Date: 13 Dec 2000 06:15:18 -0500 From: owner-telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org (Telecom Digest) To: telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org Subject: Telecom Digest V2000 #151 Telecom Digest Wednesday, December 13 2000 Volume 2000 : Number 151 In this issue: Staples Pulling the Zero, and higher digits Re: Early NPA Assignments [was Pulling the Zero] Re: Re; Pulling the Zero et al Re: AT&T still charging some people for leasing equipment Re: touchtone surcharge, was: Re: Early NPA Assignments [was Pulling Digit absorbtion Re: AT&T still charging some people for leasing equipment Access Tandem Message Mysteriously in Voice Mailbox - How? new report; Amnesty Int'l on being blocked by censorware DSL related info Re: Message Mysteriously in Voice Mailbox - How? Re: AT&T still charging some people for leasing equipment Re: Pulling the Zero, and higher digits Re: touchtone surcharge, was: Re: Early NPA Assignments [was Pulling Re: AT&T still charging some people for leasing equipment Re: AT&T still charging some people for leasing equipment ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 12 Dec 2000 08:37:44 -0500 From: "Alex Markovich" Subject: Staples Staples Communications is a nationwide advanced integrator of communications solutions. We can answer your company's complete telecommunications needs with the most progressive solutions on the market today. We offer a full portfolio of business communications systems and software, voice, data and network solutions. By partnering with Staples Communications you are putting the strength of multiple vendors to work for you, delivered on a single invoice. We offer an unmatched service and support network with the best-trained professionals in the business. Our national service center is open 24-7-365 to serve you, with service offices across the country for additional local support. With Staples Communications, you have just one number to call for sales, service and support of all of your telecommunications requirements. Our specialists act as consultants, getting to know your company's current and future needs and working with you to design the strongest, most cost-effective solution. Alex Markovich Staples Communications 312-372-2525 - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 12 Dec 2000 09:11:49 -0500 From: Joel B Levin Subject: Pulling the Zero, and higher digits In <3a35aad7$0$1504$53a6afc1@news.erinet.com>, } kamlet@infinet.com (Art Kamlet) wrote: }In article , }Wes Leatherock wrote: }> The digit "1" is the lowest number on a rotary dial, }>and "0" is the highest. } }On a list of area codes, 201 is the lowest numbered code. } }201 < 202 < 203 ..... < 212 < 213 .... } }I'm not talking about fewest pulses, but just 201 as a number. In some old list of area codes or prefixes I once saw (from an internal Telco document) the numbers were sorted in order such that "0" came after "9", not before "1". In the world of dialed numbers, the digits ran in order from 1 to "0" (which was treated as 10, though a single digit). This reminds me of something that I experimented with once, but so long ago that I don't remember when or where. Armed with the realization that "0" really meant a digit of value 10 and with some practice at "dialing" with the switch hook, I attempted to see what would happen if one "dialed" a digit with value of 11 or more. My memory tells me that a couple of times I got some weird internal telco facility to answer, but most values of higher digits did nothing on their own. So I wonder: were there things that were done that used longer pulls than "0"? /JBL - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 12 Dec 2000 09:59:14 -0500 From: davidesan@my-deja.com Subject: Re: Early NPA Assignments [was Pulling the Zero] In article , Wes Leatherock wrote: > > The system had broken down long before 1995. By the early 1950s > a second area code (918) had been added in Oklahoma, which had been > designated as a single area code state and so was assigned 405 at > the inception of area codes. There were many similar examples > around the country in the 1950s. Actually, the system broke down before it even started. New Jersey was supposed to have just 1 NPA -- 201. When the service was rolled out, New Jersey had 2 area codes: 201 and 609. - -- David Esan InformationView Solutions david.esan@informationview.com Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 12 Dec 2000 10:11:39 -0500 From: Wes Leatherock Subject: Re: Re; Pulling the Zero et al On 11 Dec 2000 21:12:27 -0500 Neal McLain wrote: > A non-made-up example: NOrmandy in Ann Arbor, Michigan. > > Before NOrmandy was introduced (about 1953), Ann Arbor > had five-digit numbers in four ranges: > > 2-0000 - 2-9999 > 3-0000 - 3-9999 except for 375 and 397. > 5-0000 - 5-9999 > 8-6000 - 8-9999 (note the 6) > > The exceptions in the 3-XXXX range accessed tie lines > to neighboring exchanges: > > 375 ("3PL") reached Plymouth > 397 ("3YP") reached Ypsilanti > > (There may have been more of these tie lines, but > memory fails me at this point.) > > The initial "8" was indeed curious: > > 8 followed by 6, 7, 8, or 9 led to a valid five- > digit number in the 8-6000 - 8-9999 range. > > 8 followed by any other digit was ingnored. Thus, > one could dial 80 and get the opeator, or 83-1511 > and reach 3-1511 (the University's PBX). > > When NOrmandy was introduced, a dummy 6 was stuck in > front of everything. Thus, 3-1511 became > NOrmandy 3-1511 (and eventually, 663-1511). (Remainder of interesting post about digit-absorbing selectors in step-by-step offices snipped.) When I moved back to Oklahoma City about 1956 or 1957, the number assigned to me was VIctor 3-6056. Oklahoma City was a multi-office city, and from many offices the second digit ("I", actually "4") was absorbed. For several weeks (until we got the Telco to change our number) we were awakened in the wee small hours several times a week by someone, usually, it seemed, by a person who had been having a few beverages and expected to be answered by a machine, not a human being. The "time" number was REgent 6-0561. If you misdialed the first digit "7" as "8" from many offices, you got V ("8") 3-6056, which of course was our number because the I ("4") was unnecessary from some offices and would have been absorbed if it had been dialed. Note "from some offices." This was a real complication in multi-office step cities because it became difficult to design digit absorbing patterns and tandem switching so that you could use the same directory number to call from any office. Pacific Telephone developed "senders" to allow translations in their vast multi-office step complex in Los Angeles and environs, since Bell Labs and Western Electric had not really perceived a need for addressing this problem, step offices, in their view, being only for small towns and originally acquired by Bell operating companies from Automatic Electric or other independent suppliers. In Houston Southwestern Bell addressed the problem by making some local calls "dial Operator," not being able to devise numbering and trunking arrangements that would fit every case. With the addition of pulse signalling to crossbar offices (not originally provided for), there was finally a way to address this question in predominantly step areas without having to replace every office. Wes Leatherock wleath@sandbox.dynip.com - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 12 Dec 2000 10:14:59 -0500 From: Wes Leatherock Subject: Re: AT&T still charging some people for leasing equipment On 12 Dec 2000 04:44:52 -0500 David Lind wrote: > Just in the last 6 months or so Verizon was sued in the South Bay CA, for > still charging customers for old telephone equipment. We're talking an area > near Silicon Valley, not some backwater. This practice was a legacy from GTE, > and Verizon acquired those customers accounts. IIRC, it was a class action > law suit. > > Don't know the staus of the case, but if this can happen in California, with > some very tight telecom regulation, it can happen anywhere. -- David GTE was not prohbited from selling or leasing phones to its customers, as the RBOCs were. Wes Leatherock wleath@sandbox.dynip.com - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 12 Dec 2000 10:24:17 -0500 From: Barry Margolin Subject: Re: touchtone surcharge, was: Re: Early NPA Assignments [was Pulling In article , John McHarry wrote: >On 11 Dec 2000 13:39:18 -0500, dannyb@panix.com (danny burstein) >wrote: > >>In <912ocs$7id$1@panix3.panix.com> roy@panix.com (Roy Smith) writes: >>... >>Alas, keep in mind that removal of the surcharge tends to lead to a >>corresponding general rate increase. > >Despite the fact, at least for a DMS, that it takes more switch >resource to support dialpulse customers. That's irrelevant. The simple fact is that the surcharge is factored into the telco's budget. If you drop it, something else has to increase to make up for the revenue lost. They could presumably replace it with a dialpulse surcharge, but since there are probably far fewer customers with pulse phones than tone phones, the surcharge would have to be enormous in order for the change to be revenue-neutral. I don't really mind the touchtone surcharge. You're not paying for cost, you're paying for the value of the service, and touchtone is a nice feature. - -- Barry Margolin, barmar@genuity.net Genuity, Burlington, MA *** DON'T SEND TECHNICAL QUESTIONS DIRECTLY TO ME, post them to newsgroups. Please DON'T copy followups to me -- I'll assume it wasn't posted to the group. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 12 Dec 2000 11:04:52 -0500 From: jsw@ivgate.omahug.org Subject: Digit absorbtion In TV V2000 #147, Dean Forrest Wright writes: [bobbitt] >But the dummy initial 6 did absolutely nothing when >dialed from another NOrmandy number! One could, for >example, dial: > 3-1511 and reach the University PBX. > 666666663-1511 and reach the University PBX. > 666666666666666666666666660 and reach the operator. >And, of course, the initial 8 continued to do nothing >if the following digit wasn't 6, 7, 8, or 9. So, one Sounds what we used to call 'digit absorbing', which was quite common on SxS switches. Certain (prepended) digits simply caused the unit to return to normal, thus 'swallowing' the absorbed digit(s). Yes, you could dial an infinite number of absorbed digits, resulting in a wide variety of stupid.phone.tricks. ;-) True 7-digit dialing on SxS required a huge number of selectors, and obsorbing 1-2 digits when not necessary was a considerable saving in equipment cost, maintenance, etc. I remember many cases where calls could be made with either 5 or 7 digits due to this process, and yes, everybody knew this, even though I never remember seeing it in the front of any phone book. Good day JSW - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 12 Dec 2000 12:08:32 -0500 From: Joseph Singer Subject: Re: AT&T still charging some people for leasing equipment 11 Dec 2000 19:00:50 -0500 "Marshall A. Levin" wrote: >I just recently learned that AT&T has been charging my grandparents a >monthly fee, admittedly a rather small one, for leasing some really old >rotary-dial phones. I think it has been going on for over 20 years. The >charge was very small, and they never were quite sure what it was, but they >kept paying it when it showed up on their phone bill. I think we figured >out they'd paid over $2000 to lease these rotary phones, many times more >than the actual cost of the equipment. > >My dad tried to help them sort this mess out and called AT&T to complain. >His argument was that AT&T was being unethical in continuing to charge >people to lease such old equipment and that most of the people who were >still paying for it were probably elderly people who didn't understand what >they were being charged for and that if they understood the charges would >most likely elect to discontinue leasing the equipment (who doesn't OWN a >phone these days?). AT&T's response was that they don't have any way of >knowing how old the subscriber is and can't just guess as to whether the >subscriber is confused or really wants to continue leasing the equipment. >Their argument is that if someone doesn't understand their bill they should >call and find out what they're being charged for and AT&T would be happy to >explain the charges. They have a point, but I suspect this goes on a lot. > >Anyway, we got AT&T to stop charging them, issue a $100 refund and convinced >them to waive the requirement that the leased equipment, which was probably >lost years ago, be returned. I think AT&T was *more* than generous to give a $100 credit and discontinue charging for this. Just because someone forgets what they're paying for isn't an excuse. This charge was nothing new if they'd been paying it for years. If there was any doubt what it was a simple call to AT&T would have cleared that up. If they've been paying "thousands" of dollars in rental fees that's only because they didn't investigate what they'd be paying for. You can buy the equivalent phone for $35 or so brand new or mostly these days you can pick up the original equipment for $5 at a garage sale. Ignorance is no defense. - --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Joseph Singer Seattle, Washington USA [ICQ pgr] +1 206 405 2052 [voice mail] +1 206 493 0706 [FAX] - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 12 Dec 2000 14:01:17 -0500 From: Phil Smiley Subject: Access Tandem What constitutes an Access Tandem. What (aside from the switching equipment) is required? Thank You, Smiley - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 12 Dec 2000 16:23:03 -0500 From: "Pete Ritter" Subject: Message Mysteriously in Voice Mailbox - How? Can anyone offer ideas on how this happened? My wife received a message in her Sprint PCS voice mailbox. It was her father saying "OK. Your English no entiendo nada." ("I don't understand your English"). My wife's parents live in Mexico and speak virtually no English. When we asked him about this message, he said that he never left such a message but that he did receive a call from a woman speaking English and that's what he said to her. Does anyone have any idea how the message could have appeared in her VMbox? Other possibly relevant information is: The mailbox says that the call (that left the message) was from 972 818 xxxx which I believe means Grapevine, TX. We have tried calling this number but get no answer. We've tried reverse lookups on the 'net without success. My wife uses a cut-rate LD carrier with a 972 local access number to call her parents, sometimes from her PCS phone, so the carrier has an association between her parent's TN and her TN in their database (it's a stretch, but could a bug in their software have caused this if the caller was calling through that carrier? But how did it get into her Sprint PCS VMbox?). Her phone's call records show that she had made a few calls earlier the day of the mysterious message but none close to the time of the message according to the VMbox and none that day to the LD carrier. Can anyone tell (from the LERG maybe) what carrier owns 972 818? Also, can anyone lookup for me the mysterious TN (off the newsgroup)? Any ideas and help are appreciated. Thanks. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 12 Dec 2000 17:22:59 -0500 From: Bennett Haselton Subject: new report; Amnesty Int'l on being blocked by censorware [sent to journalists on Peacefire's press contacts list] Peacefire's latest report was released this morning: http://www.peacefire.org/amnesty-intercepted/ "Amnesty Intercepted: Global human rights groups blocked by Web censoring software" This report, released jointly with a statement from Amnesty International, lists sites on Amnesty, their affiliates, and other human rights Web pages that were blocked by one or more of Cyber Patrol, Bess, SurfWatch, or CYBERsitter. Amnesty International brought the issue to our attention as a result of complaints that they (and we) were getting from students, who were unable to access Amnesty and other Web sites from school. The 30 sites listed in the report include Amnesty International Israel (blocked by Cyber Patrol), the NYU law school chapter of Amnesty (blocked by SurfWatch), and Casa-Alianza.org, an organization documenting violations of children's human rights in Central America (blocked by Bess). These sites were blocked due to being classified under categories such as "sexually explicit", "drugs", "violence", or "hate speech". (They were specifically *not* blocked for being classified as "political" pages, even though some schools do block students from accessing pages under "political" categories.) Amnesty USA's media director, Karen Schneider, released this statement to accompany the report: "It's extremely unfortunate that students in schools across the United States are inadvertently being denied access to portions of Amnesty International Web sites by these software programs. These students should be lauded -- not thwarted -- for their efforts to obtain important human rights information." Amnesty USA's phone number is 202-544-0200; I'm at 425-649-9024. -Bennett bennett@peacefire.org http://www.peacefire.org (425) 649 9024 - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 12 Dec 2000 21:28:24 -0500 From: "Marco Shaw" Subject: DSL related info I'm a new guy to the whole telco side of the Internet, and would like to know more. I hear talk of splitters, coils, bridge taps, drops, protectors, etc. What are some good references with a tendancy to look more at it's DSL capabilities? Books and online articles... Thanks, Marco - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 12 Dec 2000 21:44:13 -0500 From: Wes Leatherock Subject: Re: Message Mysteriously in Voice Mailbox - How? On 12 Dec 2000 16:23:03 -0500 Pete Ritter wrote: > Can anyone offer ideas on how this happened? > > My wife received a message in her Sprint PCS voice mailbox. It was her > father saying "OK. Your English no entiendo nada." ("I don't understand > your English"). My wife's parents live in Mexico and speak virtually no > English. When we asked him about this message, he said that he never left > such a message but that he did receive a call from a woman speaking English > and that's what he said to her. Does anyone have any idea how the message > could have appeared in her VMbox? > > Other possibly relevant information is: > > The mailbox says that the call (that left the message) was from 972 818 xxxx > which I believe means Grapevine, TX. We have tried calling this number but > get no answer. Grapevine is in area code 817, as it has since NPAs were first established. 972 818 is in Renner. Wes Leatherock wleath@sandbox.dynip.com - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 12 Dec 2000 21:54:49 -0500 From: Wes Leatherock Subject: Re: AT&T still charging some people for leasing equipment On 12 Dec 2000 12:08:32 -0500 Joseph Singer wrote: > 11 Dec 2000 19:00:50 -0500 "Marshall A. Levin" wrote: [ ... much snipped about AT&T charges for leased equipment ... ] > >Anyway, we got AT&T to stop charging them, issue a $100 refund and convinced > >them to waive the requirement that the leased equipment, which was probably > >lost years ago, be returned. > > I think AT&T was *more* than generous to give a $100 credit and > discontinue charging for this. Just because someone forgets what they're > paying for isn't an excuse. This charge was nothing new if they'd been > paying it for years. If there was any doubt what it was a simple call to > AT&T would have cleared that up. If they've been paying "thousands" of > dollars in rental fees that's only because they didn't investigate what > they'd be paying for. You can buy the equivalent phone for $35 or so brand > new or mostly these days you can pick up the original equipment for $5 at a > garage sale. Ignorance is no defense. A few observations: 1. The original post said nothing about the equipment being unsatisfactory or unserviceable, just an old and perhaps unstylish model. The equipment provided by telephone operating companies (Bell and otherwise) when they provided the equipment and on-site maintenance as part of the monthly charge was engineered to last for a very long time, and to require minimal maintenance. It appears that AT&T provided equipment in good working order. 2. Hardly any telephones sold today are the equivalent in reliability and maintainability. It's doubtful there are any new ones for sale today, at $35 or any other price, since today's economics militate against making such a robust piece of equipment. 3. Depending on the model, the old phone(s) may be worth much more than $5 each. Many have become collectibles, and their value is enhanced if they are still working. 4. For a time, and perhaps still, the only place to get a new (refurbished like new) Princess telephone was to lease one from AT&T. They were apparently in much demand and AT&T refused to offer any for sale--only for lease. Wes Leatherock wleath@sandbox.dynip.com - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 12 Dec 2000 21:58:56 -0500 From: Wes Leatherock Subject: Re: Pulling the Zero, and higher digits On 12 Dec 2000 09:11:49 -0500 Joel B Levin wrote: [ ... text deleted ... ] > This reminds me of something that I experimented with once, but so long ago > that I don't remember when or where. Armed with the realization that "0" > really meant a digit of value 10 and with some practice at "dialing" with the > switch hook, I attempted to see what would happen if one "dialed" a digit with > value of 11 or more. My memory tells me that a couple of times I got some > weird internal telco facility to answer, but most values of higher digits did > nothing on their own. So I wonder: were there things that were done that used > longer pulls than "0"? > > /JBL Nope. There was no piece of equipment to generate more than 10 pulses, and selectors and connectors were physical pieces of equipment with 10 levels and 10 contacts per level. Wes Leatherock wleath@sandbox.dynip.com - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 12 Dec 2000 22:05:50 -0500 From: Wes Leatherock Subject: Re: touchtone surcharge, was: Re: Early NPA Assignments [was Pulling On 11 Dec 2000 20:22:58 -0500 John McHarry wrote: > On 11 Dec 2000 13:39:18 -0500, dannyb@panix.com (danny burstein) > wrote: > > >In <912ocs$7id$1@panix3.panix.com> roy@panix.com (Roy Smith) writes: > >... > >Alas, keep in mind that removal of the surcharge tends to lead to a > >corresponding general rate increase. > > Despite the fact, at least for a DMS, that it takes more switch > resource to support dialpulse customers. That has been true in common control offices from the time touch-tone registers were provided in No. 5 crossbar. If I recall correctly, the first No. 5 XB offices had only dial pulse registers and MF registers for interoffice calls. Were touch-tone receivers ever provided in Panel-Type and No. 1 Crossbar offices? Originally No. 1 XB did not even have MF signalling capabilities (either inbound or outbound). It was conceived of for use in multi-office cities which were all Panel-Type and even when one No. 1 XB office signaled another 1XB office both emulated Panel-Type offices with revertive pulsing. Wes Leatherock wleath@sandbox.dynip.com - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 13 Dec 2000 04:01:32 -0500 From: murray@pa.dec.com (Hal Murray) Subject: Re: AT&T still charging some people for leasing equipment > 1. The original post said nothing about the equipment being > unsatisfactory or unserviceable, just an old and perhaps unstylish > model. The equipment provided by telephone operating companies > (Bell and otherwise) when they provided the equipment and on-site > maintenance as part of the monthly charge was engineered to last > for a very long time, and to require minimal maintenance. It > appears that AT&T provided equipment in good working order. > 2. Hardly any telephones sold today are the equivalent in > reliability and maintainability. It's doubtful there are any > new ones for sale today, at $35 or any other price, since today's > economics militate against making such a robust piece of equipment. Mine still works fine. I admit I don't make a lot of calls. I've had it for over 20 years. I don't know how long it had been there when I moved in. When PacBell went out of that part of the business, they offered it to me. I forget the price. I think it was only a few $. I remember thinking that it seemed like a good deal given the reliability of the phones I had used. In return for my check, they sent me a sticker to put next to the "Bell System Property" stamped on the base. I'll bring in what it says if anybody is interested. - -- These are my opinions, not necessarily my employers. I hate spam. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 13 Dec 2000 04:54:54 -0500 From: "Gail M. Hall" Subject: Re: AT&T still charging some people for leasing equipment On 12 Dec 2000 12:08:32 -0500, in comp.dcom.telecom, you (Joseph Singer ) wrote: >11 Dec 2000 19:00:50 -0500 "Marshall A. Levin" wrote: > >>Anyway, we got AT&T to stop charging them, issue a $100 refund and convinced >>them to waive the requirement that the leased equipment, which was probably >>lost years ago, be returned. > >I think AT&T was *more* than generous to give a $100 credit and >discontinue charging for this. Just because someone forgets what they're >paying for isn't an excuse. This charge was nothing new if they'd been >paying it for years. If there was any doubt what it was a simple call to >AT&T would have cleared that up. If they've been paying "thousands" of >dollars in rental fees that's only because they didn't investigate what >they'd be paying for. You can buy the equivalent phone for $35 or so brand >new or mostly these days you can pick up the original equipment for $5 at a >garage sale. Ignorance is no defense. I too think AT&T was generous to refund the old couple $100. I don't know how it was in other states, but when Ohio Bell customers were told that the equipment belonged to AT&T and AT&T started charging a rental fee, this information was very clearly stated in mail to customers. As I remember it, we heard from both Ohio Bell and AT&T. Not only that, this now elderly couple was quite a bit younger back then and probably can't use old age as an excuse -- unless they are in their nineties now. When the breakup happened and phone equipment was given over to AT&T, we continued to rent our phones for a few months. When I called Ohio Bell to ask them to change us from party line service to a single user line, they told me that we would need to get different phones. They said phones for party lines were made different from phones for single-user lines. So we decided this was a good time to buy our phones. We turned our leased phones in at an AT&T store and went to Sears and got some new phones. Amazingly, we paid $10 each for the phones. Most of the phones were quite a bit more, though. I was surprised to find phones for $10. The phones didn't last long, but they did well for a good while. One reason we rented our phones as long as we did was that in order to use the new phones, we had to get someone to put the correct plug-in to the wall. One of my sons got what was needed from Radio Shack, and we were in business. We switched to a single user line because I bought a modem for my computer, and they said I needed a single user line for the modem to work right. Back then, too, we had to call the phone company to report that we were using a modem and give them the numbers in the booklet that came with the modem. My modem was pretty much state of the art then -- 1200 baud. :-) A big improvement over the 300 baud that most people had back then. It's too bad if AT&T didn't approach the people more about buying their phones, but it may be that AT&T did do that and the people just didn't pay attention. We are so bombarded by ads these days that most of us get to the point we just don't pay any attention to any of them. I wish I had a dollar for every ad we have gotten from Ameritech trying to sell us cable television service! Grief! They are supposed to be in the telephone business. - -- Gail from Ohio - -- - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ End of Telecom Digest V2000 #151 ******************************** Date: 13 Dec 2000 22:44:14 -0500 From: owner-telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org (Telecom Digest) To: telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org Subject: Telecom Digest V2000 #152 Telecom Digest Wednesday, December 13 2000 Volume 2000 : Number 152 In this issue: Re: AT&T still charging some people for leasing equipment Re: Pulling the Zero, and higher digits Re: Early NPA Assignments [was Pulling the Zero] Re: Early NPA Assignments [was Pulling the Zero] Re: AT&T still charging some people for leasing equipment Blast from the past - AMIS Re: Early NPA Assignments [was Pulling the Zero] Re: Early NPA Assignments [was Pulling the Zero] Voice & Data Comm. Analyst Role in Toronto; 60-65K+ Re: NEED AUTOMATIC 2-LINE BRIDGE Re: AT&T still charging some people for leasing equipment Re: AT&T still charging some people for leasing equipment Re: AT&T still charging some people for leasing equipment Re: Access Tandem early DTMF, was: Re: Early NPA Assignments [was Pulling the Zero] Re: AT&T still charging some people for leasing equipment ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 13 Dec 2000 07:36:39 -0500 From: Roy Smith Subject: Re: AT&T still charging some people for leasing equipment Wes Leatherock wrote: > 2. Hardly any telephones sold today are the equivalent in > reliability and maintainability. It's doubtful there are any > new ones for sale today, at $35 or any other price, since today's > economics militate against making such a robust piece of equipment. There used to be a saying that if you dropped a WECo phone off a desk, the floor would suffer more damage than the phone. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 13 Dec 2000 08:53:39 -0500 From: Linc Madison Subject: Re: Pulling the Zero, and higher digits In article , Wes Leatherock wrote: > On 12 Dec 2000 09:11:49 -0500 Joel B Levin wrote: > > > So I wonder: were there things that were done that used longer > > pulls than "0"? > > Nope. There was no piece of equipment to generate more than 10 > pulses, and selectors and connectors were physical pieces of > equipment with 10 levels and 10 contacts per level. My brother once tried to call from an airport rotary-dial payphone to (401) xxx-xxxx, but kept getting connected to someone in Kentucky, because 0-401-xxx-xxxx was picked up by the switch as 0-502-xxx-xxxx with each of the numbers 1 through 9 shifted over by one in the rest of the number. The 0's went through as 0's, though. He finally had to give up and just dial '0' and give the number to the operator; I got to call AT&T and get the call re-rated to direct-dial calling-card instead of operator-assisted calling-card, back when they still did that as a courtesy to folks using equipment incapable of 0+ dialing. Of course, they also took off the charges for the two attempts that went through to 502. This was probably in about 1982 or 1983. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 13 Dec 2000 08:59:21 -0500 From: Linc Madison Subject: Re: Early NPA Assignments [was Pulling the Zero] In article <915efl$et5$1@nnrp1.deja.com>, wrote: > In article 100000@mail.sandbox.dynip.com>, > Wes Leatherock wrote: > > > > The system had broken down long before 1995. By the early 1950s a > > second area code (918) had been added in Oklahoma, which had been > > designated as a single area code state and so was assigned 405 at > > the inception of area codes. There were many similar examples > > around the country in the 1950s. > > Actually, the system broke down before it even started. New Jersey > was supposed to have just 1 NPA -- 201. When the service was rolled > out, New Jersey had 2 area codes: 201 and 609. No, actually, the area code system made it for more than a decade before area code 201 split to form 609. Area code 201 was assigned with the original rollout in 1947, but 609 didn't take effect until 1958. The original area code system was rolled out for operator dialing and routing in 1947. Customers couldn't dial the area code, at least not generally, until several years later. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 13 Dec 2000 09:23:03 -0500 From: Linc Madison Subject: Re: Early NPA Assignments [was Pulling the Zero] In article <3a35aad7$0$1504$53a6afc1@news.erinet.com>, Art Kamlet wrote: > In article , > Wes Leatherock wrote: > > > > 201 is not the lowest area code. These were assigned in > >the days of rotary dials, and zero was 10 pulses, not zero > >pulses. > > > > The digit "1" is the lowest number on a rotary dial, > >and "0" is the highest. > > > On a list of area codes, 201 is the lowest numbered code. > > 201 < 202 < 203 ..... < 212 < 213 .... > > I'm not talking about fewest pulses, but just 201 as a number. > > It was deliberately chosen as the "first" number because Bell Labs > was there and the area code folks wanted 201 for themselves. In > those days, if that's how you wanted it, so be it. It also fit perfectly well with the general scheme of things. In 1947, New Jersey had only a single area code, but it had one of the highest inbound call volumes of any single-code states, maybe even the highest. (After all, the two largest metropolitan areas in New Jersey are New York City and Philadelphia, leading to a lot of cross-border traffic.) Thus, Single area code per state ==> n0x code + High traffic volume ==> low dial-pull total == New Jersey ==> 201 It had very little, if anything, to do with the presence of Bell Labs in New Jersey. Maybe D.C. should've been 201 and New Jersey 202, but that's about as far as you could stretch the story. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 13 Dec 2000 10:00:36 -0500 From: Wes Leatherock Subject: Re: AT&T still charging some people for leasing equipment On 13 Dec 2000 04:54:54 -0500 Gail M. Hall wrote: > I too think AT&T was generous to refund the old couple $100. I don't know > how it was in other states, but when Ohio Bell customers were told that the > equipment belonged to AT&T and AT&T started charging a rental fee, this > information was very clearly stated in mail to customers. As I remember > it, we heard from both Ohio Bell and AT&T. Not only that, this now elderly > couple was quite a bit younger back then and probably can't use old age as > an excuse -- unless they are in their nineties now. > > When the breakup happened and phone equipment was given over to AT&T, we > continued to rent our phones for a few months. When I called Ohio Bell to > ask them to change us from party line service to a single user line, they > told me that we would need to get different phones. They said phones for > party lines were made different from phones for single-user lines. So we > decided this was a good time to buy our phones. We turned our leased > phones in at an AT&T store and went to Sears and got some new phones. > Amazingly, we paid $10 each for the phones. Most of the phones were quite > a bit more, though. I was surprised to find phones for $10. The phones > didn't last long, but they did well for a good while. > > One reason we rented our phones as long as we did was that in order to use > the new phones, we had to get someone to put the correct plug-in to the > wall. One of my sons got what was needed from Radio Shack, and we were in > business. > > We switched to a single user line because I bought a modem for my computer, > and they said I needed a single user line for the modem to work right. > Back then, too, we had to call the phone company to report that we were > using a modem and give them the numbers in the booklet that came with the > modem. > > My modem was pretty much state of the art then -- 1200 baud. :-) A big > improvement over the 300 baud that most people had back then. > > It's too bad if AT&T didn't approach the people more about buying their > phones, but it may be that AT&T did do that and the people just didn't pay > attention. > > We are so bombarded by ads these days that most of us get to the point we > just don't pay any attention to any of them. I wish I had a dollar for > every ad we have gotten from Ameritech trying to sell us cable television > service! Grief! They are supposed to be in the telephone business. > > -- > Gail from Ohio I am 72 years old and I resent being called a "victim" because I am "elderly." Most of the people I know--yes, into their 90s--have not taken leave of their senses. (Yes, I know that there are some suffering from Alzheimer's or other terrible disorders, and they are to be pitied, at any age, and are excluded from this characterization.) Recently we have heard a great deal about telemarketing fraud and about how "elderly" people are more like to be taken in by such schemes than younger people because they are more "trusting." A couple of the reports have had breakdowns of telemarketing fraud victims by age cohort. The percentage of the "elderly" taken in by telemarketing fraud was only a tiny percentage higher than that of younger cohorts, and probably within the margin of error. Most of the older people I know are probably less "trusting" than younger people, having the benefit of years of experience. Some young people are dumb, ignorant or feckless, or all three; so are some older people. Quite likely the older people who fit that mold were the same way when they were younger. In Oklahoma, not only did Southwestern Bell and AT&T both put out information about the transfer of telephones to AT&T by court order, they specifically noted you could buy your own phone, and as I recall the information pages of the phone book even had diagrams for installing or converting your existing connecting block or outlet to the proper jack. On 13 Dec 2000 07:36:39 -0500 Roy Smith wrote: > Wes Leatherock wrote: >> 2. Hardly any telephones sold today are the equivalent in >> reliability and maintainability. It's doubtful there are any >> new ones for sale today, at $35 or any other price, since today's >> economics militate against making such a robust piece of equipment. > >There used to be a saying that if you dropped a WECo phone off a desk, >the floor would suffer more damage than the phone. This wasn't just a humorous saying and was little or no exaggeration. I sometimes dropped mine on the floor (pushed it off the desk or table while I was reaching for something), and saw many other people do so, and it was practically unknown for the telephone to have damage, although the floor or items of furniture it hit might have suffered. Including unlimited in-home service in the package price of the service was a powerful incentive for telcos to provide this kind of reliability in the apparatus. Wes Leatherock wleath@sandbox.dynip.com - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 13 Dec 2000 10:55:36 -0500 From: John Gerlich Subject: Blast from the past - AMIS Does anyone know where I can get the analog AMIS specs. The Information Industry Assoc. no longer seems to be in business in D.C. They used to sell the spec. I need to implement AMIS to a Trilog system. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 13 Dec 2000 12:06:21 -0500 From: "Ed Ellers" Subject: Re: Early NPA Assignments [was Pulling the Zero] wrote: "Although DTMF was made available to the public in 1964 or 1965..." November 1963, apparently a few days before the assassination of President Kennedy. There had been technical trials as early as 1960 and market trials in 1962. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 13 Dec 2000 12:06:26 -0500 From: "Ed Ellers" Subject: Re: Early NPA Assignments [was Pulling the Zero] Wes Leatherock wrote: "The system had broken down long before 1995. By the early 1950s a second area code (918) had been added in Oklahoma, which had been designated as a single area code state and so was assigned 405 at the inception of area codes. There were many similar examples around the country in the 1950s." Including Kentucky, which initially had only one NPA (502) but added NPA 606 fairly quickly as the Lexington metro area (and the suburbs of Cincinnati) grew. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 13 Dec 2000 13:30:31 -0500 From: "ITnmotion" Subject: Voice & Data Comm. Analyst Role in Toronto; 60-65K+ I am hoping that this is an appropriate site to inform visitors of this newsgroup about a Telecommunications opportunity in Toronto. I could really use some help finding a Voice/Data Communications Analyst with strong Meridian PBX and IVR programming and support experience. If you are interested, please review our posting below and email a resume to lsherman@itnmotion.com. You can also visit us at www.itnmotion.com to view our current list of available opportunities. Thanks kindly! Voice/Data Communications Analyst; 60-65K+; Toronto Required Skills: - - Meridian PBX programming - - IVR - - Data connections - - Frame Relay - - T1 Lines Desirable Skills: - - DAVOX Predictive Dialer - - UNIX - - Networking - - Credit Card Processing Systems Job Description: Our client, a growing and successful private label credit card processing company, is offering an exceptional opportunity for a Voice/Data Communications Analyst. The successful candidate will be responsible for ordering and maintaining data links and programming on the PBX. More details are available for qualified candidates. Our client is offering the following generous benefits: - - A savings plan with a minimum of 25% interest - - A minimum of 3 weeks vacation - - Extended health and dental care benefits - - Short term and long term disability benefits - - Life Insurance Benefits - - Educational Assistance - - Mortgage Subsidy - -- Lisa Sherman Manager, Recruitment Services ITnmotion 4950 Yonge Street, Suite 208 North York, ON M2N 6K1 Tel: 416-250-2604 Fax: 416-250-2629 lsherman@itnmotion.com www.itnmotion.com - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 13 Dec 2000 15:27:46 -0500 From: Cboone@Earthlink.net Subject: Re: NEED AUTOMATIC 2-LINE BRIDGE Contact Teltone (www.teltone.com) and check their M106E DISA box.. its what you want (but it is not cheap!)..allows hookflashing and dialing a second number by use of long * and #...hangs up after pretermined time OR dialtone OR loop current... Nice box...their older M106 version was used quite a bit by companies wanting DISA on a PBX that didnt support it....or didnt want to pay the price. Chris > > >Jack Powers > > > > >> I'm looking for a device that will answer one line with dial tone > > >> from a second line and permit calls out on the second line. > > >> It must hang up the second line when the caller on the first > > >> one hangs up (determined by silence?). > > >> > > >> I believe that sutch gadgets used to be popular for indirect access > > >> to WATS lines, but I can't find one now. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 13 Dec 2000 16:53:57 -0500 From: oldbear@arctos.com (The Old Bear) Subject: Re: AT&T still charging some people for leasing equipment On 13 Dec 2000 04:54:54 -0500 Gail M. Hall wrote: > I too think AT&T was generous to refund the old couple $100. I don't know > how it was in other states, but when Ohio Bell customers were told that the > equipment belonged to AT&T and AT&T started charging a rental fee, this > information was very clearly stated in mail to customers. As I remember > it, we heard from both Ohio Bell and AT&T. Not only that, this now elderly > couple was quite a bit younger back then and probably can't use old age as > an excuse -- unless they are in their nineties now. from The Detroit News (December 21, 1995) Telephones ring up ripoff for consumers who pay lease fees year after year - --------------------------------------- By Kathy Kristof Talk about a bad deal. Anne Werner paid somewhere in excess of $600 for a $10 phone -- and she didn't even get to keep it. Werner absent-mindedly leased a telephone, paying between $4 and $7 per month for the clunky -- but dependable -- rotary-dial relic she'd had since long before the breakup of Ma Bell in 1984. It wasn't until she moved last year that she realized she still had the phone in a little-used bedroom of her house, and was paying through the nose for it. "I'm embarrassed to admit I did this," says Werner, director of community services at United Seniors Health Cooperative in Washington, D.C. "I'm a consumer advocate. I should have known better." But when it comes to phones, millions of people do what Werner did. They lease -- paying many times more for the leased equipment than they'd ever dream of spending for a comparable phone purchase. Sometimes consumers even forget about the phones, shoving them in closets and attics when they buy newer models. But they continue to pay lease fees that range from $4 to $20.95 per month -- every month, for years on end. AT&T reports that 5.5 million of its customers lease their phones -- and 90 percent of them have been leasing since Ma Bell broke up, spinning off a plethora of local and long-distance corporate offspring, way back in 1984. GTE has an estimated 2 million leasing customers, too. And somewhere in the neighborhood of 3.5 million additional consumers lease phones from a handful of other telecommunications firms, industry experts estimate. Together, that's about 11 million people, paying in excess of $55 million a month. "This is a consumer ripoff at its finest," says Jordan Clark, president of United Homeowners Association, a Washington, D.C., consumer group. Clark was introduced to the issue last year when he learned that his elderly father-in-law was leasing two phones from AT&T. The cumulative cost for those phones, which naturally had to be returned, was $1,100 - -- about $110 a year, Clark says. "We were outraged. The immediate thought that came to mind was how many other people out there are doing this?" When he found out, Clark started to campaign for change. He's now trying to persuade the Federal Communications Commission to sponsor telephone-leasing reforms -- or at least to demand more disclosure from the phone companies. However, at a time when Congress is debating a overhaul of the entire telecommunications industry, Clark's efforts have met with little success. Regulators simply have bigger fish to fry, Clark sighs. Besides, telecommunications giants argue that consumers choose to lease, and government ought not to mess with free market choices. To a great degree that's true. Almost everyone who leases a phone has the option to turn in the phone at any time. (A handful of leasing customers has three-month contracts, but nearly everyone else leases from month-to-month.) And, despite the high cost, there are a few good reasons to lease. For instance, if you want to try out new phone equipment before you buy, it might be wise to lease it for a few months. If you're in temporary quarters and don't want to drag phones -- along with all your other worldly possessions -- to a new place in a few months, it might make sense to lease, too. Virtually every department and discount store in the country sells phones at prices ranging from $9.95 to $200. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 13 Dec 2000 16:56:02 -0500 From: oldbear@arctos.com (The Old Bear) Subject: Re: AT&T still charging some people for leasing equipment Some historical notes in the form of old AT&T press releases: - ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- | Note: AT&T closed its Phone Center Stores in 1996. AT&T no longer | makes, sells or leases telephone or telecommunications equipment. | The Consumer Products group is now part of Lucent Technologies, an | independent company spun off from AT&T in 1996. Lucent still sells | and services AT&T branded telephones. For information about Lucent's | products and services, call Lucent at 1-888-4-LUCENT (1-888-458-2368) | or visit Lucent's website http://www.lucent.com/ FOR RELEASE MONDAY, FEBUARY 1, 1988 Leased residential phone prices up - ---------------------------------- PARSIPPANY, N.J. -- AT&T today announced price increases for its leased residential telephones, guaranteed the new prices until 1990 and added new products and services to the line of equipment it makes available for customers to lease. The company said the price increases range from 45 cents to 95 cents per month and become effective in March, April or May, depending on the customer's billing cycle. Lease customers will be informed of the new prices beginning today with messages printed on their bills or through direct mail notices. All lease customers are scheduled to receive at least 30 days' notice before the new prices take effect. "This is our first price increase in two years and we're freezing these new prices until Jan. 1, 1990," said Douglas Quinn, AT&T vice president for leased services. "We're also adding new products and services in response to requests made during interviews we held with thousands of customers. We're committed to meeting our lease customers' needs now and in the years to come." Later this year, the company will begin offering customers the option to pay their lease bills in person at selected locations. Currently, AT&T accepts payment for leased phones through the mail. The company said it will change the guidelines for shipping replacement leased telephones. AT&T currently will, at no charge, exchange a broken leased phone at an AT&T Phone Center or an AT&T authorized service agency, or ship a replacement to a customer's home in three to five days. AT&T has authorized service agencies in hardware stores, pharmacies and similar small businesses across the country. While the company will continue this service, as of today it will send a replacement phone free of charge by next day delivery service when an AT&T representative determines the loss of a broken leased phone creates a hardship for a customer. AT&T also will continue to make exchanges for a phone of a different color at no charge. After the price increases, AT&T's Traditional rotary telephone will lease for $2.70 per month instead of $2.25. The Traditional Touch-Tone monthly lease price will rise to $4.25 from $3.55. The Trimline and Princess rotary telephones will lease for $4.75 per month instead of $3.95. The Trimline and Princess Touch-Tone monthly lease price will rise to $5.50 per month from $4.60. AT&T's Enhanced Trimline phone, which has a control that can adjust the receiver's volume and a button to redial the last number called, will lease for $6.70 instead of $5.75. On March 1, AT&T will begin leasing a phone that will dial one of 12 stored numbers at the touch of a button. The phone has a lighted dial with buttons that can redial the last number called and place calls on hold. It also has a control that amplifies the sound in the receiver's earpiece. The Memory Telephone 410 will lease for $8.85 per month. AT&T recently began leasing the AT&T G-6 volume control handset, which customers can attach to many existing telephones. The handset is useful to customers with hearing impairments because they can boost the volume in its earpiece by up to 30 percent over the sound level in a normal receiver. AT&T also recommends the use of the handset to other customers for use in noisy locations such as kitchens or dens. The handset leases for 95 cents per month. The company said it plans to begin leasing more products requested by customers, including cordless phones and answering machines, later this year. FOR RELEASE WEDNESDAY, JUNE 29, 1988 Leased product line expanded; includes cordless phones - ------------------------------------------------------ PARSIPPANY, N.J. -- AT&T today announced that on July 1 it will begin leasing cordless telephones to customers for the first time. The company said it will offer three other telephones with special features, including a two-line telephone, for lease on Aug. 1. These phones will join AT&T's current lease product line, which includes traditional and Trimline* phones. "We're leasing cordless phones in response to requests made in thousands of customer interviews," said Douglas Quinn, vice president of lease services for AT&T. "We've found that many lease customers want both the convenience offered by phones with special features and the service that leasing provides." The two available cordless phones are the AT&T Models 5200 and 5310. Both feature sound quality as clear as a traditional AT&T phone's and a power system that works for up to seven days without recharging. AT&T will provide lease customers free replacement antennas and batteries for the phones, when necessary. An advanced security system in the phones selects one of more than 65,000 security codes each time they are returned to the bases that charge their batteries. The Model 5310 will enable lease customers to dial any of nine telephone numbers stored in the phone's memory by touching just two buttons. The phone also features a lighted dial and an out-of-range alert that beeps when the user moves to a location that reduces the phone's effectiveness. The Model 5200 will lease for $19.95 per month and the Model 5310 for $24.95 per month. On Aug. 1, AT&T will begin leasing the Traditional Telephone 100, the Feature Telephone 400 and the AT&T Two-Line Telephone 412. The Traditional Telephone 100 stores the last phone number dialed and redials it at the press of a button. It also has a mute button that turns off the receiver's microphone to allow a speaker to talk with someone in the room without being overheard on the other end of the phone line. The Feature Telephone 400 has a low silhouette and offers the same features as the Traditional Telephone 100 plus a lighted dial and a control that enables customers to adjust the volume in the receiver's earpiece. The Two-Line Telephone 412 is designed for customers with two local telephone company lines. With this phone, lease customers can make or receive calls on either line, put either line on hold, or conference both lines together for a three-way conversation. The Traditional Telephone 100 will lease for $5.50 per month, the Feature Telephone 400 for $6.70 per month, and the Two-Line Telephone 412 for $14.35 per month. Prices for the consumer phones AT&T currently leases range from $2.70 per month to $8.85 per month. Customers leasing AT&T phones get immediate, free, over-the-counter replacement of a damaged phone with the same model at more than 1,000 locations across the country, including AT&T-owned Phone Centers* and AT&T-authorized Service Agencies. AT&T also will mail replacement phones to customers free of charge when a leased phone is damaged or defective. If a customer leases a phone that is available in more than one color, the customer can exchange that phone for one of another color at no extra charge. The company said also it would make a speakerphone available for lease later in the year. With a speakerphone, one or more people in a room can carry on a phone conversation without using a telephone receiver. FOR RELEASE THURSDAY, NOVEMBER 2, 1989 Residential telephone lease service prices up - --------------------------------------------- PARSIPPANY, N.J. -- AT&T today announced price increases for its residential telephone lease service and guaranteed the new prices until 1992. The price increases range from 25 cents to 95 cents per month and become effective in January, February or March of 1990, depending on the customer's billing cycle. "In recent research, thousands of customers continue to tell us they want to lease AT&T products," said Stan St. John, AT&T vice president for residential lease services. "This increase will help us continue to provide and expand the selection of quality lease products and services." Lease customers will be informed of the new prices beginning today ith messages printed on their bills or through direct mail notices. All lease customers are scheduled to receive at least 30 days' notice before the new prices take effect. The AT&T Traditional rotary telephone will lease for $3.50 per month instead of $2.70. The Traditional Touch-Tone monthly lease price will rise to $5.10 from $4.25. The Princess rotary telephone will lease for $5.70 per month instead of $4.75, and the Princess Touch-Tone will lease for $6.45 per month instead of $5.50. The Trimline rotary monthly lease price will rise to $5.25 from $4.75, and the Trimline Touch-Tone and Traditional 100 will rise to $5.95 from $5.50. The Enhanced Trimline and Feature Telephone 400 monthly lease prices will rise to $6.95 from $6.70. "In the past two years, we've more than doubled the number of products customers can lease, adding cordless telephones, speakerphones and answering machines," St. John said. "Next year, we'll add more new products." "Customers have told us how important the convenience of leasing is," he said. "They especially appreciate the free, immediate replacement of leased products for any reason, no questions asked." Customers whose leased phones are damaged or who want different colors or models can exchange them at more than 1,000 AT&T Phone Centers and AT&T-authorized service agencies. AT&T has authorized service agencies in hardware stores, pharmacies and similar retail businesses across the country. If customers prefer, AT&T will ship the equipment to their home or office at no charge, whether it is a replacement or additional leased equipment. "Our goal is to satisfy the emerging needs of our customers with the highest quality lease service for the long term, and this increase will help us meet that commitment," said St. John. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 13 Dec 2000 17:19:12 -0500 From: Paul Gloger Subject: Re: AT&T still charging some people for leasing equipment On 12 Dec 2000 12:08:32 -0500, Joseph Singer wrote: >11 Dec 2000 19:00:50 -0500 "Marshall A. Levin" >wrote: >>I just recently learned that AT&T has been charging my grandparents a >>monthly fee, admittedly a rather small one, for leasing some really >>old rotary-dial phones..... >>Anyway, we got AT&T to stop charging them, issue a $100 refund and >>convinced them to waive the requirement that the leased equipment, >>which was probably lost years ago, be returned. >I think AT&T was *more* than generous to give a $100 credit and >discontinue charging for this. .... >If there was any doubt what it was a simple call to >AT&T would have cleared that up. .... I'm sorry, but the assertion that "a simple call to AT&T (or whatever phone company) would clear up any doubt" about the charges on one's phone bill, for an average person, let alone an older folk, is sheer fantasy and nonsense. I am an engineer, very up on telecom., a regular reader of this Digest for countless years, and *extremely* aggressive about understanding and not overpaying any bills and charges to me. Nonetheless, literally about half of the charges on my (very basic) home phone bill every month, from PacBell and AT&T in my case, are incomprehensible to me and to anybody and everybody that I've ever been able to contact at the phone companies. When I call and ask, all they say is that they are required to charge those amounts. I've given up on understanding, it's all just a tax which I have to pay for phone service. Indeed, most of the mystery charges seem to be related to taxes and fees imposed by various government entities - or so the phone companies say. In any case, again, the assertion that a simple phone call would clear up any doubt about phone-bill charges is highly wishful thinking. I dearly wish it were so! Paul Gloger - ------- - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 13 Dec 2000 20:16:43 -0500 From: "Carl G. Knoblock" Subject: Re: Access Tandem Phil Smiley wrote: > > What constitutes an Access Tandem. What (aside from the switching > equipment) is required? > Thank You, > Smiley > -- > The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail > messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. You need trunks to and from the class 5 offices (local dial tone switches) in the lata, and to and from the interlata carriers. The switch must be capable of handling billing data and passing it to the carriers in real time or at least in a few hours. The switch may be a combined Tandem/class 5 office or a dedicated tandem (normal in large population centers.) Carriers may also bypass the Tandem, if volume warrents, at their option. Larger class 5 offices have many more direct carrier trunks than do small community offices. Tandems are normally operated by the largest LEC in the Lata, because they need one for thier own local, intralata toll, anyway. Larger LATAs may have multiple Access Tandems. - -- Carl G. Knoblock Telephone Tech - (402) 397-5533 cknoblo@home.com KansasFest 2001, July 25-29, 2001 3325 South 89th St. 2001: A Kfest Odyssey Omaha, NE 68124-3008 - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 13 Dec 2000 21:37:51 -0500 From: dannyb@panix.com (danny burstein) Subject: early DTMF, was: Re: Early NPA Assignments [was Pulling the Zero] In <916i38$30f7s$1@ID-39509.news.dfncis.de> "Ed Ellers" writes: > wrote: >"Although DTMF was made available to the public in 1964 or 1965..." >November 1963, apparently a few days before the assassination of President >Kennedy. There had been technical trials as early as 1960 and market trials >in 1962. The, for want of a better term, Big Rollout was at the 1964/1965 World's Fair in Flushing Meadow Park in NYC. The phones had only ten buttons, though. Hmm.. now that I think about it, they might have had 11 (the final one being a special "world's fair operator" button). They also displayed Picturephones.. danny 'still waiting for my flying car' burstein - -- _____________________________________________________ Knowledge may be power, but communications is the key dannyb@panix.com [to foil spammers, my address has been double rot-13 encoded] - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 13 Dec 2000 22:44:10 -0500 From: Robert Casey Subject: Re: AT&T still charging some people for leasing equipment I bought at fleamkt a beat up ma bell phone and turned it in. End of lease for me back in the eighties. And now I have a nice 500 phone set. "Gail M. Hall" wrote: > On 12 Dec 2000 12:08:32 -0500, in comp.dcom.telecom, you (Joseph Singer > ) wrote: > > >11 Dec 2000 19:00:50 -0500 "Marshall A. Levin" wrote: > > > >>Anyway, we got AT&T to stop charging them, issue a $100 refund and convinced > >>them to waive the requirement that the leased equipment, which was probably > >>lost years ago, be returned. > > > >I think AT&T was *more* than generous to give a $100 credit and > >discontinue charging for this. Just because someone forgets what they're > >paying for isn't an excuse. This charge was nothing new if they'd been > >paying it for years. If there was any doubt what it was a simple call to > >AT&T would have cleared that up. If they've been paying "thousands" of > >dollars in rental fees that's only because they didn't investigate what > >they'd be paying for. You can buy the equivalent phone for $35 or so brand > >new or mostly these days you can pick up the original equipment for $5 at a > >garage sale. Ignorance is no defense. > > I too think AT&T was generous to refund the old couple $100. I don't know > how it was in other states, but when Ohio Bell customers were told that the > equipment belonged to AT&T and AT&T started charging a rental fee, this > information was very clearly stated in mail to customers. As I remember > it, we heard from both Ohio Bell and AT&T. Not only that, this now elderly > couple was quite a bit younger back then and probably can't use old age as > an excuse -- unless they are in their nineties now. > > When the breakup happened and phone equipment was given over to AT&T, we > continued to rent our phones for a few months. When I called Ohio Bell to > ask them to change us from party line service to a single user line, they > told me that we would need to get different phones. They said phones for > party lines were made different from phones for single-user lines. So we > decided this was a good time to buy our phones. We turned our leased > phones in at an AT&T store and went to Sears and got some new phones. > Amazingly, we paid $10 each for the phones. Most of the phones were quite > a bit more, though. I was surprised to find phones for $10. The phones > didn't last long, but they did well for a good while. > > One reason we rented our phones as long as we did was that in order to use > the new phones, we had to get someone to put the correct plug-in to the > wall. One of my sons got what was needed from Radio Shack, and we were in > business. > > We switched to a single user line because I bought a modem for my computer, > and they said I needed a single user line for the modem to work right. > Back then, too, we had to call the phone company to report that we were > using a modem and give them the numbers in the booklet that came with the > modem. > > My modem was pretty much state of the art then -- 1200 baud. :-) A big > improvement over the 300 baud that most people had back then. > > It's too bad if AT&T didn't approach the people more about buying their > phones, but it may be that AT&T did do that and the people just didn't pay > attention. > > We are so bombarded by ads these days that most of us get to the point we > just don't pay any attention to any of them. I wish I had a dollar for > every ad we have gotten from Ameritech trying to sell us cable television > service! Grief! They are supposed to be in the telephone business. > > -- > Gail from Ohio > -- > -- > The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail > messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ End of Telecom Digest V2000 #152 ******************************** Date: 14 Dec 2000 06:15:14 -0500 From: owner-telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org (Telecom Digest) To: telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org Subject: Telecom Digest V2000 #153 Telecom Digest Thursday, December 14 2000 Volume 2000 : Number 153 In this issue: Re: AT&T still charging some people for leasing equipment Pushbutton phones - was Re: early DTMF, was: Re: Early NPA Assignments [was Pulling the Zero] Re: AT&T still charging some people for leasing equipment ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 14 Dec 2000 03:16:33 -0500 From: oldbear@arctos.com (The Old Bear) Subject: Re: AT&T still charging some people for leasing equipment Paul Gloger writes: >From: Paul Gloger >Newsgroups: comp.dcom.telecom >Subject: Re: AT&T still charging some people for leasing equipment >Date: 13 Dec 2000 17:19:12 -0500 > >I'm sorry, but the assertion that "a simple call to AT&T (or whatever >phone company) would clear up any doubt" about the charges on one's >phone bill, for an average person, let alone an older folk, is sheer >fantasy and nonsense. > >I am an engineer, very up on telecom., a regular reader of this Digest >for countless years, and *extremely* aggressive about understanding and >not overpaying any bills and charges to me. Nonetheless, literally >about half of the charges on my (very basic) home phone bill every >month, from PacBell and AT&T in my case, are incomprehensible to me and >to anybody and everybody that I've ever been able to contact at the >phone companies. When I call and ask, all they say is that they are >required to charge those amounts. I've given up on understanding, it's >all just a tax which I have to pay for phone service. Indeed, most of >the mystery charges seem to be related to taxes and fees imposed by >various government entities - or so the phone companies say. > >In any case, again, the assertion that a simple phone call would clear >up any doubt about phone-bill charges is highly wishful thinking. I >dearly wish it were so! > >Paul Gloger Folks who live in Ohio get the benefit of a helpful consumer guide to interpreting their phone bills prepared by the State of Ohio: http://www.state.oh.us/cons/handbook/3telephone.html#bill I'm sure that rapidly changing tarriffs, taxes and fees result in this guide becoming outdated more rapidly than the consumer agency can update it. Even so, it's better than the gobbledy-gook one often gets from telco customer service people who seem to make things up as they go along just to get the customer off the phone. Deregulation was supposed to encourage price competition but the phone companies have responded by adopting complicated pricing schemes to make price comparisons difficult or impossible. Add to that the incentive of governmental entities to attempt to conceal their taxes and the result is totally incomprehensible. Of course, you could study a typical hospital bill -- which, by comparison, makes a phone bill look simple by comparison. Cheers, The Old Bear - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 14 Dec 2000 03:28:00 -0500 From: "Gail M. Hall" Subject: Pushbutton phones - was Re: early DTMF, was: Re: Early NPA Assignments [was Pulling the Zero] On 13 Dec 2000 21:37:51 -0500, in comp.dcom.telecom, you (dannyb@panix.com (danny burstein)) wrote: >In <916i38$30f7s$1@ID-39509.news.dfncis.de> "Ed Ellers" writes: > >> wrote: > >>"Although DTMF was made available to the public in 1964 or 1965..." > >>November 1963, apparently a few days before the assassination of President >>Kennedy. There had been technical trials as early as 1960 and market trials >>in 1962. > >The, for want of a better term, Big Rollout was at the 1964/1965 World's >Fair in Flushing Meadow Park in NYC. The phones had only ten buttons, >though. Hmm.. now that I think about it, they might have had 11 (the final >one being a special "world's fair operator" button). Memories! I remember going into the Bell building at that fair. :-) > >They also displayed Picturephones.. > I've seen those displayed in various places but never saw one actually in use. What I am wondering now is when the first push-button phones came out, not necessarily tone phones, though. The first pushbutton phone I ever saw was at a real estate office sometime in late 1962 or early 1963, more likely 1962, when we were shopping for our first house. We went into the office to see if they had some houses they could offer us. We had a really good conversation with the owner, and I couldn't help noticing his unusual telephone. The owner of the company was severely disabled. He had very limited use of his hands and arms, but he could hold a pen and write with effort. His phone had a headset and a box with pushbuttons on it that he could use to "dial" the numbers. I could not hear whether the numbers pulsed or toned when he pushed the buttons. He did not have enough strength to actually dial an ordinary rotary dial, but he was able to handle the buttons just fine. This really impressed me because other than his physical disability he could handle his business very well. Having this phone was one of the big reasons he could do such a good job running his business without having to have employees doing *everything* for him. He did have employees, of course, but the pushbutton phone and headset gave him more independence. When we finally did decide to buy our own phones in the mid 1980s, we got pushbutton phones. By that time you could buy them with a switch to select tone or pulse, and you could switch to tone after you got your number for those places where you needed to enter tone numbers. We did not want to pay extra for tone service. So we always got pushbutton phones that could do pulses. Later I got another line and did pay for tone service. Even for pulse dialing pushbutton phones are much easier to use, and it is interesting to me that I did not see them before 1962. - -- Gail from Ohio - -- - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 14 Dec 2000 06:03:47 -0500 From: David Lind Subject: Re: AT&T still charging some people for leasing equipment In article <3.0.5.32.20001213141809.00a2ea90@garfield>, Paul Gloger wrote: > >I think AT&T was *more* than generous to give a $100 credit and > >discontinue charging for this. .... > >If there was any doubt what it was a simple call to > >AT&T would have cleared that up. .... > > I'm sorry, but the assertion that "a simple call to AT&T (or whatever > phone company) would clear up any doubt" about the charges on one's > phone bill, for an average person, let alone an older folk, is sheer > fantasy and nonsense. > > I am an engineer, very up on telecom., a regular reader of this Digest > for countless years, and *extremely* aggressive about understanding and > not overpaying any bills and charges to me. Nonetheless, literally > about half of the charges on my (very basic) home phone bill every > month, from PacBell and AT&T in my case, are incomprehensible to me and > to anybody and everybody that I've ever been able to contact at the > phone companies. When I call and ask, all they say is that they are > required to charge those amounts. I've given up on understanding, it's > all just a tax which I have to pay for phone service. Indeed, most of > the mystery charges seem to be related to taxes and fees imposed by > various government entities - or so the phone companies say. > > In any case, again, the assertion that a simple phone call would clear > up any doubt about phone-bill charges is highly wishful thinking. I > dearly wish it were so! > Paul, Your sentiments and exasperations are mirrored almost exactly in this humourous article. Understanding your phone bill  Do you have to be a rocket scientist or a brain surgeon to figure it out? Address:http://www.msnbc.com/news/405748.asp - -- David Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ End of Telecom Digest V2000 #153 ******************************** Date: 14 Dec 2000 22:40:49 -0500 From: owner-telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org (Telecom Digest) To: telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org Subject: Telecom Digest V2000 #154 Telecom Digest Thursday, December 14 2000 Volume 2000 : Number 154 In this issue: Re: early DTMF, was: Re: Early NPA Assignments [was Pulling the Zero] Re: Pushbutton phones - was Re: early DTMF, was: Re: Early NPA Assignments [was Pulling the Zero] Re: AT&T still charging some people for leasing equipment Re: Pulling the Zero 12/12/00 ICBTollFreeNews.Com HEADS UP HEADLINES 12/13/00 ICBTollFreeNews.Com HEADS UP HEADLINES Re: Pushbutton phones - was Re: early DTMF, was: Re: Early NPA Assignments [was Pulling the Zero] Re: Pulling the Zero AboveNet backbone provider blocking Peacefire site Re: early DTMF, was: Re: Early NPA Assignments [was Pulling the Zero] Re: Pulling the Zero, and higher digits Re: AT&T still charging some people for leasing equipment Re: Pulling the Zero Re: AboveNet backbone provider blocking Peacefire site Re: Pushbutton phones - was Re: early DTMF, was: Re: Early NPA Assignments [was Pulling the Zero] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 14 Dec 2000 08:36:46 -0500 From: Subject: Re: early DTMF, was: Re: Early NPA Assignments [was Pulling the Zero] danny burstein wrote: >>"Although DTMF was made available to the public in 1964 or 1965..." > The, for want of a better term, Big Rollout was at the 1964/1965 World's > Fair in Flushing Meadow Park in NYC. The phones had only ten buttons, > though. Hmm.. now that I think about it, they might have had 11 (the final > one being a special "world's fair operator" button). I was there. I remember very well the exhibit where they encouraged you to try dialling with a standard rotary dial and then the same number with pushbuttons. There was some sort of timer that showed you how much faster it was. I don't recall those phones actually being connected to anything but the timer, there may have been others. > They also displayed Picturephones.. Yes, picturephones. To my 10-year-old self they seemed the inevitable next step. After all, "The Jetsons" had them. They had several working pairs set up so you could try them out. > danny 'still waiting for my flying car' burstein Yeah, me too. The climactic scene of "Men In Black" did bring back some fond memories. - -- ***************************************************************************** * Bill Ranck +1-540-231-3951 ranck@vt.edu * * Virginia Polytechnic Institute & State University, Computing Center * ***************************************************************************** - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 14 Dec 2000 08:46:12 -0500 From: Roy Smith Subject: Re: Pushbutton phones - was Re: early DTMF, was: Re: Early NPA Assignments [was Pulling the Zero] "Gail M. Hall" wrote: > The owner of the company was severely disabled. He had very limited > use of his hands and arms, but he could hold a pen and write with > effort. His phone had a headset and a box with pushbuttons on it > that he could use to "dial" the numbers. The Bell System had a reputation for going to great effort to enable their equipment to work for people with various handicaps. Custom-built devices to allow people without full motor function to place and receive phone calls were, IIRC, provided at no extra charge. Whether this sense of corporate social responsibility grew out of Bell's original work with deaf people, or was a requirement of the government regulatory constraints, I'm not sure. I also suspect it has fallen by the wayside these days. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 14 Dec 2000 09:56:16 -0500 From: Dominic Richens Subject: Re: AT&T still charging some people for leasing equipment The Old Bear wrote in message news:oldbear.7890.29ED2DB1@arctos.com... [...] > On March 1, AT&T will begin leasing a phone that will dial one of 12 > stored numbers at the touch of a button. The phone has a lighted dial > with buttons that can redial the last number called and place calls on > hold. It also has a control that amplifies the sound in the receiver's > earpiece. The Memory Telephone 410 will lease for $8.85 per month. HAHAHA! In 1988 we had a touch-tone phone with redial and 12 speeddial (RCL+digit) which we got for $10 (Canadian! That's less than $8.85 US!) at one of those "surplus" electronic stores. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 14 Dec 2000 11:39:16 -0500 From: varney@ihgp2.ih.lucent.com (Al Varney) Subject: Re: Pulling the Zero In article <90o02a$7rr$1@nnrp1.deja.com>, Rod Sladen wrote: >In article <90lmrp$h6d@shell3.shore.net>, > stevek@shell3.shore.net wrote: >> One of my colleagues is a lexicographer for the >> Dictionary of American Regional English, and they are >> examining the use of the word 'pull' with respect to >> rotary phones. They have a single quote that says "You >> don't have to pull the 2 and the 5 on Key West numbers-- >> only the last five numbers." >> >> Does anyone else have this sense of pull? > >The telecom archives at >http://hyperarchive.lcs.mit.edu/telecom- >archives/archives/history/numbering.plans.1950-80 > >shows several instances of the use of the term "pull" relating either >to the actual operation of the dial: >Incidentally, I have not encountered the term "pull" with this meaning >in Btirish usage. I did my "library" thing, and found several articles (in technical literature) with this usage, including one from the British Post Office ("... when the dial is pulled off-normal"). Several articles refer to US patent 597,062 (Aug. 20, 1896), which describes the first telephone "dial" I could find. This was a replacement for the original Strowger "automatic" telephone, which required the caller to push buttons rapidly several times to generate the necessary "impulses" to operate the Strowger step-by-step CO equipment. (The impulses traveled over wires not used for voice -- early push-button phone with out-of-band signaling, y'know?) Anyway, the 1896 dial was a "finger-wheel", a disk mounted vertically with "finger flanges" protruding from the front surface near the edge of the right half of the wheel. The caller places their finger on an appropriate flange (it fit the bottom 1/3 of the finger) and PULLED down to a finger-stop, then released the wheel. The impulses to the switch were generated as the wheel returned to its normal position. "Engineering & Science in the Bell System: The Early Years (1875-1925)", (Library of Congress number 75-31499), page 124 says: ".. rotary member was pulled down to the stop ... and released." A year or so later, the design was changed to a rather lopsided wheel with finger holes (oblong, not circular holes, to exactly fit the finger). The holes were still all on the right-most third of the wheel. And there were 11 holes, the top-most (above the "0") being used to reach "long distance". So, while the literature using the term "pull" might be technical in nature, I think it likely the public would have used "pull" when referring to these older "dials". They were always mounted vertically, and the finger motion was primarily down. "Pull" seems a natural way to describe the operation. I actually saw one of these phones last month while visiting the AGCS labs in Phoenix, AZ. But they wouldn't let me touch it.... AGCS is the off-spring of Automatic Electric, the company formed (in part) from the Strowger manufacturing operation. Their Phoenix site has historical (pre-1900) stuff in display cases all over the place. A working museum? (More at www.agcs.com/about, and die-hard buffs should check out www.singingwires.org) http://www.agcs.com/about/history/photoalbum.htm Another place to see this kind of stuff is the Museum of Independent Telephony in Abilene, Kansas. Al Varney - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 14 Dec 2000 11:26:37 -0600 From: "Judith Oppenheimer" Subject: 12/12/00 ICBTollFreeNews.Com HEADS UP HEADLINES ____________________________________________________ ICBTollFreeNews.Com HEADS UP HEADLINES ____________________________________________________ from ICB Toll Free News - Daily News and Intelligence covering the Political, Legal and Marketing Arenas of 800 and Dot Com. ____________________________________________________ If you have not done so already, please take a moment to complete a two-minute survey: http://www.surveyanywhere.com/SURVEY/1495773391661226 The information from the survey will help us to do a better job for you. Thanks very much for your help. Your Publisher, Judith Oppenheimer ___________________________________________________ CONTENTS - - EUROPEAN COMMISSION PROPOSES REGISTRY TO RUN .EU DOMAIN - - TRADEMARK 1, FREE SPEECH 0 - - TELLME IS TALKIN' SHOPTALK - - REALNAMES GOES FOR BROKE AMID CHINA STANDARDS DISPUTE - - AD AGENCY REVIEW POINTS TO REGISTER.COM PLANS ___________________________________________________ Resellers sought ... ITFS providers needed ... seeking licenced database containing ring tones and logos for mobile phones ... Have you been to http://ICBclassifieds.com lately? ___________________________________________________ CUSTOMER SERVICE NOTES: With over 4,000 articles archived, ICB is a popular research destination. Find all ICB headlines: http://www.icbtollfree.com/icbheadlns.cfm, or use ICB's search engine: http://icbtollfree.com/Search.cfm. Note: Registration is required. Contact information is NOT sold, leased, rented or shared in any manner. _______________notices from our sponsors_______________ >>>>>>>>>>>>> http://1800TheExpert.com <<<<<<<<<<<<< 800 & Domain Name Acquisition Management, Lost/Stolen 800 # Retrieval, Litigation Support, Regulatory Navigation, Correlating Domain Name & Trademark Matters. ____________________________________________________ EVERY 3.6 SECONDS SOMEONE DIES FROM HUNGER http://www.hungersite.com/ ____________________________________________________ ARTICLE ACCESS CODE LEGEND ICB Toll Free News offers two valuable service options: F = Free - News and Features articles P = Premium - Unlimited Site Access including all Articles and Documents. ____________________________________________________ HEADLINES for December 12, 2000 P - EUROPEAN COMMISSION PROPOSES REGISTRY TO RUN .EU DOMAIN The legal base of the proposal is Article 156 of the Treaty covering Trans European Networks. In particular the Commission would be responsible for developing and adopting policies regarding speculative and abusive registration of names and alternative dispute resolution procedures. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4866 F - TRADEMARK 1, FREE SPEECH 0 If a domain name has no communicative value, then on what grounds could a company sue to prevent individuals from registering Web sites that include its name? But the judge^̉s decision may strengthen trademark protections. Removing Web addresses from protected speech prevents individuals from arguing that the terms belong in the public domain for use by anyone. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4869 F - TELLME IS TALKIN' SHOPTALK The company has said it aims to provide the infrastructure to develop a sprawling new category of Web-like voice sites, loosely linked in much the same way America Online partner sites are grouped together by keywords under the AOL umbrella. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4867 F - REALNAMES GOES FOR BROKE AMID CHINA STANDARDS DISPUTE Despite the fact that RealNames is 10 per cent owned by Verisign, Mr Teare stands on the Chinese government's side over the disputes, attacking the Internet Corporation for Assigned Names and Numbers (ICANN) for seeking to put huge registration fees into the pocket of big American companies such as Verisign. Instead of acting ''so disrespectively'', Mr Teare said he would choose to work with mainland partners and take into account cultural traditions and local interests. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4865 F - AD AGENCY REVIEW POINTS TO REGISTER.COM PLANS The company is looking for a global advertising campaign that will heighten awareness of its service in the Pacific Rim. 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All rights reserved. ____________________________________________________ ------------------------------ Date: 14 Dec 2000 11:26:52 -0600 From: "Judith Oppenheimer" Subject: 12/13/00 ICBTollFreeNews.Com HEADS UP HEADLINES ____________________________________________________ ICBTollFreeNews.Com HEADS UP HEADLINES ____________________________________________________ from ICB Toll Free News - Daily News and Intelligence covering the Political, Legal and Marketing Arenas of 800 and Dot Com. ____________________________________________________ If you have not done so already, please take a moment to complete a two-minute survey: http://www.surveyanywhere.com/SURVEY/1495773391661226 The information from the survey will help us to do a better job for you. Thanks very much for your help. Your Publisher, Judith Oppenheimer ___________________________________________________ CONTENTS - - ALLOCATION OPTIONS FOR VANITY FREEPHONE NUMBERS - - NETNATION ALLIES WITH TELEDOMAINS FOR MATCHING 800 NUMBERS - - VERISIGN OFFERS PRE-REGISTRATIONS OF .BIZ & .INFO - - AN OPEN LETTER TO ICANN - - INTELLICOM ADDS TOLL FREE TO ITS UNIFIED MESSAGING - - VIRTUAL BROKER SERVICE - - UDRP: PROTOCOL AND PRECEDENT - - NO CONFUSION HERE - - LOVE THY NEIGHBOR - - ORANGE ADMITS CHARGING FOR FREE CALLS ___________________________________________________ Resellers sought ... ITFS providers needed ... seeking licenced database containing ring tones and logos for mobile phones ... Have you been to http://ICBclassifieds.com lately? ___________________________________________________ CUSTOMER SERVICE NOTES: With over 4,000 articles archived, ICB is a popular research destination. Find all ICB headlines: http://www.icbtollfree.com/icbheadlns.cfm, or use ICB's search engine: http://icbtollfree.com/Search.cfm. Note: Registration is required. Contact information is NOT sold, leased, rented or shared in any manner. _______________notices from our sponsors_______________ >>>>>>>>>>>>> http://1800TheExpert.com <<<<<<<<<<<<< 800 & Domain Name Acquisition Management, Lost/Stolen 800 # Retrieval, Litigation Support, Regulatory Navigation, Correlating Domain Name & Trademark Matters. ____________________________________________________ EVERY 3.6 SECONDS SOMEONE DIES FROM HUNGER http://www.hungersite.com/ ____________________________________________________ ARTICLE ACCESS CODE LEGEND ICB Toll Free News offers two valuable service options: F = Free - News and Features articles P = Premium - Unlimited Site Access including all Articles and Documents. ____________________________________________________ HEADLINES for December 13, 2000 P - ALLOCATION OPTIONS FOR VANITY FREEPHONE NUMBERS The ACA is considering allocating numbers directly to the businesses that use them, rather than to telecommunications companies. Tony Shaw said that auctioning marketable numbers would reduce the possibility of customers hoarding numbers. 'Auctions would mean that more people have a chance of obtaining these numbers but it may mean they pay a higher price for the privilege,' Mr Shaw said. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4875 F - NETNATION ALLIES WITH TELEDOMAINS FOR MATCHING 800 NUMBERS For example, for the new domain name www.DPbrand.com, the Teledomain.com service says it would help clients establish a toll-free telephone number such as 1.800.DPbrand, and/or a toll-free fax number, 1.888.Dpbrand. Unstated, though, is how the mostly depleted 800 and 888 numbers will be acquired. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4876 F - VERISIGN OFFERS PRE-REGISTRATIONS OF .BIZ & .INFO Named 'The Domain Update Internet Service,' its 'a way for those interested in the .biz and .info domains to prepare for their expected introduction in early 2001.' CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4874 F - AN OPEN LETTER TO ICANN .BIZ Duplication Wreaks Havoc in the Name Space ... We have stated many times in many venues, that the operative words are cooperation and respect. The roots have a policy to not duplicate any TLD found in the USG root or other roots which are accessed by the public. They all recognize prior use. By Leah Gallegos. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4879 F - INTELLICOM ADDS TOLL FREE TO ITS UNIFIED MESSAGING innoport.com, currently offering service with a 215 area code, is offering a premium service via toll-free number. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4873 (HEADLINES CON'T BELOW) _______________notices from our sponsors_______________ Are you a local or regional business that advertises in newspapers, direct mail, on radio or tv? 1 800 BRAND IT shared use marketing programs can help your sales skyrocket! http://www.1800BrandIt.com ____________________________________________________ 800 RATE NEGOTIATION EXPERTISE If your usage contract is coming to an end we can help you get the very best rate from your existing or new vendor. We charge $125 per hour. No fee if you choose a vendor we represent. Telemanagement, Inc. http://www.sdtele.com ____________________________________________________ IS YOUR BUSINESS LISTED? The Internet 800 Directory lists hundreds of thousands of toll free numbers and is viewed by millions each month. 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CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4878 P - UDRP: PROTOCOL AND PRECEDENT The development of UDRP 'common law' is still in its early stages. Many Panelists, however, do give prior decisions consideration when deciding UDRP cases. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4872 P - NO CONFUSION HERE 'The Panel concludes that the domain name was registered and used in bad faith... is confusingly similar to the Complainant^̉s mark ... but Respondent has shown that it has a legitimate interest in the domain name.' CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4871 P - LOVE THY NEIGHBOR '... this arbitration is not the appropriate forum for the resolution of a trademark infringement suit... One reason for the opening of new top-level domains was to permit more domain names to be available to companies with the same name...' CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4870 F - ORANGE ADMITS CHARGING FOR FREE CALLS The Joe Network said it would close its Joe0800 freephone Wap service now that all four mobile networks charge for freephone data calls. Rivals BT Cellnet and Vodafone have always charged for 0800 data calls, while One 2 One began charging at the end of August. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4877 ____________________________________________________ ABOUT ICB ICB HeadsUp Headlines Daily Email is sent by request. Subscriptions to Daily Email are free to qualified applicants. Visit http://www.icbtollfree.com/reg.cfm?NextURL=Index.cfm to sign up. Please feel free to pass along a copy to a friend, within reason so long as the message is not modified or used unfavorably. To unsubscribe mailto:editor@icbtollfree.com, subject: unsubscribe. ___________________ ADVERTISING INFORMATION ___________________ For information on advertising in ICB HeadsUp Headlines emails, see http://www.icbtollfree.com/ArticleId4415.html ____________________________________________________ Only subscribers or registered users of ICB Toll Free News web site will be able to access all or some of the full text of URLs provided. ____________________________________________________ Copyright © 2000 ICB, Inc. All rights reserved. ____________________________________________________ ------------------------------ Date: 14 Dec 2000 17:29:12 -0500 From: Wes Leatherock Subject: Re: Pushbutton phones - was Re: early DTMF, was: Re: Early NPA Assignments [was Pulling the Zero] On 14 Dec 2000 08:46:12 -0500 Roy Smith wrote: > "Gail M. Hall" wrote: > > The owner of the company was severely disabled. He had very limited > > use of his hands and arms, but he could hold a pen and write with > > effort. His phone had a headset and a box with pushbuttons on it > > that he could use to "dial" the numbers. > > The Bell System had a reputation for going to great effort to enable > their equipment to work for people with various handicaps. Custom-built > devices to allow people without full motor function to place and receive > phone calls were, IIRC, provided at no extra charge. > > Whether this sense of corporate social responsibility grew out of Bell's > original work with deaf people, or was a requirement of the government > regulatory constraints, I'm not sure. I also suspect it has fallen by > the wayside these days. Years ago I was talking to the long-time wire chief in Bartlesville, Oklahoma, which was (and still is) the headquarters city of the Phillips Petroleum Company. He related that, probably in the 1930s, there was a newspaper story or an item in the Bell Labs Record about the Labs' success in designing a telephone with an amplified receiver. The CEO of Phillips, Frank Phillips, who was partially deaf, asked the wire chief to get him one. The wire chief passed the request up the line, getting only vague responses. He persisted in the request with no cogent response. Frank Phillips suggested it might help if he (Phillips) called Cleo, or whoever was the CEO of AT&T at the time. The wire chief (sorry I can't remember his name) once more urgently passed the request up the line. He got no response, but a few weeks later a brown package arrived addressed to the wire chief from Bell Labs, containing nothing but a telephone and a print. The wire chief could tell it was a hard-of-hearing telephone, and asked area (state) headquarters in Oklahoma City for how to get the business office to write the service order to install it. (It was clear from the print, although there were no instructions, how to hook it up physically.) After two or three weeks with no response, the wire chief took the telephone to Phillips' office and installed it; Phillips was greatly appreciative. The wire chief never heard another word about it, and strongly suspected from the photo Phillips had shown him accompanying the article that the Labs sent the prototype. Wes Leatherock wleath@sandbox.dynip.com - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 14 Dec 2000 17:39:05 -0500 From: Wes Leatherock Subject: Re: Pulling the Zero On 14 Dec 2000 11:39:16 -0500 Al Varney wrote: > I did my "library" thing, and found several articles (in technical > literature) with this usage, including one from the British Post Office > ("... when the dial is pulled off-normal"). > > Several articles refer to US patent 597,062 (Aug. 20, 1896), which > describes the first telephone "dial" I could find. This was a replacement > for the original Strowger "automatic" telephone, which required the > caller to push buttons rapidly several times to generate the necessary > "impulses" to operate the Strowger step-by-step CO equipment. (The > impulses traveled over wires not used for voice -- early push-button > phone with out-of-band signaling, y'know?) > > Anyway, the 1896 dial was a "finger-wheel", a disk mounted vertically > with "finger flanges" protruding from the front surface near the edge of > the right half of the wheel. The caller places their finger on an > appropriate flange (it fit the bottom 1/3 of the finger) and PULLED down > to a finger-stop, then released the wheel. The impulses to the switch > were generated as the wheel returned to its normal position. > > "Engineering & Science in the Bell System: The Early Years (1875-1925)", > (Library of Congress number 75-31499), page 124 says: > > ".. rotary member was pulled down to the stop ... and released." > > A year or so later, the design was changed to a rather lopsided > wheel with finger holes (oblong, not circular holes, to exactly fit > the finger). The holes were still all on the right-most third of the > wheel. And there were 11 holes, the top-most (above the "0") being > used to reach "long distance". > > So, while the literature using the term "pull" might be technical > in nature, I think it likely the public would have used "pull" when > referring to these older "dials". They were always mounted vertically, > and the finger motion was primarily down. "Pull" seems a natural > way to describe the operation. > > I actually saw one of these phones last month while visiting the > AGCS labs in Phoenix, AZ. But they wouldn't let me touch it.... > AGCS is the off-spring of Automatic Electric, the company formed > (in part) from the Strowger manufacturing operation. Their Phoenix > site has historical (pre-1900) stuff in display cases all over the > place. A working museum? (More at www.agcs.com/about, and die-hard > buffs should check out www.singingwires.org) > http://www.agcs.com/about/history/photoalbum.htm > > Another place to see this kind of stuff is the Museum of Independent > Telephony in Abilene, Kansas. > > Al Varney Step-by-step was also called "Strowger" equipment for many years. The first step offices in the Bell System were Automatic Electric equipment, since Western Electric had not stooped to manufacturing such equipment at the time. The Automatic Electric line switches in glass cases in the original part of what became the JAckson office in Oklahoma City were rather fascinating and something otherwise only seen in historical material. Later additions to the office were Western Electric equipment with line finders. We didn't replace the original AE ringing machine (from 1920) until some time in the 1960s...and then because the office had grown to where the original ringing machine couldn't handle the load, not because it had worn out. Wes Leatherock wleath@sandbox.dynip.com - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 14 Dec 2000 20:09:57 -0500 From: Bennett Haselton Subject: AboveNet backbone provider blocking Peacefire site [sent to journalists on Peacefire's press contacts list] We've discovered that a large Internet backbone company, AboveNet -- which routes about 2% of all hits on a typical Web site -- has been blocking their downstream customers from accessing the Peacefire.org Web site for the past four months. AboveNet does not publicize the fact that they block customers' Internet access, and most of the AboveNet users that we talked to, were pissed off when they found out. (Most people affected by the block have never actually heard of AboveNet -- these are users who are customers of smaller local ISP's, which are routed to the rest of the Internet through the AboveNet network.) Many users couldn't believe this when they heard about it, but it's not a joke. We contacted several AboveNet users and verified that they couldn't access our Web site, even though it was up. Finally we called AboveNet and talked to a high-level technician who admitted that, in fact, this was not an accident -- they were intentionally blocking their customers' Web access to sites on the "boycott list". Yesterday, after we began publicizing that AboveNet was doing this, they temporarily stopped blocking customer Web access, so their users can now access our Web site again. AboveNet has not commented on why they did this or what they will do next. AboveNet has apparently joined a boycott of our ISP because of hosted sites such as the following: http://209.211.253.69/ which sell bulk email software. Our ISP has a strict anti-spam policy, and these sites *never* send spam or use spam to advertise. (I think this is analogous to the difference between a site that hosts password-cracking tools, and a person who actually uses these tools to steal someone's password -- there is no movement to boycott sites that host hacking tools, because it's not the software itself that is culpable.) We contacted the Mail Abuse Prevention System, the organizers of the boycott, to ask if they could take the Peacefire site off the list since all we are "guilty" of is sharing the same ISP. They said it was technically possible, but it was their policy not to un-block us unless we joined the boycott by ditching our current service provider. (Since these sites never send spam, don't believe it if AboveNet says they do this to "protect their customers from spam" -- they've never produced any spam originating from these sites, and in any case, blocking customers' Web access has no effect on the amount of spam that they get! It's just a boycott, it has nothing to do with customer protection. Not that AboveNet is currently talking to reporters anyway.) I think there's nothing wrong with boycotts, but they should be done with the *knowing* participation of the people involved. AboveNet, however, has essentially co-opted their downstream customers into the boycott, by telling them that they're getting unfiltered Internet access, but then blocking them from certain Web sites so that when they try to access those sites, it just looks like the server is down. We are advising AboveNet customers that they may be eligible to sue AboveNet for fraud. If you decide to cover this, I have the email address and telephone numbers of several AboveNet customers, who were sufficiently pissed off when they found out their Internet access was being censored, that they agreed to talk to the media about it. I'm also at 425 649 9024 -- and I just got DSL, so you should finally be able to get through on the phone line most of the time :) AboveNet can be reached at (408) 367-6624, although they are still apparently saying "No comment" to reporter inquiries. -Bennett bennett@peacefire.org http://www.peacefire.org (425) 649 9024 - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 14 Dec 2000 21:09:21 -0500 From: "Ed Ellers" Subject: Re: early DTMF, was: Re: Early NPA Assignments [was Pulling the Zero] Danny Burstein wrote: "The, for want of a better term, Big Rollout was at the 1964/1965 World's Fair in Flushing Meadow Park in NYC." True. The Bell System did demonstrate Touch-Tone at the 1962 fair in Seattle -- including the speed test also shown in New York (and later in Chicago at the Museum of Science and Industry). But they wouldn't have had full commercial service then, where in New York they probably had Touch-Tone phones all over the grounds. "The phones had only ten buttons, though. Hmm.. now that I think about it, they might have had 11 (the final one being a special "world's fair operator" button)." On the left or right of the zero? Western Electric made a few 11-button phones with a * key for field tests of Speed Calling and Call Forwarding after the Succasunna, N.J. 1ESS went into service in 1965. "They also displayed Picturephones.." Those also had 11-key Touch-Tone dials, but with the extra key in the # position and labeled V (for video). To place a Picturephone call you would dial V and then the number; dialing the number as usual got you an audio-only connection. By 1967 -- when Bell of Pennsylvania started a customer test of Picturephone at Westinghouse in Pittsburgh -- this had been replaced by 12-button 2500-type sets. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 14 Dec 2000 21:13:02 -0500 From: "Ed Ellers" Subject: Re: Pulling the Zero, and higher digits Wes Leatherock wrote: "Nope. There was no piece of equipment to generate more than 10 pulses, and selectors and connectors were physical pieces of equipment with 10 levels and 10 contacts per level." In a standard installation, yes. The very first Strowger step-by-step systems used 11 pulses to reach the long distance operator. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 14 Dec 2000 21:25:16 -0500 From: "Ed Ellers" Subject: Re: AT&T still charging some people for leasing equipment Wes Leatherock wrote: "For a time, and perhaps still, the only place to get a new (refurbished like new) Princess telephone was to lease one from AT&T. They were apparently in much demand and AT&T refused to offer any for sale--only for lease." AT&T started selling new (not reconditioned) Princess phones to the public at the beginning of 1983, through the subsidiary then called American Bell, at the same time that they offered new Traditional, Trimline and complete (not just housing) Design Line phones. I'm not sure exactly when they switched the Princess phones to lease-only. FWIW, the current AT&T leased consumer phones are listed at http://www.att.com/cls/corded.html. $4.95/month lease for a 500 rotary desk set? Heck with that stuff... - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 14 Dec 2000 21:41:37 -0500 From: Linc Madison Subject: Re: Pulling the Zero In article <91at1l$p02@ssbunews.ih.lucent.com>, Al Varney wrote: > ".. rotary member was pulled down to the stop ... and released." > > So, while the literature using the term "pull" might be technical > in nature, I think it likely the public would have used "pull" when > referring to these older "dials". They were always mounted vertically, > and the finger motion was primarily down. "Pull" seems a natural > way to describe the operation. To a point, yes. For instance, "To dial a number, place your finger in the hole corresponding to each successive letter or digit and pull the dial down to the stop." However, the sort of usage that kicked off this thread was things like "to call within Key West, you don't have to pull the 2-5, only the last five digits," is still unusual. In other words, you PULL the dial when you DIAL a number. - -- For faster reply, use Telecom#LincMad*Com, or something similar.... - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 14 Dec 2000 21:52:15 -0500 From: wollman@lcs.mit.edu (Garrett Wollman) Subject: Re: AboveNet backbone provider blocking Peacefire site In article <200012142157.eBELvuA24711@jessica.iain.com>, Bennett Haselton wrote: >AboveNet does not publicize the fact that they block customers' >Internet access, Really? When my organization talked to AboveNet about possibly getting service from them, they were quite clear that they receive and use a BGP feed of the Realtime Blackhole List. This was represented by their representative as a feature. As a supporter of their effort *and methods* to restrain spam, I cannot bring myself to feel in the least bit sorry for you. (Then again, you've always struck me as a bunch of pathetic whiners anyway, so this is hardly surprising.) - -GAWollman (My opinions, not MIT's!) - -- Garrett A. Wollman | O Siem / We are all family / O Siem / We're all the same wollman@lcs.mit.edu | O Siem / The fires of freedom Opinions not those of| Dance in the burning flame MIT, LCS, CRS, or NSA| - Susan Aglukark and Chad Irschick - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 14 Dec 2000 22:40:46 -0500 From: kamlet@infinet.com (Art Kamlet) Subject: Re: Pushbutton phones - was Re: early DTMF, was: Re: Early NPA Assignments [was Pulling the Zero] In article , Gail M. Hall wrote: >On 13 Dec 2000 21:37:51 -0500, in comp.dcom.telecom, you (dannyb@panix.com >(danny burstein)) wrote: > >>In <916i38$30f7s$1@ID-39509.news.dfncis.de> "Ed Ellers" writes: >> >>> wrote: >> >>>"Although DTMF was made available to the public in 1964 or 1965..." >> >>>November 1963, apparently a few days before the assassination of President >>>Kennedy. There had been technical trials as early as 1960 and market trials >>>in 1962. >> >>The, for want of a better term, Big Rollout was at the 1964/1965 World's >>Fair in Flushing Meadow Park in NYC. The phones had only ten buttons, >>though. Hmm.. now that I think about it, they might have had 11 (the final >>one being a special "world's fair operator" button). > >Memories! I remember going into the Bell building at that fair. :-) > >> >>They also displayed Picturephones.. >> > >I've seen those displayed in various places but never saw one actually in >use. > >What I am wondering now is when the first push-button phones came out, not >necessarily tone phones, though. > >The first pushbutton phone I ever saw was at a real estate office sometime >in late 1962 or early 1963, more likely 1962, when we were shopping for our >first house. Long, long after the Edsel brought out pushbutton automatic transmission controls. - -- Art Kamlet Columbus, Ohio kamlet@infinet.com - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ End of Telecom Digest V2000 #154 ******************************** Date: 15 Dec 2000 06:15:16 -0500 From: owner-telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org (Telecom Digest) To: telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org Subject: Telecom Digest V2000 #155 Telecom Digest Friday, December 15 2000 Volume 2000 : Number 155 In this issue: 12/14/00 ICBTollFreeNews.Com HEADS UP HEADLINES Re: Pulling the Zero, and higher digits ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 14 Dec 2000 23:57:18 -0500 From: "Judith Oppenheimer" Subject: 12/14/00 ICBTollFreeNews.Com HEADS UP HEADLINES ____________________________________________________ ICBTollFreeNews.Com HEADS UP HEADLINES ____________________________________________________ from ICB Toll Free News - Daily News and Intelligence covering the Political, Legal and Marketing Arenas of 800 and Dot Com. ____________________________________________________ CONTENTS - - CLASS-ACTION LAWSUIT FILED AGAINST NSI - - MAJORITY OF U.S. HOUSEHOLDS NOW WIRELESS - - PHONE SUBSCRIBERSHIP REPORT RELEASED - - DOT TV DOES EUROPE - - USATODAY UDRP REFUSED - - 1-800-AUTOTOW CLOSES - - WHOIS A TM ENFORCEMENT DOORMAT? 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ICB offers FREE classifieds: http://ICBclassifieds.com. _______________notices from our sponsors_______________ >>>>>>>>>>>>> http://1800TheExpert.com <<<<<<<<<<<<< 800 & Domain Name Acquisition Management, Lost/Stolen 800 # Retrieval, Litigation Support, Regulatory Navigation, Correlating Domain Name & Trademark Matters. ____________________________________________________ EVERY 3.6 SECONDS SOMEONE DIES FROM HUNGER http://www.hungersite.com/ ____________________________________________________ ARTICLE ACCESS CODE LEGEND ICB Toll Free News offers two valuable service options: F = Free - News and Features articles P = Premium - Unlimited Site Access including all Articles and Documents. ____________________________________________________ HEADLINES for December 14, 2000 P - CLASS-ACTION LAWSUIT FILED AGAINST NSI NSI has a stranglehold over the previously registered and expired domain names and competition in the domain marketplace has been "injured" by the company's actions, according to the suit, filed in the U.S. District Court, Northern District of Alabama, in Birmingham. Aggrieved users have until December 20th to register their complaint, under the tight deadline the court has set for a motion of class certification to be filed. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4880 P - MAJORITY OF U.S. HOUSEHOLDS NOW WIRELESS For the first time a majority of U.S. households has at least one mobile phone, according to a study released on Tuesday. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4886 F - PHONE SUBSCRIBERSHIP REPORT RELEASED The report presents subscribership statistics based on the Current Population Survey (CPS) conducted by the Census Bureau in July 2000. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4885 F - DOT TV DOES EUROPE ... predicts that its growth in Europe will eclipse that of its US operations by the end of 2001. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4884 P - USATODAY UDRP REFUSED Complainant alleges mark ownership, but the record shows otherwise ... complainant alleges use under license but offers no proof. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4883 F - 1-800-AUTOTOW CLOSES ... proceeds to liquidate non-performing subsidiaries; director resigns. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4882 P - WHOIS A TM ENFORCEMENT DOORMAT? IETF HOLDS WHOIS MEETING WHOIS standardization would be a boon to large companies that own hundreds of domain names by making it easier to monitor the use of their trademarks globally across the Internet. VeriSign has developed a WHOIS prototype using Lightweight Directory Access Protocol (LDAP) ... "With the access controls built into LDAP, you can authenticate various classes of users and allow more privileged classes of users to see things that others can't." CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4881 _______________notices from our sponsors_______________ Are you a local or regional business that advertises in newspapers, direct mail, on radio or tv? 1 800 BRAND IT shared use marketing programs can help your sales skyrocket! http://www.1800BrandIt.com ____________________________________________________ 800 RATE NEGOTIATION EXPERTISE If your usage contract is coming to an end we can help you get the very best rate from your existing or new vendor. We charge $125 per hour. No fee if you choose a vendor we represent. Telemanagement, Inc. http://www.sdtele.com ____________________________________________________ IS YOUR BUSINESS LISTED? The Internet 800 Directory lists hundreds of thousands of toll free numbers and is viewed by millions each month. The Internet 800 Directory will list ANY business with a toll free number, regardless of long distance carrier, for free and was the first to do so. 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To unsubscribe mailto:editor@icbtollfree.com, subject: unsubscribe. ___________________ ADVERTISING INFORMATION ___________________ For information on advertising in ICB HeadsUp Headlines emails, see http://www.icbtollfree.com/ArticleId4415.html ____________________________________________________ Only subscribers or registered users of ICB Toll Free News web site will be able to access all or some of the full text of URLs provided. ____________________________________________________ Copyright © 2000 ICB, Inc. All rights reserved. ____________________________________________________ ------------------------------ Date: 15 Dec 2000 05:10:22 -0500 From: jay@west.net (Jay Hennigan) Subject: Re: Pulling the Zero, and higher digits On 12 Dec 2000 21:58:56 -0500, Wes Leatherock wrote: : : Nope. There was no piece of equipment to generate more than :10 pulses, and selectors and connectors were physical pieces of :equipment with 10 levels and 10 contacts per level. Yep. Not sure what the significance, but I have an Automatic Electric butt-set with an 11-hole dial. The AE dials typically have a much longer "pull" for a 1 than a WEco dial. AE dials have the fingerstop at about the 5 o'clock position, with a wider blank area between the "1" hole and the stop than a WEco dial. I believe this design is for a longer dwell after the last pulse for "SATT" grounding pulses used on party lines, or perhaps to force a longer inter-digit time. This particular dial has an extra hole in the "less-than-1" space, and is mechanically set up so that this hole is the "1" and sends a single pulse. The dial is imprinted with 1 through 0 as usual, offset for the extra hole. There is a large black letter "A" in the position that gives 11 pulses. I don't think I was ever able to ever produce any "interesting" results using it on conventional lines, and typically would get a reorder when sending 11-pulse digits. I'm not sure of its exact purpose, but it's the only one I've ever seen, and only on an item designed as test equipment as opposed to for general use. I'd say it's about 1950s vintage, big metal cast-aluminum butt-set with a full-size dial. For other examples of strange rotary dials, check out a New Zealand phone. Only ten holes, but numbered in the opposite direction. Doing *that* conversion electromechanically must have been fun if they had IDDD in the early days. - -- Jay Hennigan - Network Administration - jay@west.net NetLojix Communications, Inc. NASDAQ: NETX - http://www.netlojix.com/ WestNet: Connecting you to the planet. 805 884-6323 - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ End of Telecom Digest V2000 #155 ******************************** Date: 16 Dec 2000 01:23:25 -0500 From: owner-telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org (Telecom Digest) To: telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org Subject: Telecom Digest V2000 #156 Telecom Digest Saturday, December 16 2000 Volume 2000 : Number 156 In this issue: Re: AboveNet backbone provider blocking Peacefire site Re: AboveNet backbone provider blocking Peacefire site Re: Pushbutton phones - was Re: early DTMF, was: Re: Early NPA Assignments [was Pulling the Zero] Re: Pulling the Zero, and higher digits Re: Pushbutton phones - was Re: early DTMF, was: Re: Early NPA Assignments [was Pulling the Zero] Re: AboveNet backbone provider blocking Peacefire site I think I will create the TSFPWW Re: AboveNet backbone provider blocking Peacefire site 12/15/00 ICBTollFreeNews.Com HEADS UP HEADLINES Re: AboveNet backbone provider blocking Peacefire site Re: AboveNet backbone provider blocking Peacefire site Re: I think I will create the TSFPWW Re: I think I will create the TSFPWW Re: AboveNet backbone provider blocking Peacefire site Re: AboveNet backbone provider blocking Peacefire site Re: Early NPA Assignments Re: AboveNet backbone provider blocking Peacefire site Re: AboveNet backbone provider blocking Peacefire site Re: AboveNet backbone provider blocking Peacefire site Re: AboveNet backbone provider blocking Peacefire site ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 15 Dec 2000 08:41:01 -0500 From: Jim Rusling Subject: Re: AboveNet backbone provider blocking Peacefire site Bennett Haselton wrote: >[sent to journalists on Peacefire's press contacts list] > >We've discovered that a large Internet backbone company, AboveNet -- which >routes about 2% of all hits on a typical Web site -- has been blocking >their downstream customers from accessing the Peacefire.org Web site for >the past four months. AboveNet does not publicize the fact that they block >customers' Internet access, and most of the AboveNet users that we talked >to, were pissed off when they found out. (Most people affected by the >block have never actually heard of AboveNet -- these are users who are >customers of smaller local ISP's, which are routed to the rest of the >Internet through the AboveNet network.) > >Many users couldn't believe this when they heard about it, but it's not a >joke. We contacted several AboveNet users and verified that they couldn't >access our Web site, even though it was up. Finally we called AboveNet and >talked to a high-level technician who admitted that, in fact, this was not >an accident -- they were intentionally blocking their customers' Web access >to sites on the "boycott list". > >Yesterday, after we began publicizing that AboveNet was doing this, they >temporarily stopped blocking customer Web access, so their users can now >access our Web site again. AboveNet has not commented on why they did this >or what they will do next. > >AboveNet has apparently joined a boycott of our ISP because of hosted sites >such as the following: > http://209.211.253.69/ >which sell bulk email software. Our ISP has a strict anti-spam policy, and >these sites *never* send spam or use spam to advertise. (I think this is >analogous to the difference between a site that hosts password-cracking >tools, and a person who actually uses these tools to steal someone's >password -- there is no movement to boycott sites that host hacking tools, >because it's not the software itself that is culpable.) We contacted the >Mail Abuse Prevention System, the organizers of the boycott, to ask if they >could take the Peacefire site off the list since all we are "guilty" of is >sharing the same ISP. They said it was technically possible, but it was >their policy not to un-block us unless we joined the boycott by ditching >our current service provider. > >(Since these sites never send spam, don't believe it if AboveNet says they >do this to "protect their customers from spam" -- they've never produced >any spam originating from these sites, and in any case, blocking customers' >Web access has no effect on the amount of spam that they get! It's just a >boycott, it has nothing to do with customer protection. Not that AboveNet >is currently talking to reporters anyway.) > >I think there's nothing wrong with boycotts, but they should be done with >the *knowing* participation of the people involved. AboveNet, however, has >essentially co-opted their downstream customers into the boycott, by >telling them that they're getting unfiltered Internet access, but then >blocking them from certain Web sites so that when they try to access those >sites, it just looks like the server is down. We are advising AboveNet >customers that they may be eligible to sue AboveNet for fraud. > >If you decide to cover this, I have the email address and telephone numbers >of several AboveNet customers, who were sufficiently pissed off when they >found out their Internet access was being censored, that they agreed to >talk to the media about it. I'm also at 425 649 9024 -- and I just got >DSL, so you should finally be able to get through on the phone line most of >the time :) AboveNet can be reached at (408) 367-6624, although they are >still apparently saying "No comment" to reporter inquiries. > > -Bennett > >bennett@peacefire.org http://www.peacefire.org >(425) 649 9024 Quit selling spamware and then ask the RBL team to delist your IP address. It is really quite easy. I wish my ISP used the RBL. - -- Jim Rusling Now retired full time Mustang, OK http://jrusling.home.mindspring.com - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 15 Dec 2000 08:43:21 -0500 From: "John B. Hines" Subject: Re: AboveNet backbone provider blocking Peacefire site wollman@lcs.mit.edu (Garrett Wollman) wrote: >In article <200012142157.eBELvuA24711@jessica.iain.com>, >Bennett Haselton wrote: > >>AboveNet does not publicize the fact that they block customers' >>Internet access, > >Really? When my organization talked to AboveNet about possibly >getting service from them, they were quite clear that they receive and >use a BGP feed of the Realtime Blackhole List. This was represented >by their representative as a feature. They haven't been clear, in that they block all access, and not just email blocking. Abovenet has put an ISP into a blackhole, because one of their customers is a spammer, and they included ALL the other customers of that ISP, whether or not they are spammers. I'm not arguing pro/con, just that they (abovenet and the ISP) need better disclosure of what they are doing. The idea that I as a customer, have to check what the other customers of an ISP, to see what their business model is, that is going to be a problem, with legal and other implications. