be connected, or would they be connected and then not be charged? There must be many areas of the country that have this situation. Do they get free 900 service, or are they barred from using these "services?" ctuttle@wuntvor.pillar.com (Colin Tuttle) The Eternal Apprentice BBS, Oklahoma City, OK -- +1 405 942 8794 ------------------------------ From: patrick@casbs.Stanford.EDU (Patrick Goebel) Subject: The "Ultimate" Personal Telecom System Organization: Center for Advanced Study in the Behavioral Sciences Date: Tue, 13 Jul 1993 07:49:47 GMT I am involved with a number of international business ventures and I would like to investigate the possibility of a state-of-the-art personal cellular telecomputing system to keep track of transactions. Since I have very little knowledge about the current state of cellular communications, please forgive the vague description of my needs. Any pointers you can offer would be greatly appreciated. Assume for the moment that money is no object. At the heart of the system would be a high-powered workstation with a cellular phone link to the rest of the planet and perhaps a leased line link to sites closer to home. The workstation would support a database of all transactions including voice and FAX. It would run 24 hours a day (equipped with at least one UPS) and would probably be under the supervision of a systems guru type. The workstation and its database software would have to be accessible under three basic scenarios: (1) WHILE SITTING AT THE CONSOLE. For this I would require an intuitive interface for accessing and modifying data in the database. Sending and receiving FAXes should be as simple as clicking a few graphical buttons. Video conferencing would be a nice plus. (2) WHILE TRAVELING INTERNATIONALLY. I envision carrying with me a compact notebook computer with built-in modem and cellular phone. Access to the home-base workstation needs to be fast (at least 9600-baud), reliable (wouldn't want to keep them waiting in the middle of a business meeting) and provide the same (or equally intuitive) interface to the database as seen at the workstation's console. (3) WHILE CYCLING. Yes, you read correctly. I spend a good part of my day riding a bicycle and working out in a gym. I envision a cellular phone/palmtop system that would fit in my jersey pocket or within a water bottle cage. For simple phone calls, I would want a headset and voice-activated microphone. Some form of handlebar mounted speed dialing system would also be essential. For more involved interactions with the home computer, I would dismount the bike and work on the palmtop. This unit should provide some simple interface to the home database so that recently received FAXes could be read (if only a few lines at a time) and simple database operations could be performed. Please keep in mind that money is currently not an issue, so anything goes. If you have any ideas how I might go about putting together such a system, please give me a shout. Many thanks! Patrick Goebel E-MAIL: patrick@casbs.Stanford.EDU Network Administrator VOICE: (415) 321-2052 CASBS, 202 Junipero Serra Blvd. FAX: (415) 321-1192 Stanford, CA 94305 BEEPER: Temporarily Out of Order... ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 13 Jul 93 09:49:12 CST From: Mike.Riddle@axolotl.omahug.org (Mike Riddle) Subject: Nokia P4000 Programming Info Wanted Reply-To: mike.riddle%inns@axolotl.omahug.org Organization: Inns of Court, Papillion, NE The subject just about says it all: does anyone have information on programming the Nokia P4000 hand portable cellphone? Thanks in advance. mike.riddle@inns.omahug.org Nebraska Inns of Court +1 402 593 1192 (Data) Sysop of 1:285/27@Fidonet 3/12/24/9600 V.32/V.42bis ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 13 Jul 93 16:48:19 -0400 From: mskelton@wrdis01.robins.af.mil (Mark Skelton) Subject: Information Needed on Using US Phones in Germany Does anyone have any information about the compatibility/legality of using U.S. telephones, modems and FAX machines in Germany. I remember years back when you couldn't buy anything except a Ma Bell phone in the U.S. and thought the German PTT was still the same. I have a German telephone (pulse) which works great here in the U.S., but it didn't have an RJ-11 or RJ-45 type jack. I know nothing about the ring voltage and such other things. Thanks, Mark mskelton@wrdis01.robins.af.mil ------------------------------ From: rale1@cs.aukuni.ac.nz (Ross Douglas Alexander) Subject: GSM Comes to New Zealand Organization: Computer Science Dept. University of Auckland Date: Tue, 13 Jul 1993 22:35:43 GMT On the 11 of July BellSouth introduced GSM into New Zeland. I think at this point it only covers the Auckland Metropolitan area (but don't quote me on that). BellSouth is the second cellular carrier in NZ and