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 15 Dec 2000 10:02:44 -0500 From: Wes Leatherock Subject: Re: Pushbutton phones - was Re: early DTMF, was: Re: Early NPA Assignments [was Pulling the Zero] On 14 Dec 2000 22:40:46 -0500 Art Kamlet wrote: [Somebody, I think Gail M. Hall , wrote:] > >What I am wondering now is when the first push-button phones came out, not > >necessarily tone phones, though. > > > >The first pushbutton phone I ever saw was at a real estate office sometime > >in late 1962 or early 1963, more likely 1962, when we were shopping for our > >first house. > > Long, long after the Edsel brought out pushbutton automatic > transmission controls. > -- > Art Kamlet Columbus, Ohio kamlet@infinet.com Did the Edsel controls include an oscillator (or two oscillators)? It was only after (a number of years after) Touch-Tone phones came out that someone thought of creating a dial pulse generator in a telephone that would be controlled by push buttons. Wes Leatherock wleath@sandbox.dynip.com - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 15 Dec 2000 11:22:08 -0500 From: Chris Williams Subject: Re: Pulling the Zero, and higher digits Jay Hennigan wrote: > > On 12 Dec 2000 21:58:56 -0500, Wes Leatherock wrote: > : > : Nope. There was no piece of equipment to generate more than > :10 pulses, and selectors and connectors were physical pieces of > :equipment with 10 levels and 10 contacts per level. > > Yep. Not sure what the significance, but I have an Automatic Electric > butt-set with an 11-hole dial. The AE dials typically have a much longer > "pull" for a 1 than a WEco dial. AE dials have the fingerstop at about > the 5 o'clock position, with a wider blank area between the "1" hole > and the stop than a WEco dial. I believe this design is for a longer > dwell after the last pulse for "SATT" grounding pulses used on party lines, > or perhaps to force a longer inter-digit time. This particular dial has > an extra hole in the "less-than-1" space, and is mechanically set up so > that this hole is the "1" and sends a single pulse. > > The dial is imprinted with 1 through 0 as usual, offset for the extra hole. > There is a large black letter "A" in the position that gives 11 pulses. > I don't think I was ever able to ever produce any "interesting" results using > it on conventional lines, and typically would get a reorder when sending > 11-pulse digits. > > I'm not sure of its exact purpose, but it's the only one I've ever seen, > and only on an item designed as test equipment as opposed to for general > use. I'd say it's about 1950s vintage, big metal cast-aluminum butt-set > with a full-size dial. I can remember back about 1960 in one of those "army surplus" stores in the Los Angeles area coming across boxes of old telephones with 11-hole dials. IIRC the 11th hole was marked with an "A". At the time the phones seemed to have a very unusual shape. If my memory hasn't totally failed they were mostly Kellogg "Ashtray" phones. > For other examples of strange rotary dials, check out a New Zealand phone. > Only ten holes, but numbered in the opposite direction. Doing *that* > conversion electromechanically must have been fun if they had IDDD in the > early days. In 1985 while staying in Christchurch we had one of those dial phones in our hotel room. All the other phones we had encountered in New Zealand were touch-tone by then. It was so interesting I took a picture. I'll have to dig it out so people won't think we're crazy. Chris - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 15 Dec 2000 15:54:22 -0500 From: kamlet@infinet.com (Art Kamlet) Subject: Re: Pushbutton phones - was Re: early DTMF, was: Re: Early NPA Assignments [was Pulling the Zero] In article , Wes Leatherock wrote: > >On 14 Dec 2000 22:40:46 -0500 Art Kamlet wrote: > > [Somebody, I think Gail M. Hall , wrote:] > >> >What I am wondering now is when the first push-button phones came out, not >> >necessarily tone phones, though. >> > >> >The first pushbutton phone I ever saw was at a real estate office sometime >> >in late 1962 or early 1963, more likely 1962, when we were shopping for our >> >first house. >> >> Long, long after the Edsel brought out pushbutton automatic >> transmission controls. >> -- >> Art Kamlet Columbus, Ohio kamlet@infinet.com > > Did the Edsel controls include an oscillator (or two >oscillators)? > > It was only after (a number of years after) Touch-Tone >phones came out that someone thought of creating a dial >pulse generator in a telephone that would be controlled by >push buttons. I am pretty darn certain that the Ford Technical Journal never published the secret behind the Edsel Pushbutton controls :^) - -- Art Kamlet Columbus, Ohio kamlet@infinet.com - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 15 Dec 2000 16:33:47 -0500 From: Joel B Levin Subject: Re: AboveNet backbone provider blocking Peacefire site In , Jim Rusling wrote: }Bennett Haselton wrote: Bennett's complaint snipped }Quit selling spamware and then ask the RBL team to delist your IP }address. It is really quite easy. I wish my ISP used the RBL. Bennett's not selling spamware. His provider has other customers who do, in violation of above.net's AUP, and they refuse to do anything about it (rather like a landlord who rents shops to those who fence stolen property and is happy to continue collecting the rent). He is an innocent victim, in the same sense that law enforcement somehow shutting down the building with the fences' shops can also affect, say, an action committee who has done nothing more serious than rent an office from the same landlord. There is reason for him to seriously consider voting with his feet rather than continue to depend on a supporter of spam services for access; though he could also try to see if he couldn't persuade MAPS to remove his host(s) from the blacklist. Should the provider cease to violate the AUP of above.net, I expect they would happily support removing them from the RBL or begin passing traffic for that provider regardless of the RBL. /JBL - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 15 Dec 2000 16:59:55 -0500 From: hudsonl@skypoint.com (Hudson Leighton) Subject: I think I will create the TSFPWW I think I will create the TSFPWW What is "TSFPWW" you ask? It is "The Society For The Prevention of Wall Warts" What is a "Wall Wart" you ask? It's that black cube that is the power supply for your modem, router, telephone, caculator, etc., etc., etc. Today I installed a new phone, in doing so I had to disturb that pile in the corner I joking call the "Hub Room" When I got done untangling the mess, I found I had 14 Wall Warts plugged into various extention cords, power strips, cube taps. A couple of which were not being used because I had removed other equipment and at the time had not had the courage to dive in to the pile and remove the wall wart. There has to be a better way to power all our toys. A friend who works in tech support for a large retailer reports that in a commercial building the various vibrations will cause a wall wart to work it's self out of a wall outlet and fall to the floor. One of the 1st things he does when visiting a equipment rooms is to push all the wall warts back into their outlets. If you counted up all the wall warts that that just sit there getting hot with the equipment turned off, you could proably cancel the California power alerts. - -Hudson - -- http://www.skypoint.com/~hudsonl - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 15 Dec 2000 17:25:28 -0500 From: wollman@lcs.mit.edu (Garrett Wollman) Subject: Re: AboveNet backbone provider blocking Peacefire site In article <7b7k3tk0d3jdi2pq2trf116o1suqvpqr2m@4ax.com>, John B. Hines wrote: >>[I wrote:] >>[T]hey were quite clear that they receive and use a BGP feed of the >>Realtime Blackhole List. >They haven't been clear, in that they block all access, and not just >email blocking. No, to the contrary, they were *quite* clear, as I indicated in the paragraph you quoted. (This should not come as a surprise to anyone; MAPS founder Paul Vixie is CTO of AboveNet's parent company, MFNX.) Now, if some ISP who uses AboveNet's backbone service was not honest with their customers about this, that's regrettable, but should be resolved between those entities. (I will note that MAPS requires those using the RBL to inform their customers that they are doing so.) - -GAWollman - -- Garrett A. Wollman | O Siem / We are all family / O Siem / We're all the same wollman@lcs.mit.edu | O Siem / The fires of freedom Opinions not those of| Dance in the burning flame MIT, LCS, CRS, or NSA| - Susan Aglukark and Chad Irschick - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. 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This was represented > by their representative as a feature. The RBL is supposed to be used only to block incoming mail messages, not outgoing web access. And an ISP that respects its users would leave it up to each user whether to turn on even that blocking. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 15 Dec 2000 18:22:42 -0500 From: dehoog@nifty.com Subject: Re: AboveNet backbone provider blocking Peacefire site John David Galt wrote... >The RBL is supposed to be used only to block incoming mail messages, >not outgoing web access. And an ISP that respects its users would >leave it up to each user whether to turn on even that blocking. Absolutely. Being agressively anti-SPAM is one thing, but above all a provider should be a neutral agent in these matters, serving the legitimate needs of its customers. Blocking sites arbitrarily goes strongly against the Internet spirit and should be discouraged strongly. - -- John De Hoog dehoog@nifty.com http://dehoog.org - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 15 Dec 2000 18:48:17 -0500 From: scs@eskimo.com (Steve Summit) Subject: Re: I think I will create the TSFPWW Hudson Leighton wrote: > I think I will create the TSFPWW > What is "TSFPWW" you ask? > It is "The Society For The Prevention of Wall Warts" > What is a "Wall Wart" you ask? > It's that black cube that is the power supply for your modem, router, > telephone, caculator, etc., etc., etc. > > Today I installed a new phone, in doing so I had to disturb that pile > in the corner I joking call the "Hub Room" > When I got done untangling the mess, I found I had 14 Wall Warts > plugged into various extention cords, power strips, cube taps. I don't have it quite that bad, but you're right, the situation is completely out of hand. (The only saving grace is that power strip manufacturers have recognized the problem, and are starting to come out with models designed to allow multiple "Wall Warts" to be plugged in without blocking half the other outlets.) The industry desperately needs to standardize on one voltage for these things (I'd suggest 12 volts, AC; rectifiers are cheap, and using AC avoids polarity problems) and also one standard connector for the standard voltage. Then, someone can come out with "power strips" which contain one transformer and multiple low-voltage outlets that you can plug all your little low-power devices into. Wouldn't that be nice? (If this is a brand-new idea, I hereby offer it into the public domain, and hope that this message to the Digest serves as a viable "anti-patent".) Steve Summit scs@eskimo.com - -- Programming Challenge #6: Don't just fix the bug. See http://www.eskimo.com/~scs/challenge/. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 15 Dec 2000 19:56:10 -0500 From: "Chris Ornellas" Subject: Re: I think I will create the TSFPWW There are manufacturers out there that make rack mounted powers strip specially designed to accommodate wall warts. They also have some special straps that use a thumb screw to secure a bent piece of metal to hold the wall wart in place. There are also power strips that can be wall mounted or laid on the floor that have the outlets spaced so as to accommodate the wall warts so there are no unused receptacles. the latter can be purchased at your local Wal Mart. You can email me directly if you want the manufacturers of the rack mounted power strips. I can't remember the names right now but I will look them up if your interested. cnkornellas@irtc.net "Hudson Leighton" wrote in message news:hudsonl-ya02408000R1512001559400001@news.skypoint.com... > I think I will create the TSFPWW > > What is "TSFPWW" you ask? > > It is "The Society For The Prevention of Wall Warts" > > What is a "Wall Wart" you ask? > > It's that black cube that is the power supply for your modem, router, > telephone, caculator, etc., etc., etc. > > Today I installed a new phone, in doing so I had to disturb that pile > in the corner I joking call the "Hub Room" > > When I got done untangling the mess, I found I had 14 Wall Warts > plugged into various extention cords, power strips, cube taps. > > A couple of which were not being used because I had removed other > equipment and at the time had not had the courage to dive in to > the pile and remove the wall wart. > > There has to be a better way to power all our toys. > > A friend who works in tech support for a large retailer reports that in a > commercial building the various vibrations will cause a wall wart to work > it's self out of a wall outlet and fall to the floor. One of the 1st things he > does when visiting a equipment rooms is to push all the wall warts back > into their outlets. > > If you counted up all the wall warts that that just sit there getting hot > with the equipment turned off, you could proably cancel the California > power alerts. > > -Hudson > > -- > http://www.skypoint.com/~hudsonl > -- > The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail > messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 15 Dec 2000 22:54:50 -0500 From: scs@eskimo.com (Steve Summit) Subject: Re: AboveNet backbone provider blocking Peacefire site It's a complicated question. On the one hand, merely blocking spammers from sending their spam ends up being an eternal, unwinnable game of whack-a-mole. Since spammers never read their own e-mail, nor depend on it for any positive responses they might receive from one of their missives, it's arguably the case that the only way to shut them down is to block the channels they *do* rely on for responses, e.g. web pages. On the other hand, shutting down web sites for this reason is a risky game of coercive censorship, and many people don't like it, no matter how much they dislike spam. (Me, though there are no qualifications to my dislike of spam, if I were to subscribe to something like the RBL, I'd want the addresses blocked to be only those guilty of the primary offense of carrying actual spam.) On the third hand, though (and here's some telecom relevance), there is some precedent in the real world for shutting down a web site because of the way it's promoted. I've heard (on what I remember being reasonably good authority) that, once upon a time, at least, a telco could require a radio station to conduct call-in contests only in accordance with certain guidelines and in cooperation with the telco, or stated another way, that the telco could prohibit (under threat, presumably, of disconnection of service) indiscriminate contests. I haven't been able to confirm this story (despite having asked about it here a while back), but the analogy with the net is clear: indiscriminate radio station call-in contests were prohibited because the resulting highly bursty and abnormal calling patterns were a threat to the stability of the telephone network, and spam-promoted websites can arguably be called a threat because of the deleterious effects of spam on the network. Steve Summit scs@eskimo.com - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 15 Dec 2000 23:55:47 -0500 From: tbetz@panix.com (Tom Betz) Subject: Re: AboveNet backbone provider blocking Peacefire site [ posted and mailed ] Quoth Bennett Haselton in <200012142157.eBELvuA24711@jessica.iain.com>: |[sent to journalists on Peacefire's press contacts list] | |We've discovered that a large Internet backbone company, AboveNet -- which |routes about 2% of all hits on a typical Web site -- has been blocking |their downstream customers from accessing the Peacefire.org Web site for |the past four months. Bennett, you are being used as a PR pawn by Media3. They stuck you in the middled of a Class C block otherwise reserved for their spammer and spam-software vendors, most of whom were moved into that block after having been put on the RBL when they were in a different block. Media3 knew exactly what they were doing when they put Peacfire.org there. By the way, did you know that your e-mail is being censored by Media3? They are certainly blocking e-mail from the domain spamhaus.org. Steve Linford, who operates spamhaus.org, tried to e-mail you an explanation of what Media3 is doing, and it bounced: >> ----- The following addresses had permanent fatal errors ----- >> bennett@peacefire.org >> (reason: 550 ... Access denied) >> >> ----- Transcript of session follows ----- >> ... while talking to peacefire.org.: >> >>> MAIL From: SIZE=3369 >> <<< 550 ... Access denied Of course, the MX for peacefire.org is acctually ss3.media3.net. If you are wise, you'll change hosting services pronto. Media3 are playing despicable games with you for their own sleazy ends. - -- |I always wanted to be someone,| Tom Betz, Generalist | |but now I think I should have | Want to send me email? FIRST, READ THIS PAGE: | |been a wee bit more specific. | | | "Fuck NANAE." -- Paul Vixie | YO! MY EMAIL ADDRESS IS HEAVILY SPAM-ARMORED! | - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 16 Dec 2000 00:18:10 -0500 From: Gary Novosielski Subject: Re: Early NPA Assignments On 11 Dec 2000 21:01:01 (-0500) Wes Leatherock wrote: > 201 is not the lowest area code. These were assigned in >the days of rotary dials, and zero was 10 pulses, not zero >pulses. Although the dial pulses did figure into the assignment of codes correlated to traffic, area codes have always been listed in numerical order, and 201 did, and still does top the list as the "lowest" number. Legend has it (and I have no reason to doubt) that the 201 area code was assigned here for "vanity" purposes. At the time of the assignments, Bell Labs in Holmdel, NJ was located in the 201 NPA (but has since been split out of it). This was in line with an existing New Jersey custom (that continues to this day) of reserving low auto license plate numbers for politically connected types. There was the equivalent of an area code shortage when the state government changed hands from one party to another and a mass demand for new "low plates" suddenly occurred. The "problem" was solved by revising the license place numbering plan. Sound familiar? It could be argued that the "lowest" telephone number in the world is located somewhere in Jersey City, NJ., if you accept the following definition of "low": The lowest Country Code is +1: USA The lowest US NPA is 201: NJ The lowest NXX code in 201 is 200: Jersey City Presumably, if someone in Jersey City has the number +1.201.200.0001 that could be considered to be the lowest number in the world, and a real vanity coup! I wonder if he or she knows. "But," I hear you cry, "on a rotary dial, that would be 67 pulses!" True, but this is a DTMF age. =Gary - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 16 Dec 2000 00:23:22 -0500 From: tbetz@panix.com (Tom Betz) Subject: Re: AboveNet backbone provider blocking Peacefire site Quoth John David Galt in <3A3AA56D.65322711@diogenes.sacramento.ca.us>: |Garrett Wollman wrote: | |> Really? When my organization talked to AboveNet about possibly |> getting service from them, they were quite clear that they receive and |> use a BGP feed of the Realtime Blackhole List. This was represented |> by their representative as a feature. | |The RBL is supposed to be used only to block incoming mail messages, |not outgoing web access. On the contrary, the original use of the RBL was as a BGP feed that blackholes ALL packets from the listed sources. It is still widely used in that way. - -- |I always wanted to be someone,| Tom Betz, Generalist | |but now I think I should have | Want to send me email? FIRST, READ THIS PAGE: | |been a wee bit more specific. | | | "Fuck NANAE." -- Paul Vixie | YO! MY EMAIL ADDRESS IS HEAVILY SPAM-ARMORED! | - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 16 Dec 2000 01:09:02 -0500 From: sjsobol@NorthShoreTechnologies.net (Steve Sobol) Subject: Re: AboveNet backbone provider blocking Peacefire site >From 'John David Galt': >Garrett Wollman wrote: > >> Really? When my organization talked to AboveNet about possibly >> getting service from them, they were quite clear that they receive and >> use a BGP feed of the Realtime Blackhole List. This was represented >> by their representative as a feature. > >The RBL is supposed to be used only to block incoming mail messages, >not outgoing web access. What is blocked is entirely up to the ISP. It's their bandwidth, their servers, etc. - -- Steve Sobol, BOFH, President 888.480.4NET 866.DSL.EXPRESS 216.619.2NET North Shore Technologies Corporation http://NorthShoreTechnologies.net JustTheNet/JustTheNet EXPRESS DSL (ISP Services) http://JustThe.net mailto:sjsobol@NorthShoreTechnologies.net Proud resident of Cleveland, OH - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 16 Dec 2000 01:10:17 -0500 From: sjsobol@NorthShoreTechnologies.net (Steve Sobol) Subject: Re: AboveNet backbone provider blocking Peacefire site >From 'dehoog@nifty.com': >John David Galt wrote... > >>The RBL is supposed to be used only to block incoming mail messages, >>not outgoing web access. And an ISP that respects its users would >>leave it up to each user whether to turn on even that blocking. > >Absolutely. Being agressively anti-SPAM is one thing, but above all a provider >should be a neutral agent in these matters, serving the legitimate needs of >its customers. Blocking sites arbitrarily goes strongly against the Internet >spirit and should be discouraged strongly. Unless, of course, the customers want the blocking to be done, which (in many cases) is the case. - -- Steve Sobol, BOFH, President 888.480.4NET 866.DSL.EXPRESS 216.619.2NET North Shore Technologies Corporation http://NorthShoreTechnologies.net JustTheNet/JustTheNet EXPRESS DSL (ISP Services) http://JustThe.net mailto:sjsobol@NorthShoreTechnologies.net Proud resident of Cleveland, OH - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 16 Dec 2000 01:23:22 -0500 From: sjsobol@NorthShoreTechnologies.net (Steve Sobol) Subject: Re: AboveNet backbone provider blocking Peacefire site >From 'Tom Betz': > >[ posted and mailed ] > >Quoth Bennett Haselton in <200012142157.eBELvuA24711@jessica.iain.com>: >|[sent to journalists on Peacefire's press contacts list] >| >|We've discovered that a large Internet backbone company, AboveNet -- which >|routes about 2% of all hits on a typical Web site -- has been blocking >|their downstream customers from accessing the Peacefire.org Web site for >|the past four months. > >Bennett, you are being used as a PR pawn by Media3. They stuck you in >the middled of a Class C block otherwise reserved for their spammer >and spam-software vendors, most of whom were moved into that block >after having been put on the RBL when they were in a different block. I'll make this offer, then. Host the site here. I will not ask for any money, nor will I even ask you to put my name or a link to my websites. I don't care if anyone knows I'm hosting you - I don't care about the publicity. I am offering to do this as a favor to someone I think performs a very vital service to the community at large. Media3 sucks. An abnormally large number of sites they host are designed to promote tools used to abuse the Internet. They deserve to be RBL'd. - -- Steve Sobol, BOFH, President 888.480.4NET 866.DSL.EXPRESS 216.619.2NET North Shore Technologies Corporation http://NorthShoreTechnologies.net JustTheNet/JustTheNet EXPRESS DSL (ISP Services) http://JustThe.net mailto:sjsobol@NorthShoreTechnologies.net Proud resident of Cleveland, OH - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ End of Telecom Digest V2000 #156 ******************************** Date: 16 Dec 2000 06:15:09 -0500 From: owner-telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org (Telecom Digest) To: telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org Subject: Telecom Digest V2000 #157 Telecom Digest Saturday, December 16 2000 Volume 2000 : Number 157 In this issue: Re: I think I will create the TSFPWW ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 16 Dec 2000 03:07:23 -0500 From: hudsonl@skypoint.com (Hudson Leighton) Subject: Re: I think I will create the TSFPWW In article <200012152342.PAA13303@mail.eskimo.com>, scs@eskimo.com wrote: > > The industry desperately needs to standardize on one voltage for > these things (I'd suggest 12 volts, AC; rectifiers are cheap, > and using AC avoids polarity problems) and also one standard > connector for the standard voltage. Then, someone can come out > with "power strips" which contain one transformer and multiple > low-voltage outlets that you can plug all your little low-power > devices into. Wouldn't that be nice? > > (If this is a brand-new idea, I hereby offer it into the public > domain, and hope that this message to the Digest serves as a > viable "anti-patent".) > > Steve Summit > scs@eskimo.com A major coup would be the same low-voltage connector on a wall wart, every looked at the collection of plugs on a Radio Shack "universal" wall wart. It used to that the wall wart and device had the same manfacturers name on them, now days the wall wart is labeled for the XYZ wall wart co. And you are out of luck if the wall wart and the device get seperated. I know put my own sticky label on a wall wart as soon as I take it out of the box so I have a ghost of a chance of keeping it with the correct device. - -Hudson BTW: does anybody know where I can get a "mil-spec" cigarette lighter plug. - -- http://www.skypoint.com/~hudsonl - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ End of Telecom Digest V2000 #157 ******************************** Date: 17 Dec 2000 06:15:13 -0500 From: owner-telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org (Telecom Digest) To: telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org Subject: Telecom Digest V2000 #158 Telecom Digest Sunday, December 17 2000 Volume 2000 : Number 158 In this issue: Re: I think I will create the TSFPWW Re: I think I will create the TSFPWW Re: Early NPA Assignments Subject: Re: Pulling the Zero, and higher digits Re: AboveNet backbone provider blocking Peacefire site Re: AboveNet backbone provider blocking Peacefire site power supplies, was: Re: I think I will create the TSFPWW Re: AboveNet backbone provider blocking Peacefire site Re: AboveNet backbone provider blocking Peacefire site Re: I think I will create the TSFPWW Re: AboveNet backbone provider blocking Peacefire site New area code for NY, PacBell gives faulty error message Re: Subject: Re: Pulling the Zero, and higher digits Re: New area code for NY, PacBell gives faulty error message Re: power supplies, was: Re: I think I will create the TSFPWW Re: Early NPA Assignments AUTOVON (was Re: Pulling the Zero, and higher digits) Re: FCC to End Reciprocal Loophole Radio Stations using SSb ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 16 Dec 2000 06:41:29 -0500 From: Terry Kennedy Subject: Re: I think I will create the TSFPWW Steve Summit writes: > Then, someone can come out > with "power strips" which contain one transformer and multiple > low-voltage outlets that you can plug all your little low-power > devices into. Wouldn't that be nice? Been there, did that. Take a look at: http://www.new-york.net/pics_nyc_pop/nyc_pop_024.jpg (front) http://www.new-york.net/pics_nyc_pop/nyc_pop_014.jpg (back) which is a wall wart eliminator (in this case, for AT&T Dataport 14.4 modems). [Yep, they're _old_ pictures] Terry Kennedy http://www.tmk.com terry@tmk.com Jersey City, NJ USA - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 16 Dec 2000 12:09:56 -0500 From: scsmediafmp@aol.com (Steven Scharf) Subject: Re: I think I will create the TSFPWW Cyberguys has a product that partially solves the problem. They offer heavy duty 1 foot grounded extension cords that can be plugged into the powerstrip and the the warts can be plugged into them. http://www.cyberguys.com/ They call them powerstrip liberators and for $1.79 each they are a bargin. I am going to buy a bounch of them as stocking stuffers for my family. All of them are computerheads. Steven Scharf SCS Media Services PO Box 4135 Portland, Maine 04101 Tel: 207-774-9393 Fax: 207-774-1819 SCSMedia@aol.com Hudson Leighton wrote: > I think I will create the TSFPWW > What is "TSFPWW" you ask? > It is "The Society For The Prevention of Wall Warts" > What is a "Wall Wart" you ask? > It's that black cube that is the power supply for your modem, router, > telephone, caculator, etc., etc., etc. > > Today I installed a new phone, in doing so I had to disturb that pile > in the corner I joking call the "Hub Room" > When I got done untangling the mess, I found I had 14 Wall Warts > plugged into various extention cords, power strips, cube taps. I don't have it quite that bad, but you're right, the situation is completely out of hand. (The only saving grace is that power strip manufacturers have recognized the problem, and are starting to come out with models designed to allow multiple "Wall Warts" to be plugged in without blocking half the other outlets.) The industry desperately needs to standardize on one voltage for these things (I'd suggest 12 volts, AC; rectifiers are cheap, and using AC avoids polarity problems) and also one standard connector for the standard voltage. Then, someone can come out with "power strips" which contain one transformer and multiple low-voltage outlets that you can plug all your little low-power devices into. Wouldn't that be nice? (If this is a brand-new idea, I hereby offer it into the public domain, and hope that this message to the Digest serves as a viable "anti-patent".) Steve Summit scs@eskimo.com - -- Programming Challenge #6: Don't just fix the bug. See http://www.eskimo.com/~scs/challenge/. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 16 Dec 2000 13:00:11 -0500 From: Joel B Levin Subject: Re: Early NPA Assignments In <5.0.0.25.0.20001215230144.00a08680@mailbox.verizon.net>, Gary Novosielski wrote: }Although the dial pulses did figure into the assignment of codes correlated }to traffic, area codes have always been listed in numerical order, and 201 }did, and still does top the list as the "lowest" number. Not in some old internal telco lists I've seen. }It could be argued that the "lowest" telephone number in the world is }located somewhere in Jersey City, NJ., if you accept the following }definition of "low": } }The lowest Country Code is +1: USA }The lowest US NPA is 201: NJ }The lowest NXX code in 201 is 200: Jersey City } }Presumably, if someone in Jersey City has the number +1.201.200.0001 that }could be considered to be the lowest number in the world, and a real vanity }coup! I wonder if he or she knows. Why not 201-200-0000? }"But," I hear you cry, "on a rotary dial, that would be 67 pulses!" True, }but this is a DTMF age. "Desirable" numbers for businesses are typically numbers ending in 00 or 000. Except that many years ago, while this seemed to be true in the East (and probably other places I didn't know about), in Mountain Bell territory where I lived, the best numbers seemed to be the ones that ended in the most 1's. So while "ANdrews 8-8000" might have been really easy to remember or write a jingle about, a number like EAst 7-3111 was a lot easier to dial. /JBL - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 16 Dec 2000 14:27:01 -0500 From: herbsu@netscape.net (Herb Sutherland) Subject: Subject: Re: Pulling the Zero, and higher digits I just thought of something! When I was in the military, they had their own private telephone network. It was called AUTOVON (automatic voice network). Is it possible that by dialing the "A" that would give you access to the AUTOVON? - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 16 Dec 2000 15:10:52 -0500 From: Steve Linford Subject: Re: AboveNet backbone provider blocking Peacefire site In article <200012142157.eBELvuA24711@jessica.iain.com>, Bennett Haselton wrote: > [sent to journalists on Peacefire's press contacts list] > > We've discovered that a large Internet backbone company, AboveNet > -- which routes about 2% of all hits on a typical Web site -- has > been blocking their downstream customers from accessing the > Peacefire.org Web site for the past four months. Not true. Your class C was only placed on the RBL 4 weeks ago. But a great many of the spam sites in your class C have been on the RBL since May/June. According to Peacefire.org's Whois record it looks like you were moved into that block full of already-RBL'd spammers on 22-Jul-2000. Can you confirm that? > AboveNet has apparently joined a boycott of our ISP because of > hosted sites such as the following: http://209.211.253.69/ which > sell bulk email software. Our ISP has a strict anti-spam policy, > and these sites *never* send spam or use spam to advertise. Some facts for you: Media3 has been the top Spam Support Service in the Spamhaus.org "Internet's worst Spamhausen" list for 8 months (http://www.spamhaus.org/statistics-hosts.lasso). The spam services Media3 hosts include 'Stealth Bulk ISPs' and 'Bullet-proof Bulk hosts' advertising "Spam all you want without being shut down" (http://www.bulk-isp.com/), and spamware sites selling 'stealth' spamware including 'DesktopServer' and 'StealthMassMailer' both specifically designed and marketed for spamming and which claim to cloak the spammers dial-ups and insert fake mail headers into spams to thwart complaints. Specifically, two of the Internet's most notorious hard-line spam operations are hosted by Media3 in the blocks MAPS has on the RBL, and which Media3 (allegedly) wants released by court order. They include: [1] SAMCO in block 209.211.253.0, operated by spammers Bob Galena and Mike Constantin, sells stealth spamware and operates a 'stealth bulk ISP' service, i.e: a service which spammers connect to from their dial-ups to bulk out through and which strips their dial-up IPs off and relays the spam out anonymously through open servers around the net. The SAMCO spam outfit has been thrown off just about every major US provider for the last 2 years. [2] GHI/BulkISP (Global Hosting Institute), operated by a long time spammer known as Sam Al (Saied Alzalzalah) and hosted by Media3 also in block 209.211.253.0 under numerous aliases including bulkisp.com, bulkhost.net, bulk-isp.net, bulkispcorp.net, bulk-isp.com, bulkisp.nu, bulkisp.net, bulkispcorp.com, all of which sell 'bullet-proof spamming services' with the promise "Bulletproof web space is used so you can spam without the worries of being shut down". GHI had been thrown off 5 major ISPs before moving to Media3. > (Since these sites never send spam, don't believe it if AboveNet > says they do this to "protect their customers from spam" -- they've > never produced any spam originating from these sites, and in any > case, blocking customers' Web access has no effect on the amount of > spam that they get! We're talking _major_ spamhausen, of course they send spam. These are spamhausen we've been tracking for over 2 years. Just to give you an idea, this is the termination history of just one of the spamhausen sitting right now in your class C: extractor-pro.com terminated on Dec 31 1999 (directcon.net) bulkemailpeople.com terminated on Dec 31 1999 (directcon.net) e-mailmagnet.com terminated on Dec 31 1999 (directcon.net) stealthmassmailer.com terminated on Dec 31 1999 (directcon.net) marketingmasters.com terminated on Jan 8 2000 (ticnet.com) desktopserver98.com terminated on Jan 8 2000 (ticnet.com) massmailer.com terminated on Jan 22 2000 (ticnet.com) desktopserver98.com terminated on Sep 12 2000 (intelenet.net) marketingmasters.com terminated on Sep 12 2000 (intelenet.net) e-mailblaster.com terminated on Sep 12 2000 (intelenet.net) e-mailmagnet.com terminated on Mar 14 2000 (sesqui.net) bulkemailpeople.com terminated on Feb 19 2000 (granitecanyon.com) extractor-pro.com terminated on Mar 14 2000 (sesqui.net) e-mailblaster.com terminated on Feb 19 2000 (sesqui.net) bulkemailpeople.com terminated on Mar 14 2000 (sesqui.net) e-mailblaster.com terminated on Apr 6 2000 (zyan.com) desktopserver98.com terminated on Apr 6 2000 (zyan.com) stealthmassmailer.com terminated on Mar 14 2000 (sesqui.net) marketingmasters.com terminated on Apr 6 2000 (zyan.com) tornadoblaster.com terminated on Mar 14 2000 (sesqui.net) ontarget98.com terminated on Mar 14 2000 (sesqui.net) listsorcerer.com terminated on Mar 14 2000 (sesqui.net) stealthmassmailer.com terminated on Apr 6 2000 (qwest.net) e-mailmagnet.com terminated on Apr 6 2000 (qwest.net) extractor-pro.com terminated on Apr 6 2000 (qwest.net) bulkemailpeople.com terminated on Apr 6 2000 (qwest.net) tornadoblaster.com terminated on Apr 6 2000 (qwest.net) ontarget98.com terminated on Apr 6 2000 (qwest.net) listsorcerer.com terminated on Apr 6 2000 (qwest.net) stealthmassmailer.com terminated on Apr 14 2000 (relaypoint.net) e-mailmagnet.com terminated on Apr 14 2000 (relaypoint.net) extractor-pro.com terminated on Apr 14 2000 (relaypoint.net) bulkemailpeople.com terminated on Apr 14 2000 (relaypoint.net) tornadoblaster.com terminated on Apr 14 2000 (relaypoint.net) ontarget98.com terminated on Apr 14 2000 (relaypoint.net) listsorcerer.com terminated on Apr 14 2000 (relaypoint.net) marketingmasters.com terminated on Jul 31 2000 (zyan.com) e-mailmagnet.com terminated on Jul 31 2000 (zyan.com) extractor-pro.com terminated on Jul 31 2000 (zyan.com) ontarget98.com terminated on Jul 31 2000 (zyan.com) stealthmassmailer.com terminated on Jul 31 2000 (zyan.com) tornadoblaster.com terminated on Jul 31 2000 (zyan.com) e-mailmagnet.com terminated on Sep 12 2000 (intelenet.net) tornadoblaster.com terminated on Sep 12 2000 (intelenet.net) bulkemailpeople.com LIVE in NETBLK-QWEST-209-211-248 (media3.net) desktopserver98.com LIVE in NETBLK-QWEST-209-211-248 (media3.net) e-mailblaster.com LIVE in NETBLK-QWEST-209-211-248 (media3.net) extractor-pro98.com LIVE in NETBLK-QWEST-209-211-248 (media3.net) massmailer.com LIVE in NETBLK-QWEST-209-211-248 (media3.net) listsorcerer.com LIVE in NETBLK-UU-63-74-120 (media3.net) Media3 are attempting court action which will stop the Internet community from blackholing the hard-line stealth spam operations Media3 hosts, and I find this very alarming. Should MAPS be ordered by a court to release the notorious SAMCO and GHI/BulkISP spam outfits Media3 hosts from the RBL (see info on these below), the Internet will lose its main defence against spamhausen. Every spammer on the net is cheering Media3 on and it stands to reason that without the RBL to stop them every spamhaus not already on Media3 will make a beeline for Media3. I firms like Media3 are prepared to fight the anti-spam community in court to keep the Spam Support Services they host, we stand little chance of eradicating Spam Support Services from the Internet let alone stemming the snowballing growth of Spam Support Services. As Spam Support Services are the fuel, the main cause of, and the root of today's spam problem, this is a case the Internet community actually can't afford to lose. You can review the spam services currently hosted by Media3 in the same block as www.peacefire.org at the following URLs, note that www.peacefire.org is at 209.211.253.169, slap-bang in the middle of this lot of spamhausen: IP Spam Service Site -------------- ----------------- 209.211.253.68 http://www.extractor-pro98.com/ 209.211.253.69 http://www.list-sorcerer.com 209.211.253.70 http://www.massmailer.com 209.211.253.71 http://www.bulkemailpeople.com 209.211.253.72 http://www.desktopserver98.com/ 209.211.253.73 http://www.e-mailblaster.com 209.211.253.74 http://www.marketingmasters.com/bulkserv.htm 209.211.253.79 http://www.4microsoft2000.com/index1.html 209.211.253.84 http://www.bulkers.net 209.211.253.88 http://www.bulkbarn.com/ 209.211.253.89 http://www.web-promotions.com/ 209.211.253.126 http://www.bulkisp.com/ 209.211.253.139 http://www.firstlinesoft.com/ 209.211.253.248 http://www.bulkhost.net 209.211.253.248 http://www.bulk-isp.net 209.211.253.248 http://www.bulkispcorp.net 209.211.253.248 http://www.bulk-isp.com 209.211.253.248 http://www.bulkisp.nu 209.211.253.248 http://www.bulkisp.net 209.211.253.248 http://www.bulkispcorp.com - -- Steve Linford The Spamhaus Project http://www.spamhaus.org - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 16 Dec 2000 16:08:53 -0500 From: wollman@lcs.mit.edu (Garrett Wollman) Subject: Re: AboveNet backbone provider blocking Peacefire site In article <3A3AA56D.65322711@diogenes.sacramento.ca.us>, John David Galt wrote: >The RBL is supposed to be used only to block incoming mail messages, It is supposed to be used for whatever its subscribers choose to use it for. In point of fact, the BGP feed was the first, and for quite some time only, mechanism by which the RBL was made available, clearly putting the lie to your unfounded assertion. - -GAWollman - -- Garrett A. Wollman | O Siem / We are all family / O Siem / We're all the same wollman@lcs.mit.edu | O Siem / The fires of freedom Opinions not those of| Dance in the burning flame MIT, LCS, CRS, or NSA| - Susan Aglukark and Chad Irschick - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 16 Dec 2000 16:09:38 -0500 From: dannyb@panix.com (danny burstein) Subject: power supplies, was: Re: I think I will create the TSFPWW In <200012152342.PAA13303@mail.eskimo.com> scs@eskimo.com (Steve Summit) writes: >The industry desperately needs to standardize on one voltage for >these things (I'd suggest 12 volts, AC; rectifiers are cheap, >and using AC avoids polarity problems) and also one standard >connector for the standard voltage. Then, someone can come out >with "power strips" which contain one transformer and multiple >low-voltage outlets that you can plug all your little low-power >devices into. Wouldn't that be nice? I'd modify that suggestion a bit and look forward a couple of years into the future, and recommend (nominal) 36-42V DC. Why? 1) at that voltage, unlike 12v, you can actually run your cables a decent distance without power losses. 2) there's a fair amount of telco experience with a similar voltage already. A great deal of telco stuff is powered off a nominal 48volts, so there's a small but well defined infrastructure of equipment, fittings, housings, and experience. It's generally high quality and high priced, but with a bit of luck and marketing (see below) the quality can be maintained and the prices lowered. 3) being under 50 volts, it's exempt from a lot of the National Electric Code minutia. (There certainly are safety factors but they're much less critical than at higher voltages) 4) if (and that's a big if) fuel cells can actually be manufactured and marketed succesfully, they'll be outputting a direct current feed. Since the conversion to AC requires additional equipment (and expense and space) and is only, perhaps, 90% efficient, there will be added incentive to use the DC directly. 5) And, most importantly for the wide acceptance: In the next couple of years we're going to see a lot of automotive euqipment move from the present day 12 volt battery system - charged at 14 volts, to a 36 volt battery - charged at 42 volts. So quite a bit of equipment of all sorts, including lighting, communications, and lots and lots of other stuff will soon be available off the shelf for this. - -- _____________________________________________________ Knowledge may be power, but communications is the key dannyb@panix.com [to foil spammers, my address has been double rot-13 encoded] - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 16 Dec 2000 16:10:55 -0500 From: Jim Rusling Subject: Re: AboveNet backbone provider blocking Peacefire site Joel B Levin wrote: >In , > Jim Rusling wrote: >}Bennett Haselton wrote: > Bennett's complaint snipped >}Quit selling spamware and then ask the RBL team to delist your IP >}address. It is really quite easy. I wish my ISP used the RBL. > >Bennett's not selling spamware. His provider has other customers who do, in >violation of above.net's AUP, and they refuse to do anything about it (rather >like a landlord who rents shops to those who fence stolen property and is >happy to continue collecting the rent). He is an innocent victim, in the same >sense that law enforcement somehow shutting down the building with the fences' >shops can also affect, say, an action committee who has done nothing more >serious than rent an office from the same landlord. There is reason for him >to seriously consider voting with his feet rather than continue to depend on a >supporter of spam services for access; though he could also try to see if he >couldn't persuade MAPS to remove his host(s) from the blacklist. Should the >provider cease to violate the AUP of above.net, I expect they would happily >support removing them from the RBL or begin passing traffic for that provider >regardless of the RBL. > > /JBL I misunderstood. He will then need to change providers to someone that is not spam friendly if he does not want to be blocked. - -- Jim Rusling Now retired full time Mustang, OK http://jrusling.home.mindspring.com - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 16 Dec 2000 16:11:36 -0500 From: jay@west.net (Jay Hennigan) Subject: Re: AboveNet backbone provider blocking Peacefire site On 15 Dec 2000 18:11:16 -0500, John David Galt wrote: :Garrett Wollman wrote: : :> Really? When my organization talked to AboveNet about possibly :> getting service from them, they were quite clear that they receive and :> use a BGP feed of the Realtime Blackhole List. This was represented :> by their representative as a feature. : :The RBL is supposed to be used only to block incoming mail messages, :not outgoing web access. And an ISP that respects its users would :leave it up to each user whether to turn on even that blocking. The RBL is a listing of IP addresses of organizations that engage in or facilitate spam. Most ISPs who use it apply it as a mail filter, but it can also be, with permission, used as a BGP feed to block all traffic. In my viewpoint, spam is a form of denial-of-service attack on the Internet at large, and the MAPS people are acting to reduce all of the effects of this attack. As far as Peacefire goes, they certainly can and should seek other connectifity. In addition to RBL, there are many others who independently filter traffic from spam supporting networks. Remember AGIS? Once a provider embraces spamming and spammers, their connectivity suffers and legitimate customers leave, causing a death spiral. Look at the IP space in the /24 around Peacefire's site. Would *you* want to live in that neighborhood? Do you really think that the provider isn't a spam-supporting site with a customer list like the following? 209.211.253.68 http://www.extractor-pro98.com/ 209.211.253.69 http://www.list-sorcerer.com 209.211.253.70 http://www.massmailer.com 209.211.253.71 http://www.bulkemailpeople.com 209.211.253.72 http://www.desktopserver98.com/ 209.211.253.73 http://www.e-mailblaster.com 209.211.253.74 http://www.marketingmasters.com/bulkserv.htm 209.211.253.84 http://www.bulkers.net 209.211.253.88 http://www.bulkbarn.com/ 209.211.253.89 http://www.web-promotions.com/ 209.211.253.126 http://www.bulkisp.com/ --> 209.211.253.169 http://www.peacefire.org <--- 209.211.253.248 http://www.bulkhost.net 209.211.253.248 http://www.bulk-isp.net 209.211.253.248 http://www.bulkispcorp.net Keep in mind that the RBL listings come only after extensive and lengthy attempts to educate the holder of the IP addresses to cease supporting spam and spammers. Media3 has made a business decision to provide web space to those who are profiting from a distributed denial-of-service attack on the Internet. Peacefire has made a business decision to get their connectivity from Media3. Media3 can lose their spammers and start digging themselves out of the multiple filters they've caused to be created worldwide, including the RBL. Peacefire can seek other connectivity, it's likely they've had offers from other providers who aren't spam supporters. I would seriously encourage them to do so. The cleanest, most well-run store in the world isn't going to get a lot of business if it's surrounded by crack houses, slums, and sewage treatment plants. Those who get their connectivity from a provider who uses the RBL can also seek connectivity elsewhere. Then they'll get Peacefire. And a heaping side order of spam. - -- Jay Hennigan - Network Administration - jay@west.net NetLojix Communications, Inc. NASDAQ: NETX - http://www.netlojix.com/ WestNet: Connecting you to the planet. 805 884-6323 - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 16 Dec 2000 16:12:21 -0500 From: dannyb@panix.com (danny burstein) Subject: Re: I think I will create the TSFPWW In hudsonl@skypoint.com (Hudson Leighton) writes: >A major coup would be the same low-voltage connector on a wall wart, >ever looked at the collection of plugs on a Radio Shack "universal" >wall wart. It used to that the wall wart and device had the same manfacturers >name on them, now days the wall wart is labeled for the XYZ wall wart co. >And you are out of luck if the wall wart and the device get seperated. >I now put my own sticky label on a wall wart as soon as I take it out of the >box so I have a ghost of a chance of keeping it with the correct device. Another key thing to do is put a decent sized label with the (nominal) power requirement on the equipment front and back. And if it's DC, mark down which side is negative. This will make it _much_ easier to mix and match supplies and demands. For added incentive, I've bumped into quite a few items that _don't_ have the power demand listed on the main box. - -- _____________________________________________________ Knowledge may be power, but communications is the key dannyb@panix.com [to foil spammers, my address has been double rot-13 encoded] - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 16 Dec 2000 16:12:28 -0500 From: Joel B Levin Subject: Re: AboveNet backbone provider blocking Peacefire site In <3A3AA56D.65322711@diogenes.sacramento.ca.us>, John David Galt wrote: }Garrett Wollman wrote: } }> Really? When my organization talked to AboveNet about possibly }> getting service from them, they were quite clear that they receive and }> use a BGP feed of the Realtime Blackhole List. This was represented }> by their representative as a feature. } }The RBL is supposed to be used only to block incoming mail messages, }not outgoing web access. And an ISP that respects its users would }leave it up to each user whether to turn on even that blocking. The RBL is supposed to be used any way the subscriber wishes to use it. Subscription to the BGP feed of the RBL implies an intention to use it to block all IP access to and from blackholed addresses. At the packet routing level where BGP operates, no distinction is made between email or http or any other kinds of IP packets. If it was not intended for an ISP to use the RBL in this way, MAPS would not make a BGP feed available. Your statement is just plain wrong. /JBL - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 16 Dec 2000 16:47:16 -0500 From: Robert Casey Subject: New area code for NY, PacBell gives faulty error message It looks like today is the first day of mandatory dialing of the new area code 845 (split off of 914) and my friends there neglected to tell me. Anyway, I dial 914-365-xxxx and get error message "The area code 000 has changed to 000". I called from 408-324-xxxx Had to call the Sprint operator to find out the new area code. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 16 Dec 2000 17:02:39 -0500 From: kamlet@infinet.com (Art Kamlet) Subject: Re: Subject: Re: Pulling the Zero, and higher digits In article <7E3E57AE.58F78637.0006300D@netscape.net>, Herb Sutherland wrote: > > >I just thought of something! When I was in the military, they had their own private telephone network. It was called AUTOVON (automatic voice network). Is it possible that by dialing the "A" that would give you access to the AUTOVON? My autovon phone circa 1965 had an additional column on the right with 4 buttons. The top two were FO (Flash Override) and F (Flash) and I think the next one was I (Immediate???) or ? (Priority??) but I am vague on the last two. If your phone was equipped for FO, say (the general's phone would be) then if you dialed someone, you would get through even if he was currently talking. - -- Art Kamlet Columbus, Ohio kamlet@infinet.com - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 16 Dec 2000 17:59:40 -0500 From: Roy Subject: Re: New area code for NY, PacBell gives faulty error message And why is that PacBell's fault? I would think the fault is either in the LEC for the 914-365 or in your long distance carrier. Robert Casey wrote: > It looks like today is the first day of mandatory dialing of the new > area code 845 (split off of 914) and my friends there neglected > to tell me. Anyway, I dial 914-365-xxxx and get error message > "The area code 000 has changed to 000". I called from 408-324-xxxx > Had to call the Sprint operator to find out the new area code. > -- > The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail > messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 16 Dec 2000 20:04:38 -0500 From: Dave Tweed Subject: Re: power supplies, was: Re: I think I will create the TSFPWW danny burstein wrote: > I'd modify that suggestion a bit and look forward a couple of years into > the future, and recommend (nominal) 36-42V DC. I heartily second that, especially reasons #2 and #5. DC-DC converters are already readily available, and can be made much smaller than the magnetics required to deal with 60 Hz. Let me add: 6. 36VDC is a good voltage from which to run a 120 VAC inverter for powering (legacy) devices that really need AC. I'm thinking ahead to the time when my house is mostly running off of DC. - -- Dave Tweed - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 16 Dec 2000 20:42:19 -0500 From: Wes Leatherock Subject: Re: Early NPA Assignments On 16 Dec 2000 13:00:11 -0500 Joel B Levin [ ... ] > "Desirable" numbers for businesses are typically numbers ending in 00 or 000. > Except that many years ago, while this seemed to be true in the East (and > probably other places I didn't know about), in Mountain Bell territory where I > lived, the best numbers seemed to be the ones that ended in the most 1's. So > while "ANdrews 8-8000" might have been really easy to remember or write a > jingle about, a number like EAst 7-3111 was a lot easier to dial. It depends on whether it was a step office or an office such as Panel Type or crossbar. Businesses, especially large businesses, have a large number of incoming trunks. A number ending in "00" is the very last terminal reached in a step office so there could be only one line associated with a number ending in "00." A connector in a step office starts with "11" and ends at "00." So a number ending in "11" could have 100 trunks associated with it. (If you have a need for more than 100 trunks, there are special arrangements that can be made, usually involving making some trunks outgoing only.) In Southwestern Bell territory, Kansas City and St. Louis were converted to dial with Panel Type (and crossbar later added), so businesses there liked "00." But it did mean a lot of dialing for the customer. Dallas, Fort Worth, Houston, San Antonio, Oklahoma City, Tulsa and others were all step, so large customers had to settle for "11"...and it was easier for the customers, too. The same thing was no doubt true in Denver, too. Wes Leatherock wleath@sandbox.dynip.com - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 17 Dec 2000 00:39:54 -0500 From: "Ed Ellers" Subject: AUTOVON (was Re: Pulling the Zero, and higher digits) Art Kamlet wrote: "My autovon phone circa 1965 had an additional column on the right with 4 buttons. The top two were FO (Flash Override) and F (Flash) and I think the next one was I (Immediate???) or ? (Priority??) but I am vague on the last two. If your phone was equipped for FO, say (the general's phone would be) then if you dialed someone, you would get through even if he was currently talking." Those are the right names. AUTOVON 16-button sets also had the star key labeled with a five-pointed star and an A on the # key. The only people who had FO capability were the President, the Secretary of Defense, the commanders-in-chief of the "unified and specified commands" (such as U.S. Central Command, U.S. Space Command, etc.) and the CINC of NORAD. The CINCs could use that capability only to report either a DEFCON One or a defense emergency. http://hyperarchive.lcs.mit.edu/telecom-archives/archives/reports/autovon.in structions has an old set of instructions on using AUTOVON. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 17 Dec 2000 00:50:35 -0500 From: fgoodwin@yahoo.com (Fred Goodwin, CMA) Subject: Re: FCC to End Reciprocal Loophole rbf@rbfnet.com (Brett Frankenberger) wrote in <90cjic0iha@news2.newsguy.com>: >Huh? Where have you been? The FCC has clearly ruled that it is just >as local as when you, say, call your neighbor and talk about the >election issues happening several states away in Florida. Recip-comp >most certainly is applicable and there are CLECs giving lines to ISPs >and making all their money on recip-comp. That must explain why the FCC is readying an order to end recip-comp on dial-up ISP calls (which, after all, is the subject of this thread). - -- ======================================================================== * Fred Goodwin, CMA Dallas Cowboys Training Camp Page * * fgoodwin@yahoo.com http://www.eden.com/~fgoodwin/cowboys.htm * ======================================================================== - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 17 Dec 2000 01:31:10 -0500 From: "Keith M. Hardy" Subject: Radio Stations using SSb Hello, I am trying to find radio station which broadcast on Single Side Band frequences. Is there a list somewhere? Thanks, Keith Hardy khardy3830@aol.com ________________________________________________________________ GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO! Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less! Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ End of Telecom Digest V2000 #158 ******************************** Date: 18 Dec 2000 06:15:18 -0500 From: owner-telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org (Telecom Digest) To: telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org Subject: Telecom Digest V2000 #159 Telecom Digest Monday, December 18 2000 Volume 2000 : Number 159 In this issue: Re: AboveNet backbone provider blocking Peacefire site Re: desirable numbers (was Early NPA Assignments) Re: power supplies, was: Re: I think I will create the TSFPWW Re: AUTOVON (was Re: Pulling the Zero, and higher digits) Re: I think I will create the TSFPWW comp.risks considered harmful (by some) Re: Radio Stations using SSb "Smart" Predictive Dialer? Cisco Stratacom IPX 32 Equipment Re: "Smart" Predictive Dialer? ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 17 Dec 2000 07:51:49 -0500 From: Steve Linford Subject: Re: AboveNet backbone provider blocking Peacefire site In article , Steve Linford wrote: > In article <200012142157.eBELvuA24711@jessica.iain.com>, > Bennett Haselton wrote: > > > We've discovered that a large Internet backbone company has > > been blocking their downstream customers from accessing the > > Peacefire.org Web site for the past four months. > > Not true. Your class C was only placed on the RBL 4 weeks ago. But a > great many of the spam sites in your class C have been on the RBL > since May/June. According to Peacefire.org's Whois record it looks > like you were moved into that block full of already-RBL'd spammers on > 22-Jul-2000. Can you confirm that? Very strange, I've asked Bennett Haselton that question 4 times now and he won't answer it. Suppose an ISP had a class C full of spam outfits and that therefore half of his class C was already on the RBL. Suppose the ISP had another 10-20 spam outfits he wanted to put into the same class C but he already knew that if he did that the whole class C would definately be placed on the RBL within months (because the ISP has already been told that). Suppose an "anti-blocking" site, say www.peacefire.org came along wanting hosting. In which of the ISPs many class Cs would it be a good idea to put www.peacefire.org in? Of course, until Bennett Haselton answers the question "did www.peacefire.org move into that class C in July 2000?", this remains speculation. - -- Steve Linford - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 17 Dec 2000 10:40:23 -0500 From: Joseph Singer Subject: Re: desirable numbers (was Early NPA Assignments) 16 Dec 2000 13:00:11 -0500 Joel B Levin wrote: >In <5.0.0.25.0.20001215230144.00a08680@mailbox.verizon.net>, > Gary Novosielski wrote: >}Although the dial pulses did figure into the assignment of codes correlated >}to traffic, area codes have always been listed in numerical order, and 201 >}did, and still does top the list as the "lowest" number. > >Not in some old internal telco lists I've seen. > >}It could be argued that the "lowest" telephone number in the world is >}located somewhere in Jersey City, NJ., if you accept the following >}definition of "low": >} >}The lowest Country Code is +1: USA >}The lowest US NPA is 201: NJ >}The lowest NXX code in 201 is 200: Jersey City >} >}Presumably, if someone in Jersey City has the number +1.201.200.0001 that >}could be considered to be the lowest number in the world, and a real vanity >}coup! I wonder if he or she knows. > >Why not 201-200-0000? > >}"But," I hear you cry, "on a rotary dial, that would be 67 pulses!" True, >}but this is a DTMF age. > >"Desirable" numbers for businesses are typically numbers ending in 00 or 000. >Except that many years ago, while this seemed to be true in the East (and >probably other places I didn't know about), in Mountain Bell territory where I >lived, the best numbers seemed to be the ones that ended in the most 1's. So >while "ANdrews 8-8000" might have been really easy to remember or write a >jingle about, a number like EAst 7-3111 was a lot easier to dial. I don't think it's an east versus west thing, but more likely the type of switching equipment that was originally installed. Most everywhere in major cities if the switching equipment was panel or crossbar major businesses would have numbers that ended XX00 (hundred) or X000 (thousand). In cities where step-by-step (aka Strowger) large businesses usually ended with the number 1 because in a step office to have "hunting" step-by-step offices go from 1 to 0 with 1 being the lowest number. In panel and crossbar offices the lowest number is zero. - --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Joseph Singer Seattle, Washington USA [ICQ pgr] +1 206 405 2052 [voice mail] +1 206 493 0706 [FAX] - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 17 Dec 2000 13:46:04 -0500 From: "Ed Ellers" Subject: Re: power supplies, was: Re: I think I will create the TSFPWW The problem with a common low-voltage source is that devices must either (A) be designed to operate directly at that voltage -- which may not be feasible with semiconductor technologies that prefer much lower voltages (5V, 3.3V, etc.) -- or (B) must regulate or convert the voltage down inside the device. A device that does the latter could cost as much or more (*not* including the common power supply) as one that uses an AC adapter (*including* the cost of the adapter). Now if this is desirable, there is a small standard low-voltage outlet, namely the one used on airliners to power notebook computers, that could be adopted (cigarette lighter sockets are another established 12V standard, but are way too big). Keep in mind that there are a lot of benefits to the design engineer of using "wall warts" aside from their low unit cost. In the U.S., where some jurisdictions require UL or equivalent approval by law, a device that plugs right into 120V AC needs compliance testing for the *entire* device, while if it uses an AC adapter only the adapter need be tested (except in a few cases such as TVs -- yes, even some 12" TVs use wall warts). AC adapters also allow the same unit to be sold in countries with widely varying power requirements by simply packing a different adapter for each group of countries (at the same time that a different owners' manual, driver CD, etc. is packed) instead of having to build production runs with different power supply sections. There may also be product liability benefits in being able to shift blame for fires, injury, etc. off onto the "wall wart" vendor. One thing I liked recently was the AC adapter for the Intel AnyPoint networking unit -- it's relatively flat, not a cube, and fits in almost any power strip without blocking adjacent outlets - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 17 Dec 2000 13:47:11 -0500 From: Roy Subject: Re: AUTOVON (was Re: Pulling the Zero, and higher digits) The 4 buttons were the precedence FO, F, I, P. They were kind of a joke. People would push the higher button to get their calls though. We routinely used Flash to get calls through to Germany and Japan because if you used a lower button you either got a busy signal or knocked off. And, yes, my FO button did work (1LT). Ed Ellers wrote: > Art Kamlet wrote: > > "My autovon phone circa 1965 had an additional column on the right with 4 > buttons. The top two were FO (Flash Override) and F (Flash) and I think the > next one was I (Immediate???) or ? (Priority??) but I am vague on the last > two. If your phone was equipped for FO, say (the general's phone would be) > then if you dialed someone, you would get through even if he was currently > talking." > > Those are the right names. AUTOVON 16-button sets also had the star key > labeled with a five-pointed star and an A on the # key. The only people who > had FO capability were the President, the Secretary of Defense, the > commanders-in-chief of the "unified and specified commands" (such as U.S. > Central Command, U.S. Space Command, etc.) and the CINC of NORAD. The CINCs > could use that capability only to report either a DEFCON One or a defense > emergency. > > http://hyperarchive.lcs.mit.edu/telecom-archives/archives/reports/autovon.in > structions has an old set of instructions on using AUTOVON. > -- > The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail > messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 17 Dec 2000 19:18:51 -0500 From: Dan Lanciani Subject: Re: I think I will create the TSFPWW This is proposed from time to time and there is a subtle problem. Many wall-wart-using gadgets rely on the total isolation provided by their power supplies. There are blatant cases and subtle cases. In the blatant cases, the negative power supply input may be connected to something entirely unrelated to the ground that the gadget exposes at other interface points. If the two such gadgets share a common ground connection through some other equipment (or if one such gadget shares a ground with a grounded-supply gadget) and the two gadgets share a power supply, some portion of the gadgets' internal circuitry will be shorted out. A common supply approach would require that (at a minimum) all powered modules with external galvanic interfaces be examined (and possibly redesigned) to insure that they use a standard ground reference. Since the tricks that take advantage of the isolated supplies were almost certainly used to cut costs (e.g., to fake a split rail or to control RFI cheaply), vendors will not be happy about abandoning them unless the standard can be shown to be widely used. Even if you have (or can have built) devices which all share a common notion of ground for their power supply and galvanic interface(s) there remains the more subtle issue of unwanted currents in signal ground connections (often lumped in with the somewhat nebulous "ground loop" problem). Consider two identical video cameras with a DC supply input and a baseband output sharing a common ground. Each camera is supplied with a wall wart, and the two video outputs are connected to a switcher. Everything agrees about ground, so this might seem like a great opportunity to replace both wall warts with a single supply of adequate current to power both cameras. But what if the cables to the cameras are of different lengths? There will be different voltage drops in the two supply cables and thus different potentials (relative to our one true reference ground) at the cameras. Current will flow in the shields of the video cables and the corresponding drop (rise) will be superimposed on the video signal. If the supply is unregulated this will add noise. If the supply is clean you will still get a DC offset that may or may not be a problem depending on the input stage of the switcher. Note that you can get all the same problems with just one camera if you ground its power supply at the equipment end and there are long supply and video cables between that end and the camera. These kinds of problems are often very difficult to track down. Assuming for the moment that we cannot solve the problem by eliminating galvanic interfaces (in favor of, e.g., optical or RF), I would prefer an approach of AC distribution at whatever is the highest voltage that the NEC still classifies as "low voltage" (40-50V RMS perhaps?). I think this would offer maximum flexibility. Micro-power devices with isolated (or no) galvanic interfaces could use a linear regulator run directly from the rectified input. More complicated devices could use a conventional transformer or an isolating switching power supply whose input stage runs from the rectified supply. Dan Lanciani ddl@danlan.*com - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 17 Dec 2000 21:37:54 -0500 From: Monty Solomon Subject: comp.risks considered harmful (by some) Excerpt from Risks Digest 21.14 http://catless.ncl.ac.uk/Risks/21.14.html#subj8 - ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 8 Dec 2000 14:25:34 +0100 From: Thomas Roessler Subject: comp.risks considered harmful (by some) This site: lists some results from a reverse-engineering effort against the black list used by "SmartFilter". Apparently, comp.risks is being blocked by that software under the "Criminal Skills" category, as are comp.dcom.telecom, comp.org.cpsr.announce, comp.org.eff.news, comp.protocols.tcp-ip, comp.security.announce, and others. - ------------------------------ - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 17 Dec 2000 22:01:08 -0500 From: jay@west.net (Jay Hennigan) Subject: Re: Radio Stations using SSb On 17 Dec 2000 01:31:10 -0500, Keith M. Hardy wrote: :Hello, : I am trying to find radio station which broadcast on Single Side Band :frequences. Is there a list somewhere? Single sideband is a modulation technique, not a frequency band. In its most common form, single sideband transmission involves suppressing the carrier, which makes tuning more critical. As such it is more suited for communications than for broadcast. Most shortwave voice communications are on single sideband, including amateur radio, ship-to-shore, etc. U.S. television video uses a modified form called "vestigial sideband" where the lower sideband is greatly reduced. Early experiments in AM stereo broadcasting used an interesting variation where one channel was sent on the upper sideband and the other on the lower, with a carrier present. Some VHF communications gear has been made with a modulation scheme called ACSB, amplitude compandored sideband. It's compressed audio with SSB modulation and a pilot tone to assist in receiver lock. The pilot is a form of "frequency-shifted carrier" that is used for AGC and AFC in the accompanying receiver. The main advantage is reduced bandwidth over conventional FM. Its popularity is limited, and it is on the way out in favor of narrower-band FM radios for VHF and UHF communication. Broadcast stations are still either conventional AM or FM, as far as I know. The loss of fidelity and increased complexity in the receiving equipment would tend to rule out SSB for broadcasters. If you hear something that sounds like Donald Duck on your shortwave set, that's single sideband. If your receiver has a BFO you can tune it in, very carfully and slow on the tuning knob. - -- Jay Hennigan - Network Administration - jay@west.net NetLojix Communications, Inc. NASDAQ: NETX - http://www.netlojix.com/ WestNet: Connecting you to the planet. 805 884-6323 - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 17 Dec 2000 22:04:30 -0500 From: "M H" Subject: "Smart" Predictive Dialer? OK, a question for all you folks who have some knowledge of predictive dialers (I won't ask who actually works with them; I bet no one would admit it anyway!). Are any predictive dialers "smart" enough to understand the three-rising-tone intercept that generally indicates a disconnected phone line ("boob-bob-beep! We're sorry, the number you have dialed..." yadda yadda yadda) and place that number in its 'do not call' database? I've done a quickie check on web sites but haven't found any explicit mention. _____________________________________________________________________________________ Get more from the Web. FREE MSN Explorer download : http://explorer.msn.com - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 17 Dec 2000 22:49:46 -0500 From: "RETECHWEST" Subject: Cisco Stratacom IPX 32 Equipment Complete Cisco / Stratacom IPX-32 System Available. Recently out of service from ATT. 14 cabinets, various system boards, cabling, and other items. All excellent working condition. To view the equipment: http://www.retechwest.com/CISCOIPX32.htm Thank You. Newsgroup Administrator: This will be a one time posting. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 18 Dec 2000 02:21:56 -0500 From: Robert Casey Subject: Re: "Smart" Predictive Dialer? Don't know for sure, but I bought a little box that makes such tones when I answer the phone. Purpose of box is to blow off telemarketers. Seems to work pretty well. I don't get too many telemarketers anymore since I got this box. This is where I got it from: http://www.sandman.com/tmstop.html M H wrote: > OK, a question for all you folks who have some knowledge of predictive > dialers (I won't ask who actually works with them; I bet no one would admit > it anyway!). > > Are any predictive dialers "smart" enough to understand the > three-rising-tone intercept that generally indicates a disconnected phone > line ("boob-bob-beep! We're sorry, the number you have dialed..." yadda > yadda yadda) and place that number in its 'do not call' database? I've done > a quickie check on web sites but haven't found any explicit mention. > > - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ End of Telecom Digest V2000 #159 ******************************** Date: 19 Dec 2000 06:15:19 -0500 From: owner-telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org (Telecom Digest) To: telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org Subject: Telecom Digest V2000 #160 Telecom Digest Tuesday, December 19 2000 Volume 2000 : Number 160 In this issue: censorware bill passes; universal bypass program released Telecom Update (Canada) #263, December 18, 2000 Re: Message Mysteriously in Voice Mailbox - How? Re: censorware bill passes; universal bypass program released Re: Pulling the Zero, and higher digits CFP: ACM MobiCom 2001 : The Seventh Annual International Conference on Mobile Computing and Networking SMS security over various networks? Future mobile phones 12/18/00 ICBTollFreeNews.Com HEADS UP HEADLINES Re: censorware bill passes; universal bypass program released Re: censorware bill passes; universal bypass program released ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 18 Dec 2000 10:30:47 -0500 From: Bennett Haselton Subject: censorware bill passes; universal bypass program released [sent to journalists on Peacefire's press contacts list] A new program, "Peacefire", is available on our Web page that can disable all popular Windows blocking programs with the click of a button -- released just as Congress has passed the first mandatory-blocking-software bill. Since the House and Senate passed corresponding versions of the Labor HHS Education Appropriations Bill (HR 4577) on Friday, with an amendment included to require the use of blocking software in schools and libraries that receive federal funding, it is likely to become law soon. If the meaning of the amendment text has not been changed, then blocking software will be required for adults as well as minors when using library computers: http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/D?r106:5:./temp/~r106mmFZoQ:: (see part (b), "Libraries"). The American Library Association announced the passage of the House bill in the December 15 issue of the ALA Washington Office Newsline: http://peacefire.org/censorware/alawon.12-15-2000.txt ALAWON has not yet confirmed whether the final text of the filtering amendment was identical to the original. In response, Peacefire has released a bypass program -- eponymously named "Peacefire" -- which can disable all popular Windows blocking software (Cyber Patrol, SurfWatch, Net Nanny, CYBERsitter, X-Stop, Cyber Snoop, PureSight) with the click of a button. The program is available at http://www.peacefire.org/bypass/ and we will be widely publicizing its release, despite the grave risk that we might get a lot of traffic. -Bennett bennett@peacefire.org http://www.peacefire.org (425) 649 9024 - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 18 Dec 2000 10:39:33 -0500 From: Angus TeleManagement Subject: Telecom Update (Canada) #263, December 18, 2000 ************************************************************ TELECOM UPDATE Angus TeleManagement's Weekly Telecom Newsbulletin http://www.angustel.ca Number 263: December 18, 2000 Publication of Telecom Update is made possible by generous financial support from: AT&T Canada ...................... http://www.attcanada.com/ Bell Canada ............................ http://www.bell.ca/ C1 Communications ......... http://www.c1communications.com/ Cisco Systems Canada ................. http://www.cisco.com/ Lucent Technologies Canada ........... http://www.lucent.ca/ Norigen ............................ http://www.norigen.com/ Sprint Canada .................. http://www.sprintcanada.ca/ ************************************************************ IN THIS ISSUE: ** We're Taking a Holiday ** Terry Matthews Buys Mitel Back ** Bell Wants Changes in New Phone Subsidy Rules ** RIM Plans GPRS Service ** Telus Intros Wireless Palm Service ** CRTC Wants Input on Telecom Monitoring Task ** PSINet Upgrades Eastern Backbone ** Toronto Cab Company Adopts GPS ** Internet Banking Doubles in Canada ** Scotiabank to Offer Banking via Interactive TV ** Tribunal Explains Prison Phone Decision ** Cannect Gets Okay as CLEC ** Panasonic Chooses Calgary for Design Centre ** Cuba Blocking U.S. Circuits ** Executive Shuffle at BCE ** Financial VP Leaves Cell-Loc ** New COO at 360networks ** Correction -- Look Communications ** Telemanagement 2000 Index Now Available ============================================================ WE'RE TAKING A HOLIDAY: Telecom Update is taking a winter break; our next issue will be posted Tuesday, January 2. We wish all readers a successful and rewarding New Year. TERRY MATTHEWS BUYS MITEL BACK: Terry Matthews has agreed to purchase Mitel's Communications Systems division, including the name "Mitel," for $350 Million in cash, notes, and shares. Matthews was one of the founders of Mitel; he left in 1985 when British Telecom bought 51% of the company for $320 Million. ** Matthews has also advanced $8 Million to CrossKeys Systems, a networking software company that is currently looking for a buyer. BELL WANTS CHANGES IN NEW PHONE SUBSIDY RULES: Bell Canada and Bell Mobility have asked the CRTC to reduce the interim rate for the new "revenue tax" that all telecom providers must pay as of January 1 (see Telecom Update #261). They want the 2001 rate dropped from 4.7% to 2.5%, the level Bell calculates will be due in 2002. Wireless carriers should pay only 1.5% in 2001, they say. ** Microcell and Rogers Wireless have supported the Bell application. ** Telus says it may appeal the new rules as well, but for opposite reasons: it says that the amount of subsidy generated in 2002 and beyond will be too low. RIM PLANS GPRS SERVICE: Research in Motion has signed a wholesale agreement to buy airtime and GPRS communications services from Microcell. The deal will enable RIM to offer high-speed wireless Internet access to users of its handheld data units, beginning sometime in 2001. TELUS INTROS WIRELESS PALM SERVICE: Telus Mobility has become the first company in Canada to offer wireless Internet access to Palm V devices. The $50/month service is available in the Vancouver area now; it will be offered in other parts of BC and Alberta early in 2001. CRTC WANTS INPUT ON TELECOM MONITORING TASK: Public Notice 2000-175 announces a public consultation April 18-19 to determine what information the Commission needs in order to monitor the telecom industry (see Telecom Update #240). To participate, notify the Commission by January 29. Interested parties will receive an initial report in March, prepared by a consultant still to be engaged (see Telecom Update #261). http://www.crtc.gc.ca/archive/Notices/2000/PT2000-175.htm PSINET UPGRADES EASTERN BACKBONE: PSINet will increase the capacity of its fibre link from Toronto to three U.S. hosting centres to 40 Gbps by year-end. Its Toronto-Ottawa-Montreal link can now support up to 10 Gbps transmission. TORONTO CAB COMPANY ADOPTS GPS: Toronto's Diamond Taxicab Association has ordered GPS fleet management software from Ottawa-based SiGem. The software automatically dispatches the closest available cab to a caller. INTERNET BANKING DOUBLES IN CANADA: Canadian Facts says that about 20% of Canadians have signed up for Internet banking, double the number a year ago. Of the rest, 16% say they may do so in the next six months. SCOTIABANK TO OFFER BANKING VIA INTERACTIVE TV: Scotiabank says it will be the first Canadian bank to offer on-line banking via Rogers Cable's Interactive TV service. (See Telecom Update #259) TRIBUNAL EXPLAINS PRISON PHONE DECISION: Explaining its decision sustaining a Telus complaint against the award of a prison phone contract to Bell Canada, the Canadian International Trade Tribunal says that after bidding closed, Correctional Services of Canada held discussions with Bell that were "clearly improper" and "resulted in the CSC allowing BCE to repair its bid." (See Telecom Update #257) www.citt.gc.ca/PROCURE/DETERMIN/pr2a017e/pr2a017e.htm CANNECT GETS OKAY AS CLEC: Cannect Communications, a telecom services and equipment provider, has received the CRTC's approval to operate as a Competitive Local Exchange Carrier in Vancouver. PANASONIC CHOOSES CALGARY FOR DESIGN CENTRE: Panasonic Wireless says its new Calgary design centre, one of two in North America, will move into expanded facilities next July and grow to 150 staff by 2002. CUBA BLOCKING U.S. CIRCUITS: On December 15, the Cuban government cut direct phone service between Cuba and the U.S., because of U.S. phone companies' failure to pay a Cuban tax. Calls are being rerouted through third countries such as Canada. EXECUTIVE SHUFFLE AT BCE: BCE has appointed Siim Vanaselja as CFO and Patrick Pichette as EVP Planning and Performance Management, as of January 15. Vanaselja replaces Bill Anderson, who becomes Chairman of BCI. Howard Hendrick replaces Vanaselja as CFO of BCI. Pichette was formerly a partner with McKinsey & Co. FINANCIAL VP LEAVES CELL-LOC: David Howard, formerly VP Finance at Cell-Loc, has left the company. His functions are now filled by Jim Hill, named last month as CFO. NEW COO AT 360NETWORKS: 360networks has appointed Jimmy Byrd, formerly North American President of Level 3 Communications, as Chief Operating Officer. CORRECTION -- LOOK COMMUNICATIONS: Look Communications is continuing to market its wireless digital TV and Internet services to residential customers in Multi-Dwelling Units, contrary to what was implied in Telecom Update #262. TELEMANAGEMENT 2000 INDEX NOW AVAILABLE: Telemanagement subscribers will receive an eight-page subject index with the January issue of the newsletter. The index is also available on-line at the Angus Web site, where it is updated monthly. (http://www.angustel.ca) ** The Telecom Update search engine, also on the Angus Web site, accesses items in all back issues of the weekly newsbulletin. Both resources cover all years back to 1995. ** To subscribe to Telemanagement, call 1-800-263-4415, ext 500 or visit the Telemanagement home page at http://www.angustel.ca. ============================================================ HOW TO SUBMIT ITEMS FOR TELECOM UPDATE E-MAIL: editors@angustel.ca FAX: 905-686-2655 MAIL: TELECOM UPDATE Angus TeleManagement Group 8 Old Kingston Road Ajax, Ontario Canada L1T 2Z7 =========================================================== HOW TO SUBSCRIBE (OR UNSUBSCRIBE) TELECOM UPDATE is provided in electronic form only. There are two formats available: 1. The fully-formatted edition is posted on the World Wide Web on the first business day of the week at http://www.angustel.ca 2. The e-mail edition is distributed free of charge. To subscribe, send an e-mail message to: listmanager@subs.postmastergeneral.com Insert as the subject of your message the two words: subscribe TelecomUpdate To stop receiving the e-mail edition, send an e-mail message to: listmanager@subs.postmastergeneral.com Insert as the subject of your message the two words: unsubscribe TelecomUpdate =========================================================== COPYRIGHT AND DISCLAIMER: All contents copyright 2000 Angus TeleManagement Group Inc. All rights reserved. For further information, including permission to reprint or reproduce, please e-mail rosita@angustel.ca or phone 905-686-5050 ext 225. The information and data included has been obtained from sources which we believe to be reliable, but Angus TeleManagement makes no warranties or representations whatsoever regarding accuracy, completeness, or adequacy. Opinions expressed are based on interpretation of available information, and are subject to change. If expert advice on the subject matter is required, the services of a competent professional should be obtained. ============================================================ JOHN RIDDELL jriddell@angustel.ca Angus TeleManagement Group http://www.angustel.ca 8 Old Kingston Road Tel: 905-686-5050 x226 Ajax Ontario L1T 2Z7 Canada Fax: 905-686-2655 - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 18 Dec 2000 10:53:39 -0500 From: tweek@fnord.io.com (Mike Maxfield) Subject: Re: Message Mysteriously in Voice Mailbox - How? "Pete Ritter" writes: >Can anyone offer ideas on how this happened? > >My wife received a message in her Sprint PCS voice mailbox. It was her >father saying "OK. Your English no entiendo nada." ("I don't understand >your English"). My wife's parents live in Mexico and speak virtually no >English. When we asked him about this message, he said that he never left >such a message but that he did receive a call from a woman speaking English >and that's what he said to her. Does anyone have any idea how the message >could have appeared in her VMbox? Does Mexico have the automatically installed three way calling enhanced service like the telco threw onto our service in California (and likely elsewhere) where if you press the switchhook once you get another dial tone, and then if you hang up, the number you were previously connected to rings you back? If your father in law called your wife, perhaps he got the voice mail and decided tu hang up, yet somehow when he hung up, he hit the flash button or otherwise flashed the switch hook first, and then he recieved the ringback from the voicemail box, hearing only the tail end and not understanding the context of what was being said as it went into record mode, he said his memorable words... and not hearing the person (the now ended recording) repeatherself, he hung up, befuddled. - -- tweek@io.com - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 18 Dec 2000 10:58:07 -0500 From: jlurker@bigfoot.com (Justa Lurker) Subject: Re: censorware bill passes; universal bypass program released It was 18 Dec 2000 10:30:47 -0500, and Bennett Haselton wrote in comp.dcom.telecom: | In response, Peacefire has released a bypass program -- | eponymously named "Peacefire" -- which can disable all | popular Windows blocking software (Cyber Patrol, SurfWatch, | Net Nanny, CYBERsitter, X-Stop, Cyber Snoop, PureSight) | with the click of a button. Providing software to defeat blocking software makes an nearly immediate add to the blocking lists, including server based lists that the new software will not bypass. I gather Peacefire wants to join in the reputation of the other sites hosted on their ISP. One more thought, from peacefire's web page: > In general, this program will not work against censorware > programs used in schools, but it will work against home > censorware programs except for AOL Parental Controls. If this software was written in reaction to the bill, why doesn't do anything with the computers covered by the bill itself? Seems like a stunt to get Peacefire blocked more than being helpful. JL - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 18 Dec 2000 12:47:45 -0500 From: Steve Gaarder Subject: Re: Pulling the Zero, and higher digits On 15 Dec 2000, Jay Hennigan wrote: > For other examples of strange rotary dials, check out a New Zealand phone. > Only ten holes, but numbered in the opposite direction. Doing *that* > conversion electromechanically must have been fun if they had IDDD in the > early days. Yes, I remember hearing about these. Since IDDD never - at least to my knowledge - sent dial pulses over the trunks, I expect that accommodating the reverse-numbered dial merely meant that the signaling converter had to be built specially. They also used those phones in Oslo, Norway. Since, as I understand it, they were only used in part of the country, they would have had to do the above-mentioned fun electromechanical conversion for domestic DDD, and maybe even local calls in "borderline" areas. I actually own one of the Oslo-type phones. It used to be an interesting item to show to friends, but dials are so rare these days that the difference no longer jumps out to people! Steve Gaarder gaarder@lightlink.com - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 18 Dec 2000 13:12:08 -0500 From: dawn@eecs.wsu.edu Subject: CFP: ACM MobiCom 2001 : The Seventh Annual International Conference on Mobile Computing and Networking Enclosed below please find a Preliminary Announcement and Call for Papers for the 7th Annual International Conference on Mobile Computing and Networking (MobiCom) to be held in Rome, Italy from July 16-21, 2001. As you might already know, MobiCom has an established reputation as the pre-eminent conference in this area owing to the exceptionally high quality of papers, excellent tutorials and workshops, and stimulating panels conducted by mobile computing illuminati of various stripes. For complete information about the upcoming conference, please visit: http://www.research.ibm.com/mobicom2001/ A printer friendly version of this CFP is available at: http://www.eecs.wsu.edu/~krishna/Mobicom2001-onepagecfp.pdf (PDF) http://www.eecs.wsu.edu/~krishna/Mobicom2001-onepagecfp.ps (PS) We apologize if you received multiple copies of this Call for Papers. Please feel free to distribute it to those who might be interested. Very truly yours, ACM SIGMOBILE MobiCom 2001 Organizing Committee *********************************************************************** Preliminary Announcement and Call for Papers *** ACM MobiCom 2001 *** The Seventh Annual International Conference on Mobile Computing and Networking July 16-21, Rome, Italy Sponsored by ACM SIGMOBILE http://www.research.ibm.com/mobicom2001/ http://www.acm.org/sigmobile/ Submission Deadline: January 12, 2001 *********************************************************************** PAPERS: Technical papers (maximum 15 pages) describing original, previously unpublished, completed research, not currently under review by another conference or journal, are solicited on the following topics: * Applications and computing services supporting mobile users * Architectures, protocols, and algorithms to cope with mobility, limited bandwidth, or intermittent connectivity * Database and data management issues in mobile computing * Performance of mobile/wireless networks and systems * Security and privacy of mobile/wireless systems * Interaction between different layers of mobile/wireless systems * Integration and interworking of wired and wireless networks * Adaptive applications and systems for mobile environments * Distributed-system aspects of mobile systems * Operating system support for mobility * Location-dependent applications * Wireless multimedia systems * Power management * Mobile agents * Pervasive computing * Wireless sensor networks * Wireless/mobile service management and delivery All papers will be refereed by the program committee. Accepted papers will be published in the conference proceedings. Papers of particular merit will be proposed for publication in the ACM/Baltzer Wireless Networks (WINET) and Mobile Networks and Applications (MONET) journals. Note: Student Registrations will be provided at a discounted rate. CHALLENGES SESSION, PANELS, RESEARCH DEMOS, TUTORIALS: Short papers (maximum of 8 pages) that challenge the mobile computing community with new technologies or visionary applications are solicited. Such papers should provide stimulating ideas or visions that may open up exciting avenues of mobile computing research. Proposals are solicited for panels that examine innovative, controversial, or otherwise provocative issues of interest. Proposals for tutorials are solicited. Tutorial topics that encompass the systems aspects of mobile computing and/or practical experiences in building/deploying such systems are of particular interest. Informal proposals for research demos are solicited. Proposals should include: the focus area in mobility, the technologies involved, specific equipment used, demo layout, space required, etc. Please refer to the conference website for submission and other details. IMPORTANT DATES: * Technical Paper Submissions due: January 12, 2001 - Please refer to the website for submission instructions * Notification of acceptance: May 1, 2001 * Camera-ready version due: May 15, 2001 * Challenges Session Papers, Panel Proposals, Tutorial Proposals Submissions due: January 12, 2001 - Please refer to the website for submission instructions FOR MORE INFORMATION: Send email to mobicom2001@winlab.rutgers.edu with any questions or comments about the conference or for more information. ORGANIZING COMMITTEE: * General Chair: * Tutorials Co-Chairs: Christopher Rose Ravi Jain Rutgers University, WINLAB Telcordia Technologies * General Vice Chair: Chiara Petrioli Politecnico di Milano Sergio Palazzo Universita` di Catania * Panels Chair: * Program Co-Chairs: Ramesh Rao Univ. of California, San Diego Mahmoud Naghshineh IBM T.J. Watson Research Center * Local Arrangement Chair: Michele Zorzi Marco Listanti Universita` di Ferrara Universita` di Roma "La Sapienza" * Finance Chair: Chiara Petrioli Politecnico di Milano David B. Johnson Rice University * Registration Chair: * Exhibits/Sponsorships Chair: Irene Katzela Marco Ajmone Marsan Lucent Technologies Politecnico di Torino * Publicity Co-Chairs: * Research Demos Chair: Stefano Basagni Nigel Davies Univ. of Texas at Dallas Lancaster University Krishna Sivalingam * Steering Committee Chair: Washington State University Imrich Chlamtac Univ. of Texas at Dallas *********************************************************************** - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 18 Dec 2000 13:59:15 -0500 From: Chris Kantarjiev Subject: SMS security over various networks? I'm trying to put together a white paper on the relative merits of text messaging security via SMS over the various cell networks: CDMA, GSM, AT&T's TDMA. I've found a number of links about voice security, but they're mostly fluff, and they never really mention whether the same algorithms/techniques apply to SMS when sent over the network. Can anyone give me some pointers? Even for-pay reports would be welcome at this point. Thanks, chris - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 18 Dec 2000 15:24:26 -0500 From: "IMT-2000-online" Subject: Future mobile phones Hello, As you perhaps already know, the third generation mobile phones are just about to be brought out. According to the International Telecommunications Union (ITU), the name given to the system will be IMT-2000. If you want to learn a little bit more about IMT-2000, to see how the future terminals will look like or to a watch a video that explains how IMT-2000 will change our everyday life, just have a look at our site: www.IMT-2000-online.com Thank you... Laurent HERMOYE IMT-2000-online - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 18 Dec 2000 20:19:11 -0500 From: "Judith Oppenheimer" Subject: 12/18/00 ICBTollFreeNews.Com HEADS UP HEADLINES ____________________________________________________ ICBTollFreeNews.Com HEADS UP HEADLINES ____________________________________________________ from ICB Toll Free News - Daily News and Intelligence covering the Political, Legal and Marketing Arenas of 800 and Dot Com. ____________________________________________________ A HOLIDAY MESSAGE ... from publisher Judith Oppenheimer and ICB Staff http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4899 ___________________________________________________ CONTENTS - - FCC PROSCRIBES 800 TRANSFERS BETWEEN SUBSCRIBERS - - DOMAIN NAME SOVEREIGNTY, A LEGAL MINEFIELD - - ARE DOMAIN VALUES REBOUNDING? - - FINDUS.COM RETAINS ITS DOMAIN - - COLLISION IN CYBERSPACE: RIGHT TO DOT BIZ CHALLENGED ___________________________________________________ CUSTOMER SERVICE NOTES: With over 4,000 articles archived, ICB is a popular research destination. 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Similar reports have reached the Commission’s Enforcement Bureau and Consumer Information Bureau... These changes will make it substantially less likely that RespOrgs are able to use the SMS/800 to effectuate transfers that are contrary to the rules. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4894 F - DOMAIN NAME SOVEREIGNTY, A LEGAL MINEFIELD According to a recent Xinhua report, some researchers in Shanghai are working on a solution that would assign Arabic telephone numbers to domains, universal to all, in lieu of inputting an actual language. The system has reportedly been reviewed by the Chinese Academy of Engineering, with patents pending in 30 countries and regions. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4897 F - ARE DOMAIN VALUES REBOUNDING? "Failing startups owning memorable URLs may find these domain names are their most valuable asset upon liquidation," says George Nichols, an analyst at Morningstar.com. Mortgage.com is the most recent now-defunct dot-com to hawk its URL at its fire sale. Dutch investment bank ABN Amro bought it for $1.8 million on December 14. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4895 P - FINDUS.COM RETAINS ITS DOMAIN Wallberg ruled that the couple did have a legitimate right to the name and that they had not registered it with the intention of selling it, even if they later said they were willing to sell. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4896 P - COLLISION IN CYBERSPACE: RIGHT TO DOT BIZ CHALLENGED The Atlantic Root Network, Inc., a registry for the ".biz" Top Level Domain Name ("TLD"), petitions the National Telecommunications and Information Agency ("NTIA") and the Department of Commerce ("DoC") to hold a public hearing pursuant to the Administrative Procedures Act ("APA") (5 U.S.C.A. Sec. 551, et. seq.) prior to consideration and approval of the ICANN recommended TLDs. 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All rights reserved. ____________________________________________________ ------------------------------ Date: 18 Dec 2000 23:17:19 -0500 From: jay@west.net (Jay Hennigan) Subject: Re: censorware bill passes; universal bypass program released On 18 Dec 2000 10:58:07 -0500, Justa Lurker wrote: :It was 18 Dec 2000 10:30:47 -0500, and Bennett Haselton : wrote in comp.dcom.telecom: :| In response, Peacefire has released a bypass program -- :| eponymously named "Peacefire" -- which can disable all :| popular Windows blocking software (Cyber Patrol, SurfWatch, :| Net Nanny, CYBERsitter, X-Stop, Cyber Snoop, PureSight) :| with the click of a button. : :Providing software to defeat blocking software makes an :nearly immediate add to the blocking lists, including :server based lists that the new software will not bypass. Peacefire has for a long time been on the block lists of most if not all of the censorware out there, primarily because Peacefire shows the flaws of such censorware and the tremendous "collateral damage" that censorware causes to sites which do not contain content that fits the criteria for blockage. :I gather Peacefire wants to join in the reputation of :the other sites hosted on their ISP. If they're smart, they will move. I've seen no evidence whatsoever that Peacefire has facilitated the sending of spam, or that the Peacefire site itself is advertised by spam, have you? That's the issue with the other hosted sites. :One more thought, from peacefire's web page: :> In general, this program will not work against censorware :> programs used in schools, but it will work against home :> censorware programs except for AOL Parental Controls. : :If this software was written in reaction to the bill, :why doesn't do anything with the computers covered by :the bill itself? Seems like a stunt to get Peacefire :blocked more than being helpful. Peacefire has been on the block lists of most censorware for at least a year. I believe the purpose ("stunt" if you insist) is to demonstrate the weaknesses and drawbacks of the use of censorware. Peacefire also demonstrates methods to extract the block lists in plain text. That is to the best of my knowledge the sole reason that Peacefire is and has been for some time in the block lists. And that is also in my opinion the major drawback of censorware, its concealment of the list of blocked sites. In essence the users of the censorware are allowing a third party run for profit to dicatate what is and is not appropriate, and with no ability (save for Peacefire) to analyze the accuracy or motives behind the decision. That's OK for a parent, but not IMHO for a government-funded institution choosing what is appropriate for the taxpayers to view. If this becomes law, will the administrators of the libraries be able to determine the content of the filter list? If government-mandated censorware happens to block political speech, will the libraries know this? Will they be able to whitelist it, or must they by law accept the judgement of the censorware vendor? IMHO, Peacefire is providing a valuable public service by exposing the dangers of censorware, even more so if it becomes government-mandated censorware. - -- Jay Hennigan - Network Administration - jay@west.net NetLojix Communications, Inc. NASDAQ: NETX - http://www.netlojix.com/ WestNet: Connecting you to the planet. 805 884-6323 - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 19 Dec 2000 05:17:07 -0500 From: djb0x77376989@scream.org (Dan Birchall) Subject: Re: censorware bill passes; universal bypass program released Bennett Haselton wrote: > A new program, "Peacefire", is available on our Web page that can disable > all popular Windows blocking programs with the click of a button -- > released just as Congress has passed the first mandatory-blocking-software > bill. I'd pay extra if it could disable Windows, too. :) - -Dan - -- Dan Birchall - Palolo Valley - Honolulu HI - http://dan.scream.org/ Peruse my opinions, at http://dbirchall.epinions.com/user-dbirchall Another free email site: http://www.themail.com/ref.htm?ref=1163079 My addresses expire... take out the hex stamp if your reply bounces - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ End of Telecom Digest V2000 #160 ******************************** Date: 20 Dec 2000 06:15:11 -0500 From: owner-telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org (Telecom Digest) To: telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org Subject: Telecom Digest V2000 #161 Telecom Digest Wednesday, December 20 2000 Volume 2000 : Number 161 In this issue: Re: censorware bill passes; universal bypass program released Re: censorware bill passes; universal bypass program released NYT: Stats of Cell Phone Use in Poorer Countries Re: censorware bill passes; universal bypass program released Re: censorware bill passes; universal bypass program released Re: Pushbutton phones - was Re: early DTMF, was: Re: Early NPA Assignments [was Pulling the Zero] Re: Radio Stations using SSb Re: NYT: Stats of Cell Phone Use in Poorer Countries Finding Public Domain Music-On-Hold Re: Finding Public Domain Music-On-Hold Re: Finding Public Domain Music-On-Hold Re: Finding Public Domain Music-On-Hold Re: Finding Public Domain Music-On-Hold 12/19/00 ICBTollFreeNews.Com HEADS UP HEADLINES (plus a BIG Holiday Discount) Re: Finding Public Domain Music-On-Hold Re: Finding Public Domain Music-On-Hold Re: Finding Public Domain Music-On-Hold Re: Finding Public Domain Music-On-Hold Re: Finding Public Domain Music-On-Hold Re: NYT: Stats of Cell Phone Use in Poorer Countries Re: NYT: Stats of Cell Phone Use in Poorer Countries ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 19 Dec 2000 07:19:05 -0500 From: hudsonl@skypoint.com (Hudson Leighton) Subject: Re: censorware bill passes; universal bypass program released In article , jay@west.net (Jay Hennigan) wrote: > > :I gather Peacefire wants to join in the reputation of > :the other sites hosted on their ISP. > > If they're smart, they will move. I've seen no evidence whatsoever that > Peacefire has facilitated the sending of spam, or that the Peacefire > site itself is advertised by spam, have you? That's the issue with the > other hosted sites. > Trouble is if you hang out with drunks and thieves, everybody assumes you are drunks and thieves. - -- http://www.skypoint.com/~hudsonl - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 19 Dec 2000 09:50:47 -0500 From: tbetz@panix.com (Tom Betz) Subject: Re: censorware bill passes; universal bypass program released Quoth hudsonl@skypoint.com (Hudson Leighton) in : |In article , jay@west.net (Jay |Hennigan) wrote: | | |> |> :I gather Peacefire wants to join in the reputation of |> :the other sites hosted on their ISP. |> |> If they're smart, they will move. I've seen no evidence whatsoever that |> Peacefire has facilitated the sending of spam, or that the Peacefire |> site itself is advertised by spam, have you? That's the issue with the |> other hosted sites. |> | |Trouble is if you hang out with drunks and thieves, everybody |assumes you are drunks and thieves. ... even if you're Jesus Christ. - -- |I always wanted to be someone,| Tom Betz, Generalist | |but now I think I should have | Want to send me email? FIRST, READ THIS PAGE: | |been a wee bit more specific. | | | "Fuck NANAE." -- Paul Vixie | YO! MY EMAIL ADDRESS IS HEAVILY SPAM-ARMORED! | - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 19 Dec 2000 12:34:41 -0500 From: The Old Bear Subject: NYT: Stats of Cell Phone Use in Poorer Countries As summarized by NewsScan: STATS ON CELL PHONE USE IN POORER COUNTRIES Cell phone use is soaring in underdeveloped countries. Investment banker Kent Lupberger of the International Finance Corporation explains: "The advantage is that the existing infrastructure in these countries is often terrible. And even in the worst places, there are people with money that are desperate for a viable communications network." In a country like Haiti less than 1% of the nation's eight million people have conventional, fixed-line phone service, and 400,000 Haitians are on a waiting list on which they might linger for five years before getting conventional service. The result is that the number of mobile subscribers in Haiti climbed 150% last year over the previous year, and cell phone users now account for more than a third of the nation's phone customers. But Haiti is not alone. In much of Latin America wireless phone service subscribers account for about 60% of the total phone subscribers, and in Africa the growth rate in mobile phone was 116% last year. source: New York Times (19 Dec 2000) http://partners.nytimes.com/2000/12/19/technology/19CELL.html - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 19 Dec 2000 12:57:57 -0500 From: stanley@skyking.OCE.ORST.EDU (John Stanley) Subject: Re: censorware bill passes; universal bypass program released In article , Dan Birchall wrote: >Bennett Haselton wrote: >> A new program, "Peacefire", is available on our Web page that can disable > >I'd pay extra if it could disable Windows, too. :) You already pay to disable windows. It's called "windows". - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 19 Dec 2000 13:29:56 -0500 From: jlurker@bigfoot.com (Justa Lurker) Subject: Re: censorware bill passes; universal bypass program released It was 19 Dec 2000 05:17:07 -0500, and djb0x77376989@scream.org (Dan Birchall) wrote in comp.dcom.telecom: | Bennett Haselton wrote: | > A new program, "Peacefire", is available on our Web page that | > can disable all popular Windows blocking programs with the | > click of a button -- released just as Congress has passed the | > first mandatory-blocking-software bill. | | I'd pay extra if it could disable Windows, too. :) All it does in run the UNINSTALL routine of each of the targeted pieces of software. Not really demonstrating how easily that software can be circumvented, but proving -*- News Flash -*- that software doesn't work when uninstalled. Except of course IE ... JL - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 19 Dec 2000 14:29:38 -0500 From: "Paul Cook" Subject: Re: Pushbutton phones - was Re: early DTMF, was: Re: Early NPA Assignments [was Pulling the Zero] Roy Smith roy@panix.com wrote: > "Gail M. Hall" wrote: > > The owner of the company was severely disabled. He had very limited > > use of his hands and arms, but he could hold a pen and write with > > effort. His phone had a headset and a box with pushbuttons on it > > that he could use to "dial" the numbers. > > The Bell System had a reputation for going to great effort to enable > their equipment to work for people with various handicaps. Custom-built > devices to allow people without full motor function to place and receive > phone calls were, IIRC, provided at no extra charge. > > Whether this sense of corporate social responsibility grew out of Bell's > original work with deaf people, or was a requirement of the government > regulatory constraints, I'm not sure. I also suspect it has fallen by > the wayside these days. I wonder if you may be thinking of the work done by the Telephone Pioneers, the organization of retired Bell workers? They are the ones who did all that free work back in the 1970s, refurbishing and installing old teletype machines and adapting them as TDDs. As I recall, special custom devices were not tarrifed, and so could not be provided by the telco. Paul Cook www.proctorinc.com - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 19 Dec 2000 14:51:40 -0500 From: marsgal42@hotmail.com Subject: Re: Radio Stations using SSb In article <20001216.235558.-484969.1.captainkeith@juno.com>, "Keith M. Hardy" wrote: > I am trying to find radio station which broadcast on > Single Side Band frequences. Is there a list somewhere? Yes. The World Radio/TV Handbook. Among others... I've heard HCJB and Radio Havana on SSB. Speech is OK, but music sounds really weird. There is lots of utility stuff on SSB, like HF aircraft transmissions. Check a reference like Klingenfuss for frequencies. Or just tune around. You'll hear them. Laura Halliday VE7LDH "Que les nuages soient notre Grid: CN89mg pied a terre..." - Hospital/Shafte Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 19 Dec 2000 16:42:17 -0500 From: johnl@iecc.com (John R Levine) Subject: Re: NYT: Stats of Cell Phone Use in Poorer Countries > But Haiti is not alone. In much of Latin America wireless phone > service subscribers account for about 60% of the total phone > subscribers, and in Africa the growth rate in mobile phone was > 116% last year. I've heard that in India and Bangladesh there are "phone ladies" who rent a cell phone and go around town selling service by the call. It's hugely useful to farmers who can now call and find out what the going price in the city is for their crops rather than being at the mercy of the local middleman. - -- John R. Levine, IECC, POB 727, Trumansburg NY 14886 +1 607 387 6869 johnl@iecc.com, Village Trustee and Sewer Commissioner, http://iecc.com/johnl, Member, Provisional board, Coalition Against Unsolicited Commercial E-mail - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 19 Dec 2000 18:15:54 -0500 From: John Bartley Subject: Finding Public Domain Music-On-Hold Well, since Public Law 105-298 (10/27/98) extended copyrights, it looks like if we want to add music-on-hold to our phone system we either a) find sound recordings first 'fixed' (i.e., distributed as then-copyrighted, not just performed on the radio) before 1925 or earlier b) purchase music made-for-hire c) pay for performance rights, or d) hire a commercial service, e.g., Muzak Feeling rather allergic to C) and D) (given my budget) and not wishing to expose callers-on-hold to commercial talk radio (I want them to LIKE us when they get off hold), this leaves us: A) Anyone have any pre-1925 shellac (certainly not vinyl...) and a turntable they would not mind transcribing to audio cassette? Once done, I will take them home, convert them to MP3 files and post them in an appropriate alt.binaries forum (not here - though I will post a notice here so y'all can get them), so folks can download and convert back to audio CD, or use as is with MP3 player software in an obsolete PC, a CD/MP3 player (now <$100!) or such. B) has a selection of public domain stuph for $25 per CD. Any other sources you can think of? ===== - -- "We should call this Year One of Day One." RAH to Uncle Walter, 1969-07-20 John Bartley, NT sysadmin, Portland OR (503) BAR-TLEY __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Shopping - Thousands of Stores. Millions of Products. http://shopping.yahoo.com/ - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 19 Dec 2000 19:28:00 -0500 From: Terry Kennedy Subject: Re: Finding Public Domain Music-On-Hold John Bartley writes: > Any other sources you can think of? You can buy one of 5 CD's with different types of music interspersed with "your call is very important to us, and we'll be right back" type messages from On Hold Plus for $19.95 each - see: http://onholdstore.com/holdware/musiconholdcds1.html Terry Kennedy http://www.tmk.com terry@tmk.com Jersey City, NJ USA - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 19 Dec 2000 20:43:18 -0500 From: John McHarry Subject: Re: Finding Public Domain Music-On-Hold On 19 Dec 2000 18:15:54 -0500, John Bartley wrote: >Well, since Public Law 105-298 (10/27/98) extended >copyrights, it looks like if we want to add >music-on-hold to our phone system we either... I find music on hold irritating. It is usually far too loud and interrupted with speech that sounds like you have finally cut through. Also, it destroys conference calls. If someone in the conference puts it on hold, everyone else is drowned out by music. Just say, no thanks. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 19 Dec 2000 20:54:47 -0500 From: John David Galt Subject: Re: Finding Public Domain Music-On-Hold > You can buy one of 5 CD's with different types of music interspersed with > "your call is very important to us, and we'll be right back" type messages > from On Hold Plus for $19.95 each - see: > http://onholdstore.com/holdware/musiconholdcds1.html So that's who keeps putting out that lie. A business that cared about its customers would hire enough people to answer its calls immediately, every time -- or at the very least, would install an answering machine so that its customers don't have to waste unacceptable amounts of time waiting on hold. I dumped Wells Fargo Bank a couple of years ago (remember their ads promising to pay $100 if you had to wait in line more than 10 minutes?) because their so-called customer service line made me wait over an hour multiple times -- and when I tried to work around it by going to the bank in person, the tellers REFUSED TO DO THEIR JOB and insisted I phone that same line from the bank! More recently, Pacific Bell's Message Center has done the same with its "customer service" line -- and they don't even publish a mailing address. You'd think they'd have the common sense to let you leave a message on their own service, BUT NOOOOOOOOOOOOOO! The law may not be willing to shut down businesses that pull this crap, but the public can and should, by boycotting them. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 19 Dec 2000 21:48:08 -0500 From: pw@panix.com (Paul Wallich) Subject: Re: Finding Public Domain Music-On-Hold In article <3A400F3E.305AD699@diogenes.sacramento.ca.us>, John David Galt wrote: >> You can buy one of 5 CD's with different types of music interspersed with >> "your call is very important to us, and we'll be right back" type messages >> from On Hold Plus for $19.95 each - see: >> http://onholdstore.com/holdware/musiconholdcds1.html > >So that's who keeps putting out that lie. > >A business that cared about its customers would hire enough people to >answer its calls immediately, every time -- or at the very least, would >install an answering machine so that its customers don't have to waste >unacceptable amounts of time waiting on hold. > >I dumped Wells Fargo Bank a couple of years ago (remember their ads >promising to pay $100 if you had to wait in line more than 10 minutes?) >because their so-called customer service line made me wait over an hour >multiple times -- and when I tried to work around it by going to the >bank in person, the tellers REFUSED TO DO THEIR JOB and insisted I >phone that same line from the bank! > >More recently, Pacific Bell's Message Center has done the same with its >"customer service" line -- and they don't even publish a mailing address. >You'd think they'd have the common sense to let you leave a message on >their own service, BUT NOOOOOOOOOOOOOO! > >The law may not be willing to shut down businesses that pull this crap, >but the public can and should, by boycotting them. In a recent bout with Verizon, who were completely unable to reconnect my ISDN line over the course of more than a week and five different stories, I had the bitter pleasure of keeping various customer-service folks on the line with me while we waited on hold for the next link in the chain. At an hour and a half a pop, I figure that reconnect order cost them a pretty penny, especially since I ended up cancelling the order and the service. (I was at leisure for other reasons, so the time spent on the phone was not so crucial to me.) paul - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 Dec 2000 21:41:59 -0500 From: "Judith Oppenheimer" Subject: 12/19/00 ICBTollFreeNews.Com HEADS UP HEADLINES (plus a BIG Holiday Discount) ____________________________________________________ ICBTollFreeNews.Com HEADS UP HEADLINES ____________________________________________________ from ICB Toll Free News - Daily News and Intelligence covering the Political, Legal and Marketing Arenas of 800 and Dot Com. ____________________________________________________ A HOLIDAY MESSAGE .. from publisher Judith Oppenheimer and ICB Staff http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4899 !!! AND A HOLIDAY GIFT !!! (from "the Present Isn't Wrapped Yet" departmen While our webmasters toil diligently to program your gift into our system, why should you wait ... ?! 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CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4902 F - PRIMUS ATTACKS DOT AU MONOPOLY "We were told that .com.au domain names were to be deregulated last September," he said. "Then I hear Melbourne IT saying to auDA, here's $680,000, or whatever, and they've got exclusive rights to .com.au for another year. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4903 F - NESS REAPPOINTED TO THE FCC Clinton maintains its Democratic majority. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4901 P - VERISIGN/TELCORDIA PITCH COMPETITION AT NTIA ENUM MEETING ... go head-to-head with Neustar's contention for Tier 1 monopoly administration. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/txt/NTIA_policy_brief_v2_2_files/frame.htm P - WHOIS COMMITTEE REPORTS TO NAMES COUNCIL This initial effort aims at evaluating whether it is proper for ICANN staff to set up the Whois Committee through lack of consultation process with other relevant interest parties which has brought up criticisms such as lack of openess and its transparent procedural flaw. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4909 _______________notices from our sponsors_______________ Are you a local or regional business that advertises in newspapers, direct mail, on radio or tv? 1 800 BRAND IT shared use marketing programs can help your sales skyrocket! http://www.1800BrandIt.com ____________________________________________________ 800 RATE NEGOTIATION EXPERTISE If your usage contract is coming to an end we can help you get the very best rate from your existing or new vendor. We charge $125 per hour. No fee if you choose a vendor we represent. Telemanagement, Inc. http://www.sdtele.com ____________________________________________________ IS YOUR BUSINESS LISTED? The Internet 800 Directory lists hundreds of thousands of toll free numbers and is viewed by millions each month. The Internet 800 Directory will list ANY business with a toll free number, regardless of long distance carrier, for free and was the first to do so. Go to http://gotollfree.com and see if your toll free number is listed. If not, click the Add Listing button to submit your toll free number for this free listing. ____________________________________________________ more HEADLINES for December 19, 2000 F - 1 800 SOUNDBITE SoundBite Communications, a start-up company with a breakthrough approach to personalized instant communications, announced today that Budget Rent a Car is among the initial advertisers on its 1-800-SOUNDBITE service. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/Article.cfm?ArticleId=4908 F - EASYJET GOES TO COURT In 10 cases submitted to the World Intellectual Property Organization's Arbitration and Mediation Center, WIPO ruled that the owners could keep their domains because the services they offered were not similar to easyGroup's. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4906 P - BUSH GOVT MAY SPEED TELECOM DEREGULATION "Each time the FCC has attempted to seize state regulatory authority or to dabble in local exchange offerings, the result has been the same: a failed policy that has held back the development of the telecom industry and has engendered a contentious, polarized market," asserted Ron Cowles, principal analyst for Dataquest's telecom group in an official statement. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4905 P - REJECTED TLDS PETITION FOR RECONSIDERATION Atleast one, .travel, bases its petition on the APA, stating "the basis for this request is the requirement that ICANN’s decision on the selection of new TLDs comply with the U.S. Administrative Procedure Act, 5 U.S.C. 553 et seq. (APA). IATA submits that the APA is applicable to this decision, notwithstanding ICANN’s status as a California non-profit corporation, because ICANN, inter alia: 1) was created at the request of the U.S. Government; 2) serves at the pleasure of the U.S. Government; and 3) is performing a government policy-making function -- namely, deciding whether to add a TLD to the authoritative, or “A,” root server -- that directly affects a critical public asset that has been financed by the U.S. Government, and remains subject to the ultimate control of the U.S. Government." CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4904 F - DOMAIN NAME POLICY WHO'S WHO ...an accurate and rather inclusive list... CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4900 ____________________________________________________ ABOUT ICB ICB HeadsUp Headlines Daily Email is sent by request. Subscriptions to Daily Email are free to qualified applicants. Visit http://www.icbtollfree.com/reg.cfm?NextURL=Index.cfm to sign up. Please feel free to pass along a copy to a friend, within reason so long as the message is not modified or used unfavorably. 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All rights reserved. ____________________________________________________ ------------------------------ Date: 19 Dec 2000 21:58:31 -0500 From: dannyb@panix.com (danny burstein) Subject: Re: Finding Public Domain Music-On-Hold In <20001219230337.16008.qmail@web2002.mail.yahoo.com> John Bartley writes: >Well, since Public Law 105-298 (10/27/98) extended >copyrights, it looks like if we want to add >music-on-hold to our phone system we either > a) find sound recordings first 'fixed' (i.e., >distributed as then-copyrighted, not just performed on >the radio) before 1925 or earlier > b) purchase music made-for-hire > c) pay for performance rights, or > d) hire a commercial service, e.g., Muzak Another alernative is using various public/gov'tal broadcasts. for example, feeding out the NOAA weather forecast into your MOH. Or the time clock on WWV[H]. Or, for that matter, the Voice Of America [1] or the BBC. Or my favorite suggestion: rotate through the various foriegn gov't radio stations on the United State's (s)hit list. for better or worse, there are enough of these so you'd have a pretty good choice. for example, on Monday you could have Radio Havana; on Tues. Radio Iraq; Weds. Voice of the Taliban; Thurs. the Ben Ladin Hour; etc., etc. And nowadays, a great deal of this stuff is available through an internet feed, making reception a lot easier. [1] VOA isn't supposed to broadcast to the United States, but that's another story. All together. - -- _____________________________________________________ Knowledge may be power, but communications is the key dannyb@panix.com [to foil spammers, my address has been double rot-13 encoded] - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 19 Dec 2000 22:07:16 -0500 From: Terry Kennedy Subject: Re: Finding Public Domain Music-On-Hold John David Galt writes: > So that's who keeps putting out that lie. > > A business that cared about its customers would hire enough people to > answer its calls immediately, every time -- or at the very least, would > install an answering machine so that its customers don't have to waste > unacceptable amounts of time waiting on hold. I think you're complaining about something else - probably an automated attendant. If you call a business and immediately get dumped into music, then they don't have enough people to answer the calls. This could either be due to an unsual condition (like an airline with a snowed-in hub airport) or just because they aren't paying attention to the average hold time. If it's the second case, it will likely correct itself over time - either they will lose enough customers that hold times go down, or they'll notice it and correct the problem (eventually). A national ISP's tech support hold time dropped from > 30 minutes to under a minute, but it took time to hire enough skilled people (about 4 months, if I remember correctly). In my (1-person) office I have music-on-hold. I answer all calls in person within 4 rings, but if someone asks a question that takes some research and they want an answer right away, they're getting put on hold so I can go col- lect the data. At a customer site where I installed an automated attendant (it's a school, and this way faculty members can be called directly, even when the part-time secretary isn't there), the same music-on-hold was added, as there is a very audible "kerchunk" when the AA signals the PBX to transfer the call, and with- out the music, people were thinking they were disconnected when they were only queued to the faculty member's phone. Regarding another poster's comment about conference calls - I dislike those calls more than I dislike music-on-hold, but that's just my opinion. Most folks with music-on-hold who participate in concalls know about this and just hit mute and put the phone down, rather than on hold. And the better automatic bridges let the call owner drop "problem" member calls for things like this. Of course, the managed/attended concall services can do that as well. Terry Kennedy http://www.tmk.com terry@tmk.com Jersey City, NJ USA - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 19 Dec 2000 23:57:18 -0500 From: msb@vex.net (Mark Brader) Subject: Re: Finding Public Domain Music-On-Hold John Bartley writes: > Well, since Public Law 105-298 (10/27/98) extended > copyrights, it looks like if we want to add > music-on-hold to our phone system we either > a) find sound recordings first 'fixed' (i.e., > distributed as then-copyrighted, not just performed on > the radio) before 1925 or earlier > b) purchase music made-for-hire > c) pay for performance rights, or > d) hire a commercial service, e.g., Muzak e) become musicians and make a new recording yourselves, either of your own composition or of something in the public domain. Personally, though, I agree with John McHarry: don't do that. Speaking of music-on-hold, I ran into something even more annoying earlier this month. One of my nieces was going to be given a sub- scription to Teen People magazine for Christmas. So we phoned 800-284-0200, and did not get a "cannot be reached from your area" (Canada) message -- so far so good. But what we did get was: (1) No ringback. (2) 33 seconds of instrumental music. (3) The recording "Your call cannot be completed at this time. Please try your call again later. Goodbye." (4) Hangup. I was annoyed enough to retry a lot of times over the next few days, figuring that at least I was costing them some money on each try. Always the same result (and always the same piece of music; sounds to me like the sort of thing a stage musician might use for an overture). But I never did get through. And since the recording doesn't identify who it is I'm calling, and since I got it just now when I tried again late at night, I have eventually begun to wonder if it was Bell Canada and not the subscription center that was generating what I heard. But if so, why? Can someone who knows about this tell me what's going on? - -- Mark Brader, Toronto | "...blind faith can ruin the eyesight-- msb@vex.net | and the perspective." --Robert Ludlum My text in this article is in the public domain. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 20 Dec 2000 00:18:04 -0500 From: Terry Kennedy Subject: Re: Finding Public Domain Music-On-Hold Mark Brader writes: > (1) No ringback. > (2) 33 seconds of instrumental music. > (3) The recording "Your call cannot be completed at this time. Please > try your call again later. Goodbye." > (4) Hangup. > > I was annoyed enough to retry a lot of times over the next few days, > figuring that at least I was costing them some money on each try. > Always the same result (and always the same piece of music; sounds to > me like the sort of thing a stage musician might use for an overture). > > But I never did get through. And since the recording doesn't identify > who it is I'm calling, and since I got it just now when I tried again > late at night, I have eventually begun to wonder if it was Bell Canada > and not the subscription center that was generating what I heard. But > if so, why? Can someone who knows about this tell me what's going on? That sounds like some sort of "cheezebox" call diverter. I've run into them a number of times - they either play music or give you a fake ring while they take your call and try to call another number, to patch the two together. Another giveaway is that the call supervises immediately (not that this really matters when calling an 800 #). To another poster - I've occasionally called businesses that answer calls with an "all our representatives are currently comatose or loafing, please hold on, your call is unimportant to us" 8-) message followed by music. I put 'em on hold here and go about my business, flipping the call to my speakerphone every minute or so to see if anyone has shown up at the other end. So far, I've had 100% success in getting them to sit and listen to *my* "your call is important" message + music, though they're often baffled as to how that's happening on a call _inbound_ to them. I usually get these when I get a voicemail message like "This is an urgent message about your credit card - please call us at 888- xxx-xxxx" and it turns out they're trying to get me to do a balance xfer to them. Terry Kennedy http://www.tmk.com terry@tmk.com Jersey City, NJ USA - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 20 Dec 2000 04:32:12 -0500 From: Jack Hamilton Subject: Re: Finding Public Domain Music-On-Hold John Bartley wrote: >Feeling rather allergic to C) and D) (given my budget) >and not wishing to expose callers-on-hold to >commercial talk radio (I want them to LIKE us when >they get off hold), this leaves us: If you want me to like you, you won't have hold music at all, just a gently clicking sound so I'll know the line hasn't been dropped. I prefer to listen to the music playing in my office or house, not someone else's choice of (usually) loud, bad music. - -- Jack Hamilton Broderick, CA jfh@acm.org - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 20 Dec 2000 04:35:50 -0500 From: David Clayton Subject: Re: NYT: Stats of Cell Phone Use in Poorer Countries johnl@iecc.com (John R Levine) contributed the following: >> But Haiti is not alone. In much of Latin America wireless phone >> service subscribers account for about 60% of the total phone >> subscribers, and in Africa the growth rate in mobile phone was >> 116% last year. > >I've heard that in India and Bangladesh there are "phone ladies" who >rent a cell phone and go around town selling service by the call. ..... I remember seeing something on that on TV a while ago, it looked like a good use of the emerging technologies! - - - Regards, David. David Clayton, e-mail: dcstar@acslink.aone.net.au Melbourne, Victoria, Australia. Dilbert's words of wisdom #18: Never argue with an idiot. They drag you down to their level then beat you with experience. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 20 Dec 2000 04:56:07 -0500 From: msb@vex.net (Mark Brader) Subject: Re: NYT: Stats of Cell Phone Use in Poorer Countries > In a country like Haiti less than 1% of the nation's eight million > people have conventional, fixed-line phone service, and 400,000 > Haitians are on a waiting list ... I'm reminded of the following story that Miguel Cruz posted here last year... | Reminds me of a story from when I lived in Saudi Arabia in 1997. One | of my co-workers was having dinner at someone's home. Suddenly, three | men in ambiguous government uniforms burst into the house. Talking | only among themselves, they looked around for a while and then stomped | off into the back room. The stunned hosts and guest just sat there, | not knowing if they were going to be arrested, or what. There was some | noise in the back, and the wife wondered if something was happening to | her children, but her husband said he thought she better stay put in | the dining room. After a while, the men returned from the back, left | wordlessly through the front door, and drove away. | | The man went to the back room to see what had happened. When he came | back to the dining room, there were tears in his eyes. His wife, | fearing the worst, screamed. Trying to be calm, my co-worker put on | his most reassuring voice and asked the man what he had seen. | | "Our telephone!" the man gasped between tears of shock that soon | emerged as joy. "We ordered it in 1985! I'd totally forgotten about | it! It's finally here!" Reposted by: - -- Mark Brader "After all, it is necessary to get behind Toronto someone before you can stab them in the back." msb@vex.net -- Lynn & Jay, "Yes, Prime Minister" - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ End of Telecom Digest V2000 #161 ******************************** Date: 21 Dec 2000 06:15:10 -0500 From: owner-telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org (Telecom Digest) To: telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org Subject: Telecom Digest V2000 #162 Telecom Digest Thursday, December 21 2000 Volume 2000 : Number 162 In this issue: Re: Telecom Digest V2000 #159 Re: Finding Public Domain Music-On-Hold Re: Finding Public Domain Music-On-Hold Re: Finding Public Domain Music-On-Hold Re: Finding Public Domain Music-On-Hold Re: Message Mysteriously in Voice Mailbox - How? Finding the right Bellcore CallerID document Re: NYT: Stats of Cell Phone Use in Poorer Countries Re: Message Mysteriously in Voice Mailbox - How? Vantage NT3B01AA Re: Finding Public Domain Music-On-Hold Re: Finding Public Domain Music-On-Hold IMT-2000 Cell phones as telemarketer-avoidance devices, state laws? 12/20/00 ICBTollFreeNews.Com HEADS UP HEADLINES (plus a HUGE holiday discount) Re: Finding Public Domain Music-On-Hold Re: "Smart" Predictive Dialer? ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 20 Dec 2000 07:23:42 -0500 From: johndunedin@drink.demon.co.uk (John Hein) Subject: Re: Telecom Digest V2000 #159 In message <20001218111518.6125.qmail@xuxa.iecc.com> owner-telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org (Telecom Digest) writes: > >In <5.0.0.25.0.20001215230144.00a08680@mailbox.verizon.net>, > > Gary Novosielski wrote: > >}Although the dial pulses did figure into the assignment of codes correlated > >}to traffic, area codes have always been listed in numerical order, and 201 > >}did, and still does top the list as the "lowest" number. In Strowger practice, surely 0 > 9? So, is there a 211 area code? - -- [ John Hein GM1YME | Phaggots do it on the phone! ] [ johndunedin@drink.demon.co.uk | Sine Pretio Loquimini Omnibus ] [ johndunedin@cix.compulink.co.uk| ] [ Telephone: +44 131 558 1279 |http://www.scotsgay.co.uk/people/john.html] [ TeleFax: +44 131 539 2999 | 43 B5/6 f+ t- w+ d g++ k- s++! r-- p ] [ Lambda BBS: +44 131 556 6316 | S8/9 b g- l y- z/ n o++ x-- a+ u- v- j++ ] - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 20 Dec 2000 08:31:01 -0500 From: stands2pee@my-Deja.com (Fair Dinkum) Subject: Re: Finding Public Domain Music-On-Hold On 19 Dec 2000 20:54:47 -0500, John David Galt wrote: >> You can buy one of 5 CD's with different types of music interspersed with >> "your call is very important to us, and we'll be right back" type messages >> from On Hold Plus for $19.95 each - see: >> http://onholdstore.com/holdware/musiconholdcds1.html > >So that's who keeps putting out that lie. > >A business that cared about its customers would hire enough people to >answer its calls immediately, every time -- or at the very least, would >install an answering machine so that its customers don't have to waste >unacceptable amounts of time waiting on hold. > >I dumped Wells Fargo Bank a couple of years ago (remember their ads >promising to pay $100 if you had to wait in line more than 10 minutes?) >because their so-called customer service line made me wait over an hour >multiple times -- and when I tried to work around it by going to the >bank in person, the tellers REFUSED TO DO THEIR JOB and insisted I >phone that same line from the bank! > LOL. I was on the verge of responding to a First Interstate Bank credit card offer when the news came out that Wells Fargo was taking them over. I immediately destroyed the entire mailer. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 20 Dec 2000 09:49:57 -0500 From: Subject: Re: Finding Public Domain Music-On-Hold Jack Hamilton wrote: > John Bartley wrote: >>Feeling rather allergic to C) and D) (given my budget) >>and not wishing to expose callers-on-hold to >>commercial talk radio (I want them to LIKE us when >>they get off hold), this leaves us: > If you want me to like you, you won't have hold music at all, just a > gently clicking sound so I'll know the line hasn't been dropped. I > prefer to listen to the music playing in my office or house, not someone > else's choice of (usually) loud, bad music. My bank apparently installed a new system a few months ago. I called for some reason, and they had to put me on hold. The "music on hold" was some sort of slightly too loud random chime sounds. I told the clerk when she cam back on the line that it was the worst on-hold music I had ever heard and she said that others had been complaining too. I think they changed/dropped it soon after. On the good side, they do have a live person answer the phone and transfer calls. The only reason you get put on hold is if they have to go retrieve something, or call another department to answer your question. It's a local bank, but the service is first rate. Better than any large US bank I've ever dealt with. - -- ***************************************************************************** * Bill Ranck +1-540-231-3951 ranck@vt.edu * * Virginia Polytechnic Institute & State University, Computing Center * ***************************************************************************** - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 20 Dec 2000 11:57:32 -0500 From: John Bartley Subject: Re: Finding Public Domain Music-On-Hold On 19 Dec 2000 21:58:31 -0500, dannyb@panix.com (danny burstein) wrote: >Another alernative is using various public/gov'tal broadcasts. for >example, feeding out the NOAA weather forecast into your MOH. Or the time >clock on WWV[H]. Or, for that matter, the Voice Of America [1] or the BBC. Sorry, but no AM reception, and weak FM reception, in our Zone-Three quake-reinforced steel frame building core. The NOAA VHF was my first thought; bought a radio, decent reception outside building core, but zippo in the phone room. Ditto for the old Sony shortwave I brought in. Sigh. >Or my favorite suggestion: rotate through the various foriegn gov't radio >stations on the United State's (s)hit list. for better or worse, there are >enough of these so you'd have a pretty good choice. > >for example, on Monday you could have Radio Havana; on Tues. Radio >Iraq; Weds. Voice of the Taliban; Thurs. the Ben Ladin Hour; etc., etc. Again, we want callers to LIKE us when they can get through to the specific person they are trying to reach. >And nowadays, a great deal of this stuff is available through an internet >feed, making reception a lot easier. If I had the bandwidth to spare.... but I don't. Horrible latency problems and router storms, besides. >[1] VOA isn't supposed to broadcast to the United States, but that's >another story. All together. Sorry, that's my story, as this is for a public agency bound to observe that. ===== - -- "We should call this Year One of Day One." RAH to Uncle Walter, 1969-07-20 John Bartley, NT sysadmin, Portland OR (503) BAR-TLEY __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Shopping - Thousands of Stores. Millions of Products. http://shopping.yahoo.com/ - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 20 Dec 2000 12:39:57 -0500 From: jay@west.net (Jay Hennigan) Subject: Re: Finding Public Domain Music-On-Hold On 20 Dec 2000 04:32:12 -0500, Jack Hamilton wrote: :If you want me to like you, you won't have hold music at all, just a :gently clicking sound so I'll know the line hasn't been dropped. Like the warm, melodious thumpa-thumpa-thumpa of a 1A2 interrupter winking the hold lamps that we all used to love. Maybe we can get Mike Sandman to come up with an interrupter-wink-hold-crosstalk-simulator that plugs in to the MOH port for a bit of nostalgia. - -- Jay Hennigan - Network Administration - jay@west.net NetLojix Communications, Inc. NASDAQ: NETX - http://www.netlojix.com/ WestNet: Connecting you to the planet. 805 884-6323 - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 20 Dec 2000 13:00:07 -0500 From: "Pete Ritter" Subject: Re: Message Mysteriously in Voice Mailbox - How? Interesting. Except my wife has Sprint PCS and according to her VMbox, the call that left the message came from a phone in a SW Bell service area. I don't know if Mexico has the feature you describe. If it did, would it work across int'l boundaries? messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 20 Dec 2000 13:39:34 -0500 From: "Stephido" Subject: Finding the right Bellcore CallerID document Hi, I have been looking for the Bellcore standards on the CallerID implementation and behavior. I found three documents (listed below) but I only have the title and no abstract or description. Before purchasing them, is there a way to verify that the documents are truly what I am looking for? My distributor (Global Engineering Documents, An IHS Company) has no more information. Is there a web site (other then Telcordia) or other means for information that exist? TR-TSY-000031, (now call Bellcore GR31) "CLASS(sm) Feature: Calling Number Delivery", Issue 2, June 1988, + Revision 1, January 1990 TA-NWT-001188, "CLASS(sm) Calling Name Delivery and Related Features", Issue 1, March 1991 {Waiting for Industry Comments} TR-NWT-000030, (now call Bellcore GR30)"Voiceband Data Transmission Interface Generic Requirements", Issue 2, October 1992 Thanks Stephido - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 20 Dec 2000 13:43:00 -0500 From: Jeffrey C Honig Subject: Re: NYT: Stats of Cell Phone Use in Poorer Countries msb@vex.net (Mark Brader) writes: > I'm reminded of the following story that Miguel Cruz posted here > last year... > > | Reminds me of a story from when I lived in Saudi Arabia in 1997. One > | of my co-workers was having dinner at someone's home. Suddenly, three > | men in ambiguous government uniforms burst into the house. .... > | "Our telephone!" the man gasped between tears of shock that soon > | emerged as joy. "We ordered it in 1985! I'd totally forgotten about > | it! It's finally here!" Aren't Verizon employees required to show ID before then enter a residence? ;-) Thanks. Jeff - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 20 Dec 2000 14:32:23 -0500 From: tweek@fnord.io.com (Mike Maxfield) Subject: Re: Message Mysteriously in Voice Mailbox - How? "Pete Ritter" writes: >Interesting. Except my wife has Sprint PCS and according to her VMbox, the >call that left the message came from a phone in a SW Bell service area. Should matter what she had. When the hookflash is used on the other end, the current call is placed on hold and the person gets a redial tone. If the person then hangs up, his own local CO rings the phone back and upon answering is connected to the call he put on hold with the hook flash. The other end of the connection is doing nothing other than sitting on hold during the period. >I don't know if Mexico has the feature you describe. If it did, would it >work across int'l boundaries? For other telco features I don't know if you would consider it an international boundry since it is the same North American scheme, but in this case, it would work across PBX's, radio phone, and whatever other configuration you can think of since as far as the circuits between your wife's mailbox and the remote end of the circuit goes, the circuit was connected the entire time, put on hold at the caller's CO when it gave him a second dialtone/ - -- tweek@io.com - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 20 Dec 2000 16:22:50 -0500 From: "Ian McNabb" Subject: Vantage NT3B01AA All, I do not know if this is the proper newsgroup to be posting this, but I am looking for information on a Vantage 4 port phone system model NT3B01AA. I have uncovered this phone system in the basement of our offices and was wondering if it was possible to set this up in my house. There are approximately 20 sets with the system model number NT0B02AB, which would be more than adequate to cover all the rooms in my house :-) If anyone has any information on how to utilize this system, can point me to manuals, FAQ's, etc, can you please email me at imcnabb@pricedex.com. Thanks in Advance Ian McNabb - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 20 Dec 2000 17:30:57 -0500 From: "Chris Ornellas" Subject: Re: Finding Public Domain Music-On-Hold Volume fluctuations in the level of the Music On Hold are caused by the types, distance and quality of near-end and far-end CO switches. This can also be influenced by poor recordings, improper impedance matching between the M.O.H. source and the KSU/ PBX. don't blame it all on the installer because there are other conditions that affect M.O.H quality that are out of an installers control. You can't please everyone all of the time, so try to please yourself and the person who is paying the invoices. "John McHarry" wrote in message news:3k204tscaauobpcram8qugvournij60lv9@4ax.com... > On 19 Dec 2000 18:15:54 -0500, John Bartley > wrote: > > >Well, since Public Law 105-298 (10/27/98) extended > >copyrights, it looks like if we want to add > >music-on-hold to our phone system we either... > > I find music on hold irritating. It is usually far too loud and > interrupted with speech that sounds like you have finally cut through. > Also, it destroys conference calls. If someone in the conference puts > it on hold, everyone else is drowned out by music. Just say, no > thanks. > -- > The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail > messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 20 Dec 2000 17:37:34 -0500 From: "Chris Ornellas" Subject: Re: Finding Public Domain Music-On-Hold How about just programming your KSU/PBX to produce 'Tone On Hold' when someone is put on hold. This is usually under line programming or system programming. "John Bartley" wrote in message news:20001219230337.16008.qmail@web2002.mail.yahoo.com... > Well, since Public Law 105-298 (10/27/98) extended > copyrights, it looks like if we want to add > music-on-hold to our phone system we either > a) find sound recordings first 'fixed' (i.e., > distributed as then-copyrighted, not just performed on > the radio) before 1925 or earlier > b) purchase music made-for-hire > c) pay for performance rights, or > d) hire a commercial service, e.g., Muzak > > Feeling rather allergic to C) and D) (given my budget) > and not wishing to expose callers-on-hold to > commercial talk radio (I want them to LIKE us when > they get off hold), this leaves us: > > A) Anyone have any pre-1925 shellac (certainly not > vinyl...) and a turntable they would not mind > transcribing to audio cassette? Once done, I will > take them home, convert them to MP3 files and post > them in an appropriate alt.binaries forum (not here - > though I will post a notice here so y'all can get > them), so folks can download and convert back to audio > CD, or use as is with MP3 player software in an > obsolete PC, a CD/MP3 player (now <$100!) or such. > > B) > has a selection of public domain stuph for $25 per CD. > > Any other sources you can think of? > > > ===== > -- > "We should call this Year One of Day One." > RAH to Uncle Walter, 1969-07-20 > John Bartley, NT sysadmin, Portland OR (503) BAR-TLEY > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Yahoo! Shopping - Thousands of Stores. Millions of Products. > http://shopping.yahoo.com/ > -- > The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail > messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 20 Dec 2000 17:40:34 -0500 From: "IMT-2000-online" Subject: IMT-2000 Hello, As you perhaps already know, the third generation mobile phones are just about to be brought out. According to the International Telecommunications Union (ITU), the name given to the system will be IMT-2000. If you want to learn a little bit more about IMT-2000, to see how the future terminals will look like or to a watch a video that explains how IMT-2000 will change our everyday life, just have a look at our site: www.IMT-2000-online.com Thank you... Laurent HERMOYE IMT-2000-online e - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 20 Dec 2000 20:20:07 -0500 From: djb0x77376989@scream.org (Dan Birchall) Subject: Cell phones as telemarketer-avoidance devices, state laws? Like most other multicellular life forms in the galaxy, I have an electronic lea...er, cell phone. I have noted that the TCPA makes it a Bad Idea to call said phone using a sequential- or random-dialer or an automated voice recording, and have started using it as the number-of-choice when someone "needs" my number. Rationale: if I'm gonna get telemarketed, I may as well get paid. I know various states also have laws criminalizing certain abusive telemarketing practices. Hawaii's laws do not address cell phones; I'm curious as to whether anyone else's states have laws which address the cost-shifting element of telemarketing calls to phone numbers where the recipient pays for airtime. - -Dan - -- Dan Birchall - Palolo Valley - Honolulu HI - http://dan.scream.org/ Peruse my opinions, at http://dbirchall.epinions.com/user-dbirchall Corporate Holidays 2001 - http://208.184.171.20/articles/262573.htm My addresses expire... take out the hex stamp if your reply bounces - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 20 Dec 2000 20:51:01 -0500 From: "Judith Oppenheimer" Subject: 12/20/00 ICBTollFreeNews.Com HEADS UP HEADLINES (plus a HUGE holiday discount) ____________________________________________________ ICBTollFreeNews.Com HEADS UP HEADLINES ____________________________________________________ from ICB Toll Free News - Daily News and Intelligence covering the Political, Legal and Marketing Arenas of 800 and Dot Com. ____________________________________________________ !!! A HOLIDAY GIFT !!! (from 'the Present Isn't Wrapped Yet' department) While our webmasters toil diligently to program your gift into our system, why should you wait ... ?! Subscribe to ICB Premium between now and January 6, 2001, ___________ for only $149 dollars ! ______________ Read ALL ARTICLES, get FULL SITE ACCESS, for twelve months ! Order at http://www.icbtollfree.com/order.cfm, and write '$149 GIFT' next to your name. 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CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4916 P - NUMBER RECLAMATION The move is the first under new rules that require a carrier to begin using a prefix within 6 months of being assigned. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4915 F - INTERNET NOTABLES TO SPEAK AT IP MANAGEMENT CONFERENCE Among the roster at this conference on intellectual property: Karl Auerbach, Carl Oppedahl, Bret Fausett, and controversial WG-B Chair Michael Palage. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4913 F - 1-800-TAXICAB PARTNERS WITH COORS FOR DRUNK DRIVING CAMPAIGN The initiative encourages people to use taxicabs when they've had too much to drink. "Taxis are great designated drivers!,'' says 1-800-TAXICAB CEO, Mark Adkins. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4912 F - P&G SELLS FLU.COM According to the company's listings at GreatDomains, P&G asked more than $1 million apiece for names including "romantic.com" and "sensitive.com." The company is asking $3 million for "beautiful.com." P&G executives declined to disclose the sales price of flu.com on Monday, but a source advised ICB, "it was one of the top prices paid for a domain name." The name was sold to a pharmaceutical company. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4911 F - 'BEFUDDLED' BY FCC DICTUM Neither of these abuses provides a logical or rational basis for making the toll-free subscriber/end-user a "straw man" in which to blame for these problems. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4914 _______________notices from our sponsors_______________ Are you a local or regional business that advertises in newspapers, direct mail, on radio or tv? 1 800 BRAND IT shared use marketing programs can help your sales skyrocket! http://www.1800BrandIt.com ____________________________________________________ 800 RATE NEGOTIATION EXPERTISE If your usage contract is coming to an end we can help you get the very best rate from your existing or new vendor. We charge $125 per hour. No fee if you choose a vendor we represent. Telemanagement, Inc. http://www.sdtele.com ____________________________________________________ IS YOUR BUSINESS LISTED? The Internet 800 Directory lists hundreds of thousands of toll free numbers and is viewed by millions each month. The Internet 800 Directory will list ANY business with a toll free number, regardless of long distance carrier, for free and was the first to do so. Go to http://gotollfree.com and see if your toll free number is listed. If not, click the Add Listing button to submit your toll free number for this free listing. ____________________________________________________ ____________________________________________________ ABOUT ICB ICB HeadsUp Headlines Daily Email is sent by request. Subscriptions to Daily Email are free to qualified applicants. Visit http://www.icbtollfree.com/reg.cfm?NextURL=Index.cfm to sign up. Please feel free to pass along a copy to a friend, within reason so long as the message is not modified or used unfavorably. To unsubscribe mailto:editor@icbtollfree.com, subject: unsubscribe. ___________________ ADVERTISING INFORMATION ___________________ For information on advertising in ICB HeadsUp Headlines emails, see http://www.icbtollfree.com/ArticleId4415.html ____________________________________________________ Only subscribers or registered users of ICB Toll Free News web site will be able to access all or some of the full text of URLs provided. ____________________________________________________ Copyright © 2000 ICB, Inc. All rights reserved. ____________________________________________________ ------------------------------ Date: 20 Dec 2000 22:04:13 -0500 From: John Nagle Subject: Re: Finding Public Domain Music-On-Hold danny burstein wrote: > Another alernative is using various public/gov'tal broadcasts. for > example, feeding out the NOAA weather forecast into your MOH. Or the time > clock on WWV[H]. Or, for that matter, the Voice Of America [1] or the BBC. My favorite comment on that was from a news report from someone who was having trouble getting a security deposit back from a landlord. During a long period on hold, listening to a radio station, a public service announcement came on: "Having trouble getting your security deposit back? That's illegal. We can help. Contact the Department of Consumer Affairs at 1-800....". John Nagle - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 21 Dec 2000 04:23:58 -0500 From: David Lind Subject: Re: "Smart" Predictive Dialer? In article , "M H" wrote: > OK, a question for all you folks who have some knowledge of predictive > dialers (I won't ask who actually works with them; I bet no one would admit > it anyway!). > > Are any predictive dialers "smart" enough to understand the > three-rising-tone intercept that generally indicates a disconnected phone > line ("boob-bob-beep! We're sorry, the number you have dialed..." yadda > yadda yadda) and place that number in its 'do not call' database? I've done > a quickie check on web sites but haven't found any explicit mention. > Not sure, but here are a couple of websites where you might find this info. from Telemarketing Scum Page - Tech Data Address:http://www.scn.org/~bk269/data.html The AntiTelemarketer's Source Address:http://www.antitelemarketer.com/indexd.htm - -- David Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ End of Telecom Digest V2000 #162 ******************************** Date: 22 Dec 2000 06:15:15 -0500 From: owner-telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org (Telecom Digest) To: telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org Subject: Telecom Digest V2000 #163 Telecom Digest Friday, December 22 2000 Volume 2000 : Number 163 In this issue: 211 code Re: Telecom Digest V2000 #159 Re: Finding Public Domain Music-On-Hold 3.1KHz audio calls Re: Finding Public Domain Music-On-Hold Re: 211 code Use of "211" (was Re: Telecom Digest V2000 #159) Re: 211 code 12/21/00 ICBTollFreeNews.Com HEADS UP HEADLINES (plus a Great Holiday Sale!) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 21 Dec 2000 09:09:03 -0500 From: jsw@ivgate.omahug.org Subject: 211 code >So, is there a 211 area code? Nope. In the states, prior to the widespread deployment of Direct Distance Dialing, 211 reached the toll operator in many Ma Bell communities (and some independents I would guess too). I seem to recall this in some areas as late as the early 1970s. Good day JSW - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 21 Dec 2000 09:19:06 -0500 From: Wes Leatherock Subject: Re: Telecom Digest V2000 #159 On 20 Dec 2000 07:23:42 -0500 John Hein wrote: > In message <20001218111518.6125.qmail@xuxa.iecc.com> owner-telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org (Telecom Digest) writes: > > >In <5.0.0.25.0.20001215230144.00a08680@mailbox.verizon.net>, > > > Gary Novosielski wrote: > > >}Although the dial pulses did figure into the assignment of codes correlated > > >}to traffic, area codes have always been listed in numerical order, and 201 > > >}did, and still does top the list as the "lowest" number. > > In Strowger practice, surely 0 > 9? > > So, is there a 211 area code? > > -- > > [ John Hein GM1YME | Phaggots do it on the phone! ] No, all the X11 codes were reserved for service codes; most of them were already in use long before area codes were established. For example, 211 reached the toll operator; 411 reached "Information" ("Inquries" in the U.K., I believe), now called Directory Assistance. In a lot of places 611 reached Repair Service and in some cases 811 reached the Business Office. That was in non-step offices. Step offices usually used 110 for toll, 113 for Directory Assistance and 114 for Repair Service. 411 or 1+411 is still used for Directory Assistance. In some places there have been suggestions, and perhaps some sales, of the X11 codes for commercial purposes, not as area codes but in effect as brief, and therefore very desirable, telephone numbers. 911 is now pretty well standardized in the U.S.A. as the emergency assistance number. Wes Leatherock wleath@sandbox.dynip.com - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 21 Dec 2000 09:23:39 -0500 From: Wes Leatherock Subject: Re: Finding Public Domain Music-On-Hold On 19 Dec 2000 18:15:54 -0500 John Bartley wrote: > Well, since Public Law 105-298 (10/27/98) extended > copyrights, it looks like if we want to add > music-on-hold to our phone system we either > a) find sound recordings first 'fixed' (i.e., > distributed as then-copyrighted, not just performed on > the radio) before 1925 or earlier > b) purchase music made-for-hire > c) pay for performance rights, or > d) hire a commercial service, e.g., Muzak Isn't there still public domain music available? Some 10 or 15 years ago, when I was involved in industrial TV production, some for in-house use, some for public distribution, there were sources to buy music of various types that was written and recorded in the public domain specifically for background and theme music and similar uses. Wes Leatherock wleath@sandbox.dynip.com - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 21 Dec 2000 10:29:13 -0500 From: "Steve C" Subject: 3.1KHz audio calls I have been dealing with maintainers of a Mitel iMAGINATION who are stating that their PBX will only make 3.1KHz audio calls from their analogue lines. They are quoting ETSI specifications and claiming that making an ordinary speech call would not be within spec where modems and fax machines are involved. I know of one site with an ISLX PBX that rejects 3.1KHz audio calls as incompatible with its equipment. Does anyone have information on what PBX systems will support 3.1KHz audio calls? How about relevant information from the ETSI specifications? - -- Regards Steve Croft - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 21 Dec 2000 10:53:20 -0500 From: hollaar@faith.cs.utah.edu (Lee Hollaar) Subject: Re: Finding Public Domain Music-On-Hold In article <20001219230337.16008.qmail@web2002.mail.yahoo.com> John Bartley writes: >Well, since Public Law 105-298 (10/27/98) extended >copyrights, it looks like if we want to add >music-on-hold to our phone system we either > a) find sound recordings first 'fixed' (i.e., >distributed as then-copyrighted, not just performed on >the radio) before 1925 or earlier > b) purchase music made-for-hire > c) pay for performance rights, or > d) hire a commercial service, e.g., Muzak First, the disclaimer. I am not a lawyer, and this is not legal advice. But I do teach intellectual property law at the University of Utah's School of Computing, and so can point you to parts of the copyright laws that aren't well-understood by laymen, so you can discuss them with your legal counsel. There are a number of ways you can infringe a copyright without making a copy of a work. One of these is the public performance of the work, such as playing it on music-on-hold. (There is a case from the U.S. District Court in Minnesota that confirms that music-on-hold is a public performance, and not covered by the exception that permits a company to play a radio in a public place -- _Prophet Music Inc. v. Shamla Oil Co. Inc._, 26 USPQ2d 1554.) The curious thing about the public performance right is that it does not apply to sound recordings, unless it is a digital audio transmission. The copyright to a sound recording covers what was fixed on the particular record. So you can publicly perform sound recordings on music-on-hold without infringing their copyright. But that doesn't end the question, because there may be a copyright on the music that was recorded on the sound recording, and that copyright *is* infringed by public performance. So, you likely can play a sound recording whose underlying music is not copyrighted, either as an original composition or a new arrangement. And maybe your clients will like listening to classical music. You can find an online copy of the Copyright Act at: http://www.loc.gov/copyright/title17/ Remember, this isn't legal advice, just a pointer to something you might want to discuss with your legal counsel. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 21 Dec 2000 11:28:39 -0500 From: Stanley Cline Subject: Re: 211 code jsw@ivgate.omahug.org wrote: > >So, is there a 211 area code? > > Nope. In the states, prior to the widespread deployment of Direct > Distance Dialing, 211 reached the toll operator in many Ma Bell > communities (and some independents I would guess too). I seem to > recall this in some areas as late as the early 1970s. Nowadays, 211 is used by COCOTs to reach refund/repair, and the FCC has earmarked 211 for use in reaching "community information and referral services" (in Atlanta, 211 goes to a United Way "helpline".) - -SC - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 21 Dec 2000 13:06:03 -0500 From: "David L Kindred \(Dave\)" Subject: Use of "211" (was Re: Telecom Digest V2000 #159) >>>>> "John" == John Hein writes: John> So, is there a 211 area code? No, 211 is part of the n11 block of special numbers. There should be plenty of messages in the Archive about the various n11 usages, but a few common ones (either in the past or the present): 411 Directory Assistance (AKA Information) 611 Telephone Repair 911 Emergency (Police/Fire/Ambulance) - -- David L. Kindred mailto:d.kindred@telesciences.com Unix Systems & Network Administrator Telesciences, Inc. Phone: +1 856 642 4184 2000 Midlantic Drive, Suite 410 Fax: +1 856 866 0185 Mount Laurel, NJ 08054 USA - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 21 Dec 2000 22:15:23 -0500 From: djb0x77376989@scream.org (Dan Birchall) Subject: Re: 211 code jsw@ivgate.omahug.org wrote: > > >So, is there a 211 area code? > > Nope. In the states, prior to the widespread deployment of Direct > Distance Dialing, 211 reached the toll operator in many Ma Bell > communities (and some independents I would guess too). I seem to > recall this in some areas as late as the early 1970s. According to http://www.nanpa.com/number_resource_info/n11_codes.html the FCC administers N11 codes in the USA, and recognizes 211 as a nationally assigned (which does NOT mean nationally implemented, so don't complain if it doesn't work where you are :) code for "Community Information and Referral Services" - whatever THAT means. This puts it in roughly the same category as 311 (Non-Emergency Police and Other Governmental Services), 511 (Traffic and Transportation Information), 711 (Telecommunications Relay Service) and 811 (Business Office) - N11 services that a lot of people have never heard of. Not to be confused with the much more widely known 411, 611 and 911. Speaking of nationally assigned NOT meaning nationally implemented, Verizon Hawaii routes 511 to Relay Service too. Feh. We could *really* use some traffic and transportation info, guys! Of course, the NANPA site indicates that 211 and 511 were just recently nationally assigned... - -Dan - -- Dan Birchall - Palolo Valley - Honolulu HI - http://dan.scream.org/ Peruse my opinions, at http://dbirchall.epinions.com/user-dbirchall Corporate Holidays 2001 - http://208.184.171.20/articles/262573.htm My addresses expire... take out the hex stamp if your reply bounces - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 21 Dec 2000 23:39:19 -0500 From: "Judith Oppenheimer" Subject: 12/21/00 ICBTollFreeNews.Com HEADS UP HEADLINES (plus a Great Holiday Sale!) ____________________________________________________ ICBTollFreeNews.Com HEADS UP HEADLINES ____________________________________________________ from ICB Toll Free News - Daily News and Intelligence covering the Political, Legal and Marketing Arenas of 800 and Dot Com. ____________________________________________________ Been waiting for a sale? ICB is DEEPLY Discounted for the Holidays !! Limited time offer: http://www.icbtollfree.com/Article_4910.html ____________________________________________________ CONTENTS - - 855 REPLY COMMENTS - - DOT BIZ DISPUTE ATTRACTS MAINSTREAM PRESS ATTENTION - - DAVID V. GOLIATH, DOT COM - - APRES MARINA DEL REY: NOTES FROM A WEARY TRAVELLER - - NAMES COUNCIL WORKING GROUP FORMED ___________________________________________________ CUSTOMER SERVICE NOTES: With over 4,000 articles archived, ICB is a popular research destination. Find all ICB headlines: http://www.icbtollfree.com/icbheadlns.cfm, or use ICB's search engine: http://icbtollfree.com/Search.cfm. Note: Registration is required. Contact information is NOT sold, leased, rented or shared in any manner. Buying, selling, seeking, announcing? ICB offers FREE classifieds: http://ICBclassifieds.com. _______________notices from our sponsors_______________ >>>>>>>>>>>>> http://1800TheExpert.com <<<<<<<<<<<<< 800 & Domain Name Acquisition Management, Lost/Stolen 800 # Retrieval, Litigation Support, Regulatory Navigation, Correlating Domain Name & Trademark Matters. ____________________________________________________ EVERY 3.6 SECONDS SOMEONE DIES FROM HUNGER http://www.hungersite.com/ ____________________________________________________ ARTICLE ACCESS CODE LEGEND ICB Toll Free News offers two valuable service options: F = Free - News and Features articles P = Premium - Unlimited Site Access including all Articles and Documents. ____________________________________________________ HEADLINES for December 21, 2000 P - 855 REPLY COMMENTS ATIS provided information regarding its sponsored committee - the SMS Number Administration Committee (SNAC) and the SNAC's processes and role in the 855 release decision. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4920 F - DOT BIZ DISPUTE ATTRACTS MAINSTREAM PRESS ATTENTION ICANN has recognized other domains that exist outside of its addressing system. At its meeting last month, ICANN board members decided not to approve the domain .web for use because it was already administered by another company. ICANN officials were not available for comment CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4921 F - DAVID V. GOLIATH, DOT COM "We now are awaiting a federal court judge's decision that will set a precedent we expect will have ramifications for all future US citizens who become victims of cyberpiracy." In addition, this will be the first test of the rights of a US citizen vs a foreign trademark holder in a domain case. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4917 F - APRES MARINA DEL REY: NOTES FROM A WEARY TRAVELLER ICANN had managed to alienate the administrators of the world's country-specific domains by sending them bills rather than asking for contributions... it alienated the people who just learned about ICANN through the At Large election process by projecting an image of fighting tooth and nail against granting the At Large-elected members influence over ICANN decisions, and delaying the implementation of such influence whenever possible... it alienated most of the individuals wanting to contribute in the Domain Names Supporting Organization through a convoluted "interest group" structure that seems designed to produce deadlocks rather than consensus. It has managed to leave itself without any certain source of income, meaning that it has to depend on "emergency" gifts from donors who think the alternative of seeing ICANN go down in flames would be worse than the status quo. It managed to convey the impression that all these problems have taken them by surprise. And the week hadn't started yet. A must-read chronicle by Harald Alvestrand. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4917 F - NAMES COUNCIL WORKING GROUP FORMED ICANN's secretive Names Council says its reviewing its internal consensus-building procedures, and has formed a working group ... It *is* chaired by the credible Y J Park, and so is worthy of attention if not participation. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4919 _______________notices from our sponsors_______________ Are you a local or regional business that advertises in newspapers, direct mail, on radio or tv? 1 800 BRAND IT shared use marketing programs can help your sales skyrocket! http://www.1800BrandIt.com ____________________________________________________ 800 RATE NEGOTIATION EXPERTISE If your usage contract is coming to an end we can help you get the very best rate from your existing or new vendor. We charge $125 per hour. No fee if you choose a vendor we represent. Telemanagement, Inc. http://www.sdtele.com ____________________________________________________ IS YOUR BUSINESS LISTED? The Internet 800 Directory lists hundreds of thousands of toll free numbers and is viewed by millions each month. The Internet 800 Directory will list ANY business with a toll free number, regardless of long distance carrier, for free and was the first to do so. 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All rights reserved. ____________________________________________________ ------------------------------ End of Telecom Digest V2000 #163 ******************************** Date: 23 Dec 2000 06:15:18 -0500 From: owner-telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org (Telecom Digest) To: telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org Subject: Telecom Digest V2000 #164 Telecom Digest Saturday, December 23 2000 Volume 2000 : Number 164 In this issue: Re: Finding the right Bellcore CallerID document Where can I find a Network Based ACD? Re: 211 code Re: 211 code "Low" numbers Re: Finding Public Domain Music-On-Hold fyi, at least one Attorney General sues AT&T Re: 3.1KHz audio calls Re: Finding Public Domain Music-On-Hold Re: Finding Public Domain Music-On-Hold jackass story 12/22/00 ICBTollFreeNews.Com HEADS UP HEADLINES POTS line terminations. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 22 Dec 2000 07:39:07 -0500 From: John Adams Subject: Re: Finding the right Bellcore CallerID document Stephido et. al. Depending on how deep you want to go will determine what you want. If you're interested in procedural (UI) as well as TCAP messaging between the switches, buy the GR31 document. If you also want to know how Calling Name (AIN or LIDB lookup) TCAP works, get the 1188 document. If you're designing CallerID boxes or the equipment in the switch that encodes the data, get a copy of GR80 for specific info on encoding and timing of the data signals. Hope this helps ... Stephido wrote: > Hi, > > I have been looking for the Bellcore standards on the CallerID > implementation and behavior. I found three documents (listed below) but I > only have the title and no abstract or description. > > Thanks > > Stephido > -- > The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail > messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. - -- John "Jack" Adams, Lucent Technologies, Inc. +1.732.224.8045 +1.732.224.8077 (fax) +1.908.568.1453 (mobile) 9085681453@mobile.att.net (SMS) jackadams@lucent.com 200 Schultz Drive, Room 3A-109C Red Bank, NJ 07701-6745 The power of accurate observation is often called cynicism by those who haven't got it. -- George Bernard Shaw - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 22 Dec 2000 13:10:10 -0500 From: "Jim Cheshire" Subject: Where can I find a Network Based ACD? Can anyone point me to a vendor that provides a network-based ACD? I would like to have geographically distributed agents served by the same ACD. I'd rather not purchase a CPE-based system to do this. Thanks in advance, Jim - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 22 Dec 2000 13:57:55 -0500 From: David Lind Subject: Re: 211 code In article , djb0x77376989@scream.org wrote: (snip) > > Speaking of nationally assigned NOT meaning nationally implemented, > Verizon Hawaii routes 511 to Relay Service too. Feh. We could > *really* use some traffic and transportation info, guys! > > Of course, the NANPA site indicates that 211 and 511 were just > recently nationally assigned... > Hi Dan, a basic question... Dialed 511 with a Verizon cell phone here on the mainland and got a dial tone. Can make 7 digit local calls only. Would obtaining a dial tone with cellular have any useful purpose, like data calls? - -- Thanks, David Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 22 Dec 2000 14:03:12 -0500 From: jsw@ivgate.omahug.org Subject: Re: 211 code > >Nope. In the states, prior to the widespread deployment of Direct > >Distance Dialing, 211 reached the toll operator in many Ma Bell > >communities (and some independents I would guess too). I seem to > >recall this in some areas as late as the early 1970s. > Is this the equivalent of "00" which now gets you to your LD operator? Uh, depends on how you look at it, I suppose. 211 was back in the Old Days, right at the advent of customer dialed LD calls, but certainly in the days of 'one system, one solution, one attitude', and 00 (which I can never remember actually using) is in the days of competitive carriers and the like. (Dusting off rusty memory cells.) I'm trying to remember when zero-plus calling was first used. Back in NYC in maybe 1967 or 1968 I remember what they called 'Extended Direct Distance Dialing'. For operator-assisted calls, you would dial 0-NPA-NNX-XXXX (yes, it was NNX then ;-) and the operator would break in and ask if it was collect or person or whatever. This was only on some of the 5xb offices, iirc. Also, iirc, panel subs would dial 0 for long distance. Station calls were dialed NPA-NNX-XXXX with NO leading 1. I do remember the timeout on the dialing of 0 really threw some people who were used to dialing zero and immediately hearing click-clack-click-rrring of the operator. I'm trying to remember when 00 dialing first showed up. I suppose it had to be in the 80's right after the Great Breakup when the local operators were split off from the toll operators. I'm very fuzzy on this one. Good day JSW - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 22 Dec 2000 14:35:30 -0500 From: Gary Novosielski Subject: "Low" numbers On 20 Dec 2000 07:23:42 (-0500) johndunedin@drink.demon.co.uk (John Hein) wrote: >So, is there a 211 area code? No. In the North American Numbering Plan, all the N11 codes are reserved for special service codes. Currently only 411 (directory assistance) and 911 (police/fire/medical emergency) are in use with anything like nationwide consistency. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 22 Dec 2000 14:35:47 -0500 From: Gary Novosielski Subject: Re: Finding Public Domain Music-On-Hold On 20 Dec 2000 11:57:32 (-0500) John Bartley wrote: >Sorry, but no AM reception, and weak FM reception, in >our Zone-Three quake-reinforced steel frame building >core. The NOAA VHF was my first thought; bought a >radio, decent reception outside building core, but >zippo in the phone room. Ditto for the old Sony >shortwave I brought in. Sigh. Too bad there are no copper wires running from your phone room to the outside world, or you might be able to use one for a long-wire external antenna. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 22 Dec 2000 14:44:26 -0500 From: danny burstein Subject: fyi, at least one Attorney General sues AT&T AT&T, along with the other telcos we deal with, often seem to rank in sleaziness just one step above political campaigners. Some people would say I'm being too kind, and place them below Darth Vader. AT&T in particular has sent bills for non existent account services to both my work site and to me at home. Fortunately, my employer's finance dep't caught the ones sent to the office. I forwarded complaints to the Public Service Commission as well as lots of others, concerned that this was a deliberate policy of AT&T's anticipating that many people would simply pay. The assistance we received made me thank, once again, Ron Lauder for pushing through political term limits. Anyway, Ct. Attorney General Richard Blumenthal listened to his conscience and filed suit. With a bit of luck NYS and maybe the Feds will follow: Connecticut Attorney General's Office Press Release Attorney General Files Suit Against AT&T December 20, 2000 Attorney General Richard Blumenthal today announced the state has amended its lawsuit against telephone giant AT&T to include allegations that AT&T falsely billed Connecticut consumers for services never ordered. "Our investigation shows that AT&T is bilking Connecticut consumers out of money that the company did not earn and does not deserve," Blumenthal said. "I am appalled that this long distance carrier -- with millions of customers -- sets up phony accounts and then bills unsuspecting consumers for charges they do not owe." [snip] rest at: http://www.cslnet.ctstateu.edu/attygenl/press/2000/coniss/att.htm _____________________________________________________ Knowledge may be power, but communications is the key dannyb@panix.com [to foil spammers, my address has been double rot-13 encoded] - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 22 Dec 2000 14:48:27 -0500 From: "John R. Covert Spam Sink" Subject: Re: 3.1KHz audio calls Steve Croft is concerned about his Mitel iMAGINATION PBX which is only making 3.1kHz audio calls from its analogue lines. The problem is actually with the other site, the one with the ISLX PBX that rejects 3.1kHz audio calls. These calls should not be rejected. 3.1kHz audio is the minimum standard for regular telephony; "speech" bearer type is a special type indicating that the user is willing to accept degraded service. I've been through this problem, in a slightly different situation. One of my lines at home is an ISDN line, ordered with voice service only; I had no need for the 64kbps circuit switched data, but an ISDN line, connected to a Motorola Bitsurfer Pro ISDN Terminal Adapter provides two regular analogue POTS ports which will give you superior analogue service as compared to a long loop to the C.O., and at the tariffs in Massachusetts, a significant savings over two separate flat-rate residential POTS lines. (Reminder for overseas readers: "POTS" stands for "Plain Old Telephone Service") In any case, I decided one day to turn the ISDN line over to RCN, a CLEC (competetive local exchange carrier) who would actually just be reselling Bell Atlantic (now Verizon) ISDN service to me at a 5% discount. A bad decision, but I've stuck with it for various reasons I won't go into here. Shortly after doing this, friends in Germany stopped being able to call me. They would get a recording telling them (in German) "Requested facility not subscribed" which, not being telecom gurus, meant nothing to them. Note that these people were calling from a POTS phone, where they had no control over whether the call would be presented to the terminating station as a "speech" or a "3.1kHz audio" (aka voiceband data) bearer type. For quite a while, I had no clue as to what was wrong, and of course the CLEC and LEC and various LD carriers all pointed fingers at each other and were getting nowhere. I did some experimentation, by arranging to have calls placed to my line from various different locations. From the UK, using Mercury, there was no problem reaching my line. From Germany, most calls failed, but on repeated dialling, some would go through. From Japan, all calls failed. From Finland, calls would succeed or fail depending on which LD carrier was chosen. We even found a #5 ESS in the local area which could not place calls from POTS phones to my number. We finally determined that my line had been provisioned at the C.O. (as part of the conversion to the CLEC) with only speech bearer type; I was not subscribed to 3.1kHz audio. We had this fixed, adding 3.1kHz audio as a subscribed bearer type, but still leaving off the undesired (and $5/month extra) circuit switched data, and the problem was solved. The point of this whole story is that you need to go after ISLX. Mitel is doing nothing wrong. All incoming equipment needs to be able to accept calls with either bearer type. Rejecting 3.1kHz audio calls will prevent the reception of regular calls dialled from normal telephones at various places in the world. /john (The address above is really /dev/null - the astute reader can probably figure out my real email address) - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 22 Dec 2000 15:04:59 -0500 From: dannyb@panix.com (danny burstein) Subject: Re: Finding Public Domain Music-On-Hold In <5.0.0.25.0.20001221231859.00a7c030@mailbox.verizon.net> Gary Novosielski writes: >On 20 Dec 2000 11:57:32 (-0500) John Bartley wrote: >>Sorry, but no AM reception, and weak FM reception, in our Zone-Three >>quake-reinforced steel frame building core. The NOAA VHF was my first >>thought; bought a radio, decent reception outside bldng core, but zippo >>in the phone room. Ditto for the old Sony shortwave I brought in. Sigh. >Too bad there are no copper wires running from your phone room to the >outside world, or you might be able to use one for an ext. antenna. Too bad there's no copper wire between the phone's KSU/music on hold card and the outside, or he might be able to place the radio in a good reception zone and feed the audio back... - -- _____________________________________________________ Knowledge may be power, but communications is the key dannyb@panix.com [to foil spammers, my address has been double rot-13 encoded] - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 22 Dec 2000 17:00:55 -0500 From: me Subject: Re: Finding Public Domain Music-On-Hold get a cheap cd player http://www.davenportmusic.com/musiconhold.html On 22 Dec 2000 14:35:47 -0500, Gary Novosielski wrote: >On 20 Dec 2000 11:57:32 (-0500) John Bartley wrote: > >>Sorry, but no AM reception, and weak FM reception, in >>our Zone-Three quake-reinforced steel frame building >>core. The NOAA VHF was my first thought; bought a >>radio, decent reception outside building core, but >>zippo in the phone room. Ditto for the old Sony >>shortwave I brought in. Sigh. > >Too bad there are no copper wires running from your phone room to the >outside world, or you might be able to use one for a long-wire external antenna. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 22 Dec 2000 18:07:38 -0500 From: "Tad Cook" Subject: jackass story OK, I think I may have heard it here before, but here is a cute story related to telephones: http://sunshine.freehosting.net/jackass.htm - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 22 Dec 2000 18:40:12 -0500 From: "Judith Oppenheimer" Subject: 12/22/00 ICBTollFreeNews.Com HEADS UP HEADLINES ____________________________________________________ ICBTollFreeNews.Com HEADS UP HEADLINES ____________________________________________________ from ICB Toll Free News - Daily News and Intelligence covering the Political, Legal and Marketing Arenas of 800 and Dot Com. ____________________________________________________ Been waiting for a sale? ICB is DEEPLY Discounted for the Holidays !! 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Working Group Chair (and NeuStar exec) contribution to last week's NTIA ENUM roundtable: engineering presentation to explain the technology? Or NeuStar corporate proposal to run the show? >From page one: "Who is NeuStar?", its hard to tell. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4925 F - WIPO REINVENTED "WIPO isn't WIPO anymore. No, it's the United Nations' World Intellectual Property Organisation, shortened to the UN, if needed. This is actually a very clever bit of rebranding." CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4929 ____________________________________________________ ABOUT ICB ICB HeadsUp Headlines Daily Email is sent by request. Subscriptions to Daily Email are free to qualified applicants. Visit http://www.icbtollfree.com/reg.cfm?NextURL=Index.cfm to sign up. Please feel free to pass along a copy to a friend, within reason so long as the message is not modified or used unfavorably. To unsubscribe mailto:editor@icbtollfree.com, subject: unsubscribe. ___________________ ADVERTISING INFORMATION ___________________ For information on advertising in ICB HeadsUp Headlines emails, see http://www.icbtollfree.com/ArticleId4415.html ____________________________________________________ Only subscribers or registered users of ICB Toll Free News web site will be able to access all or some of the full text of URLs provided. ____________________________________________________ Copyright © 2000 ICB, Inc. All rights reserved. ____________________________________________________ ------------------------------ Date: 23 Dec 2000 02:15:04 -0500 From: Roy Smith Subject: POTS line terminations. I was reading through cisco's Voice Analog Interface MIB, and came upon a list of possible line termination impedences, including: > ohms600Real - 600 Ohms. > ohms600Complex - 600 Ohms + 2.16uF > ohms900Complex - 900 Ohms + 2.16uF. > ohmsComplex1 - complex 1; > 220 Ohms + 820 Ohms || 115nF. > This impedance is primarily used in > Germany. > ohmsComplex2 - complex 2; > 270 Ohms + 750 Ohms || 150nF. > This impedance is primarily used in > United Kingdom and Sweden. The last 2 entries seem relatively self-explanitory, but what about the first three? Where, and under what circumstances, might you expect to see analog phone lines terminated in those ways? I'm particularly intrigued by the idea of specifying a capacitance to 3 significant digits. I would think +/- 20% would be more typical for a mass produced part. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ End of Telecom Digest V2000 #164 ******************************** Date: 24 Dec 2000 06:15:09 -0500 From: owner-telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org (Telecom Digest) To: telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org Subject: Telecom Digest V2000 #165 Telecom Digest Sunday, December 24 2000 Volume 2000 : Number 165 In this issue: Christmas TV programs in Pennsylvania Christmas programs in Pennsylvania Modular Jack Help Modular Surface Jack Help Wiring Re: Modular Jack Help Re: Help Wiring Re: desirable numbers (was Early NPA Assignments) Re: 211 code Christmas TV programs in Pennsylvania Re: 211 code Re: Help Wiring Egghead scrambles to gauge damage Re: desirable numbers (was Early NPA Assignments) Re: desirable numbers (was Early NPA Assignments) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 23 Dec 2000 10:16:10 -0500 From: Wes Leatherock Subject: Christmas TV programs in Pennsylvania This is a little different from most postings to the digest, but it's still about Telco so I think it's at least sort of on topic. A retired Southwestern Bell district plant manager called me yesterday looking for information for her current husband, a minister. He was trying to locate a two-part Christmas program that he recalled being presented on television by the telephone company in Pennsylvania (where he then lived) in the 1950s. The two parts told the Christmas story, including the nativity, and he recalled that the commercials were done by an operator (or a female actor appearing as an operator). I don't recall the programs. I joined Southwestern Bell in 1956 or 1957, and I don't remember them. It is possible they were Bell of Pa. programs, or Bell System programs in which Southwestern Bell didn't participate. If anyone reading the digest remembers these, or can provide a clue or some contact who might remember them, I'm sure they would be much appreciative. Wes Leatherock wleath@sandbox.dynip.com - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 23 Dec 2000 10:20:01 -0500 From: Wes Leatherock Subject: Christmas programs in Pennsylvania A detail about the Christmas television programs in Pennyslvania I omitted: They were performed by marionettes. Wes Leatherock wleath@sandbox.dynip.com - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 23 Dec 2000 12:13:45 -0500 From: nissansman@my-deja.com Subject: Modular Jack Help Hi, I may be posting in the wrong group but I'm desperate. My friends phone terminal is old and needs to be replaced to accept a modem connection. We bought a "Modular Surface Jack with connection block for accomodating Modular Plugs (RJ11C/14C)" manufactured by LOBO. Having some experience with LANs etc I thought it would be a simple job. (duh) However, the 4 wires in the new model are red/yel/gr/blk and the incoming tel wires are gr/orange/blu/brown (I live in Ireland in case there are color differences between countries, BTW). Also only two wires the orange and blue(I think it was blue) are connected inside the old wallmounted block with the other two wires tucked away. Which wires do I need to connect to which, do i need to pare them down, why do things always happen on a christmas weekend and why are Irish telecom companies so useless? Any help or links would be greatly appreciated and happy christmas to you all. (ps. sorry if this posted twice but my PC crashed so just making sure) Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 23 Dec 2000 12:13:45 -0500 From: nissansman@my-deja.com Subject: Modular Surface Jack Hi, I may be posting in the wrong group but I'm desperate. My friends phone terminal is old and needs to be replaced to accept a modem connection. We bought a "Modular Surface Jack with connection block for accomodating Modular Plugs (RJ11C/14C)" manufactured by LOBO. Having some experience with LANs etc I thought it would be a simple job. (duh) However, the 4 wires in the new model are red/yel/gr/blk and the incoming tel wires are gr/orange/blu/brown (I live in Ireland in case there are color differences between countries, BTW). Also only two wires the orange and blue(I think it was blue) are connected inside the old wallmounted block with the other two wires tucked away. Which wires do I need to connect to which, do i need to pare them down, why do things always happen on a christmas weekend and why are Irish telecom companies so useless? Any help or links would be greatly appreciated and happy christmas to you all. Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 23 Dec 2000 12:13:46 -0500 From: nissansman@my-deja.com Subject: Help Wiring Hi, I may be posting in the wrong group but I'm desperate. My friends phone terminal is old and needs to be replaced to accept a modem connection. We bought a "Modular Surface Jack with connection block for accomodating Modular Plugs (RJ11C/14C)" manufactured by LOBO. Having some experience with LANs etc I thought it would be a simple job. (duh) However, the 4 wires in the new model are red/yel/gr/blk and the incoming tel wires are gr/orange/blu/brown (I live in Ireland in case there are color differences between countries, BTW). Also only two wires the orange and blue(I think it was blue) are connected inside the old wallmounted block with the other two wires tucked away. Which wires do I need to connect to which, do i need to pare them down, why do things always happen on a christmas weekend and why are Irish telecom companies so useless? Any help or links would be greatly appreciated and happy christmas to you all. (this is my third time trying to post here from deja.com, I hope this message isn't being repeated and annoying everyone :)) Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 23 Dec 2000 14:53:19 -0500 From: Joseph Singer Subject: Re: Modular Jack Help On 23 Dec 2000 12:13:45 -0500, nissansman@my-deja.com wrote: >Hi, I may be posting in the wrong group but I'm desperate. My friends phone >terminal is old and needs to be replaced to accept a modem connection. We >bought a "Modular Surface Jack with connection block for accomodating Modular >Plugs (RJ11C/14C)" manufactured by LOBO. Having some experience with LANs etc >I thought it would be a simple job. (duh) However, the 4 wires in the new >model are red/yel/gr/blk and the incoming tel wires are gr/orange/blu/brown >(I live in Ireland in case there are color differences between countries, >BTW). Also only two wires the orange and blue(I think it was blue) are >connected inside the old wallmounted block with the other two wires tucked >away. Which wires do I need to connect to which, do i need to pare them down, >why do things always happen on a christmas weekend and why are Irish telecom >companies so useless? Any help or links would be greatly appreciated and >happy christmas to you all. It appears that the orange and blue are your "tip" and "ring" leads and the others are for other purposes I'd suppose. Green/Red are used for tip and ring in north America and yellow/black are used either for a second line or sometimes is used for things such as a dial light in older installations though on multi-pair cable such as Cat. 3 or Cat. 5 use a different colour scheme - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Joseph Singer Seattle, Washington USA - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 23 Dec 2000 15:23:54 -0500 From: "News at Home" Subject: Re: Help Wiring I hope this helps.... The incoming wires are your tip and ring, and they would connect to the red and green wires in your new block (this is called RJ-11, one line). The other wires are for a second line and would be wired to the black and yellow to make your block a RJ-14 for use with a 2-line phone wired for RJ14. Usually, the tip and ring are not sensitive to polarity, but if they are, you will not be able to dial out. If this happens, swap the wires (red for green and vis versa) wrote in message news:922l2j$bjm$1@nnrp1.deja.com... 4 wires in the new model are red/yel/gr/blk and the incoming tel wires are gr/orange/blu/brown BTW). Also only two wires the orange and blue(I think it was blue) are connected inside the old wallmounted block with the other two wires tucked away. Which wires do I need to connect to which, do i need - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 23 Dec 2000 15:23:54 -0500 From: "News at Home" Subject: Re: desirable numbers (was Early NPA Assignments) There is one problem with Gary's logic.... The country code for the US is not "1", it is "840" (see ftp://ftp.ripe.net/iso3166-countrycodes/). 1 is used to set the call up in the US as a toll or LD call. Try Afghanistan with a code of "004". Can't be to many phones on Afghanistan can there? Andy Kauffman "Joseph Singer" wrote in message news:3.0.5.32.20001217040822.0086f2c0@oz.net... > 16 Dec 2000 13:00:11 -0500 Joel B Levin wrote: > > >In <5.0.0.25.0.20001215230144.00a08680@mailbox.verizon.net>, > > Gary Novosielski wrote: > >}Although the dial pulses did figure into the assignment of codes correlated > >}to traffic, area codes have always been listed in numerical order, and 201 > >}did, and still does top the list as the "lowest" number. > > > >Not in some old internal telco lists I've seen. > > > >}It could be argued that the "lowest" telephone number in the world is > >}located somewhere in Jersey City, NJ., if you accept the following > >}definition of "low": > >} > >}The lowest Country Code is +1: USA > >}The lowest US NPA is 201: NJ > >}The lowest NXX code in 201 is 200: Jersey City > >} > >}Presumably, if someone in Jersey City has the number +1.201.200.0001 that > >}could be considered to be the lowest number in the world, and a real vanity > >}coup! I wonder if he or she knows. > > > >Why not 201-200-0000? > > > >}"But," I hear you cry, "on a rotary dial, that would be 67 pulses!" True, > >}but this is a DTMF age. > > > >"Desirable" numbers for businesses are typically numbers ending in 00 or 000. > >Except that many years ago, while this seemed to be true in the East (and > >probably other places I didn't know about), in Mountain Bell territory > where I > >lived, the best numbers seemed to be the ones that ended in the most 1's. So > >while "ANdrews 8-8000" might have been really easy to remember or write a > >jingle about, a number like EAst 7-3111 was a lot easier to dial. > > I don't think it's an east versus west thing, but more likely the type of > switching equipment that was originally installed. Most everywhere in > major cities if the switching equipment was panel or crossbar major > businesses would have numbers that ended XX00 (hundred) or X000 (thousand). > In cities where step-by-step (aka Strowger) large businesses usually ended > with the number 1 because in a step office to have "hunting" step-by-step > offices go from 1 to 0 with 1 being the lowest number. In panel and > crossbar offices the lowest number is zero. > -------------------------------------------------------------------------- - - > Joseph Singer Seattle, Washington USA > [ICQ pgr] > +1 206 405 2052 [voice mail] +1 206 493 0706 [FAX] > -- > The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail > messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 23 Dec 2000 15:58:20 -0500 From: djb0x773771c5@scream.org (Dan Birchall) Subject: Re: 211 code David Lind wrote: > djb0x77376989@scream.org wrote: > > Speaking of nationally assigned NOT meaning nationally implemented, > > Verizon Hawaii routes 511 to Relay Service too. Feh. We could > > *really* use some traffic and transportation info, guys! > > Of course, the NANPA site indicates that 211 and 511 were just > > recently nationally assigned... > > a basic question... Dialed 511 with a Verizon cell phone here on the mainland > and got a dial tone. I was referring to Verizon as our LEC, formerly GTE Hawaiian Tel. > Can make 7 digit local calls only. I'm fairly sure your cell phone can call 911 - isn't that required by law? > Would obtaining a dial tone with cellular have any useful purpose, > like data calls? Got me. It would help run down the battery? - -Dan - -- Dan Birchall - Palolo Valley - Honolulu HI - http://dan.scream.org/ Corporate Holidays 2001 - http://208.184.171.20/articles/262573.htm My addresses expire... take out the hex stamp if your reply bounces - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 23 Dec 2000 16:10:27 -0500 From: Wes Leatherock Subject: Christmas TV programs in Pennsylvania Sorry if this is a double post. I got confirmation from the robot that both messages were posted, but the only one that came back on my system was the second one noting the show was made with marionettes. Wes Leatherock wleath@sandbox.dynip.com - ---------------------------------------------------- Date: Sat, 23 Dec 2000 09:05:17 -0600 (CST) From: Wes Leatherock Subject: Christmas TV programs in Pennsylvania This is a little different from most postings to the digest, but it's still about Telco so I think it's at least sort of on topic. A retired Southwestern Bell district plant manager called me yesterday looking for information for her current husband, a minister. He was trying to locate a two-part Christmas program that he recalled being presented on television by the telephone company in Pennsylvania (where he then lived) in the 1950s. The two parts told the Christmas story, including the nativity, and he recalled that the commercials were done by an operator (or a female actor appearing as an operator). I don't recall the programs. I joined Southwestern Bell in 1956 or 1957, and I don't remember them. It is possible they were Bell of Pa. programs, or Bell System programs in which Southwestern Bell didn't participate. If anyone reading the digest remembers these, or can provide a clue or some contact who might remember them, I'm sure they would be much appreciative. Wes Leatherock wleath@sandbox.dynip.com - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 23 Dec 2000 19:56:03 -0500 From: Wes Leatherock Subject: Re: 211 code On 22 Dec 2000 14:03:12 -0500 jsw@ivgate.omahug.org wrote: > Uh, depends on how you look at it, I suppose. 211 was back in the Old > Days, right at the advent of customer dialed LD calls, but certainly > in the days of 'one system, one solution, one attitude', and 00 (which I > can never remember actually using) is in the days of competitive > carriers and the like. 211 (in offices other than step) goes back before World War II... how much longer I don't now. In step offices 110 was used instead, before the days of single channel operation (same operator handled both local assistance and toll calls...just necessary to dial "0" after that for either service). > (Dusting off rusty memory cells.) I'm trying to remember when zero-plus > calling was first used. Back in NYC in maybe 1967 or 1968 I remember what > they called 'Extended Direct Distance Dialing'. For operator-assisted > calls, you would dial 0-NPA-NNX-XXXX (yes, it was NNX then ;-) and the > operator would break in and ask if it was collect or person or whatever. > This was only on some of the 5xb offices, iirc. Also, iirc, panel subs > would dial 0 for long distance. Station calls were dialed NPA-NNX-XXXX > with NO leading 1. The argument over a leading "1" to indicate station toll raged for a couple of decades, with different Associated Companies having different views. (The argument still gets brough up on Telecom Digest/comp.dcom.telecom from time to time, or did as recently as a year or two ago. But "1+" seems to be well established now.) Direct Distance Dialing (DDD) went in at different times in different places over a period of couple of decades. And Expanded (or Extended) DDD (EDDD) was also added office by office over a couple of decades. It also was used for many step offices which reached the toll network via CAMA rather than LAMA. In those days you had to pass your credit card number orally, too, when the operator came on. > I do remember the timeout on the dialing of 0 really threw some people who > were used to dialing zero and immediately hearing click-clack-click-rrring > of the operator. "0" is still used for local assistance and for intraLATA assistance (where the intraLATA toll is provided by the RBOC). > I'm trying to remember when 00 dialing first showed up. I suppose it had > to be in the 80's right after the Great Breakup when the local operators > were split off from the toll operators. I'm very fuzzy on this one. That's when it was. "00" was and is to reach the operator for the interLATA IXC. Wes Leatherock wleath@sandbox.dynip.com - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 23 Dec 2000 20:06:40 -0500 From: Wes Leatherock Subject: Re: Help Wiring On 23 Dec 2000 15:23:54 -0500 News at Home wrote: > I hope this helps.... > > The incoming wires are your tip and ring, and they would connect to the red > and green wires > in your new block (this is called RJ-11, one line). The other wires are for > a second line and would be wired to the black > and yellow to make your block a RJ-14 for use with a 2-line phone wired for > RJ14. Black or yellow may also be used for ground with polarized ringing on party lines. And for some purposes you might use black and yellow for the ringer behind a cutoff key. > Usually, the tip and ring are not sensitive to polarity, but if they are, > you will not be able > to dial out. If this happens, swap the wires (red for green and vis versa) This is usually the case only with lines arranged for tone dialing and then only for older Touch-Tone sets. For most purposes you just need to know that red and green are tip and ring and go to your modem or telephone. Wes Leatherock wleath@sandbox.dynip.com - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 23 Dec 2000 20:09:17 -0500 From: Monty Solomon Subject: Egghead scrambles to gauge damage Egghead scrambles to gauge damage An intruder may have poached the online electronics and computer retailer's database of 3.7 million customers, including credit card information. The FBI and security experts are on the case. By Robert Lemos and Ben Charny, ZDNet News December 22, 2000 12:37 PM PT Egghead.com scrambled on Friday to gauge how much of its 3.7-million-customer database had been stolen by intruders during an online theft, which experts believed happened the day before. "We're in continuous crisis mode here," said a consultant from physical and electronic security firm Kroll Worldwide--the experts called in when Egghead discovered the intrusion on Thursday. The consultant asked not to be named. http://www.zdnet.com/zdnn/stories/news/0,4586,2668562,00.html - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 23 Dec 2000 21:44:55 -0500 From: "Adam H. Kerman" Subject: Re: desirable numbers (was Early NPA Assignments) On 12/23/00, at 3:23pm -0500, News at Home wrote: Don't top post, please. >There is one problem with Gary's logic.... The country code for the US is >not "1", it is "840" (see ftp://ftp.ripe.net/iso3166-countrycodes/). No final "/" in the URL, as that's a file name. ftp://ftp.ripe.net/iso3166-countrycodes IS03166 is not a standard that specifies country codes used to route voice calls over the PSTN. >1 is used to set the call up in the US as a toll or LD call. Uh, "1" is a dialing prefix before the area code in the dialing plan. In some places, it's used as a toll indicator, but not for the majority of telephone customers. And from outside countries that are members of the NANP, "1" most certainly is used as the country code to dial into telephones in the NANP. But the "1" dialing prefix is not a significant digit for use with inbound international calls and must not be dialed. It is a coincidence that "1" is the same digit used for two different purposes. >Try Afghanistan with a code of "004". Can't be to many phones on Afghanistan >can there? Won't be able to reach Afghanistan in that manner. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 24 Dec 2000 00:17:45 -0500 From: Steve Tihor Subject: Re: desirable numbers (was Early NPA Assignments) News at Home wrote: : There is one problem with Gary's logic.... The country code for the US is : not "1", it is "840" (see ftp://ftp.ripe.net/iso3166-countrycodes/). 1 is : used : to set the call up in the US as a toll or LD call. Try Afghanistan with a : code of "004". Can't be to many phones on Afghanistan can there? : Andy Kauffman I am nto sure what the numbers used there are but they are not the country codes you dial to reach various countries around the world. I assume its some sequential numbering scheme used inthe order that something was assigned. But its not what you dial int he US or elsewhere to reach those countries accept accidentally in any cases. : "Joseph Singer" wrote in message : news:3.0.5.32.20001217040822.0086f2c0@oz.net... :> 16 Dec 2000 13:00:11 -0500 Joel B Levin wrote: :> :> >In <5.0.0.25.0.20001215230144.00a08680@mailbox.verizon.net>, :> > Gary Novosielski wrote: :> >}Although the dial pulses did figure into the assignment of codes : correlated :> >}to traffic, area codes have always been listed in numerical order, and : 201 :> >}did, and still does top the list as the "lowest" number. :> > :> >Not in some old internal telco lists I've seen. :> > :> >}It could be argued that the "lowest" telephone number in the world is :> >}located somewhere in Jersey City, NJ., if you accept the following :> >}definition of "low": :> >} :> >}The lowest Country Code is +1: USA :> >}The lowest US NPA is 201: NJ :> >}The lowest NXX code in 201 is 200: Jersey City :> >} :> >}Presumably, if someone in Jersey City has the number +1.201.200.0001 : that :> >}could be considered to be the lowest number in the world, and a real : vanity :> >}coup! I wonder if he or she knows. :> > :> >Why not 201-200-0000? :> > :> >}"But," I hear you cry, "on a rotary dial, that would be 67 pulses!" : True, :> >}but this is a DTMF age. :> > :> >"Desirable" numbers for businesses are typically numbers ending in 00 or : 000. :> >Except that many years ago, while this seemed to be true in the East (and :> >probably other places I didn't know about), in Mountain Bell territory :> where I :> >lived, the best numbers seemed to be the ones that ended in the most 1's. : So :> >while "ANdrews 8-8000" might have been really easy to remember or write a :> >jingle about, a number like EAst 7-3111 was a lot easier to dial. :> :> I don't think it's an east versus west thing, but more likely the type of :> switching equipment that was originally installed. Most everywhere in :> major cities if the switching equipment was panel or crossbar major :> businesses would have numbers that ended XX00 (hundred) or X000 : (thousand). :> In cities where step-by-step (aka Strowger) large businesses usually : ended :> with the number 1 because in a step office to have "hunting" step-by-step :> offices go from 1 to 0 with 1 being the lowest number. In panel and :> crossbar offices the lowest number is zero. :> -------------------------------------------------------------------------- : - :> Joseph Singer Seattle, Washington USA :> [ICQ pgr] :> +1 206 405 2052 [voice mail] +1 206 493 0706 [FAX] :> -- :> The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail :> messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. : -- : The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail : messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. - -- Stephen Tihor/NYU/251 Mercer St/NY NY 10012/+1 212 998 3052/tihor@nyu.edu - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ End of Telecom Digest V2000 #165 ******************************** Date: 25 Dec 2000 06:15:10 -0500 From: owner-telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org (Telecom Digest) To: telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org Subject: Telecom Digest V2000 #166 Telecom Digest Monday, December 25 2000 Volume 2000 : Number 166 In this issue: Re: Telecom Digest V2000 #164 Call recording on a PC Re: desirable numbers (was Early NPA Assignments) No Cancer? Too Early to Call Don't Tawk and Drive in New York 1+ as a toll indicator (was: desirable numbers) Re: Don't Tawk and Drive in New York Re: 1+ as a toll indicator (was: desirable numbers) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 24 Dec 2000 09:35:31 -0500 From: Nathan Stratton Subject: Re: Telecom Digest V2000 #164 On 23 Dec 2000, Telecom Digest wrote: > Date: 22 Dec 2000 07:39:07 -0500 > From: John Adams > Subject: Re: Finding the right Bellcore CallerID document > > Stephido et. al. > > Depending on how deep you want to go will determine what you want. > If you're interested in procedural (UI) as well as TCAP messaging between > the switches, buy the GR31 document. If you also want to know how Calling > Name (AIN or LIDB lookup) TCAP works, get the 1188 document. > If you're designing CallerID boxes or the equipment in the switch that encodes > the data, get a copy of GR80 for specific info on encoding and timing of the > data signals. You may also want to check out GR-2939 - SPCS/SERVER GENERIC REQUIREMENTS FOR THE NEXT GENERATION OF THE ANALOG DISPLAY SERVICES INTERFACE (ADSI++) ><> Nathan Stratton CTO, Exario Networks, Inc. nathan@robotics.net nathan@exario.net http://www.robotics.net http://www.exario.net - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 24 Dec 2000 09:44:36 -0500 From: world!ecla@uunet.uu.net (alain arnaud) Subject: Call recording on a PC I am looking for a hardware pc card and software to record phone calls automatically. I know of a box called a softcall recorder that hooks up to sound card and the joystick card, but I what I would like would be an internal PC card. I will leave the PC on all the time, with the software running in the background and calls would be recorded automatically on the hard disk. Alternatively is there any software that will do the same with one of the voice modems. Please reply to arnaud@ecla.com. Alain Arnaud - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 24 Dec 2000 14:10:08 -0500 From: Wes Leatherock Subject: Re: desirable numbers (was Early NPA Assignments) On 23 Dec 2000 21:44:55 -0500 Adam H. Kerman wrote: > On 12/23/00, at 3:23pm -0500, News at Home wrote: > >1 is used to set the call up in the US as a toll or LD call. > > Uh, "1" is a dialing prefix before the area code in the dialing plan. In some > places, it's used as a toll indicator, but not for the majority of telephone > customers. Could you elaborate on "not for the majority of telephone customers"? Since telephone numbers in the U.S.A. and Canada are often presented in print and other directories aimed at North American readers as "1+NXX+XXX+XXXX" it would seem that this must be pretty universal...that is, true for a large majority of telephone custombers. Indeed, most 1010XXX IXCs require you to dial the "1" before the telephone number. (Yes, "0+" is used for calls requiring assistance instead of "1+". Some carriers make provision for this some don't.) Generally the "1+" can be (must be) omitted only on local calls, i.e., on calls which are charged either flat rate or message rate or interzone rate according to the local plan, but not as toll calls. This usually occurs in cities with more than one area code (Dallas, Houston and Denver) come to mind immediately) or where the calling party subscribes to a plan providing flat rate service for an extended area, perhaps the entire home LATA. In these cases the call is dialed simply as 10 digits (no leading "1") and you'll likely get an intercept announcement if you precede the number with "1". > And from outside countries that are members of the NANP, "1" most > certainly is used as the country code to dial into telephones in the NANP. But > the "1" dialing prefix is not a significant digit for use with inbound > international calls and must not be dialed. It is a coincidence that "1" is the > same digit used for two different purposes. In many countries the area code is shown with a "0" preceding. This similarly must not be dialed on international calls. Wes Leatherock wleath@sandbox.dynip.com - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 24 Dec 2000 14:15:33 -0500 From: Monty Solomon Subject: No Cancer? Too Early to Call No Cancer? Too Early to Call (Technology 2:00 a.m. PST) http://www.wired.com/news/technology/0,1282,40777,00.html?tw=wn20001221 The New England Journal of Medicine and the Journal of the American Medical Association released the most extensive studies to date showing that cell phones don't cause brain cancer. But the studies only told part of the story. By Elisa Batista. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 24 Dec 2000 14:17:13 -0500 From: Monty Solomon Subject: Don't Tawk and Drive in New York Don't Tawk and Drive in New York (Business Wednesday) http://www.wired.com/news/business/0,1367,40774,00.html?tw=wn20001221 The studies conflict on whether drivers with cellular phones cause a greater number of car accidents, but New York City officials aren't taking any chances. They're about to pass a law banning the use of handheld phones while driving. By Elisa Batista. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 24 Dec 2000 14:36:55 -0500 From: "Adam H. Kerman" Subject: 1+ as a toll indicator (was: desirable numbers) On 12/24/00, at 2:10pm -0500, Wes Leatherock wrote: >On 23 Dec 2000 21:44:55 -0500 Adam H. Kerman wrote: >>On 12/23/00, at 3:23pm -0500, News at Home wrote: >>>1 is used to set the call up in the US as a toll or LD call. >>Uh, "1" is a dialing prefix before the area code in the dialing plan. In some >>places, it's used as a toll indicator, but not for the majority of telephone >>customers. > Could you elaborate on "not for the majority of telephone customers"? >Since telephone numbers in the U.S.A. and Canada are often presented in print >and other directories aimed at North American readers as "1+NXX+XXX+XXXX" it >would seem that this must be pretty universal...that is, true for a large >majority of telephone custombers. Of commonly-implemented dialing plans within the NANP, use of 1+ when the NPA code must be dialed is mandatory. It indicates "area code follows" (if the next digit is N=2-9). Only in some parts of the country is the 1+ prefix used as a toll indicator. From anecdotal discussion in the telecom digest, it appears that more people use dialing plans in which 1+ is not a toll indicator than in places where it is. On the other hand, we haven't had discussion of dialing plans in the NANP outside the continental US, so who knows if toll indication is common elsewhere. > Indeed, most 1010XXX IXCs require you to dial the "1" before >the telephone number. No. Unless you place your call behind a PBX, the dialing plan is implemented by the local switch, not the IXC. In states that do not prohibit IXCs (that would normally be interLATA carriers) from completing intrastate intraLATA calls, the CAC would be used without 1+NPA if the dialing plan required 7 digits be dialed to complete the call to a neighboring exchange. > Generally the "1+" can be (must be) omitted only on local calls, i.e., >on calls which are charged either flat rate or message rate or interzone rate >according to the local plan, but not as toll calls. Come to Chicago, where the toll indicator is the dial tone. According to others on the list, dialing plans in California don't use toll indication. >>And from outside countries that are members of the NANP, "1" most certainly >>is used as the country code to dial into telephones in the NANP. But the "1" >>dialing prefix is not a significant digit for use with inbound international >>calls and must not be dialed. It is a coincidence that "1" is the same digit >>used for two different purposes. > In many countries the area code is shown with a "0" preceding. >This similarly must not be dialed on international calls. It's wrong to include dialing prefixes when writing telephone numbers. It's wrong in the NANP, in which has hundreds if not thousands of dialing plans, and it's wrong in Europe in which some countries have universal dialing plans. As there are numbering plans around the world in which the first digit may be a "0" or "1", how are callers who haven't memorized such things to know? You all cut it out now. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 24 Dec 2000 14:42:08 -0500 From: "Adam H. Kerman" Subject: Re: Don't Tawk and Drive in New York >Don't Tawk and Drive in New York (Business Wednesday) >http://www.wired.com/news/business/0,1367,40774,00.html?tw=wn20001221 >The studies conflict on whether drivers with cellular phones cause a >greater number of car accidents, but New York City officials aren't >taking any chances. They're about to pass a law banning the use of >handheld phones while driving. By Elisa Batista. This is a lie; the studies do NOT conflict on whether drivers using cell phones get distracted and cause accidents. We've discussed this before: Banning hand- held phones is a sop to the manufacturers trying to sell hands-free phones and to the cell phone service providers attempting to prevent phone use from being entirely banned while driving. A few studies suggest that use of hands-free phones while driving is even more distracting than the use of handheld phones. It's common to gesture while talking on the phone; handheld phones prevent that. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 24 Dec 2000 14:59:56 -0500 From: johnl@iecc.com (John R Levine) Subject: Re: 1+ as a toll indicator (was: desirable numbers) > In states that do not prohibit IXCs (that would normally be > interLATA carriers) from completing intrastate intraLATA calls, the > CAC would be used without 1+NPA if the dialing plan required 7 > digits be dialed to complete the call to a neighboring exchange. I can report from experience that's true. I live in a place where LATA lines don't match area code lines, and I can dial intra-LATA local, intra-LATA toll, and inter-LATA toll calls all with seven digits. (In some nearby towns, they can dial inter-LATA local calls with seven digits as well.) I can dial 1010XXX-7D to force calls to a particular IXC if I want to. Dunno if I can force local calls to an IXC, probably not. It appears that most of the US by land area use toll alerting, 1+ before all toll calls, for some definition of toll call, but the places without toll alerting include New York, Chicago, Los Angeles, Philadelpia, and their metro areas so by population more people don't have toll alerting than do. I can also report that this is a major religious issue--people who live in areas with toll alerting are sure that in its absence the world would end (or something close to it) and they'd all be living in cardboard boxes, bankrupted by unintended toll calls. People who live in areas without toll alerting don't have those problems, don't have to memorize what numbers need 1+ in order to make phone calls, and generally don't understand what the big deal about toll alerting is. - -- John R. Levine, IECC, POB 727, Trumansburg NY 14886 +1 607 387 6869 johnl@iecc.com, Village Trustee and Sewer Commissioner, http://iecc.com/johnl, Member, Provisional board, Coalition Against Unsolicited Commercial E-mail - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ End of Telecom Digest V2000 #166 ******************************** Date: 30 Dec 2000 06:15:13 -0500 From: owner-telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org (Telecom Digest) To: telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org Subject: Telecom Digest V2000 #167 Telecom Digest Saturday, December 30 2000 Volume 2000 : Number 167 In this issue: telecom digest test second test Re: Finding Public Domain Music-On-Hold Re: POTS line terminations. Re: Help Wiring Re: POTS line terminations. Re: 1+ as a toll indicator (was: desirable numbers) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 30 Dec 2000 01:39:40 -0500 From: John R Levine Subject: telecom digest test trying to see where the mail is going Regards, John Levine, postmaster@telecom-digest.org Telecom Digest moderator pro tem - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 30 Dec 2000 01:49:39 -0500 From: John R Levine Subject: second test Track down posting bugs Regards, John Levine, postmaster@telecom-digest.org Telecom Digest moderator pro tem - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 30 Dec 2000 01:55:26 -0500 From: Rodeocomm Subject: Re: Finding Public Domain Music-On-Hold I do not think it is unrealistic to either be placed on hold or to do that to callers when the circumstances warrant. This includes such bizarre situations as: - - leaving the desk to find a file - - consulting privately with someone in the office to formulate a response for the caller - - answering a call from my wife Proper application of music-on-hold has nothing to do with either professionalism or adequate staffing. - -- we use revolving CD's of public domain classical Steve Rowland RODEO - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 30 Dec 2000 01:55:56 -0500 From: Henry E Schaffer Subject: Re: POTS line terminations. In article , Roy Smith wrote: >I was reading through cisco's Voice Analog Interface MIB, and came upon >a list of possible line termination impedences, including: >> ... >> ohms600Complex - 600 Ohms + 2.16uF > ... >I'm particularly intrigued by the idea of specifying a capacitance to 3 >significant digits. I would think +/- 20% would be more typical for a >mass produced part. Resistance and capacitance values are nominal - not accurate to the number of significant digits shown. For each % tolerance, there is a series of numbers (roughly twice the tolerance apart) so that every part made can be labelled with one of those values (+/- tolerance). There usually was a color dot or stripe signifying the tolerance level. For capacitance 10% would (IIRC) be considered a tight tolerance, 20% still fairly tight - and for electrolytics the tolerance was much wider. - -- - --henry schaffer hes@ncsu.edu - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 30 Dec 2000 01:56:02 -0500 From: nissansman@my-deja.com Subject: Re: Help Wiring Thanks guys, we followed your red & green advice (suitably festive!) and my friend had the internet up and running for his little sis for Christmas day! Thanks again. In article , Wes Leatherock wrote: > > On 23 Dec 2000 15:23:54 -0500 News at Home wrote: > > I hope this helps.... > > > > The incoming wires are your tip and ring, and they would connect to the red > > and green wires > > in your new block (this is called RJ-11, one line). The other wires are for > > a second line and would be wired to the black > > and yellow to make your block a RJ-14 for use with a 2-line phone wired for > > RJ14. > > Black or yellow may also be used for ground with polarized > ringing on party lines. And for some purposes you might use black > and yellow for the ringer behind a cutoff key. > > > Usually, the tip and ring are not sensitive to polarity, but if they are, > > you will not be able > > to dial out. If this happens, swap the wires (red for green and vis versa) > > This is usually the case only with lines arranged for tone > dialing and then only for older Touch-Tone sets. > > For most purposes you just need to know that red and green > are tip and ring and go to your modem or telephone. > > Wes Leatherock > wleath@sandbox.dynip.com > -- > The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail > messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 30 Dec 2000 01:56:40 -0500 From: Greg Andrews Subject: Re: POTS line terminations. Roy Smith writes: >I was reading through cisco's Voice Analog Interface MIB, and came upon >a list of possible line termination impedences, including: > >> ohms600Real - 600 Ohms. >> ohms600Complex - 600 Ohms + 2.16uF >> ohms900Complex - 900 Ohms + 2.16uF. >> ohmsComplex1 - complex 1; >> 220 Ohms + 820 Ohms || 115nF. >> This impedance is primarily used in >> Germany. >> ohmsComplex2 - complex 2; >> 270 Ohms + 750 Ohms || 150nF. >> This impedance is primarily used in >> United Kingdom and Sweden. > >The last 2 entries seem relatively self-explanitory, but what about the >first three? Where, and under what circumstances, might you expect to >see analog phone lines terminated in those ways? > When simulating the load of an off-hook POTS handset, it would appear. The DC resistance is the first, and the AC impedance would be the second and third. It appears that the Cisco can make itself look like an ordinary handset to a switch. > >I'm particularly intrigued by the idea of specifying a capacitance to 3 >significant digits. I would think +/- 20% would be more typical for a >mass produced part. > 2.16 *is* within 20% of 2.00. IIRC, 2.16 is the more common value in mass-produced capacitors. It's probably the nearest multiple of some constant value in the forumlas for capacitance. -Greg - -- +++++ Greg Andrews +++ gerg@panix.com +++++ I have a map of the United States that's actual size -- Steven Wright - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 30 Dec 2000 02:00:29 -0500 From: Garrett Wollman Subject: Re: 1+ as a toll indicator (was: desirable numbers) In article , Adam H. Kerman wrote: >It's wrong to include dialing prefixes when writing telephone >numbers. There is an International Standard for this: +ccc ddddddddddd (where additional spaces may be added in the `ddd...' block as local convention dictates). The `+' indicates ``whatever your local international dialing prefix is''. I've seen many people add their local dialing prefix in parentheses (e.g., `+44 (0)1232 456 789'). >it's wrong in Europe in which some countries have universal dialing >plans. I believe the EU has standardized (at least certain aspects of) dialing plans throughout its member nations. >As there are numbering plans around the world in which the first >digit may be a "0" or "1", how are callers who haven't memorized such >things to know? Never mind those countries where it is neither of those. In pre-EU Finland, the inter-area prefix was `9', and was almost always written with the area code in parentheses; i.e., `(90) 1911' for the main switchboard operator at the University of Helsinki. With EU harmonisation, both the dialing prefix and Helsinki's area code had to change (since `00' is the international access code); that number is now `(09) 1911', but internationally it is of course `+358 9 1911'. (Can anyone identify a country which has at least one subscriber number shorter than eight digits in E.164 form?) - -GAWollman - -- Garrett A. Wollman | O Siem / We are all family / O Siem / We're all the same wollman@lcs.mit.edu | O Siem / The fires of freedom Opinions not those of| Dance in the burning flame MIT, LCS, CRS, or NSA| - Susan Aglukark and Chad Irschick - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ End of Telecom Digest V2000 #167 ******************************** Date: 31 Dec 2000 06:15:11 -0500 From: owner-telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org (Telecom Digest) To: telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org Subject: Telecom Digest V2000 #168 Telecom Digest Sunday, December 31 2000 Volume 2000 : Number 168 In this issue: Re: 211 code Re: ANI incorrect on cell calls Re: ANI incorrect on cell calls More Caller ID Info Re: More Caller ID Info digital anac? Re: Call recording on a PC Re: More Caller ID Info Re: More Caller ID Info Re: 1+ as a toll indicator (was: desirable numbers) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 30 Dec 2000 09:30:40 -0500 From: Darren Stuart Embry Subject: Re: 211 code [comp.dcom.telecom] On 21 Dec 2000 22:15:23 -0500, Dan Birchall wrote: > Speaking of nationally assigned NOT meaning nationally implemented, > Verizon Hawaii routes 511 to Relay Service too. Feh. We could > *really* use some traffic and transportation info, guys! The Kentucky Public Service Commission has ordered statewide assignment to the Kentucky Transportation Cabinet for 511. See: http://www.psc.state.ky.us/agencies/psc/orders/102000/0000343_30.pdf As of now (2000-12-27) when I dial 511 from my work phone in Louisville (BellSouth territory), I get to hear the phone number I'm calling *from* plus some weird code (ABSLSV075, for example, I think it must be some CO code). 211, 311, 611, 711, and 811 do nothing. In Cincinnati, you can currently dial 211 to reach the ARTIMIS travel information system, the first such service in the United States accessible via dialing n11. - -- Darren Stuart Embry. He can be condescending in a nice way. http://www.webonastick.com/ - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 30 Dec 2000 10:18:43 -0500 From: jeffrey spidle Subject: Re: ANI incorrect on cell calls Paul, if the call you are making is routed through an IXC then it is possible that the IXC that is delivering the call to the destination is not passing the correct calling party number to the destination. I know that this happens alot with the real cheap IXC's or VoIP based carriers. "Paul Wallich" wrote in message news:20001207215409.13772.qmail@xuxa.iecc.com... > In article , Paul Robichaux > wrote: > > >In article , > >sjsobol@NorthShoreTechnologies.net (Steve Sobol) wrote: > > > >>Interesting. Anyone know why ANI apparently doesn't work for cellular > >>calls? > > > >When I try the ANI number with my Powertel (GSM) phone, I get > >901-259-xxxx, even though I'm not in Memphis. Apparently P'tel is > >funneling calls from my cell area (256-337-xxxx) air-to-air from here to > >Memphis, then putting them on the PSTN. I note that when I call FedEx's > >automatic drop-box locator, it always wants to give me locations in > >Memphis instead of where I am, and this is why. > > > >However, I get correct CLID on local calls, and that's most important to > >me (after all, calling 911 and having them think I'm in Memphis would be > >pretty inconvenient). > > This is yet another sign of the fact that (for better or worse) ANI and > CLID, although superficially equivalent, use completely different > implementations and underlying data. > > paul > -- > The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail > messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 30 Dec 2000 13:46:01 -0500 From: Linc Madison Subject: Re: ANI incorrect on cell calls In article <20001230065620.24483.qmail@xuxa.iecc.com>, jeffrey spidle wrote: > Paul, if the call you are making is routed through an IXC then it is > possible that the IXC that is delivering the call to the destination > is not passing the correct calling party number to the destination. > > I know that this happens alot with the real cheap IXC's or VoIP based > carriers. > > > >> Interesting. Anyone know why ANI apparently doesn't work for > > >> cellular calls? > > > > > > When I try the ANI number with my Powertel (GSM) phone, I get > > > 901-259-xxxx, even though I'm not in Memphis. Apparently P'tel is > > > funneling calls from my cell area (256-337-xxxx) air-to-air from > > > here to Memphis, then putting them on the PSTN. I note that when > > > I call FedEx's automatic drop-box locator, it always wants to > > > give me locations in Memphis instead of where I am, and this is > > > why. It has nothing to do with the IXC, but rather with the cellular system. The ANI is that of the cellular company's trunk, which apparently is located somewhere in western Tennessee. The ANI does work, exactly as it is supposed to work, for these calls. It just doesn't return the same result as Caller ID. Anyway, this question was answered in greater detail a few days ago. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 30 Dec 2000 13:48:56 -0500 From: herbsu@netscape.net (Herb Sutherland) Subject: More Caller ID Info A couple of days ago I noticed something you might find interesting. I was at my mom's house and called my number from hers. She has complete caller ID blocking, so as expected, I received private name/private number on my display. Also, as expected, if I dial *82 preceeding my number both her name and number are displayed. However, the surprising thing is that when I dial my toll free number which rings to my number, even without dialing a preceeding *82 it displays her phone number and private name! I have noticed a few other calls coming in where the number is displayed but I get private name for the name. I'll have to ask them if they dialed me on the toll free number! __________________________________________________________________ Get your own FREE, personal Netscape Webmail account today at http://webmail.netscape.com/ - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 30 Dec 2000 14:01:36 -0500 From: eck@panix.com (Mark Eckenwiler) Subject: Re: More Caller ID Info In <6B4ED5CF.7EBAE044.0006300D@netscape.net>, herbsu@netscape.net writes: >A couple of days ago I noticed something you might find interesting. I was >at my mom's house and called my number from hers. She has complete caller ID >blocking, so as expected, I received private name/private number on my >display. Also, as expected, if I dial *82 preceeding my number both her name >and number are displayed. However, the surprising thing is that when I dial >my toll free number which rings to my number, even without dialing a >preceeding *82 it displays her phone number and private name! Um, isn't that just ANI, as with all other callee-pays calls? Doesn't surprise me. - -- Nell met, sewed elk amine: Dino's trough eater. eck@panix.com - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 30 Dec 2000 14:14:25 -0500 From: John Graves Subject: digital anac? Hi I'm just an outside plant tech. I used to have a piece of test equipment called a Techtronics 9925. This meter had the ability to anac a number and the number was printed on the lcd in digital format. These meter's were recalled by I guess our district level, because they had a reputation of being unreliable in their capacitance to distance measurements. I made the mistake of turning mine back in. My questions are:. Where can I get the protocols and source to recreate the "digital ani" ? Are there any open source examples. If not, how do I find the applicable documentation to accomplish this. I have a decent amount of programming experience, At least I know a heck of a lot more than they teach in you average VisBasic course. lol laddie@bellsouth.net - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 30 Dec 2000 14:14:24 -0500 From: John Graves Subject: Re: Call recording on a PC Cheyanne Bitware does it on a normal with a modem.. I have it installed on my computer. http://search.cai.com/www.cai.com/query.html No extra equipment required laddie@bellsouth.net alain arnaud wrote: > I am looking for a hardware pc card and software to record phone calls > automatically. I know of a box called a softcall recorder that hooks up > to sound card and the joystick card, but I what I would like would be an > internal PC card. > > I will leave the PC on all the time, with the software running in the > background and calls would be recorded automatically on the hard disk. > > Alternatively is there any software that will do the same with one of the > voice modems. > > Please reply to arnaud@ecla.com. > > Alain Arnaud > -- > The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail > messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 30 Dec 2000 16:03:33 -0500 From: johnl@iecc.com (John R Levine) Subject: Re: More Caller ID Info >>and number are displayed. However, the surprising thing is that when I dial >>my toll free number which rings to my number, even without dialing a >>preceeding *82 it displays her phone number and private name! > >Um, isn't that just ANI, as with all other callee-pays calls? Doesn't >surprise me. Sort of. Some IXCs fill in blocked CLID from ANI. Dunno whether they're supposed to do that or not. - -- John R. Levine, IECC, POB 727, Trumansburg NY 14886 +1 607 387 6869 johnl@iecc.com, Village Trustee and Sewer Commissioner, http://iecc.com/johnl, Member, Provisional board, Coalition Against Unsolicited Commercial E-mail - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 30 Dec 2000 18:30:21 -0500 From: Chris Williams Subject: Re: More Caller ID Info Herb Sutherland wrote: > > A couple of days ago I noticed something you might find interesting. I was > at my mom's house and called my number from hers. She has complete caller ID > blocking, so as expected, I received private name/private number on my > display. Also, as expected, if I dial *82 preceeding my number both her name > and number are displayed. However, the surprising thing is that when I dial > my toll free number which rings to my number, even without dialing a > preceeding *82 it displays her phone number and private name! I have noticed > a few other calls coming in where the number is displayed but I get private > name for the name. I'll have to ask them if they dialed me on the toll free > number! > You get the info anytime someone dials your 800 number. That's one of the benefits of paying for the call. If you are dialing an 800 number, even if you use *67, you don't have the option of hiding your number. As you know, the calling number is going to show up on the bill for your 800 number anyway. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 30 Dec 2000 23:34:57 -0500 From: david@uow.edu.au (David Wilson) Subject: Re: 1+ as a toll indicator (was: desirable numbers) "Adam H. Kerman" writes: >It's wrong to include dialing prefixes when writing telephone numbers. It's >wrong in the NANP, in which has hundreds if not thousands of dialing plans, and >it's wrong in Europe in which some countries have universal dialing plans. As >there are numbering plans around the world in which the first digit may be a >"0" or "1", how are callers who haven't memorized such things to know? Here in Australia we use a Zero as our area code prefix and it is considered to be part of the area code - except when dialing from overseas when it is omitted. Thus we have to write our phone numbers in two different ways depending on the intended audience: Phone: (02) 4221 xxxx Intl: +61 2 4221 xxxx You North Americans have it easier by having the same country code as your area code prefix. In theory anyone should be able to understand a phone number like: +1 210 234 xxxx I still prefer our system (if your area code is the same as that of the destination you can omit it (hence the () around the area code) but it still works if you include it). - -- David Wilson School of IT & CS, Uni of Wollongong, Australia - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ End of Telecom Digest V2000 #168 ******************************** Date: 1 Jan 2001 06:15:12 -0500 From: owner-telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org (Telecom Digest) To: telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org Subject: Telecom Digest V2000 #169 Telecom Digest Monday, January 1 2001 Volume 2000 : Number 169 In this issue: kill this meme: "Media3 put Peacefire in the line of fire..." Local vs. Long Distance from NPA-NXX? Cheap US->UK residential phone? Re: kill this meme: "Media3 put Peacefire in the line of fire..." Re: kill this meme: "Media3 put Peacefire in the line of fire..." Re: 1+ as a toll indicator Re: kill this meme: "Media3 put Peacefire in the line of fire..." Re: n11 codes Re: Finding Public Domain Music-On-Hold Re: n11 codes Re: Finding Public Domain Music-On-Hold ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 31 Dec 2000 07:36:11 -0500 From: Bennett Haselton Subject: kill this meme: "Media3 put Peacefire in the line of fire..." [I am sending this to editor@telecom-digest.org to get it through to comp.dcom.telecom. Please copy bennett@peacefire.org on any replies that are meant for me.] There is a meme going around saying that Peacefire's hosting provider, Media3, intentionally put us in an IP address block that had nothing else in it but sites selling bulk email software. Some commentators have likened this to Iraq keeping women and children inside military bases to stop the U.N. from bombing them. Jeez. Some of the people forwarding this meme undoubtedly mean well, and I respect their commitment to fighting spam, but the facts making the rounds are incorrect. Here is what really happened: The class C we're in that AboveNet was blocking their customers from accessing until recently (yes, AboveNet really was blocking their customers from accessing our Web site, not just incoming email), is 209.211.253.*. There are about 150 active sites in that range -- you can get to them all by typing 209.211.253.1, 209.211.253.2, 209.211.253.3, etc. Only 10 of those sites were listed in the evidence file for that netblock. It is completely false that Media3 put us on a machine that has "nothing else on it but spamware sites". And Media3 does *not* rotate IP addresses within a given class C, so AboveNet blocking Peacefire had nothing to do with technical necessity -- it's simply to strengthen the Media3 "boycott" (which AboveNet was participating in, by using the MAPS RBL), by hitting innocent bystanders as well. Now there's nothing wrong with boycotts in general, but I think this one doesn't have much merit, for two reasons. First of all, Media3 does not tolerate, and never has tolerated, customers sending spam. AboveNet, by using the RBL, was targeting Media3 because Media3 host sites which sell bulk email software. I think that holding software authors responsible for the actions of people who *use* the software is a very bad principle. Breaking into someone's network is a much greater theft of service than spamming them, but I've never heard of anyone calling for a boycott of ISP's that host sites where you can download network breakin software. Anyway, fine -- AboveNet and MAPS are entitled to their opinion about who is responsible for the spam problem. But my more important objection is about the way they are conducting their "boycott", by forcing their customers into it without telling them. According to my own survey of users connecting to our site from AboveNet IP addresses, not a single one of them knew that AboveNet was censoring their Internet connection. Most echoed the sentiments of one user who said, "I pay for a pipe and I don't expect this kind of monkey business." I also called AboveNet on 12/10 and talked to five different people in sales and tech support, who all said the same thing: AboveNet does not block their customers from accessing *any* Web sites. (AboveNet's policy says that they use the RBL to filter incoming email, not Web access.) And anyway, AboveNet stopped blocking their customers' access to Web sites on the same day that the story became public. That seems like a tacit admission that their policy of blocking customers' Web access was inexcusable. -Bennett bennett@peacefire.org http://www.peacefire.org (425) 649 9024 - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 31 Dec 2000 08:36:38 -0500 From: "Richard M. Sander" Subject: Local vs. Long Distance from NPA-NXX? Short of calling the LEC, does anyone know of any public- domain resource(s) that can determine, given two NPA-NNX's, whether a call between the two would be local, intraLATA or long distance? Thanks in advance! - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 31 Dec 2000 08:54:42 -0500 From: pishedme@bigfoot.com Subject: Cheap US->UK residential phone? Don't know which newsgroup to address this question to, there doesn't seem to be a 'us.telecom' newsgroup. The cheapest UK->US providers are about 3p or 4p a minute, eg Swiftcall or Onetel. What cheap reliable US->UK providers would you recommend? The regular ones like Sprint and MCI are around 10c/min but I notice smaller companies doing 6c/min for residential. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 31 Dec 2000 10:01:49 -0500 From: sjsobol@NorthShoreTechnologies.net (Steve Sobol) Subject: Re: kill this meme: "Media3 put Peacefire in the line of fire..." >From 'Bennett Haselton': >There is a meme going around saying that Peacefire's hosting provider, >Media3, intentionally put us in an IP address block that had nothing else >in it but sites selling bulk email software. >Now there's nothing wrong with boycotts in general, but I think this one >doesn't have much merit, for two reasons. First of all, Media3 does not >tolerate, and never has tolerated, customers sending spam. AboveNet, by >using the RBL, was targeting Media3 because Media3 host sites which sell >bulk email software. >Anyway, fine -- AboveNet and MAPS are entitled to their opinion about who >is responsible for the spam problem. But my more important objection is >about the way they are conducting their "boycott", by forcing their >customers into it without telling them. MAPS doesn't allow BGP use of the RBL (which Abovenet uses) if the ISP using the BGP feed doesn't let its customers know about the use of the BGP feed. And AboveNet says at http://www.above.net/anti-spam.html that they use the RBL. I agree that they could be a little more clear about the ramifications of using it, but they do say they use it. >According to my own survey of >users connecting to our site from AboveNet IP addresses, not a single one >of them knew that AboveNet was censoring their Internet connection. Do they use AboveNet directly, or an ISP downstream from AboveNet? It's not AboveNet's responsibility to contact their customers' customers. >echoed the sentiments of one user who said, "I pay for a pipe and I don't >expect this kind of monkey business." I also called AboveNet on 12/10 and >talked to five different people in sales and tech support, who all said the >same thing: AboveNet does not block their customers from accessing *any* >Web sites. (AboveNet's policy says that they use the RBL to filter >incoming email, not Web access.) Point me to the place where they say specifically that... - -- Steve Sobol, BOFH, President 888.480.4NET 866.DSL.EXPRESS 216.619.2NET North Shore Technologies Corporation http://NorthShoreTechnologies.net JustTheNet/JustTheNet EXPRESS DSL (ISP Services) http://JustThe.net mailto:sjsobol@NorthShoreTechnologies.net Proud resident of Cleveland, OH - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 31 Dec 2000 10:32:02 -0500 From: Bennett Haselton Subject: Re: kill this meme: "Media3 put Peacefire in the line of fire..." >From 'Bennett Haselton': >>Anyway, fine -- AboveNet and MAPS are entitled to their opinion about who >>is responsible for the spam problem. But my more important objection is >>about the way they are conducting their "boycott", by forcing their >>customers into it without telling them. > >MAPS doesn't allow BGP use of the RBL (which Abovenet uses) if the ISP >using the BGP feed doesn't let its customers know about the use of the BGP >feed. And AboveNet says at http://www.above.net/anti-spam.html that they >use the RBL. I agree that they could be a little more clear about the >ramifications of using it, but they do say they use it. As I wrote in my last post, "AboveNet's policy says that they use the RBL to filter incoming email, not Web access." AboveNet's page says, "The MAPS RBL is used by AboveNet to help reduce the amount of spam received by customers." I don't think anyone who reads that statement would take it to mean that AboveNet was blocking customers' Web access (especially since blocking Web access does not "reduce the amount of spam received by customers"). Unless they specifically say that they're blocking customers' Web access, then they haven't disclosed how they're using the RBL. As it is, people accused me of making up these accusations at first, because they couldn't believe that a backbone provider would be blocking their customers' Web surfing. Besides, AboveNet stopped blocking customers' Web access the instant the story became public. This seems like an admission that what they were doing was inexcusable. >>echoed the sentiments of one user who said, "I pay for a pipe and I don't >>expect this kind of monkey business." I also called AboveNet on 12/10 and >>talked to five different people in sales and tech support, who all said the >>same thing: AboveNet does not block their customers from accessing *any* >>Web sites. (AboveNet's policy says that they use the RBL to filter >>incoming email, not Web access.) > >Point me to the place where they say specifically that... This is what their salespeople and technical support staff told me, when I called them pretending to be a potential customer who didn't know what AboveNet's policies were. (By that time, I knew -- I was just trying to find out what they were telling customers and the public.) -Bennett bennett@peacefire.org http://www.peacefire.org (425) 649 9024 - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 31 Dec 2000 13:25:13 -0500 From: "Adam H. Kerman" Subject: Re: 1+ as a toll indicator On 12/30/00, at 11:34pm -0500, David Wilson wrote: >"Adam H. Kerman" writes: >>It's wrong to include dialing prefixes when writing telephone numbers. It's >>wrong in the NANP, in which has hundreds if not thousands of dialing plans, >>and it's wrong in Europe in which some countries have universal dialing >>plans. As there are numbering plans around the world in which the first >>digit may be a "0" or "1", how are callers who haven't memorized such >>things to know? >Here in Australia we use a Zero as our area code prefix and it is considered >to be part of the area code - except when dialing from overseas when it >is omitted. Thus we have to write our phone numbers in two different ways >depending on the intended audience: >Phone: (02) 4221 xxxx >Intl: +61 2 4221 xxxx Which is why I say your way of writing phone numbers for domestic use is confusing. Does Australia have a nationwide dialing plan? Then it should be assumed that domestic callers know to use the "0" dialing prefix before the area code. Your numbers should be written 2 4221 xxxx. Then that way, neither domestic nor internation callers are confused. Those of us outside Australia are clever enough to look up the country code if we don't know it, but it is too much to expect us to know if the leading 0 is a significant digit or a domestic dialing prefix. >You North Americans have it easier by having the same country code as your >area code prefix. Ah, but there is no universal NANP dialing plan. Use of the "1" dialing prefix before the area code is not mandatory in all dialing plans, or before all area codes in some dialing plans. 1 NPA NXX-XXXX SHOULD be a universal method of dialing in any dialing plan, but it is not. And people dialing behind PBXs, of course, have to follow internal dialing plans. No, I do not agree that North Americans should write phone number including the dialing prefix, ever. In your example, (02), both the dialing prefix and area code are written within the parenthesis. But someone in the NANP would see the (02) as the area code. A common method of writing phone numbers is (210) 234-xxxx. Note the hyphen. If we were writing it with the dialing prefix, we might write 1 (210) 234-xxxx. >In theory anyone should be able to understand a phone number like: > +1 210 234 xxxx For those people who recognize that as the international standard, yes. I think it is unfortunate that North Americans could see the +1 as a dialing prefix rather than a country code. >I still prefer our system (if your area code is the same as that of the >destination you can omit it (hence the () around the area code) but it still >works if you include it). Many NANP dialing plans continue to allow that. Personally, I'd prefer mandatory 10 digit dialing and elimination of the dialing prefix for station- to-station calls. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 31 Dec 2000 13:43:18 -0500 From: Steve Linford Subject: Re: kill this meme: "Media3 put Peacefire in the line of fire..." In article <3.0.6.32.20001231043933.00a0c9b0@206.81.192.1>, Bennett Haselton wrote: > [I am sending this to editor@telecom-digest.org to get it through > to comp.dcom.telecom. Please copy bennett@peacefire.org on any > replies that are meant for me.] > > There is a meme going around saying that Peacefire's hosting > provider, Media3, intentionally put us in an IP address block that > had nothing else in it but sites selling bulk email software. Some > commentators have likened this to Iraq keeping women and children > inside military bases to stop the U.N. from bombing them. Jeez. > > Some of the people forwarding this meme undoubtedly mean well, and > I respect their commitment to fighting spam, but the facts making > the rounds are incorrect. Here is what really happened: No Bennett, cut the crap. The memo you're refering to (and which you don't want people to believe as you'd like them instead to believe your version of the story, as given to you by Joe Hayes the owner of Media3), was written by me and I never said your block "had nothing else in it but sites selling bulk email software". I said your block has 20 of the worst spam sites on the Internet in it. The class C peacefire.org is sitting in (and which Media3 put you in when much of it had _already_ been on the RBL for months) is the home of a huge amount of the Internet's spam. I said Media3 has been the top Spam Support Service in the Spamhaus.org "Internet's worst Spamhausen" list for 8 months (http://www.spamhaus.org/statistics-hosts.lasso). Even though you know this you feed peacefire.org readers more crap by saying the 20 spam sites in your block "only sell spamming software" and don't spam, so those bad MAPS people shouldn't block the poor little spammers who are only earning a crust by selling harmless spamming software... Who told you this? Joe Hayes the owner of Media3? The same Media3 that has been the Internet's worst spam host for 8 months? Get real, the spamhausen in your block are all hard-line stealth spamming outfits and include 'Stealth Bulk ISPs' and 'Bullet-proof Bulk hosts' advertising "Spam all you want without being shut down" (http://www.bulk-isp.com/), and spamware sites selling 'stealth' spamware including 'DesktopServer' and 'StealthMassMailer' both specifically designed and marketed for spamming and which claim to cloak the spammers dial-ups and insert fake mail headers into spams to thwart complaints. Specifically, two of the Internet's most notorious hard-line spam operations are hosted by Media3 in the same class C as peacefire.org They include: [1] SAMCO in block 209.211.253.0, operated by spammers Bob Galena and Mike Constantin, sells stealth spamware and operates a 'stealth bulk ISP' service, i.e: a service which spammers connect to from their dial-ups to bulk out through and which strips their dial-up IPs off and relays the spam out anonymously through open servers around the net. The SAMCO spam outfit has been thrown off just about every major US provider for the last 2 years. [2] GHI/BulkISP (Global Hosting Institute), operated by a long time spammer known as Sam Al (Saied Alzalzalah) and hosted by Media3 also in block 209.211.253.0 under numerous aliases including bulkisp.com, bulkhost.net, bulk-isp.net, bulkispcorp.net, bulk-isp.com, bulkisp.nu, bulkisp.net, bulkispcorp.com, all of which sell 'bullet-proof spamming services' with the promise "Bulletproof web space is used so you can spam without the worries of being shut down". GHI had been thrown off 5 major ISPs before moving to Media3. You still believe Joe Hayes when he tells you he just hosts poor little spammers selling harmless spamming software? > Now there's nothing wrong with boycotts in general, but I think > this one doesn't have much merit, for two reasons. First of all, > Media3 does not tolerate, and never has tolerated, customers > sending spam. We're talking _major_ spamhausen, of course they send spam. These are spamhausen we've been tracking for over 2 years. Just to give you an idea, this is the termination history of just one of the spamhausen sitting right now in your class C: extractor-pro.com terminated on Dec 31 1999 (directcon.net) bulkemailpeople.com terminated on Dec 31 1999 (directcon.net) e-mailmagnet.com terminated on Dec 31 1999 (directcon.net) stealthmassmailer.com terminated on Dec 31 1999 (directcon.net) marketingmasters.com terminated on Jan 8 2000 (ticnet.com) desktopserver98.com terminated on Jan 8 2000 (ticnet.com) massmailer.com terminated on Jan 22 2000 (ticnet.com) desktopserver98.com terminated on Sep 12 2000 (intelenet.net) marketingmasters.com terminated on Sep 12 2000 (intelenet.net) e-mailblaster.com terminated on Sep 12 2000 (intelenet.net) e-mailmagnet.com terminated on Mar 14 2000 (sesqui.net) bulkemailpeople.com terminated on Feb 19 2000 (granitecanyon.com) extractor-pro.com terminated on Mar 14 2000 (sesqui.net) e-mailblaster.com terminated on Feb 19 2000 (sesqui.net) bulkemailpeople.com terminated on Mar 14 2000 (sesqui.net) e-mailblaster.com terminated on Apr 6 2000 (zyan.com) desktopserver98.com terminated on Apr 6 2000 (zyan.com) stealthmassmailer.com terminated on Mar 14 2000 (sesqui.net) marketingmasters.com terminated on Apr 6 2000 (zyan.com) tornadoblaster.com terminated on Mar 14 2000 (sesqui.net) ontarget98.com terminated on Mar 14 2000 (sesqui.net) listsorcerer.com terminated on Mar 14 2000 (sesqui.net) stealthmassmailer.com terminated on Apr 6 2000 (qwest.net) e-mailmagnet.com terminated on Apr 6 2000 (qwest.net) extractor-pro.com terminated on Apr 6 2000 (qwest.net) bulkemailpeople.com terminated on Apr 6 2000 (qwest.net) tornadoblaster.com terminated on Apr 6 2000 (qwest.net) ontarget98.com terminated on Apr 6 2000 (qwest.net) listsorcerer.com terminated on Apr 6 2000 (qwest.net) stealthmassmailer.com terminated on Apr 14 2000 (relaypoint.net) e-mailmagnet.com terminated on Apr 14 2000 (relaypoint.net) extractor-pro.com terminated on Apr 14 2000 (relaypoint.net) bulkemailpeople.com terminated on Apr 14 2000 (relaypoint.net) tornadoblaster.com terminated on Apr 14 2000 (relaypoint.net) ontarget98.com terminated on Apr 14 2000 (relaypoint.net) listsorcerer.com terminated on Apr 14 2000 (relaypoint.net) marketingmasters.com terminated on Jul 31 2000 (zyan.com) e-mailmagnet.com terminated on Jul 31 2000 (zyan.com) extractor-pro.com terminated on Jul 31 2000 (zyan.com) ontarget98.com terminated on Jul 31 2000 (zyan.com) stealthmassmailer.com terminated on Jul 31 2000 (zyan.com) tornadoblaster.com terminated on Jul 31 2000 (zyan.com) e-mailmagnet.com terminated on Sep 12 2000 (intelenet.net) tornadoblaster.com terminated on Sep 12 2000 (intelenet.net) bulkemailpeople.com LIVE in NETBLK-QWEST-209-211-248 (media3.net) desktopserver98.com LIVE in NETBLK-QWEST-209-211-248 (media3.net) e-mailblaster.com LIVE in NETBLK-QWEST-209-211-248 (media3.net) extractor-pro98.com LIVE in NETBLK-QWEST-209-211-248 (media3.net) massmailer.com LIVE in NETBLK-QWEST-209-211-248 (media3.net) listsorcerer.com LIVE in NETBLK-UU-63-74-120 (media3.net) You can review the spam services currently hosted by Media3 in the same block as www.peacefire.org at the following URLs, note that www.peacefire.org is at 209.211.253.169, slap-bang in the middle of this lot of spamhausen: IP Spam Service Site -------------- ----------------- 209.211.253.68 http://www.extractor-pro98.com/ 209.211.253.69 http://www.list-sorcerer.com 209.211.253.70 http://www.massmailer.com 209.211.253.71 http://www.bulkemailpeople.com 209.211.253.72 http://www.desktopserver98.com/ 209.211.253.73 http://www.e-mailblaster.com 209.211.253.74 http://www.marketingmasters.com/bulkserv.htm 209.211.253.79 http://www.4microsoft2000.com/index1.html 209.211.253.84 http://www.bulkers.net 209.211.253.88 http://www.bulkbarn.com/ 209.211.253.89 http://www.web-promotions.com/ 209.211.253.126 http://www.bulkisp.com/ 209.211.253.139 http://www.firstlinesoft.com/ www.peacefire.org = 209.211.253.169 209.211.253.248 http://www.bulkhost.net 209.211.253.248 http://www.bulk-isp.net 209.211.253.248 http://www.bulkispcorp.net 209.211.253.248 http://www.bulk-isp.com 209.211.253.248 http://www.bulkisp.nu 209.211.253.248 http://www.bulkisp.net 209.211.253.248 http://www.bulkispcorp.com What you need to do Bennett, instead of whining about being 'censored' because you're sitting in the middle of a spam nest, is tell Media3 to move your site out of that spamhole, you should _demand_ they move you out. And while you're at it, have you considered telling Media3 what you think of the spam nest you're sitting in? Have you considered _complaining_ to Media3 about putting you in with the Internet's worst gang of spammers? - -- Steve Linford The Spamhaus Project http://www.spamhaus.org - -- Steve Linford - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 31 Dec 2000 14:19:50 -0500 From: Neal McLain Subject: Re: n11 codes Continuing with the thread about anomalous n11 codes: In Wisconsin, the Richland-Grant Telephone Cooperative uses 511 for its Business Office number in Blue River. Richland-Grant also operates the cable television system in Blue River. This is, to my knowledge, the only place in the country where you can reach your local Cable TV system's office by dialing an n11 number. Neal McLain nmclain@compuserve.com - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 31 Dec 2000 16:53:10 -0500 From: Roy Subject: Re: Finding Public Domain Music-On-Hold I would like to point out that there is almost no such things as "public domain classical CDs". While the original composition may not be copyrighted, the recording of the performance of the music is. There is enough "On Hold" music out there for sale as well as musicians willing to have their work published that finding music isn't hard. Rodeocomm wrote: > I do not think it is unrealistic to either be placed on hold or to do that to > callers when the circumstances warrant. This includes such bizarre situations > as: > > - leaving the desk to find a file > - consulting privately with someone in the > office to formulate a response for the > caller > - answering a call from my wife > > Proper application of music-on-hold has nothing to do with either > professionalism or adequate staffing. > > -- we use revolving CD's of public domain classical > > Steve Rowland > RODEO > -- > The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail > messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 31 Dec 2000 17:58:27 -0500 From: "Adam H. Kerman" Subject: Re: n11 codes On 12/31/00, at 2:19pm -0500, Neal McLain wrote: >In Wisconsin, the Richland-Grant Telephone Cooperative >uses 511 for its Business Office number in Blue River. >Richland-Grant also operates the cable television system >in Blue River. >This is, to my knowledge, the only place in the country >where you can reach your local Cable TV system's office >by dialing an n11 number. Did you say "reach"? I would gladly dial 11 digits if I knew I could reach the call center on a regular basis without being in the call queue indefinitely. Wow; someone who can reach his cable tv system; what a concept! - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 31 Dec 2000 18:55:11 -0500 From: hollaar@faith.cs.utah.edu (Lee Hollaar) Subject: Re: Finding Public Domain Music-On-Hold In article <3A4FAAB9.8B639C01@garlic.com> Roy writes: > > >I would like to point out that there is almost no such things as "public domain >classical CDs". While the original composition may not be copyrighted, the >recording of the performance of the music is. But the public performance right in copyright does not apply to sound recordings. It only applies to "literary, musical, dramatic, and choreographic works, pantominmes, and motion pictures and other audiovisual works." See 17 USC 106(5). - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ End of Telecom Digest V2000 #169 ******************************** Date: 1 Jan 2001 20:52:55 -0500 From: owner-telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org (Telecom Digest) To: telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org Subject: Telecom Digest V2000 #170 Telecom Digest Monday, January 1 2001 Volume 2000 : Number 170 In this issue: re: kill this meme: "Media3 put Peacefire in the line of fire..." re: kill this meme: "Media3 put Peacefire in the line of fire..." Re: BLOCK: Media3, peacefire.org Re: BLOCK: Media3, peacefire.org related copyright issue, was: Re: Finding Public Domain MOH MAPS alters back-dated press release; withdraws Media3 accusations Re: More Caller ID Info Re: Local vs. Long Distance from NPA-NXX? Re: Cheap US->UK residential phone? Re: More Caller ID Info Re: Local vs. Long Distance from NPA-NXX? Re: kill this meme: "Media3 put Peacefire in the line of fire..." Re: kill this meme: "Media3 put Peacefire in the line of fire..." US Constitution and misreadings, was: Re: BLOCK: Media3, peacefire.org Re: BLOCK: Media3, peacefire.org Re: Local vs. Long Distance from NPA-NXX? ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 1 Jan 2001 12:17:08 -0500 From: Dave Anderson Subject: re: kill this meme: "Media3 put Peacefire in the line of fire..." On 31 Dec 2000 07:36:11 -0500, Bennett Haselton wrote: >There is a meme going around saying that Peacefire's hosting provider, >Media3, intentionally put us in an IP address block that had nothing else >in it but sites selling bulk email software. Some commentators have >likened this to Iraq keeping women and children inside military bases to >stop the U.N. from bombing them. Jeez. >Some of the people forwarding this meme undoubtedly mean well, and I >respect their commitment to fighting spam, but the facts making the rounds >are incorrect. Here is what really happened: I've been aware of Peacefire for a while and, without having carefully researched the issues, felt that it was doing an important job; we certainly need people willing to research what censorware is actually doing and publish their results. However, the utility of this activity is critically dependent on the quality of the research and the perceived trustworthyness of the people involved. In the case at hand (based on my own knowledge as someone who hasn't been actively involved in spam-fighting but has been paying attention to it for the past several years) your research has been incredibly shoddy. This forces me to question whether your other research is of any better quality. For me, and probably for a lot of other people, you've done major damange to Peacefire's credibility. Dave - -- Dave Anderson - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 1 Jan 2001 12:18:17 -0500 From: Bennett Haselton Subject: re: kill this meme: "Media3 put Peacefire in the line of fire..." Do you have anything specific? At 12:00 PM 1/1/01 EST, Dave Anderson wrote: >On 31 Dec 2000 07:36:11 -0500, > Bennett Haselton wrote: > >>There is a meme going around saying that Peacefire's hosting provider, >>Media3, intentionally put us in an IP address block that had nothing else >>in it but sites selling bulk email software. Some commentators have >>likened this to Iraq keeping women and children inside military bases to >>stop the U.N. from bombing them. Jeez. > >>Some of the people forwarding this meme undoubtedly mean well, and I >>respect their commitment to fighting spam, but the facts making the rounds >>are incorrect. Here is what really happened: > >I've been aware of Peacefire for a while and, without having carefully >researched the issues, felt that it was doing an important job; we >certainly need people willing to research what censorware is actually doing >and publish their results. However, the utility of this activity is >critically dependent on the quality of the research and the perceived >trustworthyness of the people involved. > >In the case at hand (based on my own knowledge as someone who hasn't been >actively involved in spam-fighting but has been paying attention to it for >the past several years) your research has been incredibly shoddy. This >forces me to question whether your other research is of any better quality. >For me, and probably for a lot of other people, you've done major damange >to Peacefire's credibility. > > Dave > >-- >Dave Anderson > > > > bennett@peacefire.org http://www.peacefire.org (425) 649 9024 - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 1 Jan 2001 14:05:12 -0500 From: Bennett Haselton Subject: Re: BLOCK: Media3, peacefire.org At 06:53 PM 12/31/00 +0000, Steve Linford wrote: [massive delete] >You can review the spam services currently hosted by Media3 in the >same block as www.peacefire.org at the following URLs, note that >www.peacefire.org is at 209.211.253.169, slap-bang in the middle of >this lot of spamhausen: [massive delete] The "evidence file" for Media3 had sites listed for selling mass email software. When one Peacefire supporter asked MAPS why Media3 was listed, they said it was for sites that sold mass email software. (The only time that MAPS accused Media3 of anything else, they had to retract that accusation later.) It's hard to argue that the "evidence" of spam discussed on UseNet, would have been sufficient *by itself* to get Media3 on the RBL. I think this is pretty much agreed on. If individuals want to boycott Media3 for that reason, fine. What I think is dishonest about the RBL "boycott" is that most individuals whose email or Web access is blocked, apparently don't even realize it. Since Peacefire.org started surveying users who connect to our Web site from an AboveNet-controlled IP address, not a single one of them apparently knew that AboveNet was blocking their Internet access. AboveNet says that they "use the RBL to protect customers from spam" -- they don't say that they block customers from accessing those Web sites, which obviously has no effect on the amount of spam they get. And even when users are aware that their incoming email is filtered by the RBL, most of them seem to believe that the purpose of doing this is to reduce the amount of spam that they get while letting non-spam emails through. They aren't aware that sites are on the RBL even when MAPS knows those sites haven't actually sent spam, but are simply hosted by an ISP which is the target of an economic boycott. Since large numbers of people have been co-opted into these "boycotts" without realizing it, whose fault is that? I think partly MAPS, for claiming in multiple places on their Web site that the RBL is a list of "spammers", "people who send spam", "sites that do not follow responsible emailing practices", etc., and generally giving the impression that the purpose of using the RBL is to reduce the amount of spam you get, without mentioning that other sites are on the RBL purely for boycott purposes. (Even though the criteria for the RBL are given in one place on MAPS's site, the rest of the site still has less-than-accurate statements about what is on the RBL.) And partly companies like AboveNet that are not clear about how they use it (blocking Web access without informing customers is really pretty low). And if a downstream ISP knows that AboveNet blocks Web sites, but then re-sells Internet access to the public without telling them this, then that downstream ISP is partly responsible as well. There are lots of links in the chain from MAPS to an end user, but if an end user thinks they're buying uncensored Internet access and they're blocked from Web sites on the RBL, then someone, somewhere in the chain, lied to the person on the next link down from them. God knows I am in favor of fighting spam. For three months last summer I reported every piece of spam I got, to the ISP hosting the Web site, the ISP hosting the name server, and (if applicable) the ISP hosting the sender account. (I lost interest when my attempts to get a spammer's site shut down failed, for the 50th time in a row.) And I would be all in favor of an honestly run boycott against sites that support spam. It is the sad truth that I don't think an honest boycott would work. Most users are much too apathetic to care. They would never agree voluntarily to participate in any boycott that would cause them to miss out on legitimate emails and lose business contacts, without having any effect on the amount of spam they received. But that's still no excuse for running a boycott dishonestly. And even though there are a lot of the links in the chain from MAPS down to an end user (the backbone, the downstream ISP, and all the salespeople in between), the simple fact is that if an end user buys "Internet access", and their email or Web access is blocked without their knowledge, then somebody in the chain lied to someone at the next link down from them. You can't have everyone tell the truth and still get the RBL boycott to work on the scale that it's implemented now. There is a nuanced debate about whether sites which sell software like List Sorcerer (not to mention sites like Peacefire which are not doing anything except being *hosted* on the same ISP) are "responsible" for the spam problem, but I don't even really think that matters. If individuals want to boycott Peacefire voluntarily because we're hosted on Media3, that's up to them. But my own survey of AboveNet users indicated that none of them knew their Internet access was being blocked without their permission. The First Amendment does not protect "speech" that consists of false statements made by a company about a product that they're selling, whether that product is (1) a list of sites, or (2) Internet access that is secretly filtered according to that list. It protects the list itself, not necessarily all uses of it. -Bennett bennett@peacefire.org http://www.peacefire.org (425) 649 9024 - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 1 Jan 2001 15:01:34 -0500 From: sjsobol@NorthShoreTechnologies.net (Steve Sobol) Subject: Re: BLOCK: Media3, peacefire.org [ xposted to news.admin.net-abuse.email. NANAE folks: Mr. Haselton and I have engaged in discussion about the whole Media3/Peacefire issue via e-mail. This particular discussion is xposted from comp.dcom.telecom and I think it raises some interesting issues. ] >From 'Bennett Haselton': >claiming in multiple places on their Web site that the RBL is a list of >"spammers", "people who send spam", "sites that do not follow responsible >emailing practices", etc., Included in the 'etc.' is Spam Support Services, which includes selling of spamware. MAPS is *not* ambiguous about this. http://mail-abuse.org/rbl/candidacy.html#ByAssociation >what is on the RBL.) And partly companies like AboveNet that are not clear >about how they use it (blocking Web access without informing customers is >really pretty low). And if a downstream ISP knows that AboveNet blocks Web >sites, but then re-sells Internet access to the public without telling them >this, then that downstream ISP is partly responsible as well. I recall seeing somewhere on MAPS's site that they require users of the RBL to indicate to customers and their downstreams that they *are* using the RBL. But I can't find any indication of that on their web site, so I'm CC'ing this post to a couple friends who work there. I could be wrong, and maybe it's just because I'm still hung over from New Year's Eve -- but I could swear it's there. :) >It is the sad truth that I don't think an honest boycott would work. Most >users are much too apathetic to care. They would never agree voluntarily >to participate in any boycott that would cause them to miss out on >legitimate emails and lose business contacts, without having any effect on >the amount of spam they received. ...which is why MAPS requires documentation of RBL candidacy and will not act on a whim. There are some people who think they move too slowly, in fact - - I say moving too slowly is much better than the alternative, which will result in "false positives". >But that's still no excuse for running a boycott dishonestly. The question issue here is whether that is actually happening. >There is a nuanced debate about whether sites which sell software like List >Sorcerer (not to mention sites like Peacefire which are not doing anything >except being *hosted* on the same ISP) are "responsible" for the spam >problem Bennett, it's been pointed out to you that there are several such sites, where the company putting up the site exists solely to send spam. Samco is the one I can think of, and there's one other, both of which were mentioned yesterday on Spam-L. Extractor Pro is another one, and Extractor Pro has never been used for any legitimate purpose, AFAIK. >but I don't even really think that matters. Of course it matters. It's not a tangential topic. MAPS says the reason for the RBL listing of the Class C in which your site sits is because there are several other sites that support spam services. If that's not true, MAPS shouldn't list the Class C. But I, for one, believe it to be true. >If individuals want >to boycott Peacefire voluntarily because we're hosted on Media3, that's up >to them. But my own survey of AboveNet users indicated that none of them >knew their Internet access was being blocked without their permission. You said exactly the same thing to me in one of our discussions in private e-mail. I pointed out that that may or may not be AboveNet's fault. I then asked whether said users were direct customers of AboveNet or not. It's very likely many (most?) of them are users of ISPs downstream, in which case there is no obligation for AboveNet to tell those particular people that they're using the RBL. They need to tell the ISPs connecting directly to them, and the ISPs need to tell the end-users. While I appreciate your efforts to discuss this topic with me in a rational, calm manner, and I wish to do the same for you, I do think that you avoided directly answering this question when I initially posed it to you. Again, as I mentioned before, this does not imply that I think you're right or wrong, but the phrase "AboveNet users" is ambiguous and (I think) intentionally vague. >The First Amendment does not protect "speech" that consists of false >statements made by a company about a product that they're selling, whether >that product is (1) a list of sites, or (2) Internet access that is >secretly filtered according to that list. It protects the list itself, not >necessarily all uses of it. I agree; however, what we are dealing with at this point is not necessarily a censorship issue, but rather one of contract law. - -- Steve Sobol, BOFH, President 888.480.4NET 866.DSL.EXPRESS 216.619.2NET North Shore Technologies Corporation http://NorthShoreTechnologies.net JustTheNet/JustTheNet EXPRESS DSL (ISP Services) http://JustThe.net mailto:sjsobol@NorthShoreTechnologies.net Proud resident of Cleveland, OH - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 1 Jan 2001 15:10:31 -0500 From: dannyb@panix.com (danny burstein) Subject: related copyright issue, was: Re: Finding Public Domain MOH In <92oh05$e2q$1@coward.ks.cc.utah.edu> hollaar@faith.cs.utah.edu (Lee Hollaar) writes: >In article <3A4FAAB9.8B639C01@garlic.com> Roy writes: >> >>I would like to point out that there is almost no such things as >>"public domain classical CDs". While the original composition may >> not be copyrighted, the recording of the performance of the music is. >But the public performance right in copyright does not apply to sound >recordings. It only applies to "literary, musical, dramatic, and >choreographic works, pantominmes, and motion pictures and other audiovisual >works." See 17 USC 106(5). Which, iirc, was more or less how the copyright to the movie "it's a wonderful life" was grabbed back. Although the film itself had reverted to "public domain" (which led to years of it showing up, repeatedly, on pretty much every tv station), it turned out that the _music_ had not. - -- _____________________________________________________ Knowledge may be power, but communications is the key dannyb@panix.com [to foil spammers, my address has been double rot-13 encoded] - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 1 Jan 2001 15:28:13 -0500 From: Bennett Haselton Subject: MAPS alters back-dated press release; withdraws Media3 accusations Below is the original version of a press release that was sent out by MAPS on 12/13/2000. (You can email rbl@mail-abuse.org to verify its authenticity.) In the fourth paragraph, MAPS accused Media3 of "refusing to require their web-hosting customers to stop advertising their websites by using unsolicited commercial email". This is also the version of the press release that was originally posted to http://mail-abuse.org/pressreleases/2000-12-13.html (as verified by someone who saved a copy from that date) and went out over the wire to MAPS's press list. The current version at http://mail-abuse.org/pressreleases/2000-12-13.html has those accusations removed. (Media3 does not tolerate their customers sending spam, and kicks off at least one customer per month because of it. The real reasons why Media3 is in the RBL are at http://evfiles.mail-abuse.org/rbl/ev/209.211.253-24.txt.) If MAPS decided that these accusations were so unsupportable that they pulled them off their Web site, then they should have also sent out a retraction to everyone who received the original press release. Sending out a press release with errors, and then altering the back-dated version on your Web site without posting a proper retraction, is a serious threat to any organization's credibility. -Bennett ******** http://mail-abuse.org/pressreleases/2000-12-13.html MAIL ABUSE PREVENTION SYSTEM (MAPS) 950 Charter St. Redwood City, CA 94063 http://www.mail-abuse.org Contact: Anne P. Mitchell, Esq., Director, Legal and Public Affairs, 650-444-0346, or email anne@mail-abuse.org MEDIA3 SUES MAPS OVER RBL LISTINGS; PRIMARY TRO REQUEST IS DENIED For Immediate Release Redwood City, CA, December 12, 2000 -- Mail Abuse Prevention System LLC ("MAPS"), the Redwood City, California based anti-spam organization, was sued today in Federal Court in Boston, Massachusetts, by web-hosting company Media3. MAPS has listed over 1500 of Media3's I.P. addresses in its RealTime Blackhole List ("RBL") database. "Media3's I.P. addresses have been listed in the RBL since at least last month, many for far longer", explained Anne P. Mitchell, Esq., Director of Legal and Public Affairs for MAPS. "Media3 asked the Court to issue a TRO requiring that these I. P. addresses be removed from the RBL, and the Court refused their request, although it did order that we not add any new I.P. addresses belonging to Media3 for the time being." The RBL is a database, which is updated in real time, containing the Internet addresses of Internet sites which have been proven to either allow their users to send unsolicited commercial email directly, or to use their resources to otherwise profit from unsolicited commercial email (sometimes known as "spam"). Subscriber sites may, at their discretion, choose to block traffic from these sites in order to reduce the burden that this unwanted email places on their networks. The dispute with Media3 arose when Media3 refused to require their web-hosting customers to stop advertising their websites by using unsolicited commercial email as an advertising medium. The unsolicited email, sent through various unrelated ISPs, advertised websites which were hosted by Media3 on their web servers. "This clearly violates the standards which we advocate, and to which we ourselves adhere," explained Mitchell. "The proprietors of these websites send massive amounts of unsolicted mail from an account with an ISP, then when that account is shut down for violating that ISP's terms of service, they just move on to another ISP. In these cases the only way to get them to stop sending the unwanted email is for the company hosting the advertised site to get involved. If they don't, there is no incentive for the unsolicited email to stop, and then we are forced to protect our own mail servers from the onslaught of that unwanted email." MAPS is based in Redwood City, California and provides spam prevention resources to systems administrators, as well as services to end users. For more information, please contact Anne P. Mitchell, Esq., Director of Legal and Public Affairs, at anne@mail-abuse.org, or (650) 444-0346. - -- - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 1 Jan 2001 16:30:15 -0500 From: murray@pa.dec.com (Hal Murray) Subject: Re: More Caller ID Info > You get the info anytime someone dials your 800 number. That's one of > the benefits of paying for the call. If you are dialing an 800 number, > even if you use *67, you don't have the option of hiding your number. As > you know, the calling number is going to show up on the bill for your > 800 number anyway. What does an 800 number cost for (very) low volume personal use? Telemarketers often hide behind PBX systems that provide useless CallerID info. Do those systems provide useful ANI data? Are there regulations against telemarketers calling 800 numbers? Are they effective? Would getting an 800 number (instead of a normal residential phone) be an useful tactic against telemarketers? - -- These are my opinions, not necessarily my employers. I hate spam. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 1 Jan 2001 16:50:02 -0500 From: johnl@iecc.com (John R. Levine) Subject: Re: Local vs. Long Distance from NPA-NXX? >Short of calling the LEC, does anyone know of any public- >domain resource(s) that can determine, given two NPA-NNX's, >whether a call between the two would be local, intraLATA or >long distance? Thanks in advance! The good news is that it's easy enough to tell intra-LATA from inter-LATA from the NPA-prefix lists you can download from nanpa.com. It's close to impossible to tell reliably what calls are local and what calls aren't, even if you're willing to pay for the information. There are services that attempt to collect that sort of stuff, but their job is made much more difficult by the existence of multiple calling plans, CLECs that have different local calling areas from each other and the ILEC, and in some places, "local" message unit calls that cost more than "toll" calls. You can't use inter-LATA as a hint that a call is toll; there are many places that have free local calls across a LATA line, state line, or even into Canada. - -- John R. Levine, IECC, POB 727, Trumansburg NY 14886 +1 607 387 6869 johnl@iecc.com, Village Trustee and Sewer Commissioner, http://iecc.com/johnl, Member, Provisional board, Coalition Against Unsolicited Commercial E-mail - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 1 Jan 2001 16:59:46 -0500 From: johnl@iecc.com (John R. Levine) Subject: Re: Cheap US->UK residential phone? >The cheapest UK->US providers are about 3p or 4p a minute, eg >Swiftcall or Onetel. What cheap reliable US->UK providers would you >recommend? The regular ones like Sprint and MCI are around 10c/min but >I notice smaller companies doing 6c/min for residential. I've had good luck with dialaround provider Cognidial at www.cognidial.com who charge 6.8 cpm US->UK. You tell them what your phone numbers are, then to make a call you dial their 800 number, then the number you want. It's not a calling card, you can't use it other than from one of the numbers you've signed up. - -- John R. Levine, IECC, POB 727, Trumansburg NY 14886 +1 607 387 6869 johnl@iecc.com, Village Trustee and Sewer Commissioner, http://iecc.com/johnl, Member, Provisional board, Coalition Against Unsolicited Commercial E-mail - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 1 Jan 2001 17:23:56 -0500 From: johnl@iecc.com (John R. Levine) Subject: Re: More Caller ID Info >What does an 800 number cost for (very) low volume personal use? I pay 7.9 cpm. >Telemarketers often hide behind PBX systems that provide useless >CallerID info. Do those systems provide useful ANI data? Sure, you get the ANI of the main number. >Are there regulations against telemarketers calling 800 numbers? Are >they effective? I can't ever recall a telemarketer calling one of mine. They don't put toll free numbers on their lists. >Would getting an 800 number (instead of a normal residential phone) be >an useful tactic against telemarketers? Nope. The reason is that low-volume 800 numbers forward to a regular phone number, and it's not generally possible to tell when the phone rings whether it's from the 800 number or not. If you want a dedicated 800 number you have to bring in a T1 and guarantee a call volume sufficient to keep it busy. Personally, I find that I've been able to keep the telemarketers to a minimum by saying "Stop - put down your script. Do you have a Do Not Call list as required by law? Good. Put me on it and don't call back, ever." Click. - -- John R. Levine, IECC, POB 727, Trumansburg NY 14886 +1 607 387 6869 johnl@iecc.com, Village Trustee and Sewer Commissioner, http://iecc.com/johnl, Member, Provisional board, Coalition Against Unsolicited Commercial E-mail - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 1 Jan 2001 18:38:11 -0500 From: Roy Subject: Re: Local vs. Long Distance from NPA-NXX? I don't see the LATA codes in the NANPA lists I use (CA). The rate center is there but then you have to know which rate center is in which LATA and I am not sure that even works. "John R. Levine" wrote: > >Short of calling the LEC, does anyone know of any public- > >domain resource(s) that can determine, given two NPA-NNX's, > >whether a call between the two would be local, intraLATA or > >long distance? Thanks in advance! > > The good news is that it's easy enough to tell intra-LATA from > inter-LATA from the NPA-prefix lists you can download from nanpa.com. > > It's close to impossible to tell reliably what calls are local and > what calls aren't, even if you're willing to pay for the information. > There are services that attempt to collect that sort of stuff, but > their job is made much more difficult by the existence of multiple > calling plans, CLECs that have different local calling areas from each > other and the ILEC, and in some places, "local" message unit calls > that cost more than "toll" calls. > > You can't use inter-LATA as a hint that a call is toll; there are many > places that have free local calls across a LATA line, state line, or > even into Canada. > > -- > John R. Levine, IECC, POB 727, Trumansburg NY 14886 +1 607 387 6869 > johnl@iecc.com, Village Trustee and Sewer Commissioner, http://iecc.com/johnl, > Member, Provisional board, Coalition Against Unsolicited Commercial E-mail > -- > The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail > messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 1 Jan 2001 19:06:25 -0500 From: iverson0900@mnjazz.com (Al Iverson) Subject: Re: kill this meme: "Media3 put Peacefire in the line of fire..." In article <3.0.6.32.20010101092150.00a08b70@206.81.192.1>, Bennett Haselton wrote: > Do you have anything specific? Specifically, I'm curious about the following. You've commented that AboveNet is not making full disclosure to its clients as to the nature of the blocking it employs. That's an intriguing thought, and very abstractly I would concur that an ISP or network provider should definitely make it very clear and easy for all of its end users to understand the criteria they use to decide what traffic to accept or reject. However, there's a flip side to that coin, that I haven't seen you comment on yet. This netblock where your web site resides, it was listed on the MAPS RBL *before* your web site was moved to that block. I see ample evidence that your ISP was aware that this block was listed on the MAPS RBL. My comments aren't about the validity or justification of the MAPS RBL listing. I'm simply curious, that in your stated interest in full disclosure, how come you haven't documented for us the disclosure, or lack thereof, that your ISP *knew* that they were moving you to a network segment that many people on the internet are already refusing traffic from, because of the other people on that segment. I'm not sure it's time to kill this meme yet. There might still be some life left to it. - -- Al Iverson - Minnesota Jazz Online - http://www.mnjazz.com/ All opinions are mine alone unless I state otherwise. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 1 Jan 2001 19:21:13 -0500 From: John De Hoog Subject: Re: kill this meme: "Media3 put Peacefire in the line of fire..." iverson0900@mnjazz.com (Al Iverson) wrote: > My comments aren't about the validity or justification of the MAPS RBL > listing. I'm simply curious, that in your stated interest in full > disclosure, how come you haven't documented for us the disclosure, or lack > thereof, that your ISP *knew* that they were moving you to a network > segment that many people on the internet are already refusing traffic > from, because of the other people on that segment. Have I been away from the English-speaking world too long, or does the above sentence make something less than total sense? - -- John De Hoog, Tokyo dehoog@nifty.com http://dehoog.org Using EdMax Ver. 2.80.1 - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 1 Jan 2001 20:15:46 -0500 From: dannyb@panix.com (danny burstein) Subject: US Constitution and misreadings, was: Re: BLOCK: Media3, peacefire.org In <3.0.6.32.20010101110846.00ab0440@206.81.192.1> Bennett Haselton writes: [lots of silly stuff, yes silly stuff, snipped] >The First Amendment does not protect "speech" that consists of false >statements made by a company about a product that they're selling, whether >that product is (1) a list of sites, or (2) Internet access that is >secretly filtered according to that list. It protects the list itself, not >necessarily all uses of it. The First Amendment to the US Constitution has almost NOTHING to do with commercial organizations. It concerns itself with GOVERNMENT censorship. Your attempt to bring it into this discussion seems like a blatant last ditch effort by you to deivert attention away from the real issue here, which is that your (otherwise laudable) material is now in the midst of a spam haven. In this specific situation vis-a-vis Peacefire and Media3, you have placed your voice in the midst of a group of annoying and loud trouble makers. COMMERCIAL organizations and PRIVATE individuals have decided that the volume of car alarms and loudspeakers and bad music and other annoyances from that neighborhood is so intense that they're putting up sound berms to block and isolate the noise. All the noise. All the sound. All the messages. All the time. Without discrimination as to which source *in that neighborhood* they're coming from. *You've* made the choice to move into and stay in that neighborhood. *You* have the option of moving out. While the groups that put up this berm probably should have done a better job of advising their users, this is a PRIVATE decision, a BUSINESS choice, and has little to do with GOV'T. The US Constitution and the Bill of Rights do NOT apply to this [1]. [1] for the most part. Yes, we can compose Clintonesque scenarios that would draw it in. Let's not. Thank you. - -- _____________________________________________________ Knowledge may be power, but communications is the key dannyb@panix.com [to foil spammers, my address has been double rot-13 encoded] - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 1 Jan 2001 20:16:37 -0500 From: pw@panix.com (Paul Wallich) Subject: Re: BLOCK: Media3, peacefire.org In article , sjsobol@NorthShoreTechnologies.net (Steve Sobol) wrote: >From 'Bennett Haselton': > >>claiming in multiple places on their Web site that the RBL is a list of >>"spammers", "people who send spam", "sites that do not follow responsible >>emailing practices", etc., > >Included in the 'etc.' is Spam Support Services, which includes selling of >spamware. MAPS is *not* ambiguous about this. Media3, however, would seem to have its class C on the list because it sells space to people who provide spam support services, yet another level of indirection. You can argue that selling the space is itself a spam support service, but that starts you into an ugly regress, e.g. is anyone who makes money by passing packets and doesn't subscribe to the RBL engaging in spam support services? Obviously boycotts like this work best when they hit "innocent" people who might get a provider to make a policy change, but I can see how Bennett Haselton might draw a nice analogy to censorware companies who put an entire site or hosting service on their list because of a few bad pages or an insufficiently-strict AUP. After all, if your cause is just, a few innocents are a small price to pay... (In general, I think that the probity of a boycott technique should be measured by how much you would squawk if it were implemented by someone who espoused the cause you hate most.) >http://mail-abuse.org/rbl/candidacy.html#ByAssociation > >>what is on the RBL.) And partly companies like AboveNet that are not clear >>about how they use it (blocking Web access without informing customers is >>really pretty low). And if a downstream ISP knows that AboveNet blocks Web >>sites, but then re-sells Internet access to the public without telling them >>this, then that downstream ISP is partly responsible as well. > >I recall seeing somewhere on MAPS's site that they require users of the RBL >to indicate to customers and their downstreams that they *are* using the RBL. >But I can't find any indication of that on their web site, so I'm CC'ing >this post to a couple friends who work there. I could be wrong, and maybe >it's just because I'm still hung over from New Year's Eve -- but I could >swear it's there. :) ... >Of course it matters. It's not a tangential topic. MAPS says the reason for >the RBL listing of the Class C in which your site sits is because there are >several other sites that support spam services. If that's not true, MAPS >shouldn't list the Class C. But I, for one, believe it to be true. As an outsider I'm rather interested by the choice of Class C network as the granularity for the black-hole list. Obviously it's slightly more convenient than doing blocking by IP (and slightly more effective if someone owns the whole block and can play address games); it also is almost certain to block people who have only the bad judgement or misfortune to be in the wrong netblock -- as above, this may be the point, but if so you have to ask whether it's a good strategy. (And if it truly is a good strategy, why not go whole hog and block Class B's or Class A's, other than the fact that those folks could squash you like a bug?) >>If individuals want >>to boycott Peacefire voluntarily because we're hosted on Media3, that's up >>to them. But my own survey of AboveNet users indicated that none of them >>knew their Internet access was being blocked without their permission. > >You said exactly the same thing to me in one of our discussions in private >e-mail. I pointed out that that may or may not be AboveNet's fault. > >I then asked whether said users were direct customers of AboveNet or not. >It's very likely many (most?) of them are users of ISPs downstream, in which >case there is no obligation for AboveNet to tell those particular people >that they're using the RBL. They need to tell the ISPs connecting directly >to them, and the ISPs need to tell the end-users. > >While I appreciate your efforts to discuss this topic with me in a rational, >calm manner, and I wish to do the same for you, I do think that you avoided >directly answering this question when I initially posed it to you. Again, as >I mentioned before, this does not imply that I think you're right or wrong, >but the phrase "AboveNet users" is ambiguous and (I think) intentionally >vague. As a random end-user, I think that vagueness hits the mark quite well. I don't get to choose where my packets go after they leave my machine or (at best) leave my ISP. Everything that's ever been written about the internet describes the net as a "cloud" where packets magically get shunted to their destinations, not one where upper-tier and backbone providers pick and choose what to let through. (Note also that someone like above.net can do this only because they are a relatively small player -- if sprint, say, decided to toss packets it didn't like, DoJ would be all over them.) One other thing I'm wondering: since above.net also acts as a backbone provider - -- or at least sometimes my traceroutes have claimed that -- insofar as its routers advertise routes that include blackholed netblocks (and I don't know that they do) they would be doing a Very Bad Thing for the integrity of the net as a whole, no matter how noble the RBL's intention. >>The First Amendment does not protect "speech" that consists of false >>statements made by a company about a product that they're selling, whether >>that product is (1) a list of sites, or (2) Internet access that is >>secretly filtered according to that list. It protects the list itself, not >>necessarily all uses of it. > >I agree; however, what we are dealing with at this point is not necessarily >a censorship issue, but rather one of contract law. It's quite possible for it to be both, unless you believe that "censorship" should only ever be applied to pure government action. paul - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 1 Jan 2001 20:52:53 -0500 From: johnl@iecc.com (John R. Levine) Subject: Re: Local vs. Long Distance from NPA-NXX? > I don't see the LATA codes in the NANPA lists I use (CA). The rate > center is there but then you have to know which rate center is in > which LATA and I am not sure that even works. Oops, you're quite right, no LATA into there. Poking around the net, I found http://www.ccmi.com/lcadata.html which is a local calling area directory you can buy for $200, keeping in mind that if you want reliable info you have to update it weekly. - -- John R. Levine, IECC, POB 727, Trumansburg NY 14886 +1 607 387 6869 johnl@iecc.com, Village Trustee and Sewer Commissioner, http://iecc.com/johnl, Member, Provisional board, Coalition Against Unsolicited Commercial E-mail - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ End of Telecom Digest V2000 #170 ******************************** Date: 2 Jan 2001 06:15:12 -0500 From: owner-telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org (Telecom Digest) To: telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org Subject: Telecom Digest V2000 #171 Telecom Digest Tuesday, January 2 2001 Volume 2000 : Number 171 In this issue: Re: kill this meme: "Media3 put Peacefire in the line of fire..." re: kill this meme: "Media3 put Peacefire in the line of fire..." court decisions on ads as "free speech" Re: Finding Public Domain Music-On-Hold Re: related copyright issue, was: Re: Finding Public Domain MOH Re: MAPS alters back-dated press release; withdraws Media3 accusations Re: Finding Public Domain Music-On-Hold Re: digital anac? ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 1 Jan 2001 20:59:26 -0500 From: iverson0900@mnjazz.com (Al Iverson) Subject: Re: kill this meme: "Media3 put Peacefire in the line of fire..." In article <200101020021.JAA24258@coral.ocn.ne.jp>, John De Hoog wrote: > iverson0900@mnjazz.com (Al Iverson) wrote: > > > My comments aren't about the validity or justification of the MAPS RBL > > listing. I'm simply curious, that in your stated interest in full > > disclosure, how come you haven't documented for us the disclosure, or lack > > thereof, that your ISP *knew* that they were moving you to a network > > segment that many people on the internet are already refusing traffic > > from, because of the other people on that segment. > > Have I been away from the English-speaking world too long, or does the > above sentence make something less than total sense? Sorry, I didn't go to college. He claims that AboveNet is being deceptive by not fully disclosing the situation surrounding the blocking. Yet it's my impression based on what's been said that his ISP (Media3) did not inform him that the new IP address they assigned him was already being blocked by 40% of the internet. I'm curious as to why that is, and what his feelings are about that. Best, Al Iverson - -- Al Iverson - Minnesota Jazz Online - http://www.mnjazz.com/ All opinions are mine alone unless I state otherwise. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 1 Jan 2001 21:46:58 -0500 From: Dave Anderson Subject: re: kill this meme: "Media3 put Peacefire in the line of fire..." [Quoting rearranged for readability.] On Mon, 01 Jan 2001 09:21:50 -0800, Bennett Haselton wrote: >At 12:00 PM 1/1/01 EST, Dave Anderson wrote: >> >>In the case at hand (based on my own knowledge as someone who hasn't been >>actively involved in spam-fighting but has been paying attention to it for >>the past several years) your research has been incredibly shoddy. This >>forces me to question whether your other research is of any better quality. >>For me, and probably for a lot of other people, you've done major damange >>to Peacefire's credibility. > >Do you have anything specific? Knowledge of how spammers and spam-service providers operate, of the importance of 'facilitators' who don't actually send spam themselves but provide support services to spammers, and of the reputations of some of the people who've been pointing out your errors. Based on this (I haven't done any independent researching of this particular situation) I have little doubt that Media3 deliberately and without warning put Peacefire in the middle of a nest of spammers and/or spam supporters that it knew was already on the RBL with the explicit intention of causing the type of outcry you've been making, and that they have been consistently lying to you to fan the flames. Failing to thoroughly check out the situation and the history that led to it (especially if, as appears to be the case, you largely accepted as true whatever Media3 told you) before posting rather inflammatory comments is, in my book, shoddy research. Dave - -- Dave Anderson - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 1 Jan 2001 22:15:28 -0500 From: heywood@gloucester.com (Heywood Jaiblomi) Subject: court decisions on ads as "free speech" A case decided by the U.S. Supreme Court in 1970 is often quoted as showing the rights of the individual exceed that of the speaker. The case dealt with unwanted postal mail. In the Supreme Court's decision in Rowan v. U.S. Post Office, the court held: "Nothing in the Constitution compels us to listen to or to view any unwanted communication, whatever its merit. . . We therefore categorically reject the argument that a vendor has the right under the Constitution or otherwise to send unwanted material into the home of another. . . We repeat, the right of a mailer stops at the outer boundary of every person's domain." - -- It ain't the whistle that moves the train. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 1 Jan 2001 23:10:07 -0500 From: "John Schmerold" Subject: Re: Finding Public Domain Music-On-Hold Sounds like BBC is best solution. Anyone know of a radio that will tune in BBC & allow connection to most MOH phone system connectors? - -------------------------------- John Schmerold Katy Computer, LLC 20 Meramec Station Rd Valley Park, MO 63088 314-316-9000 voice 775-227-6947 fax From: hollaar@faith.cs.utah.edu (Lee Hollaar) > Subject: Re: Finding Public Domain Music-On-Hold > > In article <3A4FAAB9.8B639C01@garlic.com> Roy writes: > > > > > >I would like to point out that there is almost no such things as "public domain > >classical CDs". While the original composition may not be copyrighted, the > >recording of the performance of the music is. > > But the public performance right in copyright does not apply to sound > recordings. It only applies to "literary, musical, dramatic, and > choreographic works, pantominmes, and motion pictures and other audiovisual > works." See 17 USC 106(5). > - -- - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 2 Jan 2001 01:02:40 -0500 From: "Ed Ellers" Subject: Re: related copyright issue, was: Re: Finding Public Domain MOH Danny Burstein wrote: "Which, iirc, was more or less how the copyright to the movie "it's a wonderful life" was grabbed back. Although the film itself had reverted to "public domain" (which led to years of it showing up, repeatedly, on pretty much every tv station), it turned out that the _music_ had not." In a similar vein, ever notice how Paramount takes extreme pains to claim trademark protection for the various names associated with Star Trek -- the title, the major character names, etc.? Allegedly somebody at Paramount forgot to renew the copyright registration on some (but not all) of the episodes of the original series, so they now use trademark rights to exert control over any use of those episodes. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 2 Jan 2001 03:38:23 -0500 From: jay@west.net (Jay Hennigan) Subject: Re: MAPS alters back-dated press release; withdraws Media3 accusations On 1 Jan 2001 15:28:13 -0500, Bennett Haselton wrote: :Below is the original version of a press release that was sent out by MAPS :on 12/13/2000. (You can email rbl@mail-abuse.org to verify its authenticity.) : :In the fourth paragraph, MAPS accused Media3 of "refusing to require their :web-hosting customers to stop advertising their websites by using :unsolicited commercial email". This is also the version of the press :release that was originally posted to :http://mail-abuse.org/pressreleases/2000-12-13.html (as verified by someone :who saved a copy from that date) and went out over the wire to MAPS's press :list. : :The current version at : http://mail-abuse.org/pressreleases/2000-12-13.html :has those accusations removed. I'm not a party to it, but if I recall correctly this lawsuit or at least a similar one involved a gag order requiring MAPS to retract certain statements which they had made. It may be that the change to the press release was made as a result of a court order as opposed to MAPS attempting to correct an error. : (Media3 does not tolerate their customers :sending spam, and kicks off at least one customer per month because of it. :The real reasons why Media3 is in the RBL are at :http://evfiles.mail-abuse.org/rbl/ev/209.211.253-24.txt.) Which appears to be a suitable reason for such listing, III. hosting web pages or otherwise providing connectivity to those who provide software or services for distributing spam; and VI. continuing to provide service or access to customers providing spam support services after such activity has been brought to the access provider's attention. excerpted from http://mail-abuse.org/rbl/candidacy.html#ByAssociation :If MAPS decided that these accusations were so unsupportable that they :pulled them off their Web site, then they should have also sent out a :retraction to everyone who received the original press release. Sending :out a press release with errors, and then altering the back-dated version :on your Web site without posting a proper retraction, is a serious threat :to any organization's credibility. MAPS likely had no choice lest they be held in contempt of court. You are making an assumption that the release was modified because of errors, which may not be the case. Again, as others have done, I ask why have you not asked Media3 to move your site out of that netblock or sought connectivity from another provider? It's my understanding that offers have been made to you to host your site at no charge. Your site is hosted in the Internet equivalent of a very unsavory, filthy neighborhood through no fault of your own. Ask your landlord to clean up the neighborhood, or move. If you do neither, then don't be surprised if respectable people tell their friends not to go anywhere near your present place of business. You're (presumably) paying good rent, and your landlord has put you in a slum. Blame the landlord, not the customers who are staying away because of the stink. - -- Jay Hennigan - Network Administration - jay@west.net NetLojix Communications, Inc. NASDAQ: NETX - http://www.netlojix.com/ WestNet: Connecting you to the planet. 805 884-6323 - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 2 Jan 2001 05:03:12 -0500 From: "Ed Ellers" Subject: Re: Finding Public Domain Music-On-Hold Gary Novosielski wrote: "Too bad there are no copper wires running from your phone room to the outside world, or you might be able to use one for a long-wire external antenna." Why the sarcasm? If you're reasonably familiar with this field, you must know that it's a very big no-no to connect anything to telephone company lines other than FCC-registered (or grandfathered) equipment. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 2 Jan 2001 05:39:07 -0500 From: jay@west.net (Jay Hennigan) Subject: Re: digital anac? On 30 Dec 2000 14:14:25 -0500, John Graves wrote: :I used to have a piece of test equipment called a Techtronics 9925. :This meter had the ability to anac a number and the number was printed :on the lcd in digital format. These meter's were recalled by I guess :our district level, because they had a reputation of being unreliable in :their capacitance to distance measurements. I made the mistake of :turning mine back in. The manufacturer is most likely Tektronix. Try digging around the http://www.tek.com/ site. :My questions are:. Where can I get the protocols and source to recreate :the "digital ani" ? Are there any open source examples. If not, how do :I find the applicable documentation to accomplish this. I have a decent :amount of programming experience, At least I know a heck of a lot more :than they teach in you average VisBasic course. lol It may be as simple as a DTMF receiver built into the device. There are ANAC numbers which read back the number in DTMF, presumably for use with some type of craft test set similar to yours. There used to also be some ANACs that would read the number on a loudspeaker in the C.O., which could get annoying if done in error a lot. - -- Jay Hennigan - Network Administration - jay@west.net NetLojix Communications, Inc. NASDAQ: NETX - http://www.netlojix.com/ WestNet: Connecting you to the planet. 805 884-6323 - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ End of Telecom Digest V2000 #171 ******************************** Date: 2 Jan 2001 14:41:33 -0500 From: owner-telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org (Telecom Digest) To: telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org Subject: Telecom Digest V2000 #172 Telecom Digest Tuesday, January 2 2001 Volume 2000 : Number 172 In this issue: Re: Modular Surface Jack Re: BLOCK: Media3, peacefire.org Re: POTS line terminations. Information please Re: BLOCK: Media3, peacefire.org Re: BLOCK: Media3, peacefire.org ISDN Test Scripts Re: BLOCK: Media3, peacefire.org 4 new area codes for Massachusetts to cause mandatory 10 digit dialing soon Whise is Peacefire still on Media3??? RE: POTS line terminations Telecom Update (Canada) #264, January 2, 2001 ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 2 Jan 2001 07:04:46 -0500 From: "Smith, Marty" Subject: Re: Modular Surface Jack We usually tend to cross connect the station cable (white/blue, blue/white) pair to (in your case) the red and green pair. Also try posting messages to http://www.mailgate.org/comp/comp.dcom.sys.nortel/index.html - -- Posted from dymwsm14.mailwatch.com [204.253.83.38] via Mailgate.ORG Server - http://www.Mailgate.ORG - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 2 Jan 2001 08:52:27 -0500 From: Steve Linford Subject: Re: BLOCK: Media3, peacefire.org In article , sjsobol@NorthShoreTechnologies.net (Steve Sobol) wrote: > I recall seeing somewhere on MAPS's site that they require users of > the RBL to indicate to customers and their downstreams that they > *are* using the RBL. They advise it but can't require it. However before Bennett yells "Gotcha!" the reason they can't require it is that an ISP is a private entity and can't be required to do anything if they don't want to. MAPS strongly advises ISPs do disclose any filters in use, and most ISPs do - and certainly nowdays providing email accounts protected from spam by the MAPS lists is a strong sales feature. > >There is a nuanced debate about whether sites which sell software > >like List Sorcerer (not to mention sites like Peacefire which are > >not doing anything except being *hosted* on the same ISP) are > >"responsible" for the spam problem Bennett, why don't you just load one of these sites http://www.bulk-isp.net (only a few IPs away from you at 209.211.253.248) and see for yourself. Scroll down to the "We mass mail for you", use your own eyes. You can even use your ears: Would you like to hear the owner of that site say that he spams and provides 'bullet-proof' spam hosting? The following MP3 file is Sam Al (Saied Alzalzalah), a major scumbag who runs http://www.bulk-isp.net (and quite a few other spam sites in your block) telling MAPS that he spams, just click this and listen: http://www.spamhaus.org/images/SamAlC48.mp3 Or how about this from the same spammer, Sam Al, bulkisp.nu (also at 209.211.253.248 in your block), he's semi-illiterate by the way: From: info@bulkisp.nu Subject: We Spam And Nobody Can Stop US Date: Fri, 16 Jun 2000 16:03:24 -0500 Reply-To: info@bulkisp.nu To: @att.net Message-Id: Srew the atispammers, We Beat them all. Hi My name is Sam were are spammers. We can set u up so u can spam your heart out. We have bullet proff servers, bullet proff list, and bulllet proff hosting. Just call us at 323 874 4647, or fax us at 323 512 4950 or email us at info@bulkisp.nu or go to our web page http://www.bulkisp.nu Nobody can stop us we got it down. Don't worry about the atispammers there is nothing they can do. Call me I will give you all the secrets. Sam PS Believe we are are protected nothing can hurt us or you. Still convinced the poor little spammers in your block don't actually spam, and the 'stealth' spamming software they sell is just harmless? - -- Steve Linford - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 2 Jan 2001 10:01:36 -0500 From: John Adams Subject: Re: POTS line terminations. In the case of the first two, they apply to 4 wire circuits. The pure resistive characteristic termination (600 ohms) plus the more "realistic" complex RC termination (600 ohms plus 2.16uF) are still in use . While 4 wire analog circuits are not very common (Military AUTOVON circuits come to mind), they do exist. The third characteristic termination of 900 ohms and 2.16uF is typical of most 2 wire analog POTS circuits. The specification of capacitance at 2.16 uF is a nominal value that is quite common. Roy Smith wrote: > I was reading through cisco's Voice Analog Interface MIB, and came upon > a list of possible line termination impedences, including: > > > ohms600Real - 600 Ohms. > > ohms600Complex - 600 Ohms + 2.16uF > > ohms900Complex - 900 Ohms + 2.16uF. > > ohmsComplex1 - complex 1; > > 220 Ohms + 820 Ohms || 115nF. > > This impedance is primarily used in > > Germany. > > ohmsComplex2 - complex 2; > > 270 Ohms + 750 Ohms || 150nF. > > This impedance is primarily used in > > United Kingdom and Sweden. > > The last 2 entries seem relatively self-explanitory, but what about the > first three? Where, and under what circumstances, might you expect to > see analog phone lines terminated in those ways? > > I'm particularly intrigued by the idea of specifying a capacitance to 3 > significant digits. I would think +/- 20% would be more typical for a > mass produced part. - -- John "Jack" Adams, Lucent Technologies, Inc. +1.732.224.8045 jackadams@lucent.com The power of accurate observation is often called cynicism by those who haven't got it. -- George Bernard Shaw - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 2 Jan 2001 10:32:47 -0500 From: Joseph Singer Subject: Information please Just reading a discussion group I found this little tale. I assume it's true, but even if it isn't it's a consoling tale in these non-caring high-tech times. Tale follows: Information Please When I was quite young, my father had one of the first telephones in our neighborhood. I remember well the polished, old case fastened to the wall. The shiny receiver hung on the side of the box. I was too little to reach the telephone, but used to listen with fascination when my mother used to talk to it. Then I discovered that somewhere inside the wonderful device lived an amazing person - her name was "Information Please" and there was nothing she did not know. "Information Please" could supplyanybody's number and the correct time. My first personal experience with this genie-in-the-bottle came one day while my mother was visiting a neighbor. Amusing myself at the tool bench in the basement, I whacked my finger with a hammer. The pain was terrible, but there didn't seem to be any reason in crying because there was no one home to give sympathy. I walked around the house sucking my throbbing finger, finally arriving at the stairway. The telephone! Quickly, I ran for the foot stool in the parlor and dragged it to the landing. Climbing up, I unhooked the receiver in the parlor and held it to my ear. "Information Please," I said into the mouthpiece just above my head. A click or two and a small clear voice spoke into my ear. "Information" "I hurt my finger..." I wailed into the phone. The tears came readily enough now that I had an audience. "Isn't your mother home?" came the question. "Nobody's home but me," I blubbered. "Are you bleeding?" the voice asked. "No," I replied. "I hit my finger with the hammer and it hurts." "Can you open your icebox?" she asked. I said I could. "Then chip off a little piece of ice and hold it to your finger," said the voice. After that, I called "Information Please" for everything. I asked her for help with my geography and she told me where Philadelphia was. She helped me with my math. She told me my pet chipmunk, that I had caught in the park just the day before, would eat fruit and nuts. Then, there was the time Petey, our pet canary died. I called "Information Please" and told her the sad story.She listened, then said the usual things grown ups say to soothe a child. But I was unconsoled. I asked her, "Why is it that birds should sing so beautifully and bring joy to all families, only to end up as a heap of feathers on the bottom of a cage?" She must have sensed my deep concern, f or she said quietly, "Paul, always remember that there are other worlds to sing in." Somehow I felt better. Another day I was on the telephone. "Information Please." "Information," said the now familiar voice. "How do you spell fix?" I asked. All this took place in a small town in the Pacific Northwest. When I was nine years old, we moved across the country to Boston. I missed my friend very much. "Information Please" belonged in that old wooden box back home and I somehow never thought of trying the tall, shiny new phone that sat on the table in the hall. As I grew into my teens, the memories of those childhood conversations never really left me. Often, in moments of doubt and perplexity, I would recall the serene sense of security I had then. I appreciated now how patient, understanding, and kind she was to have spent her time on a little boy. A few years later, on my way west to college, my plane put down in Seattle. I had about half-an-hour or so between planes. I spent 15 minutes or so on the phone with my sister, who lived there now. Then, without thinking what I was doing, I dialed my hometown operator and said, "Information, please." Miraculously, I heard the small, clear voice I knew so well. "Information." I hadn't planned this, but I heard myself saying, "Could you please tell me how to spell fix?" There was a long pause. Then came the soft spoken answer, "I guess your finger must have healed by now." I laughed, "So it's really still you," I said. "I wonder if you have any idea how much you meant to me during that time." "I wonder," she said, "if you know how much your calls meant to me. I never had any children and I used to look forward to your calls." I told her how often I had thought of her over the years and I asked if I could call her again when I came back to visit my sister. "Please do," she said. "Just ask for Sally." Three months later I was back in Seattle. A different voice answered, "Information." I asked for Sally. "Are you a friend?" she said. "Yes, a very old friend," I answered. "I'm sorry to have to tell you this," she said. "Sally had been working part time the last few years because she was sick. She died five weeks ago." Before I could hang up she said, "Wait a minute. Is your name Paul?" "Yes." "She left a message for you in case you called. Let me read it to you." The note said, "Tell him I still say there are other worlds to sing in. He'll know what I mean." I thanked her and hung up. I knew what Sally meant. Never underestimate the impression you may make on others. Whose life have you touched today? ~Author Unknown - --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Joseph Singer Seattle, Washington USA [ICQ pgr] +1 206 405 2052 [voice mail] +1 206 493 0706 [FAX] - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 2 Jan 2001 10:32:55 -0500 From: sjsobol@NorthShoreTechnologies.net (Steve Sobol) Subject: Re: BLOCK: Media3, peacefire.org >From 'Paul Wallich': >Media3, however, would seem to have its class C on the list because it >sells space to people who provide spam support services, yet another >level of indirection. You can argue that selling the space is itself a spam >support service, but that starts you into an ugly regress, e.g. is anyone >who makes money by passing packets and doesn't subscribe to the RBL >engaging in spam support services? A good point, that. I think the URL I gave does a pretty good job of delineating what they will RBL people for, though. >Obviously boycotts like this work best when they hit "innocent" people >who might get a provider to make a policy change, but I can see how >Bennett Haselton might draw a nice analogy to censorware companies >who put an entire site or hosting service on their list because of a few >bad pages or an insufficiently-strict AUP. After all, if your cause is just, >a few innocents are a small price to pay... Paul, I suspect you may be coming into this discussion late, so I want to give you a couple more data points. 1. MAPS, to the best of my knowledge, never starts with a whole Class C. They start with an IP that is nominated for the RBL, investigate matters, and attempt to work with the responsible organization to fix the problem (it's been said that they consider an actual listing "failure"; they would much rather educate, remove the problem and not have to list). In Media3's case, there were several IP's in that Class C that were already on the RBL for spam support services, and Media3 refused to remove them, so the RBL listing was escalated to the entire class C. And... 2. From what I can tell, from reading Bennett's own posts on SPAM-L, his site was moved to an RBL'd IP *in* *August*, a good four months after several IP addresses in that block were already RBL'd. It would seem to be a move on Media3's part to try to get MAPS to release the listing. >As an outsider I'm rather interested by the choice of Class C network as >the granularity for the black-hole list. Obviously it's slightly more convenient >than doing blocking by IP (and slightly more effective if someone owns the >whole block and can play address games); it also is almost certain to block >people who have only the bad judgement or misfortune to be in the wrong >netblock Please refer to my reply above. Generally, you (as a provider) only end up with an entire Class C in the RBL if you already are *on* the RBL for one or more IP's and you are uncooperative and/or playing games. k -- as above, this may be the point, but if so you have to ask whether >it's a good strategy. (And if it truly is a good strategy, why not go whole hog >and block Class B's or Class A's, other than the fact that those folks >could squash >you like a bug?) Lots of collateral damage. That's why the MAPS folks don't do Class C's off the bat. >through. (Note also that someone like above.net can do this only because they >are a relatively small player -- if sprint, say, decided to toss packets >it didn't like, DoJ would be all over them.) Well, not necessarily. If they wanted to block a /24 from a provider hosting scriptkiddies who were initiating DoS attacks from various IP's in that block, you can bet they'd blackhole the /24, and be completely within their legal rights to do so. >>I agree; however, what we are dealing with at this point is not necessarily >>a censorship issue, but rather one of contract law. > >It's quite possible for it to be both, unless you believe that "censorship" >should only ever be applied to pure government action. Government or no, I'm not sure censorship of Peacefire is *happening* in this instance, at least not by MAPS or AboveNet. Media3, not MAPS, not AboveNet, moved Peacefire into an already-partially-blackholed /24. - -- Steve Sobol, BOFH, President 888.480.4NET 866.DSL.EXPRESS 216.619.2NET North Shore Technologies Corporation http://NorthShoreTechnologies.net JustTheNet/JustTheNet EXPRESS DSL (ISP Services) http://JustThe.net mailto:sjsobol@NorthShoreTechnologies.net Proud resident of Cleveland, OH - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 2 Jan 2001 11:30:06 -0500 From: Steve Linford Subject: Re: BLOCK: Media3, peacefire.org In article <3.0.6.32.20010101110846.00ab0440@206.81.192.1>, Bennett Haselton wrote: > If individuals want to boycott Media3 for that reason, fine. What > I think is dishonest about the RBL "boycott" is that most > individuals whose email or Web access is blocked, apparently don't > even realize it. You mean like peacefire.org not realizing that Media3 was blocking incoming email to you? (Emails I sent to peacefire.org were being blocked by your provider Media3. They disclosed this fact to you? Nope, they later gave you some BS about it occuring "in error" but Media3 told me outright they were deliberately blocking me.) Peacefire.org is posting "MAPS are blocking us" press releases deliberately distorting facts to suit your own agenda. The prime fact you ignore is that Media3 could have placed your www.peacefire.org site in any of their many netblocks, but in August they chose to put you in the middle of a class C containing notorious spam gangs whose many IPs were _already_ on the MAPS RBL, and Joe Hayes at Media3 had been told, by MAPS, in June, _two months_ before they put you in that block that the whole class C would be blackholed. Do you not even think Media3 had a duty to tell you that the block they were going to put you in was about to be placed on the RBL? If they had told you, would you have agreed or even volunteered to be placed in there knowing you'd be blackholed by 45% of the Internet? What the heck are you still doing in that class C? Media3 are not going to get rid of their spammers to unblock it anytime soon, they're going to court to try to keep their spammers and force the RBL to unblock them. Their TRO has already been denied so it's going to take some time and it's a no-win situation for them: If Media3 lose the court case the RBL block will stay. If Media3 win the court case; system and network administrators all over the net will manually blackhole Media3 which will be infinately worse than being on the one RBL list. If you follow nanae you'll know that a lot of network admins are already blocking Media3 at their routers and MTAs, and ORBS is already blackholing _all_ of Media3. - -- Steve Linford - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 2 Jan 2001 11:31:11 -0500 From: umeshbhavsar@yahoo.com Subject: ISDN Test Scripts Hi All, Does anybody know where I can pick up or buy Layer 2/Layer 3 test scripts for ISDN. We are using Spectra (INET) boxes and unfortunately they do not have any ISDN test scripts. SPECTRA have SS7 scripts based on ITU docs (e.g Q784 ). Unfortunately ITU have not defined something similar for ISDN (as far as I know). If anybody knows even test definition for ISDN layer 2 and 3 will be much appreciated. Thx Umesh Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 2 Jan 2001 11:37:14 -0500 From: pw@panix.com (Paul Wallich) Subject: Re: BLOCK: Media3, peacefire.org In article , Steve Linford wrote: >In article , >sjsobol@NorthShoreTechnologies.net (Steve Sobol) wrote: > >> I recall seeing somewhere on MAPS's site that they require users of >> the RBL to indicate to customers and their downstreams that they >> *are* using the RBL. > >They advise it but can't require it. However before Bennett yells >"Gotcha!" the reason they can't require it is that an ISP is a private >entity and can't be required to do anything if they don't want to. >MAPS strongly advises ISPs do disclose any filters in use, and most >ISPs do - and certainly nowdays providing email accounts protected >from spam by the MAPS lists is a strong sales feature. "An ISP is a private entity and can't be required to do anything" has to rank as the stupidist single statement (even in context) that's gone by during this entire discussion, and seriously damages the credibility of the rest of Linford's argument, imo. An ISP can be required to do damn-all anything the owner or licensors of the resources it is using decides to require (within the loose bounds of copyright and contract law). They can't make a zillion copies of Win2K and give them away with new accounts, they can't sell GPL'd apps without a path to source code, they can't frame other ISPs' web sites and put frames around them etc ad nauseam. It would be a fairly simple matter for MAPS to say "it is a condition of subscribing to the RBL that you inform your end-users that you are blocking certain sites" and to test compliance by setting up a bot that (suitably anonymized) sent a prospective-customer-style query to the email address of the subscriber's choosing. (This kind of approach would be easy to spoof, but the spoofing could be detected, and besides, who would bother to deceive MAPS, because RBL subscribers' hearts are pure.) Always be particularly suspicious of shortcuts taken by people whose motives you agree with. paul - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 2 Jan 2001 12:04:15 -0500 From: "Cole T. Kracke" Subject: 4 new area codes for Massachusetts to cause mandatory 10 digit dialing soon Verizon Suggests New Year's Resolutions for Eastern Massachusetts Customers Getting Four New Area Codes Updated: Tuesday, January 2, 2001 10:56 AM ET Beginning April 2, Callers Must Dial 10 Digits Or '1' Plus 10 Digits for All Local Calls BOSTON, Jan. 2 /PRNewswire/ -- Verizon suggests some New Year's resolutions for consumers and businesses in Eastern Massachusetts who are getting four new area codes this spring. -- Get in the habit of dialing 10 digits or "1" plus 10 digits for all local calls. -- Reprogram computers that are used for Internet access, fax machines, speed dialing and call forwarding services and other equipment that dials phone numbers by April 2. (EDITORS: A list of some equipment and services that may require reprogramming follows this release.) -- Check with your security company or the supplier of your PBX business phone system to make sure your systems are programmed to handle the new area codes. -- Update phone lists, databases, Web pages, billing records and address books with the new area codes. -- Include the area code when giving out your phone number. These New Year's reminders are part of Verizon's campaign to inform residents and businesses in Eastern Massachusetts about the four new area codes and how that will affect the dialing of local phone calls. The new area codes will have the same geographic boundaries as the current 617, 508, 781 and 978 area codes. These "overlay" area codes eliminate the need to split the existing codes into ever-smaller areas to create new phone numbers and allow existing customers to keep their current numbers. The new area codes will coincide with existing area codes as follows: -- 857 will overlay 617 -- 774 will overlay 508 -- 339 will overlay 781 -- 351 will overlay 978 While telephone numbers in the existing area codes will not change, callers in Eastern Massachusetts will need to dial 10 digits -- the area code and seven-digit number -- for all local calls and "1" plus 10 digits for all toll calls. If they prefer, customers may complete all calls -- local, toll and long distance -- by dialing "1" plus 10 digits. This change affects Eastern Massachusetts customers only. Customers in the 413 area code in Western Massachusetts will continue to dial all their calls as they do today. "Customers in Eastern Massachusetts should get familiar with the new dialing method and reprogram their equipment now so both are ready before April 2," said Rick Colon, manager for area-code customer education. "A few minutes of preparation now will ensure that their calls go through once the dialing change occurs." Beginning May 2, local telephone companies may assign numbers in the new 857, 774, 339 and 351 area codes to customers who request new phone service or additional lines. The demand for new telephone numbers is exploding as Massachusetts residents and businesses increasingly have a choice of which company provides their local phone service. These competing companies require phone numbers for their customers. Just three years ago, two new area codes were created in Massachusetts by splitting existing area codes in half. The 781 area code was carved out of the 617 code and the 978 area code was carved out of the 508 area code. With the addition of the four new overlay codes in 2001, Massachusetts will have nine area codes. Nationwide, the number of new area codes also is increasing as a result of the heavy demand for additional phone numbers. The additional area codes and new dialing pattern will not affect current telephone numbers, the price of telephone service or local calling areas. In addition, customers will still dial 911 to reach emergency services. Verizon is informing its customers about the dialing change and new area codes through letters to businesses, inserts in phone bills, advertising, outreach to senior citizens and others, and special activities. "Through our extensive educational campaign, we're doing all we can help our customers get ready for the new area codes and dialing changes," said Colon. More information on the area codes and dialing changes is available Monday through Friday from 9 a.m. to 5 p.m. by calling Verizon's toll-free Area Code Information Line at 877-554-3685. Customers also may visit the company's area code pages on the World Wide Web at http://www.bellatlantic.com/areacode/pages/ma.htm. Verizon Communications Inc. (NYSE: VZ , news , msgs ), formed by the merger of Bell Atlantic and GTE, is one of the world's leading providers of communications services. Verizon companies are the largest providers of wireline and wireless communications in the United States, with more than 101 million access line equivalents and more than 26 million wireless customers. A Fortune 10 company with more than 260,000 employees and approximately $60 billion in 1999 revenues, Verizon's global presence extends to 40 countries in the Americas, Europe, Asia and the Pacific. For more information on Verizon, visit http://www.verizon.com. ON THE INTERNET: Verizon news releases, executive speeches and biographies, news media contacts and other information are available at Verizon's News Center on the World Wide Web ( http://www.verizon.com/news). To receive news releases by email, visit the News Center and register for personalized automatic delivery of Verizon news releases. ATTENTION CUSTOMERS IN THESE AREA CODES: 617 / 508 / 781 / 978 Get Ready Now for Ten Digit or "1" + Ten-Digit Dialing For All Local & Toll Calls Customers with phone numbers in the 617/ 508 / 781 / 978 area codes need to reprogram any telephone equipment, computer or service that currently dials seven-digit phone numbers. The change is necessary for the introduction of new area codes in Eastern Massachusetts this spring. Customers should reprogram that equipment or service as soon as possible so that it dials ten digits or "1" plus ten digits for all seven-digit numbers they dial today. This reprogramming must be completed by April 2. Examples of equipment or Verizon services that may need to be reprogrammed include: -- Computers used for Internet access -- Modems -- Speed dialing lists -- Automatic dialers -- Cellular and mobile phones -- Security systems (check with your security company) -- PBX business phone systems (check with your PBX supplier) -- Pagers -- Fax machines -- Home Voice Mail or Answer Call/Voice Mail features -- Call Forwarding In addition, be sure to update phone lists, databases, Web pages, billing records and address books to include area codes and include the area code when exchanging telephone numbers. For more information on Massachusetts area codes or how to dial calls, call Verizon's toll-free Area Code Information Line on 877-554-3685. Customers also may visit the company's area code pages on the World Wide Web ( http://www.verizon.com/areacode/pages/ma.htm). SOURCE Verizon Communications Inc. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 2 Jan 2001 12:29:04 -0500 From: heywood@gloucester.com (Heywood Jaiblomi) Subject: Whise is Peacefire still on Media3??? steve@uxn.com (Steve Linford) wrote >What the heck are you still doing in that class C? That, I believe is the key question. I also think that Steve Sobol (or someone else) offered free hosting for peacefire.org if they would like to move. In the interests of full disclosure, I think the quesitoning should focus on why peacefire.org is still where they are. Has there been any money or other valuable consideration exchange hands? - -- It ain't the whistle that moves the train. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 2 Jan 2001 12:49:56 -0500 From: "Steve Hayes" Subject: RE: POTS line terminations In Telecom Digest V2000, No. 164, Roy Smith asked about a list of line termination impedances and, in particular, why the capacitances are shown with such precision. Others have since also questioned why the capacitance values are non-standard. The list of impedances follows: > ohms600Real - 600 Ohms. > ohms600Complex - 600 Ohms + 2.16uF > ohms900Complex - 900 Ohms + 2.16uF. > ohmsComplex1 - complex 1; > 220 Ohms + 820 Ohms || 115nF. > This impedance is primarily used in > Germany. > ohmsComplex2 - complex 2; > 270 Ohms + 750 Ohms || 150nF. > This impedance is primarily used in > United Kingdom and Sweden. These values are intended to model the typical impedances of phone lines of varying lengths and constructions with typical equipment attached to the far end. The actual impedances vary quite a lot (e.g. with the length of the line) so they are all rough approximations. The main purpose of these impedances is to provide an ideal target which new equipment can be designed to match. For example, if you design a new telephone and go through the bureaucratic process of getting it approved (e.g. FCC registration), it will have to be tested for various parameters when connected to a line simulator matching one of these impedances (according to the particular specification). If you want your phone also approved in another country, it may have to be tested against a different impedance from this list (and with different tests and requirements as well). This doesn't mean that it must match any of the impedances exactly and it will not have to be built using the particular value capacitors or components with very close tolerances. It just needs to be near enough to pass the tests. However in the case of equipment used internally in the phone system (e.g. the Cisco unit that prompted the original post), the specifications are likely to be tighter and it may be necessary to adjust the unit to the particular impedance specified. This sort of equipment is much more expensive than a $10 phone and the extra cost of a few custom capacitors to meet the specifications is not that significant. To make the test results consistent and reproducible, the line simulator used must match the specified impedances very closely (1% or better). This can be done by using stable components (e.g. polystyrene capacitors) and selecting them using accurate measuring equipment. Several capacitors may be connected in parallel to get the exact value needed. This makes the line simulator an expensive device but only one needs to be made. Of course things would be easier if all the authorities could agree on a single test impedance but that isn't the way the world works... Steve Hayes South Wales, U.K. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 2 Jan 2001 14:41:30 -0500 From: Angus TeleManagement Subject: Telecom Update (Canada) #264, January 2, 2001 ************************************************************ TELECOM UPDATE Angus TeleManagement's Weekly Telecom Newsbulletin http://www.angustel.ca Number 264: January 2, 2001 Publication of Telecom Update is made possible by generous financial support from: AT&T Canada ...................... http://www.attcanada.com/ Bell Canada ............................ http://www.bell.ca/ C1 Communications ......... http://www.c1communications.com/ Cisco Systems Canada ................. http://www.cisco.com/ Lucent Technologies Canada ........... http://www.lucent.ca/ Norigen ............................ http://www.norigen.com/ Sprint Canada .................. http://www.sprintcanada.ca/ ************************************************************ IN THIS ISSUE: ** Telus Appeals CRTC Subsidy Decision ** 10-Digit Dialing Ordered in Montreal ** RIM Sales Rise 45% in Three Months ** Look Gets Credit Extension ** MTS Buys E-Business Company ** Telus Amalgamates Operating Subsidiaries ** Globalstar Phones Add Data ** JDS Delays SDL Purchase ** Russo Named Avaya Chair ** Itemus Acquires Digital ** Nasdaq Delists RSL Com ** Sprint Unveils French Portal ** Unique Broadband Gets $25 Million ** Telus to Offer E-Business Solutions in Ottawa ** New AT&T Canada Rep on CPC Board ** Aliant Units Complete Merger ** Telemanagement Features Local Competitors ============================================================ TELUS APPEALS CRTC SUBSIDY DECISION: Telus has asked the Federal Court of Appeal for leave to appeal the new telecom subsidy regime ordered in CRTC Decision 2000-745. Telus says that the subsidy will be too low, because the new formula is based on the telcos' incremental costs rather than embedded costs. (See Telecom Update #261, 263). 10-DIGIT DIALING ORDERED IN MONTREAL: CRTC Order 2000-1187 approves introduction of a new Area Code in Montreal, effective June 7, 2003. The new code will be overlaid on 514, and 10-digit local dialing will be introduced on January 18, 2003. ** The published order incorrectly gives the date for 10-digit dialing as January 2002: we expect the Commission to issue a correction next week. http://www.crtc.gc.ca/archive/Orders/2000/O2000-1187e.htm RIM SALES RISE 45% IN THREE MONTHS: Research In Motion reports revenues of US$61.6 Million for the three months ended November 30, 45% more than the previous quarter and 160% more than the previous year. Net income was $1.5 Million. LOOK GETS CREDIT EXTENSION: Look Communications says its bankers have granted it a four-week extension on a $50 Million payment that was due December 31. The company is seeking either a new investor or a buyer for its digital television and Internet service businesses. MTS BUYS E-BUSINESS COMPANY: Manitoba Telecom has agreed to buy Ottawa-based Exocom Group of Companies, which provides e- business services to corporate clients, for $20 Million. Exocom, which has about 130 employees, will be merged over time with MTS's Qunara e-business division. TELUS AMALGAMATES OPERATING SUBSIDIARIES: Effective January 1, Telus Corp. has amalgamated its major operating subsidiaries into a single operating company, Telus Communications Inc. ** The CRTC has not yet ruled on Telus' request for confirmation that this amalgamation will not trigger re-regulation of its competitive business outside of Alberta and BC (see Telecom Update #231, 241). GLOBALSTAR PHONES ADD DATA: Globalstar Canada's satellite phones now offer CDMA-based data transfer and Internet access at 9.6 Kbps. JDS DELAYS SDL PURCHASE: JDS Uniphase has postponed until January completion of its purchase of SDL, a California-based fibre optics supplier, because of delays in obtaining U.S. and Canadian regulatory approval. (See Telecom Update #241) RUSSO NAMED AVAYA CHAIR: It's musical chairs time at Lucent and Avaya these days. Patricia Russo has resigned as Executive VP of Lucent Technologies to become chairman of Avaya's Board. She replaces Henry Schacht, who recently resigned from Avaya's Board to become chairman and CEO of Lucent. ITEMUS ACQUIRES DIGITAL: Itemus Inc, headed by former BCE Emergis executive Jim Tobin, has agreed to buy Digital 4Sight, a consulting firm headed by Don Tapscott and David Ticoll, for $22 Million in shares and $2 Million in cash. Tapscott and Ticoll will join the Itemus Board. NASDAQ DELISTS RSL COM: Class A shares of RSL Communications, the parent company of LD carrier RSL Canada were delisted from the Nasdaq National Market on December 29. The company's shares fell from US$32.50 in March to less than 20 cents in December. SPRINT UNVEILS FRENCH PORTAL: Sprint Canada has launched a French-language consumer Internet portal, www.sprint.ca/maxi. UNIQUE BROADBAND GETS $25 MILLION: Unique Broadband Systems has received the $25 Million due under a settlement of its lawsuit against PixStream, recently acquired by Cisco. Unique says it now has "more than enough cash on hand" to fund all of its current projects. TELUS TO OFFER E-BUSINESS SOLUTIONS IN OTTAWA: Telus and Kanata-based DCIenable have formed an alliance to "develop, market and deliver custom e-business solutions to business customers in the Ottawa region." NEW AT&T CANADA REP ON CPC BOARD: Canada Payphone has added Stewart Thompson, AT&T Canada's VP Sales, Wholesale, to its Board, replacing Greg McCamus, who has left AT&T Canada. (See Telecom Update #261) ALIANT UNITS COMPLETE MERGER: Aliant has completed the amalgamation of its four provincial units: NewTel, Island Tel, MT&T, and NBTel. TELEMANAGEMENT FEATURES LOCAL COMPETITORS: Puzzled by the array of 17 Canadian carriers offering competitive local service? The January issue of Telemanagement, available this week, provides a handy guide to their services, coverage areas, and strategies. Also in Telemanagement: ** Ian Angus on George Gilder's "Telecosm": "Tunnel Vision on the Broadband Revolution" ** Lis Angus interviews Telus CEO Darren Entwhistle on Telus's new strategy and reorganization To subscribe to Telemanagement, call 1-800-263-4415, ext 500 or visit the Telemanagement home page at http://www.angustel.ca. ============================================================ HOW TO SUBMIT ITEMS FOR TELECOM UPDATE E-MAIL: editors@angustel.ca FAX: 905-686-2655 MAIL: TELECOM UPDATE Angus TeleManagement Group 8 Old Kingston Road Ajax, Ontario Canada L1T 2Z7 =========================================================== HOW TO SUBSCRIBE (OR UNSUBSCRIBE) TELECOM UPDATE is provided in electronic form only. There are two formats available: 1. The fully-formatted edition is posted on the World Wide Web on the first business day of the week at http://www.angustel.ca 2. The e-mail edition is distributed free of charge. To subscribe, send an e-mail message to: listmanager@subs.postmastergeneral.com Insert as the subject of your message the two words: subscribe TelecomUpdate To stop receiving the e-mail edition, send an e-mail message to: listmanager@subs.postmastergeneral.com Insert as the subject of your message the two words: unsubscribe TelecomUpdate =========================================================== COPYRIGHT AND DISCLAIMER: All contents copyright 2001 Angus TeleManagement Group Inc. All rights reserved. For further information, including permission to reprint or reproduce, please e-mail rosita@angustel.ca or phone 905-686-5050 ext 225. The information and data included has been obtained from sources which we believe to be reliable, but Angus TeleManagement makes no warranties or representations whatsoever regarding accuracy, completeness, or adequacy. Opinions expressed are based on interpretation of available information, and are subject to change. If expert advice on the subject matter is required, the services of a competent professional should be obtained. ============================================================ JOHN RIDDELL jriddell@angustel.ca Angus TeleManagement Group http://www.angustel.ca 8 Old Kingston Road Tel: 905-686-5050 x226 Ajax Ontario L1T 2Z7 Canada Fax: 905-686-2655 - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ End of Telecom Digest V2000 #172 ******************************** Date: 3 Jan 2001 00:06:32 -0500 From: owner-telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org (Telecom Digest) To: telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org Subject: Telecom Digest V2000 #173 Telecom Digest Wednesday, January 3 2001 Volume 2000 : Number 173 In this issue: Re: Local vs. Long Distance from NPA-NXX? Re: kill this meme: "Media3 put Peacefire in the line of fire..." Re: Local vs. Long Distance from NPA-NXX? Telecom Digest questions FW: failure notice Re: POTS line terminations. Re: court decisions on ads as "free speech" CFP: ACM MobiCom 2001 : The Seventh Annual International Conference on Mobile Computing and Networking wasting area code resources (was 4 new area codes for Massachusetts to cause mandatory 10 digit dialing soon) Re: 1+ as a toll indicator Re: wasting area code resources (was 4 new area codes for Massachusetts to cause mandatory 10 digit dialing soon) 1/2/01 ICBTollFreeNews.Com HEADS UP HEADLINES Re: BLOCK: Media3, peacefire.org Re: BLOCK: Media3, peacefire.org Re: wasting area code resources (was 4 new area codes for Massachusetts to cause mandatory 10 digit dialing soon) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 2 Jan 2001 14:50:39 -0500 From: Linc Madison Subject: Re: Local vs. Long Distance from NPA-NXX? In article <3A4DBA81.661.4594B0C@localhost>, Richard M. Sander wrote: > Short of calling the LEC, does anyone know of any public-domain > resource(s) that can determine, given two NPA-NNX's, whether a call > between the two would be local, intraLATA or long distance? Thanks > in advance! No, and in fact I can say with little doubt that there are none. It's simply far too complex a matrix to expect anyone to put it up for free. You can determine whether the call will be intraLATA or interLATA very easily with public-domain resources, but local versus not-local is much trickier, especially since there are places where there is a gradual progression from local to "extended local"/"zone" to "local toll" to "toll," or where there are optional calling plans and so forth. has links to the information about what prefixes are in what LATA. NANPA = North American Numbering Plan Administrator. If you want to know what prefixes are local to you, your ONLY option (short of trying to dig through your PUC tariffs) is to call your LEC. Many of the ILECs will often claim that they can't tell you whether another company's prefix is local to you, but that is an outright lie; you should demand a supervisor immediately if any customer service person tells you such a thing, and ask that the person be reprimanded. The only way we can squash this recurring lie is to pounce upon it every time it is repeated. The LEC most definitely does know with complete certainty which prefixes, on EVERY SINGLE OTHER LEC, are local to you, their customer. Otherwise, they would be utterly unable to prepare a bill for you each month. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 2 Jan 2001 15:35:08 -0500 From: Linc Madison Subject: Re: kill this meme: "Media3 put Peacefire in the line of fire..." In article <10101020247.AA2334@daveanderson.com>, Dave Anderson wrote: > On Mon, 01 Jan 2001 09:21:50 -0800, > Bennett Haselton wrote: > > >At 12:00 PM 1/1/01 EST, Dave Anderson wrote: > >> > >>your research has been incredibly shoddy. ... For me, and probably > >>for a lot of other people, you've done major damange to Peacefire's > >>credibility. > > > >Do you have anything specific? > > Knowledge of how spammers and spam-service providers operate, ... and > of the reputations of some of the people who've been pointing out > your errors. > > Based on this ... I have little doubt that Media3 deliberately > and without warning put Peacefire in the middle of a nest of spammers > and/or spam supporters that it knew was already on the RBL with the > explicit intention of causing the type of outcry you've been making, > and that they have been consistently lying to you to fan the flames. > > Failing to thoroughly check out the situation and the history that > led to it (especially if, as appears to be the case, you largely > accepted as true whatever Media3 told you) before posting rather > inflammatory comments is, in my book, shoddy research. Agreed, and indeed, your "Do you have anything specific?" was disingenuous in the context of this entire thread, and highly damaging to your credibility. Bennett, you're being far more thick-headed than the people who write the censorware programs you monitor. You are damaging not only Peacefire, but, by association, everyone else who fights against overly broad censorware products. You, both personally and organizationally, are being co-opted. Is it really more important to you to fight in favor of spamware and spam support services than to fight against censorware that blocks sites indiscriminately? Peacefire can only do one or the other with any hope of effectiveness. (You as an individual can do both, but not Peacefire as an organization, even if Peacefire is just you plus a few support staffers. Perhaps you need to clarify in your own mind the delineation between Bennett Haselton and Peacefire.org.) "Peacefire.org was created in August 1996 to represent the interests of people under 18 in the debate over freedom of speech on the Internet." [quoted from www.peacefire.org] How, exactly, is your siding with Media3 in its battle against MAPS in line with this purpose? People like me, who believe that unmonitored censorware is a very dangerous thing, are rethinking their support for Peacefire because of your irrational behavior and words. If you want to have any credibility at all in this discussion, you need to provide direct, unequivocal answers to questions including the following: * Did Media3 disclose to you at the time you entered your current agreement with them, that the netblock into which they were assigning you was already listed in the MAPS RBL? (Or, if your agreement predates the actual listing, that a nomination was in progress?) * Have you requested that Media3 move you to a netblock that is not in the MAPS RBL? If so, what has been their response? If not, *WHY* *NOT*? * If Media3 has been unwilling to move you to a different netblock, WHY have you not moved your web site to a different provider? * Did you knowingly permit Media3 to place www.peacefire.org in a black-holed netblock? If so, *WHY*? You have also made a statement regarding spamware that I find alarmingly disingenuous in and of itself. You have said that you believe web sites should be free to sell spamware, because they have no control of how it will be used. That's a bogus argument: there is no possible legitimate use to a piece of software that scans newsgroups for e-mail addresses and then sends bulk e-mail to those addresses, using forged headers and open SMTP relays. It is software that has no POSSIBLE legitimate use, so saying that the writer has no knowledge of the way end users are employing it, is nothing but a cop-out. Sites that sell spamware clearly meet the requirements to be listed in the RBL, as well they should. ISPs that continue to host sites that sell spamware also clearly meet the RBL requirements -- again, as well they should. Your complaint should not be against MAPS or the RBL, but against Media3. Do *YOU* have anything specific to rebut that claim? (Yes, I read your article about the MAPS press release, and that doesn't cut it, either.) - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 2 Jan 2001 15:52:12 -0500 From: Linc Madison Subject: Re: Local vs. Long Distance from NPA-NXX? In article <3A5114B9.B641999A@garlic.com>, Roy wrote: > I don't see the LATA codes in the NANPA lists I use (CA). The rate > center is there but then you have to know which rate center is in > which LATA and I am not sure that even works. My goodness, you're right. I mostly use lists from Telcordia TRA, which do include the LATA but which also cost money (although the monthly update is free). The lists from NANPA include the OCN and company name, plus the rate center and switch ID, but not the LATA. The rate center does tell you the LATA, though. Each rate center is in only one LATA. For example, here in San Francisco, we have "SNFC CNTRL" "SNFC MT-EV" and "SNFC JUNPR" rate centers, which are, in plain English, "San Francisco Central," "San Francisco Montrose-Evergreen," and "San Francisco Juniper," also known as San Francisco 1, 2, and 3. All three are in the San Francisco LATA. You can check out the Telcordia monthly update files I mentioned at Again, those will give LATA information, but nothing about local calling areas. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 2 Jan 2001 16:08:58 -0500 From: "Patrick Barnhart" Subject: Telecom Digest questions FW: failure notice Patrick, Sorry to track you down at another address, but my initial email bounced...see below. I just visited your telecom archives site...very interesting. I'm wondering if you might be able to point me to some additional information for a project that we are working on here at INFORM. Currently, we are conducting a study on wireless electronic products (particularly cell phones). The study is focused on best practices for end-of-life management of these products. Can you point me to some additional contacts who might have useful information on this topic? Here is the initial data that I'm looking for. 1. Numbers of wireless products sold historically and due on the market in 5 years. 2. Estimates of length of life for the devices. 3. Material composition of the products. 4. Reuse options (such as gifts to anti-domestic violence organizations) for wireless devices. 5. Take back programs initiated by manufacturers or resellers. 6. Amounts recycled and technologies. INFORM is a non-profit environmental research organization. Our goal is to identify ways of doing business that ensure environmentally sustainable economic growth. We issue reports that are used by government, industry, and environmental leaders around the world. Thank you for your assistance. Patrick Barnhart Research Associate Inform, Inc. 120 Wall Street, 16th Floor New York, NY 10005 212-361-2400 xt. 224 http://www.informinc.org - -----Original Message----- From: MAILER-DAEMON@xuxa.iecc.com [mailto:MAILER-DAEMON@xuxa.iecc.com] Sent: Tuesday, January 02, 2001 2:41 PM To: barnhart@informinc.org Subject: failure notice Hi. This is the qmail-send program at xuxa.iecc.com. I'm afraid I wasn't able to deliver your message to the following addresses. This is a permanent error; I've given up. Sorry it didn't work out. : Sorry, no mailbox here by that name. (#5.1.1) - --- Below this line is a copy of the message. Return-Path: Received: (qmail 3182 invoked from network); 2 Jan 2001 15:40:39 -0500 Received: from www.informinc.org (38.221.204.3) by mail2.iecc.com with SMTP; 2 Jan 2001 15:40:39 -0500 Received: from patrick (38.221.204.13) by www.informinc.org with SMTP (Eudora Internet Mail Server 1.3.1); Tue, 2 Jan 2001 15:49:18 -0500 From: "Patrick Barnhart" To: Subject: Telecom digest - questions about recycling cell phones Date: Tue, 2 Jan 2001 15:42:36 -0600 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 2 Jan 2001 16:54:33 -0500 From: Roy McCammon Subject: Re: POTS line terminations. Roy Smith wrote: > > I was reading through cisco's Voice Analog Interface MIB, and came upon > a list of possible line termination impedences, including: > > > ohms600Real - 600 Ohms. > > ohms600Complex - 600 Ohms + 2.16uF > > ohms900Complex - 900 Ohms + 2.16uF. > The last 2 entries seem relatively self-explanitory, but what about the > first three? Where, and under what circumstances, might you expect to > see analog phone lines terminated in those ways? For the last two, never. If you plot the impedance of phone lines terminated with the typical Western Electric telephone of 1970, they would cluster into two groups: one for loaded lines and one for unloaded lines. The 2.16uF was a compromise termination between the groups. The three decimal places was overzealous bureaucracy. I used to design test equipment that had to provide that termination. My recollection is that we had to use a 1% or 2% capacitor, but that was test equipment which is supposed to be better than the equipment it tests. > -- > The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail > messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. - -- If you are one in a million; there are 6000 people just like you. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 2 Jan 2001 18:30:30 -0500 From: Steve Linford Subject: Re: court decisions on ads as "free speech" In article <901CE3C31heywoodgloucestercom@209.87.239.10>, heywood@gloucester.com (Heywood Jaiblomi) wrote: > A case decided by the U.S. Supreme Court in 1970 is often quoted as > showing the rights of the individual exceed that of the speaker. > The case dealt with unwanted postal mail. > > In the Supreme Court's decision in Rowan v. U.S. Post Office, the > court held: "Nothing in the Constitution compels us to listen to or > to view any unwanted communication, whatever its merit. . . We > therefore categorically reject the argument that a vendor has the > right under the Constitution or otherwise to send unwanted material > into the home of another. . . We repeat, the right of a mailer > stops at the outer boundary of every person's domain." Specifically regarding spam and freedom of speech there is a more recent quote; in 1998 US Federal Judge Stanley Sporkin said: "[Spammers] have come to court not because their freedom of speech is threatened but because their profits are; to dress up their complaints in First Amendment garb demeans the principles for which the First Amendment stands." - -- Steve Linford - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 2 Jan 2001 18:53:16 -0500 From: dawn@eecs.wsu.edu Subject: CFP: ACM MobiCom 2001 : The Seventh Annual International Conference on Mobile Computing and Networking Enclosed below please find a Preliminary Announcement and Call for Papers for the 7th Annual International Conference on Mobile Computing and Networking (MobiCom) to be held in Rome, Italy from July 16-21, 2001. As you might already know, MobiCom has an established reputation as the pre-eminent conference in this area owing to the exceptionally high quality of papers, excellent tutorials and workshops, and stimulating panels conducted by mobile computing illuminati of various stripes. For complete information about the upcoming conference, please visit: http://www.research.ibm.com/mobicom2001/ A printer friendly version of this CFP is available at: http://www.eecs.wsu.edu/~krishna/Mobicom2001-onepagecfp.pdf (PDF) http://www.eecs.wsu.edu/~krishna/Mobicom2001-onepagecfp.ps (PS) We apologize if you received multiple copies of this Call for Papers. Please feel free to distribute it to those who might be interested. Very truly yours, ACM SIGMOBILE MobiCom 2001 Organizing Committee *********************************************************************** Preliminary Announcement and Call for Papers *** ACM MobiCom 2001 *** The Seventh Annual International Conference on Mobile Computing and Networking July 16-21, Rome, Italy Sponsored by ACM SIGMOBILE http://www.research.ibm.com/mobicom2001/ http://www.acm.org/sigmobile/ Submission Deadline: January 12, 2001 *********************************************************************** PAPERS: Technical papers (maximum 15 pages) describing original, previously unpublished, completed research, not currently under review by another conference or journal, are solicited on the following topics: * Applications and computing services supporting mobile users * Architectures, protocols, and algorithms to cope with mobility, limited bandwidth, or intermittent connectivity * Database and data management issues in mobile computing * Performance of mobile/wireless networks and systems * Security and privacy of mobile/wireless systems * Interaction between different layers of mobile/wireless systems * Integration and interworking of wired and wireless networks * Adaptive applications and systems for mobile environments * Distributed-system aspects of mobile systems * Operating system support for mobility * Location-dependent applications * Wireless multimedia systems * Power management * Mobile agents * Pervasive computing * Wireless sensor networks * Wireless/mobile service management and delivery All papers will be refereed by the program committee. Accepted papers will be published in the conference proceedings. Papers of particular merit will be proposed for publication in the ACM/Baltzer Wireless Networks (WINET) and Mobile Networks and Applications (MONET) journals. Note: Student Registrations will be provided at a discounted rate. CHALLENGES SESSION, PANELS, RESEARCH DEMOS, TUTORIALS: Short papers (maximum of 8 pages) that challenge the mobile computing community with new technologies or visionary applications are solicited. Such papers should provide stimulating ideas or visions that may open up exciting avenues of mobile computing research. Proposals are solicited for panels that examine innovative, controversial, or otherwise provocative issues of interest. Proposals for tutorials are solicited. Tutorial topics that encompass the systems aspects of mobile computing and/or practical experiences in building/deploying such systems are of particular interest. Informal proposals for research demos are solicited. Proposals should include: the focus area in mobility, the technologies involved, specific equipment used, demo layout, space required, etc. Please refer to the conference website for submission and other details. (The paper submission website is READY for submissions now.) IMPORTANT DATES: * Technical Paper Submissions due: January 12, 2001 - Please refer to the website for submission instructions * Notification of acceptance: May 1, 2001 * Camera-ready version due: May 15, 2001 * Challenges Session Papers, Panel Proposals, Tutorial Proposals Submissions due: January 12, 2001 - Please refer to the website for submission instructions FOR MORE INFORMATION: Send email to mobicom2001@winlab.rutgers.edu with any questions or comments about the conference or for more information. ORGANIZING COMMITTEE: * General Chair: * Tutorials Co-Chairs: Christopher Rose Ravi Jain Rutgers University, WINLAB Telcordia Technologies * General Vice Chair: Chiara Petrioli Politecnico di Milano Sergio Palazzo Universita` di Catania * Panels Chair: * Program Co-Chairs: Ramesh Rao Univ. of California, San Diego Mahmoud Naghshineh IBM T.J. Watson Research Center * Local Arrangement Chair: Michele Zorzi Marco Listanti Universita` di Ferrara Universita` di Roma "La Sapienza" * Finance Chair: Chiara Petrioli Politecnico di Milano David B. Johnson Rice University * Registration Chair: * Exhibits/Sponsorships Chair: Irene Katzela Marco Ajmone Marsan Lucent Technologies Politecnico di Torino * Publicity Co-Chairs: * Research Demos Chair: Stefano Basagni Nigel Davies Univ. of Texas at Dallas Lancaster University Krishna Sivalingam * Steering Committee Chair: Washington State University Imrich Chlamtac Univ. of Texas at Dallas *********************************************************************** - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 2 Jan 2001 18:54:37 -0500 From: Joseph Singer Subject: wasting area code resources (was 4 new area codes for Massachusetts to cause mandatory 10 digit dialing soon) 2 Jan 2001 12:04:15 -0500 "Cole T. Kracke" wrote: >Verizon Suggests New Year's Resolutions for Eastern Massachusetts Customers >Getting Four New Area Codes >Beginning April 2, Callers Must Dial 10 Digits Or '1' Plus 10 Digits for All >Local Calls >BOSTON, Jan. 2 /PRNewswire/ -- Verizon suggests some New Year's resolutions >for consumers and businesses in Eastern Massachusetts who are getting four >new area codes this spring. Why is it that this assignment of 4 area codes at once seems extremely wasteful use of area code numbering? 