the third major telephone company. Bell Atlantic and Ameritech own 49% of Telecom (it has a cellular system). MCI has a stake in Clear (our second long distance carrier) and BellSouth has how set up a second cellular system. The competetion has done wonders for toll prices (down, down, down) but because the government owns 51% of Telecom all local calls are free. With this is a inflation based limit on local line rental (which is at 1-2%). So local rental is about NZ$35 (or US$20) per month with free calls which cover the entire Auckland Metropolitan area. I don't know how this compares with the US. Here we also have some cross subsidisation from business (which does pay for local calls) to home and from urban to rural areas. Just some thoughts. 'Australian Communications' (an execelent mag, even from Oz) has expressed many doubts about GSM, especially with regard to the growing support for CDMA and the problems with GSM's very tight timing requirements. It will be interesting to see how it does. | Ross Alexander Computer Science Auckland University ------------------------------ From: Optimal.Simulation@mtlnet.org (Optimal Simulation) Date: Tue, 13 Jul 1993 13:42:00 -0500 Subject: ADAD Suggestions Please Reply-To: optimal.simulation@mtlnet.org Hello, I am a member of a nonprofit genealogical association. Every once in a while our club secretary must call every member to tell them where and when the next meeting will be held and things like that. At one point we tried a telephone "tree" where one personne calls five others and those five each call five others and so on. But, the chain is easily broken. So ... I've started investigating into a way to use my computer and modem and possibly a cassette recorder to automate this task. I've learned that what I'm looking for is called an Automatic Dialing-Announcing Device (ADAD). The ADAD I'm looking for must perform the following. 1 - Dial up the next club member on the list 2 - If no one answers, go to 1 3 - If someone answers, play the recorded message. 4 - Goto 1 Does anyone have any information on such things as : - Hardware - Software I think the best would be a simple system, no frills, cheap, that we could assemble ourselves from parts commonly available. I have been told that Bell Canada has restrictions on ADADs. I don't think they apply to us since our members would be aware of the system and consent to being called by it. I guess I'll call Bell Canada eventually, just to make sure. Gilles Lehoux Mechanical Engineer E-mail : optimal.simulation@mtlnet.org <- preferred lehoux@nyongwa.cam.org S-mail : 294 Fere street, Saint-Eustache (Quebec), J7R 2V2, Canada V-mail : Telephone (514) 472-8128 Organization : Computer Aided Engineering contracts & misc. [Moderator's Note: You might want to investigate some software/hardware sold in the USA under the name 'BigMouth'. Not only does it make outbound calls in the manner you specify, but it also serves as a fine single- line voicemail service. It runs on a 386 or better with 640 K of RAM and maybe 60-100K hard drive to store phrases and mailbox messages. PAT] ------------------------------ Date: 13 Jul 1993 17:01:52 From: Douglas Scott Reuben Subject: New England/Mid Atlantic Paging I've finally given in an decided to supplement my carphone with a pager. I'd like to get a NYC number (917 I guess, although Westchester/914 would be good too), annd have numeric paging from DC to Boston, AND Western Mass, Vermont, NH, and eastern PA (Allentown, Lancaster, as far west as Harrisburg.) Do I need to go with SkyTel or one of those nationwide guys, or can I just get "regional" service and bunch a few regions together? (IE, bundle mid-Atlantic with New England with Vermont/NH, etc.) Any reccommendations on pagers or companies? Any frequencies better than others? I intend to be outside most of the time, so reaching me in the subway or whatever isn't an important consideration. Would a 400MHz pager work better in the more rural areas than 900? Or is there little difference? (I'm much more familiar with lower-powered cellular service, so I am not sure if frequency is an important consideration for pagers. If anyone can offer any help, I'd appreciate hearing from you! Thanks, -Doug dreuben@eagle.wesleyan.edu dreuben@wesleyan.bitnet ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 13 Jul 93 01:29 GMT From: John C. Fowler <0003513813@mcimail.com> Subject: Stand-By Line From U.S. West There was an advertisement in the newspaper today for a service I'd never heard of. Here's the ad: WHICH WOULD YOU RATHER HAVE STANDING BY, A PHONE LINE OR A CUSTOMER? Introducing Stand-By (sm) Line from U.S. West Now your business can have all the advantages of another line without the usual expense. With Stand-By Line, the monthly rate is about half the cost of a regular line. After