617 was adequate for eastern Massachusetts for many many years. Why didn't the Mass. PUC just assign one new area code for all those areas and when that was exhausted pancake another one on top. That's the advantage you have of having overlays. Gobbling up extra area codes all at once seems awful wasteful and will in fact hasten the day when the whole of the NANP has to have a major revision. - --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Joseph Singer Seattle, Washington USA [ICQ pgr] +1 206 405 2052 [voice mail] +1 206 493 0706 [FAX] - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 2 Jan 2001 18:57:17 -0500 From: craigm@earthling.net (Craig Macbride) Subject: Re: 1+ as a toll indicator "Adam H. Kerman" writes: >>Phone: (02) 4221 xxxx >>Intl: +61 2 4221 xxxx > >Which is why I say your way of writing phone numbers for domestic use is >confusing. Another version is "+61 (0)2 4221 xxxx". >Does Australia have a nationwide dialing plan? Then it should be >assumed that domestic callers know to use the "0" dialing prefix before the >area code. Your numbers should be written 2 4221 xxxx. Then that way, neither >domestic nor internation callers are confused. Those of us outside Australia >are clever enough to look up the country code if we don't know it, but it is >too much to expect us to know if the leading 0 is a significant digit or a >domestic dialing prefix. Most people don't know the dialing prefix. If I look up a Malaysian or Austrian or whatever number on the net, I don't want to have to look up the country code. If the company wants my business, they had better have put their country code or I'm very unlikely to bother calling them. If by "nationwide dialing plan" you mean a set number of digits per number and per area code then, yes, we do now, but this is quite recent. The Australian system is not limited to specific numbers of digits as the US system is. That is why we changed from 7-digit to 8-digit numbers so easily. However, in the past, there were 5-, 6- and 7-digit local numbers in different areas with 2-, 3- and 4-digit area codes (including the 0). 10 years ago, numbers2054 12345 and 541 2345 would probably both have been valid from a capital city. The former was the number "12345" in the area "054" and would have been "+61 54 12345" when dialed from overseas, while the latter was the number "541 2345" in ones local area which, if it were Sydney, would have been "+61 2 541 2345" when dialed from overseas. Now that all local numbers have been converted to 8 digits and all area codes converted to 2 digits (including the 0), we could omit the leading 0 altogether. However, all Australians are used to the 0 marking the start of an area code and it would look strange. >No, I do not agree that North Americans should write phone number including the >dialing prefix, ever. I believe it would be rather nice if the US was consistent with the international standard and would use +1 all the time, just as I believe Australians would be best off using +61 on any number likely to be seen by people overseas. - -- Craig Macbride - -----------------------http://www.nyx.net/~cmacbrid------------------------ "It's a sense of humour like mine, Carla, that makes me proud to be ashamed of myself." - Captain Kremmen - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 2 Jan 2001 20:31:06 -0500 From: Linc Madison Subject: Re: wasting area code resources (was 4 new area codes for Massachusetts to cause mandatory 10 digit dialing soon) In article <3.0.5.32.20010102123111.008ed440@oz.net>, Joseph Singer wrote: > 2 Jan 2001 12:04:15 -0500 "Cole T. Kracke" wrote: > > >BOSTON, Jan. 2 /PRNewswire/ -- Verizon suggests some New Year's > >resolutions for consumers and businesses in Eastern Massachusetts > >who are getting four new area codes this spring. [info about > >overlays on 617, 508, 781, and 978] > > Why is it that this assignment of 4 area codes at once seems > extremely wasteful use of area code numbering? 617 was adequate for > eastern Massachusetts for many many years. Why didn't the Mass. PUC > just assign one new area code for all those areas and when that was > exhausted pancake another one on top. That's the advantage you have > of having overlays. Gobbling up extra area codes all at once seems > awful wasteful and will in fact hasten the day when the whole of the > NANP has to have a major revision. The flip side of that coin is that re-integrating area codes that were split into a single overlay, takes away what benefits the people who were split got in return for the inconvenience of the split. Okay, yes, you had to change your number, but at least you got a more specific geographic identity for your trouble. When you say 978, you know (if you've heard of 978, at least) that it's northeastern Mass. On the other hand, when you hear 564, you'll only know that it's somewhere in the western part of Washington state -- it could be Vancouver or Olympia or Seattle or anywhere in between. The crux of this issue is that the 617/781 split was wrong. It should have been an overlay. The 508/978 split, and the 617/508 split before that, made some geographic sense. The reason for doing all four overlays at once, though, is simply that it's cheaper to run one customer education campaign over a slightly broader area, than to run four separate campaigns all buying airtime on the Boston tv and radio stations. Were it not for that, the four overlays might be spread over a couple or three years. Merging my last two paragraphs, you could make a case for putting a single overlay on 617 and 781, since 781 has the least well-defined geographic identity of the eastern Mass codes. However, it would be somewhat confusing to have one combining overlay simultaneous with two ordinary overlays, besides which it's 617 that most desperately needs numbers, last I checked. I hope that, at the very least, every effort is made to switch into the overlay code the town halls of the two Boston suburbs that went to the state legislature to redraw the 617/781 line (thereby dramatically advancing the need for further relief). They certainly deserve it. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 2 Jan 2001 21:34:56 -0500 From: "Judith Oppenheimer" Subject: 1/2/01 ICBTollFreeNews.Com HEADS UP HEADLINES ____________________________________________________ ICBTollFreeNews.Com HEADS UP HEADLINES ____________________________________________________ from ICB Toll Free News - Daily News and Intelligence covering the Political, Legal and Marketing Arenas of 800 and Dot Com. ____________________________________________________ !!! SALE EXTENDED TO JANUARY 15th !!! Save $400 on ICB Premium! CLICK HERE NOW: http://www.icbtollfree.com/Article_4910.html ____________________________________________________ CONTENTS - - NEW REGISTRIES DELAYED - - CELLO.COM - - WILL 2001 BE THE YEAR OF 'NEW' ROOTS? - - CORINTHIANS.COM - Update - - A RADICAL NEW DNS - - DEAR DR. CERF ... - - TELCORDIA VERSUS NEUSTAR - IT AIN'T JUST ENUM - - IM: THE REAL DEAL - - WHAT'S AN ACCREDITED REGISTRAR WORTH? - - EMPIRE IS THE NAME OF THE GAME - - CHINESE DOMAIN DISPUTE CENTER OPENS - - HEBREW COMES TO DOT COM - - PETITION FILED TO REVOKE REGISTER.COM'S REGISTRAR ACCREDITATION ___________________________________________________ CUSTOMER SERVICE NOTES: With over 4,000 articles archived, ICB is a popular research destination. Find all ICB headlines: http://www.icbtollfree.com/icbheadlns.cfm, or use ICB's search engine: http://icbtollfree.com/Search.cfm. Note: Registration is required. Contact information is NOT sold, leased, rented or shared in any manner. Buying, selling, seeking, announcing? ICB offers FREE classifieds: http://ICBclassifieds.com. _______________notices from our sponsors_______________ >>>>>>>>>>>>> http://1800TheExpert.com <<<<<<<<<<<<< 800 & Domain Name Acquisition Management, Lost/Stolen 800 # Retrieval, Litigation Support, Regulatory Navigation, Correlating Domain Name & Trademark Matters. ____________________________________________________ EVERY 3.6 SECONDS SOMEONE DIES FROM HUNGER http://www.hungersite.com/ ____________________________________________________ ARTICLE ACCESS CODE LEGEND ICB Toll Free News offers two valuable service options: F = Free - News and Features articles P = Premium - Unlimited Site Access including all Articles and Documents. ____________________________________________________ HEADLINES for January 2, 2001 F - NEW REGISTRIES DELAYED "We're close, but that doesn't mean we're ready to announce anything yet," ICANN President Mike Roberts told Newsbytes today. "In mid- to late January we will announce that we have completed (the first) contracts." Roberts would not speculate on when the new registries would come online. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4943 P - CELLO.COM U.S. Court Order notwithstanding, a UDRP tribunal defers to ICANN's "enlightened Procedures, Rules and Regulations." CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4941 P - WILL 2001 BE THE YEAR OF 'NEW' ROOTS? ASLAN, the root server operated by ADNS received over 2.4 million hits in December, up from over 20% from November. Palmer says that he knows of several nations that will switch away from ICANN to alternative root networks, sometime in the first half of 2001. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4940 P - CORINTHIANS.COM - Update The ruling eviscerates the registrar "safe harbor" provision of the ACPA. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4938 P - A RADICAL NEW DNS Several mechanisms have been proposed for placing multilingual names -- names normally written in non-ASCII character sets -- into the DNS or addressing the need for multilingual access to the Internet in other ways. Most of them involve, to one extent or another, workarounds to the current system. This draft document proposes a "go back and fix it" approach, replacing the "IN" Class in the DNS with one that is not limited to ASCII from its initial definitions. Some of the deployment issues, politics, and other drawbacks are also briefly discussed. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4937 P - DEAR DR. CERF ... We urge the Board to reopen registration for at-large membership and to elect at-large representatives for the four remaining at-large seats at the earliest possible time. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4934 more Headlines con't. below. _______________notices from our sponsors_______________ Are you a local or regional business that advertises in newspapers, direct mail, on radio or tv? 1 800 BRAND IT shared use marketing programs can help your sales skyrocket! http://www.1800BrandIt.com ____________________________________________________ IS YOUR BUSINESS LISTED? The Internet 800 Directory lists hundreds of thousands of toll free numbers and is viewed by millions each month. The Internet 800 Directory will list ANY business with a toll free number, regardless of long distance carrier, for free and was the first to do so. Go to http://gotollfree.com and see if your toll free number is listed. If not, click the Add Listing button to submit your toll free number for this free listing. ____________________________________________________ more HEADLINES for January 2, 2001 P - TELCORDIA VERSUS NEUSTAR - IT AIN'T JUST ENUM FCC document on Number Resource Optimization discusses Telcordia's contentions over NeuStar's unfair bidding advantage. Of broader interest: audits, and fees for number reservations. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4942 P - IM: THE REAL DEAL Time Warner chief Gerald Levin, asked to name the asset that would be the most valuable to a combined Time Warner/AOL, answered: "Instant messaging." CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4939 P - WHAT'S AN ACCREDITED REGISTRAR WORTH? At 600,000 domains plus new mTLD's, $750,000 in cash and 8,250,000 shares of stock (worth $6,187,500 at its current price.) CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4936 F - EMPIRE IS THE NAME OF THE GAME "The name of the game is much bigger than domain names now. It's all about building a greater Web presence," said chief executive Jim Rutt. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4935 F - CHINESE DOMAIN DISPUTE CENTER OPENS >From January 1, 2001 on, the Resolving Center will formally begin to handle disputes over registration of Chinese domain names. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4932 F - HEBREW COMES TO DOT COM The Hebrew domain names will end in either ".com," ".net" or ".org" in Hebrew letters. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4931 P - PETITION FILED TO REVOKE REGISTER.COM'S REGISTRAR ACCREDITATION There can be no dispute that Register.com has committed these breaches. Both ICANN and the U.S. District Court for the Southern District of New York have concluded that Register.com acted in excess of its authority under the Accreditation Agreement. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4933 ____________________________________________________ ABOUT ICB ICB HeadsUp Headlines Daily Email is sent by request. Subscriptions to Daily Email are free to qualified applicants. Visit http://www.icbtollfree.com/reg.cfm?NextURL=Index.cfm to sign up. Please feel free to pass along a copy to a friend, within reason so long as the message is not modified or used unfavorably. To unsubscribe mailto:editor@icbtollfree.com, subject: unsubscribe. ___________________ ADVERTISING INFORMATION ___________________ For information on advertising in ICB HeadsUp Headlines emails, see http://www.icbtollfree.com/ArticleId4415.html ____________________________________________________ Only subscribers or registered users of ICB Toll Free News web site will be able to access all or some of the full text of URLs provided. ____________________________________________________ Copyright © 2000 ICB, Inc. All rights reserved. ____________________________________________________ ------------------------------ Date: 2 Jan 2001 21:44:08 -0500 From: "John Willkie" Subject: Re: BLOCK: Media3, peacefire.org I have read these threads with some interest from the beginning last month. It occurs to me that there is a logical reason why bennett has not taken up Steve Sobol and others on their offer to host his site on their servers for free. The logical reason is that he gets a better deal from Media3. This would explain his lack of a response to several pointed questions, his inability to "understand" what is happening, etc. By better deal, I mean that he is PAID to be there. "Anti-censorship" (self-appointed) activist (clearly without a clue) is hosted by a company that is one thin step away from hosting spam. And, he gets put in the middle of a den of thieves and fakirs, only to complain to the wrong people. Repeatedly. Then, the illiterate (unable to read and understand the US Constitution) activist spews out at others (like AboveNet) with which he CHOOSES to have a beef. It's all childless whining, and it brings the "value" of peacefire.org to less than zero. Time to read contract law, Bennett. You've lost the ability to phone to someone with a clue. I say, go f**k yourself. There might be another logical answer. Beats me what it is. John Willkie P.S. It will be real interesting to read peacefire.org's IRS form 990's, assuming he ever gets to the point of becoming a 501(c)(x) organization. Me, I think it is generous to call his organization a "private charity." _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 2 Jan 2001 22:48:04 -0500 From: heywood@gloucester.com (Heywood Jaiblomi) Subject: Re: BLOCK: Media3, peacefire.org jmwillkie@hotmail.com (John Willkie) wrote >It occurs to me that there is a logical reason why bennett has not taken >up Steve Sobol and others on their offer to host his site on their >servers for free. You've successfully applied Ocam's Razor, the principle that says "The answer which requires the fewest assumptions is the correct one." Your hypothesis fits that, and I would like to see what Bennett has to say about it. - -- It ain't the whistle that moves the train. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 3 Jan 2001 00:06:29 -0500 From: Stanley Cline Subject: Re: wasting area code resources (was 4 new area codes for Massachusetts to cause mandatory 10 digit dialing soon) On 2 Jan 2001 18:54:37 -0500, in comp.dcom.telecom you wrote: >Why is it that this assignment of 4 area codes at once seems extremely >wasteful use of area code numbering? 617 was adequate for eastern IMO, four at once does seem to be a bit many. The problem in MA is more less the same problem that plagues CA, NY, and some other states: many tiny rate centers and complex and (especially in MA) bizarre local calling area/plan options that tend to rule out easy rate center consolidation. (To their credit, some CLECs in MA are now porting numbers out of Verizon NPA-NXXs to avoid needing more NPA-NXXs themselves.) - -SC - -- Stanley Cline -- sc1 at roamer1 dot org -- http://www.roamer1.org/ ... "Never put off until tomorrow what you can do today. There might be a law against it by that time." -/usr/games/fortune - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ End of Telecom Digest V2000 #173 ******************************** Date: 3 Jan 2001 06:15:12 -0500 From: owner-telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org (Telecom Digest) To: telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org Subject: Telecom Digest V2000 #174 Telecom Digest Wednesday, January 3 2001 Volume 2000 : Number 174 In this issue: Re: 1+ as a toll indicator Re: related copyright issue, was: Re: Finding Public Domain MOH Re: 1+ as a toll indicator (was: desirable numbers) re: Information Please ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 3 Jan 2001 00:14:41 -0500 From: "Adam H. Kerman" Subject: Re: 1+ as a toll indicator On 01/02/01, at 6:57pm -0500, Craig Macbride wrote: >"Adam H. Kerman" writes: >>>Phone: (02) 4221 xxxx >>>Intl: +61 2 4221 xxxx >>Which is why I say your way of writing phone numbers for domestic use is >>confusing. >Another version is "+61 (0)2 4221 xxxx". And that's worse. >>Does Australia have a nationwide dialing plan? Then it should be >>assumed that domestic callers know to use the "0" dialing prefix before the >>area code. Your numbers should be written 2 4221 xxxx. Then that way, neither >>domestic nor internation callers are confused. Those of us outside Australia >>are clever enough to look up the country code if we don't know it, but it is >>too much to expect us to know if the leading 0 is a significant digit or a >>domestic dialing prefix. >Most people don't know the dialing prefix. If I look up a Malaysian >or Austrian or whatever number on the net, I don't want to have to look >up the country code. If the company wants my business, they had better >have put their country code or I'm very unlikely to bother calling them. And if this Malaysian or Austrian company writes its phone number including the dialing prefix, you will be unable to figure out how to dial the number from another country. I'm sorry you would be willing to do business with someone in another country only if he writes his phone number including the country code. Sheesh! And Americans are accused of being insular. >If by "nationwide dialing plan" you mean a set number of digits per number >and per area code then, yes, we do now, but this is quite recent. No, that's a numbering plan. A dialing plan comprises the rules that govern what digits must be dialed to correctly route a call. For instance, if the area code is optional, if a dialing prefix must be used for certain types of calls, etc. I was asking if the rules for dialing calls are identical throughout Australia. >Now that all local numbers have been converted to 8 digits and all area >codes converted to 2 digits (including the 0), we could omit the leading >0 altogether. However, all Australians are used to the 0 marking the >start of an area code and it would look strange. >>No, I do not agree that North Americans should write phone number including the >>dialing prefix, ever. >I believe it would be rather nice if the US was consistent with the >international standard and would use +1 all the time, just as I believe >Australians would be best off using +61 on any number likely to be seen >by people overseas. In the previous paragraph, you defend the Australian practice of writing phones numbers including the dialing prefix ignoring the standard. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 3 Jan 2001 00:18:36 -0500 From: msb@vex.net (Mark Brader) Subject: Re: related copyright issue, was: Re: Finding Public Domain MOH Ed Ellers writes: > In a similar vein, ever notice how Paramount takes extreme pains to claim > trademark protection for the various names associated with Star Trek -- the > title, the major character names, etc.? Allegedly somebody at Paramount > forgot to renew the copyright registration on some (but not all) of the > episodes of the original series, so they now use trademark rights to exert > control over any use of those episodes. False. The requirement in the US to renew a copyright to get more than 28 years of protection was eliminated in 1992, only 26 years after Star Trek began. Copyright on the original episodes will not start expiring until 2061, unless the law changes again before that. If they take extreme pains to claim trademark protection, but not the same for copyright, that would be because trademark protection, unlike copyright, can be lost by an owner that shows no interest in defending it. ObDisclaimer: I am not a laywer. ObTelecom: What terms commonly used in telephony are trademarks where? I know that Yellow Pages is not a trademark in the US, but is in Britain; and I think I know that that Touch Tone was formerly a trademark, but now isn't, in the US. What else? - -- Mark Brader "It is considered a sign of great {winnitude} Toronto when your Obs are more interesting than other msb@vex.net people's whole postings." --Eric Raymond My text in this article is in the public domain. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 3 Jan 2001 01:31:03 -0500 From: "Bob Goudreau" Subject: Re: 1+ as a toll indicator (was: desirable numbers) Adam Kerman wrote: : Uh, "1" is a dialing prefix before the area code in the dialing plan. In some : places, it's used as a toll indicator, but not for the majority of telephone : customers. John Levine later added: : It appears that most of the US by land area use toll alerting, 1+ : before all toll calls, for some definition of toll call, but the : places without toll alerting include New York, Chicago, Los Angeles, : Philadelpia, and their metro areas so by population more people don't : have toll alerting than do. However, I believe that both of these gentlemen are incorrect. There was much discussion of this topic in the Digest in the early-to-mid 1990s, during the runup to the introduction of NNX area codes in 1995. The figures I recall seeing then showed that the states where toll calls could be dialed without a leading "1" (i.e., the places without "toll alerting") were in a significant minority no matter how you counted, be it number of states, number of NPAs, number of people, or number of square miles. (And that's just in the US; when you factor in the rest of the NANP it gets even more pronounced, since Canada apparently has toll-alerting nationwide.) I believe that there are only about 8 states where it is possible to make LD calls without dialing the "1" prefix: CA, IL, NY, NJ, PA, WV, NH and ME, IIRC. Granted, all but the last three are quite populous, but they still are no match for the vast toll-alerting majority of the country. Bob Goudreau Cary, NC - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 3 Jan 2001 01:44:26 -0500 From: "Tad Cook" Subject: re: Information Please > Date: 2 Jan 2001 10:32:47 -0500 > From: Joseph Singer > Subject: Information please > > Just reading a discussion group I found this little tale. I assume it's > true, but even if it isn't it's a consoling tale in these non-caring > high-tech times. Tale follows: > > > Information Please > > When I was quite young, my father had one of the first telephones in our > neighborhood. I remember well the polished, old case fastened to the wall. > The shiny receiver hung on the side of the box. Didn't PAT post this to the Digest some years ago? - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ End of Telecom Digest V2000 #174 ******************************** Date: 3 Jan 2001 23:47:32 -0500 From: owner-telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org (Telecom Digest) To: telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org Subject: Telecom Digest V2000 #175 Telecom Digest Wednesday, January 3 2001 Volume 2000 : Number 175 In this issue: Re: BLOCK: Media3, peacefire.org Re: Telecom Digest V2000 #169 Re: Telecom Digest V2000 #169 Re: BLOCK: Media3, peacefire.org Re: 1+ as a toll indicator Re: BLOCK: Media3, peacefire.org Re: BLOCK: Media3, peacefire.org ongoing peacefire.org battle Re: 1+ as a toll indicator (was: desirable numbers) Re: ongoing peacefire.org battle Re: ILEC, CLEC, dubious parallel Re: kill this meme: "Media3 put Peacefire in the line of fire..." Re: kill this meme: "Media3 put Peacefire in the line of fire..." Re: kill this meme: "Media3 put Peacefire in the line of fire..." I Emailed SPCS and they won't reply 1/3/01 ICBTollFreeNews.Com HEADS UP HEADLINES ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 3 Jan 2001 06:24:19 -0500 From: Steve Linford Subject: Re: BLOCK: Media3, peacefire.org In article <20010102152914.24813.qmail@xuxa.iecc.com>, pw@panix.com () wrote: > In article , Steve > Linford wrote: > > >In article , > >sjsobol@NorthShoreTechnologies.net (Steve Sobol) wrote: > > > >> I recall seeing somewhere on MAPS's site that they require users > >> of the RBL to indicate to customers and their downstreams that > >> they *are* using the RBL. > > > >They advise it but can't require it. However before Bennett yells > >"Gotcha!" the reason they can't require it is that an ISP is a > >private entity and can't be required to do anything if they don't > >want to. MAPS strongly advises ISPs do disclose any filters in > >use, and most ISPs do - and certainly nowdays providing email > >accounts protected from spam by the MAPS lists is a strong sales > >feature. > > "An ISP is a private entity and can't be required to do anything" > has to rank as the stupidist single statement (even in context) > that's gone by during this entire discussion, and seriously damages > the credibility of the rest of Linford's argument, imo. An ISP can > be required to do damn-all anything the owner or licensors of the > resources it is using decides to require Hmm, according to Mr Wallich my credibility is 'seriously damaged' by my statement above, which is a bummer as obviously if I respond my response can not be credible... Guess I'll respond by quoting someone credible; here's Paul Vixie on ISPs disclosing their use of MAPS lists: Even if it were possible for MAPS to _enforce_ a contract provision which _required_ that level of disclosure by an ISP to its customers, MAPS _would_not_do_it_. It's the ISP's own network. They can block whatever they want, with or without disclosure, with or without permission. While it's courteous and professional to do it the way you're describing, we here have got to remember that it's an ISP's _right_ to be discourteous and unprofessional if that's how they choose to do business. - -- Steve Linford - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 3 Jan 2001 10:47:50 -0500 From: Claire Pieterek Subject: Re: Telecom Digest V2000 #169 >On 12/30/00, at 11:34pm -0500, David Wilson wrote: > >"Adam H. Kerman" writes: > > >You North Americans have it easier by having the same country code as > your area code prefix. > >Ah, but there is no universal NANP dialing plan. Use of the "1" dialing >prefix before the area code is not mandatory in all dialing plans, or >before all area codes in some dialing plans. 1 NPA NXX-XXXX SHOULD be a >universal method of dialing in any dialing plan, but it is not. And people >dialing behind PBXs, of course, have to follow internal dialing plans. Too true. For example, I live in QWorst (formerly Useless Waste) territory, where all calls--local or long distance--are mandatory 10-digit-dial (omitting, of course, whatever one needs to dial if one is behind a PBX). I'm visiting here in SBC (formerly Ameritech) territory. When my parents first moved here, it was 312, then 708, now 630... Anyway SBC's switches generate an error message if you attempt to 10-digit-dial within one's own area code. AFAIR, you don't have to dial the 1 here unless it really is a long distance call... Now, my big gripe is dialing "1-411" instead of good old 411, and not being able to dial 611 for repair at all! - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 3 Jan 2001 10:47:51 -0500 From: Claire Pieterek Subject: Re: Telecom Digest V2000 #169 >On 12/30/00, at 11:34pm -0500, David Wilson wrote: > >"Adam H. Kerman" writes: > > >You North Americans have it easier by having the same country code as > your area code prefix. > >Ah, but there is no universal NANP dialing plan. Use of the "1" dialing >prefix before the area code is not mandatory in all dialing plans, or >before all area codes in some dialing plans. 1 NPA NXX-XXXX SHOULD be a >universal method of dialing in any dialing plan, but it is not. And people >dialing behind PBXs, of course, have to follow internal dialing plans. Too true. For example, I live in QWorst (formerly Useless Waste) territory, where all calls--local or long distance--are mandatory 10-digit-dial (omitting, of course, whatever one needs to dial if one is behind a PBX). I'm visiting here in SBC (formerly Ameritech) territory. When my parents first moved here, it was 312, then 708, now 630... Anyway SBC's switches generate an error message if you attempt to 10-digit-dial within one's own area code. AFAIR, you don't have to dial the 1 here unless it really is a long distance call... Now, my big gripe is dialing "1-411" instead of good old 411, and not being able to dial 611 for repair at all! - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 3 Jan 2001 12:03:09 -0500 From: sjsobol@NorthShoreTechnologies.net (Steve Sobol) Subject: Re: BLOCK: Media3, peacefire.org >From 'John Willkie': >I have read these threads with some interest from the beginning last month. > >It occurs to me that there is a logical reason why bennett has not taken up >Steve Sobol and others on their offer to host his site on their servers for >free. > >The logical reason is that he gets a better deal from Media3. I offered him free hosting, completely free, with no requirement to place NSTC banner ads or links to me on his site. >to "understand" what is happening, etc. By better deal, I mean that he is >PAID to be there. Maybe. I wouldn't rule it out. >Time to read contract law, Bennett. You've lost the ability to phone to >someone with a clue. I say, go f**k yourself. I haven't gotten to the point of saying that yet... I've come close, though. - -- Steve Sobol, BOFH, President 888.480.4NET 866.DSL.EXPRESS 216.619.2NET North Shore Technologies Corporation http://NorthShoreTechnologies.net JustTheNet/JustTheNet EXPRESS DSL (ISP Services) http://JustThe.net mailto:sjsobol@NorthShoreTechnologies.net Proud resident of Cleveland, OH - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 3 Jan 2001 12:05:16 -0500 From: "Adam H. Kerman" Subject: Re: 1+ as a toll indicator On 01/03/01, at 10:47am -0500, Claire Pieterek wrote: >"Adam H. Kerman" writes: >>On 12/30/00, at 11:34pm -0500, David Wilson wrote: >>>You North Americans have it easier by having the same country code as >>>your area code prefix. >>Ah, but there is no universal NANP dialing plan. Use of the "1" dialing >>prefix before the area code is not mandatory in all dialing plans, or >>before all area codes in some dialing plans. 1 NPA NXX-XXXX SHOULD be a >>universal method of dialing in any dialing plan, but it is not. And people >>dialing behind PBXs, of course, have to follow internal dialing plans. >Too true. For example, I live in QWorst (formerly Useless Waste) >territory, where all calls--local or long distance--are mandatory >10-digit-dial (omitting, of course, whatever one needs to dial if one is >behind a PBX). You never need to dial the "1" dialing prefix? >I'm visiting here in SBC (formerly Ameritech) territory. When my parents >first moved here, it was 312, then 708, now 630... Anyway SBC's switches >generate an error message if you attempt to 10-digit-dial within one's own >area code. AFAIR, you don't have to dial the 1 here unless it really is a >long distance call... All dialing to a foreign area code requires dialing the "1" dialing prefix, the area code, and the 7-digit number, whether local or long distance. We never had toll alerting. But dialing within the same area code is 7 digits or 11 digits. >Now, my big gripe is dialing "1-411" instead of good old 411, and not being >able to dial 611 for repair at all! We never had 1-411. 411 is still allowed, but no longer allowed from Bell pay phones. 611 is no longer allowed. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 3 Jan 2001 13:13:56 -0500 From: pw@panix.com (Paul Wallich) Subject: Re: BLOCK: Media3, peacefire.org In article , Steve Linford wrote: >In article <20010102152914.24813.qmail@xuxa.iecc.com>, pw@panix.com >() wrote: > >> In article , Steve >> Linford wrote: >> >> >In article , >> >sjsobol@NorthShoreTechnologies.net (Steve Sobol) wrote: >> > >> >> I recall seeing somewhere on MAPS's site that they require users >> >> of the RBL to indicate to customers and their downstreams that >> >> they *are* using the RBL. >> > >> >They advise it but can't require it. However before Bennett yells >> >"Gotcha!" the reason they can't require it is that an ISP is a >> >private entity and can't be required to do anything if they don't >> >want to. MAPS strongly advises ISPs do disclose any filters in >> >use, and most ISPs do - and certainly nowdays providing email >> >accounts protected from spam by the MAPS lists is a strong sales >> >feature. >> >> "An ISP is a private entity and can't be required to do anything" >> has to rank as the stupidist single statement (even in context) >> that's gone by during this entire discussion, and seriously damages >> the credibility of the rest of Linford's argument, imo. An ISP can >> be required to do damn-all anything the owner or licensors of the >> resources it is using decides to require > >Hmm, according to Mr Wallich my credibility is 'seriously damaged' by >my statement above, which is a bummer as obviously if I respond my >response can not be credible... Guess I'll respond by quoting someone >credible; here's Paul Vixie on ISPs disclosing their use of MAPS lists: > > >Even if it were possible for MAPS to _enforce_ a contract provision >which _required_ that level of disclosure by an ISP to its customers, >MAPS _would_not_do_it_. It's the ISP's own network. They can block >whatever they want, with or without disclosure, with or without >permission. While it's courteous and professional to do it the way >you're describing, we here have got to remember that it's an ISP's >_right_ to be discourteous and unprofessional if that's how they >choose to do business. > In other words, "We choose not to make any affort to see that our intellectual property is used in a responsible fashion." Vixie seems to be suggesting in the lines quoted above that he doesn't think disclosure could be enforced (although he doesn't say whether that's a legal or a pragmatic opinion) but mostly he's saying that he _chooses_ not to even try to mandate disclosure. In short, hardly support for the statement "An ISP is a private entity and can't be required to do anything." But perhaps logic is just another item of collateral damage... Btw, AP reports this morning that a couple of spammers were just sentenced to two years each (for the underlying fraud as well as the hijacking of resources). The wheels of justice grind slow, but sometimes indeed exceeding fine. paul - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 3 Jan 2001 15:08:54 -0500 From: wollman@lcs.mit.edu (Garrett Wollman) Subject: Re: BLOCK: Media3, peacefire.org In article <20010103181355.20269.qmail@xuxa.iecc.com>, Paul Wallich wrote: >In other words, "We choose not to make any affort to see that our >intellectual property is used in a responsible fashion." You are assuming that there is intellectual property involved. Certainly, the way most people use the MAPS lists, there is not: a mail server sends a DNS request to a MAPS server, which responds with a one-bit (yes or no) answer. (In the famous ``phone book'' decision, it was held that the informational content of a database or directory is not subject to copyright, even though the actual database or directory, once fixed in physical form, is.) In order to receive a complete copy of the RBL database, MAPS did (don't know if they still do) require the recipient to sign an indemnification agreement. This was true for both those who received the RBL via DNS zone transfers and those (like AboveNet) who got a BGP feed from MAPS. - -GAWollman - -- Garrett A. Wollman | O Siem / We are all family / O Siem / We're all the same wollman@lcs.mit.edu | O Siem / The fires of freedom Opinions not those of| Dance in the burning flame MIT, LCS, CRS, or NSA| - Susan Aglukark and Chad Irschick - -- - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 3 Jan 2001 15:09:02 -0500 From: Babu Mengelepouti Subject: ongoing peacefire.org battle Linc Madison wrote: > Agreed, and indeed, your "Do you have anything specific?" was > disingenuous in the context of this entire thread, and highly damaging > to your credibility. Come on, Linc. "You have lost all credibility" and its variants has been a tired troll line since the BBS days. If you want to challenge someone's credibility, do it through superior logic--not something like this one. For what it's worth, I think both you and Bennett are equally credible. Shrilly ranting that someone else has lost credibility doesn't help your case. > Bennett, you're being far more thick-headed than the people who write > the censorware programs you monitor. You are damaging not only > Peacefire, but, by association, everyone else who fights against overly > broad censorware products. You, both personally and organizationally, > are being co-opted. I think that it's pretty thickheaded to blackhole all traffic (including http traffic) bound to or from an entire class C in order to "fight spam." I definitely don't support spam--I think that my contributions to the Telecom Digest Business Directory over the years has made that point crystal clear--but I don't support blackholing entire networks either. There are spamware providers in the class C where Bennett's site resides. There are also a lot of other things. The solution of "move to another ISP" is not reasonable or practical for most people--especially if they could end up blackholed again by the same wrong-headed policies. AOL is an ISP known to harbor spammers. Assume, for the same of argument, that UUNET chose to bgp filter any traffic to or from AOL and Time Warner properties, as a "spam protest." Do you honestly assume that customers wouldn't scream bloody murder, and lawsuits justifiably be filed? If you were a downstream customer of UUNET and were unable to gain access to AOL or Time Warner sites, and you weren't notified of this in advance, wouldn't you be (correctly) more than a little pissed off? Come on, Linc. You and I both hate spam, but there are reasonable spam-fighting measures and there's crossing the line. bgp filtering entire networks (unless the entire network is a spamhaus, such as cyberpromo.com), especially for murky-smelly political reasons, is both sneaky and bad business. > Is it really more important to you to fight in favor of spamware and > spam support services than to fight against censorware that blocks > sites indiscriminately? Peacefire can only do one or the other with any I don't think that Bennett is fighting in favor of spamware and spam support services, and I think that it's asinine that you would try to portray Bennett in that manner. Bennett has a problem with route filtering an entire network, that contains a lot of things other than spamware vendors. > People like me, who believe that unmonitored censorware is a very > dangerous thing, are rethinking their support for Peacefire because of > your irrational behavior and words. That just goes to show how strong your convictions were in the first place. If you're really so malleable, I have some really fine property below the water table in the Everglades... > If you want to have any credibility at all in this discussion, you need > to provide direct, unequivocal answers to questions including the > following: It seems to me that most reasonable people wouldn't automatically, when signing up for Web hosting service, ask whether the class C in which they're going to live is RBL'ed. ESPECIALLY when it's a Web site. It's immaterial whether stuff like http://windows100.com/survivalguide.html is in the same class C, regardless of how despicable it is. When I subscribe to Internet service, I have a reasonable expectation that my HTTP traffic isn't going to be secretly blackholed. A reasonable parallel would be an ILEC deciding not to allow any calls to or from a CLEC's exchange, because some numbers within that exchange are used for outbound telemarketing. Most customers, when subscribing to phone service, have a reasonable expectation that they can send and receive phone calls to anyone else who has a phone. Are you really arguing for the Internet equivalent of having to ask 20 questions before finding out whether your phone is likely to be able to call other people with a phone? Come on, Linc. I know you're smarter than that. > You have also made a statement regarding spamware that I find > alarmingly disingenuous in and of itself. You have said that you > believe web sites should be free to sell spamware, because they have no > control of how it will be used. That's a bogus argument: there is no > possible legitimate use to a piece of software that scans newsgroups > for e-mail addresses and then sends bulk e-mail to those addresses, > using forged headers and open SMTP relays. It is software that has no > POSSIBLE legitimate use, so saying that the writer has no knowledge of > the way end users are employing it, is nothing but a cop-out. Not all spamware does this. In fact, the company for which I work uses spamware. We use it to send out technical newsletters, which customers have specifically asked us for. It's sent out through our SMTP servers using real headers. Nobody would argue that this isn't a legitimate use of spamware. Additionally, it appears (based on http://windows100.com/survivalguide.html) that at least some spamware is written by the authors of CyberPatrol. So I doubt that there is any love lost between Bennett and these people. His objection, as I see it, is to HTTP traffic to his site being secretly blackholed by above.net. Your solution is "change ISPs, change netblocks, etc." If Pacific Bell was secretly blackholing calls to your consulting firm from CLECs with whose business practices it did not agree, I seriously doubt that you would consider changing to another LEC a reasonable alternative. Why do you expect Bennett to do the network equivalent? > Sites that sell spamware clearly meet the requirements to be listed in > the RBL, as well they should. ISPs that continue to host sites that > sell spamware also clearly meet the RBL requirements -- again, as well > they should. Your complaint should not be against MAPS or the RBL, but > against Media3. An appropriate and valid use of RBL is to block SMTP traffic to offending networks. However, I see no valid reason to blackhole HTTP traffic. I especially see no valid reason to use RBL's BGP feed secretly to block HTTP traffic. I don't think that MAPS is to blame in this case--they just publish RBL, and how ISPs use it is up to them. I hate spam, and I think that MAPS does good work. However, I also think that backbone providers using MAPS to blackhole all traffic to or from entire networks is a direct attack on the Internet's foundation of universal connectivity. Last I checked, there weren't many unsolicited commercial HTTP packets invading my mailbox. - -- - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 3 Jan 2001 15:33:59 -0500 From: Linc Madison Subject: Re: 1+ as a toll indicator (was: desirable numbers) In article <005d01c0754f$63efcce0$e20d1918@nc.rr.com>, Bob Goudreau wrote: > Adam Kerman wrote: > >: Uh, "1" is a dialing prefix before the area code in the dialing >: plan. In some places, it's used as a toll indicator, but not for >: the majority of telephone customers. > > John Levine later added: > >: It appears that most of the US by land area use toll alerting, 1+ >: before all toll calls, for some definition of toll call, but the >: places without toll alerting include New York, Chicago, Los Angeles, >: Philadelpia, and their metro areas so by population more people >: don't have toll alerting than do. > > However, I believe that both of these gentlemen are incorrect. There > was much discussion of this topic in the Digest in the early-to-mid > 1990s, during the runup to the introduction of NNX area codes in > 1995. The figures I recall seeing then showed that the states where > toll calls could be dialed without a leading "1" (i.e., the places > without "toll alerting") were in a significant minority no matter how > you counted, be it number of states, number of NPAs, number of > people, or number of square miles. (And that's just in the US; when > you factor in the rest of the NANP it gets even more pronounced, > since Canada apparently has toll-alerting nationwide.) I believe > that there are only about 8 states where it is possible to make LD > calls without dialing the "1" prefix: CA, IL, NY, NJ, PA, WV, NH and > ME, IIRC. Granted, all but the last three are quite populous, but > they still are no match for the vast toll-alerting majority of the > country. You left out Rhode Island. (Yes, there are toll calls within Rhode Island.) Also, Massachusetts allowed 7D toll calls in some cases until fairly recently. Still, it is a good bit under half the population. In fact, it's right about 1/3. I would say, though, that even with the growth of California's population, that most of the states experiencing faster growth are toll alerting states. States like WV and RI have stagnant or declining populations. IL experienced rapid growth after WWII, but has slowed significantly, picking up somewhat in the last decade. NH grew a good bit, but not nearly as much as in each of the last 3 decades. On the other hand, the growth champion, Nevada, is a toll-alerting state, along with high-growth states like Florida and Texas. - -- For faster reply, use Telecom # LincMad * com, or something like that. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 3 Jan 2001 17:41:00 -0500 From: sjsobol@NorthShoreTechnologies.net (Steve Sobol) Subject: Re: ongoing peacefire.org battle >From 'Babu Mengelepouti': >be filed? If you were a downstream customer of UUNET and were unable to >gain access to AOL or Time Warner sites, and you weren't notified of >this in advance, wouldn't you be (correctly) more than a little pissed >off? Come on, Linc. You and I both hate spam, but there are reasonable >spam-fighting measures and there's crossing the line. bgp filtering >entire networks (unless the entire network is a spamhaus, such as >cyberpromo.com), especially for murky-smelly political reasons, is both >sneaky and bad business. Umm. In Media3's case, the entire network is not comprised of the class C. They have other IP addresses. The analogy of UUNet blocking all of AOL or Time Warner's hosted sites is way out there. It's nowhere close to being an accurate analogy. And as I mentioned before, this was done only as a method of escalation. >is in the same class C, regardless of how despicable it is. When I >subscribe to Internet service, I have a reasonable expectation that my >HTTP traffic isn't going to be secretly blackholed. That's not a MAPS issue - if the ISP's involved don't tell their customers that they are using the blackhole list, it's extremely bad customer service, and possibly also breach of contract depending on how the ISP's contracts are written. >A reasonable parallel would be an ILEC deciding not to allow any calls >to or from a CLEC's exchange I suppose maybe this is a reasonable parallel MAYBE. But unlike ISP's, phone companies are common carriers. Is it even legal for them to do something like this? If not, this analogy is a lousy one. >Not all spamware does this. In fact, the company for which I work uses >spamware Really? Which software do you use? >An appropriate and valid use of RBL is to block SMTP traffic to >offending networks. However, I see no valid reason to blackhole HTTP >traffic. I especially see no valid reason to use RBL's BGP feed >secretly to block HTTP traffic. BGP blocks everything by default. Those who use the BGP feed know this. And it's the provider's network, and they get to decide what traffic they allow [much more so than a telco with PSTN traffic]. >I don't think that MAPS is to blame in this case--they just publish RBL, >and how ISPs use it is up to them. I hate spam, and I think that MAPS >does good work. However, I also think that backbone providers using >MAPS to blackhole all traffic to or from entire networks is a direct >attack on the Internet's foundation of universal connectivity. Last I >checked, there weren't many unsolicited commercial HTTP packets invading >my mailbox. Well, we agree on this point. And I've always maintained that it is stupid for providers not to let their customers know they're using the RBL. But this is an issue between the individual providers and their customers. - -- Steve Sobol, BOFH, President 888.480.4NET 866.DSL.EXPRESS 216.619.2NET North Shore Technologies Corporation http://NorthShoreTechnologies.net JustTheNet/JustTheNet EXPRESS DSL (ISP Services) http://JustThe.net mailto:sjsobol@NorthShoreTechnologies.net Proud resident of Cleveland, OH - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 3 Jan 2001 17:43:34 -0500 From: johnl@iecc.com (John R. Levine) Subject: Re: ILEC, CLEC, dubious parallel >> A reasonable parallel would be an ILEC deciding not to allow any >> calls to or from a CLEC's exchange Surprise, my ILEC did that for a while for CLECs with whom they didn't have EAS (extended area service) agreements, with said CLECs sneaking in via the adjacent dominant RBOC's toll tandems. I can't see what this has to do with the RBL, though. - -- John R. Levine, IECC, POB 727, Trumansburg NY 14886 +1 607 387 6869 johnl@iecc.com, Village Trustee and Sewer Commissioner, http://iecc.com/johnl, Member, Provisional board, Coalition Against Unsolicited Commercial E-mail - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 3 Jan 2001 21:00:34 -0500 From: John David Galt Subject: Re: kill this meme: "Media3 put Peacefire in the line of fire..." Linc Madison wrote: > Bennett, you're being far more thick-headed than the people who write > the censorware programs you monitor. You are damaging not only > Peacefire, but, by association, everyone else who fights against overly > broad censorware products. You, both personally and organizationally, > are being co-opted. > > Is it really more important to you to fight in favor of spamware and > spam support services than to fight against censorware that blocks > sites indiscriminately? I don't understand how you can fail to see the connection between the two. When MAPS blocks all the customers of an ISP that hosts the sellers of software for spamming, MAPS becomes "censorware that blocks sites indiscriminately." Just as NetNanny shouldn't be blocking political groups' web sites, MAPS should distinguish between ISPs selling "spam support services" and their innocent customers. If MAPS listed only the specific addresses of the spamhausen in 209.211.253.*, and the address of www.media3.net itself, rather than a whole block containing innocent customers, MAPS wouldn't be doing anything objectionable. But until MAPS makes that change, it is, IMHO. OTOH, if Media3 is moving its customers' addresses around in order to defeat that kind of fine-tuning, then Media3 and not MAPS would be in the wrong, and customers such as Peacefire ought to raise holy hell about it with Media3. (This may well constitute fraud or breach of contract.) Some people in this debate allege that Media3 has done this, but I haven't seen any examples posted, and Bennett (by the title of this thread) seems to be denying it. > If you want to have any credibility at all in this discussion, you need > to provide direct, unequivocal answers to questions including the > following: > > * Did Media3 disclose to you at the time you entered your current > agreement with them, that the netblock into which they were assigning > you was already listed in the MAPS RBL? (Or, if your agreement predates > the actual listing, that a nomination was in progress?) > > * Have you requested that Media3 move you to a netblock that is not in > the MAPS RBL? If so, what has been their response? If not, *WHY* *NOT*? > > * If Media3 has been unwilling to move you to a different netblock, WHY > have you not moved your web site to a different provider? > > * Did you knowingly permit Media3 to place www.peacefire.org in a > black-holed netblock? If so, *WHY*? I, too, would like to hear these answers. danny burstein wrote: >> The First Amendment does not protect "speech" that consists of false >> statements made by a company about a product that they're selling, >> whether that product is (1) a list of sites, or (2) Internet access >> that is secretly filtered according to that list. It protects the >> list itself, not necessarily all uses of it. > The First Amendment to the US Constitution has almost NOTHING to do with > commercial organizations. It concerns itself with GOVERNMENT censorship. True as far as it goes, but you're missing Bennett's point, which is that an ISP that uses the RBL to filter a customer's access without notice may be committing fraud or breach of contract, neither of which is protected by the First. I don't know if a court has ruled on Bennett's claim, but I would like to see it upheld. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 3 Jan 2001 21:47:03 -0500 From: Barry Margolin Subject: Re: kill this meme: "Media3 put Peacefire in the line of fire..." In article <3A53D888.FF06CB3C@diogenes.sacramento.ca.us>, John David Galt wrote: >Just as NetNanny shouldn't be blocking political groups' web sites, MAPS >should distinguish between ISPs selling "spam support services" and their >innocent customers. In the real world that we live in, sometimes innocent customers get caught in the line of fire against a company. For instance, when airline pilots go on strike, innocent passengers get bumped. This is intentional: the perpetrator hopes that the lost business and negative PR will further encourage the target to change their policy. In this case, if Media3 considers the business of the innocent customers to be important, it will do what it must to get themselves off the RBL. If they're not doing this, it suggests that they consider the spammers more important than the other customers. Why would Peacefire want to continue doing business with a company that doesn't want to provide the best service to them? - -- Barry Margolin, barmar@genuity.net Genuity, Burlington, MA *** DON'T SEND TECHNICAL QUESTIONS DIRECTLY TO ME, post them to newsgroups. Please DON'T copy followups to me -- I'll assume it wasn't posted to the group. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 3 Jan 2001 22:05:09 -0500 From: John David Galt Subject: Re: kill this meme: "Media3 put Peacefire in the line of fire..." Barry Margolin wrote: > John David Galt wrote: >> Just as NetNanny shouldn't be blocking political groups' web sites, MAPS >> should distinguish between ISPs selling "spam support services" and their >> innocent customers. > In the real world that we live in, sometimes innocent customers get caught > in the line of fire against a company. For instance, when airline pilots > go on strike, innocent passengers get bumped. This is intentional: the > perpetrator hopes that the lost business and negative PR will further > encourage the target to change their policy. I know that this happens, but I believe it will and should backfire, because those who suffer collateral damage will and should know that it IS intentional on the part of the protester, and they will and should blame the protester and not the target. It is not their job to suffer for whatever the target may have done to the protester. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 3 Jan 2001 22:44:01 -0500 From: Ray/Rita Normandeau/Frazier AFTRA-SAG Subject: I Emailed SPCS and they won't reply Accompanying my SPCS bill I recently received your form S131 offering a gift of $50.00 for switching a residential long distance phone line to Sprint and that you offer inter-state calls at 7 cents. On Usenet I saw: "AT&T, MCI, and Sprint all do one or more of the following: have monthly minimums or monthly fees, overcharge the single-line user for the PICC fee, charge a flat universal service fee instead of a percentage fee. If you're on their basic service plan, AT&T does all of these things: They charge a $3.00 monthly minimum, $1.51 for the monthly PICC fee, and a flat $1.38 universal service fee, penalizing the low-volume user even further." I realize that you are willing to credit monthly $5.95 to offset your monthly service fee. I now pay 7.9 cents a minute INTER-state and INTRA-state with NO monthly service fee by using 101-6868. However the $50.00 gift may be of interest to me. I realize that it will take 6-8 weeks for savings check to arrive. Do all five $10.00 checks arrive at same time? Can they all be used at the same time? I realize that SPCS account has to remain active, but if only one check arrives per month after the 6-8 week wait we could be talking about 7 months to use up the checks. VoiceStream is offering some very good deals here in NYC so I don't know who I will be with in 7 months. I went to the URL mentioned on your form S131 but above is not answered there. I also want to know: 1. Is there a monthly minimum? If so, how much? 2. Is there a monthly PICC fee? If so, how much? 3. What is the NYS intra-state rate. 4. Is there a flat universal service fee or a percentage fee? If so how much? I now pay a percentage fee with 101-6868. Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2001 23:45:57 -0500 From: "Judith Oppenheimer" Subject: 1/3/01 ICBTollFreeNews.Com HEADS UP HEADLINES ____________________________________________________ ICBTollFreeNews.Com HEADS UP HEADLINES ____________________________________________________ from ICB Toll Free News - Daily News and Intelligence covering the Political, Legal and Marketing Arenas of 800 and Dot Com. ____________________________________________________ CONTENTS The Reinvention of Great Domains SEE http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4945 Announce the creation of a Working Group, and give it three weeks to work including Christmas and New Years. SEE http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4949 800 DENTIST guru makes vanity branding and marketing knowledge available to others in the toll free industry. SEE http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4944 Hark, the Sheppard finger wag. SEE http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4948 Web keywords hits cellphones. SEE http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4947 There's more to Christmas Isle than crabs. SEE http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4946 ___________________________________________________ ICB is easily the most timely, concise, and articulate source of Daily 800 and Domain Name Industry Information online. Period. "An important source of inside information" says InfoWorld; "superb", "invaluable", "critically intelligent", "exceedingly useful", report ICB Premium Subscribers. ICB Premium Subscription is On Sale thru Jan 15. http://www.icbtollfree.com/Article4910.htm ____________________________________________________ CUSTOMER SERVICE NOTES: With over 4,000 articles archived, ICB is a popular research destination. Find all ICB headlines: http://www.icbtollfree.com/icbheadlns.cfm, or use ICB's search engine: http://icbtollfree.com/Search.cfm. Note: Registration is required. Contact information is NOT sold, leased, rented or shared in any manner. ICB offers FREE classifieds: http://ICBclassifieds.com. ____________________________________________________ EVERY 3.6 SECONDS SOMEONE DIES FROM HUNGER http://www.hungersite.com/ ____________________________________________________ ARTICLE ACCESS CODE LEGEND ICB Toll Free News offers two valuable service options: F = Free - News and Features articles P = Premium - Unlimited Site Access including all Articles and Documents. ____________________________________________________ HEADLINES for January 3, 2001 P - THE REINVENTION OF GREAT DOMAINS The aftermarket is dead ... long live the aftermarket. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4945 F - WHEN IS A WORKING GROUP, NOT A WORKING GROUP? Put out a press release announcing the creation of a Working Group – but (1) only give it three weeks to work (a period which includes Christmas and New Years!); (2) only allow it to respond the questions posed by a Task Force, and (3) make it the first working group in ICANN history that has to be filtered through a "task force". CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4949 P - 800 DENTIST GURU LAUNCHES NEW BIZ “While the internet has taken warp speed branding to a whole new level, the recent dot com fallout illustrates the need for brands to build on a broader base of support ... As an example, Priceline now gives equal if not greater weight to 1-800-Priceline as they do to priceline.com in their advertising." CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4944 P - DNSO REVIEW, aka HARK, THE SHEPPARD FINGER WAG Four days before Christmas, ICANN's Names Council announced a new working group to "provide additional answers to an extensive questionnaire developed by ... [the] Names Council ... with a mandate to improve the decision-making process of the Names Council... The task force has already made two calls for input to its questionnaire... This final call is intended to improve the quality and quantity of input as a function of the interactive nature of a DNSO working group..." Meaning the DNSO has already reviewed itself; this "working group" is window-dressing. *And* it's been given till January 15 to get the job done. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4948 F - VOICESTREAM + REALNAMES = CELLPHONE KEYWORD WEB ACCESS The new internet address system uses a network of routers and proprietary "in-memory" databases created by RealNames that is basically "layered" over the Internet, Chief Technology Officer Nico Popp said. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4947 F -CHRISTMAS ISLAND ADDS .CX TO THE COMMERCIAL ccTLD FRAY Mr Boonhow said CITC had teamed with venture capital group Clear Blue Day to market the .cx domain name. Clear Blue Day has provided about $500,000 in initial funding and will also provide all technical support as well as marketing advice. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4946 ____________________________________________________ ABOUT ICB ICB HeadsUp Headlines Daily Email is sent by request. Subscriptions to Daily Email are free to qualified applicants. Visit http://www.icbtollfree.com/reg.cfm?NextURL=Index.cfm to sign up. Please feel free to pass along a copy to a friend, within reason so long as the message is not modified or used unfavorably. To unsubscribe mailto:editor@icbtollfree.com, subject: unsubscribe. ___________________ ADVERTISING INFORMATION ___________________ For information on advertising in ICB HeadsUp Headlines emails, see http://www.icbtollfree.com/ArticleId4415.html ____________________________________________________ Only subscribers or registered users of ICB Toll Free News web site will be able to access all or some of the full text of URLs provided. ____________________________________________________ Copyright © 2000 ICB, Inc. All rights reserved. ____________________________________________________ ------------------------------ End of Telecom Digest V2000 #175 ******************************** Date: 4 Jan 2001 06:15:14 -0500 From: owner-telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org (Telecom Digest) To: telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org Subject: Telecom Digest V2000 #176 Telecom Digest Thursday, January 4 2001 Volume 2000 : Number 176 In this issue: List SWB Billing problems Re: kill this meme: "Media3 put Peacefire in the line of fire..." 1969-70 Phone Phreak recordings Re: I Emailed SPCS and they won't reply A town near Orlando w/o cable/DSL needs wireless access, help! ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 4 Jan 2001 00:04:04 -0500 From: Atcphone@aol.com Subject: List Patrick I enjoyed your website and feel that your audience may enjoy my website.It deals with the PBX and Key System ends of the business. Check it out if you have a chance. http://www.telcomtech.com John Armstrong John@Telcomtech.com - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 4 Jan 2001 00:09:02 -0500 From: "John Schmerold" Subject: SWB Billing problems Since September, SWB has been overcharging me by nearly 50% for DSL service. They acknowledge the mistake every month, tell me they'll fix it every month and provide credits for prior months. As you may guess, they have not fixed the problem. My next bill is due 1/12, so yesterday I thought I'd call & see what's up. Needless to say nothing has been done. But I did get a customer service agent to promise me his first born if the credit didn't appear on next bill. Today, I decided to call billing to see if I was going have to put this knuckhead's kid thru college. Guess what? He called billing yesterday to say that a credit would appear on February or March's bill. I'm livid. What are most effective steps I can take to get my bill fixed? How can I make SWB's life tough for doing this to me & many others that aren't as persistent as me? In addition to the obvious consumer fraud, it seems to me that they are committing securities fraud if the are over reporting income by 50%. Looking forward to this group's ideas. - -- John Schmerold Katy Computer, LLC 20 Meramec Station Rd Valley Park, MO 63088 314-316-9000 314-316-9200 fax - -- - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 4 Jan 2001 00:14:09 -0500 From: sjsobol@NorthShoreTechnologies.net (Steve Sobol) Subject: Re: kill this meme: "Media3 put Peacefire in the line of fire..." >From 'John David Galt': >Just as NetNanny shouldn't be blocking political groups' web sites, MAPS >should distinguish between ISPs selling "spam support services" and their >innocent customers. I don't quite understand why this is such a big deal. MAPS takes great pains to avoid having this happen because they hate collateral damage. However, in the case of an unresponsive or uncooperative ISP, *regardless* of the reason for the original RBL listing of whatever IP addresses, there will be an escalation. >If MAPS listed only the specific addresses of the >spamhausen in 209.211.253.*, and the address of www.media3.net itself, >rather than a whole block containing innocent customers, MAPS wouldn't be >doing anything objectionable. But until MAPS makes that change, it is, >IMHO. John, what you are describing is what they originally did. >Some people in this debate allege that Media3 has done this, but I haven't >seen any examples posted, and Bennett (by the title of this thread) seems >to be denying it. ...while some people on SPAM-L seem to have posted evidence that it IS happening. There's a big discussion about this taking place on that mailing list as well as in this newsgroup. >True as far as it goes, but you're missing Bennett's point, which is that >an ISP that uses the RBL to filter a customer's access without notice may >be committing fraud or breach of contract, Indeed. This is a separate issue from the one you describe above, though. - -- Steve Sobol, BOFH, President 888.480.4NET 866.DSL.EXPRESS 216.619.2NET North Shore Technologies Corporation http://NorthShoreTechnologies.net JustTheNet/JustTheNet EXPRESS DSL (ISP Services) http://JustThe.net mailto:sjsobol@NorthShoreTechnologies.net Proud resident of Cleveland, OH - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 4 Jan 2001 00:31:16 -0500 From: "Tad Cook" Subject: 1969-70 Phone Phreak recordings Check out www.phonetrips.com. This has a bunch of old recordings made by some phone prhreaks in the late 1960s-early 1970s in the Pacific Northwest. They would travel to different payphones and play around with dialing, and there are good examples of some of the sounds from panel and step offices. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 4 Jan 2001 00:56:19 -0500 From: Joseph Singer Subject: Re: I Emailed SPCS and they won't reply 3 Jan 2001 22:44:01 -0500 wrote: >Accompanying my SPCS bill I recently received your form S131 offering a gift >of $50.00 for switching a residential long distance phone line to Sprint and >that you offer inter-state calls at 7 cents. > >On Usenet I saw: "AT&T, MCI, and Sprint all do one or more of the following: >have monthly minimums or monthly fees, overcharge the single-line user for >the PICC fee, charge a flat universal service fee instead of a percentage >fee. If you're on their basic service plan, AT&T does all of these things: >They charge a $3.00 monthly minimum, $1.51 for the monthly PICC fee, and a >flat $1.38 universal service fee, penalizing the low-volume user even >further." > >I realize that you are willing to credit monthly $5.95 to offset your monthly >service fee. I now pay 7.9 cents a minute INTER-state and INTRA-state with NO >monthly service fee by using 101-6868. If people don't *know* what the going rate is or what a *good* rate for service is they will pay either tariffed rates or "cheap" rates that aren't really so cheap once you factor in monthly minimums, PICC and USF fees. Something that's not widely publicized is that there is *no* standard to assessing the PICC and USF fees and each carrier can calculate those fees according to their own wishes. AT&T just recently increased the USF from 8%+ to almost 10% of the total on the calls. I've been using a service that I found on the web called "A Bell Tolls" and they have comparisons for many different carriers and compare their "published" rates with what the actual cost of calls is with the USF and PICC charges factored into the actual rate. I don't make many toll calls. I don't make any intra-LATA or in-state calls as my VoiceStream PCS plan includes all of Washington, Oregon, Idaho and Utah as my "local" calling area and any calls made to those regions is just deducted from my standard air time. That said if I do make any long distance I am looking for a plan or plans that do not charge me any monthly access fee and also either don't charge any USF or PICC fees or if they do charge it is a reasonable charge. Currently my land line is not pre-subscribed (1+) to any carrier and I use Telegroup dialaround and pay 6.25¢ per minute (with 0.00 charge for PICC and 6% USF included in the rate) with 6 second partial minute billing. I pay 9.9¢ per minute for in-state calling which is on the high side, but as I said I don't use land line long distance for in-state calling. Their international rate to call the UK is 9.54¢ per minute which is higher than many, but still not bad. The other plan that I use is from GFI Telecom which is 6.9¢ per minute with *no* PICC and *no* USF at all for both interstate and intrastate calling. This is accessed by dialing an 800 number. Calls are billed in 1 minute increments. In-state rate of 6.9¢ per minute. An international call to the UK is 7.97¢ per minute which I think is *very* reasonable. I strongly advise people to investigate available rates through such sites as abelltolls.com or other comparison sites to see what the actual rates are. Believe it or not, but some standard "tariffed" rates can be as much as 32¢ per minute (e.g. AT&T "basic" rates during daytime hours) along with a monthly minimum charge if you don't spend a requisite amount. Of course this doesn't take into account "gotcha" carriers such as Telecom USA's "10-10-220" which charges 99¢ for a 20 minutes or a 1 minute call! A little investigation into what you can or should pay will save you some money! - --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Joseph Singer Seattle, Washington USA [ICQ pgr] +1 206 405 2052 [voice mail] +1 206 493 0706 [FAX] - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 4 Jan 2001 02:07:22 -0500 From: brian-usenet@enchanter.net (Brian Kendig) Subject: A town near Orlando w/o cable/DSL needs wireless access, help! Okay, here's the deal. I live in the town of Celebration, Florida, which is run by Disney (it's on Disney World property, just outside Orlando) and is wonderful in almost all ways except one: there is no broadband Internet access of any sort here; we're all limited to 56k modems. The town has its own private phone company and cable company. Both of these companies say (1) "we're not going to let anyone else use our wires; if anyone's going to offer DSL/cable modems here, it will be us" and (2) this town is too small to justify spending money on the infrastructure, so we're not going to offer DSL/cable modems here." The phone company briefly considered offering a five-year 256k DSL contract at $40/month times the number of households in the town (no matter how many households actually used it), but bad publicity shot down this plan. Since I don't see much chance of the town ever getting broadband access over DSL or cable, I'd like to find a wireless Internet access company in the area which might be interested in working with the town's residents. I figure this might be a win/win situation: people here who need broadband access would be happy to be on the cutting edge of technology, and any company which comes to our aid would be an exclusive provider for the town and could use it to showcase their technologies. As long as we can find a solution which doesn't require using any of the town's existing wiring, I don't see how the company which runs the town could complain. So I'm asking two things: (1) Can anyone recommend a wireless Internet access company in the Orlando/Kissimmee area which might be interested in taking on this project? (2) Does anyone have any recommendations for other solutions to this dilemma? Note that I'm not an official representative of anything, and the only person I speak for in the town is myself. This may be a half-baked nutty idea, but I don't have many more ideas left. - -- ____ |\/| Brian Kendig \ /\ / ..__. brian at enchanter net You are in a maze of twisty \/ \__\ _/ http://www.enchanter.net/ little passages, all alike. \__ __ \_ Be insatiably curious. \____\___\ Ask "why" a lot. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ End of Telecom Digest V2000 #176 ******************************** Date: 5 Jan 2001 03:56:28 -0500 From: owner-telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org (Telecom Digest) To: telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org Subject: Telecom Digest V2000 #177 Telecom Digest Friday, January 5 2001 Volume 2000 : Number 177 In this issue: Re: ongoing peacefire.org battle Re: please take ongoing peacefire.org battle to nanae or spam-l Re: SWB Billing problems Any opinions on Americom? Re: A town near Orlando w/o cable/DSL needs wireless access, help! Re: A town near Orlando w/o cable/DSL needs wireless access, help! Re: MAPS alters back-dated press release; withdraws Media3 accusations Re: I Emailed SPCS and they won't reply Re: A town near Orlando w/o cable/DSL needs wireless access, help! Re: A town near Orlando w/o cable/DSL needs wireless access, help! Re: 1+ as a toll indicator Re: A town near Orlando w/o cable/DSL needs wireless access, help! Re: 1+ as a toll indicator Re: MAPS alters back-dated press release; withdraws Media3 accusations Re: 1+ as a toll indicator (was: desirable numbers) Did I miss another Telco Consolidation? 1/4/01 ICBTollFreeNews.Com HEADS UP HEADLINES Re: Information Please Re: ongoing peacefire.org battle ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 4 Jan 2001 08:33:29 -0500 From: Steve Linford Subject: Re: ongoing peacefire.org battle [nanae added] In article <3A5383A0.AFED75DF@vcn.bc.ca>, dialtone@vcn.bc.ca wrote: > I think that it's pretty thickheaded to blackhole all traffic > (including http traffic) bound to or from an entire class C in > order to "fight spam." I definitely don't support spam--I think > that my contributions to the Telecom Digest Business Directory over > the years has made that point crystal clear--but I don't support > blackholing entire networks either. Nobody has blackholed "an entire network", what is blackholed is one of Media3's many class Cs (the specific class C in question is the Internet's worst spam nest). Every engineer on the net knows that if Media3 have any 'innocent casualties' in the blocked class C they can switch them to a different Media3 class C in a few minutes. To carify the Peacefire.org blackholing situation: Peacefire.org is _NOT_ a casualty of MAPS blackholing. Peacefire.org had happily been in a completely different Media3 class C for years. This year one of Media3's many class C filled up with stealth spam sites and after a great many warnings to Media3 was consequently blackholed by MAPS in June. This pissed off Bennett's friend Joe Hayes, the owner of Media3 (Joe Hayes was Bennett's ally in a previous blocking campaign 4 years ago by CYBERsitter). In August, two months _after_ the class C had already been blackholed by MAPS, Media3 _moved_ the unblocked Peacefire.org into the alreay-blackholed class C. It's not like Media3 didn't know that class C was blackholed, they even have a court case over it (Media3 took MAPS to court to get that class C released from the RBL, but lost). There is no way this was done accidentally or without Bennett's knowledge or they'd instantly switch Peacefire.org back out of there (and he'd be screaming his head off at them to switch him out, as anyone would), instead he _wants_ to stay blocked, completely evades the questions and isn't the slightest bit angry with Media3 at all. >From all the evidence I've seen, my opinion is that the blocking of Peacefire.org was _orchestrated_ to make Peacefire.org a casualty of MAPS blackholing. I'd like to believe Bennett didn't have anything to do with it, but I find that very difficult. - -- Steve Linford The Spamhaus Project http://www.spamhaus.org - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 4 Jan 2001 09:14:41 -0500 From: johnl@iecc.com (John R Levine) Subject: Re: please take ongoing peacefire.org battle to nanae or spam-l In article , Steve Linford wrote: > [ a good summary of the Peacefire vs. RBL argument ] Please continue this discussion in news.admin.net-abuse.email or the Spam-L mailing list, both of which are much more relevant to this issue. It was only vaguely related to Telecom in the first place. - -- John R. Levine, IECC, POB 727, Trumansburg NY 14886 +1 607 387 6869 johnl@iecc.com, Village Trustee and Sewer Commissioner, http://iecc.com/johnl, Member, Provisional board, Coalition Against Unsolicited Commercial E-mail - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 4 Jan 2001 10:13:54 -0500 From: sjsobol@NorthShoreTechnologies.net (Steve Sobol) Subject: Re: SWB Billing problems >From 'John Schmerold': >How can I make SWB's life tough for doing this to me & many others that >aren't as persistent as me? In addition to the obvious consumer fraud, it >seems to me that they are committing securities fraud if the are over >reporting income by 50%. I don't know that you should pursue the SEC issue (yet). File complaints with your state's Public Utilities Commission and your state's Attorney General. You may want to check with an attorney and see what other avenues you have available to you. The five companies that make up SBC's telephone cartel have been out of control for years. Here in Ohio, though, I think SBC actually made things worse. Our legislators have prohibited Ameritech from sending its earnings back to San Antonio until they get *their* problems fixed. (Yay, PUCO!) Unfortunately, I firmly believe that the overbilling is completely intentional. - -- Steve Sobol, BOFH, President 888.480.4NET 866.DSL.EXPRESS 216.619.2NET North Shore Technologies Corporation http://NorthShoreTechnologies.net JustTheNet/JustTheNet EXPRESS DSL (ISP Services) http://JustThe.net mailto:sjsobol@NorthShoreTechnologies.net Proud resident of Cleveland, OH - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 4 Jan 2001 10:14:26 -0500 From: Claire Pieterek Subject: Any opinions on Americom? I'm with Erbia right now and pleased with their 5.9 cpm LD service. But, the thought of 5.5 cpm and a no-cost toll-free number also billed at 5.5 cpm is almost tempting enough to switch carriers. Does anyone have any stories--good or bad--about service through Americom (http://5.5longdistance.com/americom)? Americom uses Frontier as their carrier--any thoughts about that? Thanks! - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 4 Jan 2001 10:15:13 -0500 From: sjsobol@NorthShoreTechnologies.net (Steve Sobol) Subject: Re: A town near Orlando w/o cable/DSL needs wireless access, help! >From 'Brian Kendig': >Okay, here's the deal. I live in the town of Celebration, Florida, which is >run by Disney (it's on Disney World property, just outside Orlando) and is >wonderful in almost all ways except one: there is no broadband Internet >access of any sort here; we're all limited to 56k modems. > >The town has its own private phone company and cable company. Both of these >companies say (1) "we're not going to let anyone else use our wires; if >anyone's going to offer DSL/cable modems here Mmmm? Any big telco would get slammed by the FCC after making such a claim. If someone else wants access, the ILEC generally has to provide access. - -- Steve Sobol, BOFH, President 888.480.4NET 866.DSL.EXPRESS 216.619.2NET North Shore Technologies Corporation http://NorthShoreTechnologies.net JustTheNet/JustTheNet EXPRESS DSL (ISP Services) http://JustThe.net mailto:sjsobol@NorthShoreTechnologies.net Proud resident of Cleveland, OH - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 4 Jan 2001 10:22:41 -0500 From: "John Schmerold" Subject: Re: A town near Orlando w/o cable/DSL needs wireless access, help! Check out http://www.starband.com/ My brother-in-law was a beta tester for this service, fka gilat2home, he was / is very satisfied. It runs $70 per month. $100 per month with a Dish TV feed, if you're in market for a computer, Radio Shack offers service for $60 per month, however, you must buy a computer with the system, this cost is offset by fact that the $200 install fee is waived for Radio Shack customers. Looks like they have systems from $500, so net cost of computer is $300 and you save $10 per month. Not bad. DejaNews had 17,000 hits on word StarBand. Should be able to learn more there. > Okay, here's the deal. I live in the town of Celebration, Florida, which is > run by Disney (it's on Disney World property, just outside Orlando) and is > wonderful in almost all ways except one: there is no broadband Internet > access of any sort here; we're all limited to 56k modems. > > The town has its own private phone company and cable company. Both of these > companies say (1) "we're not going to let anyone else use our wires; if > anyone's going to offer DSL/cable modems here, it will be us" and (2) this > town is too small to justify spending money on the infrastructure, so we're > not going to offer DSL/cable modems here." The phone company briefly > considered offering a five-year 256k DSL contract at $40/month times the > number of households in the town (no matter how many households actually > used it), but bad publicity shot down this plan. > > Since I don't see much chance of the town ever getting broadband access over > DSL or cable, I'd like to find a wireless Internet access company in the > area which might be interested in working with the town's residents. I > figure this might be a win/win situation: people here who need broadband > access would be happy to be on the cutting edge of technology, and any > company which comes to our aid would be an exclusive provider for the town > and could use it to showcase their technologies. As long as we can find a > solution which doesn't require using any of the town's existing wiring, I > don't see how the company which runs the town could complain. > > So I'm asking two things: > > (1) Can anyone recommend a wireless Internet access company in the > Orlando/Kissimmee area which might be interested in taking on this project? > > (2) Does anyone have any recommendations for other solutions to this dilemma? > > Note that I'm not an official representative of anything, and the only > person I speak for in the town is myself. This may be a half-baked nutty > idea, but I don't have many more ideas left. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 4 Jan 2001 10:36:13 -0500 From: Anthony Argyriou Subject: Re: MAPS alters back-dated press release; withdraws Media3 accusations >:If MAPS decided that these accusations were so unsupportable that they >:pulled them off their Web site, then they should have also sent out a >:retraction to everyone who received the original press release. Sending >:out a press release with errors, and then altering the back-dated version >:on your Web site without posting a proper retraction, is a serious threat >:to any organization's credibility. jay@west.net (Jay Hennigan) wrote: >MAPS likely had no choice lest they be held in contempt of court. You >are making an assumption that the release was modified because of errors, >which may not be the case. That does not excuse backdating the modified press release without sending out a retraction to the original recipients. If the court ordered the change, a responsible entity would send out a press release saying "we've been ordered by the Court to redact part of our press release; the modified press release is on the website." or at least to indicate on the website "modified by court order xx/xx/xxxx". Anthony Argyriou Unix _is_ user-friendly. It's just selective about its friends. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 4 Jan 2001 10:44:11 -0500 From: "John Schmerold" Subject: Re: I Emailed SPCS and they won't reply I can only speak from personal experience, but: At home and office, I've been using http://www.erbia.com no PICC charges, the taxes seem reasonable & $.062 per minute. They obtain their lines from http://www.qwest.com/ who we use for our 800 number. Can't put my finger on it, but Qwest seems more stable, so I have not transferred our 800 number to Erbia. Qwest has reasonable charges as well, I believe it's in the .08 - .09 range Best deal for calling card is http://www.bigzoo.com/ $0.039 per minute all taxes included. > Date: 4 Jan 2001 00:56:19 -0500 > From: Joseph Singer > Subject: Re: I Emailed SPCS and they won't reply > > 3 Jan 2001 22:44:01 -0500 wrote: > > >On Usenet I saw: "AT&T, MCI, and Sprint all do one or more of the following: > >have monthly minimums or monthly fees, overcharge the single-line user for > >the PICC fee, charge a flat universal service fee instead of a percentage > >fee. If you're on their basic service plan, AT&T does all of these things: > >They charge a $3.00 monthly minimum, $1.51 for the monthly PICC fee, and a > >flat $1.38 universal service fee, penalizing the low-volume user even > >further." - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 4 Jan 2001 15:34:16 -0500 From: johnl@iecc.com (John R Levine) Subject: Re: A town near Orlando w/o cable/DSL needs wireless access, help! >>The town has its own private phone company and cable company. Both of these >>companies say (1) "we're not going to let anyone else use our wires; if >>anyone's going to offer DSL/cable modems here > >Mmmm? Any big telco would get slammed by the FCC after making such a claim. The ILEC in Celebration is Vista-United, jointly owned by Disney and Sprint. They're not an RBOC, the rules aren't the same. I agree that it still stinks -- if my cousin's telco with 5000 rural subscribers can afford DSL, so can they. The other exchange that Vista-United serves is Lake Buena Vista, which is Disney World and a few adjacent businesses and residences. I'd think there'd be plenty of use for DSL there, and the two are close enough that they should be able to share back-end equipment. On the other hand, it always seemed to me that anyone who lives in Celebration has to expect to get Moused from time to time. I hear that they had a huge fight about the local schools. - -- John R. Levine, IECC, POB 727, Trumansburg NY 14886 +1 607 387 6869 johnl@iecc.com, Village Trustee and Sewer Commissioner, http://iecc.com/johnl, Member, Provisional board, Coalition Against Unsolicited Commercial E-mail - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 4 Jan 2001 15:45:27 -0500 From: "Michael A. Desmon" Subject: Re: A town near Orlando w/o cable/DSL needs wireless access, help! Brian Kendig wrote: >>The town has its own private phone company and cable company. Both of these >>companies say (1) "we're not going to let anyone else use our wires; if >>anyone's going to offer DSL/cable modems here And Steve Sobol responded: >Mmmm? Any big telco would get slammed by the FCC after making such a >claim. >If someone else wants access, the ILEC generally has to provide access. Unless it's an independent telco. If I'm not mistaken, that area is served by Vista-United. In general, the independents don't have to play by the same rules as the RBOC's. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 4 Jan 2001 18:57:01 -0500 From: craigm@earthling.net (Craig Macbride) Subject: Re: 1+ as a toll indicator "Adam H. Kerman" writes: >And if this Malaysian or Austrian company writes its phone number including the >dialing prefix, you will be unable to figure out how to dial the number from >another country. I would prefer to work on the assumption that, in any international media, people know how to phone numbers in their own country. If a number is listed as "+61 3 9876 5432", an Australian should know to dial "9876 4321" from Melbourne or "03 9876 4321" from outside the "03" area code and anyone from elsewhere in the world can just dial their international access number plus the number as written. If a number is listed as "+1 303 987 6543", a person in the USA should be able to work out how to dial it from their own area and anyone from elsewhere in the world can just dial their international access number plus the number as written. >I'm sorry you would be willing to do business with someone in another country >only if he writes his phone number including the country code. Sheesh! And >Americans are accused of being insular. This is nothing to do with being insular. It's to do with providing the information that the other party needs in order to contact you. If someone in another country lists their number as "07 123 4567", there is no way to know what the local rules are. Is the "0" part of the number when dialed from overseas or is it just an area code lead-in? If it's exactly as it would be dialed from overseas, then it's much easier for overseas callers and locals should know their own phone system well enough to know what they need to do. >No, that's a numbering plan. A dialing plan comprises the rules that govern >what digits must be dialed to correctly route a call. For instance, if the area >code is optional, if a dialing prefix must be used for certain types of calls, >etc. I was asking if the rules for dialing calls are identical throughout >Australia. Yes. If you are in the same area as the number you are calling, you never need the area code. (... but can use it if you really want to.) If you are calling a number outside your current area, you must include the area code. To my knowledge, this has always been the case. It's pretty amazing to contemplate the chaos that would exist otherwise. >In the previous paragraph, you defend the Australian practice of writing phones >numbers including the dialing prefix ignoring the standard. I see them as two entirely different situations. There are people who never make international calls and never use the internet and wouldn't understand anything in the international standard. The areas in Australia are generally referred as "02" (oh two), etc, in speech. Therefore it makes sense to use "03 9876 4321" in totally local contexts and "+61 3 9876 4321" in international contexts. The "+61 (0)3 9876 4321" format which indicates that the zero is a within-country lead-in would be the best, if there were some more standard way of expressing it. - -- Craig Macbride - -----------------------http://www.nyx.net/~cmacbrid------------------------ "It's a sense of humour like mine, Carla, that makes me proud to be ashamed of myself." - Captain Kremmen - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 4 Jan 2001 19:03:07 -0500 From: Wes Leatherock Subject: Re: A town near Orlando w/o cable/DSL needs wireless access, help! Is Celebration part of Lake Buena Vista, or part of the Disney development district? Lake Buena Vista is Disney; the only place I know in the U.S.A. where a private company can levy taxes on the businesses and residents. (Taxes, not just fees, in the same way that a government body, city or whatever, can levy taxes.) They have a great many powers; after all, Disney _is_ the city--the municipality--in Lake Buena Vista. That may extend to Celebration, too. Wes Leatherock wleath@sandbox.dynip.com On 4 Jan 2001 15:34:16 -0500 John R Levine wrote: > >>The town has its own private phone company and cable company. Both of these > >>companies say (1) "we're not going to let anyone else use our wires; if > >>anyone's going to offer DSL/cable modems here > > > >Mmmm? Any big telco would get slammed by the FCC after making such a claim. > > The ILEC in Celebration is Vista-United, jointly owned by Disney and Sprint. > > They're not an RBOC, the rules aren't the same. I agree that it still > stinks -- if my cousin's telco with 5000 rural subscribers can afford DSL, > so can they. > > The other exchange that Vista-United serves is Lake Buena Vista, which > is Disney World and a few adjacent businesses and residences. I'd > think there'd be plenty of use for DSL there, and the two are close > enough that they should be able to share back-end equipment. > > On the other hand, it always seemed to me that anyone who lives in > Celebration has to expect to get Moused from time to time. I hear > that they had a huge fight about the local schools. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 4 Jan 2001 20:23:32 -0500 From: Kevin Strietzel Subject: Re: 1+ as a toll indicator "Adam H. Kerman" wrote: > On 01/03/01, at 10:47am -0500, Claire Pieterek wrote: > >"Adam H. Kerman" writes: > >>Ah, but there is no universal NANP dialing plan. Use of the "1" dialing > >>prefix before the area code is not mandatory in all dialing plans, or > >>before all area codes in some dialing plans. 1 NPA NXX-XXXX SHOULD be a > >>universal method of dialing in any dialing plan, but it is not. And people > >>dialing behind PBXs, of course, have to follow internal dialing plans. > > >Too true. For example, I live in QWorst (formerly Useless Waste) > >territory, where all calls--local or long distance--are mandatory > >10-digit-dial (omitting, of course, whatever one needs to dial if one is > >behind a PBX). > > You never need to dial the "1" dialing prefix? Here in the piece of QWest territory where I live and work (Metro Phoenix, Arizona), the 1 seems to indicate a toll call. We have both 480 and 602 area codes in the local calling area; it's geographic and not an overlay (they waffled back and forth a couple times between overlay and geographic splits as different lobbies screamed). The 1-NPA seems to be necessary for toll calls. The 1 is forbidden for local calls (mildly annoying). The NPA is optional for local calls in the same area. Thus: 1-NPA-NXX-XXXX: Toll service. NPA-NXX-XXXX: Local service in either area. NXX-XXXX: Local service within the calling line's area. Off the top of my head, I'm not sure about whether any or all cellular phones require the 1 or even the NPA. Applies from home in 480 and work in 602. 'Course it's real nice that the office PBX knows how to dial certain frequently-called ranges of 10-digit numbers with 4 and 5 digits! - --Kevin Strietzel Not speaking for Stratus. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 4 Jan 2001 21:25:50 -0500 From: (Wm. Randolph Franklin) Subject: Re: MAPS alters back-dated press release; withdraws Media3 accusations In article on 4 Jan 2001 10:36:13 -0500, Anthony Argyriou writes: > That does not excuse backdating the modified press release > without sending out a retraction to the original > recipients. If the court ordered the change, a responsible > entity would send out a press release saying "we've been > ordered by the Court to redact part of our press release; the > modified press release is on the website." or at least to > indicate on the website "modified by court order xx/xx/xxxx". It's conceivable that the court did not allow that. Here's a related example. Walter (IIRC) Taylor used to make wine in NYS, under the name Bully Hill. However, a relative had the exclusive right to use the name 'Taylor' in winemaking. Walter went several rounds with those Taylors in court. 1. He couldn't use his name on his labels. That one was easy. However... 2. He then tried to put a statement on the label saying that a court had forbidden him to use his name. Taylor Wine went back to court; Walter was forbidden to say even that. 3. Finally, he was reduced to an simple statement that you could write the winery to learn the name of the owners. As another example, if you sign a consent degree with, say, the SEC, admitting to something, you are then prohibited in future from saying anything to dispute what you've admitted to. I actually find this sort of restriction quite scary. - ---- (Wm. Randolph Franklin) - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 4 Jan 2001 22:42:26 -0500 From: "Bob Goudreau" Subject: Re: 1+ as a toll indicator (was: desirable numbers) Linc Madison wrote: > > I believe > > that there are only about 8 states where it is possible to make LD > > calls without dialing the "1" prefix: CA, IL, NY, NJ, PA, WV, NH and > > ME, IIRC. > > You left out Rhode Island. (Yes, there are toll calls within Rhode > Island.) Yup, you're right. I just dug up an old (1997) draft of a document called the "Industry Number Committee (INC) Uniform Dialing Plan" that I have laying around, and consulted the appendix describing the dialing plans in each NPA. Rhode Island is indeed listed as using 7D for HNPA Toll. However, I also misspoke (in the opposite direction) about West Virginia, which the INC document lists as using 1+10D for HNPA Toll, so the net effect is about the same. > Also, Massachusetts allowed 7D toll calls in some cases until > fairly recently. Could you please elaborate? As a Bay State native, my memories of toll dialing all include the leading 1: either 1+7D for HNPA Toll (prior to the mid-1990s, when it changed to 1+10D); or 1+10D for FNPA Toll (always). The 1997 INC draft also lists all 3 (as they were at the time) Massachusetts NPAs as using 1+10D for HNPA Toll. Perhaps you're talking about the muddy category of "extended local area" calls, which aren't strictly Long Distance (in the sense of being able to choose an alternate carrier for such calls), but which can incur time-based "message unit" charges if you have not signed up for the appropriate Extended Area local calling plan (under which such calls have zero marginal cost). > Still, it is a good bit under half the population. In > fact, it's right about 1/3. That's what I recall being the case in the mid-1990s as well, so I guess the big picture hasn't changed very much. - --- Bob Goudreau Cary, NC - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 4 Jan 2001 23:34:18 -0500 From: tweek@fnord.io.com (Mike Maxfield) Subject: Did I miss another Telco Consolidation? Guy walks into the door of my office today, says "Hi, I'm from the Phone Company." I've had solicitation attempts in the paste for "The Copier Repair Company" and "Your Long Distance Company" to know to get the clothespin out and quickly attached to my nose before things really start smelling and I ask "Which phone company?" him: "The phone company." "You mean SBC." He started a new waltz then, suggesting that I was confused by the breakup of ATT and all the Baby Bells, and told me he was with Pacific Bell. (UH, yeah, that's what I said, SBC). I asked him if he worked for Pacific Bell or if he was a contractor. He told me that he worked directly for Pacific Bell, and was not a sales agent or anything like that. He pulled out what must have been a photocopy of a photocopy of a photocopy of a "Dear Customer" letter detail from a phone bill, with the account number of the original bill account redacted with a fat black marker somewhere back in the generations of copies, and lots of little scribbled notes, also somewhere back in the ancestry of that photocopy. There was some current generation yellow highlighter over a portion of the text, but I still was not impressed. The guy talked about how Pacific Bell sent this notice out in the bills to all businesses to inform them about a rate increase from five cents to nine cents on LOCAL TOLL CALLS (He flung that phrase around more often than a cowboy soused on cactus juice flings cow patties) and how he was now visiting all businesses to make sure they recieved the information. Now somewhere among all that verbiage he was flinging, he name droped WORLDCOM several times, telling me that Worldcom would now be handling all the LOCAL TOLL CALLS. Still skeptical, and having earlier noticed a magstripe badge hanging from his belt (magstripe facing out) I asked to see his ID. He unclips the card off his belt and shows me the other side... I didn't study it carefully enough to notice if there was a any identifying information on it... the WORLDCOM logo kind of overwelmed me. As the guy headed out of the door, I informed him (in a polite manner, as if he was with The Phone Company) that he really should dress up his presentation since a sloppy photocopy doesn't impress customers and causes skepticism. He argued that he couldn't bring the real bill because it would have account numbers showing. "Or at least something official looking like real letterhead" I responded and he walked out the door, across and out of the parking lot, not visiting my neighbors to the right or left. I didn't observe any further to see if he came back into our lot for a car he may have left behind, or if he was in a neighboring lot. So... I'm quite depressed today since finding out the MCI has apparently bought up PacBell. I think I'll find that cactus juice the cowboy was getting soused on. - -- tweek@io.com - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2001 23:53:30 -0500 From: "Judith Oppenheimer" Subject: 1/4/01 ICBTollFreeNews.Com HEADS UP HEADLINES ____________________________________________________ ICBTollFreeNews.Com HEADS UP HEADLINES ____________________________________________________ from ICB Toll Free News - Daily News and Intelligence covering the Political, Legal and Marketing Arenas of 800 and Dot Com. ____________________________________________________ CONTENTS "We are to be entrusted with what are essentially customer databases of the registrars." A somewhat fantastic statement, considering who is on the advisory board. SEE http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4953 "Placing .tv alongside .com and .net on the NSI web site is a clear indication of the growing global demand and appeal of .tv web addresses." SEE http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4950 They avoided the conflict with .WEB by not awarding that string to any applicant. The same should have applied to .BIZ, but they ignored it. Rumor has it that it was because they did not perceive a threat by such a small company. SEE http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4952 RespOrgs, it seems, would prefer subscribers file complaints with the FCC or transfer their business elsewhere. Odd, considering the specific goal of speedy technical remedy versus "ratting out" RespOrgs and litigating. SEE http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4951 ___________________________________________________ ___________________________________________________ ICB is easily the most timely, concise, and articulate source of Daily 800 and Domain Name Industry Information online. "An important source of inside information," says InfoWorld; "superb", "invaluable", "critically intelligent", "exceedingly useful", report ICB Premium Subscribers. ICB Premium Subscription is ON SALE thru January 15. Subscribe Here: http://www.icbtollfree.com/Article4910.htm ___________________________________________________ ___________________________________________________ For information on advertising in ICB HeadsUp Headlines, email mailto:editor@icbtollfree.com, subject line: ICB rate card. ___________________________________________________ ___________________________________________________ CUSTOMER SERVICE NOTES: With over 4,000 articles archived, ICB is a popular research destination. Find all ICB headlines: http://www.icbtollfree.com/icbheadlns.cfm, or use ICB's search engine: http://icbtollfree.com/Search.cfm. Note: Registration is required. Contact information is NOT sold, leased, rented or shared in any manner. ICB offers FREE classifieds: http://ICBclassifieds.com. ____________________________________________________ EVERY 3.6 SECONDS SOMEONE DIES FROM HUNGER http://www.hungersite.com/ ____________________________________________________ ARTICLE ACCESS CODE LEGEND ICB Toll Free News offers two valuable service options: F = Free - News and Features articles P = Premium - Unlimited Site Access including all Articles and Documents. ____________________________________________________ HEADLINES for January 4, 2001 P - 800 AUDIT DRAFT RANKLES RESP ORGS "The [new SMS 800 Administrator] must directly address each FCC Order clause and industry guideline related to toll free resources. [It] shall identify how it intends to support the data collection, preparation and evaluation phase of an audit performed to verify RespOrg compliance with FCC Rules and industry toll free guidelines." Etc. Not all were pleased. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4951 P - A MATTER OF TRUST? SnapNames represents, "In order to accomplish our goal of a safer and more efficient domain name system it was necessary for a third-party, independent, registrar-agnostic player to come to the table that can be trusted with everyone's customer data - that's the role we play ... we are to be entrusted with what are essentially customer databases of the registrars." Perhaps the registrars should take a closer look. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4953 F - HELP! ICANN IS CREATING HAVOC. A petition for a Rulemaking by DoC/NTIA on whether DoC will be able to enter a duplicate .BIZ into the USG root (without due process and against the APA) was filed on December 18. NITA has it under review. If they follow their own procedures, there should be a public comments period which will be announced. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4952 F - NSI & DOT TV, A DUO This deal marks the first time that Network Solutions has featured a new domain name alternative to .com, .net, and .org. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4950 ____________________________________________________ ABOUT ICB ICB HeadsUp Headlines Daily Email is sent by request. Subscriptions to Daily Email are free to qualified applicants. Visit http://www.icbtollfree.com/reg.cfm?NextURL=Index.cfm to sign up. Please feel free to pass along a copy to a friend, within reason so long as the message is not modified or used unfavorably. To unsubscribe mailto:editor@icbtollfree.com, subject: unsubscribe. (Unsubs are processed manually, approximately once a week.) ____________________________________________________ Only subscribers or registered users of ICB Toll Free News web site will be able to access all or some of the full text of URLs provided. ____________________________________________________ Copyright © 2000 ICB, Inc. All rights reserved. ____________________________________________________ ------------------------------ Date: 5 Jan 2001 02:28:14 -0500 From: "James H. Cloos Jr." Subject: Re: Information Please >>>>> "Tad" == Tad Cook writes: Tad> Didn't PAT post this to the Digest some years ago? Yup. Quick check shows vol 17, issue 344, last article. 1997/Dec/08. Cf: - -JimC - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 5 Jan 2001 03:56:24 -0500 From: Linc Madison Subject: Re: ongoing peacefire.org battle [As requested, all follow-ups to this article are set to NANAE. Please do not follow up to this article in Telecom Digest/comp.dcom.telecom] In article <3A5383A0.AFED75DF@vcn.bc.ca>, Babu Mengelepouti wrote: > Linc Madison wrote: > > > Agreed, and indeed, your "Do you have anything specific?" was > > disingenuous in the context of this entire thread, and highly damaging > > to your credibility. > > Come on, Linc. "You have lost all credibility" and its variants has > been a tired troll line since the BBS days. If you want to challenge > someone's credibility, do it through superior logic--not something like > this one. I did challenge his credibility through superior logic, Babu. Many, many specifics have been posted in this thread, and yet Bennett has the raw nerve to fire back a simple, "Do you have anything specific?" when he has been completely EVADING the specific issues that many people have raised. THAT is extremely damaging to his credibility. It's not a tired troll line, it's a fact. > For what it's worth, I think both you and Bennett are equally credible. > Shrilly ranting that someone else has lost credibility doesn't help your > case. I'm not shrilly ranting. I'm bringing up facts. I'm also not evading the questions, which Bennett is. > > Bennett, you're being far more thick-headed than the people who write > > the censorware programs you monitor. You are damaging not only > > Peacefire, but, by association, everyone else who fights against overly > > broad censorware products. You, both personally and organizationally, > > are being co-opted. > > I think that it's pretty thickheaded to blackhole all traffic (including > http traffic) bound to or from an entire class C in order to "fight > spam." It's also pretty thickheaded to allow your web site to remain (or possibly even allow it to be placed) in a subnet that you know is blackholed, just to make a political point that is not directly related to your organization's mission. > There are spamware providers in the class C where Bennett's site > resides. There are also a lot of other things. The solution of "move > to another ISP" is not reasonable or practical for most > people--especially if they could end up blackholed again by the same > wrong-headed policies. Except that it has been demonstrated that it would have been entirely reasonable and practical for Peacefire, and yet Bennett has refused all offers. You were saying about superior logic? > > Is it really more important to you to fight in favor of spamware and > > spam support services than to fight against censorware that blocks > > sites indiscriminately? Peacefire can only do one or the other with any > > I don't think that Bennett is fighting in favor of spamware and spam > support services, and I think that it's asinine that you would try to > portray Bennett in that manner. Bennett has a problem with route > filtering an entire network, that contains a lot of things other than > spamware vendors. He is in fact fighting in favor of spamware and spam support services. He is fighting dishonestly against MAPS and AboveNet's tactics in combatting spamware and spam support services. His post here about the revised MAPS press release contained some genuine facts, but he distorted them out of all proportion and give them an entirely pro-Media3 slant that was unwarranted. That's a fact, whether you think it asinine or not. > > People like me, who believe that unmonitored censorware is a very > > dangerous thing, are rethinking their support for Peacefire because of > > your irrational behavior and words. > > That just goes to show how strong your convictions were in the first > place. If you're really so malleable, I have some really fine property > below the water table in the Everglades... You were talking about asinine portrayals? I never said that my convictions regarding censorware were in any way shaken. I said that my support for PEACEFIRE is shaken. If you believe that opposition to censorware and support for Peacefire are one and the same, then I'm not surprised that you bought a swamp. I do not support every organization whose stated cause is just. The organization itself must also be well run, and Bennett is giving me serious doubts about Peacefire. > > If you want to have any credibility at all in this discussion, you need > > to provide direct, unequivocal answers to questions including the > > following: > > It seems to me that most reasonable people wouldn't automatically, when > signing up for Web hosting service, ask whether the class C in which > they're going to live is RBL'ed. The POINT is that many people believe that Bennett *DID* know before his web site was moved to that IP address that it was an RBL'd block. No, most people wouldn't ask, but I want to know whether or not *Bennett* knew. If Bennett didn't know, then he was hoodwinked by Media3. If he did know, then he was collaborating with them to make a media showcase of an "innocent victim" who in fact was in on the whole setup. > A reasonable parallel would be an ILEC deciding not to allow any calls > to or from a CLEC's exchange, because some numbers within that exchange > are used for outbound telemarketing. That's not a reasonable parallel at all, because the relationship between the ILEC and the CLEC is governed by laws and tariffs that do not apply to ISPs. > > You have also made a statement regarding spamware that I find > > alarmingly disingenuous in and of itself. You have said that you > > believe web sites should be free to sell spamware, because they have no > > control of how it will be used. That's a bogus argument: there is no > > possible legitimate use to a piece of software that scans newsgroups > > for e-mail addresses and then sends bulk e-mail to those addresses, > > using forged headers and open SMTP relays. It is software that has no > > POSSIBLE legitimate use, so saying that the writer has no knowledge of > > the way end users are employing it, is nothing but a cop-out. > > Not all spamware does this. In fact, the company for which I work uses > spamware. We use it to send out technical newsletters, which customers > have specifically asked us for. It's sent out through our SMTP servers > using real headers. Nobody would argue that this isn't a legitimate use > of spamware. The fact remains that some of the spamware in the Class C block where Peacefire's web site is currently located, does fit my description. > > Sites that sell spamware clearly meet the requirements to be listed in > > the RBL, as well they should. ISPs that continue to host sites that > > sell spamware also clearly meet the RBL requirements -- again, as well > > they should. Your complaint should not be against MAPS or the RBL, but > > against Media3. > > An appropriate and valid use of RBL is to block SMTP traffic to > offending networks. However, I see no valid reason to blackhole HTTP > traffic. I especially see no valid reason to use RBL's BGP feed > secretly to block HTTP traffic. That's a separate issue. However, I also see no valid reason to deliberately place or leave your web site in a blocked subnet. > I don't think that MAPS is to blame in this case--they just publish RBL, > and how ISPs use it is up to them. I hate spam, and I think that MAPS > does good work. However, I also think that backbone providers using > MAPS to blackhole all traffic to or from entire networks is a direct > attack on the Internet's foundation of universal connectivity. Last I > checked, there weren't many unsolicited commercial HTTP packets invading > my mailbox. I think that in most cases the MAPS BGP feed is overkill, especially for outside customers. However, I don't think it's a direct attack on the Internet's foundation. [Reminder: please send follow-ups only to NANAE. If you're using the Usenet feed of comp.dcom.telecom, that should be done for you automatically. If you receive Telecom Digest as e-mail, either reply by direct e-mail to me or in Usenet under NANAE.] - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ End of Telecom Digest V2000 #177 ******************************** Date: 5 Jan 2001 06:15:16 -0500 From: owner-telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org (Telecom Digest) To: telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org Subject: Telecom Digest V2000 #178 Telecom Digest Friday, January 5 2001 Volume 2000 : Number 178 In this issue: Re: A town near Orlando w/o cable/DSL needs wireless access, help! Re: 1+ as a toll indicator (was: desirable numbers) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 5 Jan 2001 05:56:21 -0500 From: "Ed Ellers" Subject: Re: A town near Orlando w/o cable/DSL needs wireless access, help! Wes Leatherock wrote: "They have a great many powers; after all, Disney _is_ the city--the municipality--in Lake Buena Vista. That may extend to Celebration, too." AFAIK Celebration is in the same district, which was granted special legsl powers by the Florida legislature in the mid-1960s. Vista-United was sold to Smart City Networks a few months ago. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 5 Jan 2001 06:05:01 -0500 From: "Ed Ellers" Subject: Re: 1+ as a toll indicator (was: desirable numbers) Bob Goudreau wrote: "I believe that there are only about 8 states where it is possible to make LD calls without dialing the "1" prefix: CA, IL, NY, NJ, PA, WV, NH and ME, IIRC. Granted, all but the last three are quite populous, but they still are no match for the vast toll-alerting majority of the country." Note that this doesn't necessarily apply to wireless carriers. Powertel requires 10D dialing on all calls, and does not require a 1 even on long distance calls (this applies whether you have a "free long distance" plan or not). I suspect this is because they use GSM. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ End of Telecom Digest V2000 #178 ******************************** Date: 6 Jan 2001 06:15:18 -0500 From: owner-telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org (Telecom Digest) To: telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org Subject: Telecom Digest V2000 #179 Telecom Digest Saturday, January 6 2001 Volume 2000 : Number 179 In this issue: Re: Did I miss another Telco Consolidation? Re: A town near Orlando w/o cable/DSL needs wireless access, help! FXO call hangup signalling LEC fights competition Re: 1+ as a toll indicator (was: desirable numbers) Re: LEC fights competition Re: A town near Orlando w/o cable/DSL needs wireless access, help! Re: 1+ as a toll indicator (was: desirable numbers) Re: 1+ as a toll indicator (was: desirable numbers) Re: 1+ on wireless phones AT&T Poor phone line quality Re: 1+ as a toll indicator (was: desirable numbers) Re: AT&T Poor phone line quality 1/5/01 ICBTollFreeNews.Com HEADS UP HEADLINES Coalition Makes Concession on Anti-Piracy Technology Re: 1+ as a toll indicator (was: desirable numbers) Re: 1+ as a toll indicator (was: desirable numbers) Re: MAPS alters back-dated press release; withdraws Media3 accusations ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 5 Jan 2001 08:43:49 -0500 From: sjsobol@NorthShoreTechnologies.net (Steve Sobol) Subject: Re: Did I miss another Telco Consolidation? >From 'Mike Maxfield': >So... I'm quite depressed today since finding out the MCI has apparently >bought up PacBell. I think I'll find that cactus juice the cowboy was >getting soused on. My bet is that MCI didn't buy PacBell. :) - -- Steve Sobol, BOFH, President 888.480.4NET 866.DSL.EXPRESS 216.619.2NET North Shore Technologies Corporation http://NorthShoreTechnologies.net JustTheNet/JustTheNet EXPRESS DSL (ISP Services) http://JustThe.net mailto:sjsobol@NorthShoreTechnologies.net Proud resident of Cleveland, OH - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 5 Jan 2001 10:04:44 -0500 From: Fred Goldstein Subject: Re: A town near Orlando w/o cable/DSL needs wireless access, help! John Levine writes, >The ILEC in Celebration is Vista-United, jointly owned by Disney and Sprint. > >They're not an RBOC, the rules aren't the same. I agree that it still >stinks -- if my cousin's telco with 5000 rural subscribers can afford DSL, >so can they. There are exemptions to *some* of the obligations of ILECs for "rural" ILECs, who by definition can't have more than 50,000 subscribers nationwide. Vista-United almost certainly doesn't qualify because it's part of the Sprint chain. So they must lease loops to competitors just as much as BellSouth does. It's possible that Celebration doesn't have a "central office" building of its own. Perhaps it's served out of some DLCs in huts. That doesn't relieve the telco of the need to allow leased loops (or, in such a case, subloops), but the logistics of remote-terminal collocation are tricky and few competitors have managed to get in anywhere so far. But if there's demand for it, it could be done. I don't think satellite's a good substitute, due to the latency. Wireless could do it, but since Disney owns all the land for miles around, it would be hard without their blessing to set up the base antenna, and they would probably give a hard to to anybody putting outdoor antennas on their fantasyland tickytacky housing. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 5 Jan 2001 10:19:39 -0500 From: pcolbeck@dasterdly.esc.azlan.co.uk (Pat Colbeck) Subject: FXO call hangup signalling Hi Sorry if this is the wrong newsgroup but here goes:- If I have an analogue phone connected to a PBX then the PBX is connected to an FXO interface in a router which changes the call to Voice over IP and then at the other end the same in reverse (ie router PBX phone) what should the disconnect signalling be ? So far as I can work out if I pick up the phoen and dial the remote phone them my phone goes off hook and the PBX once it has collected all the digits brings up the line to the FXO if on the router (a multmeter accoss this cable sees the voltage change from -7v to 48v then stabalize at 9v once the phone at the other end is picked up). The problem is that if I then put the phone down the voltage between the PBX and the router stays at 9volts and the router doesnt detect a disconnect. Am I correct in thinking that the voltage at this point should have dropped back to - -7volts ? The PBX to router FXO link is set for loopstart. And the PBX is an Ericsson Businessphone 50. Thanks Pat - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 5 Jan 2001 10:41:01 -0500 From: davidesan@my-deja.com Subject: LEC fights competition I saw this in the morning fishwrap: Local company moved to larger quarters across the street, and switched telephone companies. The LEC dragged their heels on installation of lines, and the company is using cellphones in the parking lot. See more at: www.rochesternews.com/0105phones.html - -- David Esan InformationView Solutions david.esan@informationview.com Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 5 Jan 2001 11:06:57 -0500 From: johnl@iecc.com (John R. Levine) Subject: Re: 1+ as a toll indicator (was: desirable numbers) >Note that this doesn't necessarily apply to wireless carriers. Powertel >requires 10D dialing on all calls, and does not require a 1 even on long >distance calls (this applies whether you have a "free long distance" plan or >not). I suspect this is because they use GSM. Wireless carriers tend to be pretty casual about 1+. The reason is that to make a wireless call, you punch in the number and press Send, at which point the phone sends the number in a block to the switch. There's no question of how many digits the user dialed, so there's no need for 1+ to distinguish 7D from 10D, so lacking that they can just ignore 1+ altogether. - -- John R. Levine, IECC, POB 727, Trumansburg NY 14886 +1 607 387 6869 johnl@iecc.com, Village Trustee and Sewer Commissioner, http://iecc.com/johnl, Member, Provisional board, Coalition Against Unsolicited Commercial E-mail - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 5 Jan 2001 11:49:07 -0500 From: "Adam H. Kerman" Subject: Re: LEC fights competition David Esan wrote: >I saw this in the morning fishwrap: >Local company moved to larger quarters across the street, and switched >telephone companies. The LEC dragged their heels on installation of >lines, and the company is using cellphones in the parking lot. See >more at: > http://www.rochesternews.com/0105phones.html Part of the ILEC's excuse: Had to obtain right-of-way from the municipality and the building owner's permission! A phone company has a municipal franchise. Obviously, it was already serving businesses along this particular street. Assuming it can string wire without interference with other utilities (i.e., it need not dig up a street), doesn't it already have permission from the municipality to do so as part of its franchise? On the other hand, isn't it typically the construction contractor's responsibility to see that all utility hookups are made before turning the building over to the ultimate user? The ILEC claimed that the CLEC only placed its order with it days before Thanksgiving and only shortly before the company would have moved in. I don't find that credible; it would seem that too many people would be prodding the CLEC to arrange for the line. The location for the line, like other utilities, would have been chosen prior to construction. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 5 Jan 2001 11:53:25 -0500 From: brian-usenet@enchanter.net (Brian Kendig) Subject: Re: A town near Orlando w/o cable/DSL needs wireless access, help! johnl@iecc.com (John R Levine) writes: >On the other hand, it always seemed to me that anyone who lives in >Celebration has to expect to get Moused from time to time. I hear >that they had a huge fight about the local schools. That's true; the school was *weird* when they were first set it up, but now it's more or less just a typical Florida school. People were lured here by promises of a first-rate cutting-edge school, but those promises dried up. As for broadband, many of us were lured here by the town's committment to a "Technology" cornerstone, a much-touted "Front Porch" town intranet with a free ISP, and promises that every house was connected with fiber-optic. Turns out that the intranet is just a bunch of modems, the town's web site is out-of-date, and the fiber-optic from each house doesn't go any further than the curb. D'oh! If you're curious, you can read some of the debate at 'http://www.xone.net/disney/board/forumdisplay.cgi?action=topics&number=4' (that board covers all sorts of Celebration discussion, and broadband pops up there frequently). Thank you all for your suggestions about how to get broadband access here! It looks like satellite isn't the way to go because of its latency issues and because we'd have to make sure the satellite dishes aren't easily visible. Wireless radio-signal-based access might be the way to go; what sorts of antennas would this require? How successful have previous attempts at this been? - -- ____ |\/| Brian Kendig \ /\ / ..__. brian at enchanter net You are in a maze of twisty \/ \__\ _/ http://www.enchanter.net/ little passages, all alike. \__ __ \_ Be insatiably curious. \____\___\ Ask "why" a lot. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 5 Jan 2001 14:59:25 -0500 From: dattier@yahoo.com (David W. Tamkin) Subject: Re: 1+ as a toll indicator (was: desirable numbers) Ed Ellers wrote in <9349ni$8nefv$1@ID-39509.news.dfncis.de>: | Note that this doesn't necessarily apply to wireless carriers. Powertel | requires 10D dialing on all calls, and does not require a 1 even on long | distance calls (this applies whether you have a "free long distance" plan or | not). I suspect this is because they use GSM. I can't say why they require 10D on local intra-NPA calls (unless there's an overlay where you are), but the reason for not requiring a 1 on long-distance calls is that cause calls placed from wireless phones require pressing a SEND key, so the carrier knows the entire dialing string by the time it has to parse it. There's no need for it to base guesses on a partly dialed number. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 5 Jan 2001 16:42:05 -0500 From: Greg Monti Subject: Re: 1+ as a toll indicator (was: desirable numbers) On 24 Dec 2000, johnl@iecc.com (John R Levine) wrote: >It appears that most of the US by land area use toll alerting, 1+ >before all toll calls, for some definition of toll call, but the >laces without toll alerting include New York, Chicago, Los Angeles, >Philadelpia, and their metro areas so by population more people don't >have toll alerting than do. A quick analysis of the US done a few years ago tallied that 25% of the area codes have NO toll alerting, while 75% do. In population, however, the non-toll-alerting states are some of the larger ones (New York, New Jersey, Pennsylvania, Illinois, California, maybe 1 or 2 others), which contain about 33% of the US population. In Canada, the whole country is toll-alerted. I think that's also true of the Carribbean islands which are part of the NANP. Curiously, toll alerting on cell phones does not always follow the pattern of landline phones in the same area. In non-toll-alerting areas, the 1+ prefix is superfluous on cell phones because it is only used to indicate that ten digits follow. On a cell phone, the SEND key fulfills that function. My AT&T Wireless phone does not require 1+ on any calls, whether used in New York (non-toll alerting) or Texas (anal-retentive toll alerting). But in San Francisco (non-toll-alerting), where it operates on the Cellular One system, 1+ is required if you are dialing 10 digits, which means you can't use any pre-programmed numbers that don't already have the 1 pre-pended. - ---- Greg Monti New York, New York, USA mailto:gmonti@mindspring.com - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 5 Jan 2001 17:01:36 -0500 From: "Ed Ellers" Subject: Re: 1+ on wireless phones David W. Tamkin wrote: "I can't say why they require 10D on local intra-NPA calls (unless there's an overlay where you are)..." There isn't. My guess is that they're trying to make things consistent for roamers, especially those on flat-rate long distance plans who are likely to have long distance numbers in their speed dial memory. (Handspring's new VisorPhone has a helpful feature to let you preset your home NPA. When you dial a seven-digit number it prepends your NPA; when you dial ten digits, less than seven digits (such as 611) or international numbers, it doesn't prepend.) "...but the reason for not requiring a 1 on long-distance calls is that cause calls placed from wireless phones require pressing a SEND key, so the carrier knows the entire dialing string by the time it has to parse it. There's no need for it to base guesses on a partly dialed number." Um, not quite. If a wireline telco required 10D dialing for all local calls, there would be no need for 1+ (other than toll alerting), because the CO would be waiting for ten digits in all cases. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 5 Jan 2001 18:44:57 -0500 From: "Carpenter" Subject: AT&T Poor phone line quality 4 months ago I moved into a new apartment with AT&T phone service. I have a Toshiba laptop with a Lucent V90 toshiba modem that I use to connect to my UUNET V90 account. Once I connect I VPN into corporate. I have never seen anything better than 33K and most were sickly 12K and some 14 and 19K connections. But yet when I dial out from another location I can consistently connect at 52K. Called AT&T and after several visits I got a tech who gave me the latest drivers. Once installed I could now at times connect at 49k but with no throughput. My phone line blew out line cards and required AT&T to come out and replace the line cards in the building. After escalation AT&T discovered they needed upgraded phone cards which were installed in the building today. Now I get consistent solid 49K connections and by that I mean 60% of the time I connect at 49k and sometimes 45, 48 and 14K. Still nothing above 50K! They say it's not the Phone line and that this is normal. Since I can most always connect at 52k elsewhere I think this is crap. Am I crazy or is it possible their system is the culprit?? They claim to have all fiber digital phone lines. Help! - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 5 Jan 2001 19:56:56 -0500 From: Roy Subject: Re: 1+ as a toll indicator (was: desirable numbers) The following URL provides some information into dialing characteristics by area code http://www.nanpa.com/dialing/index.html - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 5 Jan 2001 20:25:45 -0500 From: Andrew Subject: Re: AT&T Poor phone line quality Carpenter wrote: > Am I crazy or is it possible their system is the culprit?? They claim to > have all fiber digital phone lines. Help! You are crazy. 49k is a very good connection speed. It's possible you might be able to squeeze a liitle more out of your phone line by unplugging every telephone, answering machine and fax machine in your residence while you're using the modem. Andrew - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2001 23:38:46 -0500 From: "Judith Oppenheimer" Subject: 1/5/01 ICBTollFreeNews.Com HEADS UP HEADLINES ____________________________________________________ ICBTollFreeNews.Com HEADS UP HEADLINES ____________________________________________________ from ICB Toll Free News - Daily News and Intelligence covering the Political, Legal and Marketing Arenas of 800 and Dot Com. ____________________________________________________ CONTENTS - - EC SAYS HANDS-OFF VOIP - - 800 TRAVEL, TAKEOVER TARGET - - DOC! SAYS TELLME - - WIPO NIXES NBA KNICKS.COM UDRP - - VACATING ICANN BOARD SEAT OPENS UP - - DOT HACK ___________________________________________________ ___________________________________________________ ICB is easily the most timely, concise, and articulate source of Daily 800 and Domain Name Industry Information online. 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CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4959 F - 800 TRAVEL, TAKEOVER TARGET "I believe that the stock of 800 Travel Systems, Inc. is currently undervalued in comparison to similar companies. As such, I and the Companies that are controlled by me, intend to purchase substantial quantities of stock within the next ninety (90) days. While the intent of the purchase is for investment, a takeover may be initiated if significant stock becomes available through the public market." CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4957 F - DOC! SAYS TELLME The San Francisco Chronicle's DOC! (Directory On Call) service, which receives 5 million calls per year, will be transferred to Tellme(TM) starting today. 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CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4955 P - VACATING ICANN BOARD SEAT OPENS UP Any individual can be nominated with the exception of national government or international treaty officials. Self-nominations are permitted. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4954 P - DOT HACK Over year 2000, over 5800 defacements were recorded, over 2000 more defacements over 1999. Where did these defacements come from? Did any Top Level Domains manage to reduce their share of defacements over the last year? CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4958 ____________________________________________________ ABOUT ICB ICB HeadsUp Headlines Daily Email is sent by request. Subscriptions to Daily Email are free to qualified applicants. Visit http://www.icbtollfree.com/reg.cfm?NextURL=Index.cfm to sign up. Please feel free to pass along a copy to a friend, within reason so long as the message is not modified or used unfavorably. To unsubscribe mailto:editor@icbtollfree.com, subject: unsubscribe. (Unsubs are processed manually, approximately once a week.) ____________________________________________________ Only subscribers or registered users of ICB Toll Free News web site will be able to access all or some of the full text of URLs provided. ____________________________________________________ Copyright © 2000 ICB, Inc. All rights reserved. ____________________________________________________ ------------------------------ Date: 6 Jan 2001 00:41:07 -0500 From: Monty Solomon Subject: Coalition Makes Concession on Anti-Piracy Technology Coalition makes concession on anti-piracy technology Privacy advocates lead effort to let hard-drive owners turn off copy-prevention feature BY DAWN C. CHMIELEWSKI Mercury News After an outcry from privacy advocates, a group of leading computer hardware makers has agreed to give consumers the right to turn off a controversial new copy-protection feature on computer hard drives. http://www0.mercurycenter.com/svtech/news/front/docs/copy010501.htm - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 6 Jan 2001 00:41:41 -0500 From: "Michael D. Sullivan" Subject: Re: 1+ as a toll indicator (was: desirable numbers) "Ed Ellers" wrote in message news:9349ni$8nefv$1@ID-39509.news.dfncis.de... > Bob Goudreau wrote: > > "I believe that there are only about 8 states where it is possible to make > LD calls without dialing the "1" prefix: CA, IL, NY, NJ, PA, WV, NH and ME, > IIRC. Granted, all but the last three are quite populous, but they still > are no match for the vast toll-alerting majority of the country." > > Note that this doesn't necessarily apply to wireless carriers. Powertel > requires 10D dialing on all calls, and does not require a 1 even on long > distance calls (this applies whether you have a "free long distance" plan or > not). I suspect this is because they use GSM. Actually, most (all?) wireless carriers don't require the 1+ for long distance, because they (1) can tell whether you've finished dialing all the digits when you press the "send" button, so they don't need the "1" as a flag for figuring out whether to wait for more digits after the first seven; and (2) they aren't subject to the requirements imposed on Bell landline telcos about handing off long-distance traffic to interexchange carriers, so they are able to route the call all by themselves, based on the digits sent (which are unambiguous, if you have dialed either seven or ten digits before pressing "send"). - -- Michael D. Sullivan avogadro@bellatlantic.net Bethesda, MD, USA - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 6 Jan 2001 00:52:29 -0500 From: "Michael D. Sullivan" Subject: Re: 1+ as a toll indicator (was: desirable numbers) "Greg Monti" wrote in message news:4.3.2.7.1.20010101214119.00a9c820@pop.mindspring.com... > On 24 Dec 2000, johnl@iecc.com (John R Levine) wrote: > > >It appears that most of the US by land area use toll alerting, 1+ > >before all toll calls, for some definition of toll call, but the > >laces without toll alerting include New York, Chicago, Los Angeles, > >Philadelpia, and their metro areas so by population more people don't > >have toll alerting than do. > > A quick analysis of the US done a few years ago tallied that 25% of the > area codes have NO toll alerting, while 75% do. In population, however, > the non-toll-alerting states are some of the larger ones (New York, New > Jersey, Pennsylvania, Illinois, California, maybe 1 or 2 others), which > contain about 33% of the US population. Bear in mind, when talking about "1+" being "toll-alerting", that many (most?) wireless systems provide calling at the standard per-minute rate to many or all numbers in the U.S. part of the NANP (and sometimes the Canadian part) without any additional toll charge. And with a given carrier, whether a "long-distance" number incurs a toll charge on top of airtime may depend on the plan you sign up for. In some cases, it's toll-free anywhere in an expanded metro area, in your state, in a multistate region, or in the US/Canada. - -- Michael D. Sullivan avogadro@bellatlantic.net Bethesda, MD, USA - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 6 Jan 2001 01:59:36 -0500 From: Louis RAPHAEL Subject: Re: MAPS alters back-dated press release; withdraws Media3 accusations Wm. Randolph Franklin wrote: : As another example, if you sign a consent degree with, say, the : SEC, admitting to something, you are then prohibited in future : from saying anything to dispute what you've admitted to. I : actually find this sort of restriction quite scary. So do I, especially as: (a) Consent decree -type things seem to be gaining popularity, in general and, (b) I see it as a free speech issue, and I think that free speech belongs (or *should* belong) in the category if rights that can't be signed or negociated away. Louis - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ End of Telecom Digest V2000 #179 ******************************** Date: 7 Jan 2001 06:15:14 -0500 From: owner-telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org (Telecom Digest) To: telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org Subject: Telecom Digest V2000 #180 Telecom Digest Sunday, January 7 2001 Volume 2000 : Number 180 In this issue: Re: 1+ as a toll indicator (was: desirable numbers) Answering machines Teletool 2000 Teletool 2000 Re: AT&T Poor phone line quality Re: 1+ as a toll indicator (was: desirable numbers) Re: 1+ as a toll indicator (was: desirable numbers) Re: 1+ as a toll indicator (was: desirable numbers) Re: AT&T Poor phone line quality ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 6 Jan 2001 09:50:24 -0500 From: Wes Leatherock Subject: Re: 1+ as a toll indicator (was: desirable numbers) On 6 Jan 2001 00:41:41 -0500 Michael D. Sullivan wrote: > "Ed Ellers" wrote in message > news:9349ni$8nefv$1@ID-39509.news.dfncis.de... > > Bob Goudreau wrote: > > > > "I believe that there are only about 8 states where it is possible to make > > LD calls without dialing the "1" prefix: CA, IL, NY, NJ, PA, WV, NH and > ME, > > IIRC. Granted, all but the last three are quite populous, but they still > > are no match for the vast toll-alerting majority of the country." > > > > Note that this doesn't necessarily apply to wireless carriers. Powertel > > requires 10D dialing on all calls, and does not require a 1 even on long > > distance calls (this applies whether you have a "free long distance" plan > or > > not). I suspect this is because they use GSM. > > Actually, most (all?) wireless carriers don't require the 1+ for long > distance, because they (1) can tell whether you've finished dialing all the > digits when you press the "send" button, so they don't need the "1" as a > flag for figuring out whether to wait for more digits after the first seven; > and (2) they aren't subject to the requirements imposed on Bell landline > telcos about handing off long-distance traffic to interexchange carriers, so > they are able to route the call all by themselves, based on the digits sent > (which are unambiguous, if you have dialed either seven or ten digits before > pressing "send"). Southwestern Bell Wireless allows 10D dialing on all calls, even local calls that would go to intercept if dialed from a landline telephone. 7D dialing is also accepted for local calls. There are numerous kinds of plans which have a variety of no-toll-charge coverage areas. Wes Leatherock wleath@sandbox.dynip.com - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 6 Jan 2001 11:51:08 -0500 From: "Howard Kaikow" Subject: Answering machines Any pointers to a FAQ or recommendations for two-line answering machine? Also comparison 'tween digital and tape machines. - -- Please post your response to the newsgroup. http://www.standards.com/ipusers/standards; Word macros, including converting from WordBasic to VBA; Technical writing and reviewing; Standards - ------------------------------------------------ - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 6 Jan 2001 16:50:10 -0500 From: gripshift2@my-deja.com Subject: Teletool 2000 Has anyone had experience using this device? Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 6 Jan 2001 16:50:11 -0500 From: gripshift2@my-deja.com Subject: Teletool 2000 Has anyone had experience with "Teletool 2000"? Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 6 Jan 2001 20:33:11 -0500 From: Evan Radecki Subject: Re: AT&T Poor phone line quality Aw, c'mon. I could only get 26.4 at the demarcation point, with everything else disconnected. Stop complaining, you're lucky to get over 33.6! evan Carpenter wrote: > 4 months ago I moved into a new apartment with AT&T phone service. I have a > Toshiba laptop > with a Lucent V90 toshiba modem that I use to connect to my UUNET V90 > account. Once I connect I VPN into corporate. > > I have never seen anything better than 33K and most were sickly 12K and some > 14 and 19K connections. But yet when I dial out from another location I can > consistently connect at 52K. > > Called AT&T and after several visits I got a tech who gave me the latest > drivers. Once installed I could now at times connect at 49k but with no > throughput. My phone line blew out line cards and required AT&T to come out > and replace the line cards in the building. After escalation AT&T discovered > they needed upgraded phone cards which were installed in the building today. > Now I get consistent solid 49K connections and by that I mean 60% of the > time I connect at 49k and sometimes 45, 48 and 14K. Still nothing above > 50K! They say it's not the Phone line and that this is normal. Since I can > most always connect at 52k elsewhere I think this is crap. > > Am I crazy or is it possible their system is the culprit?? They claim to > have all fiber digital phone lines. Help! > -- > The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail > messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 6 Jan 2001 22:57:58 -0500 From: Linc Madison Subject: Re: 1+ as a toll indicator (was: desirable numbers) In article , Wes Leatherock wrote: > Southwestern Bell Wireless allows 10D dialing on all calls, even > local calls that would go to intercept if dialed from a landline > telephone. 7D dialing is also accepted for local calls. What happens if you have, for instance, a SWBW phone with a 214 number and you dial 7D when you're in Dallas? What if you have the same phone but you're in Fort Worth? Or, moving away from the overlay issue in D/FW, what if you have a phone with an 830 number from somewhere near San Antonio, but you're actually in Bexar County? Does it route you to (830) or (210)? Lastly, what if you've got a Dallas phone in San Antonio? How does it interpret 7D in that instance? Is 7D always interpreted as "same NPA as this cellphone"? - -- For faster reply, use Telecom # LincMad * Com, or something like that - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 7 Jan 2001 00:10:31 -0500 From: "Michael D. Sullivan" Subject: Re: 1+ as a toll indicator (was: desirable numbers) "Linc Madison" wrote in message news:060120011957229564%lincmad001@telecom-digest.zzn.com... > In article > , Wes > Leatherock wrote: > > > Southwestern Bell Wireless allows 10D dialing on all calls, even > > local calls that would go to intercept if dialed from a landline > > telephone. 7D dialing is also accepted for local calls. > > What happens if you have, for instance, a SWBW phone with a 214 number > and you dial 7D when you're in Dallas? What if you have the same phone > but you're in Fort Worth? > > Or, moving away from the overlay issue in D/FW, what if you have a > phone with an 830 number from somewhere near San Antonio, but you're > actually in Bexar County? Does it route you to (830) or (210)? > > Lastly, what if you've got a Dallas phone in San Antonio? How does it > interpret 7D in that instance? > > Is 7D always interpreted as "same NPA as this cellphone"? Typically, when using automatic roaming service, any 7-digit numbers are presumed to be associated with your phone's home area code. So, if my DC(202) phone calls 765-4321 while in New York or East Bejesus, TX, it will connect with the White House switchboard. It would be the better practice to program the area code with the number for all your presets, just to avoid differences of opinion if you should hit a system that does not observe this standard, however. - -- Michael D. Sullivan avogadro@bellatlantic.net Bethesda, MD, USA - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 7 Jan 2001 01:12:42 -0500 From: Stanley Cline Subject: Re: 1+ as a toll indicator (was: desirable numbers) On 7 Jan 2001 00:10:31 -0500, "Michael D. Sullivan" wrote: >Typically, when using automatic roaming service, any 7-digit numbers are >presumed to be associated with your phone's home area code. So, if my The vast majority of carriers require the dialing of at least 10 digits by roamers. - -SC - -- Stanley Cline -- sc1 at roamer1 dot org -- http://www.roamer1.org/ ... "Never put off until tomorrow what you can do today. There might be a law against it by that time." -/usr/games/fortune - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 7 Jan 2001 05:56:51 -0500 From: "Ed Ellers" Subject: Re: AT&T Poor phone line quality Evan Radecki wrote: "Aw, c'mon. I could only get 26.4 at the demarcation point, with everything else disconnected." Then you have a substandard line that is blocking the proper operation of V.90 modems -- most likely, by having multiple D/A conversions between your location and the switch. 45-48K is reasonable; 26.4 is a ripoff. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ End of Telecom Digest V2000 #180 ******************************** Date: 8 Jan 2001 06:15:15 -0500 From: owner-telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org (Telecom Digest) To: telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org Subject: Telecom Digest V2000 #181 Telecom Digest Monday, January 8 2001 Volume 2000 : Number 181 In this issue: Re: mobile phone dialing (was1+ as a toll indicator (was: desirable numbers)) PRI Circuit Problem Re: AT&T Poor phone line quality Re: mobile phone dialing (was1+ as a toll indicator (was: desirable numbers)) "standard", was: Re: AT&T Poor phone line quality Re: Finding Public Domain Music-On-Hold Re: "standard", was: Re: AT&T Poor phone line quality Re: AT&T Poor phone line quality Re: "standard", was: Re: AT&T Poor phone line quality Re: AT&T Poor phone line quality Re: "standard", was: Re: AT&T Poor phone line quality Re: AT&T Poor phone line quality Re: A town near Orlando w/o cable/DSL needs wireless access, Re: A town near Orlando w/o cable/DSL Re: 1+ as a toll indicator (was: desirable numbers) Re: mobile phone dialing (was1+ as a toll indicator (was: desirable numbers)) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 7 Jan 2001 08:00:29 -0500 From: Joseph Singer Subject: Re: mobile phone dialing (was1+ as a toll indicator (was: desirable numbers)) 7 Jan 2001 00:10:31 -0500 "Michael D. Sullivan" wrote: >"Linc Madison" wrote in message >news:060120011957229564%lincmad001@telecom-digest.zzn.com... >> In article >> , Wes >> Leatherock wrote: >> >> > Southwestern Bell Wireless allows 10D dialing on all calls, even >> > local calls that would go to intercept if dialed from a landline >> > telephone. 7D dialing is also accepted for local calls. >> >> What happens if you have, for instance, a SWBW phone with a 214 number >> and you dial 7D when you're in Dallas? What if you have the same phone >> but you're in Fort Worth? >> >> Or, moving away from the overlay issue in D/FW, what if you have a >> phone with an 830 number from somewhere near San Antonio, but you're >> actually in Bexar County? Does it route you to (830) or (210)? >> >> Lastly, what if you've got a Dallas phone in San Antonio? How does it >> interpret 7D in that instance? >> >> Is 7D always interpreted as "same NPA as this cellphone"? > >Typically, when using automatic roaming service, any 7-digit numbers are >presumed to be associated with your phone's home area code. So, if my >DC(202) phone calls 765-4321 while in New York or East Bejesus, TX, it will >connect with the White House switchboard. It would be the better practice >to program the area code with the number for all your presets, just to avoid >differences of opinion if you should hit a system that does not observe this >standard, however. If I am not roaming, but still in my "local" area which can encompass Washington, Oregon, Idaho or Utah my VoiceStream phone "assumes" that I'm in my local 206 area and will process 7 digits as if I was in area code 206. To reach a local number from my mobile I can dial 7D, 10D (area code + 7D), 11D (1+ area code + 7D) or + (character) + area code + 7D so that if I'm in a foreign country I can dial and don't have to know what the international access code is to dial a number. VoiceStream advised me that I can have all my entries in my address book with a + before the entry and it will work fine. My question is if I'm doing global roaming do I dial the local area codes e.g. in London, England would I dial (020) XXXX XXXX? Would I also dial 112 for local directory? Also to reach the local "customer care" (Vodafone, Cellnet etc.) by keying 611 from my foreign handset when roaming? - --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Joseph Singer Seattle, Washington USA [ICQ pgr] +1 206 405 2052 [voice mail] +1 206 493 0706 [FAX] - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 7 Jan 2001 12:13:12 -0500 From: "Veline Barton" Subject: PRI Circuit Problem We have a Toshiba DK424 and since December 7 have been experiencing a problem with our PRI card. Two or three times a day (normally around the same time) our PRI circuit locks up. Initially, we thought it might be a distant problem so we relocated the smart jack into the switch room. Needless to say, we have replaced the card and relocated card to different slot in cabinet. Verizon has tested circuit and according to them, there is no problem with the line. To clear the trouble, we power the system up and down. Thanks in advance for your help. Cheers, Dave Barton Telecommunication Manager The Mills Corporation 703-526-5363 703-526-5366 Fax - -- Dave Barton The Mills Corporation 703-526-5363 703-526-5366 Fax - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 7 Jan 2001 12:32:03 -0500 From: wdg@hal-pc.org Subject: Re: AT&T Poor phone line quality On 7 Jan 2001 05:56:51 -0500, in comp.dcom.telecom "Ed Ellers" wrote: >Evan Radecki wrote: >"Aw, c'mon. I could only get 26.4 at the demarcation point, with everything >else disconnected." >Then you have a substandard line that is blocking the proper operation of >V.90 modems -- most likely, by having multiple D/A conversions between your >location and the switch. 45-48K is reasonable; 26.4 is a ripoff. Well no, the line is not "substandard". Any voice grade telephone line that can sustain modem speeds of 14.4k bps or greater is a phone line that meets or exceeds voice grade design specifications. The telephone company is not the culprit here. The guilty party is the modem manufacturer for designing a modem that *requires* a higher quality telephone line than the telephone company is obligated to provide. See http://www.hal-pc.org/~wdg/56k.html for more details. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 7 Jan 2001 13:32:58 -0500 From: Wes Leatherock Subject: Re: mobile phone dialing (was1+ as a toll indicator (was: desirable numbers)) "Linc Madison" wrote in message news:060120011957229564%lincmad001@telecom-digest.zzn.com... > What happens if you have, for instance, a SWBW phone with a 214 number > and you dial 7D when you're in Dallas? What if you have the same phone > but you're in Fort Worth? > > Or, moving away from the overlay issue in D/FW, what if you have a > phone with an 830 number from somewhere near San Antonio, but you're > actually in Bexar County? Does it route you to (830) or (210)? I hope I've accurately attributed this to Linc Madison. All Dallas numbers require dialing 10D even from a landline telephone. There is no overlay involved; there are two area codes, and all local calls require the area code. The same thing is true in Houston. Don't know what the situation is in San Antonio and Bexar County (which includes San Antonio). Wes Leatherock wleath@sandbox.dynip.com - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 7 Jan 2001 13:39:27 -0500 From: dannyb@panix.com (danny burstein) Subject: "standard", was: Re: AT&T Poor phone line quality In <939i19$8vcma$1@ID-39509.news.dfncis.de> "Ed Ellers" writes: >Evan Radecki wrote: >"Aw, c'mon. I could only get 26.4 at the demarcation point, with everything >else disconnected." >Then you have a substandard line that is blocking the proper operation of >V.90 modems -- most likely, by having multiple D/A conversions between your >location and the switch. 45-48K is reasonable; 26.4 is a ripoff. Please cite any regulation, law, or tariff that a customer anywhere in the United States can use to demand that the telco improve a perfectly fine, for voice, phone line so as to provide these higher data speeds. - -- _____________________________________________________ Knowledge may be power, but communications is the key dannyb@panix.com [to foil spammers, my address has been double rot-13 encoded] - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 7 Jan 2001 15:01:17 -0500 From: Gary Novosielski Subject: Re: Finding Public Domain Music-On-Hold On 2 Jan 2001 at 05:03:12 (-0500) "Ed Ellers" wrote: >Why the sarcasm? If you're reasonably familiar with this field, you must >know that it's a very big no-no to connect anything to telephone company >lines other than FCC-registered (or grandfathered) equipment. If you can "hear" sarcasm in my e-mail, you have better ears than I (or are a better troller). In fact, I am "reasonably" familiar with the field, and I was presuming (perhaps incorrectly) that the copper in question would not *all* be Telco property, but that a sizeable fraction would be what is known as "station" or "inside" wiring. Further, I was assuming that a reasonable fraction of that would be "spare", i.e, connected to neither customer-provided nor Telco-owned equipment of any kind. In retrospect, though, I rather prefer the idea proposed by someone else that a receiver be sited outside the room in a good reception area, and the audio piped down to the phone room on a (presumably available) customer-owned spare pair. The wiring is designed to handle audio frequencies, and admittedly not to be an R.F. antenna, even though we all know it would probably work. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 7 Jan 2001 16:08:44 -0500 From: "Ed Ellers" Subject: Re: "standard", was: Re: AT&T Poor phone line quality Danny Burstein wrote: "Please cite any regulation, law, or tariff that a customer anywhere in the United States can use to demand that the telco improve a perfectly fine, for voice, phone line so as to provide these higher data speeds." How about false advertising -- when a telco-owned ISP advertises V.90 access, even though the telco's badly engineered equipment blocks it? - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 7 Jan 2001 16:12:54 -0500 From: "Ed Ellers" Subject: Re: AT&T Poor phone line quality wrote: "Well no, the line is not "substandard". Any voice grade telephone line that can sustain modem speeds of 14.4k bps or greater is a phone line that meets or exceeds voice grade design specifications." And, since Evan said he was getting 26.4, obviously the line does meet specs and then some. Then why won't V.90 work? Read on. "The telephone company is not the culprit here." Yes, they are. The telephone company chose to have three analog-to-digital conversions between the customer and the switch fabric -- one out in the customer's neighborhood, the second in the DLC terminal at the central office and the third on an analog line card in the switch. If they only had one D/A conversion -- either by having a normal copper pair from the switch to the customer, or by having a DLC system that has a true digital interface to the switch -- this problem would not exist. So, yes, Evan is being cheated by his telco's shoddy engineering -- as was the original poster, before AT&T fixed their line cards. It's hard to call V.90 modems overly demanding when, in fact, a lot of people are getting reasonable connect speeds with them. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 7 Jan 2001 16:30:05 -0500 From: me Subject: Re: "standard", was: Re: AT&T Poor phone line quality On 7 Jan 2001 16:08:44 -0500, "Ed Ellers" wrote: - ->Danny Burstein wrote: - -> - ->"Please cite any regulation, law, or tariff that a customer anywhere in the - ->United States can use to demand that the telco improve a perfectly fine, for - ->voice, phone line so as to provide these higher data speeds." - -> - ->How about false advertising -- when a telco-owned ISP advertises V.90 - ->access, even though the telco's badly engineered equipment blocks it? The only way you will get telco to guarantee any modem connection above 2400(3002 voice conditioning) Is to pay for a data grade line into your house. Granted most lines out there are far better than the original 3002 spec they still do not SUPPORT high speed data unless you pay for and get a data grade circuit to your house. Voice service means just that VOICE, no noise, hum, static etc. If you can hear impairments then you need to complain. There are several ITU specs that address this but none of them guarantee you will get V.90 speeds on your voice lines that I have read. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 7 Jan 2001 17:46:48 -0500 From: wdg@hal-pc.org Subject: Re: AT&T Poor phone line quality On 7 Jan 2001 16:12:54 -0500, in comp.dcom.telecom "Ed Ellers" wrote: > wrote: [snip] >>"Well no, the line is not "substandard". Any voice grade telephone line that >>can sustain modem speeds of 14.4k bps or greater is a phone line that meets >>or exceeds voice grade design specifications." >And, since Evan said he was getting 26.4, obviously the line does meet specs >and then some. Then why won't V.90 work? Read on. >>"The telephone company is not the culprit here." >Yes, they are. Sorry, I disagree. >The telephone company chose to have three analog-to-digital >conversions between the customer and the switch fabric -- one out in the >customer's neighborhood, the second in the DLC terminal at the central >office and the third on an analog line card in the switch. Sounds like a pretty typical situation to me. Whether the telco chose to have 3 or 103 analog to digital conversions is of little significance in this discussion. The telco was endeavoring to furnish their customer with a voice grade telephone line and from any and all perspectives, they succeeded in that endeavor. The telco was not attempting to furnish the customer a modem line, they furnished him a voice grade phone line that I'll just bet works perfectly for the purpose for which it was designed (voice telephony). The fact that your V.34 or V.90 modem cannot achieve speeds greater than 26,400 bps is not the telephone company's problem. Go read the tariffs then go read the modem manufacturer's documentation. Shucks, go read the fine print on the back of the box it came in. Plain and simple, the customer purchased the modem with no understanding of the fine print and with the assumption that he was going to enjoy a level of performance that the modem simply cannot achieve because 'the modem' is demanding phone line performance criteria that the phone company is not obligated to furnish, period. >If they only had >one D/A conversion -- either by having a normal copper pair from the switch >to the customer, or by having a DLC system that has a true digital interface >to the switch -- this problem would not exist. It *would* exist over any copper pair greater than 18,000 cable feet in length with standard H88 loading. >So, yes, Evan is being cheated by his telco's shoddy engineering -- Excuse me?? >as was >the original poster, before AT&T fixed their line cards. It's hard to call >V.90 modems overly demanding when, in fact, a lot of people are getting >reasonable connect speeds with them. Please define for us the term "a lot" and then step outside metropolitan city life and into suburban living and see if your definition still applies. I have a news bulletin for you, it doesn't. In this day and age few new suburbs have a full blown central office switch. More often than not they have remote terminals operating off analog line cards with a mux at each end and a total of 3 A-to-D conversions. Houston, Tx (where I live) is a good example. There's dozens of central offices inside the Beltway and probably a thousand or more SLC huts outside the Beltway. Most people who live inside the Beltway (most, not just a lot) are able to achieve some pretty respectable V.90 modem speeds. However, for those of us living outside the Beltway, even in the trendy upscale suburbs, V.90 is just a fantasy. But the customer is angry because he spent money on something that doesn't work and he's looking for someone to blame. He can't blame the modem maker because they had the foresight to put a disclaimer on the package and in the documentation. So now without reading the tariffs he comes gunning for the telco. Bzzzt! Wrong. If you want your V.90 modem to function at V.90 speeds you have, as I see it, one alternative and that is to move to a location within a couple miles of a C.O. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 7 Jan 2001 18:00:29 -0500 From: wdg@hal-pc.org Subject: Re: "standard", was: Re: AT&T Poor phone line quality On 7 Jan 2001 16:08:44 -0500, in comp.dcom.telecom "Ed Ellers" wrote: >Danny Burstein wrote: >"Please cite any regulation, law, or tariff that a customer anywhere in the >United States can use to demand that the telco improve a perfectly fine, for >voice, phone line so as to provide these higher data speeds." >How about false advertising -- when a telco-owned ISP advertises V.90 >access, even though the telco's badly engineered equipment blocks it? You better grab the spec books and read what V.90 is. V.90 *IS NOT* 56k, rather it is a modem speed protocol that includes modem speeds all the way down to 4800 bps. Yes, 56,000 is listed among the spec, but so is everything on down the line. Our ISP also offers "V.90 access" but we tell customers up front that we make it available but do not "support" it because of the limitations of what the telephone line can provide. It's the same reason we also have two separate banks of modems on two different phone numbers. You call one number if your phone line supports V.90 and you call another number if it doesn't. This eliminates a lot of problems and support headaches for us. If our customer can connect OK to the non-V90 number and has problems on the other number, then clearly the problem is not at the ISP. We make the service (v90) available, but we make no guarantees that they can achieve it. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 7 Jan 2001 18:32:30 -0500 From: Joel B Levin Subject: Re: AT&T Poor phone line quality In <939i19$8vcma$1@ID-39509.news.dfncis.de>, "Ed Ellers" wrote: }Evan Radecki wrote: }"Aw, c'mon. I could only get 26.4 at the demarcation point, with everything }else disconnected." } }Then you have a substandard line that is blocking the proper operation of }V.90 modems -- most likely, by having multiple D/A conversions between your }location and the switch. 45-48K is reasonable; 26.4 is a ripoff. I _know_ I have s "substandard" line. OK for voice (mostly), but at 13 or 25 miles from the switch (I'm not sure where it is) there's "pair gain"[*] equipment in the path and no way to get around it. :-( /JBL [*]When a line problem is not the copper between the vault and the house, USWorst, err, Qworst, calls in the "pair gain" techs to try to deal with it. The actual repeaters may actually be some other brand. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 7 Jan 2001 20:51:02 -0500 From: Marcus Falco Subject: Re: A town near Orlando w/o cable/DSL needs wireless access, > Telecom Digest Saturday, January 6 2001 Volume 2000 : > Number 179 > Date: 5 Jan 2001 11:53:25 -0500 > From: brian-usenet@enchanter.net (Brian Kendig) > Subject: Re: A town near Orlando w/o cable/DSL needs wireless > access, help! <> > As for broadband, many of us were lured here by the town's > committment to a "Technology" cornerstone, a much-touted "Front > Porch" town intranet with a free ISP, and promises that every house > was connected with fiber-optic. Turns out that the intranet is just > a bunch of modems, the town's web site is out-of-date, and the > fiber-optic from each house doesn't go any further than the curb. > D'oh! If you're curious, you can read some of the debate at > 'http://www.xone.net/disney/board/forumdisplay.cgi?action=topics&numb > er=4' (that board covers all sorts of Celebration discussion, and > broadband pops up there frequently). > Thank you all for your suggestions about how to get broadband access > here! It looks like satellite isn't the way to go because of its > latency issues and because we'd have to make sure the satellite > dishes aren't easily visible. Wireless radio-signal-based access Actually, it is not necessarily true that you would have to hide the satellite dishes. The FCC has been preempting a lot of local zoning that prevents people from using over-the-air services, and might well do so in this case if asked. > might be the way to go; what sorts of antennas would this require? Much bigger than satellite. The smallest I'm aware of is a kind of "pizza box" that AT&T was promoting about 5 years ago, but seems to have forgotten about lately. > How successful have previous attempts at this been? to respond to this Email, send mail to: chessler usa.net __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Photos - Share your holiday photos online! http://photos.yahoo.com/ - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 7 Jan 2001 20:56:21 -0500 From: Marcus Falco Subject: Re: A town near Orlando w/o cable/DSL > Telecom Digest Saturday, January 6 2001 Volume 2000 : > Number 179 > Date: 5 Jan 2001 11:53:25 -0500 > From: brian-usenet@enchanter.net (Brian Kendig) > Subject: Re: A town near Orlando w/o cable/DSL needs wireless > access, help! <> > As for broadband, many of us were lured here by the town's > committment to a "Technology" cornerstone, a much-touted "Front > Porch" town intranet with a free ISP, and promises that every house > was connected with fiber-optic. Turns out that the intranet is just > a bunch of modems, the town's web site is out-of-date, and the > fiber-optic from each house doesn't go any further than the curb. > D'oh! If you're curious, you can read some of the debate at > 'http://www.xone.net/disney/board/forumdisplay.cgi?action=topics&numb > er=4' (that board covers all sorts of Celebration discussion, and > broadband pops up there frequently). > Thank you all for your suggestions about how to get broadband access > here! It looks like satellite isn't the way to go because of its > latency issues and because we'd have to make sure the satellite > dishes aren't easily visible. Wireless radio-signal-based access Actually, it is not necessarily true that you would have to hide the satellite dishes. The FCC has been preempting a lot of local zoning that prevents people from using over-the-air services, and might well do so in this case if asked. > might be the way to go; what sorts of antennas would this require? Much bigger than satellite. The smallest I'm aware of is a kind of "pizza box" that AT&T was promoting about 5 years ago, but seems to have forgotten about lately. > How successful have previous attempts at this been? To respond to this Email, send to: chessler usa.net __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Photos - Share your holiday photos online! http://photos.yahoo.com/ - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 8 Jan 2001 05:38:51 -0500 From: Linc Madison Subject: Re: 1+ as a toll indicator (was: desirable numbers) In article <602g5tkqanrode9djhpcviaucmrmicjmqq@4ax.com>, Stanley Cline wrote: > On 7 Jan 2001 00:10:31 -0500, "Michael D. Sullivan" > wrote: > > >Typically, when using automatic roaming service, any 7-digit numbers are > >presumed to be associated with your phone's home area code. So, if my > > The vast majority of carriers require the dialing of at least 10 > digits by roamers. But what if you're not roaming, but yet are in a different area code from your cellphone's? For example, a Dallas customer in Fort Worth is not roaming, but is in a different area code. There are also many carriers with plans where a Dallas customer in San Antonio is not roaming. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 8 Jan 2001 05:47:54 -0500 From: Linc Madison Subject: Re: mobile phone dialing (was1+ as a toll indicator (was: desirable numbers)) In article , Wes Leatherock wrote: > "Linc Madison" wrote in message > news:060120011957229564%lincmad001@telecom-digest.zzn.com... > > What happens if you have, for instance, a SWBW phone with a 214 number > > and you dial 7D when you're in Dallas? What if you have the same phone > > but you're in Fort Worth? > > > > Or, moving away from the overlay issue in D/FW, what if you have a > > phone with an 830 number from somewhere near San Antonio, but you're > > actually in Bexar County? Does it route you to (830) or (210)? > > I hope I've accurately attributed this to Linc Madison. Yes, you did. > All Dallas numbers require dialing 10D even from a landline > telephone. There is no overlay involved; there are two area > codes, and all local calls require the area code. No, actually, there are THREE area codes involved, and it IS an overlay. There are several rate centers that have numbers in all three codes. > The same thing is true in Houston. Ditto. There are three area codes in Houston, and it is an overlay. > Don't know what the situation is in San Antonio and Bexar > County (which includes San Antonio). The 210 area code is approximately the same as Bexar County. It is surrounded on all sides by the 830 area code, which includes some of the outer suburbs. (Many maps incorrectly show the 210 area touching the 512 area and/or the 361 area, but it does not even come close.) The question, in the case of the overlay areas (Dallas, Houston, and now Fort Worth, and soon to be Austin) is what happens if you dial 7D from a wireless phone. Is it rejected? The answer may also depend on which wireless carrier you're using. The question, in the case of the non-overlay areas (San Antonio, still, at least for the moment) is what happens if your cellphone is from the suburbs but you're in the city, or vice-versa, and you dial just 7D. My impression is that most carriers will interpret that as a call within the home area code of the cellphone, even if you're well into the other code. The other question, though, is what happens if a San Antonio cellphone dials 7D while in Corpus Christi, for example. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ End of Telecom Digest V2000 #181 ******************************** Date: 8 Jan 2001 23:30:58 -0500 From: owner-telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org (Telecom Digest) To: telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org Subject: Telecom Digest V2000 #182 Telecom Digest Monday, January 8 2001 Volume 2000 : Number 182 In this issue: RE: Pri Circuit Problem Re: 1+ as a toll indicator (was: desirable numbers) Re: 1+ as a toll indicator (was: desirable numbers) le phone dialing Re: mobile phone dialing (was1+ as a toll indicator (was: desirab le numbers)) Telecom Update (Canada) #265, January 8, 2001 Re: A town near Orlando w/o cable/DSL needs wireless access, help! Re: 1+ as a toll indicator (was: desirable numbers) Re: mobile phone dialing Anti-Telemarketing Wish: a take me off your list button Re: Anti-Telemarketing Wish: a take me off your list button Re: 1+ as a toll indicator (was: desirable numbers) Re: Anti-Telemarketing Wish: a take me off your list button Re: Anti-Telemarketing Wish: a take me off your list button 1/8/01 ICBTollFreeNews.Com HEADS UP HEADLINES Fact Sheet on the PDD on CI-21 ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 8 Jan 2001 06:48:24 -0500 From: John Beckett Subject: RE: Pri Circuit Problem Veline Barton" wrote: > >We have a Toshiba DK424 and since December 7 have been experiencing a >problem with our PRI card. Two or three times a day (normally around the >same time) our PRI circuit locks up. Initially, we thought it might be a >distant problem so we relocated the smart jack into the switch room. >Needless to say, we have replaced the card and relocated card to different >slot in cabinet. > >Verizon has tested circuit and according to them, there is no problem with >the line. > >To clear the trouble, we power the system up and down. You could try powering it down, then up, or perhaps inverting the power switch.:-) Seriously, you might look at exactly is what happening at that time of day. Is there a lot of traffic? Do you know other users of PRI with that system? Is there anything special going on at the CO, like routine trunk testing? Is there possibly a compatibility issue with the CO equipment? This could be an old software version somewhere, or even a slow CPU that's losing control signals (doubtful on that one). Unless I know the people at the CO personally and they are willing to tell me things the boss doesn't want me to know, I never believe that "the circuit is OK." - -- John Beckett, Assistant Professor of Computing Southern Adventist University - Collegedale, Tennessee USA 37315 jbeckett@southern.edu http://www.southern.edu/~jbeckett (423) 238-2998 FAX (423) 238-2234 - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 8 Jan 2001 09:16:13 -0500 From: sjsobol@NorthShoreTechnologies.net (Steve Sobol) Subject: Re: 1+ as a toll indicator (was: desirable numbers) >From 'Linc Madison': >> >Typically, when using automatic roaming service, any 7-digit numbers are >> >presumed to be associated with your phone's home area code. So, if my >> >> The vast majority of carriers require the dialing of at least 10 >> digits by roamers. > >But what if you're not roaming, but yet are in a different area code >from your cellphone's? I can answer that. In my home area there are three area codes. If I dial my home number without an area code, the network prepends the area code of my cell phone to the phone number. So, for example, to dial 216 999-9999 from 216/330/440 all I have to dial is 999-9999, as long as I'm not roaming, because my phone's AC is 216 If I'm roaming, I dial 10D. Now, this only applies in my home area. If you're talking about a plan where you ARE roaming (not in your home area) and just not getting charged roaming charges, you still must dial 10D because you're not on your home network. - -- Steve Sobol, BOFH, President 888.480.4NET 866.DSL.EXPRESS 216.619.2NET North Shore Technologies Corporation http://NorthShoreTechnologies.net JustTheNet/JustTheNet EXPRESS DSL (ISP Services) http://JustThe.net mailto:sjsobol@NorthShoreTechnologies.net Proud resident of Cleveland, OH - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 8 Jan 2001 10:25:08 -0500 From: Georg Roessler Subject: Re: 1+ as a toll indicator (was: desirable numbers) Garrett Wollman wrote: > > There is an International Standard for this: > > +ccc ddddddddddd [...] > Never mind those countries where it is neither of those. In pre-EU > Finland, the inter-area prefix was `9', and was almost always written > with the area code in parentheses; i.e., `(90) 1911' for the main > switchboard operator at the University of Helsinki. With EU > harmonisation, both the dialing prefix and Helsinki's area code had to > change (since `00' is the international access code); that number is > now `(09) 1911', but internationally it is of course `+358 9 1911'. > (Can anyone identify a country which has at least one subscriber > number shorter than eight digits in E.164 form?) > There is a number in Switzerland having six digits in E.164 format: +41 1 187 The avalanche bulletin is available from this number. Enjoy, Georg - -- Dr.-Ing. Georg Rößler http://www.tenovis.com Mail: georg.roessler@tenovis.com TENOVIS, Frankfurt am Main Tel./Fax.: +49-69-7505-3813/-3314 * Nichts ist so praktisch wie eine gute Theorie. Heinz Zemanek * - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 8 Jan 2001 11:29:38 -0500 From: "Andy Ball" Subject: le phone dialing FamilyNet HQ: Telnet:\\www.family-bbs.net Hello Joseph! JS> ...in London, England would I dial (020) XXXX XXXX? > Would I also dial 112 for local directory? I /think/ 112 would get you through to emergency services. Regards, - Andy. * SLMR 2.1a * FamilyNet <> Internet Gated Mail http://www.fmlynet.org - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 8 Jan 2001 11:54:54 -0500 From: Michael Hartley Subject: Re: mobile phone dialing (was1+ as a toll indicator (was: desirab le numbers)) Here in the UK cellphone dialling is fairly straighforward- you dial the full number regardless or use the standard GSM +NN international format. This means that sitting at my desk I can dial my desk phone from my mobile by keying either +44 20 8*** **** or 020 8*** ****. I roam a fair bit, so I have most of my numbers stored in international +NN format- it doesn't effect my billing, but from the look of the thread this may not work in the US (as an outsider looking in I've always been surprised by the variation in services accross the US ;+)) >My question is if I'm doing global > roaming do I dial > the local area codes e.g. in London, England would I dial > (020) XXXX XXXX? > Would I also dial 112 for local directory? Also to reach the local > "customer care" (Vodafone, Cellnet etc.) by keying 611 from my foreign > handset when roaming? When roaming you dial the local number since for outgoing calls you're effectively 'just another subscriber' connected to the local PLMN. You will probably also have to dial a different number for customer services but if you're using a Borg ^H^H^H^H VodafoneAirtouch owned network they *may* have standarised their access numbers. Regards Mike NOTICE AND DISCLAIMER: This email (including attachments) is confidential. If you have received this email in error please notify the sender immediately and delete this email from your system without copying or disseminating it or placing any reliance upon its contents. We cannot accept liability for any breaches of confidence arising through use of email. Any opinions expressed in this email (including attachments) are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect our opinions. We will not accept responsibility for any commitments made by our employees outside the scope of our business. We do not warrant the accuracy or completeness of such information. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 8 Jan 2001 12:03:48 -0500 From: Angus TeleManagement Subject: Telecom Update (Canada) #265, January 8, 2001 ************************************************************ TELECOM UPDATE Angus TeleManagement's Weekly Telecom Newsbulletin http://www.angustel.ca Number 265: January 8, 2001 Publication of Telecom Update is made possible by generous financial support from: AT&T Canada ...................... http://www.attcanada.com/ Bell Canada ............................ http://www.bell.ca/ C1 Communications ......... http://www.c1communications.com/ Cisco Systems Canada ................. http://www.cisco.com/ Lucent Technologies Canada ........... http://www.lucent.ca/ Norigen ............................ http://www.norigen.com/ Sprint Canada .................. http://www.sprintcanada.ca/ ************************************************************ IN THIS ISSUE: ** Switch to 10-Digit Local Dialing Starts ** U.S. IP Carrier Enters Canada ** Cell-Loc Cuts Staff by One-Third ** CrossKeys Revenue Slump Leads to Staff Cuts ** Bell Appeals Denial of Rate Increase ** China Cuts Rates to Canada ** Telus Offers Flexible Wireless Web ** Hearing Begins on MTS Tax Recovery ** Mitel IP Phones to Get Palm Link ** Subscriber Gains at Rogers ** Telus Transfers CLEC Business to Separate Company ** Number Portability Expands in Alberta ** IMagic, Motorola Offer Video Streaming ** Manitoba Tel Expands PCS Coverage ** 360 Sells Capacity to GiantLoop ** Angus DSL Tutorial Now On-Line ** Got a Question? Ask 'Telemanagement' ============================================================ SWITCH TO 10-DIGIT LOCAL DIALING STARTS: Effective today, Toronto residents who dial seven digits for local calls will hear a recording reminding them to dial the Area Code next time. The new 647 Area Code, and mandatory 10-digit dialing, will be introduced on March 5. U.S. IP CARRIER ENTERS CANADA: Telecom Update has learned that Ikano Communications, a Utah-based IP network wholesaler, has purchased Canadian network facilities formerly owned by Ziplink, which ceased operations in November. Massachusetts-based Ziplink acquired about 100 points of presence in Canada last January by purchasing Interhop Network Services. CELL-LOC CUTS STAFF BY ONE-THIRD: Calgary-based Cell-Loc, a developer of wireless location and tracking technology, has eliminated 47 staff positions, one-third of its total. Cell- Loc operates networks in Calgary and Austin, Texas, but has no commercial customers. CROSSKEYS REVENUE SLUMP LEADS TO STAFF CUTS: CrossKeys Systems, an Ottawa-based developer of networking software, has laid off about 75 employees, a quarter of its workforce. CrossKeys' revenue for the three months ended December 3 dropped 66% from the previous quarter to $4.5 Million. BELL APPEALS DENIAL OF RATE INCREASE: Before Christmas, the CRTC turned down Bell Canada's application to increase rates for a set of optional local services. Bell says that these are "uncapped" services under the price cap regime, and that nearly identical increases were approved for Telus in October. Bell wants the CRTC to reverse itself, and allow the increases effective February 1. http://www.crtc.gc.ca/PartVII/Eng/8662/B2-05.htm CHINA CUTS RATES TO CANADA: On January 1, the Chinese government slashed charges for telecommunications and Internet services by up to 50%. China Netcom immediately reduced its rate for IP-based phone calls to Canada and the U.S. from US$0.58 to $0.29 a minute. TELUS OFFERS FLEXIBLE WIRELESS WEB: Users of Telus Mobility's i-Web wireless Internet service can now personalize the i-Web home page menu. HEARING BEGINS ON MTS TAX RECOVERY: The public hearing on Manitoba Telecom's request for a rate hike to recover tax expenses will take place in Winnipeg on January 10 and 11. (See Telecom Update #249) MITEL IP PHONES TO GET PALM LINK: Mitel says users of its IP phones will soon be able to dial calls from the address books in their Palm computers, using an infrared link. SUBSCRIBER GAINS AT ROGERS: Rogers Wireless gained a net 146,600 subscribers in the fourth quarter, compared to 144,000 last year. Prepaid subscribers made up two-thirds of the gain. Monthly disconnects among postpaid subscribers increased to 2.76% from 2.37% last year. Rogers@Home ended the year with 312,000 customers. TELUS TRANSFERS CLEC BUSINESS TO SEPARATE COMPANY: Until the amalgamation of Telus's operating subsidiaries last week (see Telecom Update #264), its competitive local service business outside of BC and Alberta was a division of Telus Mobility Cellular Inc. Telus has now set up a separate company, Telus Integrated Communications (2000) Inc, to own Telus's CLEC business until its regulatory status is clarified. NUMBER PORTABILITY EXPANDS IN ALBERTA: Local Number Portability will be introduced in the Alberta cities of Lethbridge, Medicine Hat, Fort McMurray, and Grande Prairie during March and April. http://www.crtc.gc.ca/ENG/public/8180-8.htm IMAGIC, MOTOROLA OFFER VIDEO STREAMING: Motorola and Saint John, NB-based iMagic TV have completed the integration of iMagic's video streaming software with Motorola Streamaster set-top box. Aliant, a part-owner of iMagic, says it will use Streamaster to deliver TV over DSL lines. (See Telecom Update #221, 256) MANITOBA TEL EXPANDS PCS COVERAGE: MTS plans to spend $50 Million to extend its digital wireless network across southern and central Manitoba, with the goal of matching or exceeding the coverage of its analog cellular network. 360 SELLS CAPACITY TO GIANTLOOP: GiantLoop Network Inc, a Massachusetts-based supplier of networking to global corporations, has chosen 360networks to provide North American and transatlantic fibre capacity. ANGUS DSL TUTORIAL NOW ON-LINE: Ian Angus explains almost everything you need to know about the different flavors of DSL in "Driving High-Speed Data Through Phone Lines," first published in Telemanagement #177 and now available in the Articles on Line section of the Angus Web site. http://www.angustel.ca GOT A QUESTION? ASK 'TELEMANAGEMENT': The "Just Asking" column in the January issue of Telemanagement answers readers' questions on corporate cellphone policy, 809 e-mails, traffic software, call centre lists, and more. ** Subscribers can send questions to editors@angustel.ca. To subscribe, call 1-800-263-4415, ext 500 or visit the Telemanagement home page at http://www.angustel.ca. ============================================================ HOW TO SUBMIT ITEMS FOR TELECOM UPDATE E-MAIL: editors@angustel.ca FAX: 905-686-2655 MAIL: TELECOM UPDATE Angus TeleManagement Group 8 Old Kingston Road Ajax, Ontario Canada L1T 2Z7 =========================================================== HOW TO SUBSCRIBE (OR UNSUBSCRIBE) TELECOM UPDATE is provided in electronic form only. There are two formats available: 1. The fully-formatted edition is posted on the World Wide Web on the first business day of the week at http://www.angustel.ca 2. The e-mail edition is distributed free of charge. To subscribe, send an e-mail message to: listmanager@subs.postmastergeneral.com Insert as the subject of your message the two words: subscribe TelecomUpdate To stop receiving the e-mail edition, send an e-mail message to: listmanager@subs.postmastergeneral.com Insert as the subject of your message the two words: unsubscribe TelecomUpdate =========================================================== COPYRIGHT AND DISCLAIMER: All contents copyright 2001 Angus TeleManagement Group Inc. All rights reserved. For further information, including permission to reprint or reproduce, please e-mail rosita@angustel.ca or phone 905-686-5050 ext 500. The information and data included has been obtained from sources which we believe to be reliable, but Angus TeleManagement makes no warranties or representations whatsoever regarding accuracy, completeness, or adequacy. Opinions expressed are based on interpretation of available information, and are subject to change. If expert advice on the subject matter is required, the services of a competent professional should be obtained. ============================================================ JOHN RIDDELL jriddell@angustel.ca Angus TeleManagement Group http://www.angustel.ca 8 Old Kingston Road Tel: 905-686-5050 x226 Ajax Ontario L1T 2Z7 Canada Fax: 905-686-2655 - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 8 Jan 2001 12:54:54 -0500 From: Brad Ackerman Subject: Re: A town near Orlando w/o cable/DSL needs wireless access, help! In article <93498d$92q0q$1@ID-39509.news.dfncis.de>, "Ed Ellers" wrote: > AFAIK Celebration is in the same district, which was granted special > legsl powers by the Florida legislature in the mid-1960s. > Vista-United was sold to Smart City Networks a few months ago. According to Hiaasen[1], Celebration was deannexed from the Reedy Creek Improvement District before the first move-in. [1] Hiaasen, C. _Team Rodent: How Disney Devours the World_. New York: Ballantine Pub. Group, 1998. - -- Brad Ackerman N1MNB "[John Howard] hasn't emerged from the 1950s, bsa3@cornell.edu and he seems rather resentful of anyone who has." http://skaro.pair.com/ -- Bill Leek, _Australia: Beyond the Fatal Shore_ - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 8 Jan 2001 13:17:48 -0500 From: johnl@iecc.com (John R. Levine) Subject: Re: 1+ as a toll indicator (was: desirable numbers) >But what if you're not roaming, but yet are in a different area code >from your cellphone's? How the heck would you be supposed to know what area code you're in? It depends on what tower your phone happens to contact, which is pretty much unpredictable. If you're on your home system, you dial with your home system's rules regardless of where in your home system you happen to be. My phone has a 607 area code, but my home system includes all of 315. No matter how far into 315 I happen to travel (which can be quite a way, several hundred miles), 7D calls go to 607. Conversely, if a customer with a 315 number happens to be here in Trumansburg, 7D calls go to 315. Anything else would be unworkable -- near an area code boundary 7D calls would be completed at random. - -- John R. Levine, IECC, POB 727, Trumansburg NY 14886 +1 607 387 6869 johnl@iecc.com, Village Trustee and Sewer Commissioner, http://iecc.com/johnl, Member, Provisional board, Coalition Against Unsolicited Commercial E-mail - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 8 Jan 2001 18:24:53 -0500 From: "Adam H. Kerman" Subject: Re: mobile phone dialing Michael Hartley wrote: >Here in the UK cellphone dialling is fairly straighforward- you dial the >full number regardless or use the standard GSM +NN international format. But isn't this because there's a service code just for cell phones? Must you dial the service code to call another cell phone? >This means that sitting at my desk I can dial my desk phone from my mobile >by keying either +44 20 8*** **** or 020 8*** ****. I roam a fair bit, so I >have most of my numbers stored in international +NN format- it doesn't >effect my billing, but from the look of the thread this may not work in the >US (as an outsider looking in I've always been surprised by the variation in >services accross the US ;+)) Replace the + with 011 when roaming within the US. >NOTICE AND DISCLAIMER: >This email (including attachments) is confidential. . . . Given that you posted to a mailing list that's gated to a newsgroup, including that disclaimed is silly. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 8 Jan 2001 18:37:11 -0500 From: "Gail M. Hall" Subject: Anti-Telemarketing Wish: a take me off your list button Here's my "old-grouchy" wish for 2001. We get so many of those idiotic recorded message telemarketing calls that I wish there was such a thing on my phone as an automatic "take this number off your list" button. Just about the worst offenders are telephone companies. Ideally, there should be some kind of standard that requires all their equipment to recognize an already existing button to act as a "take me off your list" button, say the * or # buttons. This should be publicised and included in phone books so we don't have to listen to an entire message to hear that information from marketers. Now that the cost of bulk-rate USPS service has gone up, I'm sure we will see even more use of telemarketing as an alternative. I resent having the phone company tell me that for only a little extra money each month I can get caller ID when caller ID doesn't really work consistently to identify telemarketers anyway. We should be able to get "don't bother me" service for FREE. - -- Gail from Ohio - -- - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 8 Jan 2001 18:44:09 -0500 From: johnl@iecc.com (John R. Levine) Subject: Re: Anti-Telemarketing Wish: a take me off your list button >We get so many of those idiotic recorded message telemarketing calls that I >wish there was such a thing on my phone as an automatic "take this number >off your list" button. Just about the worst offenders are telephone >companies. Recorded junk calls are completely illegal, and have been for a decade. If you can figure out who the caller was, you can sue them for $500 per call ($1500 if they knew it was illegal) in small claims court. It's the same law that makes junk faxes illegal. See www.tcpalaw.com. - -- John R. Levine, IECC, POB 727, Trumansburg NY 14886 +1 607 387 6869 johnl@iecc.com, Village Trustee and Sewer Commissioner, http://iecc.com/johnl, Member, Provisional board, Coalition Against Unsolicited Commercial E-mail - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 8 Jan 2001 21:17:14 -0500 From: merlyn@stonehenge.com (Randal L. Schwartz) Subject: Re: 1+ as a toll indicator (was: desirable numbers) >>>>> "Roy" == Roy writes: Roy> The following URL provides some information into dialing characteristics by Roy> area code Roy> http://www.nanpa.com/dialing/index.html I love the exceptions for "Oregon" and "Florida" there. Yeah, Oregon, where we can't quite be like anything else. :) - -- Randal L. Schwartz - Stonehenge Consulting Services, Inc. - +1 503 777 0095 Perl/Unix/security consulting, Technical writing, Comedy, etc. etc. See PerlTraining.Stonehenge.com for onsite and open-enrollment Perl training! - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 8 Jan 2001 21:26:07 -0500 From: Terry Kennedy Subject: Re: Anti-Telemarketing Wish: a take me off your list button Gail M. Hall writes: > We get so many of those idiotic recorded message telemarketing calls that I > wish there was such a thing on my phone as an automatic "take this number > off your list" button. Just about the worst offenders are telephone > companies. It exists as an add-on from Sandman: http://www.sandman.com/tmstop.html (scroll down to "Put an End to those Annoying Calls... For Good!!! Hang Up on them AUTOMATICALLY!"). Terry Kennedy http://www.tmk.com terry@tmk.com Jersey City, NJ USA - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 8 Jan 2001 22:17:03 -0500 From: Dave Garland Subject: Re: Anti-Telemarketing Wish: a take me off your list button It was a dark and stormy night when "Gail M. Hall" wrote: > I wish there was such a thing on my phone as an automatic "take this number >off your list" button. If you don't mind purchasing an outboard button, it does exist. Mike Sandman (630-980-7710) sells it for $13 (item #WAL4S), and I'm pretty sure I've seen it (or a similar gadget) advertised other places too. It recites a programmed "remove me from your list" message and then hangs up. If you want to catch the predictive dialers (where you get that second of silence before either a hangup or a telemarketer) Sandman also has a gadget that plays SIT tones (the boop-bop-beep "this line is not in service" tones) when you pick up the phone, hopefully making the robot on the other end flag your number as bad. So far, nothing that will send a high-voltage surge back to their telephone, causing it to explode in their hand, but maybe next year. (Disclaimer: I don't have any connection other than as a very small customer, they probably spend more mailing me catalogs than I buy, but they've been prompt and honest in dealings with me. They're also a vendor that has supported the operation of Telecom Digest.) - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Jan 2001 22:32:00 -0500 From: "Judith Oppenheimer" Subject: 1/8/01 ICBTollFreeNews.Com HEADS UP HEADLINES ____________________________________________________ ICBTollFreeNews.Com HEADS UP HEADLINES ____________________________________________________ from ICB Toll Free News - Daily News and Intelligence covering the Political, Legal and Marketing Arenas of 800 and Dot Com. ____________________________________________________ CONTENTS - - FCC NO-TRANSFER ORDER MERITS DEBATED BY SNAC - - SQUATTERS CLING TO ICANN BOARD - - ORANGE.COM IS FRUITFUL FOR SELLER - - WHOIS BATTLE DRIVES ICANN ENFORCEMENT CHALLENGE ___________________________________________________ ___________________________________________________ ICB is ... 'An important source of inside information,' says InfoWorld; 'superb', 'invaluable', 'critically intelligent', 'exceedingly useful', report ICB Premium Subscribers. 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CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4963 F - SQUATTERS CLING TO ICANN BOARD Interim board members - four members who were chosen by ICANN's founders to serve on the body's "interim" board in 1998 - may be "guaranteed another two years" while one of three ICANN directors elected in 1999 to represent the Address Supporting Organization must step down in October of this year when his term expires, and other elected directors' terms will expire in 2002. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4962 F - ORANGE.COM IS FRUITFUL FOR SELLER Experts say the name could have been worth as much as $5 million, but a spokesman for the mobile company said it had paid ``significantly less.'' CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4961 F - WHOIS BATTLE DRIVES ICANN ENFORCEMENT CHALLENGE A. Michael Froomkin, a law professor at the University of Miami, said that if Register.com did violate its accreditation agreement and ICANN does nothing, "is there any incentive for anyone to follow the rules? It's a real test [for] ICANN." 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All rights reserved. ____________________________________________________ ------------------------------ Date: 8 Jan 2001 23:30:56 -0500 From: Monty Solomon Subject: Fact Sheet on the PDD on CI-21 http://www.pub.whitehouse.gov/uri-res/I2R?urn:pdi://oma.eop.gov.us/2001/1/8/8.text.1 THE WHITE HOUSE Office of the Press Secretary ________________________________________________________________________ For Immediate Release January 5, 2001 FACT SHEET The Presidential Decision Directive on CI-21: Counterintelligence for the 21st Century President Clinton signed a Presidential Decision Directive (PDD) entitled "U.S. Counterintelligence Effectiveness -- Counterintelligence for the 21st Century." The PDD outlines specific steps that will enable the U.S. counterintelligence (CI) community to better fulfill its mission of identifying, understanding, prioritizing and counteracting the intelligence threats faced by the United States. The system will be predictive, proactive and will provide integrated oversight of counterintelligence issues across the national security agencies. Specifically, the PDD directs the following structure be established to continue the task of improving U.S. counterintelligence effectiveness: Counterintelligence Board of Directors - -- A National Counterintelligence Board of Directors, chaired by the Director, FBI and composed of the Deputy Secretary of Defense, Deputy Director of Central Intelligence and a senior representative of the Department of Justice is hereby established. - -- The Board, chaired by the Director of the FBI, will operate by consensus, and will select, oversee and evaluate the National Counterintelligence Executive (CI Executive) and will promulgate the mission, role and responsibilities of the CI Executive. - -- The Board will approve the National Counterintelligence Strategy drawn from the annual National Threat Identification and Prioritization Assessment, ensuring the integration of government and private sector interests. - -- The Board working with Congress, OMB, and other Executive Branch agencies will ensure the CI Executive has adequate resources to carry out his/her responsibilities and duties. NSC Deputies Committee - -- The NSC Deputies Committee, to include the Director of the FBI, will review the annual National Threat Identification and Prioritization Assessment and will meet at least semiannually, to review progress in implementing the National Counterintelligence Strategy. - -- The Deputies Committee will ensure that the strategy, priorities and activities of the CI Community are grounded in national policy goals and objectives; the Deputies Committee shall also ensure that CI analysis and information is provided to assist national policy deliberations as appropriate. The Board of Directors through the CI Executive will be responsible for ensuring the implementation of these decisions. The National Counterintelligence Executive - -- The position of CI Executive is established and empowered to execute certain responsibilities on behalf of the Board of Directors and will serve as the substantive leader of national-level counterintelligence. The CI Executive will be a federal employee, selected by the Board of Directors with the concurrence of the Attorney General, DCI and the Secretary of Defense. - -- The CI Executive will report to the FBI Director, as Chairman of the Board of Directors, but will be responsible to the Board of Directors as a whole. The Board will, through the Chairman, oversee and evaluate the CI Executive. - -- The CI Executive and the National Coordinator for Security, Infrastructure Protection and Counterterrorism will work together to insure that both of their programs are well coordinated with each other. - -- The CI Executive, in carrying out the duties and responsibilities of the position, will advise members of the Board on counterintelligence programs and policies. The National Counterintelligence Policy Board - -- The CI Executive will chair the National Counterintelligence Policy Board. Senior counterintelligence officials from State, Defense, Justice, Energy, JCS, CIA, FBI and NSC Staff, at a minimum will serve on the Policy Board. The NSC Deputies Committee will approve the composition, functions and duties of the Policy Board which will be consistent with the statutorily defined functions of the Policy Board. The Policy Board will establish, with the approval of the Board of Directors, other interagency boards and working groups as necessary. - -- The Policy Board, under the chairmanship of the CI Executive, will serve as an Interagency Working Group to prepare issues relating to the full implementation of this PDD for Deputies discussions and review, as well as a forum to provide advice to the CI Executive on priorities with respect to the National Counterintelligence Strategy. Office of the CI Executive - -- The CI Executive, on behalf of the Board of Directors, will head the Office of the National Counterintelligence Executive, which will among its other functions assume the functions previously exercised by the NACIC. To the extent permitted by law, resources previously assigned to the NACIC will become the initial resource base for the Office of the CI Executive. The Office will develop and deploy the following capabilities: National CI Strategic Planning - -- The Office, in consultation with United States government agencies and the private sector, will produce an annual report entitled The National Threat Identification and Prioritization Assessment for review by the Deputies Committee. - -- The Office, drawing on this Assessment and working with the policy community, appropriate Government counterintelligence organizations and the private sector, will formulate and, subject to the approval of the Board of Directors, publish the National Counterintelligence Strategy. National CI Strategic Analysis - -- The Office will oversee and coordinate the production of strategic national CI analysis and will be supported in this endeavor by all components of the Executive Branch. - -- The Office will oversee and coordinate the production of CI damage assessments and "lessons learned" papers with full support from Executive Branch components. National CI Program Budget and Evaluation - -- The Office, working with the DCI's Community Management Staff, will review, evaluate, and coordinate the integration of CI budget and resource plans of, initially, the DOD, CIA and FBI. It will report to the Board of Directors and the Deputies Committee on how those plans meet the objectives and priorities of the National CI Strategy. - -- The Office will evaluate the implementation of the National CI Strategy by the CI community agencies and report to the Board of Directors and Deputies Committee. The Office will also identify shortfalls, gaps and weaknesses in agency programs and recommend remedies. National CI Collection and Targeting Coordination - -- The Office will develop for approval by the Board of Directors strategic CI investigative, operational and collection objectives and priorities that implement the National CI Strategy. - -- The Office will not have an operational role in CI operations and investigations and no independent contacts or activities with foreign intelligence services. National CI Outreach, Watch and Warning Capability - -- The Office will conduct and coordinate CI vulnerability surveys throughout government, and with the private sector as appropriate, while working with the Security Policy community. It will engage government and private sector entities to identify more clearly and completely what must be protected. - -- The Office will conduct and coordinate CI community outreach programs in the government and private sector. It will serve as the national coordination mechanism for issuing warnings of counterintelligence threats to the national security. - -- The Office will work with various government and private sector R&D centers to explore technology needs and solutions for the CI community. The Office will ensure that emerging technology and products and services are used effectively. In addition, the Office will develop policies for CI training and professional development for CI investigators, operators, and analysts. It will also develop and manage joint training exercises, and assess the need for a National CI Training Academy. Also, the CI Executive and the Office will have a Principal Legal Advisor who will ensure that all activities of the Executive and the office comport with the law, Executive Orders and Attorney General Guidelines. The Principal Legal Advisor will provide advice and counsel to the Executive and the Office regarding national security law issues. The Advisor will coordinate with the appropriate law enforcement, intelligence and defense agencies' General Counsels and Legal Advisors in providing legal advice, guidance and representation to the Executive and the Office. # # # - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ End of Telecom Digest V2000 #182 ******************************** Date: 9 Jan 2001 06:15:13 -0500 From: owner-telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org (Telecom Digest) To: telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org Subject: Telecom Digest V2000 #183 Telecom Digest Tuesday, January 9 2001 Volume 2000 : Number 183 In this issue: Re: Anti-Telemarketing Wish: a take me off your list button Re: 1+ as a toll indicator Re: Anti-Telemarketing Wish: a take me off your list button Re: Anti-Telemarketing Wish: a take me off your list button Technicain Wanted Re: mobile phone dialing ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 9 Jan 2001 00:08:33 -0500 From: John David Galt Subject: Re: Anti-Telemarketing Wish: a take me off your list button "Gail M. Hall" wrote: > Here's my "old-grouchy" wish for 2001. > > We get so many of those idiotic recorded message telemarketing calls that I > wish there was such a thing on my phone as an automatic "take this number > off your list" button. Just about the worst offenders are telephone > companies. > > Ideally, there should be some kind of standard that requires all their > equipment to recognize an already existing button to act as a "take me off > your list" button, say the * or # buttons. This should be publicised and > included in phone books so we don't have to listen to an entire message to > hear that information from marketers. Ideally, all telemarketing should be limited by law to "opt-in" lists, and no business should be able to demand that you accept their marketing calls as a condition of doing business with them. Telemarketing, like spam, is nothing but a public nuisance. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 9 Jan 2001 01:49:59 -0500 From: "Adam H. Kerman" Subject: Re: 1+ as a toll indicator Roy wrote: >The following URL provides some information into dialing characteristics by >area code > http://www.nanpa.com/dialing/index.html Feh. 100% inaccurate WRT the Chicago area, even saying there is 10D HNPA dialing in 847! - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 9 Jan 2001 01:52:39 -0500 From: "Adam H. Kerman" Subject: Re: Anti-Telemarketing Wish: a take me off your list button John David Galt wrote: >Ideally, all telemarketing should be limited by law to "opt-in" lists, and >no business should be able to demand that you accept their marketing calls >as a condition of doing business with them. >Telemarketing, like spam, is nothing but a public nuisance. Ah. Businesses should have no speech rights whatsoever. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 9 Jan 2001 03:30:25 -0500 From: Linc Madison Subject: Re: Anti-Telemarketing Wish: a take me off your list button In article , Adam H. Kerman wrote: > John David Galt wrote: > > >Ideally, all telemarketing should be limited by law to "opt-in" > >lists, and no business should be able to demand that you accept > >their marketing calls as a condition of doing business with them. > > >Telemarketing, like spam, is nothing but a public nuisance. > > Ah. Businesses should have no speech rights whatsoever. Now *THERE'S* an insightful comment, Adam. There is NOTHING in the constitution or in any law that gives ANYONE ELSE the right to free speech on MY TELEPHONE. There is absolutely ZERO constitutional impediment to outlawing cold calling for telemarketing. The ONLY impediment is the telemarketers' lobbyists. Marketers can have their free speech on any medium to which they have legal access; I'm simply saying that my telephone is not one of such. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 9 Jan 2001 04:00:07 -0500 From: usts@uststelecom.com (Mari) Subject: Technicain Wanted Experienced Only! Key, PBX and Voice Mail. Excellent PR skills required. Potential management / working partner position with a growing interconnect company in South Florida. Respond via Email to usts@uststelecom.com Attn: MC - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 9 Jan 2001 04:45:33 -0500 From: Michael Hartley Subject: Re: mobile phone dialing Adam H. Kerman wrote > Michael Hartley wrote: > > >Here in the UK cellphone dialling is fairly straighforward- > you dial the > >full number regardless or use the standard GSM +NN > international format. > > But isn't this because there's a service code just for cell > phones? Yes. Cellphones have their own dialling codes which are in the same format as any other UK phone number, but in a different range to PSTN numbers. From later this year all mobile numbers will begin with 07 while PSTN numbers begin with 01 or 02- in the UK the calling party pays by default, so number differentiation does help the calling party to determine the cost of the call dependant on the number they're dialling. >Must you dial the service code to call another cell phone? You dial a cellphone in the same way as you dial any other phone, except that you have to dial the full number even if the cellphone is next to you since they're not locally diallable. eg I can dial 8*** **** locally to reach my desk phone, but I have to dial 079** ****** > >NOTICE AND DISCLAIMER: > >This email (including attachments) is confidential. . . . > > Given that you posted to a mailing list that's gated to a > newsgroup, including > that disclaimed is silly. Given that I'm not sysadmin I have no way of disabling disclaimers added to my outgoing mail by default. Regards Mike NOTICE AND DISCLAIMER: This email (including attachments) is confidential. If you have received this email in error please notify the sender immediately and delete this email from your system without copying or disseminating it or placing any reliance upon its contents. We cannot accept liability for any breaches of confidence arising through use of email. Any opinions expressed in this email (including attachments) are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect our opinions. We will not accept responsibility for any commitments made by our employees outside the scope of our business. We do not warrant the accuracy or completeness of such information. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ End of Telecom Digest V2000 #183 ******************************** Date: 10 Jan 2001 06:15:13 -0500 From: owner-telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org (Telecom Digest) To: telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org Subject: Telecom Digest V2000 #184 Telecom Digest Wednesday, January 10 2001 Volume 2000 : Number 184 In this issue: New Cell Antenna Re: mobile phone dialing Re: 1+ as a toll indicator (was: desirable numbers) Re: Telecom Digest V2000 #182 Re: mobile phone dialing Making all telemarketing illegal (was: Anti-Telemarketing Wish: a take me off your list button) Re: Making all telemarketing illegal (was: Anti-Telemarketing Wish: a take me off your list button) Re: le phone dialing Re: Making all telemarketing illegal (was: Anti-Telemarketing Wish: a take me off your list button) Re: mobile phone dialing 2-way radio circuit diagrams Re: Making all telemarketing illegal (was: Anti-Telemarketing Wish: a take me off your list button) 1/9/01 ICBTollFreeNews.Com HEADS UP HEADLINES ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 9 Jan 2001 08:08:19 -0500 From: davidesan@my-deja.com Subject: New Cell Antenna A British researcher has created a new antenna that he claims will reduce radiation emissions 97%, and double battery life. Read about it at: www.foxnews.com/scitech/010901/antenna.sml - -- David Esan InformationView Solutions david.esan@informationview.com Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 9 Jan 2001 09:22:27 -0500 From: "John R. Covert Spam Sink" Subject: Re: mobile phone dialing "Adam H. Kerman" wrote: >Replace the + with 011 when roaming within the US. Certainly NOT! In my GSM phone I have all of my numbers stored as +nn... including U.S. numbers (+1 npa...) and I have almost never had a problem. Unlike AMPS/DAMPS, where the mobile carriers tend to do whatever they please, GSM providers are _required_ to support the +... format for all calls, including domestic calls. If +1 NPA... or +CC... doesn't work in a GSM system, it must be fixed. GSM users are supposed to be able to store numbers in their SIM cards and have those numbers work at home or when roaming anywhere in the world. Only the full number with the + format provides this capability. /john - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 9 Jan 2001 09:22:27 -0500 From: "John R. Covert Spam Sink" Subject: Re: 1+ as a toll indicator (was: desirable numbers) Garrett A. Wollman asks: >(Can anyone identify a country which has at least one subscriber >number shorter than eight digits in E.164 form?) I thought I could. The Falkland Islands used to be +500 +4D, but now have five digit numbers. Also, for a while, Guantanamo Bay was dialled from the U.S. using the Cuban country code, +53 +4D as though the extensions on the base were the only numbers in Cuba. But at least one correct answer is Niue, where the Department of Tourism is +683 4200. E.164 actually recommends writing the number in the following form: National 311 KLondike 5-2368 Telephone ------------------------------- International +1 311 555 2368 But in common usage, it seems the horrible preferred format is +44(0)207 470-2211 even though it violates E.164 in at least two different ways, the inclusion of the "(0)" and the inclusion of a "-". E.164 forbids punctuation, which may have national meaning that could be misunderstood in other contexts. /john - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 9 Jan 2001 10:45:05 -0500 From: glen.morgan@convergys.com Subject: Re: Telecom Digest V2000 #182 Veline Barton" wrote: > >We have a Toshiba DK424 and since December 7 have been experiencing a >problem with our PRI card. Two or three times a day (normally around the >same time) our PRI circuit locks up. Initially, we thought it might be a >distant problem so we relocated the smart jack into the switch room. >Needless to say, we have replaced the card and relocated card to different >slot in cabinet. > >Verizon has tested circuit and according to them, there is no problem with >the line. > >To clear the trouble, we power the system up and down. I had a similar problem with a NEC 2400 IMS system that was losing sync on the timing circuit about 14 times a day. We eventually (long after we had swapped providers and went to a fiber based mux) found out that US West had buried the t-cables next to the area where our local power utility had their capacitor banks. Every time the power utility did a charge/discharge cycle on the capacitors, we got a burst of RF noise and the signal to noise ratio dropped enough to kick us off the circuit. Per US West, there was "nothing wrong" with the circuit when they initially tested - not surprising since it an intermittent problem and they just never happened to be monitoring it when there was a burst of RF. I got the explanation 6 months after we had originally started the troubleshooting process. This was 5 months after we had swapped to a CLEC who was able to string fiber to use and get us off of copper circuits. Moral of story - just cause your RBOC says it's cool, don't make it so. Glenn Morgan Telecom and Network Systems Convergys Corporation, Tucson Office. - -- NOTICE: The information contained in this electronic mail transmission is intended by Convergys Corporation for the use of the named individual or entity to which it is directed and may contain information that is privileged or otherwise confidential. If you have received this electronic mail transmission in error, please delete it from your system without copying or forwarding it, and notify the sender of the error by reply email or by telephone (collect), so that the sender's address records can be corrected. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 9 Jan 2001 11:34:13 -0500 From: "Adam H. Kerman" Subject: Re: mobile phone dialing John R. Covert wrote: >"Adam H. Kerman" wrote: >>John R. Covert wrote: >>>I roam a fair bit, so I have most of my numbers stored in international >>>+NN format- it doesn't effect my billing, but from the look of the thread >>>this may not work in the US (as an outsider looking in I've always been >>>surprised by the variation in services accross the US ;+)) >>Replace the + with 011 when roaming within the US. >Certainly NOT! In my GSM phone I have all of my numbers stored >as +nn... including U.S. numbers (+1 npa...) and I have almost >never had a problem. You took my comment out of context; I put your earlier quote back in. When you talk about storing numbers in your dialing directory with "+nn", I thought you were saying that you were including the prefix that means country code follows. You don't? I'm not sure what you meant by "from the look of the thread", given that the other comments about wireless weren't discussing GSM dialing plans. >Unlike AMPS/DAMPS, where the mobile carriers tend to do whatever >they please, GSM providers are _required_ to support the +... format >for all calls, including domestic calls. Precisely what do you mean by the "+... format"? Do you have a literal plus stored in front of the international number, or a dialing prefix? Are GSM systems worldwide using the same dialing prefix? - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 9 Jan 2001 12:06:05 -0500 From: "Adam H. Kerman" Subject: Making all telemarketing illegal (was: Anti-Telemarketing Wish: a take me off your list button) Linc Madison wrote: >Adam H. Kerman wrote: >>John David Galt wrote: >>>Ideally, all telemarketing should be limited by law to "opt-in" >>>lists, and no business should be able to demand that you accept >>>their marketing calls as a condition of doing business with them. >>>Telemarketing, like spam, is nothing but a public nuisance. >>Ah. Businesses should have no speech rights whatsoever. >Now *THERE'S* an insightful comment, Adam. Linc is going into "I'll be an ass" mode to distract from his weak arguments. You can tell when he starts capitalizing every fourth word or so. >There is NOTHING in the constitution or in any law that gives ANYONE >ELSE the right to free speech on MY TELEPHONE. But that's not the constitutional issue. It is proposed that there be a law banning what is presently legal speech. The suggested law must be examined for constitutional issues. >There is absolutely ZERO constitutional impediment to outlawing cold >calling for telemarketing. The ONLY impediment is the telemarketers' >lobbyists. Are you implying that you believe that banning cold calling for charitable fundraising, promoting a candidate or a referendum, promoting an issue, and the like would raise constitutional issues? Those waste just as much time and are no less obnoxious, yet exempted from current restrictions. >Marketers can have their free speech on any medium to which they have >legal access; I'm simply saying that my telephone is not one of such. Well, gee, that's what you say, but you haven't made an argument other than you don't like it. It's not precisely comparable to unsolicited faxes and spammed email. Part of the justification for such bans is that the recipient pays for receipt and storage, particularly when receiving a fax. With email there's likely a quota on received messages, plus a cost to receive them via POP or IMAP or just connecting with the Mail server. This, of course, ignores the component of misrepresentation involved in email spam, forging injection points and >From headers, accessing open mail servers the spammer doesn't do business with, etc. That's banned when faxing; the station must be identified or a voice number at the location must be given. If the telephone subscriber has a marginal cost of receiving another call from a telemarketer, perhaps it wouldn't be unconstitutional to ban. For instance, calls to toll-free numbers, forwarded numbers, cell phones, and the like could be banned. Unsolicited paging is the identical concept as email spam. Perhaps unsolicited callers could be banned from leaving a message on an answering machine or voice mail. But banning all calls made to persons answering their own phones is treading on constitutional issues. That's an attempt by government to prevent one person from communicating with another person, and could be unconstitutional prior restraint. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 9 Jan 2001 13:28:53 -0500 From: daw@mozart.cs.berkeley.edu (David Wagner) Subject: Re: Making all telemarketing illegal (was: Anti-Telemarketing Wish: a take me off your list button) If banning unsolicited calls would be unconstitutional, why is it constitutional to ban unsolicited junk faxes? Remember, we already have a law on the books that does exactly the latter. (Why might such a law be constitutional? Well, restrictions on speech that are content-neutral and that take the form of a time, place, or manner restriction may not receive the same level of scrutiny.) - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 9 Jan 2001 13:39:22 -0500 From: dave@pinguino.fsnet.co.uk (Dave Clarke) Subject: Re: le phone dialing On 8 Jan 2001 11:29:38 -0500, "Andy Ball" wrote: >FamilyNet HQ: Telnet:\\www.family-bbs.net > > >Hello Joseph! > > JS> ...in London, England would I dial (020) XXXX XXXX? > > Would I also dial 112 for local directory? > >I /think/ 112 would get you through to emergency services. Yes in Britain the Emergency services are on 999, and also the newer 112, which is intended as a pan European Emergency number. - -- Dave Clarke - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 9 Jan 2001 13:55:33 -0500 From: Barry Margolin Subject: Re: Making all telemarketing illegal (was: Anti-Telemarketing Wish: a take me off your list button) In article <93fkp6$5s8$1@agate.berkeley.edu>, David Wagner wrote: >If banning unsolicited calls would be unconstitutional, why is >it constitutional to ban unsolicited junk faxes? Remember, we >already have a law on the books that does exactly the latter. Probably because of the paper in the fax machine. You're not banning the message, you're prohibiting them from making you pay for the printing. You can hang up on a telemarketer, but you don't know that a fax is junk until after it has printed. - -- Barry Margolin, barmar@genuity.net Genuity, Burlington, MA *** DON'T SEND TECHNICAL QUESTIONS DIRECTLY TO ME, post them to newsgroups. Please DON'T copy followups to me -- I'll assume it wasn't posted to the group. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 9 Jan 2001 14:02:18 -0500 From: ttonino@bio.vu.nl Subject: Re: mobile phone dialing "Adam H. Kerman" wrote: > Precisely what do you mean by the "+... format"? Do you have a literal plus > stored in front of the international number, or a dialing prefix? Are GSM > systems worldwide using the same dialing prefix? Yes, you can store a literal '+'. So my phone has numbers stored as +31201234567 for a number in Amsterdam. + being the international access code for GSM, 31 the country code, and the rest the subscriber number. Incoming calls appear in a different format on my network: 0201234567. That number is 'national format'. On a land line, one can also dial 1234567 within the area, but GSM needs the area prefix (020 of 20, depending which way you look at it). The phone maches only digits at the end of the number, so it is able to match up 0201234567 with +31201234567. The full +31201234567 format number should reach the same subscriber if dialed anywhere in the world where the phone works. Thomas - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 9 Jan 2001 14:56:43 -0500 From: "Gavin Henry" Subject: 2-way radio circuit diagrams Does anyone have any ideas how I could get cicit diagrams or design my own 2-way radio? - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 9 Jan 2001 15:51:33 -0500 From: johnl@iecc.com (John R Levine) Subject: Re: Making all telemarketing illegal (was: Anti-Telemarketing Wish: a take me off your list button) >If banning unsolicited calls would be unconstitutional, why is >it constitutional to ban unsolicited junk faxes? Remember, we >already have a law on the books that does exactly the latter. The same law makes unsolicited robot sales calls illegal, which is where this conversation started. - -- John R. Levine, IECC, POB 727, Trumansburg NY 14886 +1 607 387 6869 johnl@iecc.com, Village Trustee and Sewer Commissioner, http://iecc.com/johnl, Member, Provisional board, Coalition Against Unsolicited Commercial E-mail - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2001 00:15:34 -0500 From: "Judith Oppenheimer" Subject: 1/9/01 ICBTollFreeNews.Com HEADS UP HEADLINES ____________________________________________________ ICBTollFreeNews.Com HEADS UP HEADLINES ____________________________________________________ from ICB Toll Free News - Daily News and Intelligence covering the Political, Legal and Marketing Arenas of 800 and Dot Com. ____________________________________________________ CONTENTS - - FREE PC-TO-PHONE USE GROWING, SAYS OVUM - - 800 / DOT COM - - NORTHERNLIGHTS.COM DIMMED BY TRO - - 800 COMMITTEE GRANTED DELAY - - INTERNIC IS DEAD. LONG LIVE INTERNIC. - - BE IT DOMAIN OR 800, TAKE NOTE. - - NAMES COUNCIL (OPERATIVE WORD) AGENDA ___________________________________________________ ___________________________________________________ ICB PREMIUM SALE ENDS SOON! ICB Premium Subscription is ON SALE thru January 15. Subscribe Here: http://www.roibot.com/w.cgi?R1764_PREMIUM ___________________________________________________ ___________________________________________________ For information on advertising in ICB HeadsUp Headlines, mailto:info@icbtollfree.com, subject line: ICB rate card. ___________________________________________________ ___________________________________________________ CUSTOMER SERVICE NOTES: With over 4,000 articles archived, ICB is a popular research destination. Find all ICB headlines: http://www.icbtollfree.com/icbheadlns.cfm, or use ICB's search engine: http://icbtollfree.com/Search.cfm. Note: Registration is required. Contact information is NOT sold, leased, rented or shared in any manner. ICB offers FREE classifieds: http://www.roibot.com/w.cgi?R1764_Classifieds ____________________________________________________ EVERY 3.6 SECONDS SOMEONE DIES FROM HUNGER http://www.hungersite.com/ ____________________________________________________ ARTICLE ACCESS CODE LEGEND ICB Toll Free News offers two valuable service options: F = Free - News and Features articles P = Premium - Unlimited Site Access including all Articles and Documents. ____________________________________________________ HEADLINES for January 9, 2001 F - FREE PC-TO-PHONE USE GROWING, SAYS OVUM According to the ‘IP telephony: Exploiting Market Opportunities’ report by Ovum, e-calling can bypass local telephony regulations and this factor is helping the service to take off in developing countries as well as developed ones. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4970 F - 800 / DOT COM "It takes some serious creative genius (or abundant capital) to obtain the perfect toll-free number," advises Network Solutions, glibly oblivious to the illegality inherent in its "abundant capital" reference, in this otherwise interesting brief on 1-800 identity online. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4969 P - NORTHERNLIGHTS.COM DIMMED BY TRO This case involves a dispute over the simultaneous use of two similar Internet domain names by two separate entities. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4966 P - 800 COMMITTEE GRANTED DELAY ... the Commission sought NANC’s recommendation to facilitate the selection of a toll free number administrator through a competitive bidding process... the IMG reached an impasse and...does not appear possible to reach a consensus ... CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4964 P - INTERNIC IS DEAD. LONG LIVE INTERNIC. Under a license agreement signed yesterday, the Department of Commerce has licensed to ICANN the right to use the trademarked term "Internic" and arranged to have the corresponding domain name registrations for .com, .net and .org transferred to ICANN. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4965 F - BE IT DOMAIN OR 800, TAKE NOTE. "Most seemingly harmless contacts from covetous parties are in fact drafted by lawyers, even though the inquiry is not on the letterhead of a law firm. No matter how friendly or folksy a letter may be from someone asking about your domain name, any response by you that makes any of the blunders mentioned above (offering to sell your domain name, stating that it is for sale, responding to an offer to purchase your domain name, etc.) is likely to be swiftly followed by a lawsuit or UDRP complaint taking advantage of your blunder." 800 number holders often fall prey to similar tactics. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4967 P - NAMES COUNCIL (OPERATIVE WORD) AGENDA ... includes an update on negotiations on new TLDs and explanation of means of charter enforcement, presented by ICANN Staff, and the Council's "consideration" of an individuals constituency. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4968 _______________notices from our sponsors_______________ QUESTION OR PROBLEM WITH DOMAINS OR 800 NUMBERS? 800 & Domain Name Acquisition Management, Lost/Stolen 800 # Retrieval, Litigation Support, Regulatory Navigation, Correlating Domain Name & Trademark Matters. http://www.roibot.com/w.cgi?R1764_Consultlink ____________________________________________________ Whether you are buying a home, drafting a will, filing bankruptcy, or involved in any type of legal matter, CaseMatch can help you find the right attorney. http://www.roibot.com/w.cgi?R1764_casematchlink ____________________________________________________ Afternic.com is your premier destination on the Web for aftermarket domain name sales, acquisition, and research. http://www.roibot.com/w.cgi?R1764_afterniclink ____________________________________________________ ABOUT ICB ICB HeadsUp Headlines Daily Email is sent by request. 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All rights reserved. ____________________________________________________ ------------------------------ End of Telecom Digest V2000 #184 ******************************** Date: 11 Jan 2001 06:15:13 -0500 From: owner-telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org (Telecom Digest) To: telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org Subject: Telecom Digest V2000 #185 Telecom Digest Thursday, January 11 2001 Volume 2000 : Number 185 In this issue: Re: Making all telemarketing illegal (was: Anti-Telemarketing Wish: a take me off your list button) Fiber SLA Re: Fiber SLA Re: mobile phone dialing Re: Making all telemarketing illegal (was: Anti-Telemarketing Wish: a take me off your list button) need a recommendation Re: Making all telemarketing illegal (was: Anti-Telemarketing Wish: a take me off your list button) What Cells Will Sell in Rio? Bill aims to block wireless junk email Re: 1+ as a toll indicator (was: desirable numbers) 1/10/01 ICBTollFreeNews.Com HEADS UP HEADLINES battery charger, cellular phone accessories. Re: Making all telemarketing illegal (was: Anti-Telemarketing Wish: a take me off your list button) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 10 Jan 2001 08:33:02 -0500 From: Linc Madison Subject: Re: Making all telemarketing illegal (was: Anti-Telemarketing Wish: a take me off your list button) In article , Adam H. Kerman wrote: > >There is NOTHING in the constitution or in any law that gives ANYONE > >ELSE the right to free speech on MY TELEPHONE. > > But that's not the constitutional issue. It is proposed that there be > a law banning what is presently legal speech. The suggested law must > be examined for constitutional issues. No, Adam, there is no such proposal. NO SPEECH IS PROPOSED TO BE BANNED. Get that through your thick skull. No speech would be banned at all, period. Only a particular method of DELIVERY of the speech would be affected. There is no constitutional impediment. The speech itself - -- the content -- is not banned at all, only its unwanted delivery to unwilling recipients. Freedom of speech does not include the right to make other people listen. > Are you implying that you believe that banning cold calling for > charitable fundraising, promoting a candidate or a referendum, > promoting an issue, and the like would raise constitutional issues? > Those waste just as much time and are no less obnoxious, yet exempted > from current restrictions. No, you are putting words in my mouth. One of your usual tricks. Kindly refrain from strawman arguments. > >Marketers can have their free speech on any medium to which they have > >legal access; I'm simply saying that my telephone is not one of such. > > Well, gee, that's what you say, but you haven't made an argument > other than you don't like it. I don't need any other argument. "I don't like it" is entirely adequate. > If the telephone subscriber has a marginal cost of receiving another > call from a telemarketer, perhaps it wouldn't be unconstitutional to > ban. For instance, calls to toll-free numbers, forwarded numbers, > cell phones, and the like could be banned. They already are. Read 47 USC 227. (Of course, I have still gotten telemarketing calls on my 800 number, including one at 4:45 a.m. on a Sunday.) > But banning all calls made to persons answering their own phones is > treading on constitutional issues. That's an attempt by government to > prevent one person from communicating with another person, and could > be unconstitutional prior restraint. No, it isn't, not in the least. It is an attempt by the government to prevent UNWANTED communication from one person to another person, which is entirely legal and constitutional. It isn't prior restraint, because it is content-neutral. It would be very problematic to ban calls from aluminum siding salesmen while permitting calls from roofers, but there is no problem at all in banning all unsolicited telemarketing calls -- including political and charitable solicitations, by the way. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 10 Jan 2001 09:19:52 -0500 From: "Bob Hoffman" Subject: Fiber SLA FamilyNet HQ: Telnet:\\www.family-bbs.net Can someone tell me where I can find an SLA for providers of Dark Fiber? Thanks, Bob FamilyNet <> Internet Gated Mail http://www.fmlynet.org - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 10 Jan 2001 10:01:37 -0500 From: Jack Adams in Holmdel this week Subject: Re: Fiber SLA Please don't consider this a flame, but exactly what type of service would you provide over dark (unutilized) fiber? I guess I must be missing something? Bob Hoffman wrote: > Can someone tell me where I can find an SLA for providers of Dark Fiber? - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 10 Jan 2001 11:25:05 -0500 From: "John R. Covert Spam Sink" Subject: Re: mobile phone dialing "Adam H. Kerman" wrote: >You took my comment out of context; I put your earlier quote back in. Actually, Michael Hartley wrote that, but you attributed it to me when you put it back in. Please be more careful with attribution. What he meant by "from the look of the thread" was that there is so much variation in how U.S. phone systems handle things, he was concerned that what works in the rest of the world might not work in the U.S. Outside the U.S. and Canada, practically everything is GSM and is very well regulated, so that roaming works seamlessly, with standard dialling, including the ability to actually store a literal "+" at the beginning of a number to indicate that it is in international format, and the requirement for all GSM systems to correctly process even local numbers stored in this format. Europeans tend to not understand that American companies in general don't give a hoot for standards, and that everything works differently here, and differently again on the other side of our large continent. But then they tend to also expect everything on their side of the pond to work the same way, which is not always the case. I _have_ used a GSM system in Europe where you could reach other mobile subscribers on the same network by dialling just the subscriber number without the prefix. This capability may have been removed when certain networks grew so large that they began to have more than one prefix. /john - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 10 Jan 2001 11:53:46 -0500 From: Paul Hrisko Subject: Re: Making all telemarketing illegal (was: Anti-Telemarketing Wish: a take me off your list button) One of the reasons for the banning of 'robot calls' was that the machine would seize the line and not release it until the end of the message, and then sometimes not for a while after that even if you hung up the line. Because this prevented outgoing calls, it was deemed detrimental to the public good since 911 calls were effectively blocked until the machine released the line. Cheers Paul - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 10 Jan 2001 14:01:55 -0500 From: "Judith Oppenheimer" Subject: need a recommendation A client of mine just got set up to be a CLEC in NY State. Can anyone recommend who best to work with (lawyer, consultant, whatever) to get the best reciprocal compensation arrangements? tia - Judith http://www.ICBTollFreeNews.com "An important source of inside information," says InfoWorld; "superb", "invaluable", "critically intelligent", "exceedingly useful", report ICB Premium Subscribers. ICB Premium Service is On Sale thru January 15. http://www.icbtollfree.com/Article4910.htm - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 10 Jan 2001 20:29:05 -0500 From: stevenl11@aol.com (Steven Lichter) Subject: Re: Making all telemarketing illegal (was: Anti-Telemarketing Wish: a take me off your list button) > >They already are. Read 47 USC 227. (Of course, I have still gotten >telemarketing calls on my 800 number, including one at 4:45 a.m. on a >Sunday.) I think they should allow you to hunt down telemarketers, hook them up to a telephone and make them listen to 5,000 hours of sales pitches, then break all their fingers!!!!! Apple Elite II 909-359-5338. Home of GBBS/LLUCE, support for the Apple II 24 hours 2400/14.4. An OggNet Server. The only good spammer is a dead one, have you hunted one down today? (c) - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 10 Jan 2001 22:26:23 -0500 From: Monty Solomon Subject: What Cells Will Sell in Rio? What Cells Will Sell in Rio? Phone manufacturers and phone service carriers are investing billions of dollars to roll out a GSM network in Brazil. Don't expect Brazilians to buy into SMS or other GSM services anytime soon. By Elisa Batista. http://www.wired.com/news/business/0,1367,41094,00.html - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 10 Jan 2001 22:52:45 -0500 From: Monty Solomon Subject: Bill aims to block wireless junk email Bill aims to block wireless junk email WASHINGTON--In our wireless world, can solicitors find you anywhere within cell range if you have a data-ready wireless phone turned on? Internet users have for years been complaining about unwanted email, or spam, with messages that promise everything from quick cash to an enhanced love life. Consumers now are concerned about spam sent to their wireless devices such as Internet-ready phones, and Congress is taking notice. One of the first bills introduced this Congress would make it a criminal act to send a solicitation to a wireless device without that individual's express permission. Rep. Rush Holt, D-N.J., has been one of the most vocal opponents of spam and first introduced this bill at the end of the last Congress last fall. However, the legislation is questioned both by the wireless industry and anti-spam crusaders. http://news.cnet.com/news/0-1004-200-4432707.html - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 11 Jan 2001 00:16:44 -0500 From: Greg Monti Subject: Re: 1+ as a toll indicator (was: desirable numbers) On 8 Jan 2001, merlyn@stonehenge.com (Randal L. Schwartz) Roy> http://www.nanpa.com/dialing/index.html >I love the exceptions for "Oregon" and "Florida" there. Yeah, Oregon, >where we can't quite be like anything else. :) Actually the chart at the URL above has other exceptions that are not explicitly listed. The chart structure assumes that dialing differences will be determined by whether the user is calling toll or not, or calling to another area code or not. Guess what? That no longer covers all the possibilities. In the Philadelphia region (area codes 215, 267, 484, 610) dialing rules don't follow any of those. In that two-overlay area, any call within or between the 4 area codes is dialed as 10 digits without a 1+, regardless of whether local or toll. (I believe 1+, is permitted). Calls from a point within the 4 area codes to a point outside the 4 are dialed as 1+10 digits, regardless of whether local or toll. This is one way that a non-toll alerting state, like Pennsylvania, can do 10 digit dialing in an overlaid area without forcing everybody to dial 1+10 digits for every call. It defines a pseudo-local area that is "close enough" to avoid 1+. But in reality 1+ in Philadelphia has no meaning at all. It's not used as a toll indicator, nor is it used as an area code indicator. It would be possible to completely drop the 1+ from all calls and the system would operate just fine. Remember 310 in California? There's a lesson in public relations in here somewhere. - ---- Greg Monti New York, New York, USA mailto:gmonti@mindspring.com mailto:gregory.monti@verizon.net - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 01:36:01 -0500 From: "Judith Oppenheimer" Subject: 1/10/01 ICBTollFreeNews.Com HEADS UP HEADLINES ____________________________________________________ ICBTollFreeNews.Com HEADS UP HEADLINES ____________________________________________________ from ICB Toll Free News - Daily News and Intelligence covering the Political, Legal and Marketing Arenas of 800 and Dot Com. ____________________________________________________ CONTENTS - - BIDDING FOR 800 ADMINISTRATION -- OR 800 CONTROL? - - EMPHATIC REVERSE DOMAIN HIJACK DECISION - - THE IDEAL INTERNET: DYSON SPEAKS - - US ENUM-DNS AD-HOC GROUP FORMED ___________________________________________________ ___________________________________________________ ICB PREMIUM SALE ENDS SOON! ICB Premium Subscription is ON SALE thru January 15. Subscribe Here: http://www.roibot.com/w.cgi?R1764_PREMIUM ___________________________________________________ ___________________________________________________ CUSTOMER SERVICE NOTES: With over 4,000 articles archived, ICB is a popular research destination. Find all ICB headlines: http://www.icbtollfree.com/icbheadlns.cfm, or use ICB's search engine: http://icbtollfree.com/Search.cfm. Note: Registration is required. Contact information is NOT sold, leased, rented or shared in any manner. ICB offers FREE classifieds: http://www.roibot.com/w.cgi?R1764_Classifieds ____________________________________________________ EVERY 3.6 SECONDS SOMEONE DIES FROM HUNGER http://www.hungersite.com/ ____________________________________________________ ARTICLE ACCESS CODE LEGEND ICB Toll Free News offers two valuable service options: F = Free - News and Features articles P = Premium - Unlimited Site Access including all Articles and Documents. ____________________________________________________ HEADLINES for January 10, 2001 P - BIDDING FOR 800 ADMINISTRATION -- OR 800 CONTROL? Industry players are jockeying to move 800 number and customer control up the food chain, from RespOrg to 800 Administrator. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4974 P - EMPHATIC REVERSE DOMAIN HIJACK DECISION Complainant has failed utterly to establish two of the three elements of the Policy... The Panel therefore denies the Complainant’s request that the domain name be transferred from Respondent to Complainant and declares that the Complaint was brought in bad faith and thus constitutes Reverse Domain Name Hijacking. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4973 F - THE IDEAL INTERNET: DYSON SPEAKS "I would say that the free market is the natural state. But you need regulation to make the free market work." CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4972 P - US ENUM-DNS AD-HOC GROUP FORMED ... established to for industry input to identify administrative US ENUM-DNS issues and recommend resolution to the issues in a Report to Study Group A. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4971 _______________notices from our sponsors_______________ QUESTIONS? PROBLEMS? 800 & Domain Name Acquisition Management, Lost/Stolen 800 # Retrieval, Litigation Support, Regulatory Navigation, Correlating Domain Name & Trademark Matters. http://www.roibot.com/w.cgi?R1764_Consultlink ____________________________________________________ Whether you are buying a home, drafting a will, filing bankruptcy, or involved in any type of legal matter, CaseMatch can help you find the right attorney. http://www.roibot.com/w.cgi?R1764_casematchlink ____________________________________________________ Afternic.com is your premier destination on the Web for aftermarket domain name sales, acquisition, and research. http://www.roibot.com/w.cgi?R1764_afterniclink ____________________________________________________ ABOUT ICB ICB HeadsUp Headlines Daily Email is sent by request. Subscriptions to Daily Email are free to qualified applicants. Visit http://www.roibot.com/w.cgi?R1764_ICBsignup to sign up. Please feel free to pass along a copy to a friend, within reason so long as the message is not modified or used unfavorably. To unsubscribe mailto:editor@icbtollfree.com, subject: unsubscribe. (Unsubs are processed manually, approximately once a week.) ___________________________________________________ ADVERTISING For information on advertising in ICB HeadsUp Headlines, mailto:info@icbtollfree.com, subject line: ICB rate card. ____________________________________________________ Only subscribers or registered users of ICB Toll Free News web site will be able to access all or some of the full text of URLs provided. ____________________________________________________ Copyright © 2000 ICB, Inc. All rights reserved. ____________________________________________________ ------------------------------ Date: 11 Jan 2001 02:34:16 -0500 From: " Hwan Chyun Euterprise Co., Ltd." Subject: battery charger, cellular phone accessories. OFFER: [TW,] battery charger, cellular phone accessories. 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URL: http://www.ph-charger.com.tw/ Contact: Chia Shiun Lin Email: promise4@ms36.hinet.net Phone: 886-4-23102361 Fax: 886-4-23101525 Address: 4F, No.497, West Dist, Ying Tsai Rd., Taichung, Taiwan, R.O.C. =================================== Posted by Taiwan Products On-line http://manufacture.com.tw/ =================================== - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 11 Jan 2001 04:30:04 -0500 From: jay@west.net (Jay Hennigan) Subject: Re: Making all telemarketing illegal (was: Anti-Telemarketing Wish: a take me off your list button) In article , Adam H. Kerman wrote: > But that's not the constitutional issue. It is proposed that there be > a law banning what is presently legal speech. The suggested law must > be examined for constitutional issues. Would you suggest that the same content delivered by sound trucks in residential neighborhoods at 3:00 AM is "legal speech"? > Are you implying that you believe that banning cold calling for > charitable fundraising, promoting a candidate or a referendum, > promoting an issue, and the like would raise constitutional issues? > Those waste just as much time and are no less obnoxious, yet exempted > from current restrictions. So, you've made dinner reservations at a nice expensive restaurant with a date and are sitting at a window seat enjoying the view when a person dressed in a clown suit and a sandwich board promoting a political candidate appears on the sidewalk outside. This person then uses a bullhorn to beg for charitable donations. You think this is a great idea? You think it's scalable, so that many charities and politicians should hire clowns to do this? > If the telephone subscriber has a marginal cost of receiving another > call from a telemarketer, perhaps it wouldn't be unconstitutional to > ban. For instance, calls to toll-free numbers, forwarded numbers, > cell phones, and the like could be banned. Technically determining in advance if a number is forwarded to a cell phone is difficult if not impossible. It is very probable that due to the exhaustion of telephone prefixes, wired and wireless phones will be sharing the same NPA-NXX. This may be happening already. > But banning all calls made to persons answering their own phones is > treading on constitutional issues. That's an attempt by government to > prevent one person from communicating with another person, and could > be unconstitutional prior restraint. I disagree. It would be prior restraint if the content of the speech were to be prevented by law. What is proposed is banning the delivery of that content in a manner that is a nuisance. Telemarketers *are* a nuisance, as are spammers, sound trucks at 3:00 AM, and fundraisers using bullhorns. Freedom of speech and of the press don't guarantee an audience. If the speaker wishes to buy radio time, sign up for public access cable, or pay for an advertisement, then fine. What would be banned is the nuisance, not the speech. Telemarketing simply doesn't scale. If you were to get one telemarketing call per ad from every advertiser in your local paper including political advertisers, charities, and classifieds, would your telephone be usable? Would it be a convenience? The content of those newspaper advertisements is perfectly legal speech. - -- Jay Hennigan - Network Administration - jay@west.net NetLojix Communications, Inc. NASDAQ: NETX - http://www.netlojix.com/ WestNet: Connecting you to the planet. 805 884-6323 - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ End of Telecom Digest V2000 #185 ******************************** Date: 12 Jan 2001 06:15:13 -0500 From: owner-telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org (Telecom Digest) To: telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org Subject: Telecom Digest V2000 #186 Telecom Digest Friday, January 12 2001 Volume 2000 : Number 186 In this issue: NY Times Article on Telecom Websites Oops! Re: Making all telemarketing illegal Re: 1+ as a toll indicator (was: desirable numbers) 973 area code Re: New Cell Antenna 1/11/01 ICBTollFreeNews.Com HEADS UP HEADLINES Re: Making all telemarketing illegal Re: Making all telemarketing illegal Re: Making all telemarketing illegal Re: Making all telemarketing illegal ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 11 Jan 2001 09:15:38 -0500 From: "William Van Hefner" Subject: NY Times Article on Telecom Websites The New York Times January 11, 2001 SCREEN GRAB Using the Web to Help Hapless Callers Cope By JOYCE COHEN MAKING a telephone call has never been so confusing. With an abundance of area codes, long-distance plans and other changes unthinkable just a few years ago — about a dozen regions now require 10-digit dialing for local calls — how does the hapless caller cope? With help from the Web, of course, where sites offer plenty of information on telephone numbers and services. For long-distance callers struggling to keep up with the frenzy of new area codes, several comprehensive sites give assistance. AreaCode- Info.com (areacode-info.com) was founded by John Cropper in early 1995, when codes started multiplying and he found himself dismayed at the lack of official information for updating his company's marketing database. As for New York's next area codes? Manhattan could get 565, with the other boroughs getting 929, said Eric B. Morson, the site's co-administrator. It's no coincidence that both codes follow the pattern of 212. After that, 212 might become 2912. The most common proposal to expand North America's rapidly shrinking stock of phone numbers inserts 9 as the second digit of a four- digit area code. The area code site run by Linc Madison (www.lincmad.com) includes easy-to-understand maps, tables and explanations. It also warns against "telesleaze" numbers, which include sex lines, and phones routed to international numbers and billed at exorbitant rates. The area code sites, peppered with bits of history, make for lively reading. The original 86 area codes, dating from 1947, used a 0 in the middle for states with a single area code and a 1 for states with multiple codes. And for four years, 914 was shared by Long Island and Westchester, making it North America's only area code that covered a noncontiguous area. (In recent years, several such codes have sprouted, and more are on the way.) A concise table of area codes, listed both numerically and alphabetically, is at www.areacodes.net, run by ProDial Communications, a long- distance provider. Official information comes from www.nanpa.com, the site of the North American Numbering Plan Administration The legwork for comparing long- distance prices, which are no longer based on distance, is done by A Bell Tolls (www.abelltolls.com). "A lot of the advertising is misleading," said Marc-David Seidel, who runs the site with two friends. "We take the hidden charges that the companies tack onto your bill and standardize them." That's why the site reports per-minute costs in peculiar amounts like 6.34 cents. A calling-card section, for calls made away from home, cautions against prepaid calling cards, which may sneak in automatic monthly deductions, large billing increments and toll-free access numbers that are always busy. News about the long-distance industry, including information about companies that have defrauded the public, is posted at Discount Long Distance Digest (www.thedigest .com), run by William Van Hefner, who is not a fan of the big telephone companies. "They aren't very efficient and don't want consumer business," he said. People wishing to avoid their long- distance carrier can do so easily, without switching, by "dialing around" it. The many dial-around discount services typically start with the digits 10-10. "Shop around before you dial around," said Rich Sayers, who runs the site at www.10-10phonerates .com, designed to help people "with a phone bill of more than $10 a month, or who are mad at their long-distance service." (Mr. Sayers and many of the proprietors of similar sites receive fees for referrals from their site and for advertising.) One advantage of dial-around services is that people can use different companies for in-state, out-of- state and international calls. Again, the advertising can be misleading, Mr. Sayers said. Some plans cost 99 cents for the first 20 minutes plus 5 cents for each additional minute — so leaving a short voice-mail message incurs a 99-cent charge. That angers him. Many people know they can circumvent the costly need to dial directory assistance by looking up numbers on directory Web sites. But they may not know that some sites — like www.whitepages.com, www.reversephonedirectory.com and www.555- 1212.com — have reverse-lookup features. Though the directories tend to be outdated and sketchy, knowing a phone number often means you can check the person's name and address. Or someone with your number can locate you. It's also possible to look up numbers of pay phones — on www.payphone-directory.org and at The Payphone Project (www.sorabji.com/livewire/payphones). As a bonus, most of the useful telephone sites have dozens of links to other sites that offer engaging telephone particulars like pictures of pay phones and recordings of sounds that telephones make. For those who yearn for the days before calling became so complicated, Robert Crowe's Telephone EXchange Name Project (www.ourwebhome.com/tenp/tenproject.html) revisits the original names of today's numbered phone exchanges. Like many who enjoy his site, Mr. Crowe is nostalgic about his childhood phone number, SYcamore 4- 7064. "Whenever I got a new number, I wondered what it had been," he said. "You used to have a feel of the geography around you in terms of the telephone exchange. It is still important to have a sense of place." - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 11 Jan 2001 12:13:00 -0500 From: "Michael A. Desmon" Subject: Oops! Wrong number! Bahamas phone book cover shows porn site URL http://www.cnn.com/2001/WORLD/americas/01/09/bahamas.batelco.ap/index.html - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 11 Jan 2001 12:38:03 -0500 From: "Adam H. Kerman" Subject: Re: Making all telemarketing illegal Jay Hennigan wrote: >Adam H. Kerman wrote: >>But that's not the constitutional issue. It is proposed that there be >>a law banning what is presently legal speech. The suggested law must >>be examined for constitutional issues. >Would you suggest that the same content delivered by sound trucks in >residential neighborhoods at 3:00 AM is "legal speech"? Can you distinguish between a ban and a restriction? >So, you've made dinner reservations at a nice expensive restaurant >with a date and are sitting at a window seat enjoying the view when >a person dressed in a clown suit and a sandwich board promoting a >political candidate appears on the sidewalk outside. This person >then uses a bullhorn to beg for charitable donations. You think this >is a great idea? My opinion on effectiveness isn't relevant. Your hypothetical is ridiculous. >I disagree. It would be prior restraint if the content of the speech >were to be prevented by law. What is proposed is banning the delivery >of that content in a manner that is a nuisance. It is not constitutional to ban a particular method of speech under all circumstances. There are nuisance laws banning telephone solicitation at certain times. If the law chooses reasonable bans, it withstands scrutiny. >Freedom of speech and of the press don't guarantee an audience. You probably have no idea what the constitutional meaning of freedom of the press is. It's the right to publish. Publishing is more than printing. It includes getting the message into the hands of its readers. A newspaper is not published when the ink is dry, the folding is finished, and all sections have been printed. Only when it has been delivered to a subscriber or sold at a newsstand is it published. Banning a telephone call for commercial purposes to someone with whom no business relationship exists under all circumstances is a type of prior restraint. The caller intends to do something you don't, i.e. try to sell a product or service, that isn't illegal under other circumstances. It's the equivalent of preventing a merchant from printing an advertising leaflet and handing it out in public. It's a thought crime. >What would be banned is the nuisance, not the speech. Fortunately for America, there's a much higher threshold for declaring a nuisance than what you think. With your idea, all speech and publishing could be banned because somebody doesn't like it. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 11 Jan 2001 22:23:27 -0500 From: Ed Hew Subject: Re: 1+ as a toll indicator (was: desirable numbers) In article <9349ni$8nefv$1@ID-39509.news.dfncis.de>, >"I believe that there are only about 8 states where it is possible to make >LD calls without dialing the "1" prefix: CA, IL, NY, NJ, PA, WV, NH and ME, >IIRC. Granted, all but the last three are quite populous, but they still >are no match for the vast toll-alerting majority of the country." On one trip to Orlando, FL, I discovered much to my chagrine that what is a local call from one hotel is long distance in one a few doors down and across the street. No 1+ prefix used for any, but a $20 extra telecom "long distance" bill from the hotel as a nice going-away surprise. I've since learned to ask about such things before checking in to a hotel. - -- Ed Hew XeniTec Consulting Services - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 11 Jan 2001 22:24:31 -0500 From: cujo6945@cs.com (Cujo6945) Subject: 973 area code Is the 973 area code region going to get a new area code soon? If it is, what number is it likely going to be? Is it going to be a split or overlay? Justin Joseph East Hanover, NJ - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 12 Jan 2001 00:49:28 -0500 From: Robert Eden Subject: Re: New Cell Antenna wrote in message news:93f2f9$jd1$1@nnrp1.deja.com... > A British researcher has created a new antenna that he claims will > reduce radiation emissions 97%, and double battery life. Read about it > at: www.foxnews.com/scitech/010901/antenna.sml is it just me? I *WANT* my antenna to radiate! 8-) Want to reduce antenna emissions 100%? Turn it off! Robert - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 01:09:36 -0500 From: "Judith Oppenheimer" Subject: 1/11/01 ICBTollFreeNews.Com HEADS UP HEADLINES ___________________________________________________ ICBTollFreeNews.Com HEADS UP HEADLINES ____________________________________________________ from ICB Toll Free News - Daily News and Intelligence covering the Political, Legal and Marketing Arenas of 800 and Dot Com. ____________________________________________________ CONTENTS - - ENUM NOTES - - CERF, WE KNEW YOU WELL ... - - ICANN EXEC COMMITTEE MEETS - - ICANN DOWN UNDER ___________________________________________________ ___________________________________________________ ICB PREMIUM SALE ENDS SOON! ICB Premium Subscription is ON SALE thru January 15. 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"... it`s been a long time since we`ve had any new top level domains in the Internet, it`s been almost ten years," says Vint Cerf. What are we to make of the new ICANN Chair is so blatantly deferring to raggedy party line (new ccTLD's have been added over the years, the most recent .ps). "Proof of concept," he recites. Sadly, "proof of capture" is more like it. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4977 P - ICANN EXEC COMMITTEE MEETS If the lawyers got half a million bucks, and theoretically the consultants got half a million bucks - where is the other $1.2M "cost recovery" collected by ICANN from the new TLD contenders? CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4975 F - ICANN DOWN UNDER "ICANN's next round of meetings will be held 10-13 March, 2001... The meetings are free to attend, and open to any interested person. ICANN encourages broad participation in its bottom-up consensus- development process." Location: Melbourne, Australia. 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All rights reserved. ____________________________________________________ ------------------------------ Date: 12 Jan 2001 03:45:13 -0500 From: jay@west.net (Jay Hennigan) Subject: Re: Making all telemarketing illegal On 11 Jan 2001 12:38:03 -0500, Adam H. Kerman wrote: :Jay Hennigan wrote: :>Adam H. Kerman wrote: : :>>But that's not the constitutional issue. It is proposed that there be :>>a law banning what is presently legal speech. The suggested law must :>>be examined for constitutional issues. : :>Would you suggest that the same content delivered by sound trucks in :>residential neighborhoods at 3:00 AM is "legal speech"? : :Can you distinguish between a ban and a restriction? Yes. :You probably have no idea what the constitutional meaning of freedom of the :press is. It's the right to publish. Publishing is more than printing. It :includes getting the message into the hands of its readers. A newspaper is not :published when the ink is dry, the folding is finished, and all sections have :been printed. Only when it has been delivered to a subscriber or sold at a :newsstand is it published. The keywords are subscriber and sold. The recipient of the newspaper requests it, either by subscription or purchase. If a printer chose to indiscrimately distribute newspapers where they were not requested or desired, the practice would be called "littering", not "publishing". I would certainly not be against telemarketing by subscription. Those who choose to accept telemarketing calls can subscribe to such a service, and just like the subscribers to a newspaper, would presumably have given permission for delivery. Those who do not subscribe, have not authorized delivery. If I subscribe to a newspaper, I give permission to have the paper's representative throw a copy onto my porch every morning. If I don't subscribe, I don't authorize the publisher or anyone else to throw trash onto my porch. Doing so is littering, a nuisance, and a crime. :Banning a telephone call for commercial purposes to someone with whom no :business relationship exists under all circumstances is a type of prior :restraint. The caller intends to do something you don't, i.e. try to sell a :product or service, that isn't illegal under other circumstances. It's the :equivalent of preventing a merchant from printing an advertising leaflet and :handing it out in public. It's a thought crime. Handing it out in public implies the recipient affirmatively accepting the handout. Merchants who print and distribute advertising leaflets in places where they are not wanted are litterbugs. Dropping one leaflet on the floor of a public place is not a big deal, nor is making one unsolicited phone call. It's a minor nuisance. Thousands of advertisers dropping thousands of leaflets on the floor is a major nuisance. Maybe, of those thousands, someone walking through will pick up a leaflet and buy something. But, in the eyes of everyone else, it's litter and a nuisance. Thousands of telemarketers making thousands of phone calls occasionally make a sale. But, in the eyes of everyone else, it's a nuisance and an annoyance. It is certainly not a thought crime. It is a nuisance. You can think about it all you want. Just keep it off of the phone lines that I pay for. It doesn't scale. And, there is indeed the issue of wireless phones getting telemarketed, either accidentally or intentionally, with the delineation by NPA/NXX getting blurred and also because of call forwarding, etc. :>What would be banned is the nuisance, not the speech. : :Fortunately for America, there's a much higher threshold for declaring a :nuisance than what you think. With your idea, all speech and publishing could :be banned because somebody doesn't like it. Littering, which is the distribution of printed material where it is not requested, is indeed banned. If advertisers want to pay my phone bills, they can call me. If I ask for a call, just like subscribing to a newspaper, they can call me. If not, keep your trash off of my porch and off of my telephone. - -- Jay Hennigan - Network Administration - jay@west.net NetLojix Communications, Inc. NASDAQ: NETX - http://www.netlojix.com/ WestNet: Connecting you to the planet. 805 884-6323 - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 12 Jan 2001 03:59:20 -0500 From: James Bellaire Subject: Re: Making all telemarketing illegal Jay Hennigan wrote: > The keywords are subscriber and sold. The recipient of the newspaper > requests it, either by subscription or purchase. If a printer chose > to indiscrimately distribute newspapers where they were not requested > or desired, the practice would be called "littering", not "publishing". I've received several "free" papers over the years - either shoppers guides or weekly summaries of a daily paper that were mostly classifieds and just a touch of news. None were requested and they showed up on my doorstep. Although generally unwanted, the free papers were still published. To not call them published would be like saying that the telemarketer calls were not phone calls due to content. > If I don't subscribe, I don't authorize the publisher or anyone else > to throw trash onto my porch. Doing so is littering, a nuisance, and > a crime. I'd have to check local laws, but it didn't stop two publishers in my hometown from their distributions. Perhaps if you had a "No Solicitation" sign up it would make a difference. The State of Indiana will be taking up their anti-telemarketer bill again this year. There is already a growing list of residence on the statewide do not call list. If the bill passes, anyone who solicits by phone in Indiana will be REQUIRED to obtain the list and REQUIRED to honor the do not call status of everyone on the list. I haven't read the current version, but I will say that a lot of my junk calls come from out of state (based on Caller ID and accent). At the last election I got recorded calls from both campaigns reminding me to vote. Both had CallerID from out of state. I don't see how a state law could stop someone from out of state, but then the sleaze - er.. salesperson - IS attempting to make a sale within the state. JL - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 12 Jan 2001 05:04:06 -0500 From: murray@pa.dec.com (Hal Murray) Subject: Re: Making all telemarketing illegal > I've received several "free" papers over the years - either shoppers > guides or weekly summaries of a daily paper that were mostly classifieds > and just a touch of news. None were requested and they showed up on my > doorstep. Me too. But there are only a few newspapers like that in any neighboorhood. In my case, there were 3 and they stopped when I asked them to stop. If there were only 3 telemarketers working my neighborhood I'd be happy to ask them each to stop. There are restrictions on telemarketers and they have held up in court. So this isn't a "simple" free-speech issue. I think it's a tradeoff between freedom and privacy. Which is more important, letting the telemarketers get their message out or letting me have my peace and quiet? (I'm not a lawyer.) Note that the tradeoff changes over time as the technology and economics change. 50 years ago telemarketing wasn't such a big deal. It was too expensive. (But you did have the Fuller Brush man knocking on your door.) Florida has a do-not-telemarket system. I'd be happy to use something like that if it was financed by the telemarketing industry. That is I'm willing to "opt-out" once, but I won't be happy if I have to pay to do that. Florida's system does charge the victim a few dollars per year. - -- These are my opinions, not necessarily my employers. I hate spam. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 12 Jan 2001 06:05:07 -0500 From: Terry Kennedy Subject: Re: Making all telemarketing illegal James Bellaire writes: > I've received several "free" papers over the years - either shoppers > guides or weekly summaries of a daily paper that were mostly classifieds > and just a touch of news. None were requested and they showed up on my > doorstep. Although generally unwanted, the free papers were still > published. To not call them published would be like saying that the > telemarketer calls were not phone calls due to content. > > I'd have to check local laws, but it didn't stop two publishers in my > hometown from their distributions. Perhaps if you had a "No > Solicitation" > sign up it would make a difference. Here in Jersey City, NJ we have a local law that bans distribution of dumped literature to buildings that have a "No Advertisements" sign posted. It's Ord. # 99-023 (http://www.cityofjerseycity.com/docs/agenda021099.htm) and it seems to be helping. Of course, dumped literature contains contact info, so you know who to report. Junk telemarketing, like the infestation of recorded "Hello - if your home needs any repairs, please leave your name and number" recordings have no identifying information as they are illegally blocking their Caller ID (the law requires it to be passed in all cases where possible). Since they're already breaking the law by doing recorded cold-calling, they just don't care. I expect the only way to get cooperation from the telco is to name them as a second defen- dant in a suit to recover TCPA damages. Terry Kennedy http://www.tmk.com terry@tmk.com Jersey City, NJ USA - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ End of Telecom Digest V2000 #186 ******************************** Date: 13 Jan 2001 06:15:13 -0500 From: owner-telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org (Telecom Digest) To: telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org Subject: Telecom Digest V2000 #187 Telecom Digest Saturday, January 13 2001 Volume 2000 : Number 187 In this issue: Re: Making all telemarketing illegal Re: Making all telemarketing illegal 1/12/01 ICBTollFreeNews.Com HEADS UP HEADLINES French Netizens May Get Cheap, Unmetered Access The Feds'll Come A-Snoopin' Do You Even Know Who's Watching? ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 12 Jan 2001 08:03:54 -0500 From: jay@west.net (Jay Hennigan) Subject: Re: Making all telemarketing illegal :Jay Hennigan wrote: :> The keywords are subscriber and sold. The recipient of the newspaper :> requests it, either by subscription or purchase. If a printer chose :> to indiscrimately distribute newspapers where they were not requested :> or desired, the practice would be called "littering", not "publishing". : :I've received several "free" papers over the years - either shoppers :guides or weekly summaries of a daily paper that were mostly classifieds :and just a touch of news. None were requested and they showed up on my :doorstep. Although generally unwanted, the free papers were still :published. To not call them published would be like saying that the :telemarketer calls were not phone calls due to content. Certainly they were published. Nutrition information is "published" on candy wrappers. That doesn't make it acceptable for people to deposit same unrequested on your doorstep. And certainly telemarketer calls are phone calls. As are obscene calls, telephoned bomb threats, and false fire alarms. That doesn't give them constitutional protection. And, to get content out of the picture, a telemarketer calling at 4:00 AM is just as much a phone call as one calling at 4:00 PM. Interestingly, a fairly large portion of the telesleaze calls I get are from newspapers soliciting subscriptions. :I'd have to check local laws, but it didn't stop two publishers in my :hometown from their distributions. Perhaps if you had a "No :Solicitation" sign up it would make a difference. Or call the cops and protest the littering. What's the difference between someone leaving a printed advertisement extolling the virtues of buying a product and someone leaving an empty cup proclaiming "7-11 Slurpee"? Both are printed, published advertisements. :The State of Indiana will be taking up their anti-telemarketer bill :again :this year. There is already a growing list of residence on the :statewide :do not call list. If the bill passes, anyone who solicits by phone in :Indiana will be REQUIRED to obtain the list and REQUIRED to honor the do :not call status of everyone on the list. : :I haven't read the current version, but I will say that a lot of my junk :calls come from out of state (based on Caller ID and accent). At the :last :election I got recorded calls from both campaigns reminding me to vote. :Both had CallerID from out of state. I don't see how a state law could :stop someone from out of state, but then the sleaze - er.. salesperson - :IS attempting to make a sale within the state. I would hope that the "long arm" statutes would apply. If the anti- telesleaze laws allow for civil penalties, a few class-action suits should do the trick. There could be federal pre-emption in the case of phone calls. IANAL, but it should be clear based on the destination NPA that the call is to an Indiana number. It might also be possible go go after the telesleaze if they do business in Indiana, regardless of the location where the call originates. The battle will be tougher if the teleslime is located outside of Indiana and doesn't have a business presence there, although the percentage of such telesleaze is likely to be small. - -- Jay Hennigan - Network Administration - jay@west.net NetLojix Communications, Inc. NASDAQ: NETX - http://www.netlojix.com/ WestNet: Connecting you to the planet. 805 884-6323 - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 12 Jan 2001 08:22:12 -0500 From: James Bellaire Subject: Re: Making all telemarketing illegal >:Jay Hennigan wrote: >:> If a printer chose to indiscrimately distribute newspapers >:> where they were not requested or desired, the practice would >:> be called "littering", not "publishing". Jay Hennigan wrote: > Certainly they were published. Nutrition information is > "published" on candy wrappers. I'd say printed, not published. Publications generally have some sort of identifying block that gives the name of the publisher, etc. and claims to be a publication. I havn't seen a candy wrapper or 7-11 cup with that level of info. The plastic bag that your paper is wrapped in is also deposited on your doorstep each day, but it is the contents of the bag that matter - the paper (or candy or soda) - not the container that could hold it. But we are splitting hares and I really don't want rabbit stew. >: I'd have to check local laws, but it didn't stop two >: publishers in my hometown from their distributions. > > Or call the cops and protest the littering. "Citizen Complaint", line 1. I picture an officer who is at best being polite while doodling and listening to your call. Back to phones now ... >: I don't see how a state law could stop someone from out >: of state, but then the sleaze - er.. salesperson - IS >: attempting to make a sale within the state. ... > There could be federal pre-emption in the case of phone calls. > IANAL, but it should be clear based on the destination NPA that > the call is to an Indiana number. It might also be possible > to go after the telesleaze if they do business in Indiana, > regardless of the location where the call originates. Technically by calling my Indiana number, they are soliciting business within the state. If they called a toll free or an FX or forwarding line in another state they may not know that the number they reached is in Indiana, but I find that most marketers call from a list where they already know my name and state. Some sequential dial, but they are generally in state. I'd say that most marketers are smart enough to know the laws of "special states". JB - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 19:22:29 -0500 From: "Judith Oppenheimer" Subject: 1/12/01 ICBTollFreeNews.Com HEADS UP HEADLINES ____________________________________________________ ICBTollFreeNews.Com HEADS UP HEADLINES ____________________________________________________ from ICB Toll Free News - Daily News and Intelligence covering the Political, Legal and Marketing Arenas of 800 and Dot Com. ____________________________________________________ CONTENTS - - RESP ORGS, LISTEN UP - - MAYBE THEY WATCHED THE VIDEO REPLAY - - KENNARD RESIGNS - - HAS ENUM BEEN BEAT TO THE PUNCH? - - NOT COM HITS CAPITOL HILL - - FRENCH GOV ENUM PROPOSAL ___________________________________________________ ___________________________________________________ ICB PREMIUM SALE ENDS IN 3 DAYS! ICB Premium Subscription is ON SALE thru January 15. 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CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4984 P - MAYBE THEY WATCHED THE VIDEO REPLAY "We have been monitoring the process by which ICANN arrived at its decision in November to approve seven suffixes: .aero, .coop, .info, .museum, .name, .pro, and .biz. There have been a number of reports that ICANN's process ... may be thwarting competition ..." CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4983 F - KENNARD RESIGNS For the next few months, Chairman Kennard will serve as a Senior Fellow of the Aspen Institute Communications and Society Program in Washington, D.C. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4981 P - HAS ENUM BEEN BEAT TO THE PUNCH? The registration and look-up can be done on the NumbersTo.com site or any web site hosting the NumbersTo.com access box. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4980 P - NOT COM HITS CAPITOL HILL DotTV made two trips to Washington, and lobbied a dozen members of Congress. Today, company executives meet with President-elect Bush's staff. ... ICANN officials also spent time on Capitol Hill this week, answering questions from congressional staffers. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4979 P - FRENCH GOV ENUM PROPOSAL ... to guarantee the consistency of ENUM domain names with E.164 numbers: "the best solution is to assign the responsibility of the ENUM domain to the current management body of the E.164 numbering system: the ITU." ENUM Chair replies, "there seems to be some trouble ... understanding the nature of e164.arpa." Ya think? CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4982 _______________notices from our sponsors_______________ QUESTIONS? PROBLEMS? 800 & Domain Name Acquisition Management, Lost/Stolen 800 # Retrieval, Litigation Support, Regulatory Navigation, Correlating Domain Name & Trademark Matters. http://www.roibot.com/w.cgi?R1764_Consultlink ____________________________________________________ Whether you are buying a home, drafting a will, filing bankruptcy, or involved in any type of legal matter, CaseMatch can help you find the right attorney. http://www.roibot.com/w.cgi?R1764_casematchlink ____________________________________________________ Afternic.com is your premier destination on the Web for aftermarket domain name sales, acquisition, and research. http://www.roibot.com/w.cgi?R1764_afterniclink ____________________________________________________ ABOUT ICB ICB HeadsUp Headlines Daily Email is sent by request. Subscriptions to Daily Email are free to qualified applicants. Visit http://www.roibot.com/w.cgi?R1764_ICBsignup to sign up. 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All rights reserved. ____________________________________________________ ------------------------------ Date: 12 Jan 2001 22:53:36 -0500 From: Monty Solomon Subject: French Netizens May Get Cheap, Unmetered Access French Netizens May Get Cheap, Unmetered Access By Kristi Essick France Telecom is opening the way for other European ISPs, which have been slow to follow the U.S. model. http://www.thestandard.com/article/display/0,1151,21455,00.html - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 12 Jan 2001 23:17:29 -0500 From: Monty Solomon Subject: The Feds'll Come A-Snoopin' The Feds'll Come A-Snoopin' by Declan McCullagh 2:00 a.m. Jan. 12, 2001 PST WASHINGTON -- Ever wonder how much leeway federal agents have when snooping through your e-mail or computer files? The short answer: a lot. The U.S. Department of Justice this week published new guidelines for police and prosecutors in cases involving computer crimes. http://www.wired.com/news/politics/0,1283,41133,00.html - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 12 Jan 2001 23:24:20 -0500 From: Monty Solomon Subject: Do You Even Know Who's Watching? Do You Even Know Who's Watching? BERLIN -- A Virtual Privacy Center, established in Germany as an outgrowth of a state privacy office, could be in the vanguard of an international effort to promote and protect privacy on the Internet. Marit Koehntopp, head of the state-run Independent Center for Privacy Protection in Kiel, Germany, said she hopes to attract participation from around the world on behalf of the common cause of educating citizens about their rights to control access to information about themselves. http://www.wired.com/news/politics/0,1283,40935,00.html - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ End of Telecom Digest V2000 #187 ******************************** Date: 14 Jan 2001 06:15:11 -0500 From: owner-telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org (Telecom Digest) To: telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org Subject: Telecom Digest V2000 #188 Telecom Digest Sunday, January 14 2001 Volume 2000 : Number 188 In this issue: Dutch Employers Can Monitor Employees' Online Activities Nader Wants International Body To Protect Consumers Online ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 13 Jan 2001 23:20:17 -0500 From: Monty Solomon Subject: Dutch Employers Can Monitor Employees' Online Activities Dutch Employers Can Monitor Employees' Online Activities Companies in the Netherlands now have the right to monitor their employees' online activities while at work, under a new ordinance that kicked in at the start of the month. http://www.newsbytes.com/news/01/160295.html - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 13 Jan 2001 23:21:24 -0500 From: Monty Solomon Subject: Nader Wants International Body To Protect Consumers Online Nader Wants International Body To Protect Consumers Online Largely in response to growing Internet privacy and security concerns, consumer activist and recent presidential candidate Ralph Nader is calling for the creation of an international consumer protection body with powers equaling those of the controversial World Trade Organization (WTO). http://www.newsbytes.com/news/01/160265.html - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ End of Telecom Digest V2000 #188 ******************************** Date: 15 Jan 2001 06:15:16 -0500 From: owner-telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org (Telecom Digest) To: telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org Subject: Telecom Digest V2000 #189 Telecom Digest Monday, January 15 2001 Volume 2000 : Number 189 In this issue: Re: Anti-Telemarketing Wish: a take me off your list button Re: Making all telemarketing illegal (was: Anti-TelemarketingWish: a take me off your list button) Re: Anti-Telemarketing Wish: a take me off your list button Re: Anti-Telemarketing Wish: a take me off your list button Re: Anti-Telemarketing Wish: a take me off your list button ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 14 Jan 2001 15:58:18 -0500 From: John David Galt Subject: Re: Anti-Telemarketing Wish: a take me off your list button "Adam H. Kerman" wrote: > John David Galt wrote: >> Ideally, all telemarketing should be limited by law to "opt-in" lists, and >> no business should be able to demand that you accept their marketing calls >> as a condition of doing business with them. >> >> Telemarketing, like spam, is nothing but a public nuisance. > Ah. Businesses should have no speech rights whatsoever. Not to unwilling people, or over a communication method that is FOR only messages desired by the recipient. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 14 Jan 2001 16:03:50 -0500 From: John David Galt Subject: Re: Making all telemarketing illegal (was: Anti-TelemarketingWish: a take me off your list button) Paul Hrisko wrote: > One of the reasons for the banning of 'robot calls' was that the machine > would seize the line and not release it until the end of the message, and > then sometimes not for a while after that even if you hung up the line. > Because this prevented outgoing calls, it was deemed detrimental to the > public good since 911 calls were effectively blocked until the machine > released the line. In my experience, most TM calls still do exactly this, even though the robot now puts a human on the line when you pick up. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 14 Jan 2001 20:10:43 -0500 From: Wes Leatherock Subject: Re: Anti-Telemarketing Wish: a take me off your list button On 14 Jan 2001 15:58:18 -0500 John David Galt wrote: > "Adam H. Kerman" wrote: > > John David Galt wrote: > > >> Ideally, all telemarketing should be limited by law to "opt-in" lists, and > >> no business should be able to demand that you accept their marketing calls > >> as a condition of doing business with them. > >> > >> Telemarketing, like spam, is nothing but a public nuisance. > > > Ah. Businesses should have no speech rights whatsoever. > > Not to unwilling people, or over a communication method that is FOR only > messages desired by the recipient. But how do you know in advance that the recipient is unwilling to receive a particular message, or that the message was not desired? Generally I hate all telemarketing calls, but a couple of weeks ago I got one that I particularly wanted to receive, although I did not know in advance that a call on that topic would be forthcoming. Wes Leatherock wleath@sandbox.dynip.com - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 14 Jan 2001 22:27:39 -0500 From: murray@pa.dec.com (Hal Murray) Subject: Re: Anti-Telemarketing Wish: a take me off your list button > But how do you know in advance that the recipient is unwilling > to receive a particular message, or that the message was not desired? > > Generally I hate all telemarketing calls, but a couple of weeks > ago I got one that I particularly wanted to receive, although I did > not know in advance that a call on that topic would be forthcoming. Do you read every advertisement in all the newspapers and magazines? Do you pay attention to every advertisement on the radio or TV? Think of all the good deals you are missing. I have no objections to your signing up to a spam-me telemarketing service if you want to - that changes things from unsolicited to solicited. What I am objecting to is that I can't get rid of all the telemarketers reasonably easily and inexpensively. Perhaps if the telemarketers didn't interrupt me I'd have more time to read the advertisements in magazines. :) - -- These are my opinions, not necessarily my employers. I hate spam. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 14 Jan 2001 23:03:17 -0500 From: "Adam H. Kerman" Subject: Re: Anti-Telemarketing Wish: a take me off your list button John David Galt wrote: >"Adam H. Kerman" wrote: >>John David Galt wrote: >>>Ideally, all telemarketing should be limited by law to "opt-in" lists, and >>>no business should be able to demand that you accept their marketing calls >>>as a condition of doing business with them. >>>Telemarketing, like spam, is nothing but a public nuisance. >>Ah. Businesses should have no speech rights whatsoever. >Not to unwilling people, or over a communication method that is FOR only >messages desired by the recipient. "Your mortgage is past due. Pay up or we foreclose and evict you." Your ideas are unusual. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ End of Telecom Digest V2000 #189 ******************************** Date: 16 Jan 2001 06:15:13 -0500 From: owner-telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org (Telecom Digest) To: telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org Subject: Telecom Digest V2000 #190 Telecom Digest Tuesday, January 16 2001 Volume 2000 : Number 190 In this issue: Settlement in MCI non-subscriber class action suit Re: Making all telemarketing illegal (was: ...a take me off your list button) REVIEW: "Netspionage: The Global Threat to Information", William Telecom Update (Canada) #266, January 15, 2001 Re: Anti-Telemarketing Wish: a take me off your list button Re: Anti-Telemarketing Wish: a take me off your list button Re: Nader Wants International Body To Protect Consumers Online Re: Making all telemarketing illegal (was: ...a take me off your list button) Re: Anti-Telemarketing Wish: a take me off your list button 1/15/01 ICBTollFreeNews.Com HEADS UP HEADLINES ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 15 Jan 2001 07:26:50 -0500 From: Nigel Allen Subject: Settlement in MCI non-subscriber class action suit Here is a press release from the law firm that represented MCI customers in recent class action litigation. I don't work for the law firm or WorldCom, but I thought that the press release would be of interest to readers of this digest. Girard & Green, LLP: MCI Reaches $88 Million Settlement for Non-Subscriber Telephone Rates Litigation EAST ST. LOUIS, Ill., Jan. 12 -- WorldCom, Inc., (formerly known as MCI WORLDCOM, Inc.) and Plaintiffs in the class action lawsuit known as In re MCI Non-Subscriber Telephone Rates Litigation have issued the following announcement: The parties in In re MCI Non-Subscriber Telephone Rates Litigation have reached a proposed settlement that establishes an $88 million settlement fund. Plaintiffs allege that MCI improperly charged some of its subscribers Non-Subscriber Rates And Surcharges (which were generally higher than subscriber rates) for Direct-Dialed long distance calls. (A domestic Direct-Dialed call is placed by dialing "1," plus the area code, plus the telephone number. An international Direct-Dialed call is placed by dialing "011," plus the country and city codes, plus the telephone number.) MCI denies the allegations, but has nevertheless decided to settle the case. The settlement will enable Class Members to get refunds of the amounts they overpaid as a result of being charged Non-Subscriber Rates And Surcharges rather than subscriber rates. If you were an MCI subscriber and paid Non-Subscriber Rates And Surcharges for Direct-Dialed long distance calls at any time from February 5, 1996 to October 15, 2000, you are a Class Member and can make a claim. -- By Internet: You can get more information and submit a claim at the Website http://www.rateclaims.com. At this Website, you can also view and print a more detailed legal notice and the claim form. -- By Telephone: You can also get more information by calling 800-967-9425 -- By written request: you can also obtain the detailed notice and the claim form by writing to the Claims Administrator at the following address: MCI Non-Subscriber Telephone Rates Litigation, P.O. Box 5053, Portland, OR, 97208 SOURCE Girard & Green, LLP Web Site: http://www.rateclaims.com - -- forwarded to the newsgroup by Nigel Allen http://www.ndallen.com/telecom.html - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 15 Jan 2001 10:36:38 -0500 From: Gary Novosielski Subject: Re: Making all telemarketing illegal (was: ...a take me off your list button) On 10 Jan 2001 08:33:02 -0500 Linc Madison wrote: >It is an attempt by the government to >prevent UNWANTED communication from one person to another person, which >is entirely legal and constitutional. It isn't prior restraint, because >it is content-neutral. It would be very problematic to ban calls from >aluminum siding salesmen while permitting calls from roofers, but there >is no problem at all in banning all unsolicited telemarketing calls -- >including political and charitable solicitations, by the way. Let me get this straight: according to this scenario, both houses of Congress pass, and the President signs into law, a bill making it illegal to solicit political campaign contributions by phone? Really? And this is going to happen when? ...and on what planet? Anyway, back on the original topic, there actually *is* a device available that adds a take-me-off-your-list button to your telephone. It retails for $12.95 from Mike Sandman . When you push the button, it seizes the line, plays a digitized audio message to the calling party, and goes on-hook. The male voice says "I'm sorry, this number does not accept this type of call. Please regard this as your notification to remove this number from your list. Thank you." - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 15 Jan 2001 11:17:29 -0500 From: "Rob Slade, doting grandpa of Ryan and Trevor" Subject: REVIEW: "Netspionage: The Global Threat to Information", William BKNTSPNG.RVW 20001120 "Netspionage: The Global Threat to Information", William Boni/Gerald L. Kovacich, 2000, 0-7506-7257-9 %A William Boni %A Gerald L. Kovacich www.shockwavewriters.com %C 225 Wildwood Street, Woburn, MA 01801 %D 2000 %G 0-7506-7257-9 %I Butterworth-Heinemann/CRC Press/Digital Press %O 800-366-BOOK fax 617-933-6333 800-446-6520 liz.mccarthy@repp.com %P 260 p. %T "Netspionage: The Global Threat to Information" In the preface, the authors state that this book is different from all the others because it points out that the Internet can make it easy and cheap to steal information. While this fact may be new to Boni and Kovacich, it shouldn't come as a big surprise to many other people. The preface also states that this text will teach you how to filch data from other people, and then closes by hoping that the work will ensure the security of Internet use. (We are also told that the book is based on seminars that the authors give, which probably explains a large number of illustrations that don't explain anything.) Part one seems to want to be a kind of historical perspective on the factors creating the current situation. Chapter one lets us in on the fact that lots of people are fighting with and spying on each other. Computers and high technology have been invented and are being used, according to chapter two. The analysis of the Internet's potential for criminal misuse, in chapter three, is slightly less simplistic, but fails to provide anything like a full picture. Chapter four is a rather mixed bag, stating that information is important, that there is a "new world order," and that e-business exists. A lot of space is devoted to definitions of espionage, and how it used to be done, in chapter five, but the book does finally start to mention some random points on data security at this point. Part two is probably supposed to be the "how to" section of the book. Chapter six dives back into the dictionaries but fails to give a solid definition of "competitive intelligence." The only actual examples of information gathering in chapter seven involve the use of phone books and trash, not the net. A few actual espionage tools, a number of useful tools that a spy might conceivably also want to use, and a lot of insistence that netspionage is possible makes up chapter eight. Chapter nine briefly describes some alleged and some prosecuted cases of espionage, but details are almost non-existent. Part three talks about protection against espionage. Chapter ten presents a very basic outline for starting discussion of data security issues. Chapter eleven goes slightly further in assessing risks and threats. The suggestion to undertake retaliation and vigilante action, tentatively though it is made in chapter twelve, is a really stupid idea. Not content with the usual short bit of blueskying, part four looks to the imaginary future. Chapters thirteen through seventeen take fanciful looks at the future of technology, business, espionage, government, and everything. This is yet another shrill voice crying in the marketplace and telling us what we already knew. It lacks detail, analysis, reality, and even an identifiable central theme. copyright Robert M. Slade, 2000 BKNTSPNG.RVW 20001120 ====================== (quote inserted randomly by Pegasus Mailer) rslade@vcn.bc.ca rslade@sprint.ca slade@victoria.tc.ca p1@canada.com What I need is a list of specific unknown problems we will encounter. - manager at Lykes Lines Shipping, from DNRC newsletter http://victoria.tc.ca/techrev or http://sun.soci.niu.edu/~rslade - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 15 Jan 2001 11:35:16 -0500 From: Angus TeleManagement Subject: Telecom Update (Canada) #266, January 15, 2001 ************************************************************ TELECOM UPDATE Angus TeleManagement's Weekly Telecom Newsbulletin http://www.angustel.ca Number 266: January 15, 2001 Publication of Telecom Update is made possible by generous financial support from: AT&T Canada ...................... http://www.attcanada.com/ Bell Canada ............................ http://www.bell.ca/ C1 Communications ......... http://www.c1communications.com/ Cisco Systems Canada ................. http://www.cisco.com/ Lucent Technologies Canada ........... http://www.lucent.ca/ Norigen ............................ http://www.norigen.com/ Sprint Canada .................. http://www.sprintcanada.ca/ ************************************************************ IN THIS ISSUE: ** Spectrum Auction Begins ** Bell Mobility Maps Drive for 3G ** Nortel Cutting 1,000 Jobs in Canada ** AOL, Time Warner Complete Merger ** Look Sells Share in Inukshuk ** Toronto 10-Digit Dialing Starts Smoothly ** Competition Bureau Okays Bell-Globe Deal ** Call-Net Takes 100% of DSL Venture ** Ottawa Names Broadband Task Force ** Stratos Takes Over BT Satellite Group ** General Affiliate Rule for All LECs ** IX Private Line Routes in Quebec Deregulated ** MTS Offers Text Chat With Customers ** Telenor to Take 36% of Wireless Matrix ** Telus Acquires Calgary Networking Business ** SiGem Purchasing UK Tracking Company ** JDS Buys Into Montreal Optics Firm ** Call Center Seminar Gives "Truly Essential Knowledge" ============================================================ SPECTRUM AUCTION BEGINS: Today, Industry Minister Brian Tobin opens Industry Canada's auction of additional PCS spectrum in the 2 GHz range. For running updates on auction results, go to http://strategis.ic.gc.ca/SSG/sf02076e.html. BELL MOBILITY MAPS DRIVE FOR 3G: On January 11, Bell Mobility announced several steps toward offering Third Generation wireless service: ** Bell's digital footprint in Ontario and Quebec will expand to match analog coverage by early 2002. ** Bell has completed a trial of an 1XRTT network, which transmits at up to 144 Kbps, and plans to roll out commercial service late this year. ** By March, Bell will offer plug-in PC cards from Sierra Wireless to link laptops to Bell's PCS network. ** Bell Mobility and PacketVideo are beginning a market trial of video services to wireless devices. NORTEL CUTTING 1,000 JOBS IN CANADA: Nortel Networks plans to cut 4,000 staff positions worldwide this year, including about 1,000 in Canada. Nortel says expansion in new lines of business will keep its total work force at approximately 95,000. AOL, TIME-WARNER COMPLETE MERGER: The U.S. Federal Communications Commission has approved the merger of AOL and Time-Warner. Among other conditions, the FCC ordered AOL-TW to ensure that other companies can connect to the next generation of instant messaging services. The Federal Trade Commission previously ruled that the merged operation must allow some competitors to use its cable TV facilities to provide high-speed Internet access. LOOK SELLS SHARE IN INUKSHUK: Microcell Telecom has agreed to buy Look Communications' 50% share of Inukshuk Internet for $150 Million. Inukshuk, which is not yet offering service, holds licenses to provide high-speed wireless Internet access in nine provinces. (See Telecom Update #264) TORONTO 10-DIGIT DIALING STARTS SMOOTHLY: One columnist predicted a consumer revolt, but it didn't happen. Bell Canada says that 75% to 80% of local calls placed in Toronto on the first day of the conversion to 10-digit local dialing used all 10 digits. Mandatory 10-digit local dialing begins March 5. COMPETITION BUREAU OKAYS BELL-GLOBE DEAL: On January 9, the Competition Bureau said it would not oppose the merger of Bell Canada and Thomson's media assets (see Telecom Update #250). Bell Globemedia was launched the same day with Ivan Fecan as CEO. CALL-NET TAKES 100% OF DSL VENTURE: Call-Net Enterprises has bought out its partner in business DSL networking, financially troubled NorthPoint Communications, for $8 Million. NorthPoint Canada is now a wholly-owned Call-Net subsidiary. OTTAWA NAMES BROADBAND TASK FORCE: Industry Minister Brian Tobin has appointed 35 people to the task force which is to advise the government on how to ensure universal availability of broadband Internet access by 2004. The list includes the CEOs of most of Canada's major telecom companies. ** When first announced in October, the Task Force was supposed to present a final report by March 31. (See Telecom Update #255) It is now aiming only to present "interim findings" by "late spring." http://www.broadband.gc.ca STRATOS TAKES OVER BT SATELLITE GROUP: Stratos Global Corporation says its acquisition of British Telecom's Aeronautical and Maritime Division makes it the second- largest Inmarsat services provider in the world. ** Stratos, which is 62% owned by Aliant, has named Carmen Lloyd as President and CEO, replacing Derek Woods, who continues as a Director and special consultant. GENERAL AFFILIATE RULE FOR ALL LECs: CRTC Order 2001-3 establishes that all local carriers -- both CLECs and ILECs - -- must ensure that affiliates reselling their local services provide equal access to long distance providers (see Telecom Update #229). This generalizes the rule established in 1999 for Microcell. http://www.crtc.gc.ca/archive/Orders/2001/O2001-3.htm IX PRIVATE LINE ROUTES IN QUEBEC DEREGULATED: Order 2001-2 deregulates Bell Canada's private line services on numerous Quebec routes, because there is sufficient competitive supply on those routes. http://www.crtc.gc.ca/archive/Orders/2001/O2001-2.htm MTS OFFERS TEXT CHAT WITH CUSTOMERS: Manitoba's telco says it is Canada's first telecom company to let its customers conduct Internet text chat with sales agents, using a dialogue box on the corporate Web site. TELENOR TO TAKE 36% OF WIRELESS MATRIX: Wireless data supplier Wireless Matrix of Calgary is buying Norcom Networks, a Virginia-based satellite data company, for shares worth about $150 Million. Norway's Telenor Mobile Communications, Norcom's majority shareholder, will own 36% of Wireless Matrix. TELUS ACQUIRES CALGARY NETWORKING BUSINESS: Telus has bought the data networking and facilities management business of Calgary-based NWD Systems. Twenty-eight NWD employees will join Telus. SIGEM PURCHASING UK TRACKING COMPANY: SiGem, an Ottawa-based supplier of GPS tracking, will roughly double its size by buying Auriga, which provides wireless fleet management to the UK taxi industry, for about $14 Million. (See Telecom Update #263) JDS BUYS INTO MONTREAL OPTICS FIRM: JDS Uniphase has taken a minority stake in Avantas Networks, a Montreal-based supplier of testing equipment for fibre optic networks. CALL CENTER SEMINAR GIVES "TRULY ESSENTIAL KNOWLEDGE": Participants are enthusiastic in praise of Angus Dortmans' on-site seminar, "Essential Skills and Knowledge for Effective Incoming Call Centre Management," led by Henry Dortmans. Among recent comments: ** "I learned a lot of invaluable information, more than I had expected. It was excellent and fun." ** "I really wished that I had attended this session when I first assumed my position in the call centre." ** "This course provides truly essential knowledge. I will recommend this to anyone in the call centre industry that I meet." For information, call 1-800-263-4415 ext 300 or go to Call Centre Seminars at http://www.angustel.ca/ ============================================================ HOW TO SUBMIT ITEMS FOR TELECOM UPDATE E-MAIL: editors@angustel.ca FAX: 905-686-2655 MAIL: TELECOM UPDATE Angus TeleManagement Group 8 Old Kingston Road Ajax, Ontario Canada L1T 2Z7 =========================================================== HOW TO SUBSCRIBE (OR UNSUBSCRIBE) TELECOM UPDATE is provided in electronic form only. There are two formats available: 1. The fully-formatted edition is posted on the World Wide Web on the first business day of the week at http://www.angustel.ca 2. The e-mail edition is distributed free of charge. To subscribe, send an e-mail message to: listmanager@subs.postmastergeneral.com Insert as the subject of your message the two words: subscribe TelecomUpdate To stop receiving the e-mail edition, send an e-mail message to: listmanager@subs.postmastergeneral.com Insert as the subject of your message the two words: unsubscribe TelecomUpdate =========================================================== COPYRIGHT AND DISCLAIMER: All contents copyright 2001 Angus TeleManagement Group Inc. All rights reserved. For further information, including permission to reprint or reproduce, please e-mail rosita@angustel.ca or phone 905-686-5050 ext 500. The information and data included has been obtained from sources which we believe to be reliable, but Angus TeleManagement makes no warranties or representations whatsoever regarding accuracy, completeness, or adequacy. Opinions expressed are based on interpretation of available information, and are subject to change. If expert advice on the subject matter is required, the services of a competent professional should be obtained. ============================================================ JOHN RIDDELL jriddell@angustel.ca Angus TeleManagement Group http://www.angustel.ca 8 Old Kingston Road Tel: 905-686-5050 x226 Ajax Ontario L1T 2Z7 Canada Fax: 905-686-2655 - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 15 Jan 2001 12:31:26 -0500 From: WD Baseley Subject: Re: Anti-Telemarketing Wish: a take me off your list button On 8 Jan 2001 18:37:11 -0500, "Gail M. Hall" stated: >We get so many of those idiotic recorded message telemarketing calls that I >wish there was such a thing on my phone as an automatic "take this number >off your list" button. Just about the worst offenders are telephone >companies. If you have a house like mine, with phones hither and thither, or if you don't want to be bothered at all - even to the extent of having to push a button - you might like something a bit more centralized and preemptive: http://www.prefonefilter.com/ Some local telcos offer a similar service for a monthly fee. (With a nod of thanks to junkbusters) more ideas and resources can be found here: http://www.junkbusters.com/ht/en/links.html#telemarketing >We should be able to get >"don't bother me" service for FREE. More to the point, IMHO: neither commercial advertisers, nor any other entity, must be allowed to subsidize their advertising costs via my telephone service subscription. Regards, WD Baseley - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 15 Jan 2001 13:05:30 -0500 From: art.shapiro@unisys.com (Arthur Shapiro) Subject: Re: Anti-Telemarketing Wish: a take me off your list button In article , WD Baseley wrote: > - -> If you have a house like mine, with phones hither and thither, or if you - -> don't want to be bothered at all - even to the extent of having to push - -> a button - you might like something a bit more centralized and - -> preemptive: - -> http://www.prefonefilter.com/ I took a look at this web site, and while it was quite impressive in appearance, the considerable number of spelling errors gave less than a professional impression. Do any readers have experience with this product? And is it some guy working out of his garage? My impression that the device, albeit potentially useful, was quite expensive for the functionality in question. Are there similar competitive products? Art Shapiro - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 15 Jan 2001 19:27:35 -0500 From: John McHarry Subject: Re: Nader Wants International Body To Protect Consumers Online On 13 Jan 2001 23:21:24 -0500, Monty Solomon wrote: >Nader Wants International Body To Protect Consumers Online > >Largely in response to growing Internet privacy and security >concerns, consumer activist and recent presidential candidate Ralph >Nader is calling for the creation of an international consumer >protection body with powers equaling those of the controversial World >Trade Organization (WTO). Would this have prevented his candidacy? - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 15 Jan 2001 20:38:49 -0500 From: "Gail M. Hall" Subject: Re: Making all telemarketing illegal (was: ...a take me off your list button) On 15 Jan 2001 10:36:38 -0500, in comp.dcom.telecom, you (Gary Novosielski ) wrote: >Anyway, back on the original topic, there actually *is* a device available >that adds a take-me-off-your-list button to your telephone. It retails for >$12.95 from Mike Sandman . When you >push the button, it seizes the line, plays a digitized audio message to the >calling party, and goes on-hook. The male voice says "I'm sorry, this >number does not accept this type of call. Please regard this as your >notification to remove this number from your list. Thank you." Actualy this device does NOT do what *I* wish for. I posted the original "wish" message. I'm not ready to make *all* telemarketing calls illegal. I simply want to make it easier for the called parties to get them to stop. *IF* there is a live human being on the line, then a recorded message played by this device or even one I read to the live human may be heared if they don't hang up first. If the caller is a recording, then the outgoing message will not be heard even if it is played by this device. In the case that I wish for, the button would send a signal to my phone company and to the machine that dialed the number or some central registry that both the phone company and the telemarketers all use to ask that my phone number be removed from their calling list. This would work better than an overall "don't-call-me" service because I could opt out selectively. As it is today, I have to pay extra money to the phone company to get the number from the calling machine/company. Caller ID is extra. The call filters offered by the phone company are yet another charge over and above caller ID. When you call the phone company to describe a problem, they kindly offer you this feature for extra money paid by the bothered customer every month. I say that if the phone company sells services to telemarket robots to call every number in their list, then the callers and not the called should be the ones to carry the burden in time and money, not the intended victims. Junk mailers pay for the postage and paper, not the recipients. I pick my mail when *I* am ready to pick it up, not when a bell rings. Also, if a "live" human does talk to me, I can ask that person to take my number off the list, but I have no guarantee that they will actually record that request. With a button that records my request for me, I would be assured to a little better extent that my request not to be bothered any more would be carried out because it is registered in a company database and is registered at my phone company. I found out the hard way that what you ask a telemarketer to do is not necessarily carried out. The university I graduated has used a telemarketing campaign to solicit contributions. One year they called, and I asked the person to send MORE INFORMATION, not that I wanted to make a pledge. Well, the person wrote me down as having pledged some money, and later I got a letter asking me to send in my pledge. I wrote back a strong letter saying that I not only did NOT tell the person I wanted to pledge money, but that I wanted to be taken off their phone list. That lasted one year. But then they sent me a letter saying that if I wanted my number to remain off their calling list, I would have to send in a form (at my expense, of course) saying I wanted to remain off their phone list. I am sorry to say that because of this type of unethical behavior on the part of their fund-raising section, I decided NOT to send any more contributions to the university. If they can't get their act together, then they can do without my contribution. What little I could send was probably going in to pay for their fund-raising campaign anyway and not for scholarships or for the actual educational facilities at the school. I did not pay for the postage to send in that form. In the past couple of years I have not received any more phone calls from them. I hope that means that they have decided not to have the phone campaigns any more. The chances are too great for the callers writing down incorrect information. By the same token, telemarketers cannot really be trusted to take your "no" for an answer and actually take your name off their list. I also think that if I hang up on a recording without letting the message play out, the robot should take my number off their calling list. I am actually more bothered by the recorded message telemarketing gizmos than I am by the human kind. I can at least talk to the live person, say no quickly or ask to be taken off the list, and hang up. But I have no way of telling a machine playing a recording to do that. As I said in my original message, I think that phone companies are some of the worst offenders when it comes to telemarketing. My phone company calls trying to sell me cable TV. My phone company calls to try to sell my wireless or cell phone service. I told that salesperson that if they would actually put their money into service the way the Ohio PUC told them to, they would be better off. If *I* decide to *shop* for cell phone service or wireless phone service or even a different cable TV service, I hope I can have a number to call and they will have people at the other end of the line that will be *prepared* to give me *accurate* information about their service and their rates. As it was, when my husband responded to an ad we got for cable TV service offered by our phone company by calling the number in the ad, it took him a good while to elicit the information about what their monthly charge would be after the introductory deal. Apparently the company does not put that information in a handy place for the sales rep. The rate turned out to be more than our current cable TV service. I'll bet their telemarketer employees wouldn't be told that information any more than that information was included in their mailed ad. Gail M. Hall - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 15 Jan 2001 22:53:51 -0500 From: catfood@apk.net (Mark W. Schumann) Subject: Re: Anti-Telemarketing Wish: a take me off your list button In article <1Eu86.7096$P5.625004@news1.rdc1.il.home.com>, Adam H. Kerman wrote: >John David Galt wrote: >>"Adam H. Kerman" wrote: >>>John David Galt wrote: > >>>>Ideally, all telemarketing should be limited by law to "opt-in" lists, and >>>>no business should be able to demand that you accept their marketing calls >>>>as a condition of doing business with them. > >>>>Telemarketing, like spam, is nothing but a public nuisance. > >>>Ah. Businesses should have no speech rights whatsoever. > >>Not to unwilling people, or over a communication method that is FOR only >>messages desired by the recipient. > >"Your mortgage is past due. Pay up or we foreclose and evict you." You agreed to receive those notices in clause NNN of your mortgage contract. Or didn't you read it? >Your ideas are unusual. Your faith in government is touching. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2001 23:16:56 -0500 From: "Judith Oppenheimer" Subject: 1/15/01 ICBTollFreeNews.Com HEADS UP HEADLINES ____________________________________________________ ICBTollFreeNews.Com HEADS UP HEADLINES ____________________________________________________ from ICB Toll Free News - Daily News and Intelligence covering the Political, Legal and Marketing Arenas of 800 and Dot Com. ____________________________________________________ CONTENTS - - RALPH LAUREN BACKS DOWN - - GEORGE W APPOINTS TRANSITIONAL ADVISORY TEAM ON FCC ISSUES - - EU PLEDGES MILLIONS TOWARD NEXT-GENERATION INTERNET - - REPORT REVEALS NEW TREND: GOVERNMENT OWNED TELEPHONY - - UPTON, NEW TELECOM CHM - - WHO IS ICANN *REALLY* INDEBTED TO? ___________________________________________________ ___________________________________________________ JUST 4 MORE HOURS !! ICB Premium Subscription SALE ends 12 am pst January 16. Subscribe Here: http://www.roibot.com/w.cgi?R1764_PREMIUM ___________________________________________________ ___________________________________________________ CUSTOMER SERVICE NOTES: With over 4,000 articles archived, ICB is a popular research destination. Find all ICB headlines: http://www.icbtollfree.com/icbheadlns.cfm, or use ICB's search engine: http://icbtollfree.com/Search.cfm. Note: Registration is required. Contact information is NOT sold, leased, rented or shared in any manner. ICB offers FREE classifieds: http://www.roibot.com/w.cgi?R1764_Classifieds ____________________________________________________ EVERY 3.6 SECONDS SOMEONE DIES FROM HUNGER http://www.hungersite.com/ ____________________________________________________ Reader Survey Shows: ICB 800, Domain & ENUM Reporting Yields Avid Readership (Our thanks to those of you who participated!) NEW YORK, ICB Toll Free News announced results of its December 2000 customer satisfaction survey: a loyal readership, high pass-along rate, and confirmation of the exclusivity of ICB's news and information. - -- 62% of respondents read ICB daily; - -- 56% share ICB news and articles with business associates; ... and a whopping 78% of respondents say ICB highlights news and issues they don't find published anywhere else. DETAILS: http://www.roibot.com/w.cgi?R1764_surveypress ____________________________________________________ ARTICLE ACCESS CODE LEGEND ICB Toll Free News offers two valuable service options: F = Free - News and Features articles P = Premium - Unlimited Site Access including all Articles and Documents. ____________________________________________________ HEADLINES for January 15, 2001 F - RALPH LAUREN BACKS DOWN Lawyers pointed out that polo is a traditional English game involving horses and therefore allowed him to use the domain name for the saddlery business. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4990 F - GEORGE W APPOINTS TRANSITIONAL ADVISORY TEAM ON FCC ISSUES CLEC, BOC, cable and wireless get seats at the table. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4989 P - EU PLEDGES MILLIONS TOWARD NEXT-GENERATION INTERNET The European Union will donate 9.8 million euros ($9.3 million) over three years toward the development by the European Laboratory for Particle Physics, CERN, of a successor to the World Wide Web, the Geneva-based body said Friday. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4988 P - REPORT REVEALS NEW TREND: GOVERNMENT OWNED TELEPHONY Over 200 state and local governments are operating telecommunications businesses of one form or another, with over 100 providing cable television service and others offering everything from Internet access to local telephony. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4987 F - UPTON, NEW TELECOM CHM Rep. Fred Upton (R) from Michigan has been selected as Chairman of the Subcommittee on Telecommunications by Billy Tauzin (R-LA), House Energy and Commerce Committee Chairman. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4986 F - WHO IS ICANN *REALLY* INDEBTED TO? The payment of $465,553.67 was made by ICANN's Executive Committee at a meeting that excluded at-large board members Auerbach and Mueller-Maguhn. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4985 _______________notices from our sponsors_______________ QUESTIONS? PROBLEMS? 800 & Domain Name Acquisition Management, Lost/Stolen 800 # Retrieval, Litigation Support, Regulatory Navigation, Correlating Domain Name & Trademark Matters. http://www.roibot.com/w.cgi?R1764_Consultlink ____________________________________________________ Whether you are buying a home, drafting a will, filing bankruptcy, or involved in any type of legal matter, CaseMatch can help you find the right attorney. http://www.roibot.com/w.cgi?R1764_casematchlink ____________________________________________________ Afternic.com is your premier destination on the Web for aftermarket domain name sales, acquisition, and research. http://www.roibot.com/w.cgi?R1764_afterniclink ____________________________________________________ ABOUT ICB ICB HeadsUp Headlines Daily Email is sent by request. Subscriptions to Daily Email are free to qualified applicants. Visit http://www.roibot.com/w.cgi?R1764_ICBsignup to sign up. Please feel free to pass along a copy to a friend, within reason so long as the message is not modified or used unfavorably. To unsubscribe mailto:editor@icbtollfree.com, subject: unsubscribe. (Unsubs are processed manually, approximately once a week.) ___________________________________________________ ADVERTISING For information on advertising in ICB HeadsUp Headlines, mailto:info@icbtollfree.com, subject line: ICB rate card. ____________________________________________________ Only subscribers or registered users of ICB Toll Free News web site will be able to access all or some of the full text of URLs provided. ____________________________________________________ Copyright © 2001 ICB, Inc. All rights reserved. ____________________________________________________ ------------------------------ End of Telecom Digest V2000 #190 ******************************** Date: 18 Jan 2001 06:15:22 -0500 From: owner-telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org (Telecom Digest) To: telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org Subject: Telecom Digest V2000 #191 Telecom Digest Thursday, January 18 2001 Volume 2000 : Number 191 In this issue: no reply needed to this... Re: Anti-Telemarketing Wish: a take me off your list button Mr Moore's Archives Question Study links mobile phone use with eye cancer 1/16/01 ICBTollFreeNews.Com HEADS UP HEADLINES Re: Making all telemarketing illegal (was: ...a take me off your list button) Re: Making all telemarketing illegal Re: Making all telemarketing illegal 1/17/01 ICBTollFreeNews.Com HEADS UP HEADLINES Chapter 11 and Layoffs for 2 DSL Providers Here's why you don't own a satellite phone Re: Making all telemarketing illegal ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 16 Jan 2001 09:37:50 -0500 From: Carl Moore Subject: no reply needed to this... ...unless you are the one taking action. I have found, that last year (2000): issue 48 is OK in the Subject header, but the other 2 references to the issue number have 47 when they should have 48 - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 16 Jan 2001 10:50:11 -0500 From: "Adam H. Kerman" Subject: Re: Anti-Telemarketing Wish: a take me off your list button Mark W. Schumann wrote: >Adam H. Kerman wrote: >>John David Galt wrote: >>>"Adam H. Kerman" wrote: >>>>John David Galt wrote: >>>>>Ideally, all telemarketing should be limited by law to "opt-in" lists, and >>>>>no business should be able to demand that you accept their marketing calls >>>>>as a condition of doing business with them. >>>>>Telemarketing, like spam, is nothing but a public nuisance. >>>>Ah. Businesses should have no speech rights whatsoever. >>>Not to unwilling people, or over a communication method that is FOR only >>>messages desired by the recipient. >>"Your mortgage is past due. Pay up or we foreclose and evict you." >You agreed to receive those notices in clause NNN of your mortgage >contract. Or didn't you read it? John has a strange notion that one needs only receive phone calls with messages one wishes to hear. That's an example of a message one might not wish to hear, yet the company may not be restricted from all collection efforts. >>Your ideas are unusual. >Your faith in government is touching. Well, that's an idiotic thing to say. Several folks in this thread are advocating a great deal more government interference. I'm not one of them. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 16 Jan 2001 16:49:54 -0500 From: James Bellaire Subject: Mr Moore's Archives Question It was 16 Jan 2001 09:37:50 -0500, and Carl Moore wrote in comp.dcom.telecom: Subject: no reply needed to this... | ...unless you are the one taking action. I have found, | that last year (2000): | | issue 48 is OK in the Subject header, but the other 2 | references to the issue number have 47 when they should | have 48 You are correct, in the volume 20 issues year 2000. It took a while to find the error as the volume 2000 issues were fine. James - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 16 Jan 2001 21:34:23 -0500 From: Monty Solomon Subject: Study links mobile phone use with eye cancer Study links mobile phone use with eye cancer by Rick Perera, IDG News Service\Berlin Bureau January 16, 2001, 07:48 A German study purports to find a statistically significant link between a rare form of eye cancer and mobile telephone use, but its authors say the topic still needs more research. http://www.idg.net/go.cgi?id=398733 - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 23:56:25 -0500 From: "Judith Oppenheimer" Subject: 1/16/01 ICBTollFreeNews.Com HEADS UP HEADLINES ____________________________________________________ ICBTollFreeNews.Com HEADS UP HEADLINES ____________________________________________________ from ICB Toll Free News - Daily News and Intelligence covering the Political, Legal and Marketing Arenas of 800 and Dot Com. ____________________________________________________ CONTENTS - - REGISTERING MULTILINGUAL DOMAINS? - - DEJA VU - - IS ROBERTS FEELING SOME HEAT? - - 7 NEW TLDS ON THE CAMPAIGN TRAIL ___________________________________________________ CUSTOMER SERVICE NOTES: With over 4,000 articles archived, ICB is a popular research destination. Find all ICB headlines: http://www.icbtollfree.com/icbheadlns.cfm, or use ICB's search engine: http://icbtollfree.com/Search.cfm. Note: Registration is required. Contact information is NOT sold, leased, rented or shared in any manner. ICB offers FREE classifieds: http://www.roibot.com/w.cgi?R1764_Classifieds ____________________________________________________ EVERY 3.6 SECONDS SOMEONE DIES FROM HUNGER http://www.hungersite.com/ ____________________________________________________ ARTICLE ACCESS CODE LEGEND ICB Toll Free News offers two valuable service options: F = Free - News and Features articles P = Premium - Unlimited Site Access including all Articles and Documents. ____________________________________________________ HEADLINES for January 16, 2001 P - REGISTERING MULTILINGUAL DOMAINS? Many domain registrars have armed themselves with the ability to cancel or transfer multilingual names by themselves, without using the UDRP. This modification was "advised" by the NSI Registry during the announcement of the Multi-lingual Testbed period. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4994 P - DEJA VU "The interim ICANN Board should return its attention to what should have been its main mission all along -- getting a real board elected, which could then put in place the more permanent institutional mechanisms that would lead to the development of real (not just declared) consensus." CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4993 F - IS ROBERTS FEELING SOME HEAT? "Every citizen on the Net feels they have been empowered to challenge what [ICANN does], and I think we should be able to get on with our jobs without organized undermining of what we're doing." CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4992 P - 7 NEW TLDS ON THE CAMPAIGN TRAIL Dot Biz' approach is interesting. What's new - NeuLevel - is indeed new - NeuStar, "the only FCC certified trusted third party," bulleting its North American Numbering "Registry" and Number Portability "Registry" as proof. Administrator, registry - what's the difference as long as they get the business. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4991 _______________notices from our sponsors_______________ For an unforgettable toll free vanity 800 number and matching domain name ... Response Marketing Group http://www.roibot.com/w.cgi?R1764_R800 ____________________________________________________ QUESTIONS? 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Please feel free to pass along a copy to a friend, within reason so long as the message is not modified or used unfavorably. To unsubscribe mailto:editor@icbtollfree.com, subject: unsubscribe. (Unsubs are processed manually, approximately once a week.) ___________________________________________________ ADVERTISING For information on advertising in ICB HeadsUp Headlines, mailto:info@icbtollfree.com, subject line: ICB rate card. ____________________________________________________ Only subscribers or registered users of ICB Toll Free News web site will be able to access all or some of the full text of URLs provided. ____________________________________________________ Copyright © 2001 ICB, Inc. All rights reserved. ____________________________________________________ ------------------------------ Date: 17 Jan 2001 13:30:40 -0500 From: Linc Madison Subject: Re: Making all telemarketing illegal (was: ...a take me off your list button) In article <5.0.2.1.0.20010114223612.00a1c410@mailbox.verizon.net>, Gary Novosielski wrote: > On 10 Jan 2001 08:33:02 -0500 Linc Madison wrote: > > >It is an attempt by the government to prevent UNWANTED communication > >from one person to another person, which is entirely legal and > >constitutional. It isn't prior restraint, because it is content- > >neutral. It would be very problematic to ban calls from aluminum > >siding salesmen while permitting calls from roofers, but there is no > >problem at all in banning all unsolicited telemarketing calls -- > >including political and charitable solicitations, by the way. > > Let me get this straight: according to this scenario, both houses of > Congress pass, and the President signs into law, a bill making it > illegal to solicit political campaign contributions by phone? > Really? And this is going to happen when? > > ...and on what planet? Hello? Yoo-hoo? That was exactly my *POINT*. My *POINT* is that there is no *LEGAL* obstruction to passing such a law, only *POLITICAL*. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 17 Jan 2001 17:20:05 -0500 From: "Adam H. Kerman" Subject: Re: Making all telemarketing illegal Linc Madison wrote: >My *POINT* is that there is no *LEGAL* obstruction to passing such a >law, only *POLITICAL*. What part of "Congress shall make no law . . . " eludes you? - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 17 Jan 2001 23:13:55 -0500 From: John David Galt Subject: Re: Making all telemarketing illegal "Adam H. Kerman" wrote: > Linc Madison wrote: >> My *POINT* is that there is no *LEGAL* obstruction to passing such a >> law, only *POLITICAL*. > What part of "Congress shall make no law . . . " eludes you? The part that says your freedom of speech extends onto phone lines that your unwilling listeners are paying for. Somehow, I can't find that in my copy of the Bill of Rights. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 00:09:17 -0500 From: "Judith Oppenheimer" Subject: 1/17/01 ICBTollFreeNews.Com HEADS UP HEADLINES ____________________________________________________ ICBTollFreeNews.Com HEADS UP HEADLINES ____________________________________________________ from ICB Toll Free News - Daily News and Intelligence covering the Political, Legal and Marketing Arenas of 800 and Dot Com. ____________________________________________________ CONTENTS - - COMMERCE PETITIONED FOR PUBLIC HEARINGS ON NEW TLD'S - - NETWORD PARTNERS WITH TECH TV - - 800 TECH TALK - - 500, 555 AND 900 UPDATE - - WHAT IS WRONG WITH ICANN? ___________________________________________________ CUSTOMER SERVICE NOTES: With over 4,000 articles archived, ICB is a popular research destination. Find all ICB headlines: http://www.icbtollfree.com/icbheadlns.cfm, or use ICB's search engine: http://icbtollfree.com/Search.cfm. Note: Registration is required. Contact information is NOT sold, leased, rented or shared in any manner. ICB offers FREE classifieds: http://www.roibot.com/w.cgi?R1764_Classifieds ____________________________________________________ EVERY 3.6 SECONDS SOMEONE DIES FROM HUNGER http://www.hungersite.com/ ____________________________________________________ ARTICLE ACCESS CODE LEGEND ICB Toll Free News offers two valuable service options: F = Free - News and Features articles P = Premium - Unlimited Site Access including all Articles and Documents. ____________________________________________________ HEADLINES for January 17, 2001 F - COMMERCE PETITIONED FOR PUBLIC HEARINGS ON NEW TLD'S A thorough, thoughtful and spot-on communications, "...we believe that the Administrative Procedure Act (APA) applies ... [and] that the processes used by ICANN to choose this particular group of seven registry operators, this particular group of seven gTLDs, and the particular conditions that will be imposed on users of these new gTLDs, were all woefully inadequate by any measure. " CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4995 F - NETWORD PARTNERS WITH TECH TV Viewers will be able to use Networds to reach TechTV online content and TechTV will promote those Networds on its cable network. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4999 P - 800 TECH TALK NANPA (still Bellcore at the time) and the various industry forums didn't like the idea of an "officially unassigned" NANP code/numbering resource being adopted without being cleared thru NANPA. Thus, the creation of 880 (and later 881, and 882). CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4998 P - 500, 555 AND 900 UPDATE The NANPA audits and reclaims, while LECs' missing access tariffs and interconnection agreements keep thousands of assigned numbers from being implemented. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4997 F - WHAT IS WRONG WITH ICANN? Should a U.S. administrative agency be allowed to "create" a private corporation, and grant it sufficient control over a government resource to make policy decisions that the agency cannot, or will not, make itself? CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=4996 _______________notices from our sponsors_______________ For an unforgettable toll free vanity 800 number and matching domain name ... Response Marketing Group http://www.roibot.com/w.cgi?R1764_R800 ____________________________________________________ QUESTIONS? PROBLEMS? 800 / Domain / ENUM Strategy, Lost/Stolen 800 # Retrieval, Litigation Support, Regulatory Navigation, Correlating Domain Name & Trademark Matters. http://www.roibot.com/w.cgi?R1764_Consultlink ____________________________________________________ Whether you are buying a home, drafting a will, filing bankruptcy, or involved in any type of legal matter, CaseMatch can help you find the right attorney. http://www.roibot.com/w.cgi?R1764_casematchlink ____________________________________________________ Afternic.com is your premier destination on the Web for aftermarket domain name sales, acquisition, and research. http://www.roibot.com/w.cgi?R1764_afterniclink ____________________________________________________ ABOUT ICB ICB HeadsUp Headlines Daily Email is sent by request. Subscriptions to Daily Email are free to qualified applicants. Visit http://www.roibot.com/w.cgi?R1764_ICBsignup to sign up. Please feel free to pass along a copy to a friend, within reason so long as the message is not modified or used unfavorably. To unsubscribe mailto:editor@icbtollfree.com, subject: unsubscribe. (Unsubs are processed manually, approximately once a week.) ___________________________________________________ ADVERTISING For information on advertising in ICB HeadsUp Headlines, mailto:info@icbtollfree.com, subject line: ICB rate card. ____________________________________________________ Only subscribers or registered users of ICB Toll Free News web site will be able to access all or some of the full text of URLs provided. ____________________________________________________ Copyright © 2001 ICB, Inc. All rights reserved. ____________________________________________________ ------------------------------ Date: 18 Jan 2001 00:37:24 -0500 From: Monty Solomon Subject: Chapter 11 and Layoffs for 2 DSL Providers Chapter 11 and Layoffs for 2 DSL Providers NorthPoint files for bankruptcy protection, and Rhythms NetConnections lays off a quarter of its staff - the latest in a series of troubles to beset the beleaguered DSL-wholesaling industry. http://www.thestandard.com/article/display/0,1151,21516,00.html - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 18 Jan 2001 00:40:22 -0500 From: Monty Solomon Subject: Here's why you don't own a satellite phone Here's why you don't own a satellite phone http://www.upside.com/Rex_Crum/3a64e0581.html - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 18 Jan 2001 01:52:04 -0500 From: "Adam H. Kerman" Subject: Re: Making all telemarketing illegal John David Galt wrote: >"Adam H. Kerman" wrote: >>Linc Madison wrote: >>>My *POINT* is that there is no *LEGAL* obstruction to passing such a >>>law, only *POLITICAL*. >>What part of "Congress shall make no law . . . " eludes you? >The part that says your freedom of speech extends onto phone lines that >your unwilling listeners are paying for. Somehow, I can't find that in >my copy of the Bill of Rights. You have not paid for any type of call screening service; that requires a secretary. Your rights not to receive unwanted calls are not so superior to a businessman's rights to telephone you that he can be prevented from doing so under all circumstances. Ever hear of equal protection? That's also in the Constitution. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ End of Telecom Digest V2000 #191 ******************************** Date: 19 Jan 2001 06:15:14 -0500 From: owner-telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org (Telecom Digest) To: telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org Subject: Telecom Digest V2000 #192 Telecom Digest Friday, January 19 2001 Volume 2000 : Number 192 In this issue: CNG detection code calling tone detection subroutine Calling tone detection subroutine? CNG detection shareware Signals of Cell Phones Motorola FW: ICRC is looking for Field Information Systems (IS) Technician s Re: Call recording on a PC In earthquake crisis, desperate Salvadorans relying on cellphones HotMail blocking users from emailing Peacefire 1/18/01 ICBTollFreeNews.Com HEADS UP HEADLINES Re: HotMail blocking users from emailing Peacefire Re: HotMail blocking users from emailing Peacefire ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 18 Jan 2001 10:15:19 -0500 From: yun_zhang@my-deja.com Subject: CNG detection code I am looking for calling tone detection code(freeware/shareware) for ADI21xx DSP. Please let me know if you have any information. Thank. Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 18 Jan 2001 10:15:21 -0500 From: yun_zhang@my-deja.com Subject: calling tone detection subroutine I am looking for a calling tone (CNG) detection rountine (assembly source code) for ADI21xx dsp. Please let me know if you have information. Thanks. Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 18 Jan 2001 10:15:20 -0500 From: yun_zhang@my-deja.com Subject: Calling tone detection subroutine? I am looking for calling tone (CNG) detection subroutine (free assembly source code) for ADI 21xx DSP. Please let me know if you have information. Thanks. Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 18 Jan 2001 10:15:22 -0500 From: yun_zhang@my-deja.com Subject: CNG detection shareware I am looking for CNG(calling tone) detection shareware in ADI21xx assembly. Please let me know if you know. Thanks. Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 18 Jan 2001 10:34:28 -0500 From: "Mauricio Pennini" Subject: Signals of Cell Phones Motorola Dear Patrick: I read your document about Programing Motorola Phones!!! Really, you made a excellent work! I need information about signals sent and received for Cell Phone, I see a pulse train, but I haven't necessary equipment for to read all!! If you know where I can get this information, pls, if possible, it will send me!! Best regards Mauricio Pennini ARGENTINA TE: +5411-4709-0433 FAX: +5411-4709-1483 Cel: +5411-15-4473-9912 Mail: mpennini@suprecell.com.ar - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 18 Jan 2001 12:28:01 -0500 From: Lowe Chris Subject: FW: ICRC is looking for Field Information Systems (IS) Technician s For the list. > -----Original Message----- > From: Rolf Sommerhalder [mailto:rs@ife.ee.ethz.ch] > Sent: Thursday, January 18, 2001 8:56 AM > To: Emergency Telecoms List > Subject: ICRC is looking for Field Information Systems (IS) > Technicians > > > Dear colleagues > > the IT division of the ICRC is looking for IS Technicians for > assignments to delegations in the field (world-wide). You can be a > "beginner" or an "old hand", but should have in any case a solid > background in IS, which has two major pillars within ICRC: supporting > computer (LAN/WAN) and telecoms (notably radio) > installations. We have > several open positions over the next few months. Your entry can be > immediate or scheduled for later, but I encourage you to apply as soon > as possible anyway. We are looking for individuals who will stay with > the organization for several years if possible. Even if the initial > contract is limited to one or two years, and then renewed to become > open ended. > > Please note that these openings are for positions in the field, and > not at the Geneva headquarters. Check out http://www.icrc.org/eng/jobs > to see where we operate. > > For all inquires, please contact our Human Ressources division at the > address given below. Thank you. > > Regards from Geneva, > Rolf > > > Your task > > The ICRC's information systems technicians install, maintain and > supervise the operation of HF and VHF stations, fixed and mobile > satellite ground stations and the entire IT infrastructure of > delegations, sub-delegations and local offices. In addition to > carrying out installation work, they maintain equipment, supervise > traffic, select and train local technicians and operators and carry > out all related administration such as contacts and negotiations > with local suppliers and authorities. > > Your profile > > - strongly motivated by humanitarian work > - responsible and possessing sound judgement > - capable of working in a team > - able to and interested in training and supervising others > - able to work under pressure in a dangerous environment > > What we offer > > - an opportunity to practise your profession in a setting of > humanitarian endeavour > - a multicultural working environment > - a five-week course at our headquarters in Switzerland prior to > posting abroad > - opportunities for in-house, in-service training > - assistance with career reorientation > > Selection requirements > > - ideal age: 25 to 35 > - single > - post-secondary qualification or recognized certificate in > the electrical/electronics field > - sound theoretical and practical knowledge of radio communication > - WAN/LAN experience would be an advantage > - sound knowledge of IT (Windows 9x, Windows NT, etc.) > - excellent command of French and English > - driving licence (must cover manual transmission a licence for > automatic-transmission vehicles only is not sufficient) > > How to Apply > > Please submit your application (including CV, copies of diplomas and > work certificates and testimonials and a recent photo) to the > following address: > > INTERNATIONAL COMMITTEE OF THE RED CROSS > Recruitment Division > 19, avenue de la Paix > CH 1202 Genève > Switzerland > > > Votre tâche > > Installation, maintenance et supervision des stations HF et VHF, des > satellites fixes et mobiles ainsi que de toute l'infrastructure > informatique des délégations, sous-délégations et bureaux. En plus de > l'installation, les techniciens SI assument les responsabilités telles > que l'entretien des installations, la supervision des transmissions, > la sélection et la formation des techniciens et opérateurs nationaux > ainsi que toute la partie administrative attenante (négociations et > contacts avec fournisseurs et autorités locales). > > Votre profil > > - solide motivation humanitaire > - sens des responsabilités et du discernement > - aptitude à travailler en équipe > - aptitude et intérêt pour l'encadrement et la formation > - prêt à travailler sous pression et dans des conditions de sécurité > difficiles > > Nous vous offrons > > - la possibilité d'exercer votre métier dans un environnement > humanitaire > - l'occasion de vivre dans un milieu pluriculturel > - une formation de 5 semaines au siège de notre institution avant le > départ sur le terrain > - la possibilité de suivre une formation continue interne > - une aide à la réorientation professionnelle > > Critères d'engagement > > - âge idéal entre 25 et 35 ans > - célibataire > - école technique supérieure ou certificat de capacité dans une > branche électrotechnique > - bonnes connaissances théoriques et pratiques en radiocommunications > - connaissance des réseaux informatiques WAN et LAN un atout > - solides connaissances dans le domaine informatique (Windows, > Windows NT, etc.) > - excellente maîtrise du français et de l'anglais > - permis de conduire (permis automatique insuffisant) > > Travailler pour le CICR > > Veuillez nous adresser un dossier complet > avec curriculum vitae, copies de diplômes et certificats de travail > ainsi qu'une photographie récente, à l'adresse suivante: > > COMITE INTERNATIONAL DE LA CROIX-ROUGE > > Division du recrutement > av. de la Paix 19 > CH 1202 Genève > Suisse > - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 18 Jan 2001 14:51:13 -0500 From: Jay E eNn eNn Subject: Re: Call recording on a PC alain arnaud wrote: > > I am looking for a hardware pc card and software to record phone calls > automatically. I know of a box called a softcall recorder that hooks up > to sound card and the joystick card, but I what I would like would be an > internal PC card. > > I will leave the PC on all the time, with the software running in the > background and calls would be recorded automatically on the hard disk. > > Alternatively is there any software that will do the same with one of the > voice modems. > > Please reply to arnaud@ecla.com. > > Alain Arnaud doesnt record calls automatically, but will record your telephone calls using a voice modem. when the phoen rings, a prompt pops up asking if you want to record the call. just an alternative to look into jenn - -- the web page you have reached http://www.twpyhr.com hundreds of telephone sounds and recordings, telephone graphics, the unofficial touch tone tunes faq, the phony dance, scans and more! - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 18 Jan 2001 18:43:57 -0500 From: "Michael A. Desmon" Subject: In earthquake crisis, desperate Salvadorans relying on cellphones In earthquake crisis, desperate Salvadorans relying on cellphones http://www.boston.com/dailyglobe2/018/nation/In_earthquake_crisis_desperate_Salvadorans_relying_on_cellphones+.shtml - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 18 Jan 2001 21:41:22 -0500 From: Bennett Haselton Subject: HotMail blocking users from emailing Peacefire [sent to journalists on Peacefire's press contacts list] We recently discovered that for the last five months, HotMail has been blocking their users from sending email to peacefire.org addresses. If you tried to send mail to a peacefire.org address from HotMail, you'd get a fake error message a day later saying that there was a problem on the recipient's end -- when it was really HotMail blocking the message from being delivered. HotMail is part of the same boycott that AboveNet was part of, when AboveNet was blocking their downstream users from accessing our Web site. After our ISP owner complained, HotMail stopped blocking their users from emailing us and other Media3 customers. HotMail is still, however, blocking their users from emailing other sites on their "boycott list". I've talked to several of our members who are using HotMail, and most of them are furious that HotMail would be censoring their outgoing mail without telling them. Again, the irony is that HotMail didn't single us out for anything, we just happened to be in the same IP address block as other sites that were the original target of the boycott (e.g. ListSorcerer.com). When our ISP, Media3, didn't kick them off, the boycott organizers expanded the "boycott list" to include hundreds of unrelated sites also hosted by Media3. Several HotMail members that I talked to, have said they would be willing to talk to the press about HotMail blocking their outgoing mail. Many of them said they never would have signed up with HotMail if they knew their mail would be blocked, and some have even said that they're going to switch to another mail service. (Especially since HotMail is *still* blocking outgoing mail -- it was just our IP address block that they exempted from the list.) -Bennett bennett@peacefire.org http://www.peacefire.org (425) 649 9024 - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 23:19:12 -0500 From: "Judith Oppenheimer" Subject: 1/18/01 ICBTollFreeNews.Com HEADS UP HEADLINES ____________________________________________________ ICBTollFreeNews.Com HEADS UP HEADLINES ____________________________________________________ from ICB Toll Free News - Daily News and Intelligence covering the Political, Legal and Marketing Arenas of 800 and Dot Com. ____________________________________________________ CONTENTS - - DOT BIZ GOES TO WASHINGTON - - SEX.COM WORTH 154M? - - NEW .BZ ON BELIZE .BIZ - - DEUTSCHE WELLE DW.COM-JACK FAILS, CITED FOR ABUSE ___________________________________________________ CUSTOMER SERVICE NOTES: With over 5,000 articles archived, ICB is a popular research destination. Find all ICB headlines: http://www.icbtollfree.com/icbheadlns.cfm, or use ICB's search engine: http://icbtollfree.com/Search.cfm. Note: Registration is required. Contact information is NOT sold, leased, rented or shared in any manner. ICB offers FREE classifieds: http://www.roibot.com/w.cgi?R1764_Classifieds ____________________________________________________ EVERY 3.6 SECONDS SOMEONE DIES FROM HUNGER http://www.hungersite.com/ ____________________________________________________ ARTICLE ACCESS CODE LEGEND ICB Toll Free News offers two valuable service options: F = Free - News and Features articles P = Premium - Unlimited Site Access including all Articles and Documents. ____________________________________________________ HEADLINES for January 18, 2001 P - DOT BIZ GOES TO WASHINGTON So-called alternative roots have functioned peacefully and productively for years by following a simple, practical policy: someone may enter a new TLD into the root, if that TLD does not already exist in any of the roots. And all of the alternative roots carry each others' TLDs as well as ICANN's com/net/org, so that no matter where you point your computer, you land up in the same place. All, that is, except for ICANN, which carries only the TLDs it governs. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=5003 F - SEX.COM WORTH 154M? "Sex is the most searched-after word on the Internet," he said, calling the site "a licence to print money". CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=5002 P - NEW .BZ ON BELIZE .BIZ ICANN's criteria for assessing TLD proposals clearly state that gTLDs that would cause confusion with existing TLDs having similar pronunciations or meanings should be avoided. The creation of a new .biz registry clearly amounts to the creation of a new TLD that is matching in pronunciation and meaning to the present .bz TLD assigned to the country of Belize. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=5000 P - DEUTSCHE WELLE DW.COM-JACK FAILS, CITED FOR ABUSE "It is unfortunate that the domain resolution policy doesn't provide for penalties against abusers like Deutsche Welle," said intellectual property attorney John Berryhill, who represents DiamondWare in this dispute. "DiamondWare has been forced to defend itself against the German government, on the basis of a complaint that has no merit. A court of law would have been able to order sanctions for bringing a frivolous lawsuit." CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=5001 _______________notices from our sponsors_______________ For an unforgettable toll free vanity 800 number and matching domain name ... Response Marketing Group http://www.roibot.com/w.cgi?R1764_R800 ____________________________________________________ QUESTIONS? 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All rights reserved. ____________________________________________________ ------------------------------ Date: 19 Jan 2001 05:51:40 -0500 From: tbetz@panix.com (Tom Betz) Subject: Re: HotMail blocking users from emailing Peacefire [ Cc:ed to Bennett by direct e-mail ] Quoth Bennett Haselton in <200101182156.f0ILu8d17903@jessica.iain.com>: |[sent to journalists on Peacefire's press contacts list] | |We recently discovered that for the last five months, HotMail has been |blocking their users from sending email to peacefire.org addresses. Big deal. Media3's been doing that forever. When Steve Linford of Spamhaus.org tried to send you e-mail, Media3 blocked it. You never complained about that. Why the heck do you stay there, Bennett? You've been offered several free hosting deals by people who don't host spammers, and won't stick Peacefire.org in already-RBLed netblocks. Why do you keep Peacefire.org stuck in the middle of that nest of spammers and spamware vendors? Is Media3 subsidizing your organization? Or are you just a masochist? - -- |I always wanted to be someone,| Tom Betz, Generalist | |but now I think I should have | Want to send me email? FIRST, READ THIS PAGE: | |been a wee bit more specific. | | | "Fuck NANAE." -- Paul Vixie | YO! MY EMAIL ADDRESS IS HEAVILY SPAM-ARMORED! | - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 19 Jan 2001 05:59:39 -0500 From: Terry Kennedy Subject: Re: HotMail blocking users from emailing Peacefire Bennett Haselton writes: > HotMail is part of the same boycott that AboveNet was part of, when > AboveNet was blocking their downstream users from accessing our Web site. > After our ISP owner complained, HotMail stopped blocking their users from > emailing us and other Media3 customers. After a while, once you discover that the behavior of your neighbors makes like intolerable for you, you decide to move (often selling your house at a loss to get away). In this case, you've had offers of free hosting from others, and yet other people have asked you pointed questions about your prior knowledge of being moved into the netblock in question, as well as whether you've asked to be moved back out, along with your ISP's responses. None of that seems to have generated any responses from you. So, until you provide some more info, please quit whining. You're well on your way to losing all credibility with me. Terry Kennedy http://www.tmk.com terry@tmk.com Jersey City, NJ USA - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ End of Telecom Digest V2000 #192 ******************************** Date: 20 Jan 2001 06:15:10 -0500 From: owner-telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org (Telecom Digest) To: telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org Subject: Telecom Digest V2000 #193 Telecom Digest Saturday, January 20 2001 Volume 2000 : Number 193 In this issue: 3G crypto algorithms Lucent to Seek Buyers for Plants; 8,400 Jobs at Stake Family.org quotes page booted by Tripod as "hate speech" re: HotMail blocking users from emailing Peacefire 1/19/01 ICBTollFreeNews.Com HEADS UP HEADLINES Cell Phone Suit Will Get Its Day in Court Re: Family.org quotes page booted by Tripod as "hate speech" ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 19 Jan 2001 14:10:31 -0500 From: janos@research.att.com (Janos A. Csirik) Subject: 3G crypto algorithms In contrast with GSM, the 3GPP organisation (responsible for 3G wireless phone standards) is making all of its documents public. However, the way in which these documents are made public is unlikely to result in immediate gratification for those who would just like to go in and look at the crypto algorithms. For that reason, I have undertaken to construct a Web page to help cryptographers learn about and study the crypto algorithms for 3G wireless phones. I believe that the algorithms will receive much more and better scrutiny if it is easy to find them (and other 3G documents that are relevant to them). This page can be found at http://www.research.att.com/~janos/3gpp.html Thank you for your attention! Janos A. Csirik. - -- Janos A. Csirik, Mathematics & Cryptography, AT&T Labs - Research - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 19 Jan 2001 18:55:17 -0500 From: The Old Bear Subject: Lucent to Seek Buyers for Plants; 8,400 Jobs at Stake As reported by Bloomberg business news for January 18, 2001: Lucent to Seek Buyers for Plants; 8,400 Jobs at Stake ----------------------------------------------------- Murray Hill, New Jersey: Lucent Technologies Inc., the biggest maker of phone equipment, said it plans to seek buyers for two of its four U.S. factories in the next six months to cut costs by contracting out manufacturing. The plants in Oklahoma City and Columbus, Ohio, together have 8,400 employees making traditional phone switches and wireless equipment. Lucent can't predict how many positions may be lost until sale negotiations are completed in about six months, spokeswoman Mary Ward said. "We very probably will be working for another employer," said Michael Quinlan of the International Brotherhood of Electrical Workers, which represents 6,400 workers in Columbus and Oklahoma City. "Lucent wants out of manufacturing." Lucent has been slower than many rivals to pull out of manufacturing and focus on equipment design and development. Last year, Nortel Networks Corp. sold four factories to Solectron Corp. for $900 million, and Flextronics International Ltd. paid $100 million for Cabletron Systems Inc.'s manufacturing and repair operations. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 19 Jan 2001 21:48:35 -0500 From: Bennett Haselton Subject: Family.org quotes page booted by Tripod as "hate speech" [sent to journalists on Peacefire's press contacts list] Interesting side note: A few months ago, we anonymously created a page at http://members.tripod.com/bryan_cody/ (That page just got shut down, but you can view the local mirror at http://peacefire.org/BaitAndSwitch/bryan_cody/ .) The page consisted entirely of anti-gay quotes taken from Focus on the Family's site at Family.org, but without the attributions (i.e. it was made to look like the page owner was the author of the quotes). We submitted the page for "review" to SurfWatch, Cyber Patrol, Net Nanny, WebSENSE, SmartFilter, and Bess. These companies all agreed to block the page as a "hate site", since these companies' criteria for "hate speech" generally include speech that advocates discrimination based on "race, gender, or sexual orientation". Then we revealed to them that we had created the page, and that the quotes all came from Focus on the Family's site, and asked if they were going to block Family.org as a "hate site" as well. (None of them did.) Now it seems that someone has reported the http://members.tripod.com/bryan_cody/ page to Tripod, and they shut it down for violating their terms of service. I assume this refers to the terms at http://www.lycos.com/lycosinc/legal.html#Prohibited where "Prohibited Conduct" includes posting content that is "racially, sexually, ethnically or otherwise objectionable". Tripod determined that a page consisting of nothing but quotes from Focus on the Family, was "hate speech". The irony here is that I would agree with Tripod about the content -- the content on the page certainly does qualify as "hate speech". I don't mind at all that they shut the page down, since it helps us make our point :) The question is why the blocking software companies -- which already agreed to block http://members.tripod.com/bryan_cody/ -- won't block Family.org for the same reason. Peacefire is against blocking such pages anyway, but only because we're against blocking Web pages in general. The content on the page does clearly meet the criteria for "hate speech" as defined by Cyber Patrol, SurfWatch, and the other blocking companies. The page describing our original project, in which we created the "bait" pages and submitted them to the blocking companies for review, and then told them where the quotes really came from, is: http://www.peacefire.org/BaitAndSwitch/ This page: http://peacefire.org/BaitAndSwitch/attributions.html#fotf lists the quotes on the page and the different Family.org URL's where the quotes came from. The definitions of "hate speech" published by the different blocking software companies, are at: http://peacefire.org/BaitAndSwitch/definitions.html -Bennett bennett@peacefire.org http://www.peacefire.org (425) 649 9024 - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 19 Jan 2001 21:49:17 -0500 From: Dave Anderson Subject: re: HotMail blocking users from emailing Peacefire On 18 Jan 2001 21:41:22 -0500, Bennett Haselton wrote: >[sent to journalists on Peacefire's press contacts list] > >We recently discovered that for the last five months, HotMail has been >blocking their users from sending email to peacefire.org addresses. If you >tried to send mail to a peacefire.org address from HotMail, you'd get a >fake error message a day later saying that there was a problem on the >recipient's end -- when it was really HotMail blocking the message from >being delivered. [snipped remainder of rant very similar to one he posted a few weeks ago] By repeating essentially unchanged an already thoroughly debunked message, you've now totally destroyed any shreds of credibility you (and, by extension, Peacefire) still had. This is a shame, since I strongly agree with Peacefire's claimed goals--but I can no longer trust anything that the organization says. Dave - -- Dave Anderson - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2001 22:46:02 -0500 From: "Judith Oppenheimer" Subject: 1/19/01 ICBTollFreeNews.Com HEADS UP HEADLINES ____________________________________________________ ICBTollFreeNews.Com HEADS UP HEADLINES ____________________________________________________ from ICB Toll Free News - Daily News and Intelligence covering the Political, Legal and Marketing Arenas of 800 and Dot Com. ____________________________________________________ CONTENTS - - NTIA WRITES ITS OWN REPORT CARD - - SPEC OUT AUDITS FOR WHICH FCC RULES? - - USPTO TO CONGRESS: LEAVE SQUAT LAWS TO WIPO - - THE NEXT ICANN CEO ...? - - NEW CEO, AT LARGE, ON ICANN BOARD AGENDA ___________________________________________________ EVERY 3.6 SECONDS SOMEONE DIES FROM HUNGER http://www.hungersite.com/ ____________________________________________________ ARTICLE ACCESS CODE LEGEND ICB Toll Free News offers two valuable service options: F = Free - News and Features articles P = Premium - Unlimited Site Access including all Articles and Documents. ____________________________________________________ HEADLINES for January 19, 2001 F - NTIA WRITES ITS OWN REPORT CARD ...and (gasp) surprise! - what a fabulous job its done! CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=5008 P - SPEC OUT AUDITS FOR WHICH FCC RULES? ... be specific, the NANC tells the Toll Free IMG ... CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=5007 (more news con't. below) ____________________________________________________ _______________Please visit our sponsors.________________ For an unforgettable toll free vanity 800 number and matching domain name ... Response Marketing Group http://www.roibot.com/w.cgi?R1764_R800 ____________________________________________________ Questions Answered, Problems Solved. 800 / Domain / ENUM Strategy, Lost/Stolen 800 # Retrieval, Litigation Support, Regulatory Navigation, Correlating Domain Name & Trademark Matters. http://www.roibot.com/w.cgi?R1764_Consultlink ____________________________________________________ CaseMatch can help you find the right attorney. http://www.roibot.com/w.cgi?R1764_casematchlink ____________________________________________________ Afternic.com: domain name sales, acquisition, and research. http://www.roibot.com/w.cgi?R1764_afterniclink ___________________________________________________ Telephone systems today CAN be CONFUSING. Telephone Learning Systems. http://www.roibot.com/w.cgi?R1764_TLSlink ___________________________________________________ It's your future ... ICANNWatch.org. http://www.roibot.com/w.cgi?R1764_IWlink ______________Please visit our sponsors.________________ ___________________________________________________ more HEADLINES for January 19, 2001 F - USPTO TO CONGRESS: LEAVE SQUAT LAWS TO WIPO The Commerce Department's own report also said that the WIPO dispute resolution process is further advanced in its analysis and interpretation of cybersquatting procedures, and suggested that WIPO, not Congress, continue along this path. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=5006 F - THE NEXT ICANN CEO ...? Former Swedish Prime Minister Carl Bildt's name has been mentioned in connection with a job opening at ICANN. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=5005 P - NEW CEO, AT LARGE, ON ICANN BOARD AGENDA The closed board meeting will be held by telephone on January 22nd. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=5004 ___________________________________________________ CUSTOMER SERVICE NOTES: With over 5,000 articles archived, ICB is a popular research destination. Find all ICB headlines: http://www.icbtollfree.com/icbheadlns.cfm, or use ICB's search engine: http://icbtollfree.com/Search.cfm. Note: Registration is required. Contact information is NOT sold, leased, rented or shared in any manner. FREE classifieds: http://www.roibot.com/w.cgi?R1764_Classifieds ____________________________________________________ ABOUT ICB ICB HeadsUp Headlines Daily Email is sent by request. Subscriptions to Daily Email are free to qualified applicants. Visit http://www.roibot.com/w.cgi?R1764_ICBsignup to sign up. Please feel free to pass along a copy to a friend, within reason so long as the message is not modified or used unfavorably. To unsubscribe mailto:editor@icbtollfree.com, subject: unsubscribe. (Unsubs are processed manually, approximately once a week.) ___________________________________________________ ADVERTISING For information on advertising in ICB HeadsUp Headlines, mailto:info@icbtollfree.com, subject line: ICB rate card. ____________________________________________________ Only subscribers or registered users of ICB Toll Free News web site will be able to access all or some of the full text of URLs provided. ____________________________________________________ Copyright © 2001 ICB, Inc. All rights reserved. ____________________________________________________ ------------------------------ Date: 19 Jan 2001 23:59:08 -0500 From: Monty Solomon Subject: Cell Phone Suit Will Get Its Day in Court Cell Phone Suit Will Get Its Day in Court NEW ORLEANS, La. - In ruling that could shake the cell phone industry, a federal judge let stand a lawsuit that says companies are making and selling cell phones with the knowledge that they may be dangerous. The industry tried to have the lawsuit dismissed on the grounds that Congress has given the Food and Drug Administration the job of overseeing cell phone safety. They argued that any attempts by other entities, including the courts, to regulate cell phones were out of bounds - but it was an argument that failed. http://www.thestandard.com/article/display/0,1151,21540,00.html - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 20 Jan 2001 03:12:42 -0500 From: jlurker@bigfoot.com (Justa Lurker) Subject: Re: Family.org quotes page booted by Tripod as "hate speech" On 19 Jan 2001 21:48:35 -0500, in comp.dcom.telecom Bennett Haselton wrote: | Then we revealed to them that we had created the page, and that | the quotes all came from Focus on the Family's site, and asked | if they were going to block Family.org as a "hate site" as well. Perchance the blockers also look at source and context? Although Focus on the Family is not universally agreed with, they are universally known, and their content does not consist 100% of negative comments on the subject of homosexuality. (Read: They have other content on their site, Bryan didn't.) | Now it seems that someone has reported the | http://members.tripod.com/bryan_cody/ | page to Tripod, and they shut it down for violating their terms | of service. | I assume this refers to the terms at | http://www.lycos.com/lycosinc/legal.html#Prohibited | where "Prohibited Conduct" includes posting content that is | "racially, sexually, ethnically or otherwise objectionable". That is your opinion. Perhaps Bryan should ask? Perhaps the terms that were violated were: f. "Stalk" or otherwise harass another. (using the account to harass blocking services) l. i. Making available copyrighted software or other Content that has had the copyright protection removed. (stealing material that is copyrighted from focus.org) ak. Upload, post, email or otherwise transmit or post links to any material, or act in any manner, that is offensive to the Lycos Network community or the spirit of these Terms and Conditions. (Is Tripod webspace intended to be used for testing blockers?) | Tripod determined that a page consisting of nothing but | quotes from Focus on the Family, was "hate speech". You don't know that. All you know is that the page was TOSed. It is your OPINION that that particular reason was the key. If you care to have "Bryan Cody" get a definitive answer from Tripod I look forward to your proof. I also hope to see some solid relevancy to telecom enter into this at some point. JL - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ End of Telecom Digest V2000 #193 ******************************** Date: 21 Jan 2001 06:15:11 -0500 From: owner-telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org (Telecom Digest) To: telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org Subject: Telecom Digest V2000 #194 Telecom Digest Sunday, January 21 2001 Volume 2000 : Number 194 In this issue: Any news on Pat? Need Help with Nortel Powertouch 350 ADSI Telephone BMW CPT 8000 Dual Band, Tri-Mode Digital Phone Re: Lucent to Seek Buyers for Plants; 8,400 Jobs at Stake Re: Lucent to Seek Buyers for Plants; 8,400 Jobs at Stake ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 20 Jan 2001 06:23:24 -0500 From: di@m2.com Subject: Any news on Pat? The subject line says it all.. DARREN INGRAM, M2 COMMUNICATIONS LTD, di@m2.com Current location M2, Jakobstad, FInland +358 40 7385292 ================================================== ++ Daily News Services ++ Worldwide Press Distribution Network ++ Photowire Service ================================================== The views and opinions expressed in this message may not necessarily reflect those of M2 Communications Ltd De synpunkter och åsikter som framkommer i det här e-post meddelandet delas inte nödvändigtvis av M2 Communications Ltd. ================================================== - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 20 Jan 2001 06:26:39 -0500 From: "Keith Knipschild" Subject: Need Help with Nortel Powertouch 350 ADSI Telephone I just bought a Nortel PowerTouch 350 ( with a ADSI module ) on Ebay, but did not get a Manual, I have owned Nortel telephones before, so I know how to use it, but I can't find out how to get the ADSI stuff to work ( ie. Call Disposition... ect ) If you have a Manual, I would gladly pay for a Copy, or even the cost of a FAX phone call. Thanks for your time, Keith Knipschild =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= WEB: http://www.knip.com MAIL: keith@knip.com =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 20 Jan 2001 11:31:43 -0500 From: Monty Solomon Subject: BMW CPT 8000 Dual Band, Tri-Mode Digital Phone Motorola and BMW Launch Integrated Dual Band, Tri-Mode Digital Phone System Now Standard on Model Year 2001 BMW 7 Series DETROIT, Jan. 17 /PRNewswire/ -- Going above and beyond customer demands for higher levels of performance and convenience, Motorola, Inc. (NYSE: MOT) and BMW announced today at the Detroit Auto Show that they have teamed up to introduce a new digital phone marketed as the BMW CPT 8000, which is based on the Motorola Timeport, a fully integrated dual-band, multi-network system. In an agreement valued at more than $11 million annually, the phone system is now standard on all 7 Series and will become available on all other model year 2001 BMW vehicles. The sleek, lightweight and portable Timeport based phone is the latest in wireless in-vehicle communication technologies, keeping customers in touch on and off the road. Available in both Time Division Multiple Access (TDMA) and Code Division Multiple Access (CDMA), the digital signal strength and flexibility of this system helps provide customers with coverage and access to many national service plans including TDMA carriers, AT&T and Cingular, and CDMA carriers, Sprint and Verizon. The Timeport CDMA phone only, also comes equipped with an Internet mini-browser feature and is Motorola's first wireless phone with Tohoku Pioneer Corporation's patented Organic Electro-Luminescent technology. The green, red and blue text and icons appear on a black background, providing users with enhanced readability in most lighting conditions. http://www.corporate-ir.net/ireye/ir_site.zhtml?ticker=MOT&script=410&layout=-6&item_id=144735 - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 20 Jan 2001 15:25:58 -0500 From: pw@panix.com (Paul Wallich) Subject: Re: Lucent to Seek Buyers for Plants; 8,400 Jobs at Stake In article <3.0.5.32.20010119185506.00854d70@216.230.209.13>, The Old Bear wrote: >As reported by Bloomberg business news for January 18, 2001: > > Lucent to Seek Buyers for Plants; 8,400 Jobs at Stake > ----------------------------------------------------- > Murray Hill, New Jersey: Lucent Technologies Inc., the biggest > maker of phone equipment, said it plans to seek buyers for two > of its four U.S. factories in the next six months to cut costs > by contracting out manufacturing. > The plants in Oklahoma City and Columbus, Ohio, together have > 8,400 employees making traditional phone switches and wireless > equipment. Lucent can't predict how many positions may be lost > until sale negotiations are completed in about six months, > spokeswoman Mary Ward said. The big Columbus plant, iirc, goes back in a pretty straight line to the early days of Western Electric. It is the kind of manufacturing facility that gets close to the scale of Boeing or GM, but with far smaller products. Truly amazing to see. (And either sad to see "rationalized" out of existence or else the cause of an enormous sigh of relief.) paul - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 21 Jan 2001 02:00:47 -0500 From: kamlet@infinet.com (Art Kamlet) Subject: Re: Lucent to Seek Buyers for Plants; 8,400 Jobs at Stake In article <20010120202623.12121.qmail@xuxa.iecc.com>, Paul Wallich wrote: >In article <3.0.5.32.20010119185506.00854d70@216.230.209.13>, The Old Bear > wrote: > >>As reported by Bloomberg business news for January 18, 2001: >> >> Lucent to Seek Buyers for Plants; 8,400 Jobs at Stake >> ----------------------------------------------------- >> Murray Hill, New Jersey: Lucent Technologies Inc., the biggest >> maker of phone equipment, said it plans to seek buyers for two >> of its four U.S. factories in the next six months to cut costs >> by contracting out manufacturing. >> The plants in Oklahoma City and Columbus, Ohio, together have >> 8,400 employees making traditional phone switches and wireless >> equipment. Lucent can't predict how many positions may be lost >> until sale negotiations are completed in about six months, >> spokeswoman Mary Ward said. > >The big Columbus plant, iirc, goes back in a pretty straight line to >the early days of Western Electric. It is the kind of manufacturing >facility that gets close to the scale of Boeing or GM, but with far >smaller products. Truly amazing to see. (And either sad to see >"rationalized" out of existence or else the cause of an enormous >sigh of relief.) It was built by Western Electric in the 1950s and when I came here in the mid-70s was still primarily manufacturing electromechanical switches and wire-wound relays. The No. 5XB was everywhere. Some SxS. There were a number of smaller items made as well, including large cabinets, stamped out by a real big press, and the core memory boards (you could look at each individual core, one bit per core) for the No. 1 ESS. Later it took on the No. 4 ESS and No. 1A Processor, and moved out of electromechanical altogether. Most of the "works" manufactured, tested and repaired printed circuit boards, with really state of the art component inserters and soldering machines. Many boards could be filled with components and soldered without being touched by human hands. Many cabinet backplanes as well. Boards of course went into cabinets. In the past 6-8 years the large switching work gave way to wireless switching offices, which is still the majority of their work. In the late 60s and early 70s, they operated three full shifts round the clock, and a freight rail line pulled right up to the loading docks. By the mid 70s trucks replaced rail. The main works building (the manufacturing building) is 1000' x 1000' for a cool million sq ft of floor space plus another 300,000 on a second deck above the manufacturing floor. The semi detatched office building is 15 yards from the manufacturing building (the "detatched" means it can get cold during chilly winter days as you go from one building to the other, even when passing through covered and semi protected walkways.) The office building houses Bell Labs and Lucent R&D work, mostly software design and development, and in many cases unrelated to the products manufactured next door. I estimate another 300,000 sq ft in the office building. And Bell Labs/Lucent rents another small 3-story building a five minute walk away. I spent the last 20 years of my Bell Labs days there, before AT&T's Bob Allen announced an unprecedented downsizing of 40,000 people, and I was one of the 40,000. Not complaining at all, though -- I got just over a year's salary plus an immediate no-penalty full pension. Had I turned down that offer, I would have worked at least the next 2 years for free:^) The "works" became a "manuacturing plant" then a Manufacturing R&D center after the demise of the Western Electric name. The ginko trees in the inner courtyard stink so bad during mating season (there are male and female ginko trees) that you have to take a detour to avoid them. In the last few years the number of employees remained steady, abut half the 1960s numbers. They are still turning out wireless switching equipment steadily and plan to continue doing so. Lucent is very likely to continue to buy from them after they are sold to another plant operator, similar to how IBM sold off its manufacturing plants but continues to buy product from them. Lucent feels the IBM model applies to itself, and by selling to another plant operator they will still get the products they want, wile letting the plant operator expand to make other products even for Lucent competitors. The local IBEW unions have met with management and this latest announcement seems to indicate the union is accepting the facts as presented and to bargain with the new company as they bargained with Lucent. In any case, they are not striking as a result of this long expected announcement. Most local observers expect things to become somewhat more efficient but for the manufacturing load to continue, the products to continue to be made and shipped as Lucent manages to gain sales over competitors, as they surely expect. Workers expect to continue to keep their jobs and benefits, but who can predict the future? In any case, I do not see the plant going away at all; just changing owners. All in all, no one here was surprised about the announcement. They just wondered why the local paper gave it such big headlines? - -- Art Kamlet Columbus, Ohio kamlet@infinet.com - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ End of Telecom Digest V2000 #194 ******************************** Date: 22 Jan 2001 06:15:13 -0500 From: owner-telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org (Telecom Digest) To: telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org Subject: Telecom Digest V2000 #195 Telecom Digest Monday, January 22 2001 Volume 2000 : Number 195 In this issue: New York Times on Lucent Re: BMW CPT 8000 Dual Band, Tri-Mode Digital Phone Re: BMW CPT 8000 Dual Band, Tri-Mode Digital Phone False detection of CAS tone with Beltronics CF130 speakerphone Re: BMW CPT 8000 Dual Band, Tri-Mode Digital Phone ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 21 Jan 2001 06:54:13 -0500 From: Gene Gaines Subject: New York Times on Lucent The weekend edition of the New York Times On the Web included a 3,500 word story on Lucent, beginning with the "now we own the world" view by senior management which appeared in the 1997-1998 timeframe. See: http://www.nytimes.com/2001/01/21/technology/21LUCE.html Can the company turn around? It is going to be interesting. This quote from the article: "... the most unfortunate part may be that the recent problems can obscure the company's legitimate accomplishments since its split from AT&T in 1996. In its final year as part of AT&T, the operation now known as Lucent had revenue of $21.4 billion. In fiscal 2000, that figure was $33.8 billion. When it emerged from AT&T, Lucent had a minimal international presence. Now, overseas customers account for about 34 percent of the company's sales. Five years ago, Lucent had no business to speak of in providing equipment for the Internet and other sorts of advanced data networks. Now, Lucent's data operations generate almost $5 billion in annual sales. ..." Gene Gaines gene.gaines@gainesgroup.com - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 21 Jan 2001 16:27:37 -0500 From: "Ed Ellers" Subject: Re: BMW CPT 8000 Dual Band, Tri-Mode Digital Phone FWIW, BMW already had an integrated Motorola StarTAC phone in the 7 Series for 2000; I know someone who got one, with an 800 MHz TDMA phone (I don't know if they offered CDMA as well; they didn't have GSM). "Integrated" in this case means that the speakerphone is part of the car's audio system and the antenna is factory installed; the phone itself apparently is no different from a normal Motorola unit, and works as such when unplugged from the car. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 21 Jan 2001 19:16:25 -0500 From: Wes Leatherock Subject: Re: BMW CPT 8000 Dual Band, Tri-Mode Digital Phone It seems to me that it has been reported in the last week or two that Motorola will discontinue making cellular phones of all types. Wes Leatherock wleath@sandbox.dynip.com On 21 Jan 2001 16:27:37 -0500 Ed Ellers wrote: > FWIW, BMW already had an integrated Motorola StarTAC phone in the 7 Series > for 2000; I know someone who got one, with an 800 MHz TDMA phone (I don't > know if they offered CDMA as well; they didn't have GSM). "Integrated" in > this case means that the speakerphone is part of the car's audio system and > the antenna is factory installed; the phone itself apparently is no > different from a normal Motorola unit, and works as such when unplugged from > the car. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 21 Jan 2001 19:21:10 -0500 From: Jeremy Bond Shepherd Subject: False detection of CAS tone with Beltronics CF130 speakerphone Hello, I purchased a Beltronics CF130 ("Advanced Communications Manager") speakerphone around 1996, and I still like the phone a lot. However, after recently subscribing to Call Waiting Caller ID service, and setting the phone's CWCID mode to "On", I find that the phone falsely asserts Talkoff mode periodically through the conversation. Apparently it incorrectly detects a CAS tone where none actually exists. This results in the microphone and earphone being muted for a half-second (or thereabouts) while the phone listens for CWCID data which, of course, never arrives. The firmware version of this phone is reported to be "CF-Phone V-03.01". Beltronics appears to have abandoned the telephone market and I cannot find a way to contact them about repairing this product. The agents at the support center (who answer when calling the number in the manual) claim they now only sell radar detectors and have no information about Beltronics phones. If anyone has any information about how I can either contact Beltronics about, or find a workaround for this false CAS detection problem, I would be very grateful. Thank you, Jeremy Shepherd - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 21 Jan 2001 21:57:00 -0500 From: "Ed Ellers" Subject: Re: BMW CPT 8000 Dual Band, Tri-Mode Digital Phone Wes Leatherock wrote: "It seems to me that it has been reported in the last week or two that Motorola will discontinue making cellular phones of all types." Now *that* would be a bombshell! What has been announced is that Motorola will stop making wireless phones *in the United States,* resulting in the loss of 2500 jobs. They say this is because "...we cannot competitively manufacture products when there is surplus global capacity at Motorola's lower cost sites." Translation: Motorola can make phones cheaper in Singapore than in Illinois. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ End of Telecom Digest V2000 #195 ******************************** Date: 23 Jan 2001 06:15:18 -0500 From: owner-telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org (Telecom Digest) To: telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org Subject: Telecom Digest V2000 #196 Telecom Digest Tuesday, January 23 2001 Volume 2000 : Number 196 In this issue: RE: Need Help with Nortel Powertouch 350 ADSI Telephone Telecom Update (Canada) #267, January 22, 2001 Re: Lucent to Seek Buyers for Plants; 8,400 Jobs at Stake 1/22/01 ICBTollFreeNews.Com HEADS UP HEADLINES ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 22 Jan 2001 10:37:27 -0500 From: "Keith Knipschild" Subject: RE: Need Help with Nortel Powertouch 350 ADSI Telephone I found the Manual Online, plus I found out that Nortel does not support these phones anymore they sold it off to AASTRA TELECOM ( 1-800-288-1683 ) AAstra told me to call my Telco's Downloader ( Verizon 1-800-348-8528 ) to get my phone programmed.. http://www.aastra.com/support/phones/pdf ( E UG PT350.pdf ) http://www.aastra.com/support/phones/PowerTouch-Vista/ptvista.html Enjoy, Keith =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= WEB: http://www.knip.com MAIL: keith@knip.com =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= > -----Original Message----- > From: Keith Knipschild [mailto:Keith@Knip.Com] > Sent: Saturday, January 20, 2001 6:23 AM > To: editor@telecom-digest.org > Subject: Need Help with Nortel Powertouch 350 ADSI Telephone > Importance: High > Sensitivity: Confidential > > > I just bought a Nortel PowerTouch 350 ( with a ADSI module ) > on Ebay, but did not get a Manual, I have owned Nortel telephones > before, so I know how to use it, but I can't find out how to > get the ADSI stuff to work ( ie. Call Disposition... ect ) > > If you have a Manual, I would gladly pay for a Copy, > or even the cost of a FAX phone call. > > Thanks for your time, > Keith Knipschild > > =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= > WEB: http://www.knip.com > MAIL: keith@knip.com > =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 22 Jan 2001 12:05:26 -0500 From: Angus TeleManagement Subject: Telecom Update (Canada) #267, January 22, 2001 ************************************************************ TELECOM UPDATE Angus TeleManagement's Weekly Telecom Newsbulletin http://www.angustel.ca Number 267: January 22, 2001 Publication of Telecom Update is made possible by generous financial support from: AT&T Canada ...................... http://www.attcanada.com/ Bell Canada ............................ http://www.bell.ca/ C1 Communications ......... http://www.c1communications.com/ Cisco Systems Canada ................. http://www.cisco.com/ Lucent Technologies Canada ........... http://www.lucent.ca/ Norigen ............................ http://www.norigen.com/ Sprint Canada .................. http://www.sprintcanada.ca/ ************************************************************ IN THIS ISSUE: ** PCS Auction, Week Two ** MDR, Switchview Merge ** Rogers Internet Woes Continue ** Telus Forms E-Business Group ** Bell Launches Business Portal ** Globalstar Defaults on Debt ** AT&T Canada Offers On-Line Marketplace ** Nortel 4Q Results as Predicted ** RIM Intros BlackBerry for Lotus ** Canada and Mexico Sign Satellite Agreement ** Mitec Buying Swedish Components Maker ** Montreal Teen Admits to Web Attacks ** Earnings Slide at Cogeco ** Bell Ups Price for SimplyOne ** Mitel Spins Off Photonics Venture ** QuebecTel and Rhythms Partner for DSL ** Shift to Offer Unified Communications ** Competitors to Continue Paying LD Startup Costs ** TMI, Motient Form Satellite Venture ** "Telemanagement" Articles on Line ============================================================ PCS AUCTION, WEEK TWO: At the end of the first week of Canada's PCS spectrum auction, bids totaled $263 Million. As expected, the most contested licenses cover southern Quebec, southern Ontario, B.C. and Alberta. This week, the bidding pace steps up with four auction rounds scheduled each day. (See PCS Auction Results Web site) ** Microcell stopped bidding after round 2, and withdrew from the auction on Thursday. ** W2N notified Industry Canada on January 14 that it now has investment from two major U.S. investment funds, GS Capital Partners and Providence Equity Partners. http://agora.ic.gc.ca/PCS_Auction/navpage_1.cfm MDR, SWITCHVIEW MERGE: MDR Technologies and Switchview, which supply telecom management software and services, have been combined into MDR Switchview Global Networks. The companies were bought and merged by Aquilium Software, headed by former MDR CEO Stan Tyo. ROGERS INTERNET WOES CONTINUE: E-mail problems still plague Rogers@Home: more than 20,000 Rogers@Home customers lost service for several days last week. One published report said that Rogers is seeking to take over control of the network servers, which are run by California-based Excite@Home. ** Shaw Communications CEO Jim Shaw is reported to be urging other cablecos to abandon @Home in favour of Shaw's almost-completed national Internet service. TELUS FORMS E-BUSINESS GROUP: Telus has combined its ISM-BC, Strategic Resources, Advanced Communications, Geomatics, Innovative Billing, and Versalys organizations into Telus Enterprise Solutions, which will be part of the company's Toronto-based Client Solutions unit. BELL LAUNCHES BUSINESS PORTAL: Bell Canada, in partnership with U.S. portal AllBusiness, has created an Internet portal catering to small and medium-sized businesses. BellZinc.ca, provides e-business, directory, and information services. GLOBALSTAR DEFAULTS ON DEBT: Satellite phone company Globalstar has stopped making payments on its US$3-Billion debt and retained an investment bank to help it "explore strategic alternatives." Globalstar has about 35,000 subscribers worldwide. AT&T CANADA OFFERS ON-LINE MARKETPLACE: AT&T Canada now offers an e-commerce service, AT&T Canada Marketplace, through which companies may procure goods on-line. NORTEL 4Q RESULTS AS PREDICTED: Nortel Networks has announced fourth-quarter revenue of US$8.82 Billion, 34% more than last year, and quarterly operating earnings of US$825 Million, a 36% increase. Results were in line with Nortel's earlier predictions. After acquisition-related costs, Nortel lost US$1.41 Billion. RIM INTROS BLACKBERRY FOR LOTUS: Research In Motion has introduced BlackBerry Enterprise Edition for Lotus Domino, which can retrieve e-mail from enterprise Lotus Notes and Domino servers. The new device is to ship in February. CANADA AND MEXICO SIGN SATELLITE AGREEMENT: On January 16, Canada and Mexico have agreed on technical and other standards allowing satellite carriers in either country to provide fixed or mobile services in the other. The protocols, singed on January 16, complete the 1999 bilateral Agreement on Telecommunications Satellite Services. MITEC BUYING SWEDISH COMPONENTS MAKER: Montreal-based Mitec Telecom has agreed to buy BEVE Invest, a Swedish electronic manufacturing company with 450 employees, for shares worth about $20 Million. BEVE's three owners will now hold 40% of Mitec shares. MONTREAL TEEN ADMITS TO WEB ATTACKS: A 16-year-old Montreal hacker, who uses the name "Mafiaboy," has pleaded guilty to 56 charges related to the denial-of-service attacks that shut down Yahoo, e*Trade, and other major Web sites for several hours each in February 2000. EARNINGS SLIDE AT COGECO: Cogeco Cable reports net earnings for the quarter ended November 30 of $375,000, compared with $5.5 Million the previous year. Revenue rose 17% to $104 Million. Cogeco is laying off 150 employees as a cost-cutting measure. BELL UPS PRICE FOR SIMPLYONE: Bell Canada has the CRTC's okay to increase rates for SimplyOne, which bundles wireless and wireline service, by $5/month. http://www.crtc/gc/caarchive/Orders/2001/O2001-25 MITEL SPINS OFF PHOTONICS VENTURE: Mitel Corp. has launched Optenia, which aims to produce chips that will boost the performance of fibre-optic networks. Optenia will continue Mitel's collaboration in this field with the National Research Council. QUEBECTEL AND RHYTHMS PARTNER FOR DSL: Rhythms Canada's wholesale DSL service will be marketed to business customers by QuebecTel. ** QuebecTel has named Louis Morin, formerly VP Sales at AT&T Canada, as Vice-President of Sales and Marketing. He will focus on building the company's presence in Montreal. SHIFT TO OFFER UNIFIED COMMUNICATIONS: Shift Networks, a Calgary-based company that provides telecom services to business tenants in multi-tenant buildings, has agreed to offer services based on Voice Mobility's Unified Communications software to its customers. COMPETITORS TO CONTINUE PAYING LD STARTUP COSTS: The CRTC has rejected Call-Net's proposal to end payments which competitors have made since 1992 to compensate telcos for part of the cost of enabling equal access. The Commission says that the amount of competitors' payments was expected to vary with traffic volumes, and in any case the 10-year payment period is nearing an end. http://www.crtc.gc.ca/archive/Orders/2001/O2001-28.htm TMI, MOTIENT FORM SATELLITE VENTURE: TMI Communications, a unit of BCE, and Motient have agreed to integrate their mobile satellite communications operations in a jointly owned company, Mobile Satellite Ventures. "TELEMANAGEMENT" ARTICLES ON-LINE: All Telemanagement editorials and a varied selection of features are available in the Articles On-Line section of the Angus Web site (http://www.angustel.ca). ** Among recently posted articles: "The Wireless Web: Fact or Fantasy," John Riddell's study of mobile data on cellular networks. ** To subscribe to Telemanagement, call 1-800-263-4415, ext 500 or visit the Telemanagement home page at http://www.angustel.ca. ============================================================ HOW TO SUBMIT ITEMS FOR TELECOM UPDATE E-MAIL: editors@angustel.ca FAX: 905-686-2655 MAIL: TELECOM UPDATE Angus TeleManagement Group 8 Old Kingston Road Ajax, Ontario Canada L1T 2Z7 =========================================================== HOW TO SUBSCRIBE (OR UNSUBSCRIBE) TELECOM UPDATE is provided in electronic form only. There are two formats available: 1. The fully-formatted edition is posted on the World Wide Web on the first business day of the week at http://www.angustel.ca 2. The e-mail edition is distributed free of charge. To subscribe, send an e-mail message to: listmanager@subs.postmastergeneral.com Insert as the subject of your message the two words: subscribe TelecomUpdate To stop receiving the e-mail edition, send an e-mail message to: listmanager@subs.postmastergeneral.com Insert as the subject of your message the two words: unsubscribe TelecomUpdate =========================================================== COPYRIGHT AND DISCLAIMER: All contents copyright 2001 Angus TeleManagement Group Inc. All rights reserved. For further information, including permission to reprint or reproduce, please e-mail rosita@angustel.ca or phone 905-686-5050 ext 500. The information and data included has been obtained from sources which we believe to be reliable, but Angus TeleManagement makes no warranties or representations whatsoever regarding accuracy, completeness, or adequacy. Opinions expressed are based on interpretation of available information, and are subject to change. If expert advice on the subject matter is required, the services of a competent professional should be obtained. ============================================================ - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 22 Jan 2001 17:27:38 -0500 From: haynes@alumni.uark.edu (Jim Haynes) Subject: Re: Lucent to Seek Buyers for Plants; 8,400 Jobs at Stake Apropos of this, the Arkansas Democrat-Gazette had a picture the other day of the former Teletype plant in Little Rock, with an Avaya banner covering the Lucent sign, and said that it too was looking for a buyer. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 23:20:27 -0500 From: "Judith Oppenheimer" Subject: 1/22/01 ICBTollFreeNews.Com HEADS UP HEADLINES ____________________________________________________ ICBTollFreeNews.Com HEADS UP HEADLINES ____________________________________________________ from ICB Toll Free News - Daily News and Intelligence covering the Political, Legal and Marketing Arenas of 800 and Dot Com. ____________________________________________________ CONTENTS - - ENUM ADMINISTRATION ISSUES - - DOMAIN NAME IN, URI OUT - - ENUM, A LA NEUSTAR - - MICHAEL POWELL DESIGNATED AS NEW FCC CHM - - WHATS WRONG WITH COPY PROTECTION - - WHAT A RACKET ! - - IF IT WALKS LIKE A DUCK AND DIES LIKE A DUCK ... ___________________________________________________ EVERY 3.6 SECONDS SOMEONE DIES FROM HUNGER http://www.hungersite.com/ ____________________________________________________ ARTICLE ACCESS CODE LEGEND ICB Toll Free News offers two valuable service options: F = Free - News and Features articles P = Premium - Unlimited Site Access including all Articles and Documents. ____________________________________________________ HEADLINES for January 22, 2001 P - ENUM ADMINISTRATION ISSUES from a numbering perspective. Could prepaid mobile numbers be inserted? Could geographic numbers lose location information? How can E.164/DNS integrity be safeguarded if responsibility lies with the customer? CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=5015 P - DOMAIN NAME IN, URI OUT Take a step-by-step walk through this ENUM how-to. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=5014 P -ENUM, A LA NEUSTAR "ENUM is about new service creation," NeuStar tells participants at last week's seminar in Geneva. "But we must address naming and numbering issues." CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=5013 (more news con't. below) ____________________________________________________ _______________Please visit our sponsors.________________ For an unforgettable toll free vanity 800 number and matching domain name ... Response Marketing Group http://www.roibot.com/w.cgi?R1764_R800 ____________________________________________________ Questions Answered, Problems Solved. 800 / Domain / ENUM Strategy, Lost/Stolen 800 # Retrieval, Litigation Support, Regulatory Navigation, Correlating Domain Name & Trademark Matters. http://www.roibot.com/w.cgi?R1764_Consultlink ____________________________________________________ CaseMatch can help you find the right attorney. http://www.roibot.com/w.cgi?R1764_casematchlink ____________________________________________________ Afternic.com: domain name sales, acquisition, and research. http://www.roibot.com/w.cgi?R1764_afterniclink ___________________________________________________ Telephone systems today CAN be CONFUSING. Telephone Learning Systems. http://www.roibot.com/w.cgi?R1764_TLSlink ___________________________________________________ It's your future ... ICANNWatch.org. http://www.roibot.com/w.cgi?R1764_IWlink ______________Please visit our sponsors.________________ ___________________________________________________ more HEADLINES for January 22, 2001 F - MICHAEL POWELL DESIGNATED AS NEW FCC CHM Powell was in the minority voting against attaching AIM conditions to the AOL Time Warner deal ... the conditioned approval "makes clear that the FCC has jurisdiction to regulate virtually every Internet product or service that facilitates communications," he wrote in his dissent. Interesting. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=5012 F - WHATS WRONG WITH COPY PROTECTION What is wrong is when social policy is created in smoke-filled back rooms, not by open public discussion, by legislatures, and by courts. John Gilmore's discussion on copy protection could just as easily apply to the DNS, or numbering system. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=5011 F - WHAT A RACKET ! Under ICANN's proposed $5M budget, 90% of funds are to be provided by the Registrar, gTLD, and ccTLD constituencies, while the Business, ISP/Connectivity Providers and Intellectual Property constituencies pay nothing. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=5009 P - IF IT WALKS LIKE A DUCK AND DIES LIKE A DUCK ... NANPA suggests that 555 numbers are not assets of the assignee. As such, assignments may not be inherited like assets of a decedent. Yet it also suggests, "a 555 assignment may be transferred to another entity through merger or acquisition, or death of the assignee, as long as the 555 assignment is in use." CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=5010 ___________________________________________________ CUSTOMER SERVICE NOTES: With over 5,000 articles archived, ICB is a popular research destination. Find all ICB headlines: http://www.icbtollfree.com/icbheadlns.cfm, or use ICB's search engine: http://icbtollfree.com/Search.cfm. 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(Unsubs are processed manually, approximately once a week.) ___________________________________________________ ADVERTISING For information on advertising in ICB HeadsUp Headlines, mailto:info@icbtollfree.com, subject line: ICB rate card. ____________________________________________________ Only subscribers or registered users of ICB Toll Free News web site will be able to access all or some of the full text of URLs provided. ____________________________________________________ Copyright © 2001 ICB, Inc. All rights reserved. ____________________________________________________ ------------------------------ End of Telecom Digest V2000 #196 ******************************** Date: 24 Jan 2001 06:15:09 -0500 From: owner-telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org (Telecom Digest) To: telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org Subject: Telecom Digest V2000 #197 Telecom Digest Wednesday, January 24 2001 Volume 2000 : Number 197 In this issue: $2400 per minute for 809 calls - nonsense! Re: Verizontal Marks End of "Name That Domain" Contest Re: $2400 per minute for 809 calls - nonsense! REVIEW: "Gideon", Russel Andrews (Peter Gethers/David Handler) Re: $2400 per minute for 809 calls - nonsense! Re: $2400 per minute for 809 calls - nonsense! Touch-A-Matic Phones Re: Verizontal Marks End of "Name That Domain" Contest Re: Touch-A-Matic Phones Wired Crimefighters ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 23 Jan 2001 09:48:45 -0500 From: "John R. Covert Spam Sink" Subject: $2400 per minute for 809 calls - nonsense! Well, the quasi-urban-legend about the 809 phone scam is going around again. Last week someone at work asked me about $2400 per minute charges, and this morning WBZ radio in Boston was running the story including the $2400 legend. The reason I call it a "quasi-legend" is that, as Telecom Digest readers know, there have been scams involving getting people to call 809 numbers, which, depending on the country actually reached, can be fairly costly. The scam involves kickbacks for the terminating customer in the foreign country from the local telephone company for receiving international calls. Unsuspecting people in the U.S. are left a message to call 809 something, and when they reach the number, they are kept on the line for as long as possible. None of the reports about the scam include the actual number, for some strange reason. But the most bogus part of the internet story about the scam is that the charges are $2400 per minute. Nonsense. In some versions of the story about the scam, the numbers are in the British Virgin Islands, in some the numbers are in the Bahamas, in some the numbers are in the Dominican Republic. The most expensive of these countries is the Dominican Republic. Calls on AT&T for customers without any calling plan to the Dominican Republic are only $2.46 per minute peak, $2.06 off-peak. After WBZ ran the story, I called them up and told them that there was no way callers were being charged $2400 per minute. It took some convincing, including being hung up on twice by some very rude woman in their news department, but finally I got to talk to "personality" Gary LaPierre, who told me to listen to their interview with a Verizon spokesman at 9:00. So I did. Of course, the Verizon spokesman just read the story off the Internet, and then when asked if the $2400 rate was true, simply said that Verizon didn't know what rates would be charged, since they were not in the business of providing international calling. After 9:00, WBZ was still running the story, but at least had dropped the part about $2400 per minute. Gary runs an afternoon segment called "LaPierre on the loose" in which he gives "dope slaps". I left him a voicemail message telling him to give a dope slap to the news staff for running a story off the internet without fully checking it out. The other problem with this story is that it is about ten years old. I seriously question whether the scam is actually still happening, or whether it is just another recycled internet story that will never die. /john - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 23 Jan 2001 10:24:00 -0500 From: Carl Moore Subject: Re: Verizontal Marks End of "Name That Domain" Contest Message dated 9 Apr 2000 from jay@west.net (Jay Hennigan) in telecom digest V20 #58 has: >WILSON, CHRIS (VERIZONSUCKS-DOM) > 555 12ST NW > D.C, WA 20004 > US A later message says the address (Washington DC, right?) is that of Arnold & Porter law firm. The *I* am making with this message is that the city & "state" are messed up, because "WA" is used for Washington STATE, not Washington D.C. Zipcode is correct for the street address of 555_12th St. NW. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 23 Jan 2001 10:27:48 -0500 From: Joel B Levin Subject: Re: $2400 per minute for 809 calls - nonsense! In , "John R. Covert Spam Sink" wrote: }The other problem with this story is that it is about ten years old. }I seriously question whether the scam is actually still happening, or }whether it is just another recycled internet story that will never die. I think it's less than a year since I last got a spam promoting numbers in Antigua or other Caribbean countries. There used to be quite a few of those. A few were even pushing countries not in the NANP. (Most of these were not in 809. Check http://www.lincmad.com/telesleaze.html .) And it's only a few years since the scam which downloaded software to a user's machine which in turn disconnected it and redialed a foreign porn site that benefited from kickback arrangements. I'm sure there were phone BILLS upwards of $2400, possibly even phone CALLS. Of course the most I ever saw for a per-minute rate was in the $6 - $10 range. /JBL - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 23 Jan 2001 10:39:34 -0500 From: "Rob Slade, doting grandpa of Ryan and Trevor" Subject: REVIEW: "Gideon", Russel Andrews (Peter Gethers/David Handler) BKGIDEON.RVW 20010105 "Gideon", Russel Andrews (Peter Gethers/David Handler), 1999, 0-345-43478-1 %A Russel Andrews (Peter Gethers) %A Russel Andrews (David Handler) %C 101 Fifth Avenue, New York, NY 10003 %D 1999 %G 0-345-43478-1 %I Ballantine/Fawcett/Columbine Books/Del Rey %O http://www.randomhouse.com/BB BB@randomhouse.com %P 466 p. %T "Gideon" This is a serviceable thriller. Reasonably convoluted plot, although not, perhaps, as surprising as the authors might think. And, as is prone to happen with collaborations, there are minor, but annoying, inconsistencies in the story and the characters. (It's also just a little bit difficult to suspend disbelief about a single hunter who can track people all over the South, especially when the prey can swap driving and sleeping shifts, and the predator is driving a large vehicle with a silly and identifiable logo on the side. And then there is the dependence on the police being stupid enough to miss things like huge differences in times of death, and even wrong bodies.) Take the technology, for instance. Communications technology, and particularly the Internet, plays a large role in the book, but it seems oddly unimportant. For one thing, most of it doesn't start until half way through the narrative. For another, while few overt mistakes are apparent (and some actual Web pages are used), no fundamental understanding of the technology is evident. Oddly, although the book is clearly based on recent concerns over concentration of telecommunications ownership and Internet communication is used a lot, the bad guys don't seem to care about owning a piece of the networked world, concentrating on the traditional media. Not that this is unrealistic. The top black hat, rather obviously a combination of Rupert Murdoch and Ted Turner, is only doing what most of his real life media baron colleagues are doing: staying as far away from the anarchic Internet as possible, and pretending it is a kind of television service with a great many channels. But an Augmon On Line could have added a lot of creativity and spice to the book. In addition, the authors have a very US-centric view of international corporations. True multinationals like the one in the book would definitely have an easier way to get around the problem of a ban on direct dealings with certain foreign countries. Turning to satellite services, there are a few problems. Geosynchronous earth orbit (GEO) is certainly preferred for broadcast satellites, but it is far from the only game in town. And it wouldn't be necessary to have a gang of illiterate peasants build a high tech launch facility in French Guiana: the European Space Agency has a very nice one there, used quite regularly. In any case, even if you did manage to build a site and launch a rocket in secrecy it wouldn't remain a secret very long. Rockets are noisy, flashy things that can be detected exceedingly easily. Various interested parties check up on these things, not least because there are less than a dozen unassigned GEO slots left, and nobody is going to stand idly by while somebody pirates one. Coming down to earth (if you'll pardon the expression), an 800 number still has to be assigned to a given phone line, even if the fax machine you want to use is installed in a computer. In any case, an 800 number is definitely not "non-area-specific," as Canadians and other non-US residents know all too well. A cell phone is not untraceable: as soon as it is turned on in a service area the position is known to within a few miles, and, in urban areas, usually much closer than that. In these highly wired days it is odd that anyone who can track down an email address for a non-acquaintance would be so lax as to endanger a close friend by using an identifiable email account to send a highly dangerous message. Even without getting into anonymous remailers, surely such a person would know about the various Web based free email services, which allow anyone to create an essentially untraceable account within seconds. But when they really want to hold secure communications, they turn to instant messaging (IM). This is really laughable. First of all, while journalists are now starting to work fairly heavily with the Internet and while some will undoubtedly have greater skills in this area than others, it simply isn't true that every large news organization has a "hacker" on staff, particularly the mythical system breakers who are supposed to be able to break into bank and credit card databases at will. In addition, being able to crack a system is no indication that you can secure one. As Gene Spafford points out, being able to pour sugar into a gas tank teaches you nothing about auto mechanics. Mostly, though, instant messaging just isn't very reliable. Email is asynchronous, and generally gets to the recipient eventually. IM requires both parties to be online, with clients active, at the same time--and on the same system. This is one of the reasons that most "by the hour" computer rental places wouldn't have IM installed. The other reason is that instant messaging systems are notoriously insecure. One popular IM system has had password, trojan, and other security problems in a never ending stream ever since it started. Another major player has deliberately opened buffer overflow holes in its own client program--apparently in an attempt to avoid compatibility with other systems. Using IM for secure communications makes about as much sense as posting your confidential messages on random billboards. The final "get the baddies to incriminate themselves" denouement lacks some detail. However, it makes up for many of the prior mistakes by being creative, effective, using technology well, and being technically correct. copyright Robert M. Slade, 2001 BKGIDEON.RVW 20010105 ====================== (quote inserted randomly by Pegasus Mailer) rslade@vcn.bc.ca rslade@sprint.ca slade@victoria.tc.ca p1@canada.com My mind not only wanders, sometimes it leaves completely. http://victoria.tc.ca/techrev or http://sun.soci.niu.edu/~rslade - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 23 Jan 2001 11:29:04 -0500 From: Barry Margolin Subject: Re: $2400 per minute for 809 calls - nonsense! In article , John R. Covert Spam Sink wrote: >After 9:00, WBZ was still running the story, but at least had dropped >the part about $2400 per minute. Gary runs an afternoon segment called >"LaPierre on the loose" in which he gives "dope slaps". I left him a >voicemail message telling him to give a dope slap to the news staff for >running a story off the internet without fully checking it out. I'd give him the benefit of the doubt. With a legend like this, it's probably not too difficult to find several "experts" who will confirm it, which is good enough for a fact checker (how much research do you really expect for a little story like this?). Even the response from the Verizon spokesman can seem like mild confirmation -- if it were really unlikely, they might have laughed at it, rather than making the noncommittal "We don't do international calling, so we can't comment on their prices" response. - -- Barry Margolin, barmar@genuity.net Genuity, Burlington, MA *** DON'T SEND TECHNICAL QUESTIONS DIRECTLY TO ME, post them to newsgroups. Please DON'T copy followups to me -- I'll assume it wasn't posted to the group. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 23 Jan 2001 12:15:10 -0500 From: Linc Madison Subject: Re: $2400 per minute for 809 calls - nonsense! In article <3a70a088.297032554@news.gte.net>, Joel B Levin wrote: > In , > "John R. Covert Spam Sink" wrote: > }The other problem with this story is that it is about ten years old. > }I seriously question whether the scam is actually still happening, > }or whether it is just another recycled internet story that will > }never die. > > I think it's less than a year since I last got a spam promoting > numbers in Antigua or other Caribbean countries. There used to be > quite a few of those. A few were even pushing countries not in the > NANP. (Most of these were not in 809. Check > http://www.lincmad.com/telesleaze.html .) I've seen spams, and certainly Usenet spams, fairly recently. I don't have any recent reports of the pager scam or the "your relative is in the hospital/in jail/left you a fortune/whatever" answering machine scam. > And it's only a few years since the scam which downloaded software to > a user's machine which in turn disconnected it and redialed a foreign > porn site that benefited from kickback arrangements. I'm sure there > were phone BILLS upwards of $2400, possibly even phone CALLS. Of > course the most I ever saw for a per-minute rate was in the $6 - $10 > range. Actually, this one is still going on. I got an e-mail from someone just last month whose dialup connection was rerouted to Vanuatu, with a 101-xxxx code for AT&T (not his default carrier), resulting in rates in the vicinity of $6/minute. ($60+ for a 10-minute call) There are plenty of "FREE porn dialers" splashed all over the newsgroups, too. (Golly gosh, they GIVE AWAY this FREE program that will let me download nekkid girlies/boytoys/farm animals, and all I have to do is let it dial their number in some country I've never heard of! What a *deal*!!) However, that's not a "1+" call, as the 809 and related codes are. The highest rates I've seen for those numbers are under $2/minute, and even most companies have rates under $1/minute for most of the Caribbean without subscribing to an international discount plan. The origin of the whole $2425/minute or $24,100 per call numbers is simply Usenet itself. Some systems convert the dollar sign into =24 (for ASCII hex value 0x24). Thus $25/minute turned into =2425/minute, which some helpful human turned into $2425/minute. If you ever see a spam claiming $242,425/minute, just remember you saw it here first. - -- Preferred reply address: Telecom # LincMad * Com - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 23 Jan 2001 12:22:46 -0500 From: Fred Atkinson Subject: Touch-A-Matic Phones Some time back, the Bell companies used to manufacture a phone called a 'Touch-A-Matic' phone. Are these phones still available? Does anyone know where one can be had? I've searched the Internet for them. There is information about them, but nowhere does it say where one can be had. Thanks, Fred - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 23 Jan 2001 13:12:23 -0500 From: jay@west.net (Jay Hennigan) Subject: Re: Verizontal Marks End of "Name That Domain" Contest On 23 Jan 2001 10:24:00 -0500, Carl Moore wrote: : :Message dated 9 Apr 2000 from jay@west.net (Jay Hennigan) Now there's a voice from the past... :in telecom digest V20 #58 has: :>WILSON, CHRIS (VERIZONSUCKS-DOM) :> 555 12ST NW :> D.C, WA 20004 :> US : :A later message says the address (Washington DC, right?) is that :of Arnold & Porter law firm. The *I* am making with this message :is that the city & "state" are messed up, because "WA" is used for :Washington STATE, not Washington D.C. Zipcode is correct for the :street address of 555_12th St. NW. I would attribute this to poor programming in Network Solutions' (or whatever registrar's) address parser. It's probably trying to render any string as FIRSTNAME LASTNAME. Could also be with a submission agent's parser. So, if he had entered "CHRIS WILSON" as a name it would correctly have been flipped to WILSON, CHRIS. When he entered WASHINGTON D.C. it got flipped to D.C, WASHINGTON, and the parser then (correctly but incorrectly) found a match in the state tables, and substituted "WA" for "WASHINGTON". I would suspect there are others that are similarly mangled - -- Jay Hennigan - Network Administration - jay@west.net NetLojix Communications, Inc. NASDAQ: NETX - http://www.netlojix.com/ WestNet: Connecting you to the planet. 805 884-6323 - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 23 Jan 2001 15:25:00 -0500 From: Joseph Singer Subject: Re: Touch-A-Matic Phones On 23 Jan 2001 12:22:46 -0500, Fred Atkinson wrote: > Some time back, the Bell companies used to manufacture a phone >called a 'Touch-A-Matic' phone. > > Are these phones still available? Does anyone know where one can >be had? > > I've searched the Internet for them. There is information about >them, but nowhere does it say where one can be had. I see them occasionally on eBay, but aside from the nostalgic value of a Touch-A-Matic there are loads of phones that you can readily buy today that have one touch dialing of numbers and can provide more numbers than a Touch-A-Matic ever could. Granted these modern phones aren't built like tanks as the WECO equipment was, but are more than able to do the same thing that a Touch-A-Matic did and even have more features. I've seen a few single line Touch-A-Matics, but I've seen more "key" 1A2 type Touch-A-Matics. - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Joseph Singer Seattle, Washington USA - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 23 Jan 2001 17:35:53 -0500 From: sjsobol@NorthShoreTechnologies.net (Steve Sobol) Subject: Wired Crimefighters Wired crimefighters Conference helps police close gap with online criminals By Bob Sullivan MSNBC MASHANTUCKET, Conn., Jan. 22 - Police in Boston had reached a dead end. They had a murder suspect, but not nearly enough evidence, and the investigation was growing cold. But a computer-trained ATF agent went undercover, and for once, used the Internet's anonymity to law enforcement's advantage. After all, if the good guys can do it, so can the bad guys. Welcome to the brave new world of cyber-policing. http://www.msnbc.com/news/519652.asp - -- Steve Sobol, BOFH, President 888.480.4NET 866.DSL.EXPRESS 216.619.2NET North Shore Technologies Corporation http://NorthShoreTechnologies.net JustTheNet/JustTheNet EXPRESS DSL (ISP Services) http://JustThe.net mailto:sjsobol@NorthShoreTechnologies.net Proud resident of Cleveland, OH - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ End of Telecom Digest V2000 #197 ******************************** Date: 25 Jan 2001 06:15:17 -0500 From: owner-telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org (Telecom Digest) To: telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org Subject: Telecom Digest V2000 #198 Telecom Digest Thursday, January 25 2001 Volume 2000 : Number 198 In this issue: 1/23/01 ICBTollFreeNews.Com HEADS UP HEADLINES remove Los Angeles Area Questions Re: Los Angeles Area Questions The Wild World of Wireless Latin America's New King of Cellular? PhoneFree to start charging for calls Re: Los Angeles Area Questions Re: Los Angeles Area Questions 1/24/01 ICBTollFreeNews.Com HEADS UP HEADLINES ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 23:10:29 -0500 From: "Judith Oppenheimer" Subject: 1/23/01 ICBTollFreeNews.Com HEADS UP HEADLINES ____________________________________________________ ICBTollFreeNews.Com HEADS UP HEADLINES ____________________________________________________ from ICB Toll Free News - Daily News and Intelligence covering the Political, Legal and Marketing Arenas of 800 and Dot Com. ____________________________________________________ CONTENTS - - NO SEX FOR SALE TODAY - - DR. M. STUART LYNN HIRED TO REPLACE MIKE ROBERTS - - COURT RULES FOR VOLKSWAGEN IN VW.NET DISPUTE ___________________________________________________ EVERY 3.6 SECONDS SOMEONE DIES FROM HUNGER http://www.hungersite.com/ ____________________________________________________ ARTICLE ACCESS CODE LEGEND ICB Toll Free News offers two valuable service options: F = Free - News and Features articles P = Premium - Unlimited Site Access including all Articles and Documents. ____________________________________________________ HEADLINES for January 23, 2001 F - NO SEX FOR SALE TODAY The domain name sex.com is owned by Gary Kremen of San Francisco. Contacted by leading German magazine Der Spiegel, he said he had no plans to sell. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=5017 F - DR. M. STUART LYNN HIRED TO REPLACE MIKE ROBERTS The new ICANN President/CEO was until his retirement in 1999, Associate Vice President for Information Resources and Communications for the University of California Office of the President where he served as chief information officer for the combined University of California system. Dr. Lynn also served as President and Chairman of the Board of the Corporation for Education Network Initiatives in California (CENIC). CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=5016 P - COURT RULES FOR VOLKSWAGEN IN VW.NET DISPUTE "All but the most blatant cybersquatters will put forth some lawful motives for their behaviors. To hold that all such individuals may qualify for the safe habor would frustrate Congress' purpose by artificially limiting the statute's reach." CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=5018 ____________________________________________________ _______________Please visit our sponsors.________________ For an unforgettable toll free vanity 800 number and matching domain name ... 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ICANNWatch.org. http://www.roibot.com/w.cgi?R1764_IWlink ______________Please visit our sponsors.________________ ___________________________________________________ ABOUT ICB ICB HeadsUp Headlines Daily Email is sent by request. Subscriptions to Daily Email are free to qualified applicants. Visit http://www.roibot.com/w.cgi?R1764_ICBsignup to sign up. Please feel free to pass along a copy to a friend, within reason so long as the message is not modified or used unfavorably. To unsubscribe mailto:editor@icbtollfree.com, subject: unsubscribe. (Unsubs are processed manually, approximately once a week.) ___________________________________________________ ADVERTISING For information on advertising in ICB HeadsUp Headlines, mailto:info@icbtollfree.com, subject line: ICB rate card. ____________________________________________________ Only subscribers or registered users of ICB Toll Free News web site will be able to access all or some of the full text of URLs provided. ____________________________________________________ Copyright © 2001 ICB, Inc. All rights reserved. ____________________________________________________ ____________________________________________________ ------------------------------ Date: 24 Jan 2001 10:39:25 -0500 From: "C. Thomas Day" Subject: remove I'm not sure how to do this but I would like my email address removed from your list. I have been using this for many years but no longer need to receive the digest daily. Thank you. I f possible, would you email me to let me know that this has been acted upon. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 24 Jan 2001 12:09:07 -0500 From: "Raymond D. Mereniuk" Subject: Los Angeles Area Questions Hello I have been a subscriber to this list for years but have not posted anything for a long time. I live in British Columbia Canada and the way they do things here is different than the US market. Working on a project for a company wanting to build their own ITX (Internet Telephony Exchange) in the Los Angeles area. The reason for LA is to allow calls to be completed or originated in/from that area. They are intending to colocate 2 racks of equipment. Basically the equipment connects to the Internet on one side and a number of voice lines on the other side. They intend to start with 4 voice T1s and build toward a total of 16 voice T1s. There appears to be two main Telecom districts in LA, Wilshire & West 7th Street in downtown LA (area code 213) and somewhere in Irving (area code 949). Or, most of the colocation facilities appear to be located in these two areas. Does either one of these areas offer any advantage over the other? Who are the better providers of voice circuits in the LA area? Everyone offers T1s but as soon as they are told what we want to do they suggest contacting PacBell. Focal and Winstar are also mentioned. Any comments would be appreciated. Raymond D. Mereniuk Raymond@fbn.bc.ca History of a Telco, A Fairy Tale http://www.fbn.bc.ca/telcohis.html - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 24 Jan 2001 15:37:17 -0500 From: johnl@iecc.com (John R. Levine) Subject: Re: Los Angeles Area Questions > Who are the better providers of voice circuits in the LA area? > Everyone offers T1s but as soon as they are told what we want to do > they suggest contacting PacBell. I'm not surprised -- it looks to me like you're acting like a long distance carrier. That's perfectly legal, but if you do you have to play by the rules which probably involve getting FG A trunks rather than plain old phone lines. FG A isn't the end of the world, it often turns out that you end up paying less per minute than you would with POTS business lines. - -- John R. Levine, IECC, POB 727, Trumansburg NY 14886 +1 607 387 6869 johnl@iecc.com, Village Trustee and Sewer Commissioner, http://iecc.com/johnl, Member, Provisional board, Coalition Against Unsolicited Commercial E-mail - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 24 Jan 2001 23:28:50 -0500 From: Monty Solomon Subject: The Wild World of Wireless January 15, 2001 The Wide World of Wireless While protocols battle in the U.S., the war's over in the rest of the world. By Genia Jones The Federal Communication Commission's decision to allow multiple wireless standards to duke it out in the U.S. market has yet to result in a clear winner. Mobile providers have established an array of standards defining the way calls and data are transmitted. But unfortunately for these companies and their customers, wireless protocols are often incompatible and limited to a small range of frequencies. Translation: A mobile phone that works in San Francisco may not work in Las Vegas. http://www.thestandard.com/article/display/0,1151,21434,00.html - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 24 Jan 2001 23:51:58 -0500 From: Monty Solomon Subject: Latin America's New King of Cellular? Latin America's New King of Cellular? Telefonica and Portugal Telecom want to form a $10 billion joint venture in Brazil, which they say would make it the region's biggest carrier. By Juan Carlos Perez - IDG News Spain's Telefonica and Portugal Telecom announced Wednesday that they have agreed to form a $10 billion joint venture to combine their mobile telephony operations in Brazil, Latin America's largest telecom market. http://www.thestandard.com/article/display/0,1151,21654,00.html - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 25 Jan 2001 00:06:10 -0500 From: Monty Solomon Subject: PhoneFree to start charging for calls PhoneFree to start charging for calls PhoneFree.com is no longer free. The Internet-based phone company has exited the business of providing free domestic phone calls from PCs to regular phones--and is now charging consumers 2 cents per minute. PhoneFree, which began offering the free advertising-based service this summer, needed to start charging its customers because of slow ad sales, said PhoneFree Chief Executive Jan Horsfall. The company began billing customers last Thursday. http://news.cnet.com/news/0-1004-200-4588413.html - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 25 Jan 2001 00:51:47 -0500 From: "Raymond D. Mereniuk" Subject: Re: Los Angeles Area Questions Louie wrote > There is a company (locally) Pac-West that offers voice circuits. > > http://www.pacwest.com > > As far as Irvine versus downtown LA Wilshire & 7th, it's easier to park in > Irvine (usually) and less expensive (usually). Downtown might be more > vulnerable to rolling blackouts (a hot subject here in Calif). Otherwise, > probably no advantage one over the other. In the LA area there appears to be four types of colo facilities 1) big national players with their own national network 2) independents w/multiple Tier 1 connections W/BGP4 3) completely carrier neutral with no house IP connectivity 4) smaller players I talked to 1, 2 and 3 type facilities. All but one offered house UPS and generator backup. The exception had generator backup after 10 to 15 seconds. Some facilities do not include power as part of the rental, it is an add-on extra. Since you pay for power as an extra they up the value with UPS and generator backup. >From an outsider's point of view LA appears to have two highly wired areas which could be called Telecom districts (from someone's web site). I don't know much about Irvine but the downtown Telecom district appears to be Wilshire and West 7th Street. A prime location appears to be 1200 West 7th Street which is also called the Garland Building. It was built ~30 years ago as a data center and the building had UPS and generator backup as a basic feature. It is probably still a data center for someone plus there are now at least six companies offering colocation facilities. >From our point of view we really don't care where it is located as chances are no one will ever visit the site. The equipment will be assembled elsewhere, tested and then shipped to LA. Most colo facilities offer free business hours reboot services and offer a "Remote Hands" service by the hour. A major concern is what area is best, or most economical, to make calls from. Does either area offer a benefit in lower metered rates to a larger area than the other. What are the meter rates for local calls in the LA area? My understanding of the power situation in LA is that the utility is municipally owned and operated and they had opted out of deregulation. Their system is independent from the California power grid and supply exceeds demand so there should be no issue with rolling black-outs in LA. Virtually Raymond D. Mereniuk Raymond@fbn.bc.ca "The Ultimate Enterprise Security Experts" http://www.fbn.bc.ca/sysecurt.html - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 25 Jan 2001 01:14:44 -0500 From: "Raymond D. Mereniuk" Subject: Re: Los Angeles Area Questions johnl@iecc.com (John R. Levine) wrote > I'm not surprised -- it looks to me like you're acting like a long > distance carrier. That's perfectly legal, but if you do you have to > play by the rules which probably involve getting FG A trunks rather > than plain old phone lines. > > FG A isn't the end of the world, it often turns out that you end up > paying less per minute than you would with POTS business lines. The principals are offering long distance services on a packet switched network. Or, in other words VoIP. I am sure they intend to play by the rules as they are already offering the service in the LA area. The voice lines will be ordered as channelized T1s and the terminating equipment has an integrated channel bank. When you order such voice T1s do you not have to choose a FG feature set with the choices being A, B, C or D? I have mainly done data stuff in the past so all this is new to me. Any comments would be appreciated. Virtually Raymond D. Mereniuk Raymond@fbn.bc.ca "Need Someone To Tell You What To Do?" FBN - The Consultants http://www.fbn.bc.ca/consultg.html - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 23:15:15 -0500 From: "Judith Oppenheimer" Subject: 1/24/01 ICBTollFreeNews.Com HEADS UP HEADLINES ____________________________________________________ ICBTollFreeNews.Com HEADS UP HEADLINES ____________________________________________________ from ICB Toll Free News - Daily News and Intelligence covering the Political, Legal and Marketing Arenas of 800 and Dot Com. ____________________________________________________ CONTENTS - - INTERNET GOVERNANCE CONFERENCE - - GRACE ENDS FOR CA DOMAINS FEB 1 - - ENUM GLOSSARY - - JAN ITU ENUM WORKSHOP - CHM'S REPORT ___________________________________________________ EVERY 3.6 SECONDS SOMEONE DIES FROM HUNGER http://www.hungersite.com/ ____________________________________________________ ARTICLE ACCESS CODE LEGEND ICB Toll Free News offers two valuable service options: F = Free - News and Features articles P = Premium - Unlimited Site Access including all Articles and Documents. ____________________________________________________ HEADLINES for January 24, 2001 F - INTERNET GOVERNANCE CONFERENCE On April 6, 2001 the Bertelsmann Foundation and the Friedrich Ebert Foundation will present an international conference in Berlin entitled "Internet Governance - Who controls the Internet?" CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=5022 F - GRACE ENDS FOR CA DOMAINS FEB 1 These .ca domain names were reserved by the Canadian Registration Authority (CIRA), but have still not been re-registered. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=5021 P - ENUM GLOSSARY dot arpa, zone, Zone ... what's it all mean? CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=5019 P - JAN ITU ENUM WORKSHOP - CHM'S REPORT “The United States appreciates the efforts of the ITU to raise awareness about the ENUM protocol recently developed by the Internet Engineering Task Force (IETF). We note that ENUM is in the nascent stages of emergence and is a matter of active discussion in many communities..." 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All rights reserved. ____________________________________________________ ____________________________________________________ ------------------------------ End of Telecom Digest V2000 #198 ******************************** Date: 26 Jan 2001 06:15:11 -0500 From: owner-telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org (Telecom Digest) To: telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org Subject: Telecom Digest V2000 #199 Telecom Digest Friday, January 26 2001 Volume 2000 : Number 199 In this issue: Question about InTRA-LATA "PIC" Validation Re: PhoneFree to start charging for calls N11 codes Transmission of network TV video in the "good ole days" Re: $2400 per minute for 809 calls - nonsense! Re: Transmission of network TV video in the "good ole days" Re: Los Angeles Area Questions Re: Telco Transmission of Network Radio/Television in the "old days" 1/25/01 ICBTollFreeNews.Com HEADS UP HEADLINES Re: Question about InTRA-LATA "PIC" Validation ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 25 Jan 2001 11:16:52 -0500 From: Mark J Cuccia Subject: Question about InTRA-LATA "PIC" Validation This applies to the US only... Now that (most of) the US has inTRA-LATA "PIC"ing, there has been a way to verify who your primary inTRA-LATA toll carrier is. The inTER-LATA 'pic' validation in the US, and "toll pic" validation in Canada (I don't know this yet applies to the non-US portion of the NANP-Caribbean, since I don't know if there is "toll pic-ing" yet on any one of those islands in the same way we have it here in the US and Canada) is (1)-700-555-4141. Sometimes, depending on reseller service provider arrangements with the facilities-based carrier they are using, a different - -xxxx line-number might be used. The leading 1+ may or may not be required, depending... i.e., it may be permissive to NOT 'have' to use the 1+ before 700-555-4141 in some areas. Some carriers allow you to reach their PIC-validation recording on ANY -xxxx line-number. But for inTRA-LATA Toll 'pic' validation (applies to US ONLY), the standard is supposed to be: (1)-(home NPA)-700-4141. Again, the situation of various or "any" -xxxx line-number as described above for inTER-LATA 700-555-xxxx as described in the above paragraph might also apply. But there is an "inconsistancy" on the dialing procedures for the inTRA-LATA toll-pic validation. Some areas use straight seven-digits 700-4141 Some areas use mandatory ten-digits, Home-NPA + 700-4141 (with no '1+' required) And some might require 1+ ten-digits (h-NPA + 700-4141) Here in New Orleans, I can ONLY reach my inTRA-LATA toll-pic validation recording as 1+504-700-4141 -- the "straight" ten-digits 504-700-4141 nor the straight seven-digits 700-4141 does NOT work. I'm curious as to which places use which types of dialing, and allow other formats as well... Also, in the US, there are THREE "geographic-POTS" area codes which have a POTS c.o.code 700! 213-700 - wireless prefix in Los Angeles 818-700 - SBC-Pac*Bell landline prefix, Northridge CA NORGCA11DS1 847-700 - SBC-Ameritech landline prefix, Elk Grove Village IL EGVGILEGDS1 [Regarding the 700 c.o.code prefix w/in SAC NPAs: Obviously, there are 8zz-700 prefixes in the toll-free SACs, there *IS* a 900-700 prefix, and there "could" be but presently is NOT any 500-700 nor 456-700 prefix, and I don't know offhand if there is or is not any 600-700 prefix; Since LATAs as used in the US don't apply to the non-US portions of the NANP, there "could" be NPA-700 prefixes in Canada and non-US NANP-Carb: Toronto ON (Canada) does have a 416-700 wireless prefix, Jamaica has a wireless 876-700 prefix. But the "non-geographic" SAC NPAs, and the non-US (Canada, non-US NANP-Caribbean) parts of the NANP don't "apply" to NPA-700-4141 inTRA-LATA pic-validation situations.] I understand from SBC-Pac*Bell that if you are in the 213 or 818 NPAs, you dial 1-805-700-4141 to verify your inTRA-LATA toll-pic. The 805 NPA is also in the So.Cal area. I wonder if you could also get your inTRA-LATA toll-pic validation recording with 1-714-700-4141 or using OTHER similar adjacent/nearby NPAs in So.Cal (where there is no local 700 c.o.code prefix), as 1+NPA-700-4141. I wonder what people in the northern Chicago suburbs area (NPA 847) dial for inTRA-LATA pic-validation, since there is that 847-700 code in Elk Grove IL (and it is SBC-Ameritech as well). Does SBC-Ameritech have them dial 1-[312/773/630/815/708]-700-4141? Do some/all of those "work"? Could it also be that the -4141 line-number in Elk Grove IL (EGVGILEGDS1) has been "unassigned" and possibly now flagged as "special/reserved - do not assign - use for 'L' PIC" ??? Thus you *DO* dial (1-847)-700-4141 within the 847 NPA to validate your inTRA-LATA toll pic? However, if that NPA is considered "out-of-LATA", you MIGHT go to the inTRA-LATA PIC validation recording of your inTER-LATA PIC, on 1+NPA-700-4141! BellSouth is my inTRA-LATA PIC AT&T is my inTER-LATA PIC If I dial something like 1-601-700-4141 or 1-228-700-4141 (both NPAs considered OUT-of-LATA, even though 601-772 Crossroads MS is IN my own New Orleans LATA), I do NOT go to BellSouth's inTRA-LATA PIC validation recording, but rather to AT&T's inTRA-LATA PIC validation announcement. Of course, AT&T is my inTER-LATA pic. Other interesting things on BOTH inTRA-LATA (1)-(home/adj-NPA)-700-4141 AND inTER-LATA (1)-700-555-4141 can be found when trying to dial with CIC/CAC codes 101-XXXX+ prior to the valdiation number! As far as I know, except for some special routing situations w/r/t incumbents vs CLECs for places using 611 for Repair and 811 for Bus.Offc, you really do NOT (yet) have any "standard" valdiation type number to find out who your Local Service Provider happens to be! MAYBE 611/811 (where those codes have traditionally been used) MIGHT route to the Repair/Bus.Offc of your LEC/CLEC rather than simply "defaulted" to the incumbent LEC's Repair/Bus.Offc. Most (if not all) parts of South Central Bell have never really used 611/811. The number to call BellSouth Repair/Bus.Offc from S.C.Bell states (KY, TN, AL, MS, LA) is a special toll-free seven-digit number, 557-xxxx. I assume that CLECs who properly recognize 557 w/in SCBell area codes/LATAs route 557-xxxx to the local BellSouth tandem for BellSouth "official" numbers. I know that there are independent incumbent telcos in Louisiana and Mississippi who recognize 557-xxxx and route the call ultimately to BellSouth (SCBell) "official" departments. BellSouth in Louisiana now offeres "PIC-FREEZING" on ALL THREE situations: - - inTER-LATA toll-PIC Freeze (available for several years now) - - inTRA-LATA toll-PIC Freeze (available since 1999 when inTRA-LATA pic'ing first started) - - and NOW they offer "LSP" Freezing! Where you can FREEZE your LSP to BellSouth (or whoever), as per recent La.PSC order. The initiation of a "FREEZE" (thru the Buss.Offc) of a PIC or LEC/LSP is to reduce/prevent the rampant situations of fraudulent SLAMMING. But, I *AM* curious as to which format(S) for inTRA-LATA PIC validation work in different areas... - - 700-4141 straight seven-d AND/OR - - home/adjacent-NPA + 700-4141 (straight) ten-d (with no 1+) AND/OR - - 1+ before ten-d (home/adj.NPA + 700-4141) Thanks for any results reported here! MARK_J._CUCCIA__PHONE/WRITE/WIRE/CABLE:__HOME:__(USA)__Tel:_CHestnut-1-2497 WORK:__mcuccia@mailhost.tcs.tulane.edu|4710-Wright-Road|__(+1-504-241-2497) Tel:UNiversity-5-5954(+1-504-865-5954)|New-Orleans-28__|fwds-on-no-answr-to Fax:UNiversity-5-5917(+1-504-865-5917)|Louisiana(70128)|cellular/voicemail- ============================================================ - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 25 Jan 2001 12:46:36 -0500 From: scsmediafmp@aol.com (Steven Scharf) Subject: Re: PhoneFree to start charging for calls Guess they gunna have to change thier name: Phone2Cents Plus look at our advts. Sounds like the next Dot.Com that will bite the dust. Steven Scharf SCS Media Services PO Box 4135 Portland, Maine 04101 Tel: 207-774-9393 Fax: 207-774-1819 SCSMedia@aol.com Monty Solomon monty@roscom.com posted: PhoneFree to start charging for calls PhoneFree.com is no longer free. The Internet-based phone company has exited the business of providing free domestic phone calls from PCs to regular phones--and is now charging consumers 2 cents per minute. PhoneFree, which began offering the free advertising-based service this summer, needed to start charging its customers because of slow ad sales, said PhoneFree Chief Executive Jan Horsfall. The company began billing customers last Thursday. http://news.cnet.com/news/0-1004-200-4588413.html - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 25 Jan 2001 13:08:49 -0500 From: wollman@lcs.mit.edu (Garrett Wollman) Subject: N11 codes In article , Mark J Cuccia wrote: >Most (if not all) parts of South Central Bell have never really used >611/811. Where I grew up in Vermont, there were *no* N11 codes in use before Enhanced-911 was implemented. I never tried dialing codes at random to see what they did, but I do recall: - - directory assistance was 1-555-1212 everywhere (not 411) - - emergency services were seven-digit local calls listed on the inside front cover of the phone book - - repair and business office information had to be looked up in the book We lived in Contel territory (802-434 Richmond), and received the NET&T Burlington phone book with a Contel cover instead of the usual New England Telephone cover. To find our phone company's business number involved looking for the ``other phone companies serving this area'' section in the front matter. Not long after we left, Contel got swallowed and in the process sold its Vermont exchanges; I believe Richmond went to NYNEX. - -GAWollman - -- Garrett A. Wollman | O Siem / We are all family / O Siem / We're all the same wollman@lcs.mit.edu | O Siem / The fires of freedom Opinions not those of| Dance in the burning flame MIT, LCS, CRS, or NSA| - Susan Aglukark and Chad Irschick - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 25 Jan 2001 16:27:57 -0500 From: Diamond Dave Subject: Transmission of network TV video in the "good ole days" This is directed for those who either were around back in the early days of TV or know the technologial history of it. Exactly how were TV programs sent via AT&T Long Lines coax systems or terrestrial microwave (both audio and video) from the major networks (ABC, CBS, NBC and possibly PBS) from the early days of TV until satellite transmissions were the norm. I know the video signals were seperated from the audio signals. But I heard there were problems getting the audio and video to sync in time, so what systems to get them to sync were used? I also heard that the audio was looped back to network headquarters (New York?) to make sure the audio singal was able to get to the farthest point in the chain. Were the video signals sent as baseband (4.5 Mhz video) or were they multiplexed? I'm assuming it was a composite signal and not a seperation of the black and white and color information. Was it sent as vestigial side band (VSB) as typical NTSC analog video is broadcast via the air or normal analog cable TV? I've found a number of websites on how network radio was sent to networked stations, but have yet to find one for early TV. Thanks Dave Perrussel Webmaster - Telephone World http://phworld.tal-on.com (moving soon to a new location!) - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 25 Jan 2001 17:06:32 -0500 From: rivas_manuel@hotmail.com Subject: Re: $2400 per minute for 809 calls - nonsense! In article , "John R. Covert Spam Sink" wrote: > , simply said that Verizon didn't know what rates would be > charged, since they were not in the business of providing international > calling. > Verizon owns CODETEL, the leading telephone company here in the Dominican Republic where 809 area code belongs. http://www.codetel.net.do They do know what rates would be charged, and they know that there are some codes that are dialed "after" the 809 area code that are Pay-per- call. Manuel Rivas Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 25 Jan 2001 19:39:25 -0500 From: Wes Leatherock Subject: Re: Transmission of network TV video in the "good ole days" The video was sent as straight NTSC signals. As far as multiplexing, all the toll routes, microwave or coax, were channelized with thousands of channels. The rule of thumb was that a video channel took the same space as 600 voice grade channels. (Since some of the coax systems only could accomodate 600 voice channels per tube, this meant one video channel took up one tube.) Remote feeds were generally set up to feed back to the network's control center in New York where they were switched like feeds from local cameras. Where there was not time or not sufficient facilities, hot switching was needed at each telco TOC in real time...often reversing direction of channel (depending on where the remote pickup was coming from) and each TOC had to be on its toes to switch at the same moment and to restore the normal path at the same moment. The tariff also provided a protection channel would be available on every route in case a working channel failed, and exceptionally for telco tariffs, provided rebates and compensation if there was a channel. As you can imagine, with this kind of protection, the rates were plenty high, and video channels got very careful attention. Eventually there was a tariff providing for just the channel with no protection channel and no rebates at a much lower price, primarily for (and perhaps restricted to) educational stations. Wes Leatherock wleath@sandbox.dynip.com On 25 Jan 2001 16:27:57 -0500 Diamond Dave wrote: > This is directed for those who either were around back in the early > days of TV or know the technologial history of it. > > Exactly how were TV programs sent via AT&T Long Lines coax systems or > terrestrial microwave (both audio and video) from the major networks > (ABC, CBS, NBC and possibly PBS) from the early days of TV until > satellite transmissions were the norm. > > I know the video signals were seperated from the audio signals. But I > heard there were problems getting the audio and video to sync in time, > so what systems to get them to sync were used? I also heard that the > audio was looped back to network headquarters (New York?) to make sure > the audio singal was able to get to the farthest point in the chain. > > Were the video signals sent as baseband (4.5 Mhz video) or were they > multiplexed? I'm assuming it was a composite signal and not a > seperation of the black and white and color information. Was it sent > as vestigial side band (VSB) as typical NTSC analog video is broadcast > via the air or normal analog cable TV? > > I've found a number of websites on how network radio was sent to > networked stations, but have yet to find one for early TV. > > Thanks > > Dave Perrussel > Webmaster - Telephone World > http://phworld.tal-on.com (moving soon to a new location!) - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 25 Jan 2001 19:42:55 -0500 From: Wes Leatherock Subject: Re: Los Angeles Area Questions On 25 Jan 2001 00:51:47 -0500 Raymond D. Mereniuk wrote: [ ... text deleted ... ] > My understanding of the power situation in LA is that the utility is > municipally owned and operated and they had opted out of > deregulation. Their system is independent from the California > power grid and supply exceeds demand so there should be no > issue with rolling black-outs in LA. The LA municipal power system is selling power into the grid, and could sell more if the transmission lines had greater capacity. This reliability only applies within the city limits of Los Angeles, not the entire metropolitan area. Wes Leatherock wleath@sandbox.dynip.com - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 25 Jan 2001 22:55:37 -0500 From: Mark J Cuccia Subject: Re: Telco Transmission of Network Radio/Television in the "old days" I read the same article on the Internet regarding Telco transmission of network radio which stated that there were problems with network TV audio not necessarily being "in sync" with the video, even on a short-hop between NY and Wash.DC.... i.e., audio of spoken words were not sync'd properly with the video of lip-movements. The article (authored by Fred Krock) is at a site devoted to Radio broadcast history, and the specific article is called "That Network Radio 'Sound'", dealing with telco distribution of coast-to-coast nationwide distribution of CBS Radio, NBC Radio, Mutual Radio, and ABC Radio, in the "good-old-days". http://www.adams.net/~jfs/netsnd.htm I can remember growing up back in the 1960s and 70s, that the major TV and radio networks used 5.0 Khz bandwidth equalized audio lines to distribute their programs nationwide. If you lived a distance away from the network point of origins for that particular program, you heard more "intensity" of "that network sound". Major markets had 5.0 Khz bandwidth audio for radio, I think all interconnected affiliates regardless of the size of the market got 5.0 khz bandwidth TV audio. But smaller, rural market affiliates of the radio networks usually had to be the ones paying telco for connection to the closest network-paid leased ccts. Thus, CBS, NBC and ABC Radio usually had a final "telephone sound" 3.0 or 3.5 Khz bandwidth acoustic quality (although if the closest connection at telco to the 'backbone' 5Khz audio line were a distance away from a network program point of origin, you'd still hear the "sound" of 5.0 Khz audio hum in addition to the even more inferior 3.0 to 3.5 Khz "telephone quality" audio). The Mutual Broadcasting System, which was radio only, and never really got into Television, was always shorter on "cash" when compared with Sarnoff's RCA/NBC, Paley's CBS, or United-Paramount-Theaters' ABC. Thus even some major markets (such as New Orleans) received Mutual Radio from AT&T on 3.5 Khz bandwidth audio, at least in the 1970's. I can remember before Mutual went satellite in the very late 1970's, hearing 5.0 Khz type audio, but "as if" it were being played through a telephone. Somewhere after Washington DC (actually Arlington VA), Mutual's "trip" to New Orleans "dropped" from 5.0 Khz lines down to 3.5 Khz Bell System landlines. I can remember in the late 1970's pre-satellite, hearing The Larry King Show on 50-Kw WSB-750 Atlanta in the overnights, where Mutual entered Atlanta on full 5.0 Khz bandwidth lines, yet if I'd switch over to whichever local New Orleans station at the time was carrying Larry King from Mutual (sometimes it was WGSO-1280, or it could be WSMB-1350, or even WWIW-1450) hearing the 5.0 Khz "quality" but also as it was dropped to 3.5 Khz "if it were" a 5.0 Khz bandwidth feed being played into a telephone. Sometime around 1979, Mutual started using satellite instead of 5.0 Khz lines to get to its BIGGEST markets. I think Mutual came into New Orleans at AT&T/SCBell, FROM Dallas. Mutual originated SOME programs from Dallas at the time as well, for some southern and southwestern states. It seems that Dallas was now getting Mutual via wider-band satellite channels, but the feed to New Orleans was still using 3.5 Khz bandwidth lines from Dallas. The 5.0 "quality" was gone, and all that was there was the "telephone call" sound. This remained until the stations here carrying Mutual started activating their own new satellite dishes. Anyhow, I don't know what "differences" AT&T/Bell had for audio regarding network TV audio vs. network radio, during the 1960's and 70's. Both network TV and network Radio SOUNDED THE SAME.... with a noticeable 5.0 Khz qulaity. However, in Spring/Summer 1978... The three commercial TV networks (and maybe PBS as well) and AT&T worked out a new technology (which was written up in Broadcasting Magazine at the time as well), called "DIPLEXING", where TWO or even FOUR full wide 15.0 Khz quality audio channels were actually MULTIPLEXED into the video signal. I can remember it was a "sporadic" thing for a few weeks... One night, WVUE-TV-8 would be getting ABC-TV with 15.0 Khz audio from the diplex method, yet the following night, ABC-TV audio on WVUE-8 would be back to "network sound" 5.0 audio. Yet both nights, WWL-4 would be getting CBS-TV in full 15.0 Khz diplexed audio, yet WDSU-6 would get NBC-TV's audio only in 5.0 "netowrk" audio both nites. The network TV stations in Baton Rouge LA might have the exact flip-flop of what I described. It took a few months to get the whole country activated for di-plex 15.0 Khz audio for network TV.... there was some training and new equipment/installation and testing to be done by both the TV stations' engineering departments as well as by Telco -- and this had to be done for every market in the country for every affiliate, for every network, and for every telco "repeater" point. By Summer 1978, most of the country was regularly airing network TV with "diplexed" audio as 15.0 Khz wider bandwidth audio quality. Probably by the Fall of 1978, for the new 1978/79 TV season, all three networks had AT&T pull the plug on the separate but parallel to the video co-ax/microwave 5.0 Khz audio lines for network TV audio, since everyone was now using the diplex method. Satellite distribution for MOST major nationwide radio and TV has basically obsoleted Telco being involved for most major national hauling of broadcast companies' audio/video. Telco is still usually involved to a freat degree for local applications, such as studio-to-transmitter links, but even that can be on private microwave as well. One more thing regarding the diplex method for network TV audio... Since you could multiplex TWO or EVEN FOUR, FULL 15.0 Khz bandwidth audio channels into the video signal over the telco co-ax/microwave, the networks were considering the possiblity of STEREOPHONIC audio, or maybe use the second audio channel for alternate language (Spanish for Hispanic markets, or maybe French for some markets in New England close to Quebec), OR, CBS was considering disconnecting the Bell System 5.0 Khz audio lines for the CBS RAD))|((O NETWORK, and instead run that as the "secondary audio channel" multiplexed with the video signal of Bell System co-ax and microwave for the CBS Television Network. This would allow CBS Radio Network programming (especially the CBS Radio Mystery Theater which was still in production and aired over the network at the time) to be heard in full 15.0 Khz bandwidth quality. However, this never came to be. One of the disadvantages was if there were a fault in the network line, not only would CBS TV's audio AND video be "down", but also the CBS Radio Network would be "down" as well. Prior to diplexing, you could have problems on TV networks where you could have the video "down" but still have audio working right, or vice-versa. Another operational "headache" that CBS and Bell would have had if they used the secondary diplexed audio channel of CBS-TV to be used for CBS Radio would be how to handle feeding markets (smaller ones) where there was a CBS Radio affiliate, but no CBS TV affiliate (if any TV station at all). Should that station have to continue to lease (or the network pay for) a 5.0 (or maybe even a new broader and more expensive 15.0 Khz) traditional telco audio line? It was a matter of trying to "configure" things where both CBS Radio and CBS Television would be fed togather over the same line to MOST of the country, yet there may be differences (INCLUDING differences in TIME-ZONE delaying) between the radio side and the TV side of CBS for certain markets. The stereo possibility by using each audio channel in the diplex, one for left, one for right, was probably more suited as an option under diplexing. However, in the late 1970's, Stereo audio for TV was still not being done in the US. True, TV audio (at least in the western hemisphere) is Frequency Modulation, and the FCC had approved FM Stereo for RADIO FM in the early 1960's, but FM Stereo for TV's FM audio had never been approved nor implemented. (If you have a Channel 6 in your market, if you're in the western hemisphere, most FM radios can be tuned down to approx 88 Mhz, since Channel 6's spot in the spectrum is between 82 and 88 Mhz, the audio being something around 87.25 or so Mhz). TV Stereo audio came about (if I remember right) in the early/mid 1980's. And it is NOT the same format as FM Stereo for Radio. Even if you use an FM Stereo radio tuned down to 88 or so Mhz, if you have a Channel 6 in your market, you won't get the audio for that Channel 6 in stereo, because FM Stereo for Radio is NOT the same as (FM Audio) TV Stereo Audio. BTW, most of the TV and Radio networks which were still using AT&T/Bell lines for long-haul national distribution seemed to make a CRASH run to RCA-Satcom satellite distribution nationwide during 1983, probably because of "fears" of what the breakup of AT&T/Bell would do to them in 1984. Mutual and government-involved NPR had already gone to (analog) Western Union Westar satellite distribution by the early 1980's. But CBS Radio, NBC Radio, ABC Radio, and the (at the time known as) RKO Radio Networks decided to use RCA-Satcom, in DIGITAL. There were advantages and disadvantages to each - analog vs. digital... You probably got a "cleaner" signal with digital, but all program and network channels for digital transmission had to all be time-division-multiplexed into a single stream and use an entire satellite "transponder". And all had to be uplinked togather at the same site. RCA->GE had an uplink site in NJ for NYCity origination transponder, an uplink site in VA (or MD?) for Wash DC origination transponder, and a transponder and uplink site in CA dedicated to Los Angeles/H'wood program originations. Things had to be "fixed" this way. (I don't know what ABC Radio did with Paul Harvey's Chicago originations though.... maybe backhauled the program via Western Union analog Westar to NY and then feed it via RCA-Satcom NY/NJ uplink "as if" it were a NY origination?) However, with analog/Westar, a single transponder could have multiple channels spaced apart on the spectrum, and each channel could have origination uplinks from numerous different areas, simultaneously! Finally: A lot has changed with network radio programming and operations as well since everything was virtually all satellite by the mid-1980's, mostly involving mega-corporate-mergers and joint-ventures, such as you basically have now only CBS and ABC -- or sometimes called Westwood/Infinity and Disney/CapCities. Mutual (or what was called Mutual) and the radio side of NBC (under contract to General Electric) as well as distribution of CNN for Radio, and others, are all part of CBS/Westwood/Infinity/Unistar/Viacom/Paramount/etc.etc. mega media corporate conglomerate. Some of these megers/joint-ventures, as well as new/enhanced technology (ABC uses SEDAT digital which is an improvement and compresses even more audio channels than the 'DAT' of the early/mid 80's digital satellite audio), have also changed up a lot of the operational/program/production procedures of the radio networks that were finalized in the mid-1980's as well. MARK_J._CUCCIA__PHONE/WRITE/WIRE/CABLE:__HOME:__(USA)__Tel:_CHestnut-1-2497 WORK:__mcuccia@mailhost.tcs.tulane.edu|4710-Wright-Road|__(+1-504-241-2497) Tel:UNiversity-5-5954(+1-504-865-5954)|New-Orleans-28__|fwds-on-no-answr-to Fax:UNiversity-5-5917(+1-504-865-5917)|Louisiana(70128)|cellular/voicemail- ============================ - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 00:31:44 -0500 From: "Judith Oppenheimer" Subject: 1/25/01 ICBTollFreeNews.Com HEADS UP HEADLINES ____________________________________________________ ICBTollFreeNews.Com HEADS UP HEADLINES ____________________________________________________ from ICB Toll Free News - Daily News and Intelligence covering the Political, Legal and Marketing Arenas of 800 and Dot Com. ____________________________________________________ CONTENTS - - A DOT TEL PLEADS ITS CASE - - TLD HEARINGS, RESULT OF DYSON DISS? - - RUMOR MILL - - INDUSTRY SEEKS FCC HELP WITH NAB ___________________________________________________ EVERY 3.6 SECONDS SOMEONE DIES FROM HUNGER http://www.hungersite.com/ ____________________________________________________ ARTICLE ACCESS CODE LEGEND ICB Toll Free News offers two valuable service options: F = Free - News and Features articles P = Premium - Unlimited Site Access including all Articles and Documents. ____________________________________________________ HEADLINES for January 25, 2001 F - A DOT TEL PLEADS ITS CASE "it is the view of the Directors of Telnic that there is no justifiable reason why the issuance of the .TEL TLD to Telnic was withheld." CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=5026 F - TLD HEARINGS, RESULT OF DYSON DISS? It couldn't possibly surprise anyone who watched Esther Dyson publicly dress down and dismiss DotTV in Marina Del Rey last November: DotTV has asked Congress to suspend new TLD implementation and reopen the application process. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=5025 P - RUMOR MILL Which new gTLD company is said to be bleeding bucks ... and what's eating up at least 20% of ICANN's hefty legal fees? CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=5024 P - INDUSTRY SEEKS FCC HELP WITH NAB "A significant network reliability concern to the telecommunications industry is the impact of [typically toll free] Media Stimulated Mass Calling (MSMC) events. CONTINUED HERE: http://www.icbtollfree.com/article.cfm?articleId=5023 ____________________________________________________ _______________Please visit our sponsors.________________ For an unforgettable toll free vanity 800 number and matching domain name ... 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Sullivan" Subject: Re: Question about InTRA-LATA "PIC" Validation "Mark J Cuccia" wrote in message news:Pine.A41.4.20.0101251020360.12520-100000@rs6.tcs.tulane.edu... > But for inTRA-LATA Toll 'pic' validation (applies to US ONLY), the > standard is supposed to be: (1)-(home NPA)-700-4141. Again, the situation > of various or "any" -xxxx line-number as described above for inTER-LATA > 700-555-xxxx as described in the above paragraph might also apply. > > But there is an "inconsistancy" on the dialing procedures for the > inTRA-LATA toll-pic validation. > > Some areas use straight seven-digits 700-4141 > > Some areas use mandatory ten-digits, Home-NPA + 700-4141 > (with no '1+' required) > > And some might require 1+ ten-digits (h-NPA + 700-4141) > > Here in New Orleans, I can ONLY reach my inTRA-LATA toll-pic validation > recording as 1+504-700-4141 -- the "straight" ten-digits 504-700-4141 nor > the straight seven-digits 700-4141 does NOT work. > > I'm curious as to which places use which types of dialing, and allow other > formats as well... Here in NPA 301 (Montgomery County, Md., just outside D.C.), where we have mandatory 10-digit dialing for local (in or out of home NPA) (with 1+10DD local calling permitted) and 1+10DD for toll (in or out of home NPA), when I dial 1-301-700-4141, James Earl Jones tells me that I'm using Verizon for regional calling. When I dial 301-700-4141, I get a doo-daa-dee tone and then a disembodied female voice tells me I hafta dial "1" to reach this number. If I dial using any of the adjacent area codes or my NPA's overlay code (240), I get the doo-daa-dee and a disembodied female voice saying we can't complete the call as dialed; this result holds whether I use the "1" or not. - -- Michael D. Sullivan avogadro@bellatlantic.net Bethesda, MD, USA - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ End of Telecom Digest V2000 #199 ******************************** Date: 27 Jan 2001 06:15:16 -0500 From: owner-telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org (Telecom Digest) To: telecom-digest@telecom-digest.org Subject: Telecom Digest V2000 #200 Telecom Digest Saturday, January 27 2001 Volume 2000 : Number 200 In this issue: Re: Transmission of network TV video in the "good ole days" Re: N11 codes Re: Making all telemarketing illegal Re: Making all telemarketing illegal Re: Making all telemarketing illegal Re: Transmission of network TV video in the "good ole days" Re: Making all telemarketing illegal Re: Making all telemarketing illegal Re: Making all telemarketing illegal Re: Transmission of network TV video in the "good ole days" Re: $2400 per minute for 809 calls - nonsense! Re: Los Angeles Area Questions Re: N11 codes possible sleazy method, was: Re: $2400 per minute for 809 calls - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 26 Jan 2001 09:07:31 -0500 From: oldbear@arctos.com (The Old Bear) Subject: Re: Transmission of network TV video in the "good ole days" Diamond Dave writes: >From: Diamond Dave >Newsgroups: comp.dcom.telecom >Subject: Transmission of network TV video in the "good ole days" >Date: 25 Jan 2001 16:27:57 -0500 >Organization: What organization? >Lines: 31 > >This is directed for those who either were around back in the early >days of TV or know the technologial history of it. > >Exactly how were TV programs sent via AT&T Long Lines coax systems or >terrestrial microwave (both audio and video) from the major networks >(ABC, CBS, NBC and possibly PBS) from the early days of TV until >satellite transmissions were the norm. Telecom Digest regulars Wes Leatherock and Marc Cuccia have done their usual excellect job of documenting the history of the technology in their replies to your question. To digress slightly, I recall as a child watching parts of the coronation of Queen Elizabeth in the early 1950s. It was a broadcast first because the *film* had been flown by military jet to the US and was put on the air within a matter of hours of the actual event. Then, maybe about 1960, I recall seeing a TV news story from Europe which had been sent by transatlantic cable using a bandwidth reduction technique of some sort where, if I recall the explantion, the frame rate was reduced and the video was sent not in real time but as an "stretched out" transmission which was then restored to something resembing full motion video -- but looking something like the slow-scan TV that was much later used to transmit images of the astronauts in space. The launch of Echo I, the inflatable aluminized mylar passive communications satelite, and subsequently Telstar, was a watershed event in telecom history. By the early 1960s, real-time TV broadcasts from across the Atlantic were not only possible, but quickly became an expected part of network news. If you couple this timetable with network television's beginnings toward the end of the 1940s, you see a technological revolution over a mere 15-year period. Remarkable by any standard. Cheers, The Old Bear - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 26 Jan 2001 11:26:04 -0500 From: merlyn@stonehenge.com (Randal L. Schwartz) Subject: Re: N11 codes >>>>> "Garrett" == Garrett Wollman writes: Garrett> Where I grew up in Vermont, there were *no* N11 codes in use before Garrett> Enhanced-911 was implemented. I never tried dialing codes at random Garrett> to see what they did, but I do recall: Garrett> - directory assistance was 1-555-1212 everywhere (not 411) Garrett> - emergency services were seven-digit local calls listed on the inside Garrett> front cover of the phone book Garrett> - repair and business office information had to be looked up in the Garrett> book Ditto Oregon. I had no idea what Aretha Franklin was singing about when she wanted "the 411 on somebody". I figured it was some urban slang. In fact, we used "113" for directory assistance locally, or 1-(AC)-555-1212 for "somewhere else". - -- Randal L. Schwartz - Stonehenge Consulting Services, Inc. - +1 503 777 0095 Perl/Unix/security consulting, Technical writing, Comedy, etc. etc. See PerlTraining.Stonehenge.com for onsite and open-enrollment Perl training! - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 26 Jan 2001 14:09:27 -0500 From: "hoffman" Subject: Re: Making all telemarketing illegal > What part of "Congress shall make no law . . . " eludes you? - -------------- Unfortunately, that doesnt seem to mean much anymore... Perhaps it never has. It is the conundrum of the way our country was devised. The Constitution isn't a law, and it holds very little "weight"; and the amount of "weight" it does held seems to diminish every decade. Politicians can, and do, pass laws on a routine basis which blately piss all over the Bill of Rights... It's up to the Supreme Court to attempt to remedy the situation after the fact; sometimes they do; oftentimes they dont. Thats the way our wonderful system was devised.. Checks & Balances... not so wonderful a system in my opinion... but then thats the subject of another newsgroup. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 26 Jan 2001 14:09:28 -0500 From: "hoffman" Subject: Re: Making all telemarketing illegal > The part that says your freedom of speech extends > onto phone lines that your unwilling listeners are > paying for. - ------------------ Really, you pay for incoming calls on your POTS line? Where do you live; remind me not to move there. [Denote the rhetorical nature of my sarcasm.] You don't pay for incoming calls unless your using a cellular phone... so this age-ol' mantra of the anti-telemarketers doesn't hold water. I'd respect the argument more simply based on the premise that you feel your being harrased. Claiming that your "paying" for the incoming telemarketer calls is really a stretch of truth. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 26 Jan 2001 14:40:05 -0500 From: sjsobol@NorthShoreTechnologies.net (Steve Sobol) Subject: Re: Making all telemarketing illegal >From 'hoffman': >> The part that says your freedom of speech extends >> onto phone lines that your unwilling listeners are >> paying for. >------------------ >Really, you pay for incoming calls on your POTS line? >Where do you live; remind me not to move there. >[Denote the rhetorical nature of my sarcasm.] > >You don't pay for incoming calls You don't pay per minute for incoming calls. You still do pay for the phone line. Next time, please try a more well-thought-out argument. Thank you; drive through. - -- Steve Sobol, BOFH, President 888.480.4NET 866.DSL.EXPRESS 216.619.2NET North Shore Technologies Corporation http://NorthShoreTechnologies.net JustTheNet/JustTheNet EXPRESS DSL (ISP Services) http://JustThe.net mailto:sjsobol@NorthShoreTechnologies.net Proud resident of Cleveland, OH - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 26 Jan 2001 15:46:28 -0500 From: "Ed Ellers" Subject: Re: Transmission of network TV video in the "good ole days" Wes Leatherock wrote: "The video was sent as straight NTSC signals." With one exception. The L-series coaxial systems didn't have enough bandwidth for NTSC color, so Bell Labs worked with RCA to develop a setup where the band from approximately 3.2-4.0 MHz (400 kHz either side of the subcarrier frequency of 3.58 MHz was converted down to 2.0-2.8 MHz, dropped back into the video signal, and then converted back up to the right frequency before sending it on to the affiliate in each city. "Remote feeds were generally set up to feed back to the network's control center in New York where they were switched like feeds from local cameras. Where there was not time or not sufficient facilities, hot switching was needed at each telco TOC in real time...often reversing direction of channel (depending on where the remote pickup was coming from) and each TOC had to be on its toes to switch at the same moment and to restore the normal path at the same moment." Normally these switches were done on a predetermined schedule, but there was one major exception. When NBC's Huntley-Brinkley Report began in 1956 -- with David Brinkley reporting from Washington, while Chet Huntley held down the fort in New York -- they didn't have the money in the show's budget to keep a line open to feed Brinkley's segments to New York, so AT&T had to switch the entire network between the two cities. That's why David and Chet always used each other's names to hand off the program -- to cue the AT&T technicians up and down the Eastern seaboard. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 26 Jan 2001 17:30:02 -0500 From: John David Galt Subject: Re: Making all telemarketing illegal Quoth hoffman@northeast.net: >> The part that says your freedom of speech extends >> onto phone lines that your unwilling listeners are >> paying for. > Really, you pay for incoming calls on your POTS line? > Where do you live; remind me not to move there. > [Denote the rhetorical nature of my sarcasm.] > > You don't pay for incoming calls unless your > using a cellular phone... so this age-ol' mantra > of the anti-telemarketers doesn't hold water. Suppose a bunch of the marketing folks from your local newspaper or car dealer show up in your front yard one evening, ring your doorbell, and want to spend ten minutes shouting and waving signs in your face. That wouldn't cost you any money, so does that mean you have to tolerate it? The cost of the calls isn't the point. The point is that a person's or family's phone line is their private property, rented to serve their own needs, and if you intrude upon it against their will, you are trespassing. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 26 Jan 2001 18:11:22 -0500 From: "hoffman" Subject: Re: Making all telemarketing illegal > You don't pay per minute for incoming calls. > You still do pay for the phone line. > Next time, please try a more well-thought-out > argument. - ------------------------ I hate telemarketers; as do many people. I think they're the bottom dwellers of the economic chain.. Nevertheless, it amuses me quite so when people rationalize the argument by claiming that they pay for the phone line. To which it can be replied: "so what, we all pay for the damned phone lines... whats the point." The phone company pays it's bills too... thats not a valid argument. WE ALL pay the telephone company so that we can both make calls and receive calls. The telemarketers pay their phone bills so that they can place calls... and there rights should be just as guaranteed as your rights. In short, you don't have any kind of right to have people not call you. Why? Because it's implied consent. You agreed to accept bullshit telemarketer phone calls the very minute you signed up for phone service. Implied consent. They have the right to call you up until such time as they violate the regulations or laws on the books pertaining to telemarketing and/or harrassment. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 26 Jan 2001 18:53:44 -0500 From: sjsobol@NorthShoreTechnologies.net (Steve Sobol) Subject: Re: Making all telemarketing illegal >From 'hoffman': >> You don't pay per minute for incoming calls. >> You still do pay for the phone line. >> Next time, please try a more well-thought-out >> argument. >WE ALL pay the telephone company so that >we can both make calls and receive calls. >The telemarketers pay their phone bills >so that they can place calls... and there rights >should be just as guaranteed as your rights. *sigh* Freedom of speech doesn't trump private property rights, either. The First Amendment doesn't allow you the right to stand in my home, bellowing in my ear. The First Amendment can not legally coerce anyone into listening to telemarketers. I'm sure you've been told all of this before. >In short, you don't have any kind of right to >have people not call you. Why? Because it's >implied consent. You agreed to accept bullshit >telemarketer phone calls the very minute you >signed up for phone service. Implied consent. Hm, must be the same with stalkers and other people who would harrass me. Wait a minute. That's not the case. If I tell someone not to call, they are not to call. If they continue calling anyhow, they're breaking the law. Funny how that works: According to the TCPA, if I demand that a company put me on their Do Not Call list, they must do so and refrain from calling, otherwise I can take them to court and collect damages. >They have the right to call you up until such time >as they violate the regulations or laws on the books >pertaining to telemarketing and/or harrassment. Amazingly enough, I just re-read this thread in Deja and nowhere do I see anyone claiming that all calls from businesses to individuals should be made illegal, least of all Gail Hall, the originator of the thread, who *specifically* *said* that was not the case. I do see a post in the original thread, made by John David Galt, that says >Ideally, all telemarketing should be limited by law to "opt-in" lists, and >no business should be able to demand that you accept their marketing calls >as a condition of doing business with them. Such a law, if it existed, would reinforce the ages-old principle I mentioned above, that yes, freedom of speech exists, but not where the exercise of such freedom impinges on other people's constitutional rights. It amuses me to no end, the way people will manipulate the Bill of Rights to suit their arguments. The Bill of Rights grants certain rights to us as long as we don't interfere with others' rights by exercising ours, but most people conveniently forget the requirement that you not interfere with others' rights. Come on - do you really think commercial speech has all of the protections of individual speech? Really? Hm, when was the last time you saw a cigarette ad on TV? (for example) - -- Steve Sobol, BOFH, President 888.480.4NET 866.DSL.EXPRESS 216.619.2NET North Shore Technologies Corporation http://NorthShoreTechnologies.net JustTheNet/JustTheNet EXPRESS DSL (ISP Services) http://JustThe.net mailto:sjsobol@NorthShoreTechnologies.net Proud resident of Cleveland, OH - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 26 Jan 2001 20:22:57 -0500 From: Wes Leatherock Subject: Re: Transmission of network TV video in the "good ole days" On 26 Jan 2001 09:07:31 -0500 The Old Bear wrote: [ ... text deleted ... ] > To digress slightly, I recall as a child watching parts of the coronation of > Queen Elizabeth in the early 1950s. It was a broadcast first because the > *film* had been flown by military jet to the US and was put on the air within > a matter of hours of the actual event. Actually the Canadian Broacasting Corporation's film arrived earlier, and on of the networks, I believe ABC, arranged to feed it to its stations in the U.S.A. It was an interesting time in the communications field. Wes Leatherock wleath@sandbox.dynip.com - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 26 Jan 2001 21:53:49 -0500 From: Linc Madison Subject: Re: $2400 per minute for 809 calls - nonsense! In article <94ou43$1nk$1@nnrp1.deja.com>, wrote: > In article , > "John R. Covert Spam Sink" wrote: > > > ... simply said that Verizon didn't know what rates would be > > charged, True. > > since they were not in the business of providing int'l calling. True, although they are trying to get into that business, at least in some states. > Verizon owns CODETEL, the leading telephone company here in the > Dominican Republic where 809 belongs. True. > They do know what rates would be charged, and they know that there > are some codes that are dialed "after" the 809 area code that are > Pay-per-call. False, and also false. Verizon DOES NOT know what rates you will be charged for a call to the Dominican Republic, because that rate is not determined by Verizon (on EITHER end of the call). The rate is determined by your LONG DISTANCE carrier, not by your originating local carrier (whether or not that's Verizon), NOR by CODETEL or any other company or agency in the D.R. Also, there are NOT any pay-per-call prefixes in the 809 area code, as dialed from the United States. Any such pay-per-call prefixes are EXCLUSIVELY for domestic use and cannot be dialed from the U.S. If they can be dialed from the U.S., they will be charged at exactly the same rate as a POTS call from the U.S. to the D.R. In no event whatsoever can any company in the D.R. dictate a surcharge to be applied on a call from the United States -- no such billing mechanism exists. Once again, the $2425/minute scam is a gross exaggeration of the facts of the matter. The reality is more like $1/minute, but, with the exception of caller-pays cellular numbers, all numbers in 809 will be billed the same by all U.S. carriers. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 26 Jan 2001 21:54:51 -0500 From: Linc Madison Subject: Re: Los Angeles Area Questions In article <3A6F4E5A.13916.2BE8914@localhost>, Raymond D. Mereniuk wrote: > [regarding colocating a VoIP facility in the Los Angeles area] > > A major concern is what area is best, or most economical, to make > calls from. Does either area offer a benefit in lower metered rates > to a larger area than the other. What are the meter rates for local > calls in the LA area? There will be more people within your normal 12-mile call radius if you're in downtown L.A. than if you're in Irvine, but that may not matter, because normal metered rates won't apply. You'll be doing FG-A rates, which are entirely different and may not even have any mileage sensitivity. In short, it may not matter where you are, as long as it's in the right LATA. I don't know that for sure, but I do know that an answer for ordinary business lines will not necessarily have any bearing on the answer for FG-A lines. - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 26 Jan 2001 22:00:42 -0500 From: Wes Leatherock Subject: Re: N11 codes On 26 Jan 2001 11:26:04 -0500 Randal L. Schwartz wrote: > >>>>> "Garrett" == Garrett Wollman writes: > > Garrett> Where I grew up in Vermont, there were *no* N11 codes in use before > Garrett> Enhanced-911 was implemented. I never tried dialing codes at random > Garrett> to see what they did, but I do recall: > > Garrett> - directory assistance was 1-555-1212 everywhere (not 411) > Garrett> - emergency services were seven-digit local calls listed on the inside > Garrett> front cover of the phone book > Garrett> - repair and business office information had to be looked up in the > Garrett> book > > Ditto Oregon. I had no idea what Aretha Franklin was singing about > when she wanted "the 411 on somebody". I figured it was some urban > slang. > > In fact, we used "113" for directory assistance locally, or > 1-(AC)-555-1212 for "somewhere else". Generally the X11 codes were used in cities that converted to dial with Panel Type or crossbar equipment. (Yes, even New York was once all manual.) 11X codes were used in step-by-step offices. 110 - 211 - Long distance operator 113 - 411 - Directory assistance (earlier "Information") 114 - 611 - Repair service. 811 was only used in some places, and even in PT and XB offices many used normal telephone numbers. (And in many places, "normal telephone numbers" had fewer than seven digits. I lived for a time in a place where my home phone number and business phone number were both three digits. Tulsa had a combination of four-, five-, and six-digit telephone numbers. Oklahoma City had five- (mostly) and six-digit numbers. Houston and Dallas generally had five digits--presented as one letter plus four numerals. Such as R-4085 (Riverside 4085). Later went to six digits with the first two letters dialed. Incidentally, operators used a different set of codes with operator toll dialing began--121 for inward operator, 131 for Information (Directory Assistance). Subscriber toll dialing, and 555-1212, came quite a few years after that. Wes Leatherock wleath@sandbox.dynip.com - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ Date: 26 Jan 2001 22:47:32 -0500 From: dannyb@panix.com (danny burstein) Subject: possible sleazy method, was: Re: $2400 per minute for 809 calls - In <260120011656355426%lincmad001@telecom-digest.zzn.com> Linc Madison writes: [snip of the usual high quality stuff] >Also, there are NOT any pay-per-call prefixes in the 809 area code, as >dialed from the United States. Any such pay-per-call prefixes are >EXCLUSIVELY for domestic use and cannot be dialed from the U.S. If they >can be dialed from the U.S., they will be charged at exactly the same >rate as a POTS call from the U.S. to the D.R. >In no event whatsoever can any company in the D.R. dictate a surcharge >to be applied on a call from the United States -- no such billing >mechanism exists. Being in the midst of trying to resolve Yet Another F**cked Up billing scam by AT&T and an IP and Verizon [1], I've been giving this lots of thought and am not quite as cerain as Linc that this can't be done. Bear with me a moment... Since just about anybody can set up a telco billing establishment which will then get access to the various originating telcos, I think there's a way to do this. And, looking at the various court actions underway against veritas and others, it seems it has been [2]. Let's say the 'take-a-buck' telco sets up shop in the DR and makes arrangements with the locals to get, say, the entire 739 exchange. (Doesn't really matter but i'm choosing this to make the description easier) When you call (809) 739-9999 from your home phone in, say, Verizon territory, your ANI goes out from you to the IXC and also to the freindly folk at 'take-a-buck'. So, what's to stop 'take-a-buck' from submitting their own billing statment, along with your ANI, to Verizon? Who will then cheerfully put it in their next phone bill to you and request payment? It seems that anyone with access to the LEC billing systems can, and does, put these things through all the time... Including, for example, AT&T f "web service" which may or may not have ever been ordered. [1] my home phone bill showed various calls to a "900" number. These were billed by AT&T on behalf of the typicals... and Verizon was quite happy to list them in my phone bill. I wasted my time calling AT&T which insisted that I had to have made these calls and therefore had to pay. [3] However, the calling number (which, fortunately, was listed on the bill) was NOT one of my current numbers. It was one that I had cancelled out in earlier years. I still had the primary number and some others. I then sent off a letter to the NYS Public Service Commission. Which shit- canned me claiming they had no juridiction over 900 service. This despite my very clear note explaining this was a completely erroneous and quite possibly fraudulent bill, and the fact that it was "900" was merely a sidelight. I then rewrote them, this time to the PSC chairman by name. *That* got the note forwarded over to AT&T, which then wrote back to me apologizing. In the meantime I've received collection notices from the IP's accounting bureau... I had also written to verizon's "appeals" office (formerly the "president's office") about this. I hve yet to get any answer from them. Oh, for good measure I also sent a letter to the NYS Attorney general. Who also claimed he had no jurisdiction over "900" numbers. Curiously, a neighboring State's AG (Richard Blumenthal in Ct.) seems to have no trouble following up on telecom issues of this sort. So, boys and girls, if you want to sell your ecstacy and heroin and child porn and c-4 and red mercury, make sure to package it in plastic bags with the number "900" on it and sell it in NYS. [2] keep in mind that the court cases only occur when the actions have been so egregious that the political/regulatory/criminal groups are forced into action. hence this sort of activity must be pretty common - -- _____________________________________________________ Knowledge may be power, but communications is the key dannyb@panix.com [to foil spammers, my address has been double rot-13 encoded] - -- The Telecom Digest is currently mostly robomoderated. Please mail messages to editor@telecom-digest.org. ------------------------------ End of Telecom Digest V2000 #200 ********************************