that, you're only charged about a nickel for each minute you use. So it's a good way to manage phone costs while keeping up with a growing business. Stand-By Line is ideal for a fax, modem, or credit card verification, and for overflow customer calls during busy times. So call the Small Business Group at U.S. West today. We'll be standing by. [end of ad] My question is: what is this? Is it just a regular phone line with a different pricing scheme? Given that they're advocating using it for incoming calls, does the per-minute charge apply to those as well? We got CLASS features recently: is there something about this deal that requires CLASS? I'm not a business: just a curious consumer. John C. Fowler, 3513813@mcimail.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 13 Jul 93 01:15 From: reece@kd4lon.speedway.net (bryan reece) Subject: Re: Cox and BellSouth Want to Use 511 In comp.dcom.telecom Carl Moore writes: >There was a note in the Digest recently about 711 being used for >self-ring in area 412 in western Pennsylvania. Anyone else ever hear >anything regarding any usage of 711? In Durham, NC, (919 286) the local carrier uses 711 to read back the number of the calling telephone (like 311 in most other areas does). Bryan Reece PGP key ID=72D873 ------------------------------ End of TELECOM Digest V13 #471 ******************************   Received: from delta.eecs.nwu.edu by mintaka.lcs.mit.edu id aa09487; 13 Jul 93 22:36 EDT Received: by delta.eecs.nwu.edu id AA29026 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4 for telecomlist-outbound); Tue, 13 Jul 1993 19:48:47 -0500 Received: by delta.eecs.nwu.edu id AA27214 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4 for telecomlist); Tue, 13 Jul 1993 19:48:01 -0500 Date: Tue, 13 Jul 1993 19:48:01 -0500 From: TELECOM Moderator Message-Id: <199307140048.AA27214@delta.eecs.nwu.edu> To: telecom@eecs.nwu.edu Subject: TELECOM Digest V13 #472 TELECOM Digest Tue, 13 Jul 93 19:48:00 CDT Volume 13 : Issue 472 Inside This Issue: Moderator: Patrick A. Townson Re: Conversion From UTM to Geographical Coordinates (Dale Chayes) Re: Answering Machine and Fax Marriages - Can They Work? (Joel Snyder) Re: Beep at Start of International Calls (Miguel Cruz) What's Going on With Payphone 2000? (Miguel Cruz) Why Can't I Call 800 Numbers Internationally? (Miguel Cruz) Caller ID (Miscellaneous Topics) (Herb Weiner) Addresses of Companies Offering Callback Service? (Tony Lim) Transcontinental Propagation Delay (Jonathan Edwards) Movie Review: {Line of Fire} and Telecom (Robert L. McMillin) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: dale@lamont.ldgo.columbia.edu (Dale Chayes) Subject: Re: Conversion From UTM to Geographical Coordinates Reply-To: dale@lamont.ldgo.columbia.edu Organization: Lamont-Doherty Earth Observatory of Columbia University Date: Tue, 13 Jul 1993 16:53:38 GMT In article 17@eecs.nwu.edu, Samir Soliman writes: > Does anyone know how the conversion from UTM to geographical > coordinates is done? There is a USGS (U.S. Geological Survey) software package that does various kinds of map conversions. It does UTM to and from geodetic coordinate systems (and lots of other stuff.) The compressed tar archive is 99 kbytes. I can (probably) put it out for anonymous ftp if there is interest. In the mean time, I'll check and see if its distributable. >From the README file: For more complete desription of 'proj' see: "Cartographic Projection Procedures for the UNIX Environment---A User's Manual" by G.I.Evenden, USGS Open-File Report 90-284. A copy can be obtained from: USGS Books and Reports Sales Federal Center, Box 25425 Denver, CO 80225 (303) 236-7476 FTS 776-7476 or from the author. Here is the 'man' page: PROJ(1) USER COMMANDS PROJ(1) NAME proj - forward cartographic projection filter invproj - inverse cartographic projection filter SYNOPSIS proj [ -bcefimorstTwW [ args ] ] [ +args ] file[s] invproj [ -bcefimorstTwW [ args ] ] [ +args ] file[s] DESCRIPTION Proj and invproj perform respective forward and inverse transformation of cartographic data to or from cartesian data with a wide range of selectable projection functions. The following control parameters can appear in any order: -b Special option for binary coordinate data input and output through standard input and standard output. Data is assumed to be in system type double floating point words. This option is to be used when proj is a son process and allows bypassing formatting operations. -i Selects binary input only (see -b option). -o Selects binary output only (see -b option). -ta A specifies a character employed as the first character to denote a control line to be passed through without processing. This option applicable to ascii input only. (# is the default value). -e string String is an arbitrary string to be output if an error is detected during data transformations. The default value is: *\t*. Note that if the -b, -i or -o options both return values. -c file File is the source file name of additional + option control data for the projection procedures. -r This options reverses the order of the expected input from longitude-latitude or x-y to latitude-longitude or y-x. -s This options reverses the order of the output from x-y or longitude-latitude to y-x or latitude-longitude. -m mult The cartesian data may be scaled by the mult parameter. When processing data in a forward projection mode the cartesian output values are multiplied by mult other- wise the input cartesian values are divided by mult be- fore inverse projection. If the first two characters of mult are 1/ or 1: then the reciprocal value of mult is employed. -f format Format is a printf format string to control the form of the output values. For inverse projections, the output will be in degrees when this option is employed. If a format is specified for inverse projection the output data will be in decimal degrees. The default format is %.2f for forward projection and DMS for inverse. -[w|W]n N is the number of significant fractional digits to em- ploy for seconds output (when the option is not speci- fied, -w3 is assumed). When -W is employed the fields will be constant width with leading zeroes. -T ulow,uhi,vlow,vhi,res[,umax,vmax] This option creates a set of bivariate Chebyshev poly- nomial coefficients that approximate the selected car- tographic projection on stdout. The values low and hi denote the range of the input where the u or v prefixes apply to respective longitude-x or latitude-y depending upon whether a forward or inverse projection is select- ed. Res is an integer number specifying the power of 10 precision of the approximation. For example, a res of -3 specifies an approximation accuracy better than .001. Umax, and vmax specify maximum degree of the po- lynomials (default: 15). See also: fproj(1). The +args run-line arguments are associated with cartograph- ic parameters and usage varies with projection and for a complete description see Cartographic Projection Procedures for the UNIX Environment-A User's Manual ) They may be ei- ther entered on the run line where they must be preceeded by the + symbol or specified in the file reference by the -c option where the + prefix is optional. The options are pro- cessed in left to right order from the run line followed by processing the entries in the -c file. Reentry of an option is ignored with the first occurance assumed to be the desired value. One or more files (processed in left to right order) specify the source of data to be transformed. A - will specify the location of processing standard input. If no files are specified, the input is assumed to be from stdin. For ASCII input data the two data values must be in the first two white space separated fields and when both input and output are ASCII all trailing portions of the input line are ap- pended to the output line. Input geographic data (longitude and latitude) must be in DMS format and input cartesian data must be in units con- sistent with the ellipsoid major axis or sphere radius un- its. Output geographic coordinates will be in DMS (if the -w switch is not employed) and precise to 0.001" with trail- ing, zero-valued minute-second fields deleted. EXAMPLE The following script proj +proj=utm +lon_0=112w -r <, Eddie Corns writes: > Hi, I am posting this query on behalf of a friend trying to run a > small business. He has currently one telephone line and an answering > machine. He would like to also add a fax machine and wants to find > the most viable options. > If he tries to put them on the same line I presume he needs some kind > of manager box that discriminates fax callers from others. My limited > knowledge of telephony suggests this is done by the bleepy noise the > caller gives when connection is established. [some text deleted] There are two main ways to do this. A lot of the choice depends on what kind of FAX traffic he's expecting. If, like most small businesses, he thinks that random people may call him up and expect to FAX things to him without any notice, then this post is appropriate. Of the two ways, one of them works 100% all of the time, and leads to happy customers. The other one works only some of the time, which is no way to run a business. The basic problem with modem calls (a FAX call is essentially a modem call) is that the calling modem expects the answering modem to make a noise of some sort. If the calling modem made a noise, that would make things a whole lot easier for budget-minded folks. Anyway, some FAX machines will actually make a noise on calling called a "CNG" tone. But this tone only comes with auto-dial calls. Since most impromptu FAXes are not autodialed, but are manually dialed (i.e., you punch in the number as it's going over the line), you cannot count on getting a CNG tone. It is for these reasons that all of the solutions which are based on a "magic" box that you buy that automatically discriminates FAX from voice (and even from modem) calls only work some of the time. It's just not possible to tell, without making any noise, what kind of thing (person, FAX, modem) is calling you. However, all is not lost. You can do this by MAKING the guy at the other end tell you. One way is by having two phone lines (that's expensive, or relatively more so). Another way is by having something called Distinctive Ringing (your telephone company may have another name for it). With distinctive ringing, you get a single telephone line, but that line has multiple numbers. When someone calls number #1, the line rings normally. When someone calls number two, the line rings with two short rings instead of one long one. Some phone companies offer up to four numbers on a single line, all with distinctive ringing cadences. Distinctive ringing costs $5/additional number in my calling area, per month. Installation is low, about $15. There are boxes which can reliably determine which number has been dialed and then route the call accordingly -- as long as you have distinctive ringing. Let's say you have two phone numbers, one for voice and one for data, using distinctive ringing on the same line. You plug the telephone line into one of these box's "IN" port. Then, you plug your answering machine/voice telephone into the "LINE 1" out port. And plug your FAX machine into the "LINE 2" out port. It works beautifully. If you don't believe me, try and send me a FAX, and see if I answer the phone. Boxes. I have heard of three boxes. The one I buy for my clients and use regularly is the Autoline Plus from ITS Communications (800-333-0802) is available for $150, and supports three devices. The Ring Director is available from Hello Direct (800-444-3556) and does the same thing for $100, but only supports two devices. I saw a box in the J&R Catalog as well for about $80. Joel M Snyder, 1103 East Spring Street, Tucson, AZ, 85719 +1 602 882 4094 (voice) 882 4095 (FAX) 882 4093 (data) jms@Opus1.COM Opus One ------------------------------ From: miguel@extro.ucc.su.OZ.AU (Miguel Cruz) Subject: Re: Beep at Start of International Calls Date: Tue, 13 Jul 1993 19:06:04 GMT In article Liron Lightwood writes: >> Almost certainly the beep on calls from abroad is a "bug not a feature". >> I suspect it's a very short burst of the 2600 Hz that is still used on >> MF trunks as a supervisory signal. > I have noticed this beep whenever dialing international calls from > here in Australia. Does this beep always occur in other countries > too? At least here in Australia, the beeps (three little pips) are there to tell the people you are calling that you are paying a lot of money for that call, so they darn well better talk fast and not waste your time. They last about two seconds and since people can't really talk through them (they're pretty loud), we figure that Telecom Australia must make some number of millions of dollars a year by having them (they bill by the second). The competing carrier, Optus, doesn't have them and nobody seems to miss them much. If you're calling your relatives, they already know where you live and they're not likely to be terribly enlightened by these beeps. If you're making a business call you probably aren't that concerned with getting that extra note of urgency. ------------------------------ From: miguel@extro.ucc.su.OZ.AU (Miguel Cruz) Subject: What's Going on With Payphone 2000? Date: Tue, 13 Jul 1993 19:06:04 GMT The last time I was in the USA, I noticed at several airports these AT&T Payphone 2000 things with 24x80 screens and full keyboards. Pretty excited by this (we just got call waiting in Australia), I punched in my Sprint card number (Sprint was the only US company willing to give me a calling card when I didn't have phone service, or even reside, in the US -- MCI and AT&T laughed at me) and it was rejected -- apparently they only take AT&T cards even though for some reason I thought they were interchangeable. So I called a friend from a different phone and asked for her AT&T card number and tried that, only to find that the data terminal functions of the Payphone 2000 are in fact fictional (presumably to begin working sometime around the year 2000). Does anyone know what the story is with these? They seem like a fairly expensive investment to be dropping in airports (I saw them in four or five big cities in the space of a couple weeks) without getting extra revenue from them ... and I don't see what would be stopping them from working -- either the thing has the proper hardware